Is Elise Trouw CHEATING in her live looping performances?

[@alecsputnik]

What, she used a pre-recorded track in a music VIDEO!?! OMG!!! SHOCKED!!!! I saw Elise last year live. She performs a ton of loops live. She also performs parts that are already pre-recorded loops that trigger at the appropriate time. Again, WOW, an artist is using the tools available to them to create music. just astonished, as I was born yesterday.

[@olivergearing]

LOL! Lots of people who feel that unless you are playing everything absolutely live then it doesn’t count!

[@AdamBoozer]

I think that the beauty in what she's doing is that she actually had to play these herself. I'm not concerned if she uses some pre-recorded tracks for various reasons. I would think the same of many things. Though, I feel baited like an Astrum video here. 😆

[@olivergearing]

Sorry about the baiting, it’s not something I’ve done much of before! Thanks for your excellent comment

[@jkRatbird]

Just to clarify in case it was unclear: she is not cheating and she is really playing everything live. Actually, learning to “fake” everything perfectly in sync with a pre-recorded track well enough that people can’t spot the misalignment between audio and video would take exactly as much time and effort as doing the real thing so that just makes no sense.

[@olivergearing]

Yes, this is a really important point which doesn’t come across strongly enough in the video.

[@viewoftheaskew]

Some folks live just to tear others down, they are the ultimate losers because that's all they can do to make themselves feel better about themselves. Good on ya for calling them out! I like your tip asking whiners, "Are you ok?" lol.

[@olivergearing]

Thank you! I appreciate the support - wasn’t sure how this video would go down!!

[@Lethoscorpia]

One colleague kept slagging off U2 especially Bono so I told him he was just disgruntled with his own inadequacies and his face just fell at the realisation I was totally right

[@olivergearing]

Such a powerful way to deal with this! Nice one!

[@rickwalters8553]

Everything about this is perfect, spot on. You gained yourself a new subscriber, you gained Elise Trouw a new subscriber… and you even earned System of a Down a view ;)

[@olivergearing]

Thank you for your sub and your kind comment! System of a Down are a departure from Elise, but still awesome!

[@jkRatbird]

And this comment is perfect thanks for saving me some typing!

[@00PlPu00]

I find the very idea that "cheating" is even possible in art a bit bizarre... There are literally no rules. Art is not a sport :)

[@thoughtlesskills]

Im not so concerned with 'cheating' as bullsh*tting and misrepresenting. If this person doesnt pretend to do this all themselves live then idc.

[@00PlPu00]

@@thoughtlesskills ...what?

[@olivergearing]

Great point!

[@chuntoon1]

Does it matter if she plays them live ... heck .. does it matter if she plays the instruments at all? .. Heck .. lets get AI to program the music and she can sit in front of the drums. I think us live loopers look at it as it's own thing and if you take the 'live' out of it ... I'm a Elise fan either way .. well, 'fan', I enjoy her video

[@olivergearing]

This is a really great post, really balanced. I think she is playing live, perhaps my video was a little too strong on the pre-recording theory, but thank you for sharing your perspective in a kind, honest way

[@chuntoon1]

@@olivergearing Thnx! I loved the video and thought you laid the theory out perfectly. I found your thoughts very interesting!

[@michael1]

@@olivergearing The issue really boils down to what the claim is. e.g a magician's premise is that he's tricking you but within certain parameters. If you learn he just edited camera footage we feel cheated because we knew magicians are 'fake' they aren't really magic, but they are fake within a unwritten but nevertheless agreed set of parameters for what a magician is allowed to do to trick us - and editing camera footage, or getting a 'stooge' to play along don't fit into those rules. Similarly if Dave Lee Roth and EVH are running around on a stage surrounded by pretty girls in a colourful and energetic MTV video of course it's ok they aren't really playing their instruments - but I still expect it to be Eddie Van Halen playing on the record and, if I purchase a ticket to go to a music festival where Van Halen are playing I absolutely expect the musicians on stage to be playing their instruments and singing live. On youtube, I guess you could therefore argue that it's not live, but here's the premise, if I'm creating a video that is more or less saying "Hey girls check out my guitar chops" If I'm not actually playing then that seems disingenuous and I can understand why people would consider that fake. Similarly for anyone who is purporting to be creating music on the fly using various midi controllers and maybe singing too - I'd expect that performance to be live - and if it isn't then they should make that very clear, especially if the video appears to show them in a way that suggests they are creating the music as we watch it. Now a few youtube guitar players and other musicians end up where they do a recorded performance of the music when the cameras aren't rolling and they can be relaxed and whatever else, and maybe do a bunch of takes trying to get a perfect one - and then they film themselves in a more sort of audience friendly way and they're playing rather than miming, but the playing we hear is an earlier studio take - and obviously if there's any difference between what we're hearing and what they appear to play then people will spot this. Some will be ok with the knowledge about how the realities of filming vs recording work, and others will put it straight into the 'fake' category and feel cheated by that performer. The bottom line I guess is that there are no actual rules, each performer has to decide what they are comfortable with doing and with how honest they are with their audience about what they are doing. Equally each audience member together (or in comment sections collectively) can decide for themselves how they feel about what a performer is doing or appears to be doing, But, certainly youtube artists need to realise that if they are not playing and recording themselves live and they aren't completely open about how their content is created that a section of their audience is going to have an opinion about that which they are likely to be very vocal about expressing. Particularly in the case where a performer has said (or strongly implied) they do one thing but they actually are doing another - i.e if you BS your audience they are far more likely to feel cheated if they discover you lied - with the potential for a backlash if they had formed an idea that what they thought you were doing required significantly more skill, talent or whatever than what it actually does. e.g If I create videos where it appears I'm playing lots of fast, clean notes on the guitar a lot of people would get upset if they discovered there were any kind of editing techniques, speeded up video, altered audio etc to make my supposed "live" performance better than my live guitar playing actually sounds - and you can see this has been the case on youtube and instagram etc. OTOH once the notion a guitar player can 'fake' their performance exists there's also a section of any audience on youtube who are immediately cynical and suspicious that any skilled performance has been faked. This is no different to the idea that cycle racing, because in the past has had so many riders using performance enhancing drugs now many of the audience think every successful rider is cheating - they've kind of soured the milk for everyone else - whether they cheat or not.

[@olivergearing]

@@michael1 great comment, thank you for your comprehensive and nuanced take! I like the analogy of the magicians - we are ok with the ‘pretend magic’ it just happens to be very skilful! For what it is worth, I think Elise is live, but does a good job on the post production of the audio. Thanks again

[@EarnestWilliamsGeofferic]

I heard she isn't even building the equipment live. She's using stuff she built or, Heavens for-fend, BOUGHT prior to the performances!

[@olivergearing]

lol!

[@John-Dennehy]

No idea why youtube recommended this video. I don't know anything about the woman discussed, so I have no boat in this race; However I would push back on the argument that music video are not live, and no one cares. Personally, authenticity matters and I feel beauty is most often found in the imperfections of a live recording. And pretending something is live, when it isn't does detract from that authenticity for me.

[@olivergearing]

Thanks for watching - does seem a bit random that you were recommended! Do you even like live-looping?

[@CharlieTheAstronaut]

Howdy random stranger, nice message you put out there, all the best to you :)

[@olivergearing]

Thank you! Appreciate the comment and support!!

[@NatGreenOnline]

You forgot that she's also beautiful. Young, talented AND beautiful. That outrages the keyboard warriors. Elise is awesome and very talented IMO. Kudos to her.

[@olivergearing]

Good point! Kudos to you too mate

[@00PlPu00]

No idea how that is relevant at all

[@patrickderp1044]

talented cover bands are still cover bands

[@olivergearing]

I love cover bands!

[@Kyrelel]

The first step towards respect should be learning how to pronounce her name correctly. Also, no one expects the musicians to be playing live in a music video

[@olivergearing]

Definitely, it is really important. According to her KZbin page her name rhymes with Snow, for anyone not sure.