Interview with a Pedophile - Follow Up (Part 1)

[@lss74]

I have to be honest here.... if I had a small 5 year old child and a sibling drunkenly admitted they had 'un-natural' feelings towards her.... I would WITHOUT SHAME put immediate distance between them.

[@sophiashmia6587]

⁠@@iamjay6112hi jay, just wondering, if you can help me understand here, how is it possible for you to be in love or emotionally close to a child and not be sexually attracted to them? Was it because you repressed those feelings? Or because they weren’t there? It seems strange to think you are sexually atttacted to little girls but not her? Why not her.

[@uuproverlord8324]

@@iamjay6112 what was ur subreddit u owned

[@mynameisntemma167]

I would not blame you at all. I don’t think anyone would, however I imagine if this were a family member of mine, I would not cut them off. I share a very similar view as the host, which is we must condemn the act of harming children, but should offer support to people who struggle with this attraction. They would never be around my child even with supervision, but if they are committed to not offending, I don’t see a reason to stop talking to them all together

[@Gatby-zp7uw]

8

[@toeachitsown2050]

​@@iamjay6112can you explain the unhealthy infatuation you admitted to?

[@minervaschwartzbaum2792]

I got the feeling he was infatuated with his niece and (if we’re to trust what he says) even though he hadn’t developed sexual feelings for her yet, he was dangerously close to it. I don’t blame his brother. I did feel sorry for Jay, but I would never allow him around a child in my care. It’s too great of a risk.

[@jonathaningram8157]

It's a sensible answer but because of that mentality, pedos will hide who they are just to get close to those children. So in the end, it doesn't solve anything. I think there isn't any good answers there.

[@toeachitsown2050]

He shouldn't be allowed ANY children

[@necoragha65]

I was under the impression Jay was in love with the little niece. They quite rightly so broke off contact. Even if he didn't act upon it, it is not a normal situation for a little girl to be in.

[@mkim4091]

It was a relief to hear that, who what direction could have gone.

[@sophiashmia6587]

It isn’t a good or safe situation for her no and I understand why his brother cut contact. The average person is not going to be reasonable to their brother falling in love whith his child niece and being a pedophile. I would of cut him off too even if he is a good person or my brother for the safety of my child.

[@TheChgz]

Trigger warning for SA I always had a weird relationship with my own uncle growing up. I didn't have a healthy father figure in my own life and my Aunt and Uncle would often invite me to go on family holidays because I was the same age as their daughter. He would avoid me a lot when I was little but when I turned 11ish he started getting very close to me and would give me lots of cuddles. We would make a lot of sex jokes to each other. He kept telling me that he loved me and saw me as a daughter. Then when I was 25ish he eventually tried making out with me. Nobody in my family stood up for me and they told me he meant it as a joke. But after hearing this interview I know 100% what it was.

[@insideout277]

⁠@@TheChgz Only you know the difference between if it was jokes ore not. Did you get hurt at the time is what important.. and if he kept doing it didn’t respect you. Sounds like ha was a jerk, but it is dangerous to assume and judge him about the seriousness based on this interview. I don’t know but don’t reach too quick conclusion ether

[@somexp12]

@@insideout277 "dangerous to assume and judge" Huh? He did what he did. You either think that's appropriate or you don't.

[@alessiacalzolari2541]

I have a lot of empathy for these people. However, if someone tells me they feel attraction towards my kid, I don't care who you are or where you stand. You will simply not be allowed around them, end of. Can't risk it and the priority is to protect my child, not be considerate of you feelings.

[@ashleypearson7848]

100 percent agree

[@epileptictrees5213]

I mean, that's just common sense. If someone is sincere about not wanting to act on those thoughts they probably take care to avoid children most of the time anyway.

[@Kyotopearl]

So you have empathy as long as it’s someone else’s kids in his path and not yours. Not me. He called it his dark side for a reason. He was PURPOSELY putting himself in the presence of a child he was ATTRACTED to. People who genuinely want to get sober don’t go hanging out in bars and drug dens.

[@alessiacalzolari2541]

@@Kyotopearl no... I am just saying that I get the point of the podcast and that it's very eye opening. But I don't think anyone with children would want them around.

[@44nk96]

100%. They would never be around my child again.

[@nettwench]

My concern was that he was a recovering addict and if he ever relapsed his actions would not be under control. I applaud Jay for seeking help and opening up about this because we really need to understand this. I also understand why the brother cut off contact because the inappropriate emotional attachment to the child is harmful in itself, even if there is no sexual contact.

[@toeachitsown2050]

Yes, an addict, but not recovering. Twice the interviewer asked about him trying to get clean and he said something to the tune of "not really". He admits to slipping up while under the influence, but we are supposed to believe he is a non offender?

[@pinkpugginz]

​@@toeachitsown2050it's just too hard for me to believe he's never offended because every situation he gets involved in there happens to be children around. Why did he befriend a family in his church that had young kids in his age range. Why not befriend other recovering addicts and do adult activities to keep away from children.

[@toeachitsown2050]

@pinkpugginz 100% ! I met a former therapist who worked with these offenders for 5 yrs and told him about this ridiculous interview. He said, "They are the most untrustworthy manipulative people. I would trust never them and I think they should never leave jail." THAT'S the reality, I'm afraid

[@rhealajoie2204]

I think your interview if "J" is excellent. However, I think there is an important point that is missed. "J"'s niece at 5 years old was the same age that J" was when he was sexually initiated. This is key. You muddy the waters by speculating about whether his interest is 'normal' or not. His early sexual experience left him feeling lonely and isolated. He only feels 'safe' with small children, hence his dependency on her. His 'anxiety' about the relationship was a warning sign.

[@TeaCup1940]

If it is true that he was sexually abused, because many pedophiles lie about having been abused just to get more sympathy. And nobody at 5 can be sexually initiated, only sexually abused.

[@itsjustme479]

You're right it's absolutely a detail worth noting, however this is an active conversation its not "muddying" the waters the whole interaction is necessary to even make those connections. Stifling does not work his inability to communicate his feelings is what truly would've made things a mess because he is left to his own mind and often every human in the world will justify their actions malicious or well intentioned. I think the little things he did when talking to parents was his way of protecting the girl, his overall feelings of unease were absolutely a sign and without having gone through this who knows how long or how close he'd have gotten with some other little girl.

[@anniepaul13]

Both the therapist and Jay are not being emotionally honest about what Jay did in this situation. Jay didnt tell his brother. The brother received tips from an internet troll. Additionally, Jay went to therapy because of an "emotional dependency on a 5 year old", how is that appropriate? obviously, he knew it wasn't ok. What in the world was the brother supposed to do especially after hearing Jay drunkenly admit to having a dark side? Jay didn't have an emotionally intelligent discussion with his brother. He was acting shady and then the brother received all this horrible info from a stranger. If nothing else, even if the girl didn't sense the intense emotional attachment that little girl and even her parents are extremely confused. He admitted to making excuses just to see the girl then took it back in a email. You want the public to be honest about this being a problem, but it sounds like Jay is not completely honest with himself about his feelings. I genuinely feel bad for him, but not enough to risk a child being deeply hurt for life.

[@FanKidsMom]

💯

[@laney612]

the brother absolutely did the right thing by removing the niece from the MAP's life. I too could feel the distorted attraction the MAP felt, Maybe the attraction is being openly discussed here as if awareness has it under control, but I don't believe for one minute those distorted feelings won't be turned into reality unless completely removed from a vulnerable situation. As an adult, I have felt someone had the same feelings for me as I did for them and was dumbfounded when coming to the realization they did not so projection is real. Difference being that adult could tell me I was wrong which is not the case in a adult/child relationship. The MAP's emotional level was stunted in childhood and clearly remains stunted. He should NEVER be allowed to interact with children!

[@biggy_fishy]

💯

[@stregalilith]

As an attorney who works with LGBT youth I’m a mandatory reporter and I’m so moved by the frankness and compassion in this presentation. I agree that we all need to lift the stigma and learn as much as we can and I commend his courage and yours for opening the door. The amount of trauma he has suffered in his life overwhelms me and I want to say that I believe he is a valuable human being who deserves peace, healing and joy. I do not see him as dangerous just as struggling and I’m so glad he is getting good therapy and has insight into his issues. Also, I must say it’s SO important to make the distinction between “J” and those people who are truly dangerous. I am also a parent and a grandparent so believe me I am very protective of children but I believe this man has valuable information to impart and he deserves support and appreciation for sharing it.

[@Kwd123]

Why is it important that you state you work with LGBTQ youth, like why say that versus just saying youth? Are you equating having empathy for paedophiles with having empathy for LGBTQ people? I agree with you that people talking about their attractions is great, and I hope that Jay can have a positive affect on somebody out there to get help and not offend. I don’t think claiming he’s not dangerous is necessarily accurate, seems pretty clear that he was troubled by his love for his niece and where it was headed. It’s great that he was concerned and wanted help, but there was still some risk for the child.

[@biggy_fishy]

@@Kwd123 Absolutely, to say there's no risk is just not accurate and pedophiles are manipulative ALWAYS. Let's go back to him talking about leaving that church..... Huge red flag🚩

[@LordOfZ3]

Thank you

[@StevenMichaelCunningham]

They are dangerous around others......others also deviant or not. That is the rub.

[@Walkingwithjordan214]

@@biggy_fishythe way he acted like the victim…

[@profe3330]

I'm of two minds here. On the one hand, sure - every person, no matter how unappealing, deserves human sympathy to some degree. On the other hand, no - we all have unacceptable urges (who hasn't MOMENTARILY considered slapping an obnoxious child, or sleeping with her best friend's boyfriend?) but, if we're halfway decent people, we don't act on those urges. We don't try to rationalize them, and we grow up to realize that we can't have everything we want, or act on any impulse. At the end of the day, I can't sympathize with people who destroy the lives of children. Full stop.

[@epileptictrees5213]

This is a good take.

[@hannahlabyrinth1945]

Exactly. The line is drawn at anything towards children. We absolutely should not give them a “community” and making it seem like MAP is a sexuality. Just because they have not actually committed an offense, doesn’t mean they don’t have disgusting thoughts and probably seek out CP. it’s disgusting and I will in no way ever sympathize.

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@hannahlabyrinth1945 you say "exactly", but I'm not sure you read the comment

[@mirb2093]

Lol the “urge” to slap someone is not the same as inherently being attracted to children-meaning you can never form a valid relationship whether romantic or sexual. That’s not to excuse any offenders of course, but I think you’re underestimating/minimizing the impact that has on one’s life.

[@profe3330]

@@mirb2093 Hey, there are plenty of people whose lives have been destroyed by uncontrolled violence and unresolved rage - and yes, this stuff can destroy every single relationship in a person's life, including - but not exclusive to - those that are romantic or sexual. Our culture seems to think that sexual urges - especially in men - are so cataclysmically powerful that they're uniquely uncontrollable, but I don't buy that. At all.

[@robynmeyer7796]

A close female member of my family, aged six, suddenly started having night terrors…they were intense and had been occurring for a few weeks. To me it rang alarm bells, so I spoke with her Mom. It turned out that another girl (also aged six) was sexually assaulting her and other girls in the classroom at school. This included genital abuses and wasn’t by any means light play or having sweet undertones, it was rough and forceful with intent to not be caught by the teacher. How we respond is important, but when these issues get brushed under the carpet by authorities like schools, police and welfare agencies it made me realise why society often struggles with responses and ideals with regard to potential predators, including children. The child in question had been abused for some time by her father and was re-homed with her grandparents. But despite this taking place she was allowed to stay in the class amidst the students she had been forcing herself upon, some of whom displayed trauma indicators. The victims were simply left to carry on and pretend all was well and they were not offered support or an opportunity to voice their feelings. It took the parents (of my family babe) to arrange counselling for their daughter themselves as the night terrors continued. Was it any wonder that some of the children in the class eventually moved to other schools, to an environment their parents felt was safer? To me a lack of appropriate response by responding agencies and schools does little to promote balanced public perception of what’s best in these situations, if anything it incited conflict and distrust toward them. Despite my family members parents being reasonably open about sexual discussion in their home, it takes some sound reasoning to make healthy choices, and it certainly threw a curveball at them. Was this child (the female perpetrator) already pre-programmed with a sexual mindset, and possibly trained to inflict abuse on others? Was it her way to regain some form of power in her own inner world by tormenting her peers? Is this child a potential danger to herself and others as she grows older?…and had this gone unchecked would it have potentially formed a pod of children more likely to abuse as they grew older? Is it important to understand the need for balance and reason when we are confronted with some of the more unpleasant aspects of life or should we just take a hard line attitude and slam the mutts in our world, including children?…which apparently is often where it all begins. I’d like to think she gets the help and support she obviously needs and that hopefully early intervention equips her with the tools to earn a rewarding life. Is my attitude responsible? What do you think?

[@TeaCup1940]

I wonder how this could even happen inside the classroom and where was the teacher in that moment? It is very scary that such a thing can happen in school by another child. Many children sadly do sexually abuse others because this is what they have learned. I think she may wanted to regain some control by doing it. Obviously she needs help as much as her victims. Sad that the school didn't have the necessary policies and structures in place to prevent this from happening in the first place.

[@StevenMichaelCunningham]

DAMN. 🤹🏻‍♂️ While damage, deformity & each can be hereditary evil/crime/perversion/corruption/violence/weakness/insanity is a choice. It is not sane after all. Law or no law. 🙈🙊🙉

[@fatuusdottore]

I'm sorry to hear that happened. Most likely she was reenacting abuse because she also didn't receive the appropriate intervention, the school should have acted in everyone's interests tbh.

[@emilyz3932]

Just because Jay’s family was always present at the property when he was with his niece does not necessarily mean they were never alone. He said that they had a special tree in the back yard they went to which could have been isolated if no one was monitoring them.

[@StevenMichaelCunningham]

There is no reason or excuse for them to be in the same time & space.......

[@lawyerlizenel6727]

I would rather make a mistake on the safe side and keep him away from my kids. It only has to happen once, and that kid is scarred for life.

[@bigymara]

I don’t think we ‘can’t know’ if the relationship was harmful because of the stigma, I think we can’t know, because we have an unreliable narrator.

[@Ventress1]

I grew up with something similar. As a small kid, my uncle gave me the most attention compared to my other cousins who were also my age. He would compliment me, always choose me as his favorite, sometimes I felt like he never even acknowledged my cousins were right there with me yet, he still singles me out. In fact, my cousins had their uncle who would also single me out as well. As a child who was EXTREMELY shy, I hated this obvious attention. Mind you, I also never reciprocated. I tried to stay away from them as much as possible and it bothered me that my body language was clear and they still wouldn’t stop. When I got older it slowly went away but I still get uncomfortable whenever I see them. Nothing too terrible ever really happened, but looking back I feel like they were infatuated with me or whatever it was. Regardless, I still remember and I still don’t like being around them because of that. I’m 30.

[@declankelly9829]

You were probably a very good looking kid... probably still are. They annoyed you a bit.. but they did u no harm. Just think... u gave them a lot of joy by being so good looking!

[@_the_mothman_]

​@@declankelly9829 Ew??

[@binniparis8024]

If you single out a child for favoritism it can isolate them from the rest of family. Was my experience with my sa. I agree 100% to drop stigma, more trained counsellors yet never drop public registers, these people can not hide amongst children. Xx

[@tinam761]

ABSOLUTELY!!! The registers are needed… families deserve the right to have reasonable information in which to protect their children.

[@gangstaboy9387]

​​@@tinam761 Lmao you guys.. It's baffling that you don't understand that your unempathetic feelings about this is LITERALLY one of the biggest reasons that sa is so prevalent. Because what happens when the stigma is so big that you can't seek help? They isolate and do horrible stuff. Think whatever you want but if it hasn't helped in the last 200 years then I would guess it won't start working now. Therapy and help is proven effective but you guys just want to see someone burn and don't care about how many children who actually suffer because of it. We're talking about non offending now. You know, millions and millions of the ones out there.

[@elizabelthe]

i think jays attraction to his niece is great evidence to hammer home that this is not a sexuality. being gay does not make you suddenly attracted to your same sex relatives. jay is not well, and he should not be grouped with those who are.

[@_the_mothman_]

Agreed!

[@ciaraskeleton]

I find this channel so healing for my personal trauma. I cope by learning. I was Fascinated by his first interview and how you brought it into a new light. Providing a place to talk about the real hard topics. Hopefully all of this leads to the safekeeping and guarding of minors and to better methods of help for maps. Thanks as always for talking about the real stuff Dr Honda. 🙌

[@bigwhy6845]

big agree, silencing these topics doesn't help anyone and leads to more people suffering in silence. MAPs exist, so how do we help them while ensuring no children are harmed. People who have knee-jerk negative reactions seem more motivated to showcase their own superiority rather than actually trying to improve things.

[@ciaraskeleton]

@@bigwhy6845 you put that very well indeed!

[@diamoradiaz4287]

He wasn't trying to prevent harming his niece, he was pursuing being with her, that intensity harms a child even if he didn't molest her or more.

[@Yikkoofficial]

Exactly

[@shypenguin9766]

I strongly disagree with the connection between society’s disdain for pedophiles and Hitler’s disdain for the Jewish people. Pedophiles aren’t being rounded up and filed into concentration camps. These two categories are, historically speaking, in no way the same level of oppressed. This, especially so, when the level of oppression mentioned in this section of the video was internet hate. If you’re trying to address pedophilia from a mental health standpoint, a much more adequate comparison could be drawn to folks who were classified as “insane” for having epilepsy back when asylums were more prevalent.

[@Nacedah]

I’m glad someone said that. This was a really misguided analogy. I actually agree with the general proposition that there is excessive stigma, especially toward non-offenders. But the Nazi analogy is way off base.

[@shamsham8328]

I think your characterization of the situation with his niece is pretty accurate. Even if youre an NOMAP and are brave enough to come on this show and talk about it, it feels like there is a pretty slim chance you're willing to come out with the information that you knew you were sexually attracted to her while spending time with her even if you didn't do anything with her. Im guessing MAYBE he knows how he was feeling wasnt exactly normal and probably regrets letting it go far enough to him wanting to see her a lot and spend time with her and cant really admit that because unfortunatley it probably felt good to him and admitting that would be extremely vulnerable and probably contribute to the stigma.

[@shamsham8328]

@@callmekirkland8 I think there is a stigma because harming children is bad and society wants to prevent that. Society largely does not understand the difference between a NOMAP and an offending pedophile. I dont think wanting to protect children from offenders is wrong at all. i do however think there is a problem with the lack of nuance in society around non-offending people who suffer from this desire due to trauma, and offending people who might even be sadistic in some cases.

[@shamsham8328]

@@callmekirkland8 I guess I'm not really sure what you're asking, what data are you looking for exactly? The distinction alone between trauma-based personality disorders and true psychopathy that Dr. Honda mentioned is well established clinically.

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@callmekirkland8 You have any scientific sources for the claim that "100% of pedophiles are liars"?

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@callmekirkland8 Then list them. Unless, you know, you don't actually have them. Because I don't see anything in the DSM diagnosis about being predisposed to lying. I mean, the very fact that you used "100%" means you're bullshitting. It's not something grounded in research, just your own misconceptions and bias and hysteria.

[@shamsham8328]

I think to answer a lot of these questions is going to require you to do a bit of research on psychology and pedophilia yourself, its all publicly available information. Youre correct that there is difficulty collecting reliable empirical data on this topic but it does already exist in some number. I dont think we disagree THAT much really. 1. "pedophiles are pedophiles because they themselves were abused" There are indeed empirical studies that show this to be the case for many. Its not true for every pedophile obviously. There are ways of independently verifying this information from people other than the pedophile self-reporting so it doesnt matter if they are a liar or not. 2. "Why would they be different? They have the same broken brain structure." There is obviously a difference between having a desire and acting on it versus having a desire and not acting on it, so i dont think I have to explain that one more. If youre taking about actual biochemisty and motivation, everyone has a different reason for offending at anything. Some people rob banks because they are sociopaths and have no empathy and think it would be fun, some people do it because they are desperate and poor feel they have no choice, perhaps some have some substance abuse issues. Science so far, though still very much incomplete, shows the existence of genetic AND social factors that both contribute to peoples behaviour in various complex ways. This is also true for pedophilia, and we know that through existing research as well as the fact that why wouldnt it be the case when it is for literally everything else? I mean there are studies you can find out actually showing that many sexual child abusers arent even pedophiles in the sense that they arent attracted to children necessarily but lack availability to other means of sexual gratification and so abuse people near them. Basically what im saying is, there are a lot of different potential factors that child sexual abuse can happen which have been uncovered and there is research available for you to go look at and decide how much of it you agree with or dont.

[@Koshrocreations]

Such a sad world we live in: a child gets SA, eventually grows up being a pedo from the trauma, people on the comments say this grown child should be punished and suffer... but this was a SA child! Shouldn't we try to help them overcome their trauma? Society must find a way to protect other children while at the same time treat them. Otherwise it's an abusive cycle and comments point to that: children being SA by other children who were SA by adults who probably were SA as kids.

[@The_Remnant86]

Not too long ago, I watched an interview with Dr James Cantor, and it was a little hard to process with my childhood trauma. After watching your interview with jay, I'm able to understand in a way I never knew was possible. Thank you for your work.

[@Julia-um4rv]

I'm glad you're brave enough to talk about this. I was thinking about this for a while but it's such a stigma that people are afraid to even talk about it. Going into social work, I want to be able to help people and I think the only way we can put an end to Child sexual abuse is to talk about it.

[@toeachitsown2050]

He is not brave. He is anonymous and wants a platform to gain sympathy.

[@carolhowell5417]

I was sexually abused by my mother’s boyfriend at 8 years old. What I think about him, looking back, he was sadistic, he enjoyed humiliating me in my mother’s presence. I do believe, however, there are some who have psychological problems but they don’t want to hurt children. I have sympathy for them, I cannot imagine what they deal with in their mental world. I have always said I would rather be an abused child rather than a child abuser, I would not want to live in their minds.

[@bleepbloop4826]

I would never let a "MAP" around my kids because I'm not willing to allow there to be any risk of emotional or sexual harm to my kids. I can be sympathetic to Jay but I don't think he is entitled to interactions with children. Even if he is non-offending, he still seems like an "edgy" chronically online adult with underlying bad ideals and a victim mentality that makes him feel that he is entitled to his niece. By not telling his brother, he lied by omission and exposed her to risk.

[@richardlong2094]

He did cuddle her though if he was left alone with her I would bet my life that eventually he would slip and do something. It’s the equivalent of being left alone with a girl you already like and expecting you to not try something eventually or an addict left in a room with there D.O.C

[@Deborah78681]

Just as it wouldn't be a good idea for an alcoholic to hangout at a bar or a gambling addict hangout at a race track, it wouldn't be a good idea for a pedophile to have a special relationship with a child. Some may thing it's ok with a child of the age group the pedophile is not attracted to but attractions can change so it's not worth the risk to minors. Adults must protect minors who are venerable. There are plenty of people that don't have special relationships with minors at all and they live fulfilling lives.

[@tuszajnojneeg0052]

In regards to how Jay talked about his niece. Please if you forgot listen to it again. It was strange, concerning the way he talked about her.

[@xSpyder5x]

I agree, some of the intonations in his voice were less genuine than the baseline

[@egg_bun_]

​@@xSpyder5xyeah it definitely sounded like he was lying and holding back from the whole story of how he actually feels.

[@nettwench]

I think that limerance is a factor here, as a part of CPTSD from trauma. Longing after an unattainable love object. It's an obsessive attachment. So you can't form appropriate emotional connections with people who are your own age or who are realistic romantic partners. It prolongs the experience of feeling alone, abandoned and hopeless. It fills a void that was created by the childhood trauma, abuse or abandonment. It's being stuck in the trauma. I lost my father at age 7 and as an adult I experienced this repeatedly, being infatuated with unavailable men. It was miserable. I've had years of therapy and still didn't know about this until I found psych professionals talking about it on YT.

[@InYourFaceNewYorker]

The brother did the right thing by preventing Jay from seeing his niece. However, he shouldn't have ended HIS relationship with him. They could have set something up where they'd see each other when the little girl wasn't around. It sounds like by ending HIS relationship with him... that was just nasty and personal and not just about protecting the girl.

[@cheesebread3]

If I found out that someone I knew was attracted to my child in that way I’d never want to see them again. Yes, it is personal.

[@InYourFaceNewYorker]

@@cheesebread3 Even if it was your own brother? Even if he came to you and said "I don't want to feel this way and I'm going to get help", or something to that effect?

[@silverdoe9477]

Yes we absolutely need to talk about this without hatred, that’s the only way they can seek help & prevention. I can’t imagine the self hatred they feel.

[@user-lh3sw4tq2n]

Nothing compared to their victims.

[@silverdoe9477]

@@user-lh3sw4tq2n I’m a victim. Thats why we need to provide treatment & prevention before they offend. We need to make them feel safe enough to ask for help.

[@lucylohan8894]

@@callmekirkland8 THiS!!!!

[@AllyMack23]

Multiple research studies have found positive results when looking at effectiveness of sex offender treatment.

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@callmekirkland8 "actually, there is evidence to support this" "please, they're just grifters" lmfao

[@bonnie3937]

I think if you are atteacted to children sexually, I think it is putting yourself and more importantly in a dangerous situation by spending time time together. It may be innocent in the begining but just too much risk.

[@judyhickman5831]

I appreciate this interview so much for many reasons. The tone set by the interviewer, the obvious skill of the therapist in conducting it, the treatment you gave to Jay as a human being with genuine feelings and ability to care. I found Jay to be forthright and I admire his courage to look at himself and to share his experiences. I see Jay as a boy within his adult man body, who has a long-standing fixation. It's as if he is still back there in his early years of age six, and he was not prepared emotionally to move on from the mindset of those times. Jay says "I don't know" to many questions, seems reminescent of a young boy's answer. He did not have sisters which may have helped in learning how to relate to females in childhood. But that is only a tiny facet and not significant. I think since Jay did not seem to have an outlet in a person he could or would go to, to help him reconcile his feelings and seems like he safely compartmentalized this aspect of development This interview and the care with which it was conducted, aided atmosphere for Jay to be candid, and my perception of this by 2nd break, was of a fellow human being struggling with a dilemma, instead of being a peek into a gross offender. Thanks for that goes to the both of you.

[@wayside5182]

I feel like jays a liar he was attracted to the niece but with past experiences knows he can’t say they it’s manipulation people like him do that then when they finally get the chance they say oh I don’t know what came over me

[@bibattybobattyboop9567]

Also we need to start early educating our kids about sexual predators. If kids are educated on what to look out for and what’s appropriate and what’s not and that they can come to their family or a trusted adult if someone is making them uncomfortable no matter who that person is, that they can say NO, kids are better able to advocate for themselves and tell someone “no, don’t touch me there” or “no, that’s not appropriate “ if kids are given these tools early that could help decrease their risk of becoming a victim as well.

[@LilyBecca]

I have done this with my daughter. I worry sometimes that I might be making her not trust men, but I just want to protect her, and I want her to realize that anyone can be a pedophile. When I was little, I felt safe around anyone that looked like a Grandpa. I don't want my daughter to be that naive. When she was very little, I told her that nobody should ever touch her and that there are boys and men out there that are sick inside and would want to marry her. That was the best way I could explain it since she was too little to know what sex or sexual activity was.

[@jonathaningram8157]

Clearly sexual education is extremely important (for that and teenage pregnancy). Because a lot of the time the child doesn't even know what is happening to them. Also being able to discuss freely help the child. I heard many stories of children being afraid to talk to their parents because they thought they did something wrong and would be punished. But at the same time you don't want to be too specific to preserve their innocence. It's difficult but the USA is clearly behind in that regard.

[@SpikedTeeth]

​@beccajune I sincerely hope you're telling her not to let ANYONE touch/talk to her inappropriately and not just men specifically. Men may be the most commonly caught pedophiles, but many female pedophiles exist and get away with it because of the belief that women can't be pedophiles.

[@skleroosis]

I think it's so important to have a level of acceptance and support in society for MAPs who don't offend. I'm not comfortable with them having access to children, at least unsupervised, but it seems a lot of MAPs are the way they are because of childhood abuse, so the answer can't be just to keep abusing them and making them feel awful about themselves, because as long as they don't offend, none of this is their fault. There has to be a way to protect kids from abuse while also protecting the kids who have been abused and grown up from further abuse.

[@biggy_fishy]

To protect yourself from allegations? You may think your sly, but many people caught your sleight of hand verbiage. You should not be around children. Full stop. ​@@iamjay6112

[@abxv_]

Please never speak faster, I love that you speak in the speed you do. It's very relaxing and makes me understand much better

[@xSpyder5x]

Big props for taking on this topic. The interview was really good. I hope you revisit it and update it. People need help, I commend Jay for not acting physically, and realising there was something not riht

[@wts7273]

Wow you are so thorough in every single explanation it is so incredibly touching. You always inspire me to be more compassionate to others and to myself. This world is very lucky to have you.

[@abandonablesnowman]

People wouldn’t be suspicious about uncles though if a lot of people weren’t being abused by their uncles, or some man. It’s a very common story. Obviously women can be predators too, but what is it, 1 in 9 girls are abused by an adult before 18? That’s an extremely high amount of people, so who are these predators? Everyone isn’t being abused by the one guy. People are right to be protective. What’s the alternative? We aren’t vigilant about that?

[@abandonablesnowman]

@@iamjay6112 I’m sympathetic to MAP’s, but sympathy and what I do as a parent are two different things. It’s a similar concept to being someone who wants to open carry. Yeah, you probably aren’t actually going to hurt anyone because in your mind you’re a decent human, but why should I trust that? Nothing about that situation is reassuring for me and I’m not trying to wait around for something to happen. Ultimately my child’s well-being is of infinitely more importance than an adult’s feelings

[@mirb2093]

@@iamjay6112 I would have to disagree that being a MAP doesn’t make someone a special threat. Seeing as the attraction is towards children, if a MAP were to ever act in their attraction in any way no matter how minor/major, it would inherently be damaging. This does not apply to those attracted to adults.

[@abandonablesnowman]

@@iamjay6112 Sure, I’m not talking about you personally, but my original response was to Kirk saying it’s ridiculous to be wary of dudes that hang around kids and I’m saying people are cautious for a reason and that child SA is too common to disregard that in favor of being non-stigmatizing

[@mirb2093]

@@iamjay6112 Yes there are plenty of harmful ways to act on attraction with other adults, but the difference is acting on attraction to children in any capacity is harmful since the attraction is unnatural by nature. I’m not making any assumptions about your experience that you would want to or fantasize about causing harm, but the reality is any conceptualization of your attraction would be harmful because kids and adults cannot have a romantic/sexual relationship in any form that’s healthy. Whether or not you physically harm/assault them, even the potential in emotional boundaries being crossed can be traumatizing. Since there is quite literally no way for that relationship to exist that is not damaging, that makes it inherently more risky, whether it’s acted upon or not, especially given that you don’t know which person will/won’t act on their thoughts until it happens.

[@abandonablesnowman]

@@mirb2093 Yeah, the whole premise here of destigmatizing NOMAP’s is dependent on trusting that they’re acting in good faith

[@shortnotekerrie]

Hi I listened to the interview with Jay. I really thought because of his upbringing circumstances and all kind of said a lot about how he is now. I felt empathy, and sad for him. Where he was treated badly too. When It got to his 5 year old neice, I wasn't sure how that was going to go. He did say, We were never alone although we loved going up a tree together. My brother and his family were still on the property though. That kind of sent alarm bells to me. I really do feel sorry for him. I wish like you that things/ life was different in his childhood. Love and understanding was felt by him. ❤

[@simhthmss]

I wouldn't want someone with a sexual attraction to children to interact with my children even if it was my brother, I would likely want to hang out separately. Like meet up with him at a pub or a walk or whatever. I don't have children but, the whole thing would seem too risky to me.

[@tomburns5231]

Thanks for your kind, informative, and compassionate responses, Kirk :)

[@skrapelotto]

You kinda got the story wrong about Jay. When Jay was drunk and told his brother about the dark things about him they didnt know wtf he was talkin about bc he couldnt explain it. The brother didnt find out until Jay told his roommate and got held at gun point

[@couch_philosoph3325]

I think we can all agree pn the fact that the best way to prevent any assault is by offering maps /pedophiles the help they need and deserve. Many of them were sexually assaulted as kids as well. By not offering them therapy, we will just increase assaults on kids. We also need kids to teach that they can always say no, offer them safe people to talk to and teach them that their body is theirs and if something doesn't feel okay it is not okay. Giving maps a place to heal and protecting kids are not exclusive, in fact they are two ways to the same goal. We want kids to be safe. We can do everything to ensure that while still trear maps like humans. Because imagine you are assaulted at 5 and then you grow up being attracted to 5 year olds. Knowing its wrong and also never wanting to hurt anybody. Kids will always come fist. But prevention is the way to go and with this maps can receive a better qualitaty of life also

[@justsomerandomhomie1794]

THIS! So many people lack critical thinking nowadays. Like even if you hate pedophiles, at least try to help those who are struggling to control their pedophilic desires. By stigmatizing them and not offering help, you're essentially helping to create offenders as well as victims.

[@Iisho]

I'm only a few minutes in the video, but I wanted to say that I dont think the terms "NOMAP" or "MAP" should be used because I worry they normalize pedophilia. I know these people cant control their urges, I have no ill will towards those who actively fight against their urges, but I still think it's something we shouldnt try normalizing. I'm also a little biased. Growing up as an artist in the late 2000s/early 2010s, "MAP" means a "multi animator project" to me and I'd like it to retain that meaning 😂

[@bigwhy6845]

how do these terms normalize pedophilia? If anything, it might be less distressing for victims because the term "pedo" is a lot more graphic. Like you're listening to a therapist's channel. Why would he not use the most up-to-date clinical term.

[@Iisho]

@@bigwhy6845 Maybe it's cause I'm on tired brain but I cant really articulate why it worries me. Just that the use of "MAP" gives me a sinking feeling. As for how that makes it normalized, it's precisely as you said. It's a less traumatic word, it's easier.

[@ahchiso]

@@Iisho I get that and sorta feel the same way solely because of the usage of it on Twitter or tumblr. Ppl on those use those terms in a context that makes it seem like sexuality terms rather than a philia that is more specifically abnormal and morally incorrect (given its impact on the survivor's psychology later on). But at the same time, the terms are pretty self explanatory.

[@lucylohan8894]

THIS!!!!!! Just like how we won't name shooters... why give these people any way to normalize or any chance to feel normal cause it's not!!!!!

[@kat_likemeow]

​@@lucylohan8894no one is saying it's normal? Hence the encouraging to seek treatment / therapy..

[@skrapelotto]

I also wanna add that I think Jay has some demons that he is not ready to face yet. and he isnt gonna tell the full truth about his condition bc he knows it could be incriminating. The biggest red flag showing that is him being sexually attracted to kids but he says that every feeling he had for his niece wasnt sexual or romatic. But he says it was like be was inlove. Makes no sense at all. If that was the case he wouldnt feel bad about that situation bc there is nothing wrong with being very close with a family in that way. He knows telling the truth would mean they would look into other things and also his brother would hate him even more and never give him a chance. All ima say is I read through bullshit. I watched many interviews and interrogation sessions with liars and manipulators. Ppl who have done some of the most heinous crimes I found myself having some compassion for them and I’d be like “Hold tf on….” 😂 Jay isnt the truth

[@JonMcIntosh-sc9wl]

I agree with your assessment of Jay. I don't believe for a moment that he didn't have sexual or romantic feelings for his niece. Sounds like he was obsessed with her and that's not a normal Uncle/Niece relationship.

[@TeethSink]

The idealism you have towards no-maps is ridiculous. I understand your approach toward the social nuance; not instantly rejecting or demonising no-maps, but you're being so generous with the individuals ability to control and regulate themselves. As sympathetic as you are I can guarantee you wouldn't allow these people to be alone with *your* children. Regardless of how harmless they may appear.

[@tinam761]

I deeply appreciate Jay giving this interview. I can’t imagine his struggle. I also believe he does not see all the ways in which he HAS been inappropriate with children. I don’t want to bash him and at the same time … I’m concerned. He seems to want to have it both ways… he excuses predators that HAVE offended. He doesn’t seem to have any disgust or anger over the fact people HAVE offended. That’s a HUGE problem. I hope he stays in therapy. He should probably never be In relationship with children. Some of what he described sounded normal and even paternal/ uncle kinds of feelings… but some level of too far. I hope he gets the treatment he needs and deserves… he is a human created to love and be loved in return.

[@epileptictrees5213]

Dr Honda nerding out about the possibility of life on other planets is an appreciated and wholesome digression.

[@talla8555]

My question is is it possible that EMDR may help Jay with the original inciden5 when he was 5? If the brain can reprocess these incidents is there a chance that maybe Jays preference may change?

[@biggy_fishy]

Great question

[@berenonehand]

17:30 yes, his description of his feelings towards his niece doesn't make much sense. He's a MAP, but he had no sexual feelings for her? Not credible. 21:25 being in therapy does not necessarily mean someone is less at risk to offend. You are inflating practical efficacy of it. 23:30 you are making pronouncements based on a tacit assumption that Jay was not lying to you about anything. That's just not realistic. Yes, I know, in order to help someone as a therapist there has to be a baseline of trust; you kind of have to believe them to an extent. I understand, but that does not change the fact of the lying at all. What it does is make you unconsciously deny or diminish the importance of it, in order to be effective at your job. But the lies are still there, if they are there. Your help isn't going to be very helpful if you are helping a lie. 28:55 sorry but men without any children of their own who are nevertheless interested in children are in a high-risk group for pedophilia. I'm not saying that most of them are pedos, just significantly more of them than the general pop.

[@biggy_fishy]

💯 is kinda a red flag that this doctor minimizes all the grooming behavior...map himself? I'd bet on it.

[@samanthaettlin1831]

I'm having such a hard time listening to this because of the incredible gaps in dr. Hondas memory! Follow ups are supposed to help tease out details and nuance, but how is that possible when the original interview is so misrepresented in the follow up? No shade, Kirk...just please listen to the first interview before answering the follow up questions!!!

[@GirlCalledKau]

Could you be a little bit specific? I can't identify any gaps and i just listened to the original interview. This is a genuine question, not trying to pick on you or Dr. H...

[@peskycritter79]

@@GirlCalledKau For example, the way Dr. H describes Jay's brother finding out is very different from what Jay said in the interview. In the interview, Jay said that someone online outed him to his family, while in this video Dr. H said that Jay told his brother.

[@genetoretum]

Both happened. Someone outed him to his family and cumulatively he broke down dropping hints while trying to come out with it and the evidence caused the rejection.

[@biggy_fishy]

​@@peskycritter79 how did the person on the internet know?

[@juliesquirrel]

He had been posting supportive comments to about the map community on his red duty and a moderator of his was able to piece together his identity through bits of info she came across on different platforms. She outed him

[@GillyTheKid14]

I'm 29 years old but I wanna be like Dr. Kirk when I grow up😁

[@saragoodwin7855]

At timestamp 21:10, you ask the listener “could Jay have had this kind of relationship with the 5 year old?” and then go on to explain how inappropriate his feelings actually were. So the answer is no. And there’s no evidence other than the fact that we’re all clocking it, he was not being completely honest and truthful of his feelings. People who want to harm, whether intentional or not, other people need help and to stay away from those who are vulnerable to them at all costs. It’s not worth the risk.

[@susiesus]

I think Dr. Honda is a little too attached to his idea that if there was less stigma MAPS would reach out for help, therefore decreasing instances of child abuse... The flaw in this idea is that even as Jay said... sexual abuse is not always based in MAPS status but usually in being cruel or in power. I don't think this new society in which MAPS didn't have stigma would eliminate as much abuse as Dr. Honda thinks, although it def would decrease a certain amount.

[@44nk96]

Thank you for always helping to empower people with knowledge.

[@PequotRican]

I am a survivor of CSA and I think this is a very important conversation to have. But we all need to be honest, there is a cure. Its hormone therapy. And if a NOMAP really doesn't want to offend, they will be willing to voluntarily get on meds. Otherwise, I don't believe them and they are a danger.

[@tinam761]

💯 💯 💯!!!!!! If a NOMAP truly does NOT want to offend… there are measures they can take. The hormone therapy would help … no social media would help … lots of things can be done. They just aren’t choosing to do it.

[@genetoretum]

The first time I watched the Venture Brothers, I was SO HORRIFIED that they'd literally write in a pedophile like Sgt. Hatred. I hated myself for feeling more sympathy for him as the show went on. It reminded me of the feelings I grew for my groomers as a child. My boyfriend pointed out to me that Hatred did not want to have these feelings, and told me that there are people in the real world who go as far as to become eunuchs to avoid harming little children. I didn't know that before he gently told me that. I didn't understand the difference between my abusers and someone who was traumatized into being unable to be attracted to adults. Just food for thought -- Hatred took medication to tamp down his urges and it reminded me here.

[@JustEye_La]

I wrote a post in the first post about this interview with a pedophile that our son was abused by his own biological, mother. We had no idea what was going on . Mostly bc he had a speech impediment. When he was 8 he came home from a visit with his mom and told his dad that his mom forces him to shower with him and he doesn’t like it. He even asked her to stop doing this. Ironically it happened at his grandmother’s home and as I listened to him myself, I found this very odd that no one said anything? The following visit that he had with his mom- she forced him to shower with her. His dad and I paid for his mom to have a mental evaluation. As more of the details came out, it was very difficult to process. Teachers had asked me why his mom was showering with him but I had no idea why or how it bothered our son so much. I’ve never called a crisis center but when I did they told me and I quote “ there is much more to this story. This isn’t all that happened “. I write this to tell parents to listen to their children. Especially your sons. Boys aren’t valued or even reported when it comes to sexual abuse. Back to our son’s mom, She told the judge that she thought our son enjoyed showers with her. Even the judge was in shock. Be on the child’s side. This is their childhood.

[@MariaG345]

I’m sorry. I can’t with the whole “minor attracted person” as a sexual preference. It is disgusting. Since when do we categorize mental illness as a “preference”? You’re crossing a very thin line here from compassion to acceptance and normalization. Not ok. This term is not officially recognized by any major authority in psychology, those who have tried to push it have lost their credibility and their jobs.

[@eh1126]

Exactly! Especially a sexual deviance that, if acted on, is extremely psychologically and physically damaging to children. They deserve to be protected and these monsters are a waste of air.

[@user-lh3sw4tq2n]

Really disgusting 🤢

[@AllyMack23]

He is not advocating for it to be considered a sexuality.

[@eh1126]

@@user-is7mm9jo1u it is functionally no different? Are you on drugs? Heterosexual or homosexual sex between two consenting adults doesn’t end in physical, emotional or psychological trauma (unless there’s boundary violation). In what world does s3x between a child and an adult seem okay to you? Children do deserve more empathy and protection as they are in their formative years and cannot protect themselves.

[@MariaG345]

@@AllyMack23 I never said he is, but even if I did that is debatable. He is definitely advocating for “de-stigmatization”. Utilizing the term “minor attracted person” and words like “prefers” and “can’t control” at the very least demonstrates he strongly believes this belongs in the umbrella of sexual preferences.

[@raincadeify]

Exactly. You can't negotiate this kind of relationship without harming the child's sense of what's appropriate and possibly setting her up to be abused by someone else. Jay is saying he's a special case, HIS love is "pure" and he still supports his behavior as acceptable, because HE says he didn't SA her. I've talked to a half dozen pedophiles and this is the script. Just listen to Michael Jackson's justification for a middle-aged adult repeatedly having boys (all in the same age range, another red flag) sleeping in his bed. All because he loves them in a harmless way. If Jay has a 'special' bond with a six yo, let him set up a college fund, not pose as a playmate. I'm kind of appalled that Honda seems willing to risk more harm to the child because Jay is depressed. There's a lot of distance between wishing death on Jay and pretending anything he says after "I can only be sexually attracted to 6 year olds" (but not my niece) is the truth. Jay knows that Honda has a duty to report, that there are no guarantees that he might get doxxed by a listener, risking criminal charges, and he has admitted he'll give this overly sympathetic interview to his family. This is all classic manipulation by a sex offender. This time and energy would be better spent showing how healthy boundaries can be established without involving children at all.

[@IARRCSim]

1:02 Trigger warnings are overused in general and in the original video too. People can be triggered by anything and everything. The title of the video is "Interview with a Pedophile". The video title alone should be sufficient warning about what could be said in the video.

[@MemoryRJohnson]

The conversation around "NOMAPS" also seems to imply that the only reason why they are not offending is because it isn't socially acceptable. If they found a society where this behavior was accepted, would they still not offend? If I found a society where it was socially acceptable to kill, I am 100% certain I would not kill, because I truly believe taking life is wrong. Do they truly believe pedophilia is wrong, or do they simply not want to be caught and jailed?

[@epileptictrees5213]

Is it that hard to comprehend that someone can have a desire they know is wrong, and make the decision not to act on it?

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@callmekirkland8 Because they know it causes harm.

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@callmekirkland8 Sure, buddy. Whatever you say.

[@MemoryRJohnson]

@@epileptictrees5213 Absolutely! And I said so above. My question was if it was socially acceptable, would they act on it? Their reasons for wanting to identify as "MAPS" seem self-serving.

[@epileptictrees5213]

@@MemoryRJohnson The idea that they know it is wrong, objectively, would imply that they wouldn't act on it in a society where it is acceptable.

[@juleslynn476]

I get what you're trying to do here and I'm grateful there are folks like you Dr Kirk willing to stomach this in order to try and prevent this child abuse but...I just can't...maybe because I was a victim as a child and that just makes me unable to hear all this out and listen at all, I dont know, but as a survior I just wanted to let you know that I support what you and others are doing with this. Good luck to you and thank you.

[@toeachitsown2050]

Everyone here seems to agree that the older relative abused Jay at 5, yet we ignore what he did to other kids as he was growing up, yet claims he didn't do as a teen, although he thought his urges were "normal" until early adulthood?

[@juliesquirrel]

Im sorry but we can’t treat some adults as above suspicion because they are not known to be attracted to minor children. It would be wonderful if we could be open-minded and free of any bias based on the adult’s gender. Unfortunately we can’t. It’s only logical to view adults taking an interest in your children with some suspicion and not leave it to chance. It’s not as if someone who is likely to sexually offend against your child will make it known. It’s a parent’s duty to recognize that other adults are, in general, not terribly interested in your children and to not risk placing their children in situations where they are unnecessarily vulnerable. If an adult man’s (or woman’s) feelings get hurt cause they are viewed with a degree of suspicion so be it.

[@marilyn3605]

I deeply feel bad about what happened to Jay as a child. However, if he says he’s not harmful to children why tell anybody about this darkness? Then he doesn’t trust himself? I don’t know. I am very conflicted by this 😮Help

[@genetoretum]

So he can get help for it probably. Idk. Why does anyone tell anyone about their mental health condition? I am not a MAP, I am not a pedophile, but I was sexually offended as a child, by another child who was being sexually offended by an adult. Just as well, I was sexually offended by adults throughout my childhood. The fact that I'm able to be sexual at ALL today is a bloody miracle, but if it had altered my brain so much that I was only able to be attracted to the demographic of my abusers... I could have ended up Just Like Jay, we all could have, no matter how hard it is to comprehend for any of us at this point in our lives and development. It is a tragedy what happened to Jay. Purely and simply. I do believe he did the right thing by trying to tell people around him that he was pushing these feelings down. This is the responsible thing to do. I don't think it's because he didn't trust himself, I think it's because he just needed help bearing it all. Seeking help for any other issues like psychopathy doesn't inherently mean you don't trust yourself, it just means you are AWARE that you need help. I wouldn't want to be Jay's friend because it would trigger me too much to think about my childhood, but Jay deserves a support system and friends who can handle him..

[@flask223]

I mean if u have pedo thoughts or attraction u need to go to therapy. Don't try to tell ppl to keep it to themselves bc thats the most dangerous

[@enderthexenocide760]

The attitude you are portraying is the very thing this doctor is arguing against. You think someone who wants to talk about their attraction to children must be viewed with suspicion because they aren't just keeping it to themselves. That's the very problem, people who are nomaps are afraid to talk to someone because of your attitude.

[@enderthexenocide760]

Haven't you ever just wanted to be understood by the people you are close to, or that you want to be close to? Sometimes it is as simple as that. Wanting to talk about something like an attraction to children does not equate to fearing you will harm children.

[@Nall412]

Weird way of thinking about it.

[@nattyfeatureseverything6179]

as a survivor its interesting to see how much i can actually relate to him with not when it comes to having attraction to minors but with the alcohol and drug addiction and the burying my traumas in those things the forced awkwardness in intimate relationships with others who will never understand me or what i m going through the fear of being manipulated or feeling manipulated even in seemingly healthy relationships or what i call false red flags

[@susanmehalick4664]

Thank you so much for doing this interview. It was very informative.

[@hannahlabyrinth1945]

I’m really disappointed of the defense on pedophilia “stigma”. It’s not a damn stigma. If you’re a human being, it is wrong and twisted. You might as well call murder a stigma. These people would absolutely offend if it was socially acceptable.

[@Svartr.HrafnSvartr]

@@iamjay6112 Hi Jay. How would you know you wouldn't? Even people engaging in socially acceptable relationships find themselves in situations they never intended to find themselves in. Emotions can be overwhelming enough to override our better judgements.

[@JustSayRance]

@@iamjay6112 What do you make of the people who look back positively on their sexual relationship with an adult as a child?

[@JustSayRance]

@@iamjay6112 I agree yeah. While I was surprised there were people who felt that way, they are a minority. As for the majority who look back on it negatively, it also seemed to have profound negative psychological effects. There are even psychobiological consequences to the act. Anyway, I respect you for doing the interview. As someone who is non-exclusive but with a preference to young since age 19, I absolutely understand at least part of your struggle.

[@prahslra]

I worry about how the niece might have felt after Jay suddenly disappeared from her life. Surely she would have felt abandoned.

[@auggies1able]

I always listen at 1.5 x the speed, otherwise I lose focus really quickly. thank you for this incredible channel ❤️

[@Vivacious_Chaos]

Currently I'm educating myself on Pedophilia and Ephebophilia. The latter I think is rarely talked about the harm of CSA is similar. I have experienced both but that isnt the point of my reply. I recently came across a person who I think is a MAP. I dont know for sure but I had a visceral reaction. I am trying to understand my anger response to MAP also, why this person felt okay to tell me about their um, "urges". I appreciate the work your doing. This topic needs to be discussed as well as the dark triad people with particular proclitivites to harm or maim people sexually.

[@SGHNTZ]

I have been trying to understand myself since I was like 15, my past wasn't even bad, I didn't experienced harm, I still couldn't find anything helpful in 7 years, I have theories and ideas of why and how, but I don't think simply understanding can do much tbh.

[@Vivacious_Chaos]

@victorluciscaleum You might be right. But I don't know another alternative at this point, and understanding or learning to understand hasn't led my astray yet. I didn't think of what it must be like to live as MAP. I appreciate your reply, truly. I don't think MAP is broken or even traumatized , but can be different in ways that are hard to understand.

[@ThePrince96]

I didn't trust Jay to be honest. There were several times throughout the interview I got the feeling he wasn't being truthful. Certain stories he told, when you asked for further detail on them, he gave very flaky or even sometimes distracting answers.

[@christyparis4935]

Leave innocent children alone! I don't care what you identify as.

[@wallybingbang4350]

Having empathy for these people is like leaving your door open at night.

[@donpeace894]

Yes it's ridiculous

[@javierpacheco8234]

But what kind of door? You just said door, it can be any door?

[@wallybingbang4350]

@@javierpacheco8234 Or a window Children are snatched in many ways Have you seen ‘The Sound of Freedom’ ? 😱

[@epileptictrees5213]

You should definitely talk at length at the MAP label and why you use it, since it seems to be the number one thing people talk about on these videos.

[@user-up9jf1jq2w]

I have found that when aggressors are trying to work on me as an easy target, because of my victim vibe, they get a strong push back which probably surprises and hopefully frustrates them. However, I have to admit that it usually scares me a lot when I am still in communication with them.

[@pedrogonzales9202]

Does "follow up" mean that the interview continues? I'm into this video 1/3 already, and so far, it's all commentary. I'm more interested in the interview itself. I get that the commentary is part of it of the whole, but... One does need a lot of patience here.

[@biggy_fishy]

Yeah your missing the interviewed person. We want a follow-up with Jay. You didn't even listen back to the interview first.

[@steamengineer100]

I’m reading a lot of “no map is allowed in my child’s life” attitude presented here. The entire point of this program is to shed light on this topic and share humility to maps who are non offending. These could be anyone in your life. Are you sure they aren’t in your circle? Words are cheap and text online is cheaper so save your assurance for when you look in the mirror. And consider accepting that you may be friends with one of these people. (Meaning you should reconsider your previous ignorance to this condition) this poor man was afflicted with this condition and couldn’t have a decent relationship with his niece and brother because in-part, he was honest.

[@SGHNTZ]

I strongly disagree. The best way to be sure that we never cause harm to them is to remind ourselves that it's bad, whatever our thoughts are.

[@anniepaul13]

Omg all these tangents. Spending half an hour on a letter that's not even about the interview but about someone not having a reaction to the interview??? Are you avoiding the feeling that something isn't quite right?

[@lisahere859]

I'm shocked that a doctor feels that there's only harm done if it is somehow "proven" by empirical evidence. It is well established that grooming is harmful per se. There is nothing complicated about that. Please look into grooming which often involves favouritism etc, known as targeting the victim.

[@serendipity1237]

That is absolutely not at all what he said.

[@justthatgirl-ct4jo]

​@@serendipity1237I swear I think people aren't even listening. Why cut on a podcast lol?

[@scotwells7573]

Given the climate today if I knew I was that way I wouldn’t want to put myself in a situation where I would get 10 years for saying hello to someone’s kid.

[@flask223]

Sus

[@awkward_alex8661]

the relationship with his niece was weird. he thought of her all the time in a more obsessive way, like you said in a relationship sense. even if nothing was going on, it was none the less weird. js bc he didn’t act on it, doesn’t mean he wasn’t in the future because based on how obsessed he said he was. i’m hope there is some sort of program that helps pedos be able to change, some won’t change or still offend, those are the people are the ones we should hate. people can’t change unless they want to edit: btw i really like how you give a lot different examples

[@BH-sr1kb]

The safety of the child comes first regardless of whether the adult feels slighted/hurt/insulted/discriminated etc against. It is the job of a parent to protect their child and it would be negligent to put them even in a situation of potential harm which may or may not eventuate. There is no grey area here, a 'minor attracted' person does not have the right to decide how much exposure they 'should' have to a child. Would you let a reformed alcoholic run a liquor store? No matter how insistent they were that there would be no risk to their sobriety the potential is always there. Since when is it okay to risk the safety of a child just to make an adult feel accepted in society? I have two girls, there is absolutely no way I would even contemplate allowing them to spend time with an adult who admitted they were developing feelings for them. Even if they didn't admit it, if I noticed an adult singling out one of my children and spending excess time with them, I would absolutely put a stop to that. As a parent that is my role, it has nothing to do with the feelings of the adult in question, but everything to do with the safety of the child.

[@user-up9jf1jq2w]

I felt from his account that he is in love with his niece too.

[@palomafernandez6748]

Frankly if this person is attracted to children but is telling you they dont feel that way about your daughter and that they would never do anything to harm them it still is not worth risking you risking her welfare. I would respectfully demand that there is no longer any contact until that child is an adult. You can be trusting all you want but you can never truly know what is going on inside that person and he clearly seems to be telling himself his feelings are not physical attraction or romantic but then what is it? It could just be a strong familial bond but what are the odds that that is the case?

[@Lorry1094]

What’s wrong with the relationship is because he has secrets desires for her and there’s a very strong possibility for that to turn into grooming. It’s fine if you don’t have those feelings. He also admitted towards the end that he felt in love with her, and also wasn’t a Reddit user who ousted him to his brother?

[@MemoryRJohnson]

Thank you for sharing this video and taking the time to talk to this person. It's a difficult and divisive issue. Not all men commit sexual offenses. But enough men do to where it is a legitimate, constant concern. It is a concern that cannot be waved away by saying "women do this too." We aren't safe even in our own families. We aren't safe with our husbands or friends. I believe all people should have access to mental health without having to deal with stigma, but the reality is that our concerns are more than valid. And until we can do something about the ridiculously high percentage of men who commit sexual offenses, I will act accordingly for my own safety and peace of mind. I reject the idea that pedophilia is a sexual orientation. That is a very offensive assertion. If it was a sexual orientation, where are the large numbers of people who are sexually attracted to only elderly folks? You do not get a cookie for simply not acting on your impulses. That is not enough. People should be free to get the help they need. But until the work is done and there is a shift in those statistics, I don't really care.

[@kyledawson4535]

I agree this stuff happened alot, but women commit it just as much and are just not caught or it is rationalized. I'm not disregarding the problem, in fact I actively research the topic. But to blame all men for somthing only a few do and only blame men when women do it to is sexist.

[@MemoryRJohnson]

@@kyledawson4535 Women obviously do commit these crimes. However, men commit the VAST majority and that's just fact, even when you take into account underreporting. Those are literal facts.

[@Brian.001]

I'm not clear on your argument. " If it was a sexual orientation, where are the large numbers of people who are sexually attracted to only elderly folks?" If it is NOT a sexual orientation, but some other sort of attraction, where are the large numbers of people with a similar attraction to old people? How does the label 'sexual orientation' imply that there must be a parallel orientation to other age groups?

[@MinisterRedPill]

Thank God I don't have these urges. It's crazy! I wonder if these people were molested when they were young?

[@pasta2339]

I’ve noticed a huge difference between the professional and personal outlook on Jay story, and I think we need to shift more to the professional side of it. This is because when we think about someone getting that is close to us, we often at a rationally and so the more personal answer to Jay’s situation is no contact. However, when we look at it, rationally from third viewpoint we can assess what is actually best for the situation. From cheese history in life fully believe that we need to take his words as his honest interpretation of events, he wouldn’t be going on a podcast about something with this much social stigma without being 100% truthful. He wouldn’t be at that point.

[@ClairesMyth]

No but she has a point about attracting predators. I use the analogy of blood in the water, they will come at a higher frequency bc of the sixth sense that you've been harmed/are vulnerable. The more we heal, the more those interactions will lessen but we will always have more of those types of people than a normal person

[@countcoupblessings979]

13- late 20's is fraught with lots of new & different types of rejections, Normal rejection. We all must learn healthy coping through that time .Sucks that he had a warped sense of what accepted / special was .

[@notnow7829]

I think society does always question when a man is working w or in charge of kids but I think it's warranted. I also think we need men like you to be more vocal about men pedos that offend children and speak against it instead of telling us that society is wrong for alienating them. And calling them maps is a dangerous norm. The word Pedo is a red flag and let's adults and children know to be cautious around them. Teaching kids to call them Maps is like trying to desensitize them to the fact that those men are getting aroused around them. So I will not ever call them maps. They are pedos and should get extensive therapy for that.

[@bonnie3937]

I do believe that their are sexual predators that have little or no empathy, that their need is sadistic control, they need to be treated as any predator, rapist. However, for pedophiles that seek help and support and truly do not want to harm a child need support and help.

[@bonnie3937]

I am speaking of the pedophile who does not act on his attraction.

[@gangstaboy9387]

Im sorry but I feel like you really made the last question harder than it was lmao. She asked, plain and simple: "Is it normal for children to have a sexuality and be sexual creatures without having been through abuse?". Why did you read so much into it? It's a very interesting and common question

[@sethscarboro2682]

I think if you could turn back the clock he should just not have had contact with the five year old period. the risk is too great.

[@abbeynormal252]

My wife and I sought marriage counseling due to many issues, but the main one was lack of intimacy on her part. She was having PTSD from a childhood/teen rape. So we wound up with a Therapist the specialsed in sex therapy. She didn't just treat victims but also SO's (usually just getting released from prison) for the state and federal government called Sex Offender Treatment Program. I guess it's done in a group form. It sounds like this Jay should maybe look into this. Im not sure how, though there might already be something out there for that. Talking to her gave me a whole new perspective and understanding for my marriage and wife.

[@light9623]

Thank you Dr. Honda