Is Nightmare Moon A Better Ruler Than Celestia?

[@brandonwilliams6221]

Each season is not a year in the show. We can track the progress of time in-universe using the winters in the show. The characters reference prior Hearth’s Warmings but never mention any that we the audience weren’t privy to. And since Hearth’s Warming is the holiday we are shown the most throughout the show, it’s the most accurate one to use to keep track of time. (Nightmare night, running of the leaves, hearts and hooves day, and the summer sun celebration are mentioned/shown multiple times but not nearly as much as Hearth’s Warming.) With this in mind, it hadn’t been five years since Nightmare Moon’s return. It had been about three. Which still confirms that Luna’s eternal night isn’t a death sentence. But it’s important to have the correct amount of time. We also know their seasons are in the same order as ours, Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall. So even though they can manipulate their weather, we know each season still has to pass before another winter can occur. Up to there were only three winter episodes. Winter Wrap-up, Hearth’s Warming Eve, and Tanks for the Memories. We also know that the show began around the summer solstice, meaning the summer/spring weather we see during the Re-mark episodes confirms that only three years have passed. Give or take some months. The pace of events in the show are very fast in-universe and that fact is even mentioned by characters who remark that crazy events happening in Ponyville are very common. The entire show itself takes place in the span of half a decade. Great video by the way.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@brandonwilliams6221 thanks for this. I wasn't completely sure about the passage of time.

[@siddhianishkala4543]

You forgot "Hearthbreakers" (Season 5), "A Hearth's Warming Tale" (Season 6), "The Hearth's Warming Club" (Season 8) and "Best Gift Ever" (Special).

[@HououMinamino]

I thought yhat Nightmare Moon said, "My sister has been imprisoned in the Moon for a thousand years" in the episode.

[@oceansolstice608]

@@HououMinamino I think she just says ‘years’ but not a specific amount?

[@Rybakov22]

@@ItsOfficiaI Nightmare Moon might not need to sacrifice Elements of Harmony to defeat plunder vines, after all. In the second episode, it was shown that elements were in the castle within Everfree forest all this time. Under the floor. And the old castle is right beside the Tree of Harmony. It is possible, that with elements stored there, plunder vine just didn't have a chance to grow at all. They are dormant, yes, but they nonetheless are powerful magical artifacts located near their place of origin. Honestly, being dormant might even make it easier for them to empower the tree itself.

[@featherlight2652]

One thing I think isn’t super touched on- It was wildly easy to get to Nightmare Moon in her castle. Twilight literally just walked right in without anybody stopping her. Either Nightmare is very accessible to her subjects, or they are just not scared of anything. Considering Rarity mentions “touring hours”, I’m guessing it’s a bit of both.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@featherlight2652 Damn I never even thought of that.

[@iiomqfaderz]

She probably is a good ruler in the ways that really matter, just kinda meaner idk

[@helenanilsson5666]

@@iiomqfaderz Yeah, and "mean" doesn't have to be a bad trait in a ruler when you look at pre-democracy royalty. As long as that "meanness" was directed towards enemies outside of the kingdom, that basically meant the people had a distant bully protecting them. Heck, even today there are huge swathes of people who clearly endorse autocracy because fuck it, it would be really nice to have a bully that protects you and as long as that bully never turns on you don't have to worry about outside threats.

[@cathygrandstaff1957]

Considering her whole thing was being jealous of the attention her sister was getting I’m not surprised she allows ponies to come and pay attention to her.

[@grandmasterofdemoniccock]

@@cathygrandstaff1957 I think it’s more so because she wants to promote a lack of fear. Let her subjects know that she is approachable when she’s not there to subjugate them. She wants them to love the night, not fear it.

[@moisieiev7124]

Nightmare Moon would've probably given more rights to Bat ponies

[@mustbeluna]

She would treat them as her own Do you think fluttershy is living as a bat pony in the universe?

[@moisieiev7124]

@mustbeluna mb

[@mustbeluna]

@@moisieiev7124 for what?

[@moonblaze2713]

What are you talking about?

[@ephemerameera]

i think they probably thought u were asking the question in a rhetorical​ sarcastic way or annoyed or smt idk @@mustbeluna

[@Avoxxii]

I think the first time Luna transformed, she had no control...but during the alternative timeline, she seemed more willing to listen because she got control over the "dark powers"...the first time we saw nightmare moon again, was nightmare night...where she was in her "nightmare" form to scare the children. So she can willingly transform into that form still

[@Eclipse_101]

I thought it was just an illusion

[@Avoxxii]

@Eclipse_101 not exactly, sure it is an illusion, but she still carries that dark magic inside of her, same with how she created the tantabus

[@shadowserenity1879]

The Nightmare Moon in nightmare night was likely an illusion, though that's just my headcanon

[@Avoxxii]

@@shadowserenity1879 not exactly, sure it's an illusion, caused by the evil magic she still has inside of her, same with how she created a tantabus that can give *nightmares* and is a magical form of Luna

[@shadowserenity1879]

@@Avoxxii Personally, I believe Luna wouldn't want to actively transform into the real nightmare, also she spit out fake teeth. The tantabus was meant as self-punishment, and was never meant to wander out of Luna's head.

[@MaddieVenus]

I think that raising and lowering the sun and moon uses a lot of their power, which is why Celestia and Luna seem so weak compared to Princess Twilight. Celestia raised and lowered the moon and sun by herself for 1000 years, which made her absolutely weak and unable to deal with enemies on her own. On the other hand, Nightmare Moon, leaving the moon in the sky all the time, did not use her powers, which is why she was strong enough to deal with all enemies without help. For this reason, the ponies were loyal to her because for 1000 years she defended them herself and was the strongest of them all. She was probably strict, but she defended them and seeing that ponies who were not originally in the army now are in it, she increased the military strength, which strengthens Equestria. Also 1000 years ago princesses would address their subjects differently and probably have a different relationship, for example using the "canterlot voice" to speak to subjects. Celestia was more social and playful so she loosened the etiquette, so the behavior of ponies in the world of Nightmare Moon may simply be a demonstration of how ponies would behave if strict etiquette was still maintained

[@anglepsycho]

Also Celestia forcing the moon like that means she fucked over all the ocean life in that area for at least a week lmao, good god that tide pattern is disastrous.

[@tenebrisevernight]

You seem to have misunderstood. The alternate timeline where Nightmare Moon rules isn't where she defeated Celestia 1000 years ago, it's where she defeated Celestia upon her return from banishment. Those differences your listing aren't the accumulative effect of a millennium, there the result of a few years

[@MaizeSnallygaster]

Fun fact: Nightmare Moon is likely inspired by Shakespeare’s Romeo and Juliet, specifically the line “arise fair sun and kill the envious moon”.

[@Jamseth_Ingramious]

Moon: *pulls out uno reverse card*

[@Pearl.Is.Autistic.SU.900]

Crazy how back then they never saw the moon in the sky during the day, like ever. Apparently they thought the moon just rose and set like the sun.

[@Shythalia]

Saying "is likely inspired" instead of "is inspired" means that you aren't 100% sure if that's even true. Speculation/theory/hypothesis ≠ fact. If you don't even know if it's really true, then don't present it as a fact.

[@cathygrandstaff1957]

I thought she was inspired by Tirek. In G1 Tirek is the villain who wants to create eternal night using the power of the Rainbow of Darkness.

[@CasketGenneva]

hmm

[@KitsuneNotFound]

16:17 I cannot express how much that line pissed me off. She did NOT want to make the world a nightmare, she just said she wanted eternal night.

[@Dontdoillegalactivity]

Which isn’t good you need the sun to survive

[@Priestesskikyou]

​@@Dontdoillegalactivity Yeah that's the thing that argument does not apply because Equestria does not function like the real world. And the very important part is that magic is a thing. We have gardens that can grow inside. It's implied that when Luna was banished in the first place the fight and the overacting incident did not take a single day. As it's implied that Luna becomes nightmare Moon on the day they celebrate nightmare night. Which we think is October, however the Summer sun festival is the festival that they celebrate commemorating when Celestia Rose the Sun. After banishing her sister, this means that there is a high likelihood that the battle between the two sisters took an entire year, from that October to the next summer. And the ponies survived it. And we do get a glimpse in that altered, universe section that there are still ponies that exist in nightmare Moon's universe we don't see all of them but we do clearly see that the vegetation found in the everfree forest is still a thing. So we don't actually know that the plants can't grow and we don't actually know that that world genuinely needs sunlight in order to survive.

[@lunar_proxy]

which will make the world a nightmare because constant nighttime will kill literally all plant life + give everypony crippling depression

[@spaghetti5914]

she's just a ✨goff✨

[@PlanetEarth1369]

⁠@@lunar_proxyDid you watch the video? He literally talked about the consequences of eternal night at 6:52 and showed how despite it being nighttime for literally years at that point, there were no noticeable negative impacts on plant life. I get the need to be edgy and subversive to look cool and smart, but when you confidently say objectively wrong things, you just sound stupid.

[@CottageCoreCoward]

I always just imagined that night-blooming plants would take over/get stronger/be altered for the sake of food/ecology.

[@kitsunephantom6155]

I think for Nightmare Moon's continued reign, the way she rules is how she defeats the following villains. TLDR Nightmare Moon's proactive ruling style and focus on national security over personal freedom doesn't let the later villains become genuine threats. Discord was only released due to his statue being exposed to ponies' disharmony for centuries. Given how strict Nightmare Moon seems to be in regards to potential threats, I would think she either put him somewhere far from exposure or simply destroyed him while he couldn't fight back. I also don't think she'd tolerate unrest or a lack of unity, as that would make her forces weak. Chrysalis is almost a non-issue because of how militant Nightmare Moon is. Her personal royal guard is always on go and loyal to a fault to their leader, and the way Rainbow Dash acts tells me that Nightmare Moon is regarded highly enough for her ponies to defend her from threats she's not even aware of. The slightest mistake and every changeling is getting *deleted* from Equestria. Sombra is either light work or a non-issue, depending on how Nightmare Moon reacts to the Crystal Empire returning. If she only cares about Equestria and leaves Sombra to regain his throne, I'm willing to bet that her cohesive and loyal armies will decimate his unwilling war slaves if she doesn't annihilate him directly first. If she goes expansionist and moves to take the Crystal Empire, the crystal ponies would be too weak to repel her forces. Additionally, as her militant ruling style emphasizes the swift and thorough destruction of any and all threats, she may inadvertently quell the lingering fear of Sombra from the crystal ponies, effectively defeating Sombra before he has a chance to become a tangible threat. Tirek, again, is either light work or a non-issue. If Nightmare Moon realizes Cerberus has left its post, she's going to personally check if Tirek is still imprisoned. Considering how dangerous he is if left to his own devices, she'd start a nation-wide manhunt and personally see to his reimprisonment. She's not going to be taking any risks or chances with him. Starlight Glimmer is unlikely to catch Nightmare Moon's attention to begin with, but if she does, she's either forcefully recruited into the standing army or imprisoned. Nightmare Moon would not stand for any potential rivals, no matter how small. Cozy Glow is a non-issue because there's no friendship school or anything of the sort. I do think she'd claim the ranks when she's old enough to enlist, but she's not going to be anywhere close to challenging Nightmare Moon. As for the other kingdoms around Equestria, I think they'll eventually go to war with her because I'm fairly sure the eternal night affects the entire world. Even if the world's life can go on without the Sun, that doesn't mean the peoples are content to. Considering how much they dislike one another, I can't see them making a unified force to actually take Nightmare Moon down. Doubly so if she has control of the Crystal Empire.

[@dustyrose192]

I think then she would take control of the Cystal empire because she knows that other nations will go to war against her and her night

[@musicnightmare]

And with the discord considering they refuse to work together she'd STILL win,.. it's just now she might be taking over THEIR territory instead-😅

[@kitsunephantom6155]

@@musicnightmare Eh, I'm not sure Nightmare Moon would go into absolute conquest considering how Rarity reacts to Spike, but any places with pony or pony-like species may catch her attention. Can you imagine how terrifying her armies would be with kirin in the ranks? I think she'd beat them into the dirt just to prove she can, not because she wants their land. Besides, a decent amount of them live in places that ponies might find near inhospitable, like the dragon lands.

[@Phonenix_6543]

Personally, I think Celestia is the better politician where Luna is the better protector. But ultimately both are needed as rulers. In the episode where Celestia and Luna switch cutie marks, Luna struggles with her sister's duties of being a public figure, smiling all the time, ect. And in the same episode, Celestia is seen coming out of a meeting talking with the members of the meeting in a very superficial and polished way. Where in the episode Do Princesses Dream of Sheep (or something like that) we see Luna take on the Tantabus head on. She fights nightmares, pulls dreams together, and even plans on dealing with the Tantabus herself before agreeing to ask for help. Not only that, but in the Nightmare Night episode, Luna is seen to have a variety of magic such as shape shifting, weather control, bringing animate objects to life. She even swiftly saves Pip from falling into the barrel of apples. She is also shown to be incredibly strong as the ground breaks under her hooves when she stomps. Not only that, but Luna mentions on occasion that her subjects used to fear her in the past. But why? Was it just because she is the mysterious one of the two sisters or did her nightly abilities give her subjects something to worry about in comparison to Celestia? And without the Elements, would Celestia have beaten Luna? Based on what's seen of their fight, I don't think so. And in the episode where Shinning Armor and Twilight are fighting for that sibling crown thing, Celestia is more willing to put her trust in Shinning but Luna wants to handle the subject of security herself. I think that kind of shows their strengths as rulers and also their weaknesses. While Celestia nurtures her subjects, builds relationships with them, and has more faith in her subjects, Luna would rather deal with threats heads on, protect her subjects from harm, even from herself, and acts as a guiding light in her subjects nightmares. It's my head canon that just like the two sisters are needed to rule the night and day, they are also needed to provide specific elements of ruling that contrast each other but together create a perfect balance of harmony. 🌄🌌

[@mysticalmind5115]

This is so well put!!!

[@Phonenix_6543]

@@mysticalmind5115 thank you!! 😊

[@kkamajwi]

in the nightmare moon rule, she wouldn't really have to do all the smiling that celestia does, or struggle with it as much since their personalities are quite different. she wouldn't need to keep a joyous/happy/friendly face since.. well she is the ruler (what are they gonna do abt it lol), and the different personality, NM seems more confident/arrogant and extroverted, which is quite the opposite of Luna. That would allow her to perform political duties almost on the same level as celestia while also possessing the immense strength to protect.

[@Phonenix_6543]

@@kkamajwi that's true, I can totally see NMM doing it all...I do wonder though what caused such a personality shift? The show never really gives an answer as far as I can tell.

[@kkamajwi]

@@Phonenix_6543 i just assume its the classic theatrical shift of a villain, you know how dramatic their personalities become. kinda like with starlight, hers was (seemed to me) like more of a mask for her insecurities that was feuled by betrayal yk. cover all that up with the dramatic confidence adn loudness. redeemed starlight seems more reserved and shy around ppl could be fore luna as well, but hers could be more gaining confidence after letting NMM out, using her resentment and allowing herself to see herself as worthy and hence teh confidence(or ego who knows) and personality shift. (you could kind of see it physically, she is taller as NMM, grander and on equal standing, physically, as celestia)

[@kevinmccalister4602]

The mere fact that Rarity mistakes Twilight and Spike for tourists means there is a tourism industry specifically for visiting nightmare moon’s castle. And the fact they just barged in implies that nightmare moon has no fear of just leaving the doors unlocked. And combining these things means that Nightmare Moon must be beloved by the population unless she mandated by law that you must make a pilgrimage to see her. But in that case Rarity would have said more pilgrims. So overall I would agree that equestria would be safer. Question is would it be better? Bepends on how you define better. Personally I’d like to have sunlight, but I don’t need it. Especially if the advantages in my personal life are significant. Question is would anything change about your personal life outside of no sunlight and having a more active force slaughtering beasts and threats under her rule?

[@Drave_Jr.]

More likely to be conscripted as part of the active force.

[@kevinmccalister4602]

@@Drave_Jr. Ah so you're saying nightmare moon has drafted her army. I could see that. A more militant Equestria conquering the world? I wonder if there was a war between ponies and dragons to take their riches explaining rarity's racism.

[@SirLuckySlime]

I think it's far more likely that her castle just acts as a temporary safe-haven for ponies. The Everfree forest is overgrown and timberwolves are everywhere. I don't think her being "beloved" by ponies is the only reason they wouldn't pass up free refuge...

[@thejester2751]

Nightmare moon happily allowing her subjects in and out of the castle shows a mutual trust and respect. Not only do her subjects abide by the "touring hours" rules and don't bother Nightmare moon before or after BUT ALSO Rainbow Dash taking off her helmet and speaking out instead of staying silent when Twilight is confronted shows that she along with the other guards aren't scared of Moon. It might even show that Nightmare moon will listen to her subjects and guards and allow them to speak freely instead of the silent and weak guards Celestia has. Canterlot castle's visitors are guards and the other princesses most of the time and as shown in the episode where Celestia goes to Ponyville for a visit the ponies around her are walking on eggshells and are terrified of messing up even though Ponyville is probaly the closest town to Canterlot and Celestia. Sure Nightmare moon wanted to exert her power on all the other AU's but who's to say they wouldn't actually prefer her rule?? It's better than Sombra, it's much better than Tirek! Moon would do a service by eradicating them, taking over and rebuilding the other worlds. Maybe, if given the chance, she would've left some of the other worlds alone or even made peace to form a universal alliance. She's clearly smart enough to know she can't fight everyone. Twilight's bias stops a possible universal peace effort, I know that's a wild thing to say but... Nightmare moon is competent, any universe that refuses can be forgotten about and left to their own universe if they don't know how to dimension hop, universes with horrible endings can be saved and the more powerful alicorns and species that join up can ensure the safety of everyone else. Idk it's neat ig I love Nightmare Moon.

[@trolledfordrip]

this is like the first scp 5243 deadline ( read the site 43 books on wiki their peak ) but without the 6 billion dead right off the bat so if even they had doubts about bringing back the main timeline then this would be even more morally grey since all in all this is a far more better place then that deadline was and well its not like it risked the multiverse or was apart of a timeloop that needed to be done so nightmare moon's world could easy have stayed... hell we never know if that world died since it could have just went on just never have had this version of twilight in it with nightmare not finding out about the other AU's

[@professorsassafras]

In Luna defense, she always did generally prefer a more hands on approach and didn't like politics and paperwork

[@Jenkinsmum]

It is shown in "My Little Pony: Deviations" that Nightmare Moon doesn't display any signs of tyranny or wickedness. She merely wants ponies to like the things she likes. She also gets pacified without the use of the Elements of Harmony. I'm not sure if Celestia in the storyline was stupid or genius to send Blueblood to deal with Nightmare Moon instead of Twilight. I think Nightmare Moon needs to realise that eternal night will mean no sunshine to make the plants grow healthily, which in turn will mean no fruit for her beloved Batponies.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@Jenkinsmum I did not know about this. Thank you.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@Jenkinsmum also finish the video. I brought up the sunlight thing.

[@Jenkinsmum]

@@ItsOfficiaI I guess magic moonlight can be a sunlight substitute.

[@starpool04]

Thank you for mentioning this I was just thinking about it.

[@moonblaze2713]

Hey, a monaechic ruler of a country attempting to make their preferences official policy is a form of tyranny. Just thought you ought to know you contradicted yourself.

[@savcicerenifsaliyor]

Funfact: nightmare moon wasn’t alone in the moon! In the comics it shows some sort of night creatures lives in the moon. They actually help her escape and kinda are her friends lol

[@LARADEKA]

Actually (Spoilers ahead): She corrupts the Nyx race as Nightmare Moon, and the dark energy possessed all of them. This is likely how she escaped. When the Nightmarity Arc happened, the corrupted Nyx (or the Nightmare Forces, because I am still not sure if the Nyx race are just a mouthpiece to the Nightmare energy, or they are really reversed... but it might be the Nightmare energy itself) possessed Rarity. And then Luna purifies them all, and they're good again with all pony-kind, back to duty, I assume.

[@ArtHeartAlex]

My question hasn't been whether or not she'd be better, but how kingdoms outside of equestria would cope with eternal night. I mean, they can't just mindlessly want to agree with eternal night. That being said, what if neither of the sisters were ruling? Would the sun or moon just get... Stuck?

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@ArtHeartAlex Unicorns used to give up their magic performing the cycle of the Sun and Moon. Celestia essentially single handedly invented the Unicorn species of pony as it's understood in the show because they no longer had to waste all their magic performing the day and night cycle.

[@BlankComicsMain]

There’s an episode where both sisters go missing, and it’s half day half night so yeah, it just gets stuck

[@Nick-yl4qp]

I think Equestria has got to be in some kind of different dimension because in the movie they were both turned to stone and the sun and moon were a non issue during the mane 6's travels

[@dayknight03]

So as someone who’ve only seen a few episodes and remember very little of the story, I can only put a small amount of my own input. 1.From what I could remember, during her first appearance nightmare moon didn’t really attack anyone but the queen and twilight. 2.From the clips that you’ve played, her alternate timeline seems to be the safest, as long as you don’t ask for a 1V1 against her. 4.The queen (Celestia?) never seems to care, even when certain threats appear. Like in the specials where twilight turns into a human, Sunset Shimmer (Cool name BTW) just straight out steals the elements and I don’t remember if she ever bothers to show up or give chase. Lady, those things are your kingdom’s super weapons, WHY ARENT YOU WORRYING?! I remember the Human version doing more than her…even if it wasn’t much. In the end…We can all agree on one thing…. NIGHTMARE MOON HAS THE BEST DESIGN (In both forms) OUT OF ALL THE PONIES!

[@neeneko]

With regard to the night : maybe one explanation is, well, we only got to see a few hours. Perhaps there is still a day-night cycle, but the night takes primacy and is when people are out and about, sleeping during the day.

[@Amonimus]

While not totally in defence of Celestia, there are several points in the show of note: 1. Celestia does defend Equestria on occasion, but it's explicitly off-screen. There are at least two episodes where she and Luna manage to fend off a random monster by themselves and she says she misses her adventurer days. 2. Celestia has a power complex. Her magic can effectively be equal to a tactical nuke, so she avoids using it when others are nearby, and also because she's afraid of tripping into tyranny. 3. She doesn't have access to the Elements of Harmony, which are actually considered a tactical weapon, so her options against external threats are limited if she's not willing to fry enemies to death. 4. Equestria is partially a democracy. While not a stable form of government, Celestia spends almost the entirety of her time on bureaucracy, finances, and leading her personal school. 5. She has decided to make Twilight her successor before the series has even begun. While I don't find it ethical, she's confident her student has everything covered. Celestia also shows long-range teleportation, so she can swoop in as a last resort. Celestia is also angsting about Sunset Shimmer betraying her and doesn't want a repeat of that. While her track record is really poor, she still kept the nation peaceful for 1000 years, so it's hard to compare Nightmare Moon with her without seeing her resolve every problem Celestia had or considering what Celestia could have done better, like at least raising the military budget and funding like a research center of defensive artifacts. We also can't fully assert Nightmare Moon's rule is satisfactory, she has a streak of narcissism and any possible rebellion may have already been destroyed, and if you look at the map some locations are missing. She also wouldn't have to deal with Discord (still being stoned) and Chrysalis (who wouldn't care about love-less Equestria).

[@trolledfordrip]

who said it was love-less? just cause the ponys shown here did't show any love does not mean people don't have love and also the crystal empire would sill most likely be around (unless it was shown to have been gone) and unless we know how discord broke out in the main timeline and know it could not have happened here then she most likely did have to deal with him

[@cleverfoxseer7023]

The problem here we only see Nightmare Castle which can be new capital and nothing else. For all we know maybe rest of Equestria is in completely ruins.

[@NoSauceOrBroth]

The later seasons pissed me off with their rule(Luna and Celestria). Nightmare Moon wins by default.

[@sophietremblay3795]

I love Luna and her villain version nightmare moon I always hated celestia

[@NoSauceOrBroth]

@ Honestly, I wished the two were more active in Equestria. Other than leaving everything to Twi and the gang.

[@sophietremblay3795]

@ yep

[@Ebh55.]

What about it?

[@kintsuki99]

Something people never take in consideration when talking about Celestia is that she elevated a divided and undeveloped bunch into a nation and kept it for a thousand years of peace and prosperity/stagnation.

[@trinstonmichaels7062]

A rules purpose is to keep their people safe celestia constantly fails to do that it's amazing that the nation hasn't fallen yet.

[@Crow_Duskwing]

Honestly, 1000 years of peace is enough for me to say that Celestia is quite competent as a ruler. She knows when to delegate the tasks, and there is even a theory that most of her failings during the show were intentional to test Twilight and her friends. Nightmare Moon would of course turn Equestria into a personified authoritarian state, where her ruleship would be absolute that the power of propaganda and loyal internal police forces. Perhaps, this way of state could have high chances for existance, but it would all end, the moment NM disapears from the political stage. Now, I wonder, how Equestria would fair under the ruleship of Daybreaker?

[@skyarrow4583]

There is actually a very interesting fanfic about this concept of Nightmare Moon having to be in charge called 'Left Behind' on Fimfiction

[@Priestesskikyou]

I don't like that narrative, I know that that's the narrative the story goes along with. But it doesn't suit what is actually shown. Put yourself in Luna's shoes, up till you get your cutie mark, you are hanging out with ponies day and night, then boom flash, now you're stuck only being awake at night. You exhaust all of your energy to raise the moon and, form the constellations and other things. As well as doing dreamwalking duties, night court and anything else that might need doing. By the time you are finished you are so exhausted that you sleep until the next sun set. The only pony that you are able to speak to is your sister, who seems apathetic to your continued isolation. You want nothing more than to have ponies hang out with you when you are around at night, you suffer this fate for the entire time you have your cutie mark. Because the night and that which lies in it is unknown ponies are scared of it and you. They're not likely to try to make friends with you. Pushing you even more into isolation. As a direct result you snap, we know from The starlight anger episode that emotions are literally magic in this world and can possess other ponies. If starlight's anger can possess others because the bottle holding them broke it could be possible that the severe anger from a lifetime of isolation, could actively take a mind of its own and possessed Luna like it did in the comics. And the penalty for being overcome by grief because of social isolation caused by your cutie mark, an isolation that doesn't stop when you return might I add. Is that you are a sentenced to suffer even more isolation. And when you come back, you are only accepted because magic brainwashes you into believing fighting for yourself was a bad thing. It is said that the victors write history. Why would Celestia make herself look like a tyrant, who cared little for her sister, and her needs. Rather than a benevolent ruler. Who is it that said that she did all of this because of jealousy? The people. Who did nothing to stop that rumor and the other nightmare Moon nightmare night based rumors Celestia. I don't see what she did as a result of jealousy. I see it as a result, of a mental breakdown as a result of a lifetime of social isolation caused by their cutie mark. We know cutie marks have the capacity to ruin ponies lives thanks to troubleshoes. I view Luna as a tragic story rather than as a jealous sister because she does not come across as jealous. it wasn't that Celestia was receiving praise it was that only Celestia was being associated with. This is something that is left out all the time.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@Priestesskikyou believe me, I'm an ADVID Luna defender. But I do see notes of jealousy in her actions, but I'm not painting is a negative. I think she has every right to be envious. The things you mentioned just compound on it even more.

[@Pearl.Is.Autistic.SU.900]

Yes I agree with both of you, not black and white, it’s extremely nuanced.

[@atlasgraham154]

When you think about Nightmare Moon's motivations, it actually makes perfect sense that she'd banish Celestia instead of killing her. For one thing, it would give her a taste of her own medicine. For another, when Celestia returns, she'll see with her own eyes that Nightmare Moon's kingdom was thriving under her rule -- she'd be able to sneer at Celestia and say 'Look how much better things are when you aren't here to hold me back?' Also, considering how everyone we see acts around her, she went HARD on reshaping her very villainous first impression, and the fact that she likely saved Equestria from the threats the Mane 6 would have dealt with, on her own, probably helped immensely with fostering that new image.

[@magic_pink_horse]

Always love it when YT points me to an expectedly good 20-minute video essay about pony from a person I didn't know before. Instant sub ❤

[@LurukiFennecFox]

10:42 ok i now want to make an au of my au and call it "eternal night" so i can have a variant with nightmare moon

[@hollytheanimalcrossingfan]

Based on what I've seen, nightmare moon is the least evil out of the villains twilight visited in that alternate universe. I got a theory that she knows how plants and animals need the sun to thrive and thus, created special plants that can survive without the sun. But the manga version of her is worse as she makes a deal with changelings and makes her subjects work in mines.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@hollytheanimalcrossingfan there's a manga??

[@kingfairytale4306]

​@@ItsOfficiaI Yep, only the most devoted fans know about them though. It's not common knowledge outside of Japan.

[@kopop-]

I think she is a good ruler she never said she whude turned life into a nightmare she just wanted to take over and she just made the wrong approach she just hade to tack pony side by her

[@A7642-h2y]

5:22 those are not alternative realities, we see the same timeline, zecora explains in one of them that time is like a river, she shows it by changing the way river is going, not splitting it

[@foxmountain8065]

I mostly agree with this take Nightmare Moon would be an effective leader to the point I think it's the only really likely timeline since she wouldn't allow anyone near the discord statue and would stomp out Tirek and Sombra. I personally think and have heard this is confirmed somewhere in the comics (I'm not really sure) that Celestia not only throws every scenario because it's a teaching moment for Twilight but she also orders Luna to throw every scenario. We also know they probably aren't in their primes anymore but that's pure speculation Celestia and Luna are godlike entities and there's no real way to argue around it. One thing I rarely see brought up is that Twilight isn't the only person Celestia wants to see grow, she also wants Cadance to get her chance in the spotlight and that's likely the reason she let Queen C "beat her".

[@n1conicokneecaps]

I haven't interacted with mlp in a VERY long time but I watched the show and was obsessed with the lore for most of my childhood, so I loved soaking up all the information in this video. Luna was and will always be my favorite character in the entire series, she just seemed so much more interesting and complex compared to her sister, so you best believe I lached onto from episode 1 onwards✊ Personally, I agree with all points stated here. It does seem like Moon's timeline is the most secure one, and the idea that Luna was always more of a protector adds up looking back on all the episodes we see her doing stuff herself, or being ordered to stand back by her sister. Damn, I should probably catch up on all the Luna content I missed. 🌙

[@cathygrandstaff1957]

A couple counterpoints: it’s shown that the Everfree Forest has expanded significantly in Nightmare Moon’s reign, because the map doesn’t change positions from one timeline to the next so it should be somewhere in Ponyville. I don’t know the exact location of Twilight’s castle, just that it seems to be on the outskirts of Ponyville but still close enough that it’s considered part of the town. We don’t see what has become of the rest of Ponyville although given the number of Timberwolves it’s likely the town is no more. For what caused the expansion I think the most likely explanation is that the Tree of Harmony died, either from lack of sunlight or from the loss of harmony amongst ponies as a result of the sun being taken, or possibly Nightmare Moon herself destroyed it in an attempt to prevent the Elements of Harmony from being revived. Alternatively Celestia herself is exerting a significant amount of power keeping the Everfree Forest in check, which could be indicated by the fact that the only other timeline in which it seems to have expanded is the one in which Chrysalis wins and presumably has all 3 princesses imprisoned in her anti-magic cocoons. And that could be why Celestia is always delegating responsibility to the Mane 6. We also see that while Nightmare Moon herself is not a cruel ruler usually she does have a habit of going off on anyone who mentions her sister, as we can see from Dash’s reaction when Twilight mentions Celestia. As for Celestia’s banishment I’ve always interpreted it as Celestia allowing herself to be banished as atonement for being unable to save her sister, with Nightmare Moon banishing her as revenge for having been imprisoned herself. Your analysis of Luna and Celestia’s ruling styles sounds right and is reinforced by the types of problems they have to deal with. Celestia’s main problems are diplomatic in nature, making sure the various cities and tribes continue to get along. Luna’s main problems, dealing with nightmares, require her to brute force overpower them a lot of times and then soothe the pony having the nightmares. We see this with both Scootaloo and Sweetie Belle where she leads by vaporizing the monsters both had conjured before talking to them about their fears. As such it would make sense for Celestia’s ruling style to be based around conflict resolution by diplomacy while Nightmare Moon shoots first and asks questions later.

[@entropyhater]

an interesting question is whether NM appeared in ponies' dreams as ruler in that timeline, I'd assume she wouldn't bother but it's funny to imagine it

[@ditzydoodle8381]

I'm glad to see another analysis of this, as I was annoyed that the only other one that supported Nightmare moon was you know who, I wish we'd see more stuff on Nightmare Moon in general. I like your take, I also kind of wish the whole Changeling 'rebellion' idea wasn't just done in the background or that Queen Chrysalis who could've been seen as a good 'ruler/mother' figure to her subjects finding them food only to just toss that out the window and make her just hungry for power. And if they must keep to the Chrysalis only starved her subjects cause she's a power hungry tyrant needing them reliant on her, I wish Throax could've you know, challenged her, seen more dynamics and learned more about the changelings and how they adapted to a new way of life. But that's just me being a sucker for world-building and cultures. xD

[@n0_mu]

not me clicking in here bcuz I am such a sucker for nightmare moon (my first weird crush ig?) I don't really have anything to say about the ruler thing, but I do like that she had the best universe among all the others, im js really hyped cuz nightmare moon isn't brought up much by the community other than a few mentions of her evil doings here and there overall im js quite happy to see a good nightmare moon that still has all that sass :3

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@n0_mu Ah. I see you're a person of culture as well.

[@PrincessLuna-fan-e4f]

That's a really good video with interesting points and arguments. Personally, I think that her grace Nightmare Moon, the mare of the night, would have a long and successful reign. However if her reign would be better than the one of Celestia depends on the perspective, in my opinion, the reign of Nightmare Moon would be better than the one of Celestia in several ways but on the other side the reign of Celestia would be better than the one of Nightmare Moon in some ways, the reign of Nightmare Moon would definitely be more interesting than the reign of Celestia. It really depends on which type of leader someone likes or prefers. Nightmare Moon would be a successful ruler. As mentioned in this video, the eternal night existed for several years in the alternate universe that Twilight saw and didn't have a that bad visible impact on the environment, so I don't really see much of a problem there (maybe there is some magic that keeps everything intact, there are many possibilities to speculate). In terms of relations with neighboring countries or civilizations, I don't see Nightmare Moon going Expansionist and invading others. Nightmare Moon would however definitely do something about ambitious leaders of neighboring lands who want to conquer her Equestria or are a danger to her Equestria, she would defeat Sombra and Chrysalis, also she would lead her troops into victory herself and would show bravery in battles (gains her even more support and is strengthening the moral of the troops immense), I think, after she defeats Sombra and Chrysalis, Nightmare Moon would turn the Crystal Empire and the Changeling Lands into vassals of Equestria, she would probably put puppet Monarchs in power there or even takes the ruling titles of those countries herself and rules them separately as vassals, to prevent danger from there in the future. So Nightmare Moon would have a stable and successful reign. Interesting could be what happens when Celestia returns after 1000 years. Celestia could try to turn Nightmare Moon back into Luna or send her to the Moon. If Nightmare Moon would defeat Celestia again, she could send Celestia back to the Moon or keep her here by her side but in that case Celestia would have a far less important position, and here comes the danger in keeping Celestia by her side, because Celestia could now suffer from broken pride and could turn into Daybreaker which could be a serious threat to Nightmare Moon. The funny scenario would be Nightmare Moon and Daybreaker doing an evil Diarchy and rule together, the probably more realistic scenario would be the two fighting each other. But that's just my personal thoughts to this really interesting topic.

[@mw385]

I don't comment much but I really like this video and appericate your take on this!

[@namelessnavnls8060]

Makes me wanna write my own fanfics of Queen Nightmare Moon omg.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@namelessnavnls8060 Cook.

[@VenomQuill]

Interesting video! Honestly, there's not a black-and-white answer. Nightmare Moon would definitely make for a better war leader. What we see are ponies constantly battle-ready, on their hooves, and ready to fight and defend. Even Rarity has her mane pulled up in a utilitarian fashion. It's possible that Nightmare Moon, once disposing of her sister, put the Elements of Harmony back in the tree (restoring its power and defending it from the bramble seeds Discord planted) and started training everypony in warfare. No more quiet time; it was time to get ready for anything. Thank you for pointing out we never leave the Everfree forest. Who's to say that Equestria even still _belongs_ to them, anymore? Maybe after Luna refused to raise the sun and lower the moon, destroying the tidal pattern and screwing up the natural order globally, the other nations got REAL bothered. Maybe there was a civil war over this whole kerfuffle. Why else would they be staying in the Castle of Two Sisters in the Everfree forest instead of Canterlot, the capital of Equestria? Even if there was no civil war and everything was peaceful because all the ponies accepted Nightmare Moon, she should still be in Canterlot where she's closest to her subjects. However, she's now in the heart of Equestria, out in a dangerous place where dignitaries, nobleponies, regular citizens, and anypony else who needed to visit her might be deterred from visiting due to distance or threat of bodily harm or death. (Remember the timberwolves?) Princess Celestia is much better at the politics of ruling than Nightmare Moon, and not as good at the combat. She's extremely passive and, as you said, fights only when pressed enough. Considering she could blast a pony into dust if she wanted to, and she's older than Equestria, yeah I get that. That's why she and Luna make a much better team. All these "bad endings" come from Celestia just not being able to handle violent threats violently. Nightmare Moon would have handled them violently and prepared the nation to handle them violently. But I'm not confident Nightmare Moon would have the capability to keep up with the day-to-day politics of Equestria as well as Celestia.

[@DinoTamer-22]

Lots of very good arguments. I feel that maybe Celestia has a Superman complex due to her power. The idea that she has to be careful because of how powerful she is which causes her to avoid getting involved or hold back. This could be due to her sending Luna to the moon. That doesn’t mean she’s a good ruler though it just explains why she’s so passive.

[@bezirochepolska1295]

It also explains, why she was always defeated soo easly. She was always afraid to use her 100% of power + she is a bit of tired by taking care of the Sun.

[@zosiakepka1339]

I recommend the widely known Past Sins fanfic which show Nightmare Moon as a ruler

[@Glorymoon97]

Celestia always involved herself politically. Even though there's a crisis, governance still needs to continue. Celestia has a chosen hero to rely on, and part of ruling often times means delegating tasks to others so she can continue holding government together.

[@MMsfuncle]

0:40 “mama there a girl behind you” but like actually what happened. someone please give me the drama

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@MMsfuncle kzbin.info/www/bejne/fWeZiIOMbNeoo5osi=4ZFItwO2-jsQyFMD

[@boredjunior4120]

Search for JoonTheKing's video on her (Lily Orchard)

[@frank_calvert]

actually nightmare moon being her sister is in the initial book sequence, its not first revealed at the end of ep 2

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@@frank_calvert Fair enough.

[@SuperomiNordestino]

Nightmare Moon's government is a dictatorship, that's why things seem to be working out. The only people from Equestria who appeared during that timeline were soldiers, not ordinary civilians.

[@a_chick3n._.]

Tho it is a castle and it wasn't touring hours anymore

[@witherslayer-7315]

6:52 personally, I do not belive this is enough to say that the consequences of eternal night "don't exist". We really have no way of knowing just how long it would take for everything to suffer because of it. Because for example, the ponies do control their part of the world to a degree, with the weather and growth of crops ect. It could be that the abilities of the ponies could be keeping the consequences at bay for a lot longer than they would in the real world. But doesn't exactly prove that these bad things will NEVER happen. (Although to be fair, it is possible that they could find a way to prevent it by that point, but that is not graurenteed. ) Furthermore, there could also already be problems with the environment that we simply aren't seeing. And the focus on the need for there to a day and night cycle (i.e. unicorns literally draining their magic just to raise the sun and moon in the past) lends itself to the idea that it wouldn't be a great idea for Equestria to be left in eternal night. Basically, my point is that there simply isn’t enough information to say definitively that the consequences of eternal night wouldn’t exist in any way or if the magic in the world would just be slowing down the process. That's kinda one of my disappointments with the worldbuilding, actually. I wish we had more info on this stuff since it seems to directly affect the motivations of one of it's villians.

[@Wishtelle]

Someone here noted that the area where twilights castle was has been overrun by the everfree forest, which means it's expanded significantly since her rule.

[@keyboard-smash]

omg fellow Infinite Eclipse discordian here?!?!?!? (I'm Alpha Centauri btw)

[@ronjuskala]

I don't want to anger anyone... But Nightmare Moon sounds a bit like a real-world dictator Stalin. But she would definitely make a strong nation. I think that I will put more of Nightmare Moon to my AU:s Queen Luna...

[@pastorcodymitchell1456]

i just appreiciate that you used stalin

[@Foxy_editzs]

I agree even though princess Celestia has a nice gyat but luna would be a better ruler

[@warwulf1889]

Why would Nightmare Moon try to inspire anyone to grow strong when she clearly wouldn't want anyone rebelling against her.

[@neeneko]

If we are going to draw such a comparison, I would call her closer (within this theory video at least) to Alexander II or Cathrine the Great. Brutal scary, but reform minded with great interest in improving their country and the people within it. Stalin was more focused on personal power and how he was perceived by other national leaders.

[@alanmichelsandoval8768]

Based exclusively on the opening of the first episode, all Luna wanted was to spend time with the other ponies who were sleep during night, thats why she was jealous of celestia, she technically still likes her subjects

[@osmanthuswine5336]

I love how people just explain the plot of the show even tho a non fan wouldn’t even be watching the video

[@Dcyaboi33]

Very solid breakdown on this topic. I can't remember the last time I went into a video essay and was able to follow along easily with the topic I was interested in. I came into this with the bias in Celestia's favor but came out happily convinced I could be wrong in certain aspects. Though when you mentioned Celestia as a "victim of the plot," I agree. Celestia as a character could be very fit to rule. I believe in her position as ruler, she would have to focus, be mature, and not be as foolish as she is made out to be in the show. As a character, she IS competent. As part of the plot, it strips her potential. Great vid bro, and I'm sorry about whatever happened between whomever this other person is you won't mention. I know how that feels 😅

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@Dcyaboi33 oh you misunderstand. They didn't do anything to me personally. They've been outed as a massive predatory weirdo.

[@Dcyaboi33]

​@@ItsOfficiaIyeah that sucks dude fr :/ Btw, I was editing my comment when you responded. Could you give it a quick read? You don't have to respond, I just wanted to give my two cents to the conversation.

[@starchildofthesun]

The one problem I have, is that discord's seeds would have sprouted causing the everfree forest to grow wild and expand throughout Equestria and all the beasts from the forest would have eaten and/or k!lled most of the ponies, and without the elements being returned to the tree of harmony, the forest would stay that way. Meaning the few ponies we see in the castle would probably be ALL of Equestria's citizens. Now, I'm not saying LUNA would have been a bad ruler, just that Nightmare Moon WAS a bad leader.

[@WyvernoftheStars]

I had the same thought. Although it is possible that Nightmare Moon could've destroyed the seeds, the sheer amount of timberwolves and who knows what else we see in the forest could easily pick of the ponies, especially magicless, flightless, earth ponies.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@starchildofthesun What I'm saying is Nightmare Moon definitely would not have just let the seeds grow. As soon as she realized they were a threat she would have handled them. Otherwise I feel like they would have grown over her castle too, and it's weird to assume she would have just thrown up her hooves and let everyone die.

[@starchildofthesun]

@@ItsOfficiaI That's assuming her power can actually defeat discord's power, which is also assuming the seeds are caused by discord's power and aren't their own kind of magic. There's too many unknowns to confirm anything other than the fact the seeds would grow and stay that way without the elements

[@aku2136]

nightmare moon is so cool I wish she had more villain presence when she appeared

[@Pyromic]

You realize royalty is like this irl too, yeah? Theyve got armies for this In Equestria, Twilight and her friends are Celestias favorite knights and the most successful. Of course shed send them on important missions instead of going herself, shes the queen, not the weapon.

[@seraphywang4638]

I think the point still stands that she makes super dumb decisions way too close to deadlines. She sends Discord, a dubiously reformed villain that can immensely help Tirek if he were to turn and then decides to put all her magic into Twilight despite the fact that Discord knows that Twilight is a princess so her excuse that “Tirek doesn’t know that there is a 4th princess” is a terrible excuse. She lost against Chrysalis by being ignorant of Twilight’s feelings and she couldn’t deal with King Sombra herself? A tyrannic threat that we’re explicitly told is super dangerous if unleashed and confirmed to be so in the Cutie Re-Map? She just treats it as an assignment that Twilight has to fix when it’s clear that Twilight wasn’t able to fix it, Equestria would be in civil war.

[@Pyromic]

@seraphywang4638 okay, true, that was a little dumb.

[@hedonismbot1508]

The problem here is that in the Nightmare Moon timeline, we never actually saw what life was like outside the castle - I'm pretty sure Rarity was working for Nightmare Moon in some capacity.

[@siriadias4020]

Maybe i'm seeing this with a fan eyes, Since i love luna/nightmare moon. But she doesn't seem too mad even when someone invades her her castle. As rarity said, it wasnt the time for visits. And nightmare moon just acted against twilight once she hears about the time spell. Maybe if twilight used other words to talk about the spell maybe NM would be willing to help her get back to her timeline

[@dysfallacyyt]

my headcanons are nightmare moon and daybreaker arent evil versions, just powerups, and it just so happens they became evil and used that form to be stronger. celestia’s stronger than luna, celestia is slightly weaker than nightmare moon, daybreaker stronger than nightmare moon

[@cleverfoxseer7023]

Well it not exactly work with Radiant Star and other forms of alicorns.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@dysfallacyyt outside the comics Daybreaker isn't even real. Just a figment of Starlight's imagination. And Celestia is FAR weaker than Moon. It only took one shot for her to decide she needed to use the Elements.

[@XxWindpawxX]

@@ItsOfficiaI I would agree with this if not for the fact that Luna recognizes Daybreaker immediately and outwardly names her without even being told who she is or being explained anything. The fact that she recognizes Daybreaker without any explanation means that that was not the first time Luna had seen her - which means that Celestia has had nightmares about becoming Daybreaker at least once if not more than once before. Even though it may not have been real in a tangible physical sense, it is a very real possibility that Celestia and Luna are both aware of. Just an interesting thing I wanted to point out.

[@asukamiyafuji]

It's like how Momonga/Ainz Ooal Gown from Overlord rules Nazarick and all who he rules over. Regardless if human, undead, or monster.

[@Blizzard_Princess]

OMG YEAH!!! I DIDN'T EVEN THINK OF THIS WHEN WATCHING THE VIDEO! But yeah that really works and might have been how Nightmare moon rules!

[@evym3765]

actually, it's most likely Nightmare moon didn't have to deal with Discord since it was the CMC who freed him by arguing

[@joaolucascastro7936]

Since we already analyzed Nightmare moon's kingdoom, now im really interessed and curious if you maked a "Is Luna a better ruler than Celestia?" Video😅

[@Reputationdino]

I was watching this video, then i was like ooooo luna is literally so pretty, so I went to pintrest and looked at some aesthetic pics of her, then fanart, then other fandoms, then I started reading other fanfiction thats completely unrelated to mlp... so I started watching the video, took a several hour long break, then came back 😭

[@lasercraft32]

I mean in this universe Pegasi move the clouds and make the weather, and Celestia and Luna raise and lower the moon... They make a whole point in the first episode that the reason the Everfree Forest is scary is because it functions on its own without pony interference (you know, like how nature works in the real world). Basically what I'm trying to say is, its not that farfetched to think that plants wouldn't need direct sunlight to survive in this world like they do in real life. Heck they can probably photosynthesize via moonlight or magic or something wacky like that.

[@AngelEmfrbl]

There are timber wolves running amok where they shouldn't. Her kingdom is eternal night. This should be a sign not all is well in her kingdom.

[@cupsofpog4999]

The pathway is also not leading through from the forest, it could be that the actual kingdom is in a different direction.

[@gizmo4192]

The reason it's set in the forest is because that is the location of the original castle of the two sisters@cupsofpog4999

[@professorsassafras]

I also feel like I should play angels advocate and in Celesitia's defense she isn't necessarily a passive ruler per say. She does a lot of work. Basically any part of running a kingdom that doesn't involve defense, or active war level threats celesitia handles essentially not all but alot of the things that can be done with paperwork. Plus even though she has authority to be a princess and do whatever she wants she clearly wants other noble ponies to actually have a say and she tries to make the absolute monarchy as close to democracy as she can. While Luna does a massive amount of kingdom work too that shouldn't be understated in Celesitia's own words "I have to attend decrees and meetings and meetings about decrees and decrees about the meetings". Now celesitia is clearly a flawed ruler and does deserve some blame it's not fair to blame Luna for everything. I'm just saying, Celesitia does actually have a point

[@vaggos2003]

Since we are on the topic of Hasbro properties, what is your relationship with another popular Hasbro IP, an IP with cars, space, different shapes and forms, my favourite fictional character of them all and a recent great beloved animated movie?

[@ldking5132]

Not a fan of MLP. But I enjoy your content. Will drop a like and keep it moving awaiting the next vid. Take care brother

[@vaggos2003]

Based reply. 👍

[@lasercraft32]

Fighting is Magic music... So nostalgic!

[@DoubleGoner]

Woah what was that at the end of the video? Also super interesting video!

[@Leah4Life143]

I think Nightmare Moon would be a good ruler. In my opinion she could definitely be a little stronger than Princess Celestia with her magic and leadership abilities we see in the episode where Nightmare Moon is ruler of Equestria. The main thing to me than that makes her a bit more powerful than Celestia is that since its literally in her name, she'll have the ability to manipulate nightmares in ponies and get inside their heads in the form of the blue smoke whether asleep or awake like an illusionist, kind of like the Freddy Krueger of the pony world. She would in someway break Celestia down in her mind causing her to go insane and overthrow her, which would be tricky since Celestia is said to have strong mind be nonetheless Nightmare Moon would be intelligent enough to plan something that COULD actually succeed.

[@Areyouafraidofthedarkkuk]

In that one scene twilight's acting like nightmare Moon chose her name like I'm pretty sure everyone else named her nightmare Moon , like nightmare Moon did not spawn into the world like I'm going to be a nightmare for everyone. Yay!

[@Razorrrrrrrrrrrr]

19:29 is this au readable anywhere?

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@Razorrrrrrrrrrrr No. But I'm considering putting it into video format as a what if series.

[@poploli2660]

Please do

[@justme._.7923]

YES HIGH QUALITY MLP CONTENT

[@zara98_n12]

She also fights nightmares for ponies to make sure they sleep well. She probably has more fighting skill than celestia. While she's fighting at night for who knows how many ponies to have a good dream. People don't see her nor her own sister appreciating her It's not unreasonable for her to think she can be a better leader who can also protect her people just like protecting them from nightmares every night. And after the nightmare moon phase people start to fear her rather than thank her

[@alireza2847]

Well actually Celestia can to some extent see the future in her dreams, as we saw when Tirek was introduced, so that might be why she entrusted so much on Twilight and her friends

[@Birdsflight44]

Nightmare Moon is a curious topic, because she's the most developed form of corrupted Equestrian Magic in all of G4 media. EqG really expands on the concept, but both it and FiM proper demonstrate the idea that Equestrian magic is inherently corruptive in large doses, unless tempered by friendship and harmony. (Look at Spring Breakdown and how it makes a distinction between Equestrian Magic and "Evil Magic") Nightmare Moon, IMO, represents an interesting idea that Luna (and perhaps some ponies like Stygian) may, indeed, be more closely affiliated with the Darkness than others, and I kinda wonder if she has the capacity to function better than others while under its sway. I liked the theory that the celestial glow surrounding the Moon in the alternative reality meant she was using Celestia to supply some alternative "sunlight" to Equestria, for example. And Rarity's racist dig at dragons was likely a reference to the Winter Moon book, as a conflict between bat ponies and dragons is how Luna got her Royal Guards. That indicates that she did go out of her way even as Nightmare Moon to help the bat ponies, which iirc she hadn't been aware of before modern Equestria. So, compared to many of the lands of this world- like Griffinstone, or the Changelings badlands or the Kludgetown wastelands or the Storm King's empire or the likes, she really doesn't seem like a bad leader. (Most of the world of G4 seems pretty shit ngl) But it is wrong for her to have disrupted Equestria as it was. Now, if Nightmare Moon had made a Moon Colony and accepted citizens on a voluntary basis, this would've been a whole other story... But IMO, my personal hot take is that Celestia isn't actually that great a leader, but that her existence as a benevolent pony who can single handedly can raise the sun is enough to have brought a new era to ponykind. Horse Play explained in no uncertain terms that the natural course of unicorn kind was to eventually use up their magic in some (at least somewhat meaningfully) permanent way, to the point that Equestria was LITERALLY "Running out" of magic users. All Celestia had to do was make unicorns not have to use up magic on the sun and an entire third of the population could then have fine motor skills and wizardry available to bring an age of magic to pony society. ...Which also does imply that, if Nightmare Moon wasn't messing with the celestial bodies, she could potentially have a HUGE amount of magic to use as she pleased, now that I think about it. 🤔

[@ПритонРолевиков]

I love the theory that Celestia actually much more powerful than in the series and she just can’t afford to use her abilities. I mean, if Luna’s “sin” is jealousy, wouldn’t it be poetic if Celestia’s one was hubris. In this case Celestia willingly gives up in the majority of battles in order to prevent losing control over her dark side Daybreaker. This theory also holds up to the point of the older sister being stronger than the younger one, which is a common way of portraying their power levels.

[@StoutShako]

Man, I would love to nerd out about this, but it is fuckin 3 AM and I need to get some shut-eye. I think that there's a lot of things that people are missing, and while I do think it's about time someone gave Luna her powers, I feel like people are way too harsh on Celestia. But I'll get into that once I'm not sleep deprived lmao

[@Cade_Squirrel]

This is a classic case of a free government vs a safe government, Nightmare Moon creates a military state where everypony is a soldier, this makes Equestria alot safer because everypony is ready at a moment's notice to fight to the death, but it's not a free government, Celestia dissolved the Equestrian military because she saw that Equestria's militaristic past was outdated and secondly useless, Nightmare Moon is Luna completely unrestrained, if a threat comes to her kingdom it's very likely she would just kill it.

[@fridriechrussofobber3500]

Is passivity ethically wrong? That is the point from which critique of Celestia must arise I believe. According to some, the maxim always should be to do no evil. To do no harm. Evil may come to the world, but not through you. This is called Solzhenicyn principle and could be, at least to me, viewed as a cowardly way out. Celestia had a thousand years to secure Equestria from any and all threats - and to even expand the kingdom, so no future threats from outside may arise - not including of course unreasonably powerful magical foes. Such expansion can be done very much peacefully, through competent diplomacy and foreign policy. You have much larger sense of the bigger picture in place of an immortal very powerful magical ruler and your plans may transcend generations. But she did not do that. Even against Nightmare Moon, a problem she helped to create and not permanently solve, Celestia instead sent her student on something that may be very well considered a suicide mission. As such, Celestia is immoral, bad ruler, at most managing to keep in peace mostly peaceful realm. More like a technocratic provisional government than an actual policy maker. Her hands-off approach allows various sorts of unnecessary suffering to occur while doing very little with the immense potential of both her realm and her own powers and longevity. As such, it can be argued that if Nightmare Moon recovers from her first episode moustache twisting megalomania at least partly, she would have a very simple job surpassing Celestia in terms of being a good ruler, lacking reluctance to act and personal issues with more iron-hoofed approach.

[@Shashu_the_little_Voidling]

*NLR theme starts playing in the background*

[@HououMinamino]

I'm curious as to whether Nightmare Moon would have ever chosen a successor such as Twilight Sparkle, or just opted to rule forever without ever retiring. Unless it would eventually become necessary to choose a successor. I don't think the show ever mentioned how long alicorns live, if they ever age, if their power ever declines over time, etc.

[@DeliriousDaydreamer]

Every villain until Starlight Glimmer was a threat only because of Celestia in the first place, so not really all that surprising.

[@KidPrarchord95]

i've personally always been a fan of the idea that, while Celestia is indeed powerful, it's a very specific power. Like, someone who has built their body for rock climbing will undoubtedly be strong, but not strong in the right way to be a good boxer. Or, someone who's really good at building computers won't necessarily be good at building a car. Similarly, Celestia utilizes extreme magical power to raise and lower the sun, but when trying to channel her magic into a combat scenario she's nothing special (undoubtedly quite capable, but I doubt she's leagues above her guards) This wouldn't extend to Luna, since she clearly has a lot more practice and desire for combat. Though, its possible that raising these heavenly bodies takes such a toll on both of their "magic reserves" that having to maintain the day cycle seriously nerfs what they're actually capable of

[@hudson963]

when you mentioned how Luna was more hands on something clicked: Celestia is associated with the sun, which is far more distant from the planet. conversely the moon is closer to earth, more involved, has a greater effect (ignoring the cycle of life for a moment)

[@katshaveagun]

I feel like Nightmare Moon as a ruler might seem like a crazy kooky evil one, but i feel like she's actually nice

[@professorsassafras]

While i don't think nightmare moon would be a better ruler i do think Princess luna would be w better ruler. She seems to share celesitia's beliefs in friendship, seems to value culture. However unlike celesitia she seems more balanced. Although she likes friendship she values Self sufficiency and solving problems yourself and would probably promote similar behavior from subjects. Luna is able to take action like nightmare Moon and is also able understand kindness wnd friendship like Celestia. This would never happen. Because Celesitia would never give her full control of the Kingdom but i think Luna has a lot more potential to surpass celesitia and twilight as rulers then nightmare moon

[@rainbowmoon9721]

I fully agree!

[@briarbat]

Personally, I think that it ultimately doesn't matter how well NMM rules because she is inherently putting Equestria at great risk by holding the sun hostage and I think there may be concerning implications for how she deals with the pushback. I don't think its a stretch to believe that the world of Equestria is not so different from our own where the sun is necessary for lots of wildlife and plantlife. Perhaps NMM has found magical means to bypass this on Equestrian soil, but not everyone and everything else on the planet will be so lucky. There is bound to be a major level of resistance from other nations and activists who rightfully want and need the sun back. Considering Equestria is still in one piece in the Princess NMM timeline, It's safe to say that she has had some success in dealing with these obstacles. My concern is how. As you've mentioned, she likely doesn't take the peace and harmony route. I have my doubts that she would simply sit down with all these groups of people and come to a friendly compromise. By holding the sun hostage she is either putting a massive target on Equestria's back and/or dealing with conflict in ways that no leader should. Her spite and selfishness will eventually overshadow her attempts to be better than her sister and it will have grave consequences.

[@ItsOfficiaI]

@briarbat That's fair. As I said this is mostly speculation and it entirely comes down to headcanon what you think would happen.

[@Asgourd2]

Do Discord Eris & Cosmos have nightmare forms?

[@oilking-bo3gt]

I would'nt even say Celestia IS the reason eqastria IS stabel ITS the Mane six Starlight and Spike i kinda mean taht IS the Point of the Show Like The one time Apel Jack and flutershy braught speech to the Keerans Or the time spiek united the changlings and Dragons or The time the Where they defeated Starlight's regime or The time the became Friends with the yaks or wehn twighlight defeated Trixi in Magic Duell

[@PIMKAMINA2]

part of NMM being able to defeat the others is that as NMM she wouldn't be afraid to use more sinister tactics and dark magic to defeat the others. Celestia plays everything straight lace, whose to say NMM didn't face off Queen Chrysalis and cast a disintergration spell to fuck her up completely? Oh the crystal empire returned and Sombra declared war on equestria? Whoops, sorry, now he's been turned into mist, how would you like to be a colonial territory of the glorious kingdom of the moon? tirek is trying to steal all of equestrias magic? all the lunar citizens willingly give their magic to their radiant queen so she can power up to defeat him. NMM is self absorbed and harsh but it seems like above all else she wants to protect her kingdom. after all the thing she originally chased wasn't power, it was adoration, approval, she wanted to be revered and praised, of course she would try to be as fair and leniant as possible with her subjects while maintaining what she saw as necessary law and order to keep the kingdom strong.

[@sillyswrdd]

As celestia’s no1 hater I already believe she would’ve been so tbh

[@АнастасияВасильева-з3ш]

The expansion of the forest led to the destruction of the city. The tree wolves probably destroyed the apple farm economy, as well as damaged the logistics of the pegasus water supply. As they draw water from the lower city district for their city in the clouds. There is no rainbow without the sun, which means that the production at the weather factory should have at least partially changed the direction. Evacuation and restoration of the city near the forest would require large resources from the treasury. The latter never happened, the hometown of several characters is missing. The change in the capital led to a shift in the values of economics and culture - the school of the gifted, which was owned by the last ruler, could either lose its relevance or completely fade into the background. Perhaps there was a purge of nobles loyal to the solar princess and the top of the army. The moon's management shows a cult of personality, an emphasis on the military and security. Remember that it can come into people's minds in a dream. This is a violation of privacy, constant surveillance. Maybe she's trying to create a loyal stratum of the rich top of the army so that the generals do not overthrow her, and therefore allows them liberties in communication. It is not clear whether the forest continues to grow, and whether the ruler somehow prevents this. It is not clear where the population of the regions destroyed by the forest has gone. It is not clear what the life of an average citizen looks like. So far, it resembles North Korea. I love this character. I really do. But it is impossible not to worry about the mental state of the princess, her ability to delegate power. Security is cool. And you know what else is cool. Vitamin D. Do not die when winter comes and in the absence of the sun the snow will not melt. To know that your house will not be destroyed by wolves and living trees. To have the freedom of speech to talk about past rulers and say anything. By the way, the fact that she forbids talking about her sister may have consequences like censorship in the media and changing historical facts. I want to be able to refuse to serve in the army. To be able to distinguish calendar days and not be afraid that if your watch stops working, you won't know the time. The devastating potential for privacy violations if the princess continues to visit her subjects in her sleep is terrible in this universe, because she can fuel her paranoia and look for people who remember her sister and kill them. It's more than cameras on every corner, it's a judgment on thoughts that you don't control.

[@Kuromi_besties]

Ngl it would’ve been nice to see lunar in celest’s body

[@Minecraftgamer101-p8w]

nightmare moon is so smart

[@ClashBluelight]

I feel like Nightmare Moon would be something of a strong nationalist, populist figure. There's nothing she wants more than for the people to adore her, and to be left alone by outsiders. So I think Equestria under her rule would become isolationist and would focus on self improvement as much as possible. Think of a situation similar to the United States prior to world war 1, or Japan prior to the second. Strong militaries, secure borders, limited import, massive export, and an extremely strong national identity. They would be seen as fringe extremists by the rest of the world, and would miss out on new developments, but ponies in the distant future would probably long for the days of Nightmare Moon's rule when looking back, even if they don't know exactly what that means. This type of situation would also explain the relative peace we see despite the several supervillains running around. None of them are willing to attack Equestria while it's an isolationist military state.

[@simplegeneral5688]

if you asked me if I would rather serve a goddess philosopher or a goddess protector, I would choose the protector a 100/100 times. Imo, tyranny is preferable to a leader who will let my country desintegrate to extinction of civilization as I know. Its why I would rather serve Daybreaker than Celestia. Some would say tyranny foosters corruption, but a hands off approach does the same, if Nightmare Moon's rule is corrupt and unequal, so is Celestia's, two sides of the same coin, just one protects her nation, the other canonically could barely do it.

[@pazacevedo7396]

I remember years ago loving art for the “New Lunar Republic” in a sort of parody of politics for the MLP:FIM world. Now I feel vindicated on the fact that Luna/Nightmare Moon is more politically competent lmao

[@alanmichelsandoval8768]

Wouldnt it be cool if there were an episode with a fringe group of conspiracy theorists ponies that want nightmare moon to be the ruler. With some dumb signs that say "nightmare moon was right" and stuff