Is Concordia fun?

[@tylerbrown9797]

Ancient rome's empire could have never been constructed with the primitive technology of the time, concordia is about being an alien species that mind controlled genetically modified humans they referred to as "consuls" who went around using advanced alien tech to construct the roman empire. When you get a colonist out of storage in concordia thematically its actually pretty literal, you are physically taking one of the romans you abducted and genetically modified/installed a mind control device in that is in cryostasis storage and teleporting it down back onto earth. Also sailing ships could never have travelled the vast distances of the mediterranean in roman times to discover the safe routes between harbors, the ships you have are purposefully vague looking since the space aliens would disguise hovercrafts as sailing ships and have them use advanced antigrav engines to zip across the ocean and then put into port like a normal sailboat. Its disappointing to me that so many people miss the great scifi theme in concordia.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

You're making me like it so much more...

[@dimpleza]

This!!

[@SGFlicksify]

Been watching Ancient Aliens, huh?

[@tylerbrown9797]

@@SGFlicksify I have to keep track of what humans know about us, it is my job so

[@SGFlicksify]

Re. Looks/Components: it’s a deliberately dry sober game all about the gameplay & avoids garish depictions of gods etc. It’s the stupid box cover that’s the main letdown - am tempted to cover mine with wallpaper, that bad! (I reckon if they rereleased it with a box cover based on the card art it would go down a treat.) Agree that the fiddly endgame scoring is a weakness - although it is what the variability of tactics is all about.

[@paulhamrick3943]

Yeah it's strange, I actually like "dry", classic board game design, in addition to newer, cartoony or super high production value (read: expensive to hire an artist for) aesthetics and artwork. And for people who have a problem with dry, classic board game aesthetics, I honestly think it's one of the biggest biases in board gaming, and I almost can't trust reviews from people who exhibit that bias. Sorry!

[@ShineOnYouCD]

IMO it's more not liking old school elements, like not enjoying a 90s video game because it feels dated

[@BillyIndiana]

I like Concordia a lot (especially when wearing a toga), but then again I like Grape Nuts too. Not sure what that says about me. I don't disagree with most of your not fun points, but the fun parts far outweigh them for me. NIce overview & review!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Thanks Billy!

[@ericw4377]

Fist bump to a fellow Grape Nuts fan. In the UK, where I am, it exists, but goes largely ignored.

[@mrp4242]

As a fellow cold cereal connoisseur, Grape Nuts is in my Top 10. Healthy and hearty. It’s a great choice.

[@BenS1002]

I've always described Concordia as "Fun like Excel is fun". Pipeline too. Both amazing games I love to play... but yeah, they tweak the same part of my brain as building a cool spreadsheet. (Hint: anyone who's ever described a spreadsheet as "cool" is a good candidate to love this game).

[@jeffmcleod3829]

This explains a lot...

[@AnathemaMysticalcel]

Spreadsheets are the best!

[@cwaddle]

Good analogy

[@Alejus-z8y]

Se siente así al jugar? Como si estuvieses trabajando con un Excel? Ufff que seco, frío, y abstracta debe ser esa experiencia.

[@BenS1002]

@@Alejus-z8y Como dije, a un determinado tipo de persona, a la que le gustará este juego, a la que le gusta divertirse creando una buena hoja de cálculo. Eso no significa que sea el único tipo de persona a la que le gustará.

[@kosterix123]

The problem with concordia is that you have to force yourself to play it. Yes then it's fun. But after a while, I never "feel" it. Exactly what OP says in 18:00

[@nathanvanderriet209]

By in large I'm aligned with your conclusion, Concordia isn't particularly fun. And that's despite the fact that I love a lot of the mechanics in theory the scoring _in particular_. The cards you buy for your deck doubling up as multiplier (or really your multiplier doubling up as action cards) is a really clever mechanic and if you ignore it you're losing- its integral to the game not a weird feature. The lack of randomness in gameplay is great and I love card driven actions (especially as it makes the game easier to teach). To elaborate on my gripes then I will compare this to a little known game called Brass Birmingham (which for me is concordia meets ticket to ride- concordia was my first medium+ weight euro that I bought). I respect concordia a lot, I very rarely feel excited by the prospect of playing it. Brass has four massive advantages for me: It keeps me on the edge of my seat, turns almost never feel unsatisfying, I really care about what my opponents are doing and I feel there are genuinely more paths to take to win the game. In Concordia, for contrast, both the negative and positive impact your opponents make on you is greatly reduced, and while one in every three turns feels great as things align, one in every three inevitably also feels like a complete trash. About this often you'll find yourself just shy of being able to do what would clearly be the best action and are instead left with no good alternative. You must now take a considerably weaker form of another action to set up for next turn. (In brass, taking a loan, drawing wilds, building a coal mine instead of a luxury, etc all still feel pretty good especially for only one of two actions and because they have a positive impact on subsequent turn order). Finally I feel like theres an optimal strategy to play in concordia and there's no use deviating, I've only lost one game ever and it was by less than 7 to the person who finished the game. That strategy involves building your little 'engine' or economy first and foremost, generally concentrating on key regions and avoiding opponents where possible, then ticking the boxes on the important victory conditions that you haven't naturally met (usually just building one or two more settlements) and finally deciding when is the right time to cash in and send the boulder hurtling to the end of the game by going hard on buying cards (causing any rational opponents to do the same). Of course some cards are worth considerably more than other because some victory conditions are just objectively better to go for. Maybe better graphic design as you mentioned would be enough to drag its score up by a point (though I firmly prefer meeples to minis), but I don't think there's any saving the frustrating turns that inevitably arise, the complete lack of interest in what my opponents are doing or the fact that despite the random setup each game plays out the same.

[@lystic9392]

It's like fantasy capitalism. You start out with almost nothing and you keep getting more. Most people enjoy getting more stuff. Making more stuff with stuff. And many actions in the game help someone else too. Or you can use something someone else took. So unlike most Euro games that make you block someone and have no other interaction, you have more interaction in this game and at least half of it is actually fun.

[@jeffmcleod3829]

Hmm - one of the Fun things I love and I think is worth mentioning is the Prefect action. Much like the diplomat card, this is an action that benefits other players, making other players turns interesting for you. While simultaneously having a push your luck aspect with the coins on the other side. (Pleasedontflipthemoney. Pleasedontflipthemoney) So there are two mutual benefit aspects in the game. One in your hand for you (the diplomat) and one on the board for other players (the prefect) It’s genius. As for the overall fun - there is something to be said about looking at the board and seeing everyone’s meeples and houses spread across the Mediterranean, especially considering you all started jam packed in Rome. Like Carcassone it has that “we built this together” aspect afterwards.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Yes, and the game's method of doling out resources is preferable to Catan's, despite being far less frequent.

[@gordcarleigh9157]

This video was great and fun. I agreed with almost everything you said. I made an excel calculator that we sometimes use to score live in Concordia. It works pretty well and helps you visualize what a successful move is. "Oh, a brick city in this region would be worth 3 but this wine city would be worth 5" I would definitely like a remastered edition with character art.

[@mathswithgarry7104]

Any chance you could do a video on your spreadsheet?

[@namelessfire]

Hand management and deck building are not interchangeable. Primarily because one mechanism involves your hand and the other involves your deck. Concordia isn’t a deck building game because you don’t have a deck, you only have a hand; unless, you are proposing that you play the whole game with your deck in your hand. In that case, this is why we can’t have company over.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

My point is that it's a fussy distinction that smacks of gatekeeping. How is it not a deck-building game though, really? You have a hand of cards. You spend those cards to get new cards into your hand. The spent cards go into a discard pile. A certain card lets you reclaim all the cards from that discard pile. The _only_ element that's missing that is common to deck-building games is the concept of *randomly* drawing *some* of your cards into your hand, while some other cards may stay on the table in a face-down pile. To my mind, a distinction that minute doesn't deserve a separate term, let alone pedantic correction from strangers on the internet!

[@IBasharAnalyse]

Sorry to revive this topic, but ACTUALLY you don't buy cards because they are better than your starting deck. They are very very slightly better, not significantly. You buy new cards because they give you points. Paying 2-3 resources and an action is definitely not worth a couple of cards if you only take their effect into account.

[@jacobhawk9311]

Keep these videos coming Ryan! It gives me a good look at games I don't own. Helps me weigh the pros and cons

[@NightsAroundaTable]

DAMMIT MAN i'M NOT A MACHINE!

[@jacobhawk9311]

@@NightsAroundaTable It would be a lot cooler if you were :) But I just joined your Patreon just now so that should help with it. It's long over due. (I am on the Discord as well but rarely active). I have enjoyed your content a lot over the last couple years. Especially being stuck at home with Covid you and some other creators have been awesome. I truly appreciate all you do!

[@TommysHouseOfMunch]

My favorite board game channel period.

[@maximjussim1024]

Fully agree with your assessment. I was wondering for years why I don't get Concordia that often to the table. Now you have verbalized it for me. Thx.

[@TheLuminousCleric]

It's fun!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

You're fun!

[@bethezebra]

😂

[@susannaheisenbraun6635]

I'm always glad to see one of your Find the Fun's pop up on my screen -- well done on this one. I own Concordia but have yet to get it to the table with my husband. I have played it 2-handed to learn the rules and did find the decisions compelling, but was totally disappointed in the components. Even my kids, who can't wait to get their hands on my Everdell hedgehogs or Calico cats or Viticulture visitor cards (I'm serious, they love playing with so many different board game components) were like, "No, I'm good," when I offered a pile of pieces that I wasn't using. As a mostly solo player I'm looking forward to the Solitairia expansion supposedly coming out soon. Thanks for your FUN videos.

[@olivierjodoin2283]

Never understood critics of the production of this game. The maps are gorgeous, they jump to me, enticing me to play the game. And I don't want to upgrade the resources to the super deluxe ones, not because of the very expensive price, but because I prefer the basic wooden resources from the game. So I found myself disagreeing with most of your "not fun" points and was flabbergasted that it was on the not fun scale. But you're still highly entertaining, so you get my thumb up 👍

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Thanks, Olivier! The maps are certainly easy on the eyes if you're used to map-based games like RISK, or stuff from publishers like GMT. i think maps - especially if they're based on our planet - just bore me. The rare exception is a really nice blue-green map of the Caribbean, or some sunny archipelago. But Concordia such oodles of fans to defend it, i didn't feel bad taking a mild swipe. :)

[@olivierjodoin2283]

You might be on to something, I've played a ton of Risk with friends between 15-25 years old, so that might be nostalgic.

[@olivierjodoin2283]

I've learned of your channel through Rahdo and your Concordia how to play video is always the one I link to others. Best rules explanation I've watched.

[@christianhorvath791]

I would bet this channel is gonna get pretty big.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i’ll take that action!

[@lightbulbsun]

His videos are some of the best there are on games, he deserves it.

[@benhoff901]

I like to have a balanced board gaming diet. I agree that it is as bland as grape nuts. I agree it looks boring, terrible cover, and total lack of theme. But it just scratches this "efficiency puzzle" in a way that other games don't. There is no luck, it doesn't over stay it's welcome and I love the secret scoring because every one thinks they are in it the whole time. It isn't the same kind if fun as my other games but I always have fun while playing it!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Hey - you're right. There's no luck! In fact, i think it's even less no-lucky than the oft-touted Terra Mystica (which has some randomness in setup that may favour one faction over another). i think the only remotely lucky thing here is turn order and how those new cards get dealt to the shopping row - is that correct?

[@benhoff901]

@@NightsAroundaTable Ya, the order those cards come out are definitely the most luck based part, but since that deck has multiple of most cards you will likely get more than one shot at each one. It is also fairly quick and super easy rules explanation which makes it more accessible that Terra Mysitica or other heavier strategy games. It is a bit of a goldilocks game for me and my group. Not too long, not too hard, juuuuust right.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

@@benhoff901 For sure, it's far easier to explain than TM. And the randomness of the card deal is even mitigated by the fact that the good cards are sorted into sections, so there can't really be that much variability in them.

[@ScytheNoire]

Concordia is one of many Euro games where mechanics are valued above all else. Maybe it's a Euro game thing, but I think that audiences today want their Euro games to also look good. When you see games like Everdell, Brass, Viticulture, Scythe, and Wingspan, we get to wanting all our Euro games to look that good. There is no excuse these days for dry, boring looking Euro games.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i agree. i remember a time when Days of Wonder came in and kicked over the apple cart. They were like "BY THE WAY: WE HIRED ARTISTS" and everyone was like "whaaaaa...??" i think DoW is owed a lot in the beautification of board games.

[@dimpleza]

By now I think they do it on purpose so you know what you're getting into :)

[@Johannes_W]

Aside Brass you only mentioned euro games which mostly valued looks and nothing else. I rather stick to those who value mechanisms as the look is far from the top of my priorities for a game.

[@R0land1199]

Your unfun points aren’t necessarily wrong but I weigh them so low versus the great game play they aren’t really relevant. I kind of felt like you were stretching with this one. :).

[@pm71241]

Does Concordia need an "attract mode"? When you describe arcade games ... I guess I'm really not alone when having little interest in them. I'd rather dive into a deep strategic challenge of cardboard. And the last time my son convinced me to try an arcade game based on the "attract mode", he walked away utterly disappointed by a really shitty game.

[@chimster1234]

Fun and appeal is subjective for sure. My Fun is probably pretty damn boring for most people. I love Concordia because it's fun for me. I also bought it initially based on the aesthetics. I love the way it looks. To me, its elegant. Sure beats the cartoony look and feel that most other games are going for....imho of course. But I agree with you on many of your points though. An anvil as a tool? That actually had a fairly big impact on learning the game. Had it been a hammer, it wouldn't have been an issue.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Fun vs appeal? That’s a useful distinction. The game is enjoyable, but unappealing.

[@petewhyle4683]

Really interesting thought about the lack of personality and colour. Never really thought it would be more 'fun' with them, but I actually agree. If the cards had images of the people performing the action and a small God image would be great. I'm now imagining all those games would cards that have great graphics that really just to add theme and flavour (Dominion, MTG, 7 Wonders, etc)

[@NightsAroundaTable]

For sure! Could you imagine M:TG with all stats and no pictures? That's kind of what we're dealing with here. Much less expensive to produce, of course. But this game has a history of questionable art decisions (read: very little money spent). Check out the original cover of the Salsa expansion for proof of that.

[@jackbaligad7004]

Et tu, Ryan? I find Concordia fun despite your valid not fun points. I appreciate the “good game doesn’t mean fun game” point. So what’s a bad game that’s a fun game? Great vid as always!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Thanks, Jack! Just glancing at my board game collection, one that jumps out as bad-but-fun is King of Tokyo. Maybe i'll make a FtF episode for that one soon.

[@jackbaligad7004]

@@NightsAroundaTable Ok, I can see that. That would make a “fun” Find the Fun vid!

[@spencercapier2258]

Okay wow. I want to start by saying I think you are one of the smartest reviewers out there. I really dig what you do. I completely disagree with your approach to what is fun! I don't like games that are brash and infantile. All the games you contrasted to Concordia were saccharine sweet, at least in their design. I like the grown up restrained design of the Uwe Rosenberg Euro game aesthetic. Fun for a grown up is not My Little Pony. Concordia takes a bit of work to get into, like a Margaret Atwood novel or a NFB documentary. I don't play games for the quick hit of dopamine like in the video game world (slight dig) I play them for the log term deeper sense of joy and contentment. I don't want cocaine, I want community and a proper cup of tea. Hansa Teutonica looks like my dog barfed medieval Germany on to my Persian carpet. But it's deep and satisfying game. The cover of Concordia is an abomination, as is the box for the first expansion Salsa. The restrained design and the minimalist components distract you in no way from the elegance and beauty of a finely executed mechanic. BTW it's not conquest it's TRADE. 2nd or 3rd century AD during the peaceful part of Roman history. If you like podcasts there is an absolutely brilliant and FUN podcast called "The History of Rome." It's great. Seriously though, I am snarky but I think you wanted to provoke responses so I'm giving you one. I'm Canadian so now I'm slightly guilty and want to apologize. You are doing amazing work and you have been a major contributor to my mental health during the pandemic. Also I've bought Roll for the Galaxy and all the expansions thanks to your videos and I haven't had anyone in the house for 16 months. BTW the best insert for that is Gaming Trunk. Keep up the great work, I'm going to support you on patreon now...

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Thanks, Spencer! i’ve been talking to Gaming Trunk recently about getting something going. Canuckistan ftw! i remember a year or more ago - maybe on the Castles of Burgundy - someone describing many euros as “aggressively boring,” and the phrase just stuck in my mind as being both hilarious and useful. i don’t need games about zombie hookers to have a good time - and *actually* dull gameplay of the kind you might find in a game illustrated by The Oatmeal makes me legitimately yawn - but recall that i’m the guy who gave a thumbs up to Keyflower… a game that, despite having no faces like Concordia, still manages to project a certain personality. (Kind of an accountant’s personality. But at least it’s something.) Also… let’s not paint all video games with the same brush. I am a dyed-in-the-wool text adventure fan (and author!)

[@paulszki]

I really wouldn't call Terra Mystica "saccarine". Same for 7 Wonders. It's not about how luxurious or colorful or detailed components are, not about miniatures, companion apps, lush artwork etc. It's really about personality or the uniqueness in presentation. This looks like a game from the 90s with leftover components from Settlers of Catan. Components in Concordia are just not good. It's not just about how "colorful" something is. Concordia is actually very colorful and saturated. Just take the player colors. It's the standard red, blue, green, yellow, black. What was keeping them from using some interesting color schemes? Did it HAVE to be primary colors plus bright green & black? And I'm not judging from afar. I own Concordia, I played it several times, including Salsa and on different maps. It IS a great game. But there are other great games that actually have an engaging presentation in addition to being an excellent game, so naturally I will gravitate towards games that "have it all". And to be fair, for me Terra Mystica actually has the exact same problem. Components lifted straight from Settlers of Catan, a "world map" that looks nothing like a real place (I MUCH prefer the maps from Concordia, because you get a sense of where you are in the world) and that one artwork of your chosen race really doesn't really infuse much flavor. In contrast to say, Race for the Galaxy, which also has a billion symbols and Iconography but at the end of the game I actually feel like the game told a story and I forged some kind of identity through the planets I chose to conquer or settle and the technological developments I chose to research. At the end of a game of Terra Mystica I feel like either I managed to get enough points or I didn't. Same as Concordia. (I like Concordia more though.) I think the best comparision would be Brass. It's very similar to Concordia on a surface level. You have a bunch of cards in your hand which you play to become an economic powerhouse on the board. Only Brass Lanceshire/Birmingham are beautiful games despite the oppressive theme. The player colors are interesting and not just red, green, blue, yellow. It's funny because the original game was also a favourite of many but due to the "remake/remaster" it has jumped up so much in popularity. Imagine Concordia getting a serious facelift like Brass. 😍

[@spencercapier2258]

@@NightsAroundaTable I will admit I may have upgraded the coins in Concordia to give a bit more pizzazz to the game play. Geekup bits for Ora et Labora would incapacitate me with joy. So though I do like the little blue square for cloth because abstraction is my jam, I am a sucker for aesthetics, just the aggressively boring kind as you say! Also: the Castles of Burgundy redesign was a crime against humanity. The last video game I really enjoyed (apart from Last Day on Earth on the iPad) was Firewatch so I do like video games, I was just being obstreperous.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

@@spencercapier2258 i need more folks who can casually throw around words i have to look up in the dictionary! i have metal coins en route for Merchants & Marauders and am very excited. Still haven't played my copy of Ora et Labora. And we agree on that Burgundy travesty.

[@RandomPerson-nd2ey]

Haha. I guess I'll be "that guy". It's a hand management game. Deck builders have a shuffled deck you draw cards from to put in your hand. A hand management gives you access to everything at the same time. That's actually relevant because deck builders are more fluid and random because you're restricted by the random card draw. It's really fun and cool when you the right combination of cards to pull off the combo you were planning when you got a card, like getting the right combination on a slot machine. Hand management allows more choices. Less randomness but you are able to do what you want when you want it. Also, you're not playing as conquering groups. There's no combat. You're playing as merchants. The colonists (people and boats) are establishing trade routes so they're going back and forth on that route trading things. The houses are trading posts. That's why the costs go up for every other one that's already there. You're having to build up your store to compete with one that's already established. Edit: no argument against any of your points with the artwork and components. I'd like for them to make a second edition with all of that updated. I don't think they should add iconography instead of text though unless they're very careful about making it as clear as the text. Edit: Yeah, we just call them "coins".

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Yes - correct on both counts. Hand management vs deck builder may be an interesting distinction for ultranerds - i just worry that it's not a useful piece of pedantry for welcoming new people to the hobby. Raoul: "We're gonna teach you this great deck building game!" Hubert: "Um, actually? It's a hand management game." Suzy: "i'm just gonna.... go."

[@skeezaworkan]

It's about trading, not war XD

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Then why does it make me wanna smack someone??

[@skeezaworkan]

@@NightsAroundaTable haha XD

[@RossEphgrave]

Thanks for this review. I've had this game in my hands a few times and put it back on the shelf. I have a feeling it would be like playing Strasbourg which was fun the first few times but then suddenly felt very antiseptic.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Definitely give it a go if you find yourself in a board game cafe. It's light enough on rules and setup that you won't spend your whole time finding your footing.

[@TheLabecki]

As a suit wearer I happen to like Concordia's button up business like presentation! lol. I agree with you regarding the obliqueness of the scoring, but the aesthetic and thematic side of things does not matter to me that much.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

We can’t all rock up to the game table in a bathrobe and an inside-out Harley Davidson t-shirt with cigarette burn holes in it.

[@ProgShell]

I love Concordia, but I agree that it’s absolutely the kind of game that people make fun of when they make fun of modern board games. Also, regarding the scoring when I’m teaching Concordia I don’t even tell people how to score. It’s so complicated to explain. It’s easier to just explain the cards and play it and then score it at the end.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

It’s all about the cones!

[@WhatsDaveUpTo]

Why do people think scoring in concordia is difficult? Its dead easy! each card scores like it says on it. Have multiples of the same god card? They each score individually. I have one card that says i get a point for each province im in...great 3 points. I have another card that says i get a point for each province im in, great, another 3 points! Why is that so difficult?

[@pete7421]

Great video series! Would love to see you do one for Lorenzo Il Magnifico.

[@tala1246]

One of my favs out of about 200 games we own, actually. Ha.😁

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i hope the other 199 are all variations of Fluxx! :)

[@paulszki]

Title is misspelled ConDordia 😅 (thank you for your awesome videos)

[@Physiology-E-Paathshala]

I like Concordia...Never saw this game with such a detailed perspective....Before watching your video..I thought everything about (and in) this game was good but now I am having second thoughts myself....😅

[@Rooney0196]

Just recently purchased this, introduced by a friend. I definitely agree about the components haha. I have deluxe tokens even cloth, just need wine. I'm pretty excited to play it with those. I also agree about the art, definitely needs to be updated. Speaking about the money.. I don't even want to try and spell it lol. I call it money/coins during the game 😆 We skipped the scoring rounds, we only did it once at the end. Ps. I see you have Pirates Cove, are you willing to sell it hahaha

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Is Pirate’s Cove in demand? It’s… not very good.

[@Rooney0196]

@@NightsAroundaTable nah, the bf just wants a copy. He's more of a collector lol vs I actually want to play the games.

[@clyne90]

How is Black Angel? I'm considering getting it

[@NightsAroundaTable]

My wife Cheryl and i had different experiences. We played it with my friend Dave. Dave and i both have ADHD (his is more pronounced), so poor Cheryl had a rough time with us. i LOVED it. Cheryl was in a mode that night where learning new things was hard, and she failed to grasp some of the more crucial aspects of play. She couldn't wrap her mind around this odd, particular scoring system the game has, and it bit her in endgame. Dave and i had a really good time obsessing over the minutiae. i thought it was really neat. It reminded me of... have you played Lords of Waterdeep? Imagine that game, where you can pay to build new worker placement slots that everyone can use... except add this interesting mechanic where those worker placement slots can be pushed off the board with the passage of time. That was the most unique thing going on in the game, to my mind.

[@WhatsDaveUpTo]

Its a poorer version of its magnificent sibling Troyes.

[@igelkott255]

I'm guessing you would consider Thunder Road Vendetta to be FUN. I also consider TRV to be FUN - a kind of crazy FUN. I also consider Concordia to be FUN- more of a serious type of FUN. I like a variety of different types of FUN games.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

So true! The comments i’ve seen about Thunder Road classify it as a certain kind of fun, for sure. i don’t know if my game group would dig it? Kinda seems like a Mario Kart vs Gran Turismo situation.

[@danagoniahobby4914]

I love these videos! Pls do “Black Angel” or “Trockerion” next :)

[@Cornchps827]

Black angel for sure. I already know Trickerion is fun haha

[@NightsAroundaTable]

@@Cornchps827 Trickerion's one where i would list a bunch of stuff that other people wouldn't find fun, but that i adore. 15 minute setup/decision time? Fun! Kitchen sink mechanics? Fun! Multi-hour play time? Fun! :)

[@zipl0c]

I have yet to play Concordia. I bought it (Venus standalone version) because I have a friend who is obsessed with Catan, and though it was my gateway game and my favorite game before I played other modern games, I can't stand the idea of playing Catan again. Whenever I look at it to learn it (I watched and liked your how to play video as well), it just looks so BEIGE and BORRRING. Genuinely, I bought it to make HEAT: Pedal to the Metal ship for free and to have an option on-hand if Catan gets suggested. HEAT, by the way, is FUN. edit: misspelled “BEIGE”

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i’ve heard such great things about Heat!

[@zipl0c]

I don’t know whether or not it lives up to the hype (how would one calculate hype:good ratio?), but it genuinely is good. It’s easy to teach and learn, fun and fast to play, and has additional modules to add complexity.

[@WhatsDaveUpTo]

I played Concordia once in a two player game. I thought it was...okay. though I could probably see how with more players it would be more fun.

[@mikemudrow]

Another good one on the books. I too would like to see a revamped version with slightly nicer components and artwork on the cards. But I never really understood why everyone rails on Concordia for being ugly. There are tons of other good games that are waaaay uglier. Is it just that it's so highly ranked that it takes the flack for the rest of the ugly Euros? I'll grant that the boats, dudes, and resources are fairly generic, and the cards need updated artwork and better indication of scoring. But at least they aren't CUBES on various shades of BEIGE. I think the colors are muted on the board on purpose, so the vibrant player colors can stand out better. Also, Ryan, Concordia is not a deck builder. I'll die on this hill. It's not just pedantic for hand management vs. deckbuilding--It's a significant difference. Story time: last year I taught my dad Concordia and then Clank! a few days later. He thought both were fun, but got frustrated in Clank! because the cards he wanted in his deck didn't show up when he needed them. He never remarks on mechanics because that's just not how he enjoys games. But after playing Clank! he said he would have enjoyed it more if he had been able to have all his cards in his hand, even if he was only allowed to play 5 in combination at a time. Now, that's my bad for failing to teach deckbuilding such that he could more quickly succeed. Or for teaching two games with such outwardly similar but internally different cardplay styles back-to-back. I'll do better next time in planning and teaching. All that is just to say, I think there is a meaningful difference in terms of how deckbuilders and hand management games play, and we ignore them at risk to our friends' enjoyment.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Ooooooh you've done it now. You'll die on that hill, and i'm prepared to let you! It sounds like what you're describing is your dad's tolerance for randomness, not any significant mechanical difference in gameplay. In some deckbuilders, you draw all your cards. In some, you don't. i don't think we need to pedantically categorize that difference with a completely new term. My hope is to make board games MORE accessible, not less - and i've been doing that Board Games 101 series to help explain insider nomenclature that might confuse or frustrate newcomers. "Deckbuilder" vs "Hand manager" feels destined to confuse and alienate. Is Arnak a deckbuilder or a hand manager? You're guaranteed to draw all your cards (provided the game doesn't end) - you just don't necessarily pull them all in the same draw. New cards go to the bottom of the deck, but you may be able to engineer your turn to dig down to them. In Monumental, new cards you buy go to the TOP of your deck, so they're immediately usable if you're able to execute a "draw a card" action. Like Arnak, you WILL see your whole deck, unless the game ends before you get a chance to cycle through it. Is Monumental a deck-builder or a hand manager? What about Bohnanza? All you're doing is managing your hand. But is calling it a "hand management game" at all helpful or informative? i don't think it is. What about Hanabi? To my mind, and to simplify it, they're all deckbuilders (except Bohnanza and Hanabi). Everyone starts with the same crummy cards, and you can use those cards to buy better cards into your deck. That, there, is the salient point. Some of these games let you chip through your whole deck, and some have you drawing only a few cards from it, reshuffling frequently. Sometimes your new cards go to the top of your deck, sometimes they do to the bottom, and sometimes (as in Concordia) they go straight into your active hand. But those variations don't warrant an entirely other classification. So here we are, two dumb corpses on a hill. It was a nice life! (And by the way... ugly is still ugly, even if something exists that's even uglier. ;)

[@mikemudrow]

@@NightsAroundaTable good points all around. Honestly, deck building fits under the umbrella of hand management anyway. Sorry to clutter up your efforts at accessibility :)

[@mikemudrow]

To me, the randomness of the draw is core to the roots of deck building as a mechanism, clear back to Dominion and even earlier to the CCGs that inspired the genre. It's about the suspense of not knowing what you will draw that makes it fun. Games like Arnak and Monumental iterate on that idea. I'll admit Concordia has some deck builder flavor, but it just doesn't *feel* like a deck builder because there is no card draw: the only suspense comes from the cards your opponent will play.

[@usmanfarooq6741]

Hmm. I suppose when I feel like playing a "fun", game then I play something like King of Tokyo or other such dice driven games. But if I want to "enjoy" a thinky, puzzly game with lots of decision space and strategy, plus i dont care much about the art on the cover then Concordia is up there with some of the best.. in my humble option anyway

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Totally fair! i do love to set my mind to work. But i’m spoiled for choice over here, and will reach for a dozen other games before this one.

[@usmanfarooq6741]

@@NightsAroundaTable I agree there is a lot of choice BUT if this pops up in one of your dozen games, then its doing pretty well considering how many good games there are out there

[@Physiology-E-Paathshala]

U should do more such Find the Fun even for classics like Carcassonne, splendor, etc

[@Johannes_W]

I mean I was able to follow you on the Funkenschlag criticism, but here it stops, haha. All the "negative" things you said don't bother me at all in the game and barely effect the fun I have. But it is also true that I sometimes look through balance sheets and also find that at least interesting.

[@AllYouCanBoard]

Great stuff, Ryan! I held off from buying Concordia or seeking it out to play for so many years now, mostly because of feeling similar to a lot of what you described here - it didn't look FUN. But, to this day, I keep hearing people rave about it, and a lot of people say it's their #1 game of all-time. I recently cracked and finally bought it but it's still sitting on the shelf, unplayed. Watching this makes me wonder if I made a mistake, after seeing you pick it apart... I, too, have enough games in my collection that I absolutely LOVE, and I'm worried this will just be "fine" and nothing more. Anyway, thanks for the detailed breakdown and the laughs! Hoping this one doesn't make me crap my pants... or wait, do I WANT this one to make me crap my pants? :P P.S. Oshawa, eh? Hello from Winnipeg! - Carlo

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Hey hoser! The good thing about buying a game you may not be thrilled with that everyone seems to live is that it’s easier to resell. :). It’s honestly a solidly built game… i just wish it was about magical biker gnomes or something.

[@AllYouCanBoard]

@@NightsAroundaTable Do I sense a re-theme in the works? You should probably claim the rights to that idea before somebody else jumps on it.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

@@AllYouCanBoard If i had a dime for every magical biker gnome board game in development...

[@conradglasbergen4708]

Oshawa? the shwiggity! he ho from hammetown hamilton!

[@emmanuelrodriguez1693]

I'm on team not deck building! - i hate deck building but love concordia. its the random draw for me vs control in when cards are played/"drawn"... Anyway, good video big fan of the channel !

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Line up on that side of the battlefield! We ride at dawn!

[@WhiteOpsDude]

This was a helluva review mate. I really enjoy watch it and frankly I didn't find anything that you've said to disagree with.

[@yvindheilo229]

Pick up the custom meeples for the game. Gorgeous and adresses the problems you have with the game! :)

[@carlatate7678]

Hm, I eat wholemeal pasta and all my veggies (including those that are technically fruits) and my cereal choices are definitely more Grape-Nut than Count Chocula...and so are all my board game preferences. (And yes it bothers me that you say deck builder when it's a hand management game. :) ) Concordia, Castles of Burgundy, Obsession, Brass: Birmingham -- whole lotta whole grain goodness there. You say you and your wife 'got really into it' but it wasn't 'fun'. 'Getting really into it' equals fun, for me. Elegant game play, scoring that's just complex enough that you might have some surprises at the end of the game, and decision making that is just complicated enough to engage but not agonising -- that's fun! Now I'm off to enjoy my salted oatmeal and black coffee breakfast. (BTW, I see 7 Wonders Duel on your shelf there, I got rid of that one because we thought it was too dry!)

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i’ll give you engaging and interesting and compelling and thinky, but i’ll stop short at fun. And Burgundy is very dry too, but i find it fun. It’s a real fine line. :)

[@henrykorvus6954]

Concordia uses hand management, it’s not a deck builder.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i see you made this comment before i complained about you in the Find the Fun video. :)

[@wsiegel9539]

I think if Concordia had a reprint with updated artwork, cool mini's and resources ( KickStarter I'm looking at you ) I would be all in. I do enjoy the game when I play it, with the Salsa expansion, however I agree it is a very dry game. It reminds me of another game I adore very much, Hansa Teutonica, Great mechanics, no real theme. neither box art screams, Play Me.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i've heard so much about Hansa Teutonica, but i think whenever i've looked at the box, my eyes go crossed with disinterest, like you say.

[@kaladze93]

I can't think of a game that needs cool minis LESS than Concordia.

[@jeffweber8244]

Want to hear more about what happened at Jeneane's wedding.

[@5ammy13]

You look so much like Brian Quinn from Impractical 😁😉

[@NightsAroundaTable]

You’re not the first person to say it!

[@Duxa_]

Hmm, for some reason it is assumed as a given that heavy economics or mechanics games are not fun. Hansa Teutonica, Castles of Burgundy, PowerGrid, Brass (2007) and many others look drab, yet are very very fun. This is true even for video games, look at EVE, its a spreadsheet, yet is one of the most successful MMOs out there, its been running longer than WOW. I guess different people just have different definitions for 'fun'. some consider winning 'fun' (we all have friends like this), while others (like me), enjoy the experience of playing and could careless if I win. Winning makes me happy, no doubt, but its not required to have fun. I can see how the cloth tile is underwhelming, but at the same time when looking at it it totally made sense that it was a folded sheet of cotton. Also if it really bothers people that much they can cheaply be replaced with a 3D printed or some other component. 'Faces' complaint is a strange one, I havent thought about it at all, and now that its pointed out it doesnt bother me personally at all. I think the fun lies in the game's mechanics rather than its presentation. The mechanics are the cake, while presentation is a cherry on top. lack of that cherry does not ruin the cake. just my two cents. Ive always been put off by presentation of classics like Catan and Carcassonne, yet I wouldnt say they arent fun. I think this is an excellent game, id recommend it for people who like Castles of Burgundy or Hansa Teutonica.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Of the games you mentioned, i've covered off two more in this series: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gHKsnIuGhcpjkK8 kzbin.info/www/bejne/ipDOoqZoo7GkgNE i recently played Hansa Teutonica for the first time and came away quite impressed with it.

[@richardhancock1505]

Thanks Ryan, I really enjoy Concordia despite the lack of cool artwork. I’d love to see a re-make with your suggestions to have the game look as good as it deserves. You make me think about what it is that makes me want to play any game… For me FUN GAMES: would mean opportunities that make me laugh or interact with other players such as Pitch Car Telestrations Cosmic Encounter Deception Murder in Hong Kong Then there are games I love equally but for different reasons: ENGAGING/ ABSORBING / SATISFYING / EDGE OF YOUR SEAT- POO YOUR PANTS - TENSE games Star Wars Rebellion Twilight Imperium IV 7 WONDERS DUEL Everdell A Feast for Odin Rising Sun LOST RUINS IF ARNAK BRASS BIRMINGHAM TOO MANY BONES they satisfy in different ways. All of these games are added to in terms of enjoyment with beautiful components, artwork, game flow and player aids/ clear rules. Love your intelligent approach, humour and ability to stir up debate! Keep ‘em coming’!

[@Alluvian567]

Not knowing the score at all until the end is one of my favorite parts of Concordia. I have a strong dislike for score trackers in any game that does not have a ton of end game scoring. Seeing that you are in last place and have no chance to win with 1/3 of the game left to play is deflating and ruins the game for about half the players at any given table. That said, we score Concordia in a score sheet we made up. Doing that track is really clunky IMO.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

It's a philosophy, for sure. i have a friend whose motto is simply "play to win," and if that means you have to be ruthless and crush your opponents beneath your heels, then so be it! But i recognize that not all play styles are to all tastes. :)

[@mathswithgarry7104]

Concordia is the Roman goddess signifying harmony or agreement in marriage or society.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

She’s also the goddess of grapes and jet airliners.

[@mathswithgarry7104]

@@NightsAroundaTable A lot of people who play this game say that the gameplay is superbly balanced. I hope they're right, because I just got the game for my birthday!

[@whoeveriam0iam14222]

This game looks like one of those old games that got a remake and now this original looks weird and old Except there is no newer version? The difference between a hand management game and deck building is the expectation of the player hearing the term In a deck builder you don't know what your next hand will look like but you improve the deck to improve your chances of getting the good stuff In hand management games you can see and use all your options but you have to plan ahead so you don't end up with useless cards at the end of your hand. Just because you can take the cost of wasting a turn to get your cards back doesn't make it a deck builder

[@hpshovecraft]

I felt bad initially for being a game mechanic pedant (shouting at my monitor "For crying out loud, Ryan, they have fundamentally different play patterns!") but then Ryan was a stickler over what counts as a tool and I felt like I belonged. Concordia doesn't do it for me, and I agree the presentation is weak. I also think it's a very mechanical game, just a collection of transactions for resources on the board, where the theme of your actions doesn't come through. Imagine if all of Lost Ruins of Arnak felt like advancing your magnifying glass on the research track. The recent Faiyum (which owes a lot to Concordia) looks like a much better game to me, but I find the art direction and production decisions even worse than Concordia, so much so that I doubt I'll buy it. Thanks for making these great videos, and I'm glad you have people to support you instead of just freeloaders like me.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Thanks, hoshovercraft! it’ll make a crew member out of you yet! Whenever anyone mentions Faiuyum, i think of Feudum, and that batshit insane official How to Play video that had me howling with laughter at its sheer absurdity by about 3 minutes in.

[@matthewbarker9134]

Guess what, anvils and toolboxes are tools!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

So is heat! So are hands! Everything is nothing!

[@danielyeatts491]

Dude, if you want a FUN game you do NOT play a freaking EURO. Bust out Telestrations or Time's Up and have a laugh around the table with a few cocktails for FUN, or go tot he park and have a Nerf Battle, hiding behind some trees. Concordia is an AMAZING Euro game, a thinker, that does not overstay its welcome like some other Euros do, and doesn't have so many rules that you have to constantly be checking the rulebook for iconography or mechanisms. Euros are never FUN. Has anyone ever said Orleans was FUN? How about Puerto Rico or Paladins of the West Kingdom? Fun is not the appropriate word. Words I might associate with most Euros: Complex / Challenging / Competitive / Thematically and Aesthetically as DRY as the Sahara, and yet Incredibly Satisfying (when the points add up.) I hear you here and I respect your opinion, and I even agree: Concordia is not necessarily FUN. But damn, it is a great freaking game!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i do have fun playing certain euro games for sure, but it’s down to how you define “fun.” Some players think pvp mechanics are fun. Some say auctions are fun. Others like trading with other players. i’m discovering i don’t generally consider staunchly multiplayer solitaire games much fun. i can’t get ppl in my game group to play the types of party games you mentioned with me. Why? Because they don’t find them fun. We don’t have to adhere to a normie/mainstream Nerf-or-nothing idea of fun. To some people, spreadsheets are fun. i call those people “Euro gamers” :P

[@typerk2388]

I find it laughable that you take on the mock pedant nerd voice to for people who discuss mecahnics. Let's not forget that you once argued that Telestrations is not a game and backed it up with "I'm a ludoligist, I'm a game designer by trade".

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Yeah, but i’m a COOL nerd… not, like, a nerdy nerd. i’m the kind of nerd who makes fun of other nerds to avoid getting beaten up by definitive non-nerds.

[@jeffmcleod3829]

Must. Not. Die. On pedantic. Hill... Cant help it: To me Concordia is not a deck builder because it lacks two key components: 1) the randomization of what might come up next and having to decided on gameplay because of it and 2) the need to thin out the deck for more efficient game play If anything, I would call Concordia action selection. Or something. Just not deck building.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Yeah - i agree. Action selection, or even worker placement. It’s a weird one, because they’ve taken what’s usually on a board and put it on cards instead.

[@TheTheshadow32]

I did not even know Concordia because I am for 95% a solo player … and then they published the solo expansion a few weeks ago. WoW … With hundreds of different solo games under my belt I think this solo mode is nuts… The AI Bot playing against your own played cards. Tremendously fun… because “fun” is so subjective it is odd to even take this as a title for a review series. But I get it, you need the views and hits in order to sell your videos. 😀 Yes Concordia has an older approach and it is clearly a step up from both basic deck builders and the old Catan like games but as a thematic gamer, - adventures and wargames- are my thing, it is ONE of the very few eurogames I actually like to play from time to time along with Viticulture or Terraforming Mars or the newer Dune Imperium. Any way Concordia SOLO is a LOT more fun AND thematic than say Tapestry or Pendulum. My number one solo game is Enemy Action : Ardennes. Talking about historical realism. That one every boardgamer should play at least once in his/her life time. You will soon realise what a boardgame CAN do thematically. Be prepared to learn history…🍇

[@NightsAroundaTable]

If i don't learn any history while playing Enemy Action: Ardennes, am i doomed to repeat playing the game?

[@TheTheshadow32]

@@NightsAroundaTable You’ll probably learn more about the battle of the Bulge by playing Enemy Action Ardennes than reading a few books about it. 😀. Actually that’s why we started wargaming in the 60’s. Fun is very subjective.

[@Straddllw]

All the "not fun" things can be countered by "get gud". :p

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Including “git gud at publishing board games” :)

[@alkendan3984]

Everything you say that are pro fun are also pro fun to me. And the cons you said are actually also pro fun to me. I think is the perfect eurogame. And it feels and look european. Love the economy love the strategy and love this game. Your critic is mostly about how it looks. But for me the fun is in the dinamics. And I do like how it looks, looks ancient. It feels like a very well thought game. Also your video is good. :) I only disagree with the opinion. I think Concordia is fun. And I do think it makes people play more healthy ^-^.

[@GuyRiessen]

How many times have we all been suckered into buying a video game based on its "attract factor' only to find out it's absolute garbage...that experience is not fun. FWIW I too was a video game artist for 10 years, and then a VFX artist on many of those shiny FX heavy movies for the last 15 years. Although a tried and true professional artist, I will be the first on the soapbox to shout that 'pretty' in no way equals fun. In no way. None. (and no, I don't like quarterly earnings reports from pharmaceutical companies)

[@alxvdark]

I might enjoy playing this, but anyone I show this to is going to be like: “No.” Yokohama met such a fate (and it looks better than this)...if you have a good game, get yourself a graphic designer and an artist/illustrator!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

It's a good game! i promise! But we're spoiled by choice, and there are plenty of good AND good-looking games out there to play, so why sacrifice half the experience?

[@BigDeuce1972]

I love grape nuts.

[@BoardGameGran]

LOL Trying to work out if to buy this and you made it sounds really NOT fun, which I wasn't expecting. Clearly needed more Chockula. Thanks for he thoughts!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

It’s a well-lived game! It would get played more if it was one in a small collection, but it just gets overlooked for flashier stuff.

[@marksteelman7747]

You have succeeded in talking me out of buying this game

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Try it for free somewhere first!

[@thursty4boardgames944]

I understand the complaints that people have for Concordia considering its art direction but, for whatever reason for my girlfriend and I we find this game to be gorgeous. It’s the game we have the most plays on that is about 20+ plays within the last year. We love the way the maps look on the table and the components. I love the scoring and I know I don’t have to speak on that because a lot of people do but, especially in very strategic euros like this one a scoreboard where everyone knows how behind they are when there’s another hour left is debilitating. However, with Concordia’s scoring system you don’t know how well everyone’s doing but you try your best to focus on 2 or 3 gods and score the best that way. I love not knowing how well everyone did because if you destroyed someone who was right behind ya in points at that point, pun intended, the game is over so no need to be bummed out by a bad score or being destroyed by a great one. I find the scoring to be tense and exciting. I’ve got 6 maps to it and I think I’m gonna collect these maps like how people collect ticket to ride maps. Overall, I understand that people will view this game as dry but I cannot see it that way, it is exciting at every turn and the cards do what I expect them to do after what they are named after. I’ve got the Concordia Venus standalone box so pulling that out is exciting since it has this gorgeous purple hue and has this weight that something wonderful is about to happen. It is as fun for me as Everdell is but I understand why you cannot call Concordia fun. It is dry there’s no denying that but I think it is nonetheless a fun experience. It has wonderful fun things where if you’ve expanded somewhere and someone plays their prefect to a region you’ll get whatever your city produces when it is not your turn and that’s fun. Anyways I could talk endlessly about this game since it’s my #1 game of all time

[@NightsAroundaTable]

i'm glad you chimed in, because i wanted to talk to someone who had played a bunch of the maps. Do you find those additional maps really change the experience? Expound!

[@thursty4boardgames944]

@@NightsAroundaTable if you look at bgg there’s a pdf that has a chart for what is called a “heat map.” Basically let’s say you want a tight 3 player map for Concordia well on the chart the tightest map, meaning an experience where players are gonna get in each other’s way, will be Corsica. Now of the maps I have are From the concordia Venus box Ionium, Hellas, Imperium, and Cyprus. Those maps are nice and adds to the variation but it’s really the new Venus god that changes the game a bit and the ability to change the price for the cards and the magister card which copies your last played card. The second map pack I got was the Concordia Venus Balearica/Italia map pack which introduces the fish mark in which all the prefect spots are swapped for fish which you can spend at the start of your turn at the fish market. The fish market 8 of these spots that are either a resource or some sort of special action you get to do in addition of your card you’ll play after you’re done with the fish market stuff. All in all I love this fish market, and I think salsa is must buy just for the salt resource. Also, I would add any map pack that has some set of special rules is a must get like the Aegyptus/Creta boards which are really fun ones that change up the game just a bit to keep it interesting. I’ve only been playing this game for a year but I have really have loved every play and discovering new maps is fun. I tried them out first on Tabletop Simulator.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

@@thursty4boardgames944 Ah - i didn't realize there were rule changes with the new maps. i thought they just had different city locations and routes, and maybe province sizes. That makes it a lot more compelling. The Terraforming Mars Venus map, for example, merely changes up the positions of things that are already in the base game. And it alters the public goals.

[@thursty4boardgames944]

@@NightsAroundaTable not a lot of them alter the rules or add things but the ones are do are for sure interested. I know there’s one where the first person to get their sea colonist there will earn some points at the end of the game but that player will be playing with one less colonist for the rest of the game (or at least I believe that’s how it works). It’s definitely worth looking up if you enjoy Concordia enough but it sounds like you play it every now and then which I can’t blame ya if you got gorgeous games like Everdell. It’s definitely worth the research into some maps that just look like new routes because there are definitely some with some really cool rules. I know there’s one that has a one city brown province that allows you to take whatever resource you’d like every time you prefect for the resource. Anyways, yeah for sure and I was worried about that too. The other problem I have is I love having the idea of just having so many boards and maps to play for a game I know I’ll pretty much only play at 2 lol. Also, you mentioned the wooden goods/resource seeming to be just standard which I can’t blame ya there and I honestly have never thought about the tool being represented by an anvil and the sort of problem with that lol. There are some really gorgeous options on Etsy that people have made for Concordia. I know I’ll be deluxifying my copy since I know Rio Grande will never do that. A lot of rio grande games are too ugly for me and for whatever reason I never saw that with Concordia

[@TheLuminousCleric]

I have another target for you: Faiyum. That game looks like it was made in the 80s. Just like Vinhos. Ugly boards.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

You're the second person on this thread to mention Faiyum!

[@Q-papir-tigris]

Let's talk mechanics...tools and anvils. This is not a DECKBUILDING game, it's RONDEL style game. (sorry, had to point it out) :P :D PD-Verlag is not famous for "production design"! ;)

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Oooooohhhhh.... that's a very chewy challenge you've posited. i want to disagree, but i'm trying to figure out WHY i disagree. ... okay, how about this: it's not a rondel, because there's nothing *positional* about your action choice. With a rondel, you need to travel around a circle or loop in order to *reach* the action you want. And there's a possibility of overshooting it, or of not being able to "physically" get to it. But in Concordia, all available actions are equally selectable/reachable. There's no spatial consideration or limitation, which i think counts it out of being a rondel. If anything (if you want to be boldly heretical) it's more like a worker placement game where the placement spots are all personal to each player, and the move to reclaim your cards is akin to sweeping your placed pawns from the spaces, freeing them all up again.

[@joshuag7027]

Everytime I consider this game I think: mechanics are interesting, but it's soo dry!

[@NightsAroundaTable]

It’s eating-saltine-crackers-in-the-Gobi-desert-with-Bea-Arthur dry!

[@TheBigScreenTv21]

Concordia is my favourite game but Ryan is so right. The art design is very bland. I can far easier get people excited for Everdell or Wingspan just beacuse of fun art and theme.

[@Javaslinger7730]

Eh, weak criticisms. Concordia is a great game.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Good to see you just read the chapter headings before commenting.

[@scottaldersey5115]

Concordia IS a great game, and the reviewer acknowledges that. It also definitely doesn't hit the table in my group as much as other more exciting games, even if those games are less mechanically sound. I agree 100%.

[@alxvdark]

"counter-point: you're wrong" the weakest criticism of all

[@thecuriousboardgamer]

Great vid! I haven't played Concordia yet, but I bought it on sale to give it a go. Beyond the Sun is just begging to be on this series.

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Beyond the Sun is well loved by the crew! Try popping on to the Discord server - it’ll be easy to convince them to play it on BGA.

[@whitegazeebo]

You've accidentally inserted the word "not" in front of "fun" in that video several times, but nobody is perfect. One comment about the end game scoring, it is not only a valuable mechanism but is almost required in some games to prevent Kingmaking or "bash the leader". It should probably appear in more games than it does. This also seems a more pro-theme, anti-mechanics video, or if you prefer pro-"Ameritrash", anti-Euro video. Should you be able to have a game that has both great theme and mechanics? Sure, but they are few and far apart, and remember this game was made 8 years ago, you are darn lucky that wheat and wine and tools and cloth aren't just coloured cubes. I see a lot of games that address all your concerns, but far too often they are all sizzle and no steak with balance issues and mechanism issues. I find the best balance are usually the deluxe reprints of older games where they have well balanced and designed mechanics and also the nice touches of higher quality components and revamped art (though some remakes I find garish preferring the muted tones of the older style games).

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Oh no! Let me go back and edit all the "not's" out! :P You mention deluxe reprints you like... care to name any names? i bet i can guess at the "garish" one... it's been mentioned many times in this very thread.

[@notyou1760]

Completely agree! All euro games are basically like playing a game based on a statistics class.

[@bradyveltin9048]

Terrible take

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Superb comment!

[@MatthewSmith-xl5cr]

Are you able to articulate why you feel that? It’s really unhelpful to criticize when the only purpose is to make yourself feel better. If you actually have a point, and are intelligent enough to make it, could you?

[@healthygamingnetwork4980]

“Pedantic board game mechanic conversations…”. Don’t you mean,” Pedantic board game MECHANISM conversations?” 😁

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Ha! Touché! But no. "Mechanism" is routinely shortened to "mechanic" in the video game world, and i originally hail from video games!

[@christianhorvath791]

haven’t played it

[@NightsAroundaTable]

Give it a whirl! Definitely worth trying. (See? i'm doing its missing attract mode work for it)