Is Alicent Hightower's Exclusion From Rule Her Punishment For Upholding The Patriarchy?

[@fabiolaliano8620]

it’s so weird to see people say she “chose” the wrong team….. you mean the one she created ?? you mean her own children ?? you mean she chose to be raised by otto ??

[@hawkins347]

I think show missed the mark when they didn't include that so long as Daemon is near Rhaenyra, Alicent's kids would never be safe, which I understand is the motivating factor for the usurpation more so than "can't have woman on the throne".

[@milananalim]

@@hawkins347 yeah but same goes to rhaenyras and daemons kids, they would never be safe if Alicents kids have any power.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yeah a not small portion of the audience seems to think she should have chosen Rhaenyra over her kids for the sake of girl power or something?

[@JohnDoe-vw4zf]

​@HillsAliveYT maybe don't support your father's rebellion against the royal family. She did have options and at some point, she has to make held responsible for her decisions.

[@HillsAliveYT]

@@JohnDoe-vw4zf They are the royal family.

[@mechamoons]

what annoys me the most is people now saying "now alicent finally learns what it feels like to be ignored/belittled/not being taken serious just because you are a woman." as if this hasn't been alicents reality her WHOLE life where she had to live in a world where her own fate and life was always driven by the decisions of men. have they completely forgotten the first season?

[@HillsAliveYT]

Exactly, her life has literally never NOT been like that.

[@Argos-xb8ek]

@mechamoons She had a lot of privilege throughout her adult life. She was the ruling Queen, and her father was Hand

[@mechamoons]

@Argos-xb8ek That does not diminish her struggles as a woman in a patriarchal society ever since she was a child. Obviously she has privileges, she is a noble woman of a big house. But Rhaenyra had and also has privileges, and still struggles to make herself seen as a powerful ruler because of her gender.

[@Argos-xb8ek]

@HillsAliveYT I mean she was atleast on the other side of this when it came to her opposition to Rhaenyra in mid to late season 1 looking to undercut, overspeak, or ignore Rhaenyra

[@jostockton.]

@@Argos-xb8ek and Rhaenyra had even more ❤️

[@Princess_Weekes]

I feel like the show doesn't really know how to allow the characters to be nuanced and I don't think Fire & Blood is perfect, but it understands what stories it wants to tell and have the readers interact and chew on.

[@Mic-Mak]

Princess Weekes! Haven't seen you in a minute. Need to catch up on your video essays. Hope you're doing good! 😊

[@GhostEmblem]

I feel that in Fire and Blood its way more clear cut that both sides are awful, so much worse than the show.Sometimes I think people forget how george writes this particular series. Its practically supposed to be anti monarchy propaganda. There is no good side and there is no such the as a good king the system itself is massively flaw and all of westerosi history is a case study on how fucked over everyone who is not the king, and also the king for that matter, is in a true monarchy. Thats the real nuance that everybody show writers inccluded seems to miss. There are no good guys everyone is out for themselves any 'good' is only an extension of that.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Agreed, the show writers seem to be bending over backwards to get rid of any potential nuance that the characters had in the books, and for whatever reason they seem to think that the book content isn't enough to keep viewers interested in a show so they keep adding things in that essentially change the meaning of the story from F&B. I don't think F&B is perfect either, but it had enough meat to make a TV adaptation on its own, and HotD keeps on trying to imbue things with greater meaning rather than letting the audience come to its own conclusions or letting the material just speak for itself.

[@joywagner979]

​​@@HillsAliveYTwhat do you consider nuance? I think the nuance in this show is so subtly nuanced that most people miss it. To me, the book was about as subtly nuanced as a sledgehammer to the face. Rhaenyra was cartoonishly terrible. Alicent was cartoonishly terrible. Their sides duked it out and everyone suffered outlandishly, The End.

[@hurremhightower]

@@joywagner979the nuance is non existent because the characters change their goals every episode

[@RoreyG]

The irony is that Alicent could have had that soft power she expected ala Olenna Tyrell if she was more outwardly warm and maternal with Aegon. As the video said, Aegon shows the most deference to her and he relies on her the most, even despite most of their on screen interactions being that she's scolding him, or using him. Think about it. 1. When she's scolding him post Dyana (sigh, can't stand this show only bs, but that's another story), he alludes to the fact that all he wants is her affirmation. Viserys too, but I believe he places a certain emphasis on her. 2. After Viserys dies, he specifically requests to see Alicent. 3. In the Carriage, he knows Viserys didn't like him compared to Rhaenyra and didn't truely believe that he changed his mind. He was contemplating going through with the coronation if he could make Alicent proud and get her affirmation. Hence, the "do you love me" scene. 4. He decides to take on the role of King not only because of the positive affirmation the smallfolk gave him, but because Alicent stepped in front of Maelys to protect him. That showed Aegon that his mother loves him despite of everything. And its the only good take away from the show change to that scene (seriously though, we lose more screentime with Aegon and Sunfyre to give the Black stans a bs girlboss moment with Rhaenys). 5. Post Blood and Cheese when he was fighting down Otto's plan to parade Jaeherys' corpse and use it as propaganda, he looked to Alicent for comfort and support. 6. At the end of that episode, when he's at his most vulnerable, he goes to Alicent's room to cry and mourn, expecting his mother to comfort him. 7. When he feels stifled by his small council, he seeks out Alicent so he can vent and for guidance. And when she tells him that he's basically useless and to do nothing, he feels deeply hurt. The reason he hopped onto Sunfyre and headed to Rook's Rest was to prove himself to his mother. To show her that he is actually capable. 8. Finally, when he gets burned and crippled and in great pain, he uses what little effort he has to call out to her, "Mummy". For all of the memes about Aemond, Aegon is actually the real mamma's boy. And if Alicent had translated her love for Aegon more warmly even since youth, he might be more inclined to not only seek out her guidance (as he does already), but will be more inclined to adhere to that guidance.

[@Loki-g3k]

Their relationship is so tragic and heartbreaking.

[@joaopedrolima904]

Perfect 👏👏👏

[@Jesussaves7811]

In an interview about this, Ewan Mitchell said that Aemond dismisses Alicent simply because he didn't want his mother disagreeing with his decisions in front of everyone. His reason was so simple that I didn't think of it. 😂

[@poenpotzu2865]

Makes sense, from his point of view his mother bickering him must feel emasculated.

[@DiarrheaIsUnbreakable]

Aemond: “Mom, you’re embarrassing me!”

[@Jesussaves7811]

@@poenpotzu2865 Yeah, he could have done it nicer though. He also says that Aemond still loves his mother and points out that when Alicent is caressing his face, the mask drops for a couple of seconds. The interview is on KZbin where Ewan explains what Aemond is thinking in episodes 5 and 6.

[@alialmuhanna4938]

I agree; the Regent being undermined by his parent is bad from. Further, one of Robert Greene’s Laws of Power describes how one should deal with predecessors, even if it was one’s own parent. Search “Law 41: Avoid Stepping into a Great Man’s Shoes” for more insight.

[@johanwestin3030]

@@Jesussaves7811 plus Alicent is not in the succesion.

[@kimberlyplatt2382]

Alicent supporting Rhaenyra makes no sense. Do people expect Daemon someone who openly hates and mocks Alicent and her children to suddenly disappear or be friends? Plus Rhaenyra only has power because the men in her life gave it to her, like her father and uncle, Corlys.

[@made-line7627]

You're on point, though I had to laugh at the idea that Daemon _wouldn't_ just "suddenly disappear" 😅

[@user-xh6jk4mi8u]

Exactly. Rhaenyra might let her kids live, but Daemon certainly wouldn’t.

[@HillsAliveYT]

And it's weird that this is so often overlooked, because the show really hammered at it in season 1 and 2. Daemon is extremely dangerous and this entire mess started specifically because he was too violent to even have a shot at the throne.

[@kimberlyplatt2382]

@@HillsAliveYT hell knowing Daemon. I doubt he’d allow any of his wife’s bastards to take the throne. Over his own sons with her.

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

I just wonder why people think she would side with Rhaenyra over her own children. Regardless of what the show tries to portray her as, she loves her kids. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra over her kids. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra over her own moral principles that state that siring bastards to pass off as legitimate is wrong. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra because she comes with Daemon whom openly hates her, her house, her father, and her children and certainly wouldn’t oppose eliminating them as threats.

[@Emma88178]

People dismissing Alicent for choosing the “wrong side” and she’s “upholding the patriarchy” is absolutely ridiculous. Do you people really think she would go against her OWN children?! And disregard her own children’s inheritance?! She knew how dangerous Daemon would be with her sons still alive. And Rhaenyra threatened to maim Aemond even more after he lost his eye. Why would she chose her?

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

I just wonder why people think she would side with Rhaenyra over her own children. Regardless of what the show tries to portray her as, she loves her kids. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra over her kids. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra over her own moral principles that state that siring bastards to pass off as legitimate is wrong. She wouldn’t choose Rhaenyra because she comes with Daemon whom openly hates her, her house, her father, and her children and certainly wouldn’t oppose eliminating them as threats.

[@user-ti5cw1ug6l]

The narrative is ironic in that Daemon is all "Whatever belongs to my wife is also equally mine" which is the definition of patriarchy and that the Black council is your stereotypical old misogynistic men. It seems like despite everything, the Greens do think highly of Alicent and only opted against her because of PR, Aemond because he thought she would constantly object to further war with Rhaenyra. Thanks to the misunderstanding, the sept scene, among other things he kinda called it right. Though, if he did it to book Alicent that would be pure misogyny.

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

Yeah book Rhaenyra and Alicent were both looking at this as a war and didn’t mind more blood shed at this point not like in the show

[@aicchi1234]

For real. People act as if Rhaenyra is championing the women's right movement in Westeros. She's doing this for herself. She doesn't care about other women. Didn't care about how Alicent was forced to marry her father, didn't care about Laena Velaryon's ashes to get cold before fucking Daemon, didn't care that by pushing her bastard to take Driftmark, she was taking away another girl's birthright. And there's nothing wrong with that. She doesn't need to be the beacon of feminism in Westeros to be a worthy queen, but people need to stop pretending that she is. If the feminist girlboss needs other women to give up their power, autonomy, and ambitions so that she can forward herself, then she's most definitely is not a feminist girlboss.

[@ComradeQuestion091]

THANK YOU

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

Exactly! I’m team Green leaning but I can sympathize and at times root for the Blacks. The problem to me is fans rooting for Rhaenyra simply because they think because she’s a woman, she’s a feminist and she champions women’s rights and her reign will bring gender equality to Westeros or the starting point to women’s liberation which is 100% untrue. She isn’t fighting for women to inherit she’s fighting for her to inherit. However just because she isn’t feminist doesn’t mean you can’t support to sympathize with her but fans shouldn’t support her just because they think she’s a feminist

[@ComradeQuestion091]

@@via-anghelmagahum2586 I agree, Rhaenyra doesn't come across as a feminist, but 2 things can be true at the same time. Rhaenyra winning and ruling would be a step towards equal treatment of women in Westeros...and a pretty significant step at that.

[@midnightcoffee6463]

@@ComradeQuestion091 I doubt it - Aegon the Conqueror's Sisters also rode dragons and were badass, but that didn't make any difference for women in Westeros

[@Dell-ol6hb]

thank you it's so dumb, idk why they cannot have her be a nuanced or morally grey character, no she can never be made to look like shes in the wrong or self-interested it has to have some grander goal and other nonsense

[@iamai_iggs]

I'm sorry but this show is so cooked. Ryan Condal said Aemond fired Alicent because he thinks Alicent doesn't functionally add anything to the council so there's really no deeper meaning behind this action. but Ewan said Aemond fired Alicent because she's his kryptonite, the one thing that breaks his front. he gets too emotional with her in the room so she has to go. like why is there such a big gap between what is portrayed on screen and what was actually meant

[@ocyybit3133]

It's funny that the actors usually have a much better take and perspective on why their characters act the way they do than the writers.

[@Loki-g3k]

We're were luck to have good actors on the green team. They understand their characters far better than the writers. ​@ocyybit3133

[@amorojaz27]

The show isn't over yet. Remember, Jaime Lannister's character arc didn't really kick in until season 3 (the writers really screwed up said arc afterwards, though). So be an optometrist and hold out hope.

[@idawg7332]

@@amorojaz27 but I don't want to examine people's eyes

[@amorojaz27]

@@idawg7332 I'm just referencing the show Barry.

[@Tgsva352]

I think the show thinks that becoming a “rhaenyra stan” is the true definition of female liberation. So Baela and Alicent giving up their own ambitions is supposed to be their way to “liberation”.

[@Infernal460]

Yet team black is doing far worse.

[@Tgsva352]

@@Infernal460Rhaenys was elevated by the narrative as the first true feminist of westeros, wise beyond her age. Rhaenys only “true” ambition it seemed was to pass Driftmark to her female line, Rhaenyra hijacked the line with her illegitimate male children. Actually there was one person with any amount of substantial power that offered Driftmark to pass to Baela and Rhaena…. It was Alicent. Not only does this show lack integrity regarding its own narrative but it also lacks intersectionality. Alicent and Rhaenyra can never be two sides on the same coin. “The debased wicked Lilith” and “The virtuous Mary” but with a progressive twist!

[@Infernal460]

@@Tgsva352 To point out the obvious, the reason why men dominate this world. Is because they fight the wars. Team black and only play out "girl power" because men will fight for her. War is the domain of men. Peace is the domain of women.

[@TheAmenez]

I think you're just frustrated and projecting. Alicent has been weaponizing misogyny her whole life against Rhaenyra. Sucks for her that it bit her in the ass. She's a hypocrite, and Baela isn't giving up any ambitions what?

[@Tgsva352]

@@TheAmenezright because she had none. Maybe the one she took from Rhaenys yes- but wait wasn’t rhaenys begging her husband to let baela inherit driftmark? Whoops.

[@radioslave5307]

Aemond and Cole had a scene together talking about how Alicent still cares about Rhaenyra (which is true),and is unwilling to fully commit to a fullblown war (also true), and anyone not determined to project their personal dollar store feminism onto the story can see plain as day that this is the primary reason Alicent has been shut out of the council. because its now a WAR council and she's the only one there who hasn't committed to the idea that Rhaenyra has to die. there's also the fact that Aemond clearly tried to kill their king and everyone is too afraid to speak out against him, and real irony of the scene is that Alicent's primary motivation has been to protect her children, and the realization of the fact that one of her children has become the greatest threat to her immediate family.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yeah that actually is a fair argument, I just wish Aemond hadn't been so MEAN about it. I say about the man who just set his brother on fire.

[@delilahflowers]

She's also been messy and unraveling this season. Even from the 1st episode we are given the sense that she isn't on her A game. She walks into her first council meeting (alongside Cole) disheveled enough that Otto takes notice. She takes a shower after this meeting in the middle of the day & then combs her hair. It's subtle but its something that would've been noticed by ppl around her. Larys has replaced her staff (why wasn't Alicent more hands on in choosing her new staff?). She misses a council meeting ,which Larys takes note of along with the moon tea on her desk. At council meetings, she's wishy washy & doesn't seem to propose any actual peace terms. She's acting unmoored & out of character this season & the council isn't wrong not to hand over the reigns to her.

[@radioslave5307]

@@HillsAliveYT he's just in his bratty teenager phase. and the whole scene with him and aegon when aegon woke up was classic sibling "Don't tell mom, bro. I didn't even hit your that hard."

[@kenaidip2504]

I hate the girl power narrative. Rhaenyra has and always will only look out for her interests. Queen Alysanne was the only woman to actually better the lives of all women in Westros.

[@jameer7565]

This.

[@mattsavage9960]

Any examples of Alicent actually making the lives of any woman better, I mean her own son raped a woman and she did nothing. Now that woman is working for Rhaenyra.

[@miracle9158]

True

[@jostockton.]

Rhaenyra is the walking picture of white feminism! She "got hers" and that's all that matters to her.

[@19EHF]

Better the lives of all women how exactly?

[@motherbrain3758]

Your videos are like a breath of fresh air after suffering in the fandom honestly. I'm a little upset at the directions they decided to take Alicent and Aemond in this season. They felt much more like a team in season one and all that development was scrapped. But even so, it's not her fault that she's been rejected from power, and it's annoying to see folks celebrate this supposed feminist comeuppance. Honestly one of the biggest disservices the show has done to itself was scrapping the matrilineal vs. patrilineal basis for this conflict. Removing the weight of the vote Jahaerys called during his reign makes the conflict far more black and white (man vs. woman) than it was in the book, and it feels as though they have written themselves into a corner. Hence us receiving uninspiring scenes like Alicent being kicked off the council, when it feels very unrealistic for any of the characters to react in the way they did.

[@user-xh6jk4mi8u]

@@tata11kai22 the show’s “feminism” at this point is misogyny. Rhaenyra is indecisive and she, along with the other female main characters, just want peace. Rhaenyra went from boiling in anger and grief to hatching a needlessly risky plot to see Alicent to stop a war that had already started.

[@HillsAliveYT]

Yes I am so sad that they made Aemond just go full American Psycho, his mama's boy relationship with Alicent was one of my favorite parts of season 1.

[@jostockton.]

@@tata11kai22 I mean to be fair the story is called "The Princess and the Queen"

[@adelkaizbest2038]

People forget that in this world it's not as if everyone thinks that women should have no power ever. It is normal for them to be regents. Alicent was overlooked for being a woman (which really would look bad to have her as ruler considering the situation) but for not being bloodthirsty enough as well. What pisses me off the most is how out of their way writers went to give us NOTHING to root for in team green. There is not one relationship or interaction that is a joy to watch or to look forward to (and if there is, I'm sure it will be another misundertanding or they will change it). Every scene with them is just one: 'Tf is wrong with you? Can you behave like a person who gives af about their kids like in season 1 for one second pls?' Alicent is here just to be punished at this point. Aemond is a psycho wild-card who burned his brother. Aegon is a drunk and grapist, but they tried their absolute best to make us feel sorry for him when he's in pain. I was looking forward to seeing grown up Aemond with his mother, considering that they were more than fine a season ago. Aegon with his brothers as they were in the book. More of Helaena... But nope. It is forbiden to have one positive interaction in team green ✌️ But let's keep the green vs. black marketing as if we are really making it an interesting competition between perspectives ☺️

[@jonathanthomas4327]

It's strange that the show keeps bringing up Alicent's "misunderstanding" when it is made pretty clear that the rest of the council was going to crown Aegon regardless. I wonder would Viserys have had the option to abdicate? I know show Robert thought about doing it when ruling was troublesome, but is that actually a thing in Westeros?

[@amorojaz27]

Alicent had total control over Aegon, even if only for a few moments. And because she convinced herself that Viserys(a man she had known for most of her life) had changed his mind about the succession at the last minute, she convinced him to take the throne and helped make war inevitable.

[@WillyYalad-ep7gv]

​@@amorojaz27They would put him anyaway or his brother

[@amorojaz27]

@@WillyYalad-ep7gv still, Alicent could have chosen differently, and that goes for pretty much everyone on the Greens' side.

[@jostockton.]

@@amorojaz27 the child bride could have chosen differently? What? Chosen not to be a forced child bride? Chosen not to be Otto's daughter?

[@amorojaz27]

@@jostockton. Getting pimped out to Viserys was not her fault at all. But, convincing herself that Viserys had changed his mind at the last second, after knowing him for most of her life, and likely seeing him act senile as he was in those moments? That was her fault. While the war was probably inevitable with or without her, her choices put her and her family on the wrong side of this war. By wrong, I mean the losing side, and her daughter especially is going to suffer for it.

[@Valentinianist]

People don’t understand that Alicent is a) dragonless, b) has no land or titles and c) is not a Targaryen. She’s not sitting on the throne anytime soon, fuck what Rhaenys said. The only way she could get as close to power would be by advising a more powerful person that could give her influence. She would have a better chance of getting that by having Aegon (her son, people pleaser, mommy issues) than Rhaenyra (self interested, wife of Daemon, bad relationship with Alicent) on the throne.

[@delilahflowers]

I hated that scene with Rheanys because nothing she said applied to Alicent. In what world would Alicent ever sit the iron throne when she's not in line for succession? Where else in the world can she be free from her prison?

[@silverprincess2642]

THE HILLS ARE ALIVE, WITH THE SOUND OF VIDEO ESSAYS!!! As much as i love my Rhaenyra, I don't think any woman or ANYONE, for that matter, deserves oppression. I don't care if they don't agree with me. That includes Alicent. Plus, she still needs to marry Rhaenyra... Let me dream.

[@alanaatkinson551]

The show is extremely biased towards the Black and their foolishness in trying to push non-existent feminism is making the show unbearable to watch.

[@Unworshipediety]

lol, what? It's about two women and feminine things happen to them due to their sex, position in society, and choices. I don't think it's going to turn out well from team Black, (not that I know anything) but I've enjoyed it so far. I try not to gas myself up on hate when I watch this show.

[@alanaatkinson551]

@@Unworshipediety It's about two families fighting for power, making horrible decisions that result in them losing a lot. No one is justified because war is wrong. That's the message. Rhaenyra is no girl boss fighting for women's rights, she's fighting for HER birthright. She only cares about being the exception above other women no one else. Alicent made decisions that anybody in that ERA would've made because she was smart enough to understand that the LAW would not accept Rhaenyra to be a ruler and Viserys did NOTHING to CHANGE that law. You can't judge a medical show through modern lense, that doesn't make any sense because modern rules don't apply to the past.

[@miracle9158]

@@Unworshipedietyit’s not about two women

[@Unworshipediety]

@@alanaatkinson551 Now you're comment makes more sense. You went off into feminist bashing wonderland with your first comment and just lost all patience with you. Even your second comment is trying my patience. Have fun hating life or whatever floats your boat. Have a very none girl-boss day.

[@Unworshipediety]

@@miracle9158 I know that, I just couldn't help myself. I saw the phrase _non-existent feminism_ and I just dived right on that grenade. Ooops, _♫oh, woe is me!♫_

[@bilnik6593]

People saying Alicent could have supported Rhaenyra just don't understand how the entire system works; all of her children would be in a very precarious situation should Rhaenyra ascend, even if Rhaneyra would never personally wish them harm (though the incident at Driftmark gives Alicent reason to believe otherwise). Having an alternative candidate for the throne would give Rhaenyra's enemies a fatal advantage, because any Lord who is even mildly dissatisfied with her can now look to Aegon or Aemond, and that would definitely create trouble down the line. Yet people treat it like Alicent was delusional and inspired hatred in her children when this was always a ticking bomb waiting to go off from the start. It's very telling that even in a show that is explicitly about women's struggles under the patriarchy people are more than eager to blame everything on the one woman in charge.

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

The show to me makes the mistake of believing that Rhaenyra is some radical feminist girl boss Dany 2.0 who stands up for the marginalized group and by becoming queen she’d liberate all the women of Westeros and/or be the starting point and key to ending misogyny in Westeros and therefore if you support the Greens you are a sexist and by doing so Alicent is anti woman which is 100% untrue. Rhaenyra just like Alicent takes advantage of patriarchal rules and in many ways conform to system. Rhaenyra isn’t given support from others not just because of misogyny (although that certainly plays a role) but other things about her like her siring of obvious bastard she attempts to pass of as legitimate and give privileges they don’t deserve. This isn’t a girlpower boss babe story. This is about ambition being key in downfall. This is a story about a family making choices that lead to a divide that destroys them forever. Rhaenyra in the books and to maybe a lesser degree in the show isn’t fighting for women’s right to inherit and women’s equality but for HER to inherit. It’s rules for thee but not for me. Viserys her father wasn’t breaking tradition to make her heir simply because he wants to uplift women and wasn’t making changes in laws to help women in nobility have more rights and therefore Rhaenyra to legally be heir to the Iron Throne. It’s disingenuous to believe one member of an oppressed group (women in this case) in a dubious position of power, whether it’s Rhaenyra or Alicent, is therefore solely responsible for finding a way to free the oppressive group within the system and the ultimate key to social change and if they don’t actively try to do so or fail to do so they are horrible people. It’s more complicated than that. It takes more time than that and it takes more than one single person in a position of power. It’s a gradual change. When living as a marginalized person (despite being in high positions of power Alicent and Rhaenyra are still oppressed) in a system that is oppressive and built against you, it takes more than just you to make social change. Alicent not supporting Rhaenyra is more complicated than she’s internalizing misogyny. And it’s disingenuous to say she gets what she deserves by not supporting Rhaenyra or being outwardly feminist. She like many other medieval woman or women in general throughout history living in majorly patriarchal oppressive societies is making due with what little power and agency she is given and tries to gain power and agency in the little opportunities given. By believing that Alicent is horrible because she has conformed and worked within this patriarchal system to advocate for herself and her sons negates the experiences of many powerful yet still oppressed women throughout history from ancient times to now. There have been plenty of influential and powerful women in Medieval England that Westeros is based off of like Eleanor of Aquitaine, Elizabeth Woodville, Margaret Beaufort, etc. who were oppressed yet still operated within patriarchal systems and gained power and lost power in them. These women were incredible and we shouldn’t overlook their power and sympathize with their downfall simply because they conformed to the patriarchy they were raised in or weren’t actively trying to change it. But still just because Rhaenyra isn’t a feminist neither is Alicent doesn’t mean you can’t still root for them. Just don’t follow Rhaenyra simply because you think she’s a feminist.

[@hurremsultanas]

I know I'm far from the only person to say it at this point but people arguing that she's getting a deserved comeuppance are ignoring everything else that has happened to her and victim blaming her.

[@J_ads2000]

Two things can be right. She is a victim, a child bride but that doesn’t undo all her bad. If a victim of S/A goes around assaulting others after because they think it’s normal then does that make it okay? Of course not. Alicent has propetiated the abusive cycle on her daughter Helaena, on Aegons victims and on Rhaenyra.

[@hurremsultanas]

@@J_ads2000 That completely misses my point. Yes a victim can also become a perpetrator but that doesn't mean that she deserves more misogyny. Victim blaming is still victim blaming regardless of whether or not the victim is 'problematic'. Feminism isn't only for the 'right' women. Besides Alicent's feelings about Rhaenyra are far more complex than just misogyny.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

@@J_ads2000also ask yourself, if it had be Jace int that situation would Rheynra still cover it up?

[@Tgsva352]

@@hurremsultanasthats the issue with the show. It believes that “feminism is only for the right and virtuous woman”!

[@hurremsultanas]

@@Tgsva352 Exactly.

[@Sam_Kings]

What really strikes me about the 'progressive messaging' in the show is how hypocritical it is. A feudal monarchy is one of the least progressive form of government possible. A woman being the monarch doesn't make it more progressive or feminist. Rhaenyra isn't a feminist champion. Her motivations are entirely self interested - which is fine. I just wish the show was actually nuanced.

[@FanOfTheMyths]

Honestly, I think what's happening to Alicent has much more to do with one of the major themes of ASOIAF: generational parental failrure and neglect. Alicent had a poor example of a parental figure, and then got put into a situation where it is more difficult to be a parent. Where some people in the real world are able to overcome that and be wonderful parents, Alicent was not that person in this story. It's not all her fault, but the reality is that she wasn't a good parent. There were ways to handle Aegon's bad behavior that Alicent didn't use, relying on physical assualt and yelling at him instead. As she so clearly pointed out, for years she was the one ruling the Seven Kingdoms (with Otto, who is also a poor grandfather figure) but didn't take that opportunity to take Aegon under her wing to show him how to rule (which his father should have done - I'm not saying it's all her fault, but that she had a chance to fill in the role her husband did not and failed to do so). Perhaps having purpose and support would have helped him go down a better path. With Aemon she failed to protect him even before the eye incident. She actively blamed the younger Strong boys for the bullying when it was obviously the older Aegon who was the ring leader. She could have gently spoken to him, she could have had HIM punished for the pig thing. And she could have swallowed her anger at Rhaenyra long enough to make her confront her own sons about the bullying. I'm a teacher, I know how tough it can be sometimes to talk to parents or teachers you don't like to get them to talk to their kids about what they did. Even with teachers and parents that have been back-stabby at times. But, it's an important step to take (and you should do it on the record - in the real world, making sure it's recorded over email. In Alicent's world, perhaps in front of Viserys so that he sees your good faith effort and Rhaenyra is forced to play nice in return). Perhaps she could have sent Aemon to Old Town instead of Daeron - there are no dragons and dragon riders to mock him, and they would have to respect a prince. Kind of like pulling your kid out of a school they are bullied at and sending them to another one you can trust better. Again, this is GENERATIONAL and a huge theme of ASOIAF. Alicent doesn't know how to groom her sons for leadership or how to protect them from abuse because no one did that for her. Likely, her father didn't know how to raise daughters for his own reasons. Ned never taught his daughters (especially not Sansa) how to prepare for Kings Landing and politics because he was overcompensating for all the children he saw get hurt in his own youth and was overprotective and because his family didn't expect him to have that level of influence that he needed to be trained for those skills himself. Catelyn failed to teach those same girls about politics because she was treated as a male inheritor of Riverrun for most of her childhood until her much younger brother was born, and then just married off without a mother figure around to have first taught her female politics. Cersei was a terrible mother partially because she didn't have good examples of parents from her father and her mother died early. And all of those failures to parent (no matter how unferstandable for why they happened) turn back around and bite them in the ass. Catelyn's daughters don't know how to handle politics and are stolen by the court. A ton of how Ned fucked up might have been avoided partially if his daughters were aware of what was happening around them more. Cersei's parenting lead to Joffery killing Ned and fucking up any easy victories for her, and Tommen is turning against her more easily because of her abuse of him. And, while there are no clues that this is coming from their own parenting experiences, Oberyn and Doran Martell are getting the backlash of their own parenting as well. Oberyn's example of obsession with vengeance will likely get his daughters killed in their hunt for vengeance for him. Doran being secretive, uncommunicative, and slow to do anything led to his daughter hating him for YEARS before she finally worked against him and his plans. His own hunt for vengeance and neglect of his son led to that son being so desperate to please that he did a series of stupid things that led to him burning alive. I don't think it's even necessary to explain Tywin bad parenting blowing up in his face. Over and over, bad parenting (even and especially within favorite characters of the fandom) are a lot of the reason that harm comes to them and their loved ones. And to the whole of Planatos. Personally, I think that the Long Night that is coming and that came before might be shown to be results of parents allowing their bad choices and teaching of their children to effect the world. It's sad that Alicent is in the sitatuon she is. Maybe if she got to get married a little bit later and to a sweet man of a middling house, she could have been happier and had the support and energy necessary to break the cycle her from her own father and be a good mother. But that's not what happened. Instead, she's stuck watching the cycle happening before her, leading to war and suffering and the pain of her own children. Not only Aegon, but Aemon, too. It must be so painful to watch your son become ruthless and vengeful. I'm not a mother yet, so I don't know the full extent of it yet, but I get the smallest of examples of that pain when I see my students spiraling with bad decisions after bad decisionss. You know it's the circumstances around them that have at least partially led to that, but you don't know what to do to help. I've cried from frustration in situations like that or stood in silence in shock (when it wasn't something physical happening, of course) a lot like Alicent. And, again, that's as their teacher, not their parent! House of the Dragon and ASOIAF are tragedies in motion. PS: you can start seeing that poor parenting thing show up among the Blacks a little, too, though more slowly. Corlys and his bastards and his granddaughters. Daemon and his daughters. All the kids that are going to be traumatized by war by the end of this. Once again I say that I hope we see AFTER the war as well!

[@TheGoodLuc]

And Alicent will outlive her children. All of them.

[@terilien6124]

Just wanna note that even in France, where female succession was not allowed, there were numerous highly successful female regents(blanche of castile, Anne of France, Catherine de Medici, Marie the Medici...).

[@greenknightofwar7024]

They’re are many successful women in the medieval period.

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

@@greenknightofwar7024they still operated in a deeply patriarchal system and still managed to gain power and a little agency for themselves whilst in many ways conforming to said society like Alicent

[@rsync9490]

And in the Ottoman Empire, where women had even less agency, there were highly successful regents. Handan Sultan, Turhan Sultan, and of course Kosem Sultan.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

@@via-anghelmagahum2586 it was heavily circumstantial an depended on what culture a female ruler rose to power

[@user-ti5cw1ug6l]

They kept one system of succession and applied it consistently to avoid conflicting claims but other than that, if there was a good option to lead France when the king was a kid they wouldn't care too much that it was a woman.

[@alexandrajay2001]

the way so many people are gleefully celebrating Alicent being pushed out of the political sphere and being discussed as a marriage offer without her consent is really strange and off putting. it seems like people are simultaneously lambasting her for being anti-feminist, and approving of her being mistreated by the patriarchy because she "deserves it", without any recognition of the cognitive dissonance. what kind of feminist equality designates some women as deserving of patriarchal abuse? she's not even that sexist- unlike the men around her, she didn't support Aegon simply because he is a man and Rhaenyra is a woman, but because he is her son and she wanted him to be safe, and she believed (until recently) that it was what Viserys wanted.

[@jostockton.]

Exactly. Team Black is as feminist as the Lannisters are frugal, lmao. They only support their favourite female self inserts getting ahead. But overall, they are obviously very male centric.

[@ronbzoom8531]

GOT and HOT D is supposed to be loosely based on medieval Britain. The concept of feminism during such an era seems anachronistic. It's as if one were criticizing the ride of a horse and buggy using terminology better suited for vehicles equipped with a combustible engine or better yet, EV. What power could anyone realistically expect a character like Alicent to possess in such an environment regardless of what side she chose? How could Alicent, Rhaenyra, Rhaenys, or any female actually "choose" feminism in a world where the concept is incomprehensible? And let's not forget, these female characters are the highest of the high born. What of the small folk? What say do they have in their destiny? Alicent wasn't punished for "upholding the patriarchy." She was punished for being born in this time and place. Alicent was always more pawn than queen in this game of thrones.

[@delilahflowers]

Exactly! There is no where else for Alicent to go, she has reached the pinnacle of power for a woman in her world. She has been Queen. There is no other freedom or escape from "prison" anywhere else in this world. Unless she abandons her family & lives as a vagabond. Rhaenyra & Rheanys have more power than Alicent because they have dragons but even they uphold the patriarchy and would have continued to do so even if they sat on the iron throne.

[@khfan4life365]

What absolutely gets me is the showrunner and writers said that Alicent “never sacrificed anything”. Are they f**king kidding me right now? All Alicent ever did was sacrifice-her body, her ability to love, her goals, and her aspirations-for her father and the Targaryens! It’s Rhaenyra who never sacrificed anything! And she had the gall to say (as the writers’ mouthpiece) that Alicent never sacrificed anything!? FOH with that nonsense, Condal and Hess!

[@hl3511]

The show goes out of its way to favor Rhaenyra too much. Like these characters are all grey characters, not just black and white evil. But the greens have clearly been portrayed as villains against the ‘noble’ Rhaenyra

[@ComradeQuestion091]

I agree thatcRhaenyra isn't noble but the Greens are clear villains in this case. Criston Cole blames her for breaking his vows (to put it another way, an adult man blames a teenage girl for seducing him). Otto has been scheming from the start, so much so that the fan theories about him plotting to kill Aemma are worth considering (even if they are almost definitely wrong). Alicent is judgemental and vindictive but the thing about her that pisses me off the most is that she plots to put Aegon on the throne but put no effort in actually preparing him for it, she was knowingly planning to put a drunken rapist on the throne.

[@hl3511]

@@ComradeQuestion091 I agree with you. Don’t mistake me, I don’t see the Greens as the good guys, just not evil. I personally have my own gripes of how they wrote Cole, much better in the books but different interpretations. As for Otto, 100% correct with his schemes . He did say in the show that Alicent must prepare Aegon to rule, and she completely failed at that. I just personally don’t like how Rhaenyra is portrayed as the clear good guy, when she has bastards that strips Vaemond and the rest of Velaryons of their birthright, wanted to torture her brother when questioning her bastards and an overall violent character in the books. Of course she is a grey character with good qualities, but they rarely show her bad

[@ComradeQuestion091]

@@hl3511 I hear you, but Rhaenyra being potrayed as the "good guy" doesn't feel like it's wrong. She's the designated heir and the council vote was a one time decision. Aside from Alicent misinterpreting Viserys' words (which I still think was her being willfully obtuse), there is no real reason why Aegon should have been crowned. Also, if we agree that most characters are morally grey, then the ones who actively started antagonizing the other are the clear villains...I don't judge any fan who is pro-Greens, but we cannot pretend that they aren't the clear aggressors here

[@ComradeQuestion091]

@@hl3511 And if we are saying that the books should be the basis of our character judgement (ignoring that George wemt out of his way to remind us that the sources were unreliable) then we should also be complaining that Alicent isn't being depicted as power hungry.

[@khfan4life365]

"I want my mother." (when he is in distress) "Do you love me?" (when they force him to be king) "Mother?" (they wanted Aegon to parade his dead son) "They don't care what I think." (craving for his mother's approval) "Mummy?" (when he is on the verge of death) I can't believe we had an entire season of Aegon just craving for Alicent's love and attention only for Alicent to agree to have him killed in the end. I can't imagine his reaction when he finds out his own mother betrayed him.

[@chiarajune5738]

Alicent is my favorite character. I really don't love what they're doing with her this season. It feels like they just had no idea what to do with her and put her in as many "humiliating" situations as possible, which is really unfortunate. I think she deserves better than that. I wish the writers worked a little harder on the individual character studies this season. It feels like alot of things are left up to interpretation and like the actors are carrying this whole season lol

[@Loki-g3k]

Thank you. I always appreciate your work because i think you're one of few people in the internet who understands this story and the hidden historical meanings behind it.

[@alexissandren1884]

An important factor in Alicent's fall from power that should be considered is the scene where it happens. If the point of the writers was to tell us Alicent was being punished by patriarchy, the scene would had been her being pointed out by all the men in the room and sent away by the smug bastards. What we got instead was Aemond going "of with their heads" on the whole council by sending Tyland to Essos, calling Larys a toad and sending Cole off to die. Aemond shows clearly that if he could he would get rid of the whole council. But the only one that he actually can "fire" is Alicent which is what he does and he is actually relatively quite fair and cordial when doing it. Alicent didn't loose her position because she was a woman, she lost it since Aemond knew her loyalty was to Aegon. And because he knew Alicent would disapprove of his actions, just as he wouldn't approve of her council and advices. So having her in the council would only be a liability.

[@me-fm8nl]

The choices she made were the best choices she could make. Its also the choices that would doom her. It's tragic because none of the available options empower her. Upholding the patriarchy would lead to her misfortune. She could only count on the loyalty of her sons, but they betrayed her. It is interesting that she is realizing how little respect and consideration her sons have for her. This will open up her eyes, set her on a different path. One in which she claims total agency and works on her own goals rather than doing what is expected of her.

[@Stay_Zerose]

Hill's is the true femininst, as the only person on YT that seems to actually understand how the patriarchy works. I am sick and tired of male content creators trying to explain feminism through Rhaenrya and bashing Alicent, I'm also sick of the woman that do this but they are much fewer. I wish everyone would stop virtue signalling and actually use their brains for a second

[@CC-cw8wu]

I feel like people acted the same way with Sansa’s arc in the books. She gets SAed and abused because she was raised feminine by her mother and to take on the behaviors of a lady. She makes some choices based on those ideals at the age of 11 and life falls apart around her. It’s tragic because in most people’s youth, we make decisions based on our dreams and our ideals not on our wisdom. Yet some people think Sansa deserves all her abuse for not seeing through the patriarchy she was raised to conform to at the age of 11.

[@joaopedrolima904]

The funny thing is when a sensible KZbinr needs to say the obvious, because the overwhelming majority of those who follow the series don't understand such a simple thing. when the overwhelming majority of those watching support a spoiled and privileged woman and antagonize another woman who had to do the best she could in a system so stacked against her... we have failed as a society

[@alanaatkinson551]

Yes, people only scream feminism when it suits their narratives. A bunch of hypocrites.

[@angela_merkeI]

I just don't see the supposed feminism emitting from Rhaenyra. Zenobia styling herself Queen and pretender to the Roman empire didn't do anything for 99,99999% of women, same when Mary became Queen of England, when Eirene was empress of Rome or when Margaret Th*tcher became British prime minister. She is a individuum fighting for personal power in a system where even the notion of feminism would be completely ludicrious to her and her contemporaries. The only queen of Westeros that did anything for women was Alysanne (as did her real-life counterpart Roman empress Theodora) and even that didn't come anywhere near close to the emancipation of women.

[@gurpreetbajwa4490]

Considering how much they've changed the source material, are they even going to go with the ending for these characters from the book? I mean I guess they could but they'd have to change the context quite a bit. It would have to be that Team black installs a great great Queen and it's only through treachery that she ends up failing. So basically everyone else is to blame lmao

[@nicknaylor9895]

I dunno why this is so shocking to Alicent or anyone else. Yes, the people who didn’t think a woman should rule were never going to pick a woman to be regent. This was obviously going to happen.

[@delilahflowers]

She wasn't next in line in the role of succession. Aemond is the correct person to rule as he is Aegon's heir. Alicent has already been ruling during Visery's sickness and was shown to be respected by the council last season, she had her time.

[@thedevilsadvocate858]

Also , the fact that Rhaenyra only has any claim to the iron throne because her younger brother Baelon died in infency , if Baelon have lived he would he the center of Viserys's attention, Rhaenyra would be married to Baelon and baring his children while he prepared to be king

[@Mrblob100]

I'd say viewing Alicen losing power through a Feminism vs Patriarchy is dumb, as its more about court influence, with her dad as Hand and Agon as King she had influence and some control but with Aemond and his different view of how to proceed with the war.

[@soja8044]

I feel the conception of feminism and misogyny in this show is so misunderstood by many viewers. So many people mistake Rhaenyra's fight. She isn't fighting for her right, as a woman, to take the throne, she his fighting for her right and claim, as a person to gain her throne. She is fighting for herself and not women. She is not the feminist queen people make her out to be, because she fights for her and her alone. She never expresses herself on the struggles of women as a social class, just her struggles as Rhaenyra Targaryen. She doesn't care about the claims of Rhaena or Baela, she doesn't even try to understand Alicent, only to have her submit to her, as she does with anyone. I'm kinda mad at the show for pretending this is a partiarchy vs feminism fight, because the view is really simplistic, and it pushes most people to be team black when none of the teams should win this war anyway. And so many viewers seem to completely forget how life was hard for Alicent and that she has been subjected to way more atrocities than Rhaenyra at the same age. She is a victim of misogyny who was probably traumatised by forced marriage, being raped and forced pregnancies, all of that for nothing because her disgusting old husband still prefers Rhaenyra over any of his other children. On the other hand, Rhaenyra got a wedding which was an agreement on both parts, got children with two men willingly, never got raped as far as we know, and got to do whatever she wanted just because she is the princess. She was as free as a princess can be, and Alicent wasn't. And people completely overlook that aspect of Alicent and the impact it has on her as an adult and her views of power and woman's right, in a world where woman's right isn't even a fight to begin with.

[@tabularasa7350]

the whole thing is competence vs incompetence, Alicent had the winning cards and throwed them away by bringing her lover and the rat catcher into her house, her father was the competent Statesman and was thrown away by her favorite son who is an idiot, and her only competent son will be pushed away being the only thing standing between their defeat and death, unfortunately I see the Rat catcher will play his cards and bring back the idiot son as king and they will all die for incompetence.

[@WillyYalad-ep7gv]

.

[@MobbJacket88]

The people pushing the whole "girl power narrative" don't realize how boring their takes rare.

[@ryankwon8785]

A good feminist story should have centered around Nymeria not Rhaenyra.

[@fabiolaliano8620]

I feel like a lot of the “issues” people have with the show are mainly them conflating the popular interpretations of casual viewers with the show’s intentions. if people took off their “what do casuals think” glasses off they’d see that alicent is being clearly portrayed as a tragic, sympathetic yet flawed character, but people assume they’re “trying to make X character look bad or good” when that’s absolutely not how writing works. if anything, it’s the audience with a waning level of media literacy the ones “making” certain characters “look good or bad”. they’re trying to write interesting characters, and that sometimes entails on them doing things that might “make them look bad”. that’s conflict. that’s layers. that’s storytelling the show clearly isn’t portraying rhaenyra as a feminist saint either if people actually paid attention to the show. she repeats that her claim is based on her father’s wishes, not because she wants a better future for women, she relegates rhaena as a second mother simply because she doesn’t have a dragon of her own therefore she isn’t useful in battle and should be shielded and instilled in a traditionally feminine role. the fact that one can point out all the ways rhaenyra has wronged people over the years and is not staking her claim for the sake of feminism shows that the writers are being conscientious of the nuances in these characters, but I guess since it’s not blatantly obvious people act like it doesn’t exist. I guess people need characters to turn to the camera and say “Rhaenyra is not doing all this because she is a girlboss who believes in feminism, of course young kids believe their mother is perfect, they’re young kids, alicent has clearly always been trying her best and whenever she does something flawed it’s not because the writers are trying to ‘sabotage’ her. both teams have their points and their flaws (bc you need that for something to be interesting and entertaining) and if you just tuned out what casuals think or how you think they might react to something then you’d actually notice that”

[@spearofhope2]

Alicent's life has been a harrowing story in the consequences - internal and external - of patriarchal oppression. The way it erodes your agency, your own relationships, even your own internal morals, your sense of self... It's one of the few things that the show was able to sometimes get right. But now I'm supposed to forget that whole arc and believe that she now is Deserving of that patriarchal oppression that has poisoned her whole life??? Why? Because of her interpersonal issues with other women? Because of her own political ambitions? Because she rebelled against the equally oppressive and patriarchal mandate of forced motherhood, and wasn't able to bond with and care for the babies she was forced to have as a child??? Now she suddenly deserves to be oppressed? Are people seriously saying that?

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

I read an interview by a female director I forget her name but she said there’s a trope in entertainment in films that female characters are viewed to be either victims or villains and can’t be both. It’s said because both her and Rhaenyra are both victimized in many ways and yet do villainous things. Yet viewers and writers don’t allow for both to coexist so therefore one has to be a victim Rhaenyra and the other a villain Alicent

[@kimberlywebster6057]

The issue isn’t misogyny-it’s *patriarchal bargaining* in the context of kyriarchy. The argument therefore sounds strawman to me. One can criticize her for patriarchal bargaining notwithstanding that the bargain didn’t turn out so well for her in the end and wouldn’t have been much better regardless of her decisions. And one can empathize with at least some of her choices at the same time, given the limited power available to her.

[@user-ke9ir1xn7p]

The point of femninism is misinterpreted here. Alicent wouldn't definitely have power if she sided with the Blacks. But the fact that she supports Aegon's claim on the throne is solely because he is a son, even though Rhaenyra is the older child and Viserys' chosen successor. I was surprised when she wanted to rule in behalf of Aegon because they were right, Aemond is next in line and if the queen has to rule, it should be Haleana not Alicent. Why everybody is claiming she is reaping what she sowed because now she understands what is being outcasted from power solely on basis of being a "woman". Raena is not in power because she doesn't have a dragon, so was Aemond's case when he didn't have one. So their not being important or not being in power is not dependent on their gender. Being a woman doesn't mean you have to be powerful but loosing power for just being a women is painful and unfair. And Alicent understands this now. Because the people who subdued her before were always people who outranked her his age or position, her father, her husband, Rhaneyra but now its her son who is subduing her. Thats what hits her hard. Because she expected them to value her as she valued Otto but Aemond didn't. This didn't happen with Aegon. He did value her mother, her approval. The fact that Aemond is dismissing her hits her hard as he is doing it solely because she is a woman, he loves his mother but thinks women has no place is politics. Thats why she is reaping what she sowed because they supported a son instead of a daughter and now she wants to rule and gets dismissed. Honestly Alicent shouldn't have felt bad because if she would have actually used her mind, this was very natural of the green council.

[@jjosifovic]

I despise how the writers are making Alicent this season and I have to believe this is the same alicent from season 1? Alicent who went to mama bear on rhaenyra in episode 7 would never just be sitting with rhaenyra and not call the guards on her after the death of her grandson. Ur telling me Alicent actually believe the council would listen to her after she has done nothing but wanting peace with Rhaenyra and counseled restraint the entirety of season 2.

[@alanaatkinson551]

That's what I noticed too. The writers are Black stans which is so annoying. That's why the show is biased towards them.

[@Soleil.m]

The way I read that scene was that Alicent felt she had to try- the same sentiment Rhaenyra had when she went to King’s Landing episodes prior. I mean, what was Alicent supposed to do? Sit there and not do anything, despite thinking Aemond caused Aegon’s injuries? I don’t think she was surprised at not being chosen. But she had to try. I’m not even a fan of Alicent post-timeskip but even I feel like people are taking an overly simplistic view of her actions.

[@princessbubblegum27]

I feel incredibly bad for alicent

[@Alex-AQ88]

Agree with this soooo much. The Alicent-hate is very unjustified.

[@quinn28345]

really great video. thank you for making this. alicent is one of my favourite characters of all time, and my favourite in HOTD! it frustrates me to no end that people think team black is being shown and widely accepted as "team feminism" when thats truly not the case

[@moona3206]

I have been waiting for you to talk about that scene! 😌

[@jamiereekie9342]

I think everyones over looking for position in the monarchy, its nothing to do with feminism. Shes the queen Dowager! her reign is over! Aegon and helaena and king and quuen now, succession goes forwards NOT backwards! Take queen Liz II for example when her father George VI died her mother didnt take the throne. No, she became the queen mother. Or the mad king George III where his son George the prince REGENT ruled for him. There has been cases of kings too young or incapable of ruling where a regent of older member family tried to rule for them.. it didnt work out for them tho, they would piss off a lot of the lords and be overthrown I dont under why shes trying to take power when its not hers to take and why the writers are portraying it like that? It shows those countries who dont have monarchies also dont understand how it works!

[@QuinnFirstOfHerName]

There's a line from the "Little Fires Everywhere" adaptation where Kerry Washington's character tells Reese Witherspoon's far more privileged character "You didn't make good choices, you had good choices". I think it's important to separate the idea of consequences of ones actions with "deserving it" because sometimes there are no good options within a bad system. Maybe Alicent should have tried to run away with Aegon and defect to Rhaenyra, certainly the choice she made hasn't protected her family. But she had no good reason to fully trust Rhaenyra with the safety of her children, and no reason at all to trust Daemon. If I were her I would 100% think that Daemon would murder my sons if he got the chance. It's a harsh lesson to be sure, but acting like a medieval woman deserves to suffer because she didn't invent feminism is not a feminist stance and it's weird that it's treated as such.

[@DarkKing009]

They really assassinated her character in season 2 episode 8. I lost a lot of respect for the character after that.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

I would say yes and no. Was she a good mom, no. Does she love her kids and want the best for them, yes. Did she haves the best means and environment to raise them, massive no. Is she responsible for the dance, no. She’s only as responsible as the other players in this game. Personally she’s my favorite female character, because she’s a very complicated woman who has been put in a position where she doesn’t want to be in, but soldiers on regardless. She’s a loving mother, but also a terrible parent because of her own upbringing and her experience with her parents. Rheynra on the other hand is the only person who has a lot coming to her. Alicent in many ways never had the power to choose, Rheynra did and many of her decisions lead to countless deaths and misery, while being completely out of touch with reality. She believes that because a bunch of dead men swore oaths and that she has lizard nukes the people are obliged to bow and serve her. All while trying to pass off obvious bastards as heirs to the iron throne, while killing anyone who disagrees with her. I’m not saying one’s a saint and one’s the embodiment of evil. But the show really wants people to see Rheynras actions as righteous and Alicents as evil.

[@jostockton.]

She's a good mom, yes. Unlike a certain Dragonstone boymom, she actually disciplines her children and doesn't gaslight them.

[@via-anghelmagahum2586]

She’s flawed and we can empathize with her and that’s why she’s incredible as a character. We aren’t asked as viewers to view her as perfect. She like many Green characters are layered and that’s why they are compelling because we can both love and hate them at the same time. The Blacks especially Rhaenyra to me are trying to hard to be too likable. We aren’t given layers to Rhaenyra the way Alicent is. We see virtues but aren’t given many flaws to humanize Rhaenyra the way Alicent is.

[@WillyYalad-ep7gv]

​@@via-anghelmagahum2586Absolutely yes, they try so hard to make us see them as Dany or the Starks of HOTD, when not, that is not their role.

[@amorojaz27]

​@@jostockton. A good mother wouldn't let her son comfort her after said son had just lost an eye.

[@jostockton.]

​@@amorojaz27she didn't, and that's not bad parenting anyway lmao. A good mother would demand justice for her kid LOSING AN EYE which she did and you just not so subtly ignore. Meanwhile, Rhaenyra uses her kids as pawns and made her own stepdaughter the mammy to her sons. Gross.

[@Shenanakins]

they are framing this story as "Alicent chose the safe careerpath to becoming a schoolteacher and now rhaenyra is a rockstar and so shes just being a jealous ass bitch" which is INSANE because she was a child bride and it was forced on her and she didnt have the power to say no the way rhaenyra was, who is a targaryen princess, the heir to the throne who is also daddy's little girl and nicknamed "the realms delight" who was given the freedom to choose her own husband (only for her to squander it to mess around with Daemon). the moral "feminist" argument for rhaenyra is giving "if you're homeless just buy a house... duh!" why isnt alicent being a better feminist and just doing whatever she wanted? is she stupid??

[@KuningannaSansa]

I stopped watching the show an episode or two ago, but still looking forward to and enjoying your essays!

[@LittleMissAwesome121]

I like Alicent but might we also add to the fact that she’s dismissed because she’s not been at all helpful. All she has said is no, don’t fight, be calm, let’s send letters. In s2ep1 you can see Ironrod’s eyes roll back into his skull when she asks about whether her letters have been answered and he says something like ‘the one offering condolences on her dead son?’ He gets it’s, that this war is too far gone to make overtures to peace even as we start the season. The terms of s1ep10 were rejected, blood has been drawn, additionally we know Rhaenyra wasn’t even reading any of those letters, first due to grief and later resentment (“Alicent’s son sits my throne”) but still Alicent is trying to parlay with a nonexistent interlocutor, and it is scuttling the Greens’ ability to act decisively. Aegon wanted to burn the blockade in ep1 and get the Tully’s on side before Daemon had even left. But he gets talked out of it by Alicent. And that attitude continues even after b+c when by all rights, her son targeted, her grandson butchered in his cradle, she should want every black head on a spike à la Daemon, yet she still pushes for peace. And technically commits treason during the ep3 sept scene by letting Rhaenyra leave. Alicent could have taken a stabbing for the greater good. Realistically getting rid of Rhaenyra wouldn’t have actually ended the war, but it would have put blacks into disarray for a time, and more to the point Rhaenyra didn’t come with any terms, only the assertions she doesn’t want fight. Which okay, and? (And this was on the assumption that Alicent could do anything with said terms, if they existed, which she can’t -something Hill’s has discussed previously). Someone genuinely on side, might have taken one for the team, just saying. Aemond realised that while he loves her and wants to win primarily for her, this is a time of war, a time for decisive action, of men doing what men do, but all of Alicent’s suggestions thus far have done nothing but slow down and undermine their cause, and Aemond cannot have that weakness in the small council. Not only is her advice bad, but if she were to begin contradicting and arguing him, his own mother, it would make him look personally weak. Therefore, she had to go. Granted, I would have liked Aemond to go about it more tactfully, talking about ‘domestic pursuits’ you disrespectful little shit, but Aemond isn’t exactly known for tact so I am also not surprised. Moreover he was essentially correct, Alicent served ably in a time of peace and we are thankful for her contribution, but this is a time of war, and she made no good contribution. It’s taken six episodes but finally we’ve realised that Alicent has failed to get on side and therefore needs to get lost. Maybe there is something about patriarchy in all of that, but there’s a part of me that thinks Alicent of the book (had she not gone through the trauma of b+c) would not have been dismissed, because book!Alicent was on side 100%. But that’s just my feeling

[@amorojaz27]

This might be because I genuinely love the scene in the sept, but I don't think it was just lingering fondness that made Alicent let Rhaenyra go. The sept is a church, and in the Middle Ages fugitives could take refuge on holy ground. I don't know if the Faith has that same tradition, but seeing how much it's modeled after the Roman Catholic Church, it wouldn't surprise me if they do. And if they do, Alicent, as a religious woman, would follow it. That's at least part of why she lets Rhaenyra go, in my opinion.

[@gajakdgsqihshsn6839]

Honestly, its just bad writing on the writers part. They literally don’t know what to do with Alicent this season. It was as if they want her to be unlikeable but sympathetic at the same time, but they still don’t know how to properly execute that. Does this season want to show Alicent being repressed and how that affects her decision making in politics? Or was it to show how she’s hypocritical than what she shows people of Westeros? Or was it about how she’s a trapped victim in this patriarchal society? Or was it about all these things? Because whatever it is, her character was still a writing mess this season. Alicent in S1 was all these things yet she’s coherent and engaging as a character. Now, in season 2 it was as if she’s written with no proper arc in mind. I still want to give the last 2 eps benefit of the doubt, and hope that they will fix her character.

[@jacc1854]

I think I kinda reject the idea that HOTD is creating a "girl power," narrative for the blacks, I fully believe that's where the audience has taken it but I don't think the text is responsible for the audience's interpretation because then we'd also have to argue that the books paint Tywin Lannister as a super cool aspirational badass y'know? I think a significant amount of your argument is resting on the assertion that the show is portraying the Blacks as the aspirational feminist trailblazer side, and then you followup with several examples of how that isn't true, and I firmly believe that those are all intentional choices within the text. I don't think the show blames Allicent and I don't think it portrays Rhaenyra as the 'good' guy. I DO think it wants to put us in Rhaenyra's perspective which inevitably will see protagonist bias in the audience so I really hope they are gonna do something with it, but the show as it is thus far I'd be surprised if it uncritically maintained this protagonist bias.

[@johanwestin3030]

I hope they are setting up a real heel turn when she gets to rule, but probs not. The choices made to simplify the succession issue makes me think they are trying to mirror more recent politics, like with the anti gay sparrows. I do think there should be some more exposition on how her action impacts others, like the suitors, The Cole man and vaemond. The normies will not catch those nuances.

[@fabiolaliano8620]

yeah, I feel like a lot of the things attributed to the show are just people misinterpreting the text and calling it bad

[@pawebielinski4903]

You are very right.

[@Methus3lah]

I think people really need to start looking at this show as a Shakespearean tragedy, wherein every character has a tragic flaw and these flaws spiral into war. All of these characters are fascinating and likeable (at least to me), but also super messed up. They’re 3-dimensional. And to see it as “good guys and bad guys” misses the point.

[@Loki-g3k]

Aegon and Aemond are truly Shakespearean. Alicent is the most realistic woman figure in the series.

[@truetory6231]

The idea that a woman should support another woman simply because they are both women is how woke people think, they view gender politics as more binding than family ties. These are the same people who once claimed that Sansa should have supported Daenerys over Jon simply because they are both women. The fact that Jon was related to Sansa by blood while Dany was a stranger to her is irrelevant to people who think this way. To them gender identity is all that matters, and so much that they actually think it is wrong for a mother to back her son over her stepdaughter

[@alanaatkinson551]

This! This is exactly why modern feminsim is insufferable.

[@ComradeQuestion091]

10:38 "...someone who has already disregarded her for the sake of her own interests." Sounds like a rather unfair assessment of Rhaenyra and Alicent's relationship. How did you expect Rhaenyra to treat Alicent when the latter was ALWAYS antagonizing her? Openly even?

[@arielpearson4819]

I think a lot of this goes back to the lack of establishing what the social order of Westeros at this time looks like. In season 1, it's from a purely Targaryan perspective where women are literally royalty with flying nukes. Alicent's viewpoint on women and power is probably the common viewpoint of the people of Westeros, but we don't really get to see that. We see just about all of the men against having a female ruler, and Alicent who is meant to come across as a conservative "pick me" type of girl because her experiences don't fit those of the Targaryen women she's surrounded by. If the showrunners wanted to go for a "women hold up the patriarchy, too" approach, they should have kept Alicent's original age to make that clearer, instead of trying to have it both ways by making it an individualist dispute between two former friends with opposite politics.

[@jostockton.]

Too bad the only conservative pick-me girls are Rhaenyra and Baela.

[@counterspellgoon6854]

preach Queen

[@Okkotsu86275]

The fandom and the creators have done with Alicent this season is a damn shame, and the waste of Olivia Cooke's amazing talents. Alicent Hightower should be a force that is well respected and appreciated not only in her own fraction and house and Westeros as whole. But instead they have made this punching bag to display how wrong misogyny is and how she picked the wrong side. Because this adaption is so favorable towards the Blacks and they have whitewashed Rhaenyra's character, they have did so much damage to Alicent and the Green fraction.

[@amorojaz27]

Just one question. How are her experiences any different from what Sansa went through in GOT?

[@Okkotsu86275]

@@amorojaz27 It’s not and that’s the problem I have with it.

[@amorojaz27]

@@Okkotsu86275 I would say she's been having a better time of it overall than Sansa, actually. At least she's not getting beaten to a pulp every other day.

[@Okkotsu86275]

@@amorojaz27 That's true, at least not physically. She is not getting beaten down

[@mattsavage9960]

She literally has 2 or 3 pages max from the books to work with this season, same with Daemon and Rhaenyra they literally only have 2 pages max each for all the events that have happened so far this season.

[@Spoogebro]

I would love to hear your thoughts on nettles and rhaena

[@amorojaz27]

I think the writers made the right call by merging them.

[@jostockton.]

​@@amorojaz27.... why?

[@amorojaz27]

@@jostockton. Among other things, it saves Daemon from ending the show as the Littlefinger of his generation.

[@jostockton.]

​@@amorojaz27 Daemon is already a pedophile though?

[@wargames2195]

It's called bad friggin' writing. The writers need to include muh patriarchy somewhere when it makes more sense for the Greens to have a united front.

[@Marlboro-lights1]

The show is great. The fandom is garbage. As soon as I see someone freaking out because their beloved “team black” was insulted by someone voicing an opinion opposing theirs, I check out. It seems like most of the people that behave this way are strictly show watchers and either have no respect for the source material or make fake quotes by GRRM up like “George has said time and again that the book is the false unreliable story and the show is the true telling of the dance” when George himself just made a blog post not that long ago throwing shade at show runners who think they can make a story that’s already been written better. I’m pretty sure I’ll be proven right this coming weekend with the final episode. If you’re even slightly “team green” you’re going to have a bad time! If the leaks are true it flies in the face of everything established in this already established story.

[@itspronouncednikolaj333]

All I’m gonna say is that I saw the episode 8 leaks and it is something. I’m done with the show completely

[@khfan4life365]

Aemond kicked her out because he was pragmatic, not because of misogyny. Show Alicent doesn’t have the stomach to strike back at Team Black. Not even after the m*rder of her young grandson. I think Aemond was the best choice for regent because he had fighting experience and skills as a tactician. I won’t call Alicent a bad mom. She did the best with what she had. But I will call her a fool for trying to make peace with the woman who wanted Aemond tortured after his eye was cut out for pointing out an obvious fact. Also, Alicent knew Rhaenyra would have to k*ll all four of her children to be the uncontested heir. Driftmark should have been the point of no return for Alicent, but it wasn’t. I’m not mad. Just disappointed.

[@amorojaz27]

I agree with most of this, but you overlook the fact that Alicent convinced herself that a dying and delusional old man(that she had known for most of her life) changed his mind about who should be his heir. And while the coup probably would have gone forward without her, for the first time in her life she had control over her situation when Aegon was brought to her. You can't say he wouldn't have renounced his claim if she asked him to. I agree she probably would have been screwed no matter what, but the fact is she did her part to make the Dance happen. And the generous part of me that is gradually gaining respect for Rhaenyra likes to think that, had Alicent backed her claim, Rhaenyra would have taken care of her, and protected her family(or at least, helped them get out of Westeros before Daemon tries to kill them behind her back). So up to a point, yes, Alicent is reaping the results of her actions. Does she actually deserve it? Not necessarily, but she still could have gone another way.

[@FriendlyBatDoom]

Yep

[@amourtabb7859]

I feel like the train was leaving the station without her and she had to get on board. These are the same men who don't care about her opinion now. You don't need the King’s consent to rule in his name. Aegon's own council sicked his kingsguard on HIM.

[@amorojaz27]

​@@amourtabb7859true, but again, Alicent had control over her situation for the first time in her life, and she made the wrong choice. Again, she doesn't deserve the consequences she's facing, but she did make the bed and has to lie in it now.

[@fasho387]

@@amorojaz27 This is a whole lot of ifs for a half lie. Yes she heard what she wanted to, but in contrast with Rhaenrya, she did the least wrong

[@amorojaz27]

@@fasho387 she might have done less wrong overall, but she did make a bad call when she had control over her situation for the first time in her life. She doesn't deserve what happened to her, and she deserves what's coming her way even less, but you can't deny she's in this mess because she made the wrong choice.

[@TheCoconutKangaroo]

Good points! Something to think about ...

[@lauren8135]

I feel both disdain & empathy for Alicent. You could argue that to a degree she isn’t fighting the patriarchy and she’s simply doing what she’s told uncritically, and she’s supporting Aegon over Rhaenyra. But this is what she has known all her life. this is what she has been told is her path and calling is, to get married, produce heirs and see her and the kings first born son rule the kingdom. She sees her job as helping to guide and teach him to be prudent, judicious, and listen to people like his grandpa Otto who has been doing much of the business of ruling Westeros for decades. But I do also see princess Rhaenys’s (RIP) point about Alicent just wanting to make a window in her prison instead of breaking free, but breaking free is very difficult to do in her current circumstances. Westeros it sounds like doesn’t give most women much say in who they marry and once they marry their husbands make the decisions. It’s hard to breakdown a whole system where women don’t have their own financial stability, land, and the jobs they can do outside of their own household or without a male family member who runs that business are very limited. I know fighting the patriarchy is a positive thing in terms of decreasing oppression, but it’s a tall order to take down the patriarchy that’s very difficult to accomplish without thousands of years progress, technology and a monumental shift in economic system functions.

[@adamglenen734]

*Norman Rockwell's Freedom of Speech* ALICENT IS ONE OF THIS FANS FAVOURITES

[@TheSora63]

The thing is, she should have known. The rules of the game are clear: the Hand commands, and if not the next in line. The only one who changes the rules is the king (Eddard was appointed by Robert for example). As the instigator of this war along with Otto and Rhanyra, she should have known better. The show is a disaster.

[@lyamainu]

Alicent is an absolute victim, who never fought back and actually made decisions that made her own (and everyone else’s) situation worse. I have a lot of pity for her, but I don’t think she’s anyone to admire or look up to. The only reason I like Rhaenyra even slightly is because she’s a good mother. Otherwise, she’s totally self absorbed and stuck up - just look at her night with Criston. Honestly, I hate both teams.

[@jostockton.]

Rhanerya is a bad mother and Alicent did fight back. That's the entire point of her beef with Rhaenyra and the scene in Driftmark.

[@sabrinamcclain162]

Aemond is next in line to the throne, and could be King at any point because Aegon is in critical condition. If Aegon had died and Aemond had been made King instead of Alicent, no one would say that Alicent is being passed over because of the patriarchy. Is Aemond a good choice? No. Almost as if who is the child of the previous ruler isn't a good method of choosing leaders. I see the point of the dance as, the patriarchy and monarchy and other issues with Westeros such as the prejudice against are so entwined that trying to remove one element- the patriarchy- is ultimately doomed and only draws attention to how rotton the whole system is. There's a reason why Game of Thrones/aSoIaF is such a dark story where the characters are so unhappy and it's that their society is structured in such a way that even those on the top are miserable, let alone those at the bottom.

[@joyfulgirl91]

Alicent is a tool who was used and could never sew anything she was responsible for, let alone reap it. Even her worst mistakes have no true impact on the throne or the war. They are no punishments or rewards because there is no possible framework for a just ending for her

[@Argos-xb8ek]

Her own inability to actually control her sons or being more aware is what caused this outcome for herself. She tried to alienate Aemond and it ended up costing her because as it turns out undermining your most powerful military asset and son who is the heir apparent is a terrible idea. Alicent and Otto brought his on themselves.

[@Dpt3445]

I am a hard black supporter, but I still like Alicent and her storyline. I still think she is to blame for being pushed out of the Green Council and has made mistakes. As pointed out in the video, Alicent has grown up knowing that in the current world of Westeros her power is tied to men, especially as she doesn't bring hard power such as a dragon. Yet, she doesn't do much within the story to leverage what she can to secure or gain power. Instead, she only takes it when it is being given to her. One example is her relationship with her sons. We see with Rhaenyra, she has kept her children close to her before the war broke out. She's had a large influence on their personalities and taught them, to some degree, that sexism is not the best path. Jace supports Rhaenyra through out the story and values her thoughts, even if he is a bit disobedient sometimes as teens are. Furthermore, we see with Cersei in GOT, she leveraged her relationship with her children to secure power. Alicent has not made a similar relationship with her sons. They've been raised to be hateful and to dismiss her easily as other men around her have. I'm not saying that she is a bad mother or that she should have been more "domestic". I'm saying that is she wanted more power, there have been plenty of opportunities to use leverage if she cared to develop those methods to gain power. Finally, I think the idea she should have joined team Black makes now sense. If she believes that the only way this war could end is one side being eradicated, she is not going to help Rhaenyra do that. Although I don't believe Rhaenyra would kill anyone outside of Aegon and Aemond, that is still unacceptable to Alicent.

[@mariavi33]

I find the take that it’s only about women having power or not is pretty reductive. Yes, that is definitely a part of it, but it also ignores a lot about how the systemic misogyny in Westeros, including succession customs, actually works. It's not just about a woman having power; it's about a woman inheriting even though she has 3 surviving legitimate brothers. Also, there is a difference between a woman ruling in her own right and a woman ruling on behalf of a man. An example of this is the real-life medieval succession war the Dance was inspired by (the anarchy). Because if they had been more accurate to that, then Helana would have been in charge. Also, Aegon would have been unable to rule because he had been captured and held hostage instead of being injured. In response, Helaena would have rallied and led his forces until they captured the MVP of Rhaenyra’s forces, which would have forced her to do a hostage exchange. Unfortunately, GRRM decided to be more misogynistic by putting Aemond in charge, and the show managed to make it even worse.

[@gerardjagroo]

Aemond was unnecessarily brutal in firing his mother. Considering this is the woman who drew a knife on the King's daughter for him, it shows a tragic lack of gratitude and an over-inflated ego besides. Besides there even if he had to fire her, (which I kinda have to agree with) there is a way of going about it with more sensitivity. Just wrap up the unpleasantness with lots of verbiage, make sure to show plenty of appreciation for past kindness and include a moderate amount of bullshit artistry. Like this: _("...Mother, I would always be grateful for the support you have given me throughout the years but I do not think it would be politic for you to remain on the Small Council lest, by your very presence, you inadvertently invalidate my position as Regent_ _Given my youth and inexperience, there will be those who will look for any pretext to question my judgement and there will be those who wonder if I am not merely your puppet simply mouthing your own words_ _Already there are those who already question your presence on the Council and given the precarious position of our family we can ill afford any instability or division within our faction_ _For this reason I've decided to remove you from the council_ _You must not imagine that this decision is the result of any acrimony or because I no longer respect your opinion, rather on the contrary I will continue to treasure your advice but now for the good of our House, it must be given in an unofficial capacity...")_

[@amorojaz27]

Yeah, but Aemond has modeled himself after Daemon, a guy who buys so much into the belief of Valyrian supremacy that he thinks basic manners are beneath him. Plus, Alicent spent weeks dumping all the blame for the war on Aemond, ignoring her own role in making it happen.

[@Bakarost]

Feminism! Yes! The savior of humanity! Men bad! Ugah ugah!

[@jostockton.]

Well it's kinda true

[@sardonically-inclined7645]

It's Alicent's due for alienating her sons. When her eldest finally found the motivation to live up to something she foisted on him and after losing his son, she has both been distant and dismissive, going so far as to call him useless when he asked for guidance, spurring him to action that had the consequence of removing him as her access to power. Her other son, she clearly neglected. Leaving him to become colder as he got older, but it's not as if he would spurn affection. He sought it out in Sylvie and will later seek it out in Alys. If she expected to rule on behalf of her children as she ruled for her late husband, one would think she'd take the initiative to maintain healthy relationships with them, especially Aemond, being the more competent and having the larger dragon, in the case that if Aegon refused the coronation or must later be forced to abdicate.

[@fasho387]

alienating how? maybe you didnt watch season 1 but Alicent did her best. she wasnt perfect but she made her kids into kings and queens

[@greenknightofwar7024]

One can still love their children and be a terrible parent, simplified.

[@LizbetNene]

Making the show about girl power rather than systems of power more broadly makes so much of it very shallow.

[@nagorepalaciosdelafuente]

This feminism and all that comes with it in a medieval based show it's so annoying and useless, like please don't destroy something that isn't suppose to be progressive, In fact Rhaenyra herself wasn't choosen cause Viserys was a feminist cause If that were the case he would have renounce to the crown and give it to Rhaenys he only chose Rhaenyra first cause Daemon and second cause she was the only daughter of his true love simple as that, If Aenma Arry would have given him a son that would have survived he would have been the heir not Rhaenyra

[@chrisrubin6445]

Its not Alicents fault for “choosing the wrong team” its her fault for raising Aegon and Aemond to be like this. Rhaenyra knew how to raise children to be good, the most important quality of a monarch for the sake of succession.

[@ertjg]

i'm in love w/ her

[@jostockton.]

As anyone would be ❤

[@Unworshipediety]

Alicent has access to the histories contained in her keep as does Rhaenyra, but much of what is known in their world isn't peer-reviewed, just written by the victor or so it seems. Alicent is doing the best she can as she's using the tools available and _some_ of those tools she's mastered. Yet, when sharp tools is all you have to use, blunt instruments can be seen as inessential until you find one: then opportunities arise. Alicent seems to be reaping what she's sown, although it seems more likely that her choices were illusory. Anyway, great video. I don't know how I even feel about it though, it gave me some interesting thoughts.

[@randomusername3873]

People acting like otto cares about women in power, as if it wasn't about the hightowers getting the power😂😂

[@creativemind2942]

.

[@VANIT_E]

I don't think anyone is making the argument that if Alicent chose Rhaenyra's side, she'd have more power.

[@aicchi1234]

No, she would not. She, just like Baela, Rhaena, Rhaenys, and everyone following Rhaenyra, would be sycophants.

[@amorojaz27]

She would avoid a very undeserved fate, though.

[@niloticnya]

I think she deserves a seat on the council, and they explicitly say it’s bc she’s a woman. I don’t think she should be the ruler bc she’s not a dragon rider tho

[@jamesstone6582]

"women in this world simply can't take power for themselves"..... Except of course... The women who do that... White worm... Alys Rivers... Baela... Also probably Raena.... Rhaynera.... Not to mention the badass women who also girlboss their way into positions of authority in GOT... It's completely okay for Alicent to be a shitty person AND have had shitty circumstances, AND to reap the consequences of her shitty choices, that's called a complex character... It's also completely okay to ignore the absolutely shitty things that she's done and only focus on the shitty things she couldn't control in her life, that's called media illiteracy and it also happened to half the audience of The Boys in a mirrored equal but opposite way

[@milananalim]

Alicent wasn’t born into royal family, she was never suppose to have the same type of authority as Rhaenyra or even her own daughter. I think she basically forgot her own place because she got used to seeing rhaenyra as equal since the childhood. If she supported the black I think her life would be better as she wouldn’t be disrespected much as she is now by the greens. As for power it’s just something that she never meant to have.