Is it WRONG to Encourage Kids to Believe in Santa? w/ Sean Fitzpatrick

[@pintswithaquinas]

Well? Go on, what do you think about telling kids about the Santa?

[@christianmaestas4435]

Can it be seen like our Lords parables? Fictional stories to tell truths? Like how He would tell a parable, then explain it after? Teach about Santa Claus and transition into talking about Saint Nicholas when the kids grow up enough?

[@joechriste7052]

I’ve decided not to let my kids believe in Santa and I told my parents and family about this and they have freaked out, calling me selfish, ruining Christmas, etc. I simply want to be truthful with my kids and keep them more excited about Christ’s birth than what gifts Santa was bringing them. I’ll still teach them about St Nick and everything, but he’s in Heaven, not the North Pole making toys with elves.

[@faithreasonstudios9123]

Here are all our thoughts: (Spoiler, we agree). kzbin.info/www/bejne/gqfbiGukbpeDhbM

[@mortensimonsen1645]

To first convince your children about Santa, and then later reveal that it is not true *at all* - that is really bad. Why do we need a Santa really?

[@dm9856]

Catholic Bros need to chill on the anti Santa narrative. It's fun and doesn't take away our religion at all. It was Catholics who invented Santa anyway. I think we need to reclaim him from the weird English prodestant fairy version of Santa. When we lean out of culture they steal and rebrand our traditions. How many times have prodestant people stole and cheaply rebranded Catholic traditions?.... endlessly.

[@JMPStart]

Instead of telling my children about how Santa decks the halls I’ll tell them the story about how Santa decked a heretic

[@jackm7221]

Yes.

[@TruePT]

Sounds way more exciting 🤣

[@alecfoster5542]

Nice.

[@dylanrunner2001]

Deck the heretics with bounds of holly, fa la la la la la la la la

[@nickk4851]

Lol yes.

[@celiamergen2091]

When I was little I prayed to Santa (because I knew he was a saint) and asked that if he was really real to bring my sister this ballerina doll with brown hair that I saw in a magazine, because I thought she would really love it. I never told my parents about it. "Santa" brought my sister that doll and also brought me the same doll with blonde hair. It was a true miracle for me and I think that St. Nicholas' intercession was truly involved.

[@Internet_Insider_]

Yes Santa brought it?? Not your parents lol

[@pearlescobar9449]

But she didn’t mention it to her parents though, yeah they bought the dolls but they got the special ones she had Saint Nicholas intercede for

[@garybrown2039]

Honestly just teach them about St. Nicholas . He’s a way better story anyway.

[@erojerisiz1571]

Actual St. Nicholas did more than just give gifts And he didn't need flying deers or elves to do all that

[@garybrown2039]

@@erojerisiz1571 exactly! He is a much better example of a moral individual than the fairytale we tell to kids.

[@JustUsCrazyBoyz]

I believe in Santa Claus. He was a holy Bishop that lived in late antiquity eastern Europe who did throw gifts through chimney's.

[@JustUsCrazyBoyz]

He's gonna find out who's naughty or nice! Santa the original Gangster!

[@4thlegion253]

@@Anyone690 😂

[@Radabah]

That was St. Nicholas not "Santa Claus".

[@joelellis7828]

They’re the same. Sancta Nicholaus is the Germanic rendering of Saint Nicholas

[@crenshaw2186]

But is he still throwing gifts through chimneys?

[@teresaf4615]

Why is it such extremes - NO Santa or lie 100% to push Santa no matter what? I believe there is a middle road. We teach our kids about St. Nick, so we have Santa and allow our kids' imagination to flourish. If my kids ask me a question about it, I do not lie. I ask questions back about what they think, sometimes their sibling gives them an explanation, or when that isn't enough for them I tell them the truth. Also, they know what Christmas is - Jesus's birthday! We have a birthday cake for Jesus every Christmas. Also, I have 13 siblings. We grew up with Santa and we are all practicing Catholics. Actually 2 are priests! It won't make your kids stop believing in Jesus.

[@alecfoster5542]

Bravo Teresa!

[@legalfictionnaturalfact3969]

the "no middle road" thing is "don't LIE to your children". telling a story about st nicholas as historically accurately as you can is fine. telling them a fat man comes down their chimneys and watches them and punishes them is not fine. that understanding has nothing to do with choosing middle of the road. the truth is extreme.

[@michaelroy6630]

I think Sean takes a fantastic approach to it. He's able to preserve the whimsical nature of Saint Nick and Christmas without lying. That way kids can still participate in the joy their friends who believe in Santa have while understanding that it's centred on the spiritual reality of Christ and his saints. I hope if/when I have kids i can imitate this approach with them!

[@freda7961]

Yeah, very interesting take on it. I thought that it was convincing that we ought to rescue the idea of St. Nick from secularism and bring it back to the context of Christianity and sainthood, not to totally throw it out. Never thought of it that way.

[@pintswithaquinas]

Look at that pretentious host with his compensating-for-something pipe.

[@cloud1stclass372]

I had to delete my snark response about that pipe because you beat me on the draw. Good on you. Honestly though, there is no joy that compares to children at Christmas time and Santa is a huge part of that. I would never rob my children of that simply because some guy with a comically large tobacco pipe says that it's never OK to lie.

[@pintswithaquinas]

​@@cloud1stclass372 Thanks. I can't tell if you're joking towards the end there so forgive me if I'm misinterpreting you, ​ but I don't think that's a good response. I'm not asking you not to lie because I said so. I'm asking you not to lie because lying is intrinsically evil. If you disagree with that then you disagree with the Catholic Church: “Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.” [Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 2482, 2483.] I'm down with speaking about Santa the way in which Sean suggests here in this vid. But that isn't lying.

[@cloud1stclass372]

@@pintswithaquinas I was kidding around (although I have neither the dexterity nor self confidence for a pipe like that). More to the point, though: Lying is in fact an offense to the truth. You won't get an argument from me there, although the "truth" that your statement infers is objective Truth with a capital T. This truth is sourced in the ground of existence itself. Santa Clause, on the other hand, is not an offense to the truth. It is a stimulation of the imagination granted us by the same source as truth itself. Santa Claus is not an idol when *properly* understood. It is an imaginative construct that brings joy and wonder to children across the world. In my opinion that can never be a bad thing. And more realistically, children don't even ask whether or not Santa Claus is real until they are old enough to comprehend the logistics of Santa. In a way, Santa helps children understand truth in a far more experiential way. Either way, Merry Christmas to you and your family. Try not to hyperextend your arm with that pipe.

[@alecfoster5542]

@@hobbiton64 The LOTR is a LIE and anti-Catholic! (Just trying out my Matt impersonation.)

[@nickk4851]

@@pintswithaquinas Hey Matt! I thought I heard you interview Peter Kreeft once and the topic of lying came up. He said that it's not always wrong to lie. He even went so far as to say that we sometimes are morally obligated to lie, for example, if you were hiding Jewish people in your basement during WWII and the nazis came knocking. I think it's safe to say we'd all agree that you should lie to the nazis in that case and not tell them you're hiding Jewish people in your home. Sharing that just to open up the possibility that lying can be ok, depending on your intent. What are your thoughts? Could an argument for the goodness of "lying" about Santa be made, sort of like a pros and cons list, what good things could come of it vs what bad things? I'm not saying I have such a list prepared or that I support telling kids Santa is real, just sharing what came to mind while listening. I suppose the example I shared is quite extreme, because it's lying vs letting people be killed, so there's a heirarchy of values to be considered there.

[@michelegeis2301]

Thank you for this talk. As a kid when I found out the truth I was hurt. I tell my kids the truth so they always trust me. We try very hard to focus on Christ coming during Advent and not get swept away with the world. My kids asked me why oh why do parents lie to their kids? They see the injustice better than nostalgic adults.

[@nickmedley4749]

“The eye of the poet sees less clearly, but sees farther than the eyes of the scientist.” -Peter Kreeft(The Philosophy of Tolkien)

[@troubledguest7118]

I don't get this argument that we shouldn't do Santa with our children because it's "lying". I grew up believing in Santa, and I also grew up believing in fairies and unicorns and dragons. My parents told me that thunder was the angels bowling in heaven and that my stuffed animals could become real if I loved them enough. This is how children have been raised for thousands of years and I fail to see how it's bad. It made my childhood magical and wonderful and I'm not going to deprive my own children of that.

[@absolutetruths1245]

Because it’s entirely unnecessary, the truth/reality is magical enough

[@Jerome616]

@@absolutetruths1245yeah, until i was a parent, I didn’t realize how much it is just peer pressure to teach your kids about Santa. Instead, I just told them about the real st. Nicolas, told them we get their presents, and that at Nicolas brings their presents on Christmas Day. That way, when the reveal is eventually done, it’s like 20% fantasy, instead of 100% fantasy. 😅

[@ncgerstell]

I think there's something essential to teaching children about folklore. Fables and myths aren't 'falsehoods' and they are a necessary component of any culture. I'm not lying when I let them believe in Santa, dragons (especially), and fae. They teach children about the world and contextualize it in a way that they can understand as children. When they get older, they can learn the real truths contained in the myths. In the case of Santa: charity, obedience, and hospitality.

[@HolyKhaaaaan]

I think this might be half the reason the Church didn't have the old myths about the old gods stricken from the record. It is easy to see why the old gods were a wrong and bad thing. But the image of an All-Father of all the good Children which embody virtue and goodness is a type of God Himself. I've recently come to savour the sad story of the Chinese Kitchen god, Zao Jun. He was an ordinary man who had left his wife for a younger woman, was punished by God. He was struck blind, and when his wife took pity on him and showed him love, he could see it was her. In shame he jumped into the kitchen stove - which was sadly on. God blessed him, they say, for his change of heart by making him report on how all Chinese families were doing every year on New Year's. The story and rituals around him embody the importance of faithfulness and of a good family life.

[@suzannephillips6236]

Best answer!

[@christianmaestas4435]

How do you clean that pipe? The pipe cleaners you’d need must be enormous!

[@deledition6335]

It’s up to us parents what we teach our children about Santa. As long as they know the real Christmas story. The birth of our savior is what we celebrate.

[@rschiwal]

Of course we believe in Santa. He is a living saint. Knows if we've been bad or good, can be in every house on Christmas, knocked out Aryans...

[@thomasjorge4734]

He knocked out Arians in 325 and Aryans in 1944!

[@4MDH]

Santa Claus, who supposedly lives in the North Pole with elves and flies around the world delivering gifts is NOT St.. Nicholas! Teach your kids about the real St. Nick and what he did while alive, praying for three kids who came back to life? Wow! Way more interesting than Santa Claus.

[@rschiwal]

@@4MDH A little known tidbit: St. Nicholas is the patron saint of Pawn shops. Their symbol of three circles on a string originally represented the heads of the three brothers he bargained for before he brought them back to life.

[@Radabah]

I don't agree with Matt on all things but I'm 100% with him on this one.

[@charlenemcgregor7857]

But I do have to say it was heartbreaking this week when my daughter asked me 2x if he was real & I decided to tell her the truth it was devastating. Then I told her about the real St. Nicolas & how the story evolved over the years. I felt horrible that I participated in the lie. I celebrated the feast day of St. Nicolas with her & ordered some books & prayer cards and that seemed to have calmed her sweet heart. I got to in to the land of elf on the shelf...because I was following the trend and not the Lord. We are going to do Mary on the shelf next season. Definitely going to confession about this next Sunday mass.

[@MattisWell.20]

Answer to the title: no😆 It was probably more wrong that as a kid I would tell every other kid that Santa wasn’t real, and they would hate me for it😂 The myth of Santa Claus brings out a child-likeness in children that should be considered sacred. Truth is often more than fact. Even as a child not believing in Santa, I still loved pretending, and still do.

[@tc_449]

amen

[@rebn8346]

Santa is real. 4th century Bishop.

[@catholicdevotee_119]

I fear telling kids about Santa Claus will make them question God Himself, that’s why I am not going to raise my kids with Santa Claus.

[@Jayce_Alexander]

One of the interesting things about living in the Netherlands is that Santa Claus isn't nearly as prominent of a figure in pop culture as Saint Nicholas himself. Saint Nicholas' feast day is a huge holiday, and is probably the main day of the year children receive gifts (apart from their birthday). Santa is partially based on him, but also partially based on the figure of Father Christ/Father Frost/Ded Moroz. The Dutch and Belgian Saint Nicholas celebrations actually represent Saint Nicholas as a Christian bishop, and he dresses and generally behaves as such. I reckon that most children in the Netherlands don't really believe in Santa, but they tend to believe in Saint Nicholas. The strength of the tradition is even more remarkable when you take into account what a bulwark of Calvinism the Netherlands was for hundreds of years - to the point where Catholics were banned from practicing their faith in public and not allowed to have their own churches until far into the 19th century. But somehow this is a December tradition that has never really lost its vitality or cultural relevance, even in traditionally very protestant areas.

[@HolyKhaaaaan]

It is actually kinda remarkable now that I think of it that such a Calvinist area still had Saint Nick - as his real, Catholic bishop self - every year.

[@tanjagantner6685]

But you have Zwarte Piet (excuse the possibly off spelling) who is not a historical figure.

[@Jayce_Alexander]

@@tanjagantner6685 He is a holdover from a pagan tradition celebrating Wodan (the west Germanic name for Odin), who had people dressed in all black accompanying him symbolizing ravens. The character (it's not really a single character as there is more than one) faded away in his raven form several centuries ago, disappearing entirely for a good while before being reintroduced in the form you are refering to in the 19th century as a Moorish noble soldier (a knecht, or knight, essentially). The reference to the Moors stems from the fact that in the Dutch Saint Nicholas tradition he is said to sail from Spain to the Low Countries each year with his (until quite recently mostly military) retinue. This is why the clothes resemble those of Landsknechten, such as the Swiss guard. Until the 1990s Saint Nicholas' retinue typically also included people dressed as Spanish soldiers wearing a cuirass and armed with halberds, giving much of the annual Saint Nicholas parades even more of a Swiss Guard vibe.

[@OhLookItsJonBoy]

It’s so weird watching parents on here saying they don’t want their kids believing in a made up figure, while they themselves believe a man lived in a whale and a 500+ year old man, his wife, and kids rescued numerous animals, plants, insects, and even termites on a ship.

[@MrFlynn-xz8wj]

I am a teacher and remember we had parents who would not lie to there children concerning Santa Claus. Fine with me. Unfortunately the children would enter their Pre-K or first grade class and traumatize the other children preaching the good news of the non-existence of the red suited man. The children were crushed. We send out an email just to encourage their children to keep quiet about it out of concern for the mental well being of their classmates. I have raised a bunch of kids and we took a very neutral approach. There were never any presents under the tree from Santa Claus. My wife would just write "From Merry Christmas" on certain presents. I also make the connection between Santa and St. Nicholas. My oldest son once confronted my wife concerning the existence of the tooth fairy. My son said, "Sometimes I think there is a tooth fairy, and sometimes I think its you." My wife confessed that she delivered the money. It did not destroy the trust in their relationship. I agree we should not be encouraging the Macy's parade version in any way. I also have never done the picture thing on a mall Santa's lap. I think the neutral approach is the best.

[@lizlovsdagmara5525]

When I was in the first grade, we had a kid just like that. Telling everyone there was no Santa. It didn't bother me a bit. I knew was getting presents and that he would be getting nothing.

[@kayest.claire932]

A friend of mine stopped believing in God because her parents lied to her about Santa. Her thought pattern was, If they lied about Santa then they must be lying about God. I think this is a rare reaction, but it made me think twice about teaching kids about Santa. If I'm ever called to parenthood I will be telling them that Santa is a fun game that everyone plays and then teach them about the real St. Nick.

[@Jerome616]

Similar story where two parents I know this they’re kids magic is real ( at a really young age), and when they eventually realized that isn’t true, they became an atheist at 9 years old 😅

[@thefuzzfactor2989]

My parents never encouraged us to believe in Santa. I dont think we were in any way deprived by this. I couldn't imagine our parents lying to us. In spite of knowing that santa wasnt real Christmas was still magical for us as children and we hung up our stockings knowing that it was our parents filled them.

[@Jerome616]

Yes, people are so afraid to let it go.

[@jackm7221]

As soon as I hit 21 I am buying that pipe and no one shall persuade me otherwise!

[@emilyann4549]

My parents didn't tell me Santa was real. I knew the story, but I knew it was a story. So, I really don't understand the tradition. I'm about to have my first child and will not be telling my child that Santa is real. Mostly because I don't get it. Christmas for us was a time of sharing gifts. We would make gifts for all our family members. It was so fun to share and be creative. I would really think about what my family liked, and create something that related to who they were. For me, it was more about giving and less about receiving. Of course I was excited about my gifts, but I was just as excited for my family to see my drawings or ornaments. I will admit I broke some other kids' hearts, telling them Santa wasn't real, so I will try to teach my child not to do that. 😅

[@NevetsWC1134]

When I was young I would point at sewers and say look dad, that's where the ninja turtles live. And he said yes they do. Was he lying yes. But oh was it cool to think they were real. Sometimes it's okay to let kids gave imaginations.

[@Internet_Insider_]

The BIG difference is. Your parents didn't create the idea in your mind of the ninja turtles.

[@Rose-ct8lq]

My parents never made us believe in Santa. My dad always told us where the myth of Santa came and we were familiar with St. Nicholas. We would not do gifts on Christmas, but instead a family dinner and Mass. The gifts came on January 6, the day of the three wise men, who came and left gifts for us. We’ll put a shoe and a letter and there would be gifts in the morning. It was magical!

[@jusme2888]

We did this too! El Dia de Los Reyes! We left hay (fake of course) for the feed & received a gift lol

[@Rose-ct8lq]

@@jusme2888 aww yes, it was a nice tradition growing up

[@STSBP]

Father Christmas is not an allegory of snow and holly; he is not merely the stuff called snow afterwards artificially given a human form, like a snow man. He is something that gives a new meaning to the white world and the evergreens, so that the snow itself seems to be warm rather than cold. - GK

[@kyleenfinnegan7208]

This conversation drives me crazy. Does st theresa send you roses? Can you prove it? Do we need to pick it apart? Calling my grandmother a liar just doesn't sit right.

[@weere100]

Where I come from, we got in contact with the story that St Nicholas is basically what mainstream decoyed as Santa Claus because of that story how he gifted those three poor girls. Either that or we say that the gifts are from Lil' Jesus(because it's his birthday) . So the Santa Claus never got rooted properly 😅

[@umiluv]

Santa is a magical human folklore experience. We all play in the fun of pretending Santa is real and when kids find out that he’s not, they are now part of the group that has to pretend for the younger kids. It’s a wonderful game that is played by the entire world. There is magic in that and it is fun and wonderful. That is why anyone who doesn’t play the game is called a grinch because they either want to ruin the magic for others or they don’t want to play along with everyone else. Just not cool to be a grinch.

[@Internet_Insider_]

it's not MAGIC. It's just a pure lie. You're just lying to children.

[@m4641]

This clip is an answer to a prayer. Having taught our children to "believe in" 🎅, we're now confronted with a deeper issue. If a child takes seriously the words of their parents and finds out that their words were not truth then the problem becomes centered on trust. Specifically, the problem is that of betrayal. If anyone has been betrayed by someone they love then they can understand that it is a long road to restoring that trust. We're on this road right now. Having experienced this first hand with my youngest daughter, I will never present to another child🎅 in the same way.

[@aidananderson8535]

Santa is a tool for teaching faith. Growing up believing in this mystical being and his otherworldly powers wires your mind right

[@angrypotato_fz]

Great clip! Encouraged me to listen to whole conversation. Time for a new outro, though - this one has gone old... :) I live in Poland and in school it was strange for me to see how great the importance of Santa Claus is for English-speaking people and how strong he's connected with Christmas. Unfortunately nowadays it's becoming here quite similar to USA standards ("thanks", western media :() but we still celebrate St. Nicholas day on 6th December. It is and was a great feast for children (mainly), and we have a custom of dressing up as Saint Nicholas, but I remember the character to always have been connected to the real bishop. I wasn't too disappointed when I as a child I got to know that it was just my uncle/grandpa/someone else dressing up, I quickly understood this as an act of commemoration of a real figure with a joyful social ritual. My nieces seem to get it as well, even though they just started primary school. I think the whole issue is MUCH easier when you don't build a massive, separate, completely fictional fable around Saint Nicholas (or even introduce another fictional hero, Santa Claus jolly, fat, bearded man) with all the Elves, North Pole, sledge, chimneys, cookies, reindeers etc. And it's much better when the commemoration of St. Nicholas is celebrated separately from Christmas (we already have a much greater hero for Christmas time :))

[@Littlemermaid17]

Father Christmas is such a source of wonderment in childhood. Teach your children about Christ and let them be excited for Santa.

[@thefuzzfactor2989]

Here in Ireland my sisters and I were never lied to by our parents and yet Christmas was magical. We also had a beautiful crib!

[@kevinkempton6894]

Thank you for popping up on my next watch feed. I grew up in that house of lies, though Christmas was a Hallmark holiday for us as well. Now that I have come to Christ and believe in him, I've wrestled with the idea of Santa. Truth is what I want and can't imagine giving my kids anything but truth. I heard Dr. Scott Hahn use the phrase "distinguish in order to unify". If we distinguish the reason for the season, the story will unify the family. And, opposition to the truth has only one goal - to divide and conquer. Let us be unified on this one and stop putting St Nick in a cage and restore Christmas and advent to the Light of truth.

[@tonywallens217]

Believing in Santa Claus was such a happy blessing as a child

[@CatholicCat-er9xn]

For me too!!,

[@tonywallens217]

@NoName 😂. Trippin

[@leilapaulino8575]

Santa was the best lie ever told to me. When I was little I aspired to be like him. I would smell the wrapping paper and rub my face on it because “santa touched it” the innocent memories I still feel to this day. And now I value my parents for putting in so much work and waiting all night for me to fall asleep. I loved it let kids have innocence. Until this day I have so much hope and innocence because of my childhood.

[@Illycrium]

Two kids under 3. Not doing Santa, I'm more on the "throne of lies" side of the isle lol

[@timothyobrien8591]

Santa instills faith, hope and charity. Why would it be so hard to teach kids that Saint Nicholas can do everything that Santa does? Teach your kids about Christ and instill belief at a young age, your kids will grow up knowing how much love their parents put into Santa. In a world that wants to destroy innocence and imagination, why do we as Catholic try to do the same? J.R Tolkien wrote letters to his Children as Fr. Christmas. Christmas morning, I take my kids to Mass to celebrate God becoming man, I don't teach them we go to Mass to celebrate gifts and Santa. We teach our kids about Transubstantiation, guardian Angels? Heave and Hell? Yes, when kids learn Santa is make belief, they should already have enough faith in Christ to not be shaken and to understand that God who is omnipotent can do all things. They will understand the distinction between make belief and the supernatural/divine. Also going to the TLM helps ;)

[@alecfoster5542]

Mike drop...thanks Timothy!

[@MagnumLapua338]

We don't lie to our kids.

[@theartjunkie]

My whole hold up with Santa is how can we explain to the children whose families don’t have much and therefore get very humble gifts why their friends maybe got very expensive Santa gifts? We discuss Santa as a fictional character but, thanks to public school, it’s become a bigger deal for our kids. We have tried so hard to keep our Christmas focus on Jesus and even some of our families are so insistent on Santa - even though we have asked them otherwise.

[@jaynex903]

Just tell them why we celebrate Santa Claus... Let them have fun knowing the truth ... I tell all these gift giving is to remember St.Nicolas who helped needy people which should be considered at least during Christmas preparations. And he can still intercede for us and help us in a good way from heaven.

[@OpEditorial]

You're overthinking this, just enjoy the holidays.

[@kurthumphres1685]

Jonathan Pageau would disagree on Santa not being real!

[@googleaccount4471]

We can teach kids about the wonderful Saint Nicholas and his miracles whilst still taking them the mall to sit on Santas lap and leaving some cookies for Santa

[@sueannevangalen5186]

Yes! Sean Fitzpatrick, that was so well articulated. I believe in Santa and also believe passionately that we need to reclaim the Santa legend for Christ and rescue him from the insanity that tells kids he's literally coming down the chimney. That's not what believing in Santa is all about. I'm going to watch this video again. Well done, both of you.

[@paulwinters6024]

No Santa comments. The Churchwarden pipe held my attention for too long.

[@irene_irenaeus_ihs]

Really loved Sean approach. I feel a lot like you Matt, but who knows how will I manage it if, God willing, I have kids of my own. Let's bring the real Saint Nicholas (and The Wise Men, since in Spain and other parts of Europe we receive presents from them) and let God guide us to truly celebrate Him during Christmas. Merry Christmas everyone!

[@jmpersic]

Ha! My four year old who reads chapter books came up to me yesterday and said, "I don't think St. Nicholas or Santa Claus comes down our chimneys". "You're right!" I said. I proceeded to hell her about the real St. Nicholas.

[@lety2467]

I have been debating doing the santa claus thing since my first daughter was born. Now she's 2 and I still don't know what to do! I 100% agree with Matt's reasoning and that is my reasoning as well HOWEVER I believed in Santa when I was a kid and it is such a beautiful memory. I'm just going to put it off for another year lol

[@WhyWasntIBornInTheMiddleAges]

I personally would just tell her who Saint Nicholas was. Not to mention that you would have to lie to make her believe in Santa Claus and it could damage her faith in God when she finds out Santa isnt real as I have heard a some people say that it did damage their faith. Good thing this isn't a problem in my country becouse we have Saint Nicholas instead of Santa.

[@littlequickfire3296]

Myths and folklore are an important part of childhood. They are cultural and teach children important lessons in a way they can grasp. I actually find Santa to be a very good parable in having faith. Remember the kid from the Polar Express who didn't believe in Santa? He only believed what he saw and furthermore those things that could be explained by man. But once he finally took the leap of faith and just believed, he finally saw Santa Claus and could hear the sound of the bells on his sleigh.

[@olgac.h.1278]

But usually parents don't insist that fairies exist.

[@HolyKhaaaaan]

A lot of this ties into the question of how we devlop rituals in the first place. How did the Latin Mass or the Divine Liturgy become what they were, and why did they stay that way? It's no small mystery why American parents started teaching that Kris Kringle breaks into your home and leaves you gifts; why is St. Nick the one saint most Protestants pay some homage to? Like these guys, I'm not being quite literal. I'm trying to hit on something I don't understand except in shadows. Why we do rituals, and why a certain way.

[@carolinpurayidom4570]

Parents be telling their kids unnecessary lies and be surprised when their kids lies to them if you don't want your kids to lie dont lie to them First. If you want kids to have Christmas spirit tell them about the real reason for for Christmas if you want to incorporate Santa in then tell them about his spirit of joy and genenorisity and to emulate thats what he is about.

[@jusme2888]

I grew up believing in Santa, I'm a cradle catholic so I was also aware of St Nick & the birth of Jesus. Most Christmas songs (at least in my childhood) talked of the nativity, Mary, silent night, hark the herald etc Joy to the world etc etc.. My kid is now 18 & in college so my opinion may not count here but I raised her believing in Santa until 1st grade. At first grade age (the summer before the school year began) she was told that there is no fat guy leaving her gifts - IT'S MOMMY😂 and like me, she was always & still is reminded of the true meaning of CHRISTmas. She was also told of the real St Nicholas story at the time too. She seems ok, she still loves the season til this day, and yes- she will still watches Christmas cartoons 🤦‍♀️😂

[@rosemarycooper1572]

There’s nothing wrong with a bit of magic for little children. Generally when they find out, they don’t hold it against their parents!

[@joshuacooley1417]

So here is a thought you might consider... Father Christmas is real, but not exactly a 'person'. Rather he is a 'personification' of a spirit, or a divine influence. To explain this allow me to refer to my own background. My parents never played the Santa Claus game with me growing up. I never heard of Santa Claus until I started watching Christmas specials on TV. I can still remember asking my parents who this santa claus guy was in all the shows and them explaining how kids believe that santa brings them presents on Christmas etc. I remember thinking how absurd it was that other kids believed this and didn't know that their parents were the ones giving them the presents. However, at the same time, I was just as enchanted by the mysterious nature of the holiday and its surrounding mythology as any other kid. I don't feel like I lost anything by not believing that Santa was a real guy. Years later when I became a rabid consumer of all things Tolkien and Lewis, I always loved the Father Christmas imagery that showed up occasionally and found that there was something in it that spoke to me. There was something alluring about it. After reading the Discarded Image, by CS Lewis, and Planet Narnia by Michael Ward, I realized that the Father Christmas image was an embodiment, or personification of the Jovian spirit that is present in Christmas. This is the spirit of the magnanimous, joyful, King who gives gifts super abundantly. This is an aspect of the Divine and an influence that God sheds upon the world, that we desperately need in our day and age. It is at once older than the ages and yet younger than spring. It comes every year when winter is at its bleakest and heralds the return of Joy and feasting. St. Nicholas is an exemplar of this divine grace. Just as Mr. Fitzpatrick was saying, when we talk about Father Christmas, we are talking about a real thing that can be manifest or embodied in us. It is not just charity, but specifically that kind of charity that is hallmarked by Royal grandeur, and great feasts. This spirit can not only be manifest in us, but we can be immersed in it. In short, I think it would be accurate to say that I believe more in Father Christmas now than I did when I was a kid.

[@TommyRushing]

I have 3 Bobonych pipes, not as long, but love them dude needs more recognition.

[@Jesusgirl00]

I saw a picture of Santa kneeling in prayer to Jesus, I really liked that

[@Jim-Mc]

How has this not summoned Jonathan Pageau?

[@MagnumLapua338]

I have prayed to Saint Anthony to find an item. The item then shows up in a spot I have already searched multiple times.

[@rachelmiles2211]

Still firmly against convincing kids that Santa Claus is real. There is a huge difference between telling our children we believe their guardian angels protected us or that St. Anthony helped us find something and telling our children Santa Claus brought them presents: angels and saints are REAL and DO protect and help us. Equating the angels and saints with a fake fat Hallmark man is setting them up for spiritual confusion and potential disaster. Ask me how I know.

[@luciag.suberviola1364]

In Spain and many countries of Central and South America we celebrate The Three Wise Men who went to worship the Child Jesus and brought him gold, frankincense and myrrh. They bring gifts to the children at dawn on January 6. That is much prettier than Santa Claus and he is 100% Catholic.

[@tammyschilling5362]

The way that Fitzpatrick compares the goodness of telling the kids about saints and angels with Santa Clause makes me wonder if he believes in saints and angels. Because it sounds like he is saying that those things are fake, too, so santa is really no different.

[@bradrenfrew2749]

I think teaching my kids about St. Nic isn't a bad thing. Maybe saying he lives just north of us (I live in Alaska) is a little unnecessary. What my struggle is, shouldn't we as Catholics teach our children more about Christ on the 25th of December instead of just getting gifts from a saint, or is that too deep for children?

[@dbelezi2157]

And on December 26th, we will forget about this as an issue for another 364 days.

[@CatholicK5357]

One thing I know for sure is that saying St Nicholas has a Mrs Clause is heretical if not blasphemous.

[@JP2GiannaT]

We don't do Santa. We respect the choice of others to do so, but we don't think it's a good fit for our family.

[@dbelezi2157]

I don't think it's wrong to tell your kids about the idea of Santa, I think it's fun and all. At the same time, we should keep it balanced and use santa, or more properly " Saint Nicholas ", to have fun but not take away from but promote what Christmas is about and who Christ is.

[@birdman9265]

Saint Nicholas and Santa Clause are two very different things. Santa is a married fat old guy who lives in the north pole with elves and encourages consumerism and greed. Saint Nicholas is a great saint who actually helped people with gift giving, did not encourage children to demand that their parents spend gross amounts of money. Santa is a way for the heretical modernists to detract from the actual holiday--Jesus's birth. If we taught children about the actual Saint Nicholas and what he did and celebrated him as such it would be different. Santa is a bastardization of a great saint for heretical purposes. I do not think it is healthy at all to tell children these lies because they will grow up and realize that you told them God is real and they can't see God, like they couldn't see Santa, so it is just another lie. To bring this type of heretical, and satanic, greed-filled character into a Catholic home, around children is reckless and irresponsible. I do like the idea of Saint Nicholas and praying for him to come and bless the children, discussing how amazing this great Saint's life on earth was. But I think it is absolutely essential to keep Santa and Saint Nicholas entirely separate.

[@morant3057]

On the Ted Lasso series they said Christmas was Santa's Birthday.

[@frans3950]

Were did you buy that awesome pipe?

[@wynbrown7321]

Illusions are shattered every day.

[@johnpaulfitzpatrick8145]

Great topic for a great time 🙏

[@justinjustinjustin10]

So you have no problem telling your wife she might look fat in a dress if so, Matt? Lol. No lying now.

[@nicholaspostiglione3948]

I agree with Timothy Gordon on Santa. These charasmaniacs like Fradd should leave the Traditional movement instead of trying to subvert it and turn them into charasmaniac parishes and ruining Christmas for children.

[@terrydelp9166]

The real Saint Nicholas is freaking awesome.

[@alistairproductions]

Other guys doing some mental gymnastics

[@blueskymoon1planetearth309]

Saint Nicholas of Myra (270-343 A.D.) existed and become a Bishop.

[@charlenemcgregor7857]

I can see both sides of the argument however in my heart I'm happy that I grew up believing in him then not. Growing up in the 80s & 90s I can say that the commercialism was less than it is today. My parents went with the flow but always talked about Jesus is the reason for the season....

[@bettyec6825]

We are to be asking God for help, not the dead. ‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭8:19‬ ‭ "When they say to you, “Consult the mediums and the spiritists who whisper and mutter,” should not a people consult their God? Should they consult the dead on behalf of the living?" ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭6:9‭-‬13‬ ‭ “This, then, is the way you should pray: ‘Our Father who is in the heavens, let Your Name be set-apart, let Your reign come, let Your desire be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us today our daily bread. And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. ‘And do not lead us into trial, but deliver us from the wicked one - because Yours is the reign and the power and the esteem, forever. Amĕn.’"

[@whatbrigiddid6492]

Interesting debate. Did you know that ‘Claus’ is a Etymological Edit From Dutch and German Claus, a contraction of Nikolaus (“Nicholas”)? Santa = Saint Claus = Nicholas

[@bradleyhoyt3188]

Well ... Santa isn't a total lie, he was real at one point. His real name is Saint Nicholas, and if you go by the German Tradition, that is who you teach your children about. And Krampüß isn't a total lie either considering he represents consequences of bad actions.

[@OneMansOdyssey]

You have to have Jonathan Pageau on again so he can explain that Santa actually *does* exist, and it's lying for you *not* to tell them about him.

[@06rtm]

Let me put it this way, would you rather we didn’t have the legend of Santa Clause? I think its one of the greatest aspects our world has to offer

[@himl994]

Matt, you’ve talked to Jonathan Pageau. Watch his video about Santa.

[@chrisfernandes5982]

I agree.

[@merryarttoonesakamarysusan559]

i agree w matt

[@briangutierrez3765]

Way to Hans Landa your guest. What an epic pipe. 😀

[@MisterMunkki]

Santa is real. There's no lie about it.

[@johnmainwaring6556]

We brought our kids up on Santa as merely a nice story, but didn't feel the need to go through the whole charade. We told the kids the gifts were from relatives and friends. It was just as much fun. Now on another point as a good 'protestant' I would warmly invite you to search the scriptures for any reference to prayers being made to 'saints' or even reference to 'patron' saints. You could ditch those non-truths straight away - forget santa. We have one mediator between God and man - Jesus Christ. Keep it simple guys, I once heard a definition of Catholicism... Christianity with whole load of unnecessary clobber. God bless you fellas. I really enjoy the channel and get a lot from it.

[@alecfoster5542]

The belief in Santa Claus instills a sense of wonder and imagination into a child and, as they outgrow the belief, they can transfer that sense of wonder to the physical world and their faith. The definition of a fanatic is adhering to something so strongly that you lose your basic humanity. Matt, you are coming close to fanaticism in a very narcissistic and killjoy way. Sean has a more intelligent approach of instilling proper religious instruction in his kids without denigrating the culture he lives in. I would also add that playing Santa as a parent reinforces a very unselfish sense of giving (without taking credit). Don't be a jerk.

[@christiandpaul631]

Santa Clause is a whimsical legend that is part of our celebration of Christmas. He teaches the merits of generosity and children should be good and kind. Santa, the tree, and the Lionel train are part of the whimsy and symbols of the celebration. The birth of Christ is the reality behind those symbols and a manger should be under every tree. Unfortunately, protestants are the majority in the US and don't honor saints so only Catholics kept the tradition. Protestants don't usually have a manager and of course the Boomers stopped teaching The Glory of God as the old testament tells us we must do. 'And all thy children shall be taught of the Lord; and great shall be the peace of thy children. Isaiah 54:13'

[@YouTubeComments]

You need to hear Jonathan Pageau talk about Santa. Santa does actually exist.

[@Jesusgirl00]

Is the tradition of Santa Catholic? St. Nick. ❤or does it come from somewhere else?

[@larrym.johnson9219]

Matt is Gandalf!

[@beavadakkoot]

I always believed it was wrong to lie to children about it. I don't like the idea and I won't tell this to my children. Christmas is about Jesus and in Portugal earlier and some people today still say that the child Jesus brings the presents (in a way its true since its through christ that we even live)

[@SC047074]

So good!