Investment Casting VS Ceramic Shell for Bronze Sculpture

[@itsclearasmud7718]

I cast bronze at UH in Honolulu in 86. We used USGS plaster mixed with very fine silica sand (100 mesh) as the investment. Cheap and available mix. Its been 45 years but I think the ratio was 2/1. We also used a tapered main sprue that was J shaped. We cast sprues in wet plaster molds made for that purpose. The cup was attached to the top of the J. The taper in the sprue decreased toward the hook in the J. The cup of the sprue was waxed to a piece of ply. And the model was attached at the hook of the J. Other sprues came off the J at an angle attaching to the sculpture and we waxed cotton string and drinking straws to form vents that were also attached to the ply before investment. The whole thing was surrounded by a tube of tar paper with a chicken wire innertube. It was cast with the investment upside down which always left the cup hollow for recieving molten bronze. The tarpaper was removed leaving a large block of plaster with an embedded chicken wire reinforcement ready for melt out. The trick was when you flipped it over and removed the ply, the cup was facing up. At that point the tapered J was hanging there in the investment under the cup. As you filled the cup with molten bronze the weight of bronze from the cup pressurized the bronze down the J sprue and up into the piece. The taper in the J created a venturi effect forcing bronze into the mold cavities and squirting out of every vent hole. We also used a shop vac after burn out and sucked and bits and ash out through the cup before the pour.. DM me if you want to chat.

[@bonedaddyshonestreviews6933]

I'm not a bronze caster, so this sounds like Greek to me, but seems to an ignorant person like me, that it's good advice for him in the future. But the year you said is the same year myself and my man was born, and we are both 37 , turning 38 this year, so, if you say it's been 45 years ago for you, I'm guessing you're referencing the year you started college. God bless you.

[@HobbyOrganist]

Funny thing about plaster is it starts to calcine and break down when it's heated to something like 135 degrees F. Burning the gypsum rock and grinding it up is how the plaster is made to begin with. I remember putting a small cast hydrocal sculpture in a ceramic kiln at cone 05 or 06, it warped and shrunk quite a bit, I can't imagine it works real well for burning out the wax and pouring in 2000 degree bronze, though I used a 50/50 plaster/sand mix to pour Brittania metal in, but that was only around 450 degrees F

[@itsclearasmud7718]

@@bonedaddyshonestreviews6933 38 years ago for me, not 45. Then I went on for a teaching fellowship/ MFA at UofO in ceramics. That being said, I'm a 56 model, so yea, older than dirt. I continue to cast bronze and other stuff using the same method. Though now they have no stir ceramic shell which for the small timer is a big improvment. Im sure there is a lot more chasing flash with plaster and sand.

[@bonedaddyshonestreviews6933]

@@itsclearasmud7718 I'm glad I was able to help you remember the number of years clearer, that way you don't make yourself seem older than you actually are 😜. I'm sure you appreciate not feeling older than you actually are 😊. And 56, in my opinion, is still somewhat young. Particularly because my mom died when she was 56 years old, and I was 19, so it's been 18 years ago for me now. So, please, at least for your own self-esteem, don't force yourself to FEEL older or SEEM older than you actually are. You ain't 56 years old, you're 56 years young. God bless you!

[@itsclearasmud7718]

@@bonedaddyshonestreviews6933 Im 68.

[@calicamo1]

I vote for the investment cast bison. I like the more detailed look, even if there are more flaws.

[@jayedwin98020]

I'm assuming the "flaws" can be dealt with, when doing the overall finishing.

[@DragonAtelier]

9:52 happened to me a lot of times ! I noticed that for me the thing that works best is after burnout to add 2-3 more coats of slurry only to „patch” the cracks which occured but are not eye noticable.

[@jamesmihalcik1310]

Fantastic comparison and discussion!

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Thank you!

[@jimkaletaBuffalo]

Great job. Thanks for sharing your projects

[@JuliaPaloma-u3g]

such a great video! The suspense!!! I'll save this video for when our students start thinking investment is so much better--for our shop, investment works so well, and ceramic shell takes so long between layers.

[@HobbyOrganist]

Ive made plasticene standing dog models in the 1990s, about 7" high with a base attached. I made plaster piece molds of the model, the German Shepherd took 7 molds. I then made block molds of those and poured in a soft liquid rubber, probably Polytek 74-40 and then I had a set of molds to cast plaster waste mold pieces in. I cast the 7 pieces for the German Shepherd and once soaped and assembled I poured the hot wax in. Some of the 7 plaster pieces came right off, some had to be drilled and broken apart to remove from the wax, then I had a near perfect wax cast with no attachements needed as the base and everything was integrated in the wax casting. I shipped that off to Parks Bronze in Joseph Oregon and had them cast it completely solid, artist supplied wax, patina ready was $110. I did the patina and mounting on a 1" marble base, it weighed 24 pounds. I still have the molds, and in fact I just cast the 7 plaster pieces this week and I also still have my wax pot that is half full of the nut brown wax I used 30 years ago, more than enough to cast the dog. I'm going to send the wax out to a foundry that is also in Joseph Oregon as Parks Bronze is no longer, neither is Weston Studio which I also used back then. Ive poured bronze in a college non credit class before, but it's a lot of work, you need the furnace and tools, so much can go wrong and frankly I'd rather just pay the foundry professionals who do this all day every day just cast the bronze for me and I'll do all the rest of the phases involved. It can be difficult to try and handle a blazing hot , heavy cruicible in tongs that has more than about 5# of metal in it by yourself. In the class we had a two man tong to lift the cruicible out= much easier with 2 people!

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

A well equipped foundry can cut down on the cost. It’s not worth it for me to take on projects like that. I turn down a lot of commission work. $110 in 1990 adjusted for inflation would be $264 today. There are a lot of steps to this craft.

[@Nickscreativestuff]

As fabulous as ever … my heart jumped when I saw the blow out … you seem to have perfected your vacuum technique so much it makes the shell process look rather rustic in comparison. It reminded me of when I participated in a weekend bronze casting workshop. I guess there are many different products around the world that can be used for this process, here in the UK Workshop I remember we used some sort of fume box with ammonia in it to dry the shells quickly. The burnout process hadn’t been at all flawless and there was a lot of cracked shells that needed repainting with slurry and then re-cured in the fume box. I suppose there are many ways to skin a carrot and I love how you show the trials and triumphs of being an experimental artisan. Top awards to you and your exquisitely entertaining channel … Nick

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Thank you for the kind words. Yeah there are lots of different ways to do it. I always think back to how the ancient people did this kind of stuff. It just amazes me that they could do such amazing work without power tools.

[@Nickscreativestuff]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios that would make an interesting video to try and recreate how ancient civilisations managed to cast their bronze pieces … N

[@jayedwin98020]

​@@lundgrenbronzestudios: The ancients had their tools and tricks, which would be really interesting to know more about. Although, the only power they had was the "arm-strong" method, which, in general, seemed to work quite well them.​

[@zunibuffaloman6141]

I teach casting at two different colleges, and use many different casting techniques. I start with broome/pasta, etc, Cuttlefish Bone, Tufa, Nature models, Foam, Sand, Dhokra, then Silicon & Vulcanizing molds for multiple injections, Wax in Clay, Wax Wires, Wax Carving, Investment, Steam, Ceramic Shell, and Slush. I do teach these methods in my Jewelry classes, but Green Sand and Ceramic Shell for Sculpture. All have their own style and results. I love giving my students a realm of casting possibilities. We are always open to different techniques and end products. Each is a learning experience, and that's the beauty of casting metal. We use Gravity, Centrifuge, and Vacuum methods with Oxy-Acetylene and Electromelt Furnaces for melting mostly Bronze & Silver. Thank You for sharing your knowledge and experiences...it's most helpful and inspiring!

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

That’s really cool. I’m sure I could learn a lot from you.

[@jagboy69]

I've seen fingerprints in metal using suspendaslurry, but I think all comes down to dewax of the shell. Both have their benefits, but reserve investment casting for jewelry and shell for larger pieces.

[@bitsandpeace]

Just found your awesome channel. I have been pursuing lost foam castings. But your videos are great. Thank you

[@jayedwin98020]

With "lost foam casting" do you burn-out the foam as you would wax? I'm guessing fumes from the foam burning out might be a real problem with regards to breathing.

[@liegesaboya33]

Congratulations for your pieces of art , for the way you teach us in the art of metal casting sculpture . Long life to your channel 💟 Best regards from the Samba Land , Brasil .

[@blueiris69]

I prefer the sharper look of the investment cast. Being able to see more detail in art is a good thing!

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah that’s true!

[@matthewbaker2573]

if your vacuum pump malfunctions, you can try releasing the air bubbles with vibration. putting on top of a washing machine when it's at full revs and tapping the bowl with a solid object will do the trick if you have nothing to hand

[@DragonAtelier]

15:07 dang. US prices are high. In the EU I paid last year 180EUR for the bucket od SS RS

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Shipping price is the killer.

[@DragonAtelier]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios yeah. But I got info that the price is 2x higher if you want to buy in winter season when the slurry can freeze - then they ship in special containers to prevent that. Either way - 180EUR is about 200usd so a lot less than 300usd shipped - the price without shipping with self pickup is 120EUR

[@mevk1]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios Back in the day I purchased my investment from a local aluminum foundry. Don't remember the brand names (they used two different types and both worked equally well on my silicon bronze castings). Getting harder to source locally as it seems like everything is made in china these days. Still doesn't hurt to call around or just stop in and ask if they can spare a couple 20lb bags.

[@nuclearmantis666]

I like the plaster method, preparing the wax model with powdered gravel&plaster by coating.

[@thebicyclesafaris]

Thanks for sharing your stuff, this was really great info!

[@Phil_Cleaver]

Everyone is invested in their own technique 😊 But I am in the plaster investment camp. I have a different technique to yours where I build up detail layers first then follow up with a course flood layer. If an artist leaves their finger prints in the wax I intend to reproduce them. The best advantage of using plaster is that you can dunk it in vinegar and then water jet the last of the clinging investment off. No need to wire brush. The used dry investment goes into the crusher and anything up to 2/3 recycled goes back into the next flood layer for the next project. No one technique fits all circumstances but for small sculptures with a high texture finish I prefer plaster.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Interesting. I haven’t heard of that method. You should make a video of it.

[@Phil_Cleaver]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios I use a different account of video. this is an old demonstration for students with errors included. I generally don't share it. kzbin.info/www/bejne/q2KVi5dul8dgb9Esi=JziJVi6u6SAKa2Kk

[@agentfifteen]

I wonder if it would be possible to do 1 or 2 coats of the ceramic shell and then dip the rest into investment plaster? Maybe that way you will get the smoother finish of the ceramic shell method but don't have to wait as long as well as risk that It cracks?

[@DragonAtelier]

17:27 so for me. Slurry for big casts and bigger projects and investment for smaller ones like your bison. But that is only my opinion and I am not a pro metal caster 😁 peace 🤜🏻🤛🏻

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

That’s kind of what I’m thinking too.

[@walkthroughmania1]

The project is great, very intricate thought process.

[@LunarburnStudio]

Nice comparison. Reminds me that I need to do some spruing videos.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah. Spread you knowledge. I watch your videos but I forget things. Then I re watch them and I’m like, “oh yeah I forgot to do this and that, and I wasn’t suppose to do that”. But your videos are very helpful.

[@BobbyJ529]

What did you think of his problem and solution at 4:13?

[@LunarburnStudio]

@@BobbyJ529 He is right that you want to keep those holes open as long as possible to aid in drying but eventually they will close if you don't cut a large enough opening. In those situations when the hole can only be so big, it's okay to let close. The reality is that the core, because of compression, can be a dip or two thinner than the exterior shell.

[@kwaaaa]

1:50 note to self, don't ask her to hammer in a nail while you hold it, LOL.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

😆 no hammers!

[@avenuex3731]

12:56 you might consider running pins in to hold the core and fill it ahead, replacing the fill hole. Clip the pins after. Way less finishing.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Is that how you do it? Just leave the core inside. I always remove the core on my investment castings.

[@hj-clone]

no feeling like a failed casting. great save- you could match up a wax of the missing bits, but of course it's a lot of work attaching. Again with another well made video, frozen fingers and all-andy k

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Haha. Yeah I survived the frozen fingers! I can cast another day!

[@hj-clone]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios I use suspendaslurry to pretty good results. gets heavy dipping and coating, "catbox method". some say you can fill them with water to check for leaks, I don't, but I should. when I use satin cast it is in the centrifugal caster which is really fun. that stuff costs so much to ship I drove to Oakland (100 mi RT) to save the $150 for 100 lbs. my flasks are 3-1/2 X 6 max, but for that small stuff it is often silver, like your strawberries.I haven't done much hollow ceramic shell-it is tough to remove, and I just gas weld.andy k

[@MuskratOutdoors]

I love your videos. I learn a lot from every one of these. Just starting this, I need to figure out as much as possible before doing it. Cost ads up fast when it doesn't work out. Because of cost, It looks like your investment plaster is the way to go. The ceramic dip I bet would have a lot of uses too, but looks harder, and costs more. Maybe use it on smaller things?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah it really depends on the size and shape of the think. The biggest flask of investment I’ve done was 15 lbs. any bigger than that and it’s gets more and more awkward to move out of my kiln when it’s red hot.

[@JohnJones-oy3md]

This video was definitely worth the wait. BTW, R&R should sponsor this channel.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I emailed them to see if they had affiliate marketing or anything like that and they never even responded.

[@JohnJones-oy3md]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios The bastards.

[@TreyLin]

Very informative! Keep up the excellent work

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I will try! Thanks!

[@DragonAtelier]

lets go :0. I was waiting for this from your side :)

[@angusmcnaughton4570]

This helps me a lot , I was wondering what the mysterious elvin Goo was in other videos. I am hoping that I can find something to make that will sell. Gotta be something. 🤔

[@desimirbobinac7073]

Hi, Bronze Studio. Tell me something. What is power and working volume of your electric kiln, and if you could share burnout schedule for suspendaslurry and ultravest molds.

[@micah2936]

I want to get into Lost PLA Casting, after watching this video I think I’d rather try the investment plaster. I just got a foundry that was purposed for gold, but I’m hoping I can utilize it for converting 3D printed into metal. Also I can design the vents into my model, so it looks like it will be way less complicated than wax

[@cianmoriarty7345]

If you're working with gold, why wouldn't you just get a resin printer? I'm assuming you can get a resin for them suitable for investments? 🤔

[@GoldMugu]

Hello Lundgren, i love your stuff

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I’ve seen some people bury it completely in sand. It might have saved this one. I’ve also seen people hang them up in the air which seems dangerous to me.

[@cindylundgren1924]

I love them both! Whichever you think is easier?

[@gppl77]

I've read that people spray IPA over the wax model prior to filling flask with investment. Not much, just to get the model slightly wet. This prevents air bubbles from sticking to the model. I'm using this from day 1 and haven't seen bubbles on models yet, though I don't have big casing experience.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

What is IPA?

[@gppl77]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios Isopropyl alcohol

[@gordoncouger9648]

In your case, I think better truly is the enemy of good enough. The quality of either casting is within the variability of factors beyond the investment method. The choice of using traditional investment methods or ceramic shells is made for reasons other than the quality of the final product. I expect the all-up weight of the invested pattern and final casting have a great deal to do with the actual choice of methods in commercial settings.

[@SculptyWorks]

I definitely prefer investment myself! 👍👍 I should hit you up sometime maybe about doing some collab casting video. 😁

[@neafranklin7905]

Personally I like the slurry. I'm curious.. Do you cast steel ?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

No. Casting steel is not really for a garage set up.

[@bigred8438]

Can I ask whether the investment is simply plaster of Paris or does it have added sand or some other fine grain substrate in it?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

It is not just plaster of Paris. It is specially made to take the heat and is also porous. Unlike plaster. You can use plaster by adding sand as kind of a poor man’s investment. But I’ve never done much with that. If you are going to go through all the steps to make a bronze it’s best to have good material.

[@emilywilliams2926]

Why did you have to evaporate the wax before putting it in the kiln with the investment bison ?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

It needs to melt out very fast. If it warms slowly it expands and cracks the mold. But if I put it in my electric kiln that hot the wax makes a big fire ball and nearly burns down my garage. Which isn’t good for business.

[@levitumlin7481]

I think that metal actually stays cooler if you turn the heat way up because then you can Weld faster and it keeps it cool. If you have the heat low then you have to have the heat on it for longer which makes things even hotter in my experience. But to each their own, and if it's working for you then that's great too! Keep up the good work brother

[@azvdcrafts6147]

I'm new to metal casting. I've heard that basic plaster in a pretty good material for casting aluminium and bronze. Is that true? How well does it work?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Honestly it doesn’t work very well. People do it but it’s not ideal. The people who do it usually mix it with sand so it has some permeability and you have to heat it very slowly to minimize cracking.

[@railwaybob1886]

Without burying the ceramic shell, it's more brittle than an eggshell. You bury the ceramic shell to add support to the shell so that it doesn't crack and the bronze pours out, ruining your casting.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Some guys hang their shells on racks in the open air a pour into them. I don’t know how they do that. But the thinking is if it does start to leak they take a cold piece of iron and seal the leak and continue the pour. If it begins to leak in the sand they can’t seal it. But it didn’t work out to well for me as you saw.

[@dustbinbroom]

You need a chill stick, a rod with a damp rag on it. Also after burnout patch all splits and cracks with furnace patch. Pour shell hot and with plenty of head pressure

[@johan97s]

For the investment casting process, how long do you perform burnout in the kiln after dewaxing? :)

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I try to follow the but our schedule for the specific investment. I use Ultravest.

[@Blake-gh8xl]

Dude the sad music!!! It got me!

[@liegesaboya33]

What kind of torch have you used to weld the tail of the bison ? Thanks

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Tig welder. AHP 201 alpha.

[@liegesaboya33]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios thanks !

[@fishcake959]

do you use a sealing coat after burnout? usually helps with cracks. wire is handy for large castings an flat castings but shouldn't be necessary for something like that. .

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

So what is a seal coat?

[@fishcake959]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios you can dip the shell once more (just slurry no grit)after burnout, it helps seal cracks and make the shell stronger. burring them would have probably saved that cast to

[@CdoGtheGreat]

Maybe you could cast the base completely separate and hollow out the entire under belly of the beast. Have countersunk mounting holes in the base and mounting posts under each hoof then tap and screw together. What do you think?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

That sounds like a good way of doing it but it still leaves a seam. If I fuse the wax before casting then it’s seamless which I think I prefer.

[@mevk1]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios On investment version, placing a larger sprue cup placement into under belly seemed more logical to me though shrinkage did not seem to be a problem, and as you say, parting lines were eliminated which is always a bonus. Looks like your better half, with some training, could make an excellent assistant. You two should collaborate on a project or two and see how it goes.

[@mevk1]

You know what they say "a family that plays together stays together

[@AshleyWaldron-y6h]

What is the composition of the slurrry?

[@hargrim6892]

combine these two methods. to prevent crack, pour that ceramic into ultra vest investment.

[@katalytically]

I think the investment casting is better, particularly since your vacuum seal was not working properly when you started pouring the bronze. You paused to improve the seal, which gave the bronze a little time to solidify before you continued the pour. So if your vacuum seal was good at the beginning, you may not have had some or all of the small bubbles.

[@paulrossell4884]

I use investment a lot. For years. It can vary from brand to brand, and the liquid you use. I know you used water, however some investment use a special liquid. If that liquid freezes, its fked. If you overheat, under heat, the metal, that can effect the cast. I few other things can have effects but im tired and going to bed. Great job though buddy, you made me wanna try some larger items. I do dental and jewellery.

[@sammason8444]

Can it be poured as a solid cast ?

[@edivanbraga6877]

Dude, could you tell me what yellow product is that you use to coat the wax molds?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

The yellow product is called suspenda slurry.

[@psylegio]

Both look good so for me the success/failure ratio would be the key as I am just beginning to learn and do not have silicone molds to make several similar items.

[@psylegio]

Would it work to just use bronze "chappies" to keep the inside on the inside and then just leave it at that or is there a practical reason to keep the statue hollow? I mean is there a way that one can fill the inside with investment, secured with bronze pins, cover it again with wax, chase it and cast it as if a solid piece?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah I have done that. I actually made copper corona virus where I made a hollow round ball of copper where I did just that. I filled it with investment and then I put the sprue over the hole so when I cast it the hole was covered and the center remained filled with investment. I don’t normally do things that way but it can be done.

[@psylegio]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios Thank you for the answer! There is enough equipment to invest(!) in without a welder so that is welcome. 😊

[@Madnikodemus2]

I like the one with the leg that tapers down to the size of a toothpick

[@mevk1]

Since it has one good side just display the "public" side -no one will know. Maybe? chop the bison head/shoulder, and mount plaque/trophy on the wall like the big-game hunters do. Also, like your bookend idea. Not a mistake but an opportunity.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah I thought about hanging it on the wall but I think I will try to make another and make matching book ends.

[@FahrulRozi-cu1rr]

Pengalaman yg sangat bermanfaat

[@DanielSMatthews]

Ceramic Shell probably makes more sense for larger pieces?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah that’s kind of what I’m thinking.

[@thomaskung1865]

how did you make the wax models?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

By pouring hot wax in and out of a mold.

[@thomaskung1865]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios so do you connect half molds like the ones they use for chocolate bunnies?

[@jakegingrich7214]

What is the core for? Why not just make it solid?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Because the thicker the metal the more I have do deal with shrinking. Thin uniform thickness gives the best results.

[@Ellington_Industrial_Arts]

You need to try using a Pyrex gas lens for your TIG torch. I think it'll make your life a lot easier. You get better argon coverage, a more stable arc, and it's much easier to see the tungsten for intricate work.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I’ll have to look into that. I don’t know much about welding. That’s a real science.

[@TEKKKNO]

Wonderful experience

[@hugoebuc]

You could use wax mixed with bronze metal powder, what you do is heat the wax to about 80 degrees Celsius and then with the help of a mixer add the metal powder passed through 200 mesh, also add a little borax, The mixture obtained is poured into a silicone mold in the shape of a chocolate bar to break the formed cubes. This wax can be reheated to 80 degrees Celsius, thereby It becomes fluid so that it can be injected with the help of a press, into a silicone mold with the necessary shape. After cooling, the shape obtained is covered with ceramic paste and everything is dried and melted at a temperature below the melting temperature of the metal used....

[@richmerj1401]

Where do you sell your castings?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I’m not good at selling my work. I sometime put it on Etsy but right now I don’t have anything up. Was there something you were interested in?

[@richmerj1401]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios I like your work. Just thought that you went through all this work to sell the statues. I love the bison and the impala.

[@lawrencebrown410]

Where do you buy the slurry?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I buy it from Rio Grande jewelry supply. Or Ransom and Randolph.

[@lawrencebrown410]

I like the videos that talk about the how and why parts of casting. I haven't seen a lot of videos explaining the process for home hobby casting. I want to cast bronze sword parts (cross guard and pummel) for an English long sword blade I have, but it's been hard to get started with all the materials equipment and basic knowledge of where to start or troubleshoot issues that may come up. Keep up the good work I always look forward to seeing your next post. 👍

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

@@lawrencebrown410 I always loved watching Alec steel make swords. He did some casting projects for some of his swords and that’s what inspired me to start casting myself.

[@Atanar89]

I really want you to test the difference between a selfmade clay slurry and the expensive product. I really want to know if making your own is a viable budget option if you have more time than money.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

That would be an interesting test. I’ve always wondered how the ancient people did it.

[@sierraecho884]

Did you try to make your own investment with fine sand?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

No I never have.

[@gordon6029]

Awesome vid buddy. Cue sad music.

[@mevk1]

I vote for investment. Seems cheaper and a little easier. In industry I think slurry might be reserved for higher temp metals like stainless, or where dimensional accuracy is critical like for NASA, maybe(just guessing again)?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I will keep experimenting with both but will likely use investment more often.

[@odysseyraven5930]

Hey Lundgren, I was wondering. Since you used two types of wax for your investment cast, do you steam the wax out for that and re use that as well? Wouldn’t the waxes mix together? I understand microcrystalline was is best for molds, but with the sprew wax mixed in, would you notice it becoming less useful? Thanks! 🙏🏽 I’m hoping to make a bronze statue this summer using your methods. I’m currently building everything and your channel has been a god send❤

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Oh it’s ok for them to mix. I reuse the wax and it works just fine but it needs to be cleaned. So I stretch pantyhose over a silicone rubber bread pan and pour the wax through to filter and crud out.

[@mevk1]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios a softer candle like wax of course gives less detail than hard pattern-grade wax.

[@sierraecho884]

Using wires or steel wool should help like steel reinforcement in concrete.

[@DragonAtelier]

10:36 i hope you used a dust mask cause dust from the slurry is pretty much dangerous

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I do use a dust makes most of the time. Sometimes I forget. I need to remember not to forget though.

[@DragonAtelier]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios yeah. Slurry dust adds up in ypur lungs in time like lead in your body. Do not know how to describe it properly in English.

[@jayedwin98020]

It would appear that using the "Investment Casting" process has a few more "pluses" than the slurry method. 1) Investment Casting seems to be just a lot easier method to use. 2) " " appears to take less time to accomplish, from start to finish. 3) " " your clean-up seems to be quicker, and a lot easier to do. 4) " " also seems to be a less expensive overall process. 5) " " doesn't appear to have the same blow-out problems. 6) " " has finer detail quality, when finished. Although, with all the above stated "pluses", "Investment Casting" appears to have one major draw-back. You are limited in the size of objects you might want to cast. From a quality standpoint, does it make any sense to cast in sections? On hollow objects, it would be a lot easier to clean-up. If casting in sections, would there be any advantages to making the walls of the casting thinner? The main downside I see, would be having to weld the pieces together, along with the added time for finishing that would be necessary. Also, would casting in sections enhance any of the overall quality of your castings? Lastly, do you carve your own wax patterns? If so, have you ever used "3D resin printing" to make your castible, wax patterns? Great video, and I'm looking forward to watching more of your videos soon! Thank You, Jim Dasher Spectrum Graphics Seattle metro area

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Blow outs can happen in investment too if it’s too thin. But the flask holds most of it together so that’s only an issue at the bottom. Cost and benefits can be personal preference. Some people prefer ceramic shell and some people prefer investment. But it really depends on the artist and the piece being cast. You can cast things in pieces but it’s usually just because of size issues. Or clean up. Welding is fairly simple but the metal chasing can be difficult and time consuming. So I don’t cast in pieces unless I have to.

[@jayedwin98020]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios: Any answer for my last question from above: Do you carve your own wax patterns? If so, have you ever used "3D resin printing" to make your castible, wax patterns?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

@@jayedwin98020 I have used PLA but never resin. I do make my own wax patterns though. I have several videos on that process and I’m working on some coming videos of that as well so stay tuned!

[@TKTrooper]

I think another problem with the ceramic shell failing is the sanding you are using to coat the model. You need to use silica sand. That will help with the shell cracking

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

It is silica sand. But it’s well rounded and I think I need an angular sand.

[@Mistertbones]

Both methods have their advantages and disadvantages. I'd say stick with investment casting for your main stuff, and save ceramic shell for larger projects.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I think you might be right.

[@mhernandezae86]

Holy hell. I didnt know you could use hot water to remove the wax. Looking through the rest of your videos to see if you have a more detailed video of that water wax removal.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I’ve never made a video about that but that’s a good idea.

[@mhernandezae86]

@lundgrenbronzestudios If you do ill be first in line to check that out. 😁 Also subbed and 🔔

[@joshlintula9457]

Nice!

[@TheTeknikFrik]

Nice video! I'm going to try lost pla casting next I think... but, man that molten bronze looks hot.. I think I'll stick to pewter or maybe zinc ;D (At least, that's what I'm telling myself...) Btw, not to be a party pooper and I know you welded just a little bit, but UV from welding is not good for the skin. Even worse than the sun.

[@In_Search_of_a_simpler_life]

I’m looking for help with investment castings of 5”x4”x2” brass sculptures. I’ve found loads of foundries, but very few with the artistic flair needed to pull off the right look, surface prep and volumes. (Please let me know if anyone has this capability) Let me know where I can send photos! Cheers!!

[@CdoGtheGreat]

Also that slurry needs water added as it evaporate. Maybe poor it into a smaller container when it gets too low. I think I would stick with investment casting.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Yeah I’ve heard that. I’m not sure how much water to add though. I’ve added some.

[@davidkeenan5989]

Well done.

[@Kefas226]

Try more amps and fraction of second for time.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

What will that do?

[@racheldeatherage1512]

So wait, is the investment method cheaper, easier, better, and faster? I vote investment :)

[@DragonAtelier]

yes for smaller casts - try to use it for a cast that is like 60cm hide 30cm wide etc - try to make a flask to use for that, and how much investment you would need to use to cover the pattern for it. for me suspenda slurry is better but only because I make cast bigger than 10-15cm in height.

[@DragonAtelier]

1:58 lmao - does it hurt 😂

[@TheBabins]

I am totally new to this channel and your artistry, but I was watching this view and I noticed your challenges with air bubbles. Have you ever tried to vibrate the air bubbles out? I believe this is done in some cement processes to get rid of air bubbles.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I have done that but typically my vacuum chamber works pretty well.

[@appatula]

Old fashion investment is a damn hardy process. Even for the large projects, reinforced investment (concrete reinforcing mesh or chicken wire) is pretty hard to beat if you're already set up for it. That being said; I've seen my fingerprints come through on bronze investment castings. The only catch 22 is if your sandblasting the piece anyway then putting patina down or finishing it doesn't really matter. The finish will be etched likely along with the very fine ceramic shell fingerprints. I've casted napkins with investment (Yes paper napkins infused with wax!) and the detail is certainly still there. The Investment vs Ceramic Shell choice really boils down to three things: Personal preference, your shop workflow, the size/weight constraints you have, and of course the type of casting. It's easier to coat slurry on a sprue than filling up a 55 gallon drum full of investment not to mention WAY lighter. They are both are great processes and both have their place. ...........Especially when you want to avoid dealing with cores and ramming up flasks with French sand or petrobond that can't cut the details! FYI For anyone who is interested in artisan lost wax bronze casting I can recommend the book: The Craftsman Revealed Adriaen de Vries Sculptor in Bronze by Jane Bassett. It details the construction of the waxes and casting techniques etc. of his sculptures from the late 1500's to early 1600's. X-ray photography is used to evaluate the processes that were used back then. It's quite amazing to see the mastery of casting achieved way back then! P.S. I must admit, seeing that snow in the background of the first pour in the video had me cringing a little! One thing you never loose is that fear of moisture when all of a sudden it's raining molten bronze!

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

How on earth do they move a 55 gallon drum of investment, and burn it out? That’s amazing. The biggest flask I’ve done was 15lb and that was super big and heavy to me. Love the info! Thanks for commenting.

[@jayedwin98020]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios: I guessing you would have one hellava large furnace! 😎

[@sierraecho884]

Pressure cast the investment with steel wool.

[@MikeG-js1jt]

Why wouldn't you have just made them solid?

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Metal shrinkage is the main reason. It’s very hard to get something that shape and size to turn out with out a lot of shrinkage.

[@homegunsmithunger598]

Seems that asking the wife for help is the same everywhere in the world... :D

[@Stonehaven2112]

I vote for the one with a complete butt. I think the chance of a blowout is inherent in the shell process and is a big flaw. Investment seems better. I liked seeing all of your processes to remove the wax too.

[@kozko-xe1xl]

If you put the suspenda slurry in a narrow bucket you'll have more height.

[@arrowdriver007]

Looks like the investment method is less expensive, quicker and a lot less work all way around.

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

For small pieces yes. It’s gets harder the bigger you get.

[@dumbvedeoz]

not sure about this method LOL!

[@TBATBA-qp1zz]

you need to invest in some leather gloves…10.32 is cringe worthy. They would help with your scorpion collecting adventures too … turning over rusted metal, rocks, debris, with bare hands ....sheeesh ATB ~ nice work

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

I do wear gloves on occasion.

[@TBATBA-qp1zz]

@@lundgrenbronzestudios ... lol , nothing like rolling the dice ! v nice work though !

[@3dguy839]

You obviously need more experience with lost wax with slurry

[@lundgrenbronzestudios]

Thanks for the advice.

[@FryingMike]

nicee

[@chera.]

❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@mikesproject4704]

investment casting