Is Narcissism Like Bipolar or Depression, Mood Disorder? (Addiction, Depression, Suicide, Webinar)

Presentation to Addiction, Depression, Suicidal Risk Webinar, September 2020
The pandemic will be followed by 3 waves of mental health issues: mood and anxiety disorders, narcissistic-psychopathic acting out, and psychotic disorders.
Many scholars consider pathological narcissism to be a form of depressive illness. This is the position of the authoritative magazine "Psychology Today". The life of the typical narcissist is, indeed, punctuated with recurrent bouts of dysphoria (ubiquitous sadness and hopelessness), anhedonia (loss of the ability to feel pleasure), and clinical forms of depression (cyclothymic, dysthymic, or other).
This picture is further obfuscated by the frequent presence of mood disorders, such as Bipolar I (co-morbidity).
While the distinction between reactive (exogenous) and endogenous depression is obsolete, it is still useful in the context of narcissism. Narcissists react with depression not only to life crises but to fluctuations in Narcissistic Supply and to a circumstantial inability to express their dominant psychosexual type (cerebral or somatic).
The narcissist's personality is disorganised and precariously balanced. He regulates his sense of self-worth by consuming Narcissistic Supply from others. Any threat to the uninterrupted flow of said supply compromises his psychological integrity and his ability to function. It is perceived by the narcissist as life threatening.
Indeed, depression can be conceptualized as a reaction to the systemic failure of hitherto trustworthy and efficacious coping strategies, either owing to a seismic change in circumstances and the environment, or because of overwhelming new information.
I. Loss Induced Dysphoria
This is the narcissist's depressive reaction to the loss of one or more Sources of Narcissistic Supply - or to the disintegration of a Pathological Narcissistic Space (PN Space, his stalking or hunting grounds, the social unit whose members lavish him with attention).
II. Deficiency Induced Dysphoria
Deep and acute depression which follows the aforementioned losses of Supply Sources or a PN Space. Having mourned these losses, the narcissist now grieves their inevitable outcome - the absence or deficiency of Narcissistic Supply. Paradoxically, this dysphoria energises the narcissist and moves him to find new Sources of Supply to replenish his dilapidated stock (thus initiating a Narcissistic Cycle).
III. Self-Worth Dysregulation Dysphoria
The narcissist reacts with depression to criticism or disagreement, especially from a trusted and long-term Source of Narcissistic Supply. He fears the imminent loss of the source and the damage to his own, fragile, mental balance. The narcissist also resents his vulnerability and his extreme dependence on feedback from others. This type of depressive reaction is, therefore, a mutation of self-directed aggression.
IV. Grandiosity Gap Dysphoria
The narcissist's firmly, though counterfactually, perceives himself as omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, brilliant, accomplished, irresistible, immune, and invincible. Any data to the contrary is usually filtered, altered, or discarded altogether. Still, sometimes reality intrudes and creates a Grandiosity Gap. The narcissist is forced to face his mortality, limitations, ignorance, and relative inferiority. He sulks and sinks into an incapacitating but short-lived dysphoria.
V. Self-Punishing Dysphoria
Deep inside, the narcissist hates himself and doubts his own worth. He deplores his desperate addiction to Narcissistic Supply. He judges his actions and intentions harshly and sadistically. He may be unaware of these dynamics - but they are at the heart of the narcissistic disorder and the reason the narcissist had to resort to narcissism as a defence mechanism in the first place.
This inexhaustible well of ill will, self-chastisement, self-doubt, and self-directed aggression yields numerous self-defeating and self-destructive behaviours - from reckless driving and substance abuse to suicidal ideation and constant depression.
It is the narcissist's ability to confabulate that saves him from himself. His grandiose fantasies remove him from reality and prevent recurrent narcissistic injuries. Many narcissists end up delusional, schizoid, or paranoid. To avoid agonising and gnawing depression, they give up on life itself.
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[@pisces_chick2511]

The stbx husband was diagnosed with Bipolar Disorder in 2014. I had left him, a few months before that, in the middle of the night while he was on midnight shift, taking only the important things for me & our daughter. He did not know where we went for the first two months of our escape. He got so abusive, drinking for hours at a time, hateful, cruel and dangerous that I had no other choice but to leave him. At that time, we had been together for 20 years. Of course, he said and did everything I needed to hear & see to go back. He promised to get help for the drinking and the anger, to see a psychiatrist, get counseling. So that is how his wrongly diagnosed bipolar came to be. After researching it for the next 6 years, it just didnt fit. It didnt explain his behaviors, actions, reactions, abuse, binge drinking, betrayal's & cheating. It ultimately led me to the cluster B's & NPD & my world was changed forever since! The bad thing is I was still in a bit of denial until he ended up hurting me and blowing up the bridge between us, forever. If only I stayed away, I would have been able to save myself from the cruel, callous and painful betrayal of his Final discard. Thank you, Dr. Vaknin

[@pisces_chick2511]

@@breeneb2705 yes I understand the concerns of labeling people. I have been back and forth myself when finding about NPD. Unfortunately, he seems to be the poster child for the disorder. I feel he has a lot of sociopathic traits, also. I spent my life, pretty much with this man. We were both 14 when we got together. We are now 40. I wish I was wrong about knowing he has NPD. Thank you, though for forewarning people about labeling someone with this disorder. Unfortunately, nowadays, narcissism is a huge buzzword and people do not understand how destructive, abusive and harmful they are to the people who love them.

[@rosshandy5077]

What a selfish person you are obviously you didn't care enough to help and support him with his mental illness. These people suffer like you wouldn't believe. A lot time commiting suicide. Shame on you!!!!!!

[@pisces_chick2511]

@@rosshandy5077 Really?! Really?!! I was the one who was suicidal, also our daughter, not him by any means!!!!!!!! Let me tell you right now...I was with him since we were 14 yrs old. I was WITNESS to the PATTERNS of behavior and the PATTERNS of abuse, denial, gaslighting, deflection & projection, the triangulating, the ghosting..up for hours searching for his vehicle thinking he ran off the side of the road because he disappeared, was supposed to be at work but came back home at Noon and nonchalantly telling me he decided to go to a party instead. He came from such a dysfunctional, drunken & abusive home & family life that my parents (Jehovah's witnesses, mind you) let him move in with us the day he turned 18! He used them AND me to a horrible extent (now that I look back). We got married at 21 yrs of age because he got me pregnant with our daughter. After we got married at the age of 21 and had our daughter 5 months later...he put me & our daughter through enormous psychological, verbal, financial and physically abusive HELL! I stuck by his side and kept trying to convince him that his behavior, actions and life WAS crazy! I caught him trying to F*** all the women in my & his life. My friends, my family members, his own family members, his own step- sisters, aquintances, his friends girlfriends & spouses. Even my own gay NEPHEW! Finding those texts, talking about what they wanted and were going to do to each other "the next time". He eventually, a few months later, discarded and left me for his OWN COUSIN, who was his BEST FRIEND'S WIFE!! Don't you get on your moral high horse and chastise me for 25 years of his "mental illness" & sticking by his side through his psychological abuse, financial abuse, verbal abuse, physical abuse, sexual abuse, hours of binge drinking (like 27 hours at a time) bullying, job & medical insurance losses, DUI's, assault charges (from other people he beat up in bar fights) and Narcissistic Abuse, that you know nothing about. I stuck by his side through his raging alcoholism & He had me to the point of suicide after 25 YEARS of blindly and naively sticking by his side thinking that the alcoholism or bipolar disorder was causing it all. Our daughter LEGALLY changed her name due to the mayhem, pain, torture, abuse & CALLOUSNESS he caused us. Go somewhere else with your keyboard savior syndrome! I tried helping him thru almost THREE decades before I found out what he truly is. Go ask his "best friend" & his daughter the type of person he is. Go bother someone else. We've already been traumatized enough!

[@xav0l0]

Enlightenment brings strength even more so when no contact is not an option.

[@larasheart6579]

I think the answer is no, it's not something you turn on or off. And there is no cure either, because a narcissist doesn't think there is nothing wrong with them. The only way is to avoid narcissists at all costs.

[@butterflies6538]

I do not agree. There are narcissists that know that they are, but they are unable to find a solution to their problem because it is too overwhelming and too big for the body to handle. In that case the only thing left is to accept it.

[@Gotanewcaseofcrabs]

Dear Professor, Recently I suffered through an episode of My 600lb Life, a train wreck American reality show. I was struck by this morbidly obese person, living in a complete delusion with the people around her feeding the delusion. My question; are these people narcissistic? And if so, what type? Thank you!

[@timindia7185]

I have a question Professor Vaknin ! Does people with Narcissistic personality disorder feel joy & happiness !? For example from their personal achievements or from receiving gifts or services ? Thank you for your time and your knowledge

[@samvaknin]

They are elated in the shared fantasy, in the pathological narcissistic space, and when they receive narcissistic supply and sadistic supply (if they are also sadists).

[@butterflies6538]

Dear Sam Vaknin, there's one thing that takes my concern, which is that narcissists are painted as very evil creatures, while they are also human beings and disordered. In fact the trauma they have suffered was most probably so intense that it shattered their sense of self and identity. I wonder whether it's not a better idea to find a way to treat narcisism, rather to criticize them and demonize them even more. I haven't yet watched the video, but I am wondering about this for a long time. I have known narcissism from very closeby, and I might think that I have traits of narcissism. I do believe there's a physiological response/damage due to extreme damage and prolonged ptsd. Would love to know more and I hope that stigmatisation of narcissism will stop soon and that we can look for healing and treatment.

[@lrowlands53]

There is no effective treatment, so far. It’s not like a head cold. Yes, they have been traumatised and deserve compassion, but they are dangerous for any person they have contact with; they destroy lives without a second thought. What you mistake for demonisation is the unveiling of truth. The disorder is defined by deception so people need to know the level of guaranteed devastation at the narcissist’s hands. Your rational mind has to accept these facts; until it does you exist in cognitive dissonance. Further, supposed narcissistic traits are just self interest and absorption, not the pathological characteristics of someone with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I encourage finding out more rather than shooting in the dark with blanks of ignorance. Sam Vaknin is someone worth following and absorbing. Just do it.

[@andreamagyar7776]

You dismiss the fact that they are an adult now. The child once they used to be suffered. As an adult we choose how to be. Most child gets traumatised growing up, more of a norm than the exception . This people knows exactly what they are doing, they enjoy it. I have ZERO emphaty and tolerance for this immaturity.

[@kirstenshindler7767]

How about we educate people about what NPD looks like and then people recognize the patterns and behavior and eventually there will be no tolerance for their bad behavior..and humans will finally evolve! Maybe if you recognize u have npd you won’t have children.. That would break the cycle. I have two teen boys and I have witnessed the damage from their father.

[@butterflies6538]

I keep disagreeing on the fact that they are not humans. Every human being deserves compassion. It's not because there is no treatment, that it won't exist. I'm sure something can and will be found. I studied neuroscience and molecular psychiatry myself and I have very high hopes for this field.

[@butterflies6538]

@@kirstenshindler7767 well that I understand. My dad was a narc and the damage done to my life is immeasurable. I don't know if I will ever heal and suffering is too much too handle. It breaks you but as I say, I think that there's a very important physiological component that plays a role, in particular the nervous system and sensitivity in the sense of neural connectivity.

[@alexralph1795]

I have to apply psychoanalytical interpretations of psychosis to the characters and films of Alfred Hitchcock. Please explain the mirror phase and the manic defense in a way I an understand as I have dyslexia and add and I'm having trouble focusing on the reading material. Thank you

[@snooksmalloy7594]

Is the narcissist drawn to, either consciously or not to a person with bi-polar disorder in order to enjoy the mania (hyper sexuality) and doesn’t care when the depression hits due to other supply sources? I’m diagnosed with bi-polar II disorder which I think is moderately managed. I think I’m a rapid cycler when in contact with him. He seems to be a trigger and I have a difficult time distancing due to that high, and also my daddy abandonment issues from by father who was... a narc of Trump proportions. I think the answer is yes. Just curious about your thoughts, and apologies if you e addressed this. I try to catch all of your videos, but I’m sure I e missed a few. Thanks in advance

[@samvaknin]

Narcissists are drawn to any and all potential sources of narcissistic supply. Nothing else matters, nothing else is relevant.

[@snooksmalloy7594]

Sam Vaknin Thank you very much.