Inside the Gearbox: AOE Misconceptions

[@NegativeAirsoftTech]

Telling people when in hindsight you've made an error is always a tough pill to swallow so I tip my hat to you, it sucks but you gain real respect for it - I've seen far too many bad AOE corrections & showcased them on my channel.

[@sterkriger2572]

OMFG it’s Luke Neg. that’s an amazing crossover. My first go to tech commenting in my other go to tech.

[@robsorgdrager8477]

If you got Luke's respect then your doing things alright 😊

[@jonnieZG]

"There is no second best, you always should do your best work!" - that's a thought to live by!

[@papercrowe8772]

I can’t believe you made it through all of those guns in a day, my best is like two or three in a days work

[@ValaskaErgonomic]

Hey proper is better than fast tbh so if it takes you longer but they're all done well, you're good

[@raymondiscool1]

It takes years of experience before gearboxes become common sense just like trade work such as electrical once you get so good at it it becomes no brainer and before you know it you speed through it

[@cjh.1920]

I’m a beginner who has yet to crack open their first aeg gearbox. Your videos have been extremely helpful in helping me plan, and I really appreciate it. 👍🏼

[@danielschmidt1990]

Same here man.. Been watching his videos for hours now

[@InvokeZero]

I've been out of the game, and out of gearboxes for close to 10 years now. The last time I was really diving into tech work was back when AoE and Sorbo were all the rage and hearing yours and NegativeAirsoft's comments about it has really let me know I have a lot of catching up to do. I still think the shock absorption factor (one of the original reasons Sorbo became a thing) is worth considering when working on a gearbox, but realizing I don't need to go crazy with it to get perfect AoE is... refreshing.

[@RAZERTAHP]

Glad to see you diving back into the gearbox head first again👍🏻

[@mr.airsoft8295]

I liked your comparison between washers on the piston and sorbothane on the cylinder head, you did a good job explaining it and clearing up the subject. Great video overall.

[@anthonyprioletti7800]

Awesome stuff as always. I like to use plastic pistons cause the sector gear does the aoe correction for me lol.

[@eeemistr]

No happened with me the first plastic piston tooth worn out by high speed sector gear,replaced with all metal teeth piston.

[@wtc3668]

Thank you, you made that very clear. Cheers

[@louhis7158]

It's good that you corrected these misconseptions... Everybody is just fighting about this, They don't EXACTLY know how Gearbox works. And you don't have to correct AOE in every single gun. There are some guns that need AOE correction and there is guns that don't need it. Remember that...

[@nielsnielsen9013]

How do you know which ones do and which ones doesn't?

[@louhis7158]

@@nielsnielsen9013 If The pickup tooth doesn't have flat surface to The piston's first tooth, then you have to correct it.

[@MegaChickenPunch]

@@nielsnielsen9013 watch the video

[@MGirute]

Hey, cheers for a great info! If I'm not mistaken in one of your videos you were showing 3D printed spacers for hop up chamber spacing to flawlessly space chamber to gearbox. But I can't find which video it was. Could you please tell what the dimensions for such spacer? Thicknesses, ID and OD. Do you continue to use them?

[@robj3518]

Very precise info, very well described, thank you

[@teagangilmore7450]

I have been thinking about overhauling a rifle I have. It underperforms and I think it could be really fun to work on it. I am going to be watching a ton of your videos. thank you for uploading

[@TS-su7nj]

The ICS L86 is such a beautiful and unique rifle - including the gearbox design. One thing I hate about it is the awkward trigger pull and trigger reset, especially when using in semi only.

[@edgargee408]

This is the way

[@gelology5514]

Hey mate just with correcting aoe and the teeth on the piston I tend to take the first tooth off of the piston but with the second I angle it to like a 45° angle on it so you get more contact with the sector

[@Fheross324]

What is the size of the plastic washers you use for AOE??? Additionally, do you use longer screws you buy yourself to fit the washers between the piston and piston head? Or do the normal screws work just fine?

[@johnanthonydecastro190]

same question

[@roylariosa2961]

Tnx for sharing your idea to us

[@markarato8034]

Great vid!

[@uazfoursixnine]

Great video as always. Can you do a video about V3 triggers; how to easily install them in the gearbox (you touched on it in a previous video) and how to fix the problem of stuck gearbox/trigger if you're shooting too fast on semi?

[@Alex_seakeeper]

Hello my friend! Excellent view with the right look, everything is correct and clear. Very useful for anyone digging into gearboxes. Thanks for the channel and work for people))

[@arismarkbaclayon2822]

Awesome! Thanks for the tips more power and godbless 🙏

[@pmancer]

Your vid is very helpful!

[@joejoeseesingtons]

Good info

[@Huntertheairsofter]

TheAirsoft Tech, would you mind linking sone washers for AOE correction, I always have a hard time resourcing them after I obtain some.

[@jaydomingo2751]

Great video👍🏻. I want to find out what is the size of spacer that you used between the piston and piston head. Thanks in advance

[@doofwop]

Not a heavy airsofter but I have a couple of airsofts - one is still in the box the other a Krytac PDW that has a couple hundred BBs through it. Opened the gearbox and observed the first two teeth behind the pickup tooth are chewed up. Not missing just chewed up. What is going on with this gearbox?

[@PhantomM16]

The big deal of losing the second to last AND the third to last teeth completely is this: what was the point in correcting the AOE to begin with if you have created another failure point? Fixing AOE is to have less stress on the sector gear & piston. Removing too many teeth just puts you back in that same boat...but maybe even worse because the sector is pulling back a piston with more mass now.

[@shaun536]

That was exactly my thoughts when I decided to try my hand at it. So I carefully removed just enough material for it slide past those teeth and still left enough of the tooth to be able to catch the following teeth properly for better strength.

[@knightairsoftwarrior]

what size are those washers and can I get them from amazon?

[@thomashradecky]

Why do you swiss cheese your pistons when you put the weight right back on with your washer/piston head method of correcting for aoe?

[@J3unG]

Great vid on the ICS. Have you done work on ICS AK series? Main question for me is can I use a new design version 3 gearbox that features quick change spring? If so, what do you recommend? Thanks!

[@pauls.5815]

how do you center the piston head when using washers?

[@WhatTheSkara]

Is it possible to have some proper data on why AOE is done? I mean, gear teeth are designed in a certain way (involute gear shape) to provide a constant transfer of energy between each tooth, each gear and from the sector teeth to the piston rack. By correcting the angle at which the piston rack engages with the sector teeth you effectively modify this energy transfer process, any mechanical reason to do it other than "I've done it for ages"? p.s. not trying to start anything, it's a genuine question

[@opairsoft8100]

It’s been done ages ago when forums where popular. It’s because you will have less wear on the pick up tooth for both the sector and piston. It’s basic gear teeth interaction

[@Evan-eh9dd]

It seems you have better understanding than the majority of the tech community, or at the very least you're more skeptical. You will do well to deal with things as you see fit and do your own experimentation. No one's putting out actual quantifiable data. A lot of airsoft tech theory is hearsay, unproven trends, and/or outdated methods or parts that have carried on for over a decade.

[@Whiskey11Gaming]

The problem with the rack's on MOST pistons is they aren't using a proper involute gear shape. The teeth are usually a trapezoid. This is mostly true of the sector gear's teeth as well, while SOME gearsets sold have the proper shape on the remaining teeth. There is also an additional issue that airsoft guns DON'T deal with is the thrust loads from the bevel gear, pinion depth, and backlash... To put it lightly, these guns are all made in the cheapest of cheap locations using materials bordering on insufficient for longevity. Companies which have taken steps to address the common airsoft failure points usually charge enough that they go out of business faster than they can make the guns... It's also why there has been nearly ZERO innovation by manufacturers. The fact that MOSFETS took nearly a decade to enter mass adoption shows EXACTLY what I'm talking about.

[@jamesblease4393]

It should never be '12 O'clock' unless you have incorrectly formed gear teeth (which I have never seen). 9 times out of 10 no real adjustment is needed.

[@84NZ41]

that is my experience as well. for the past 4 or so years I probably had to correct AOE once. and that was on an old AEG.

[@opairsoft8100]

I would heavily disagree, most guns don’t have perfect aoe, let alone when you start mixing upgrade parts in that are to different spec

[@84NZ41]

​@@opairsoft8100 like I said, not in my experience... but you can disagree all you want, still doesn't change MY reality

[@galahadluardo226]

Thanks for this! Very informative. I just want to ask, how thick is your washer/spacer between piston head and piston body?

[@joshuabower61]

Great vid. I’ve done both ways over the years but my one question always was, don’t you lose some volume when you correct aoe behind the piston head? Just a thought

[@Terminatorbart]

Good info!

[@scotmetcalf2745]

For me being a beginner it would be nice to see the Starbucks thing install and how are you exactly find it although I know you said Home Depot RC car etc. appreciate you have a fantastic day

[@SeRgEyYyY777]

So, can you tell what you done with l86 already? Especially interested in nozzle and hopup chamber

[@Zakath86]

When washers are put behind the piston head. How do you secure it so it's always perfectly centered? I am yet to find a plastic washer with the dimensions 20 and 5 mm to make a snug fit.

[@thenameisluckyboy]

How do you center the piston head when you place so much spacers in between?

[@TheLobesrm]

so what are your thoughts on ICS i just picked up an ICS YAK and want to know thoughts and perspective from a tech thanks in advance!

[@butcher6939]

I bought lonex cylinder with purple piston head. I would like to put it inside elak 702 gen 2. The problem is the piston doesn’t fit right inside the gearbox. I’ve noticed holes in el piston head have bigger diameter than a lonex piston head. What should I do? Drill through lonex piston holes to make them bigger?

[@reaperswinter749]

Nice that SHS pistons are cheap.

[@mikemegadeth4110]

So I've used the shs 14 or 15 steel tooth piston that came pre cheesed and I've noticed that the piston itself is shorter, and the rack is smaller aswell. Had to correct my aoe with multiple spacers, their other pistons are bigger and longer

[@sammoore4972]

I wonder in the inject process they added the cheese effect in the mold that would change the shrinkage rate of the plastic when curing. Is the metal rack shorter as well? Is it rocket or shs?

[@mikemegadeth4110]

@@sammoore4972 shs and yes. I bought 3 of there's. Solid, holes in it and the one with the slits on the side like mlock. I measured them too it was definitely smaller in damn near every aspect. Even had issues with being too tight for the gb piston tracks. I started getting the biggest thickest fucks I could fine then cheese em myself

[@sammoore4972]

@@mikemegadeth4110 MEGADETH \m/. I picked up a couple rocket pistons just to see what they're about being shs's red headed step sister company so far had to clean up some features (I'm a machinist) they seem to be alright had to ca the rack in but thats kinda a norm for me. I'm not a huge fan of the cheese engineering the factory puts in, isn't as structurally sound as I'd like. I wonder why they are out of spec like that. Or is that the spec and they know you're trying to limit weight so shorter narrower would do the trick in a sense. Shorter for aoe as well. Hell idk I'm trying to make sense out of a company based in Hong Kong. Not saying anything besides there there and I'm here hahaha

[@marinusdedreu3833]

@@mikemegadeth4110 try getting some 3d printed pistons from "Airsoft Parts"

[@Scoobydcs]

Hi, i have a new (maybe 100 rounds through it) we glock 18c and im having trouble with mags, i have 2 new normal mags, 1 2nd hand and 1 new extended mag. 1 new normal mag works fine but the rest are very patchy. usually il get 2 or 3 rounds out of them then i get lots of gas out the back and the bb just rolls out of the barrel, any ideas?

[@Fheross324]

Not too experienced in GBB pistols, but sounds like your o-rings could be freezing, therefore causing gas to just burst out? Maybe not that problem exactly, but whatever it is the gas that is supposed to be sealed inside isnt being sealed inside. So i'd try replacing the o-rings on the fill valve and the rear valve??

[@williamgiaccone2569]

Last build I did a little while ago I did the same trick of putting spacers between the piston and the piston head and I couldn't fit enough spacers in-between without having the screw for the piston head come out and have metal shards go throughout the gearbox. I am especially asking this question now because I am experimenting with a damper piston head because I like the way it sounds and there is no way I can fit a faucet washer in there so what could I do in the circumstance where I am already at the max amount of spacers I can fit before putting piston head at risk?

[@opairsoft8100]

You should be able to find longer screws at any hardware store

[@williamgiaccone2569]

@@opairsoft8100 alright I’ll check it out when I do that build, thanks!

[@TutonWolf]

Ahoy there - Firstly, love the channel, been a massive fan ever since I started getting involved with airsoft several years back - Not sure if this is the place to ask, but thought I'd give it a try I recall seeing a few videos where you spoke about motors, and specifically Motor Tuning (Frankentorques etc) - I've been looking around online and I can't find anything on Proper airsoft motor assembly/tuning - Thinking Shimming the armature, preventing up and down movement, ensuring Brushes are all suitable for the commutator or bedded in - Is that potentially a video you could make with the in depth details of airsoft motors, and perhaps how to get them running as smoothly and efficiently as possible? Thanks again for the wealth of knowledge you share with us all.

[@QuantraClounix]

can anyone link me those plastic washer with correct size?

[@sammoore4972]

I'm with ya!

[@Evan-eh9dd]

go to McMaster Carr's website. they have tons of hardware and raw materials. There's a lot of stuff in their catalogue, but the site is pretty straight forward to navigate.

[@MrLink0r]

thanks for good vide, but I'd recommend to use aluminium washer instead of plastic ones as in some cases those could be destroyed by piston rack, even it was glued.

[@marinusdedreu3833]

If the piston rack is installed properly that is impossible

[@MrLink0r]

@@marinusdedreu3833 it could be on high ROF builds. I saw couple of examples.

[@federico.biondi-4704]

test the components Fps softair 💯🇮🇹

[@WhatTheSkara]

Non sono niente di speciale, SHS ha gli stessi prodotti sul mercato da anni...

[@federico.biondi-4704]

@@WhatTheSkara con il pistone e l'asta posso ancora essere d'accordo ma le teste in confronto fanno pena

[@seseroblesdmd8020]

Comment

[@paranoidplus5609]

aoe correction on the piston or the cylinder head will create a loss of volume regardless although aoe correction on the piston with a ported cylinder WILL NOT as long as the piston retracts passed the port

[@MegaChickenPunch]

true

[@yourbiggestfan6766]

🤙

[@minhthinhhuynhle9103]

How'bout AOE 90 degree without removing all of the 2nd last tooth :> oh I did it , works perfectly fine for a DSG 50+ rps :))

[@Vranabg]

you talk a lot without saying anything and your music is louder than what youre saying