Is Rocket League a Tier 1 Esport?

[@captaiawesome2260]

Rocket League definitely feels the most like a real sport. All of the FPS competitive games feel more like military simulations. I really wish the event organizers would actually advertise the brackets a bit more though. I was getting into the World Championship, but I had a really hard time knowing who was playing and when. If didn’t notice the !bracket command in Twitch, I would have no idea who is playing and when.

[@R_Stolp]

Kinda agree with your feedback, but how should they make the bracket more obvious? In the preshow they completely go through the bracket. And even if you missed that they show the bracket and planning and go through it between every series. And show the planning for the next days when games get known. So how do you think they could improve? Liquipedia is a seperate thing not with psyonix so i dont know if they can just put that on stream all the time.(?)

[@Heatwave9000]

​@@R_StolpThey need to fix their own website, we shouldn't have to rely on third party sites like liquipedia to check brackets.

[@Rwstahl12]

Liquidpedia

[@esgreen8612]

@@Rwstahl12this ^

[@chrundlethegreat2251]

Another thing that makes it the game that's by far the closest to a real sport is the way the skill ceiling keeps being raised even though the game is almost exactly the same. It's exactly what happens in real sport: more investment floods in making it more viable to pursue as a career from an early age, you get to dedicate everything to improving and records just keep getting broken. NO OTHER GAME DOES THIS. They need updates, patches and new mechanics to push the game forward, while we just need insane talent and opportunity.

[@JusticeExplorer]

The thing about Rocket League is that it never really exploded, it's a slow growing game but has an extremely consistent fanbase. The bad thing with things that explode in popularity is that they come down in around the same amount of time, and Rocket League doesn't have that. Which is why I believe that far in the future, yes, Rocket League will become a consistent tier 1 esport, I mean the game hasn't even been out for 7 years or so and it's still still growing, so just let the eSports scene cook. It isn't a tier 1 esport, it has the potential of one.

[@everjan66]

@@Heatwave9000have you heard of football?

[@Brockfiree]

@@Heatwave9000 hey, a quick tip for you: watch the other esports and tell me if is not an "outscore your opponent" situation...

[@its.tranquility.]

@@Heatwave9000 smh this guy

[@KirbyRL]

esports in rocket league keeps growing, every worlds it has more and more watching

[@Heatwave9000]

@@Brockfiree Don't act like a smartass. I'm still waiting for rocket league to hit the numbers it actually needs to be a tier 1 esport. Heard it has potential for years and yet its still no where close. RL is literally the exact same game every series. Nothing changes.

[@mathewpowers5]

I'm almost 100% like you Sun. I'm a sports fan that found RL/RLCS and loved it because it's like a sport. Love the whole scene, the players, the stories -- and ppl like you. I'm all in.

[@Average-Lizard]

Agreed about production value and storylines! This worlds was a masterpiece as far as esports events go - definitely loved it. I've watched LOL worlds and CSGO majors for much longer than I've watched big RL events, and yes the viewership and player counts are obviously higher for them, but this Worlds outperformed LOL worlds in production quality and storylines. I was very impressed as a viewer at the compelling games and storylines. LOL has the quality of gameplay and production value to beat out RL no doubt, but they just fail to cultivate/market their talent, players, scene, and stories the way RL does. Well done RL esports this season!

[@patricklloyd1261]

agreed about lol but cs is still the king of production in esports

[@crows8107]

You kind of have to have at least a basic understanding of how LOL works and what different champions do to be able to enjoy watching the gameplay though. Like as someone who's never played DOTA or League, I have absolutely 0 clue what I'm looking at if I see clips or tune into a stream. Rocket League is similar enough to real sports that most people would be able to understand the point of the game within seconds of tuning in, even if they've never played it before so I feel like that's a big factor in the growth the esport is seeing

[@Average-Lizard]

@@crows8107 I agree that RL is more intuitive, no doubt, but it seems like esports audiences are composed more of a subset of the games player base than from the general population or even esports/gaming populations in general. So while I hope RL esports grows, the numbers tend to show the only way that will happen is if RL player base grows. I don’t see a correlation between Top esports viewership/popularity and ease of understanding for viewers.

[@Average-Lizard]

I agree with all of your points about understanding the game for sure, but I guess I'm not convinced that non-rocket league players are watching rocket league esports. I could be wrong though - maybe I'm missing something.@@crows8107

[@SiddarthaTB]

Bro is capping. LOL Worlds 2023 didn't even happen when you commented and the storyline this year was one of the best.

[@jerry3790]

The thing about rocket league esports is that because it’s such a different game there isn’t as much overlap between “tier 1” esports fans and rocket league

[@DaTimmeh]

Now I’m actually really curious what the viewer overlap between different esports looks like.

[@JusticeExplorer]

I think RL borders tier 1 and 2, doesn't really fit in either, but something in between.

[@theowijnen6893]

Rocket League esports might get a big boost once the UE 5 version or whatever psyonix is working on releases. The same happend with the free to play update where the viewership got bumped up because of all the new players trying out the game. The reason the other games are "tier 1" esports is because they just have a larger player base and can convert that to esports fans.

[@cmdrfunk]

Those new players tried out the game and then rejected it. Same thing will happen with UE5 if things like the smurf issue aren't resolved, which it won't be.

[@BradenChristensen]

@@cmdrfunkthe funny thing is it is SO easy to fix that, and I don’t see why Psyonix doesn’t do anything about it

[@HolyDiverBronco]

Well, in my lifetime and I am 63..........RL is without a doubt, the best game i have ever played.....I love the competition, every damn game.........

[@RC-zb8tl]

Right on dude

[@tossos]

Personally and respectfully, I don’t see why I should really root for an Org per se, like let’s say it’s your Org, I wish you well, but i’m not as heavily invested like i’m invested in the storylines and players. My two cents, cause I hear your point about the Orgs, what can Orgs bring to the fans in a direct way that actually increases emotional investment? Obviously we appreciate the Orgs, making pretty much everything possible in the first place, especially knowing that it’s such a difficult business to sustain and grow. That said I can’t see myself caring for, let’s just pick Vitality here, - caring to be a Vitality fan if in honesty I just enjoy the exact dynamic of those specific three players have at the current point in time. That’s coming from somebody that also never really picked a favorite team in IRL sports. I just don’t see the point, it’s like being loyal to a brand, which in itself is a weird dynamic, but on top of it the product of that brand can change at any moment. This is meant as an insight into one fan voice, no shade. With so many young players, roster changes and many more teams competing, I really don’t see a way to become a bigger Org fan in the current „meta“ of the eSport. I find this exact topic very interesting, but I guess there is no correct answer to this since fandom in itself is kinda irrational and lead by passion and fun. edit: a big difference to IRL sports is something like having a local team and basically having your community of fans that you can be a part of every game day ON location. I will probably never visit a Lan and the majority of fans will never do that (that’s just math lol). Watching rocket league, although sad as it sounds, is such a solitary experience for me as a viewer and I think many can relate on that.

[@Issi0]

You don’t have to root for an Org, that is actually the beauty of Rocket League. Just the same as in Football⚽️ you have neutral or impartial spectator. How Rocket League Esports is showcased. And how beautiful the players play you can just be a neutral watcher and enjoy it. But even then when you do choose a org to support, it brings you closer to it and you actually get thrilled if they win. And upset if they lose. Exactly the same as Football. And no other game has that. Except fps battle royale games but that doesn’t count in what I’m reffering to.

[@tossos]

@@Issi0 Yes I agree, I love being a neutral watcher, but I also do root for certain teams and people, that’s the fun. In the end I’m always happy with the games and winners! :) that comment was more targeted at Sunless, since it was a comment of his and he has an Org and maybe it could be in some way interesting or helpful hearing from eSport fans about this :)

[@Issi0]

I see your edited version and I completely agree if ur referring to the lack of interaction or social engagement while watching the game. I hope that one day Rocket League will change something in the live events that would make a huge impact on the world. Or even in the live streams when Esports is show casing. They should interact more with the fans or atleast do something cause watching RL Esports is really lonely and makes it eventually boring.

[@Issi0]

@@tossos yeh but you were definitely right. But based my 2nd reply to you I also want to add, imagine Rocket League would be so big. That fans actually come together to watch it. Just like irl games.

[@Zzzeloin]

i consider it a tier 1 esport. rocket league isnt even my main game and i play it occasionally only but watching RLCS is so freaking hype! I tried watching other stuff like valorant but cant get the same hype and cant tolerate how long the games can be, not saying that valorant esports is bad but rocket league is, in my opinion, more hype. From the casters to the music used to introduce players to stax giving us all goosebumps before starting the game, its perfect.

[@Heatwave9000]

Its just not a tier 1 esport by any means though objectively

[@Xerinity]

@@Heatwave9000 VALORANT shouldn't be.

[@nathanielmills2081]

@Xernity in three years valorant has got more viewers that rocket league has in 6 years.

[@dukcy7450]

@@Xerinityit should. Any of riots competitive titles are going to be tier one, simply because what makes them the forefront of the scene in terms of an esports governing body is the scale that riot operates. Many star players in lol and valorant make exceptional salaries for playing riot titles, compared to other esport leagues

[@perezthereza33]

@@nathanielmills2081 I mean its riot games

[@TocoaPuffs]

I watched RLCS religiously for about 2 years. Then they introduced the multi-stream tournaments and I noped out entirely. I used to be able to watch every game every weekend and it was a lot of time, but I could get all of the games from the RLCS tournaments. Or I could catch up during the week if I couldn't get to it over the weekend. Once they had every team play all day for two days, there was just too much content. I couldn't keep up and didn't see a point in trying. I then just never got back into it, and that was probably 2021. You're absolutely right with there being too much content. I like that they're expanding, but I can't learn all the players and get all the references if it requires me to have 4 streams running for 2 days straight to get most of what happened.

[@Drrobverjones]

I got into Rocket league because of Johnniboi 1v1 show matches back in 2017-2018. I watched a bunch of them. Then I started playing last year. And I finally watched my first rlcs in the na spring invitational. It was so cool. I have watched at least a little of each event since. It's been a lot of fun.

[@meetra5073]

1:00 that was around the time technoblade blew up iirc because of keemstar's minecraft monday tournaments, and techno himself was getting a minimum 50k viewers from the first tourney, let alone in the later ones he was getting a couple hundred thousand (sometimes up to 500k or more iirc). Then some other tournaments like minecraft ultimate and minecraft championships came up where techno's vods would get millions of views after getting hundreds of thousands live. Dream and other top tier MC youtubers/streamers would compete also and bring some more 10k+ viewership numbers.

[@mdogg95]

Definitely not tier 1. Definitely don't care either way. I love RL Esports and the community behind it, and I will continue to be a fan and support it as long as I can.

[@isaakvandaalen3899]

I agree that it's not a Tier 1 eSport but I also enjoy watching RLCS more than literally any other eSport. It definitely has the potential to be Tier 1 it just needs to capture the right audience, as it grows more, more people will hear about it and be drawn in. Like you said it takes time.

[@w.bi11y]

They need to do better at advertising events. Maybe implement a tab in the game so you can check out when upcoming matches are or even a more interesting way to view teams and their standings. If they make it easy to follow, people will follow

[@cedrica3007]

The fanbase isn't big enough because south korea and china are not part of the Rocket League esport. Those two countries along could bring a massive fan base. Ohterwise Rocket League has everything, just not a big enough fan base world wide.

[@imthejaeger9593]

I don’t think ppl will ever choose team over players cus that’s where it differs from irl sports like the only way someone likes ur team is cause of the players or a fan of the team from a different esport. At least I don’t think it would change until situations like the same players for one team in a year could all be the same players for another team the next. Players feel more permanent than teams ig

[@Mark_Grand]

A psychological reason for this in my mind, is most irl teams have 10+ people. Basketball, football, soccer, you have a lot more players and if one of them switch teams it’s not as significant. In RL there are 3 players. That’s it. It’s a HUGE deal when your fav player switches teams, and when the team stay together the way NRG did for so long, you find a lot of people happy to support a team Iike that, but partially because it’s been the same 3 players season after season.

[@Drrobverjones]

I agree. The other reason players choose teams irl is because of location often. I rooted for teams in my home state because they were from my state. We have regions in rocket league, but if it is advertised it isn't well known where these teams reside if that even makes sense for an online game.

[@joshbangert]

this second channel is probably the smartest thing youve ever made sunless

[@CooIGamerz]

As a minecraft esports player, I am offended

[@RaGe0rge]

That's such an interesting point about being fans of an organization vs fans of a player. You see it in traditional sports, die-hard franchise fans for decades. But you also have fans who follow a specific player to whatever team they are on. I was always an oKhaliD fan, but now he's not on Falcons anymore, so I'm not as invested in them. I'm a huge RW9 fan, but it's also fun being a Rule 1 fan because of the MENA storyline, the twins and the hype and exposure you bring to the team.

[@msaocer]

Rlcs' problem is that their viewership is limited by Rocket league's player count. Maybe a UE5 update would help with that

[@manuelbonelli3690]

The fact is that RL is really a unique game. The only one like this. It's one of those games that you either love or hate, no in between. While it's true that his simplicity allows viewers to understand what is going on in esports game compared to other games like LoL (where you need to know how the game works and all the details), it's also true that as a game it is destined to be less popular than any fps game. Fps are probably the most popular genre ever since old consoles with the old Cod's. And since they all work around the same mechanic at the end of the day it doesn't make much difference if you switch from watching CS to R6 or valorant. The main basics things are the same, kill and don't get killed. So it's also easy for those type of games to increase the views. Valorant is a perfect example, it's a 2 year game and has a way bigger viewership than RL just because people were already used to similar formulas (in particular CS) and didn't have to adapt to the game. RL main strenght it's also his main problem

[@eddie2sweaty]

I've been keeping an eye on upcoming events and I noticed they haven't added any that go past the end of October (with the exception of a single D tier event). Was speculating that perhaps Epic plans on releasing the UE5 update before they schedule anything else.

[@warlock_r]

Sometimes, I even wonder if they even have anything tangible. Otherwise they would have released a trailer or a teaser at least.

[@swagie_]

if you've been checking through liquipedia it's normal that you don't see anything planned. they can't just guess when the regionals will be. they're also not affiliated with psyonix

[@thund3r94]

Imo rocket league is the hardest to get good at from others, cause no other game translates to it, majority of big games are shooters and if your good at one shooter you’ll be pretty good instantly with any other shooter that and the crowd and now how the season is formatted I think once the prize pool is slightly bigger it will be a tier one esport

[@Issi0]

Yep Rocket league is the most hardest and then I rank Fifa. I played hundreds of games and these are my experiences

[@Jackheartskateboards]

Def agree with your whole perspective. The only things I couldnt keep out of my mind primarily were the modern Super Smash Bros Melee community and also the avid fans and players of StreetFighter. Those are definitely, in my eyes, on the same overall "level" as RocketLeague, and if you look at the fan bases of those games and especially the Pro Players themselves, you'll see a lot of similarities; which I think put RL and those other games I mentioned in an Esport tierlist of their own. Maybe Tier 1, but Tier 1 in a more underground, hardcore, raw Esport list/sub-category/genre/culture in which the games that have been officially deemed the current Tier 1 esports will never be able to embody, emulate, or gain access to. With all that being said, it doesn't matter at all and my brother and I sweat our asses off right next to eachother while he plays SSBM and I play RL, both of us ethernetted tf up while also watching and enjoying some of the most intense Pro RocketLeague matches streamed live as well as the most insane SSBM legendary matchups of all time made possible by the relatively new implementation of Rollback Netcode allowing Melee to function online and somewhat revive the Esport despite Nintendo's efforts to stop it. Went off on a bit of a tangent at the end, but anyways, huge fan of you Sunless, always have been!

[@patrickftw8464]

I'm a huge fan of rocket league, and also a fan of fps esports. I also love CoD esports, but a lot of people write that off compared to stuff like CSGO, which I also like to watch. I've always thought RL would be the best esport eventually, but it took me a bit to start getting invested into it. If the RLCS could somehow get more people invested in the players themselves, I could see it blowing up much more. CoD is that way for me, there's certain players and teams I love watching because of the storylines/rivalries. I get more hype for them than some real sports now lol. Granted there's been a lot more time for the CoD scene to develop those storylines. Players like Scump have been around since mw2-3 lol. I know they exist in RL too, and it's starting to get much better in that regard, but I think as more players become well known, and the storylines start writing themselves, it'll only get better. The game itself is perfect for esports imo

[@Bvroegs]

i like this channel better than main, thank you sunless

[@zephpark]

MoreSunless is my fav because it's a lot more of just you being you. You do these big productions on the main channel which I also love but I feel like watching these videos I'm getting to know you on a deeper level and that has so much value.

[@simonklunder904]

Sunless, every single video you make doesnt fail to give me chills. its so amazing. Thank you!

[@jiraiya2000]

in the case of rocket league i think the mechanical meta is headed in the right direction which is the heart and soul of any esport and the presentation and storyline are passionnate and relatable which is 2nd to me in importance . the only thing lacking are franchise level and skilled coaches and coaching staff that will carry the majority of organizational responsibility. they will come from the crl in my mind because the role is more important in the crl.

[@stefanheinze-milne7040]

Really well said, Sunless. I like your perspective on the time it takes to grow a base and your optimism.

[@GooberLeague]

another interesting question is when the heck is Rocket League moving to UE5?

[@Shwiggity_shwagg]

You're exactly right about having good storylines. As someone who's been playing for 7 years, I obviously have some favorite players and teams but I have such a massive appreciation for this game so I just love watching good rocket league. I'm not necessarily a "Vitality" fan but watching them sweep the whole EU region and eventually take worlds truly felt like a once in a life time event that was so cool to see. And this game only gets better and better every season and I can't wait to see where it goes from here. ❤ I love your videos sunless! Thanks for always delivering great content! 🙏

[@chrundlethegreat2251]

The best part of Zen being a CLEAR no1 is that we can anticipate an extremely polarizing event if he ever gets knocked off the top spot, or it's going to be so clear and decisive that it ignites the fanbase again. I'm pretty sure there are dozens of pros wanting to be the one to knock him off the top spot and I can't wait to see the ceiling being pushed even further.

[@w.bi11y]

You should watch the highlights of vitality's match against Rule one at gamers8. It was unreal

[@chrundlethegreat2251]

@@w.bi11y Oh I did...and the Sunless vid as well. Waiting for their doc to release. I think it perfectly shows the power of investment in this SPORT. That event was NUTS!

[@Dante-nu5cn]

I think it's really interesting what you said in the end of the video. For me, any sport is interesting as long as you're rooting for someone. In the olympics, I even watched the skating events because my country was competing in it, and I have absolutely no interest in skating. I hope we start to grow this team allegiance because imo it makes us more passionate about the sport in general.

[@Hangiinjohnny]

Worlds was the first event I watched and it was awesome

[@chrisc_1012]

Seeing Rocket League's Grim Reaper goal explosion on actual BBC Sport during the pandemic was… an experience

[@danielspillane2506]

I think a big factor is that this game is mainly played by kids. I’d love to see some of the older ex pros still playing, sure they can’t compete with the younger players a lot of the time, but that’s why an overage league would also be a great thing to see. There would be the main rlcs tournaments which anyone can be a part of and then an over 25s or something where it will be the players who have slowed down a little, you can only be registered for one bracket at a time. So you could still have someone like monkey moon playing rlcs, but then also have someone else like leth just playing in the over 25s. Now the reason I think this would make a difference. I am 34 and love to play rocket league, I played rl at launch and played for a couple of years. I ended up moving to Australia to do a bit of travel and have since settled over here, I started playing rl again and I got semi serious about it and considered trying to get good enough to get ssl. I was grinding pretty hard tbh. I hadn’t ever really watched rlcs until a few months ago, I think Boston was the first event I watched actually, but I did know it existed. I always had this thought in the back of my head about how amazing a life it would be to play rl professionally, even if that was incredibly unlikely, but still none the less it was a cool possibility, until I started watching rlcs and realising how I’m already well over the hill to being a rl pro. While that hasn’t changed my love of the game too much, it has stopped me being serious about playing, I play for fun, but the grind is over. Think of all the older men that play golf, they play golf because that’s a sport that they still have opportunity to become one of the best, age isn’t really a factor for pro golfers. Anyway, rant over. Thanks for the video as always sunless, I’d love to hear your thoughts on this.

[@cmdrfunk]

Cheering on rocket league pros is like cheering on the little league world series. You might watch a short highlights thing about it on ESPN8 but are you really a fan? Nope. They're kids.

[@jmm00702]

age isnt a factor either in most videogames, much less rocket league which isnt as reaction and eyesight dependant as stuff like FPSs lol, thats a huge fallacy that keeps getting thrown around on esports as a whole, which is way too young of a concept and still isnt taken as seriously worldwide to be kept as a long-term profession, plus most scenes have just died after a couple decades, before even getting to a point of an "established meta" like sports are nowadays, thus in esports younger generations get massive headstarts because they enter competition with exponentially more tools and knowledge available than whatever the generation before them had, as that gen before usually is a first-gen of the game, from a time where the meta was in its infancy. The main factor is time, the game requires insane mechanical grind and constant upkeep to not drop that skill off once youre at a high level, and thats way easier to do as a kid with more free time. Kids also make better use of that time because of naturally more malleable brains that will learn faster, making their grind time more efficient, and thats where the more-widespread-knowledge headstart factor kicks in, but thats not a headstart that stays around forever, if a videogame actually lived 50+ years to actually slow down meta development the headstart would barely be any different from the headstart the previous gen had in their younger days, and also its not like you cant make up for the difference with just more grind time. You talked about how age isnt a factor for pro golfers but im telling you, even if age isnt much of a factor when golfing, it is way more than what it is in rocket league, as it has actual physical requirements. Mental speed decline isnt as much of a thing as gamers think it is (eyesight can be in FPSs, but nothing that glasses/surgery cant repair), you wont really be affected by it unless youre permanently slowing your brain on purpose with drug/susbtance abuse ofc. Theres a reason pro tennis and football players on healthy diets are keeping top form and dominating their competition into their late 30s-early 40s and retire by that age due to physical issues rather than mental slowness, yet tennis requires way faster reaction speed and hand eye coordination than most videogames. Also many 1v1 (where having to live under a louse org paycheck isnt an issue) long-lived esports like fighting games (very fast reaction time reqs) and RTS (one of the most intense high apm-requiring genres), the same pros from 20+ years ago keep dominating tournaments while being near or into their 40s, while grinding way less than they used to as they have families and responsibilities to attend to etc: the slight speed loss can be completely made up by experience. Many older esports with insane skill caps like the grandfather of esports, Quake, even died off due to just being too hard for anyone new to even get motivated to compete as every lobby was full of people with 15+ years of experience that just meant you werent even gonna move 1m from spawn (mark my words, this can become an issue in rocket league's future too) No quake pro ever fell off the 1v1 scene, there still is no way to get them off the throne to the point it went the other way than it did for you: demotivates the new younger gens making the game eventually die. Mind you quake is a shooter, one of the genres where mental age should have the strongest effect, and guess what, the current rank one in the "modern" quake (Quake Champions) is no other than rapha, who has been playing for an eternity in older quake games now and is your exact same age... K1llsen, another oldschooler that still plays a bit is also hovering around there, currently 6th but has hovered up to 2nd, and he's 2 years older than you. Rocket league will be no different, the game is just currently too young. But once the mechanical development starts nearing its human limits, like if now it were to start slowing down, zen will be right there 20 years from now, still dominating everyone, as long as he still enjoys the game. This game is also learnable at any age too btw, as long as youve got the mindset for it, the brain is completely malleable, you just gotta train it just like you would any muscle, learn how to learn, and actively learning new info will actually bring health benefits that will potentially avoid a mental diseases like Alzheimers further down the line. I made a point on this during the pandemic, as a 30 y.o that had never touched rocket league (though i have competed in relatively high levels in many sports and games + chess in the past, but the closest that had transferable knowledge into RL was irl football lol, theres not many things similar to this game), some friends introduced me to the game in a couch session while drunk at some party. The best one there was like gold, he kept shittalking us for fucking everything up ofc, and we had a blast. I told em i was gonna get the game and git gud coz it actually seemed like a high quality competitive - highly skill capped game, something i hadnt seen much of since the quake days (and ive played most of the "s-tier" esports at high elos and many below too, mind you). I bought the game in the nintendo switch to try it out casually first but quickly forgot about it. However the f2p wave came in a bit later and i remembered like hey i was gonna grind this to destroy my friends next time. Started playing and got instantly hooked. I put all the newly found pandemic freetime hours in, studied the ins and outs of the game, went for crazy mechanical grind sprees that no youtuber "coach" recommended for what was my level at the time (I didnt hire any coaching sessions, but most of the free access advice available was garbage imo, and its probably again because the scene is too young to know what proper coaching in this game will be). In under a year i got to GC, completely soloq, and thats with a VERY demanding full time job (12 hour days were and still are commonplace) and a wife (no kids though, that combined with the pandemic helped a ton on the time requirement factor), and as a 30 y.o, so no "fast learner coz young" advantage or anything. I slowed down the grind after gc because the pandemic slowed down and had to use my time in more job affairs again, but kept playing some ranked seasons when i felt like it (and get easily back to gc1-2 for rewards in 2s at least, with a couple games of regaining the decayed elo for skipping seasons), and I kept grinding mechs for fun in freeplay, playing some hoops (also got to gc there, also soloq, while playing in 180 ping servers coz theres just no lobbies in mine at that elo), and im now doing consistent triple resets double mustys and even niche freestyle stuff like fetelix jumps in cas/freeplay as my chill alone time, while being like 32, and people say players lose their mechs as they get older lol 🤔, however it is true that with the current state of esports there still wont be much interest to stay in the scene long instead of moving into content creation or something. I wouldnt willingly stay in something that wont pay the bills and doesnt build up a curriculum, while having the much better job (though exploitative, but pays good) i have access to at this age. So yeah counter rant over, older players just stop putting the time or get too comfortable on their outdated muscle memory and dont wanna change it because too much effort+lost hours (example the ridiculous amount of old pros that still dont use directional airrolls thus stay stuck on shitty mechs. I straight up unbound normal airroll mid grind and started using both ARL and ARR, yes it will drop your rank for a while, itll be frustrating and make you wanna switch back for months, but in the long run youll start liking it and itll allow you to keep pushing, and goind through these bumps is the only way to not stagnate your progress). PD: there are some senior leagues on games like csgo, but those make sense for actual seniors, the oldest champ won one of those tournaments at 78 y.o in 2019. Keep in mind these are dudes born in the 1940s, games didnt even exist so they have no gamer background or experience advantage like we will in our 70s, but still, at that age reaction time does slow down enough for a separate league to make sense, specially in a shooter like csgo, but in games like RL where reaction time brings very limited advantages, im curious to see how our generations of kids born gaming from a young age will fare in their senior years.

[@samstrong8527]

WHEN CAN WE BUY THE RULE ONE DECAL IN THE ITEM SHOP!?

[@fl4shyb013]

Rocket Leagues problem when it comes to popularity in my head comes from the nature of it, most of the other esports are shooters and strategy games which there are many of and you can carry your skills over to other games, good for both casual gaming and long term. Rocket League however you can play can play casually but there are no other games like it and you cant carry over your skill, the only way to improve is to play long term, which for me is why I love the game, training everyday getting better and better, scoring your first flip resets, your first ceiling shots or just being an all round better player and winning matches is very satisfying. Shooters are faster for getting satisfaction where in Rocket League you must work for it.

[@tjhf]

I'm a psychic. I clicked on 20 seconds after it was posted with no notifications.

[@Singingschizophrenic]

I don't get notifications.

[@jorgen8068]

My parents don’t love me

[@teyleen]

The fact that the meta of rocket league is not designed by a team of developers but instead the curiosity and skill of the players is something that advertisers will start to pick up on. If you were a huge rocket league fan when it came out in 2015 but you went into a coma and were just coming back the game you would not have to learn anything new. Fortnite, Valorant, pubg, LoL, etc, they all require a full team of people in a perpetual state of whack a mole nerfing, buffing, adding and removing things not necessarily to make it better but more often than not to try to make it interesting again. So players strategies and skills must constantly change and evolve in accordance to what the devs do to the game. Rocket League is the only esport that is a set system. I think of playing rocket league a lot like playing the piano and other games are a 7 key kalimba but one of the keys lights up when you press it - and like you can play some cool stuff on a 7 key kalimba but it’s not a piano. I grew up flying model planes and playing rocket league is also so similar to learning how to fly a drone or plane You can argue CS GO is very balanced and a set system as well but then we get into rocket league’s other unique advantage - it is the only game that can claim to be an esport that does not revolve around killing other players. I think this opens up rocket league to an entire universe of advertising/partnership potential that other games won’t be able to compete with. Finally, I think we get lost in what psyonix has created when we focus only on the soccer part of soccar Because the car is everything, we need more pure competition with these incredible vehicles. A new ball or power up based play is not right. Bringing racing to rocket league as another arena to test players ability to control their cars makes so much sense. And It’s also wild that there really is no racing esport scene and rocket league has the potential to step in in a big way.

[@KirbyRL]

Im seeing more and more people out of no where play the game, and with viewership growing the game is fine whether it becomes "T1" or not as it has a solid fanbase that wont let go of the game similar to how smash is but at a much larger scale.

[@zeropanda4806]

That is a point I have, I want to decide on a team, but I dont want to select a team based off the player/players playing there ,but to be a fan of the actual team, but I dont know what to look for in teams from the perspective???

[@Drrobverjones]

The difficulty is that teams irl for sports are often location based. I root for x team because I live there ect. Rocket league has regions, but beyond that, there isn't like a home stadium.

[@zeropanda4806]

@@Drrobverjones exactly, the reason I support my favourite soccer team is because of my dad, or basketball team because it is near where I live. but rocket is very broad. hard to pinpoint a reason to decide a lifetime team.

[@Drrobverjones]

@@zeropanda4806 yeah. I vote for GenG, but that is mostly because of the story of their team, and that they took Chronic on when no one would and Chronic deserved it for years. But, once again that is the players more than the team. I don't know what to look for in a team.

[@vyrm1391]

Bro seeing leth sitting inside the rlcs arena just brings me back man, I want him back in it.

[@Boukevx]

I really believe we need to create a way to promote offline local tournaments somehow. Trying to create competition at schools and colleges to embrace Rocket League as the esport to play. The power of LAN, emotion and competitiveness need to be created on a much larger scale than just the pro's and top level players. We could do it online as well but there should be a solid physical reward to compete in the tournaments. If this becomes accessible I really believe we could level up the esport two years later or something.

[@iSys31]

I know it's out of topic but I just wanted to wish a good luck to your team tomorrow. As a Vita fan, I hope this revenge will be as incredible than the last match in Boston. Your players are at home, they have to give it all 💪💥

[@thund3r94]

Honestly I want rule 1 to win just so it’s not a boring predicable winner of the lan lol

[@notheories9012]

I'm glad you came in saying this is a stupid debate. It's so freaking dumb! Firstly, it's a pointless conversation. Secondly, even if you buy into it the conversation isn't comparing apples with apples. Like the games with the highest viewership all appeal to a Chinese audience to get the massive audiences. Rocket League (and some other games) isn't even available in China. Beyond Rocket League there are some games that are huge in specific countries but they're not as accessible elsewhere. Does that make them "low tier" because the game isn't available in other regions...? Regardless, Rocket League is obviously just better anyway ;)

[@Pytahh]

Can you make a video of you just laughing- I love it ❤ 😅

[@jennyridge2046]

Where's the rule one decal at sunless

[@Sploooshen]

like 2 monthes

[@havingfun8192]

Sunless you must be ecstatic right now Rule One beat Vitality in an amazing 4 games to 0 sweep at Great 8 and sent them home. Congrats and I hope Rule One wins it all.

[@yesssirr1424]

I think people enjoy watching 3v3 but like gamers 8 I think they should implement 2s and 1v1

[@jayjay1drum1skate]

I think in the future they will be able to have the pitch in the middle of the arena using hologram technology. Viewed a bit like the show “robot wars” and it will be immediate tier 1 e sport and viewed by all sorts around the world. I think that could even take it to the olympics.

[@w.bi11y]

That would be bonkers

[@timbabwe7450]

WOAH

[@glizzardo2692]

So just my 2 cents, as far as people being fans of the org instead of individual players, take a look at what other pro sports teams do. First, they associate themselves with a specific geographical region. Second, they have pretty generic but relatable mascots. Third, they have great marketing/merch/advertising/sponsorships. And last, they win. Just look at the Dallas cowboys. Even though they haven’t won since the 90s, they have one of the largest fanbases of the NFL. A big part of that was that they *were* a dynasty at one point, but what has kept them on top is without a doubt is their brand. Dallas is an iconic Texas city, cowboys are an iconically Texas thing, and the logo is the iconic Texas lone star. So even though they haven’t won much in thirty years, their brand represents and invokes something in people that is incredibly relatable, that even the average person who doesn’t even watch football can connect with. I love rule 1 as a name, but if you are an outsider who knows nothing about rocket league, you probably won’t understand what a rule 1 is. I think it’s absolutely a better than vitality or nrg or cloud 9 or whatever, because all those names are so abstract, and they just mean nothing really unless you are already “in the know.” But I think rule 1 does have a ton of potential for branding, marketing, etc. it’s just gonna take someone who understands that you have to have mass appeal to people that are completely outside of the scene in order to become more mainstream. Just through watching your videos, I have pretty high confidence that you already understand most of what I’m trying to say, and I have 100% confidence that if anyone can help break rocket league into the mainstream, it’s you.

[@notheories9012]

Side note beyond the previous comment - awesome video!!

[@KoDough]

One of the biggest differences as well for this, along with it having such a high skill ceiling, is the untapped Asian market. There's very little there right now in comparison to other continents. LoL, CSGO, and Dota 2 have not only been around for quite some time, but they have world attention...and most of the worlds population is in the Asian continent! Only time will tell but I think it'll keep growing more!

[@MeWeeney]

I think what makes people more fans of specific players over orgs is because of having small sized teams. Over the course of a single season, you could see literally every player on the team change.

[@SolidFlair]

i think you are absolutely right that there were a little bit too much majors. the same events again and again. my girlfriend thought it was the same thing everytime. although she likes rocket league for the competition she was bored of it at some point.

[@Jrppegg]

The fact that Psyonix reached out to creators that I’ve seen on youtube to make pregame hype animation of the teams that play shows that they really wanted to make this years worlds even more special than any before it one example is Tobias Leander who made one for rule one and liquid

[@avien9068]

Love the content as always

[@Oussennessuo]

3:16 fun fact, that dude is french too xD

[@trevormckee3193]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Rocket League can't really be a "tier 1" esport until multiple teams can put up consistent results for multiple seasons with very minimal roster changes. People become fans of players, but teams don't stay together long enough for viewers to become fans of the orgs themselves. Since orgs aren't tied to locations like cities or states/provinces, people can't jump in and pick "their" team based on something simple like proximity. They have to find players, who currently tend to move around a lot. It's hard to have great stories when teams don't stick together.

[@Kml_200]

guaranteed is, gameplay is basic that a viewer can pick it up in minutes and gameplay is flashy but skillfull, a well known concept but with a twist. imo games like csgo esprots are slow pased (for newer viewers) and complex with lineups, peeks, things that seem simple but are really complex to understand. Games like val or overwatch have too much going on for a viewer to enjoy, you need to see everythign t understand but rl is a small enough field, simple gameplay yet fun

[@Tripped2011]

True, I also stopped watching most Majors because of the many events. Im not a full time RLCS watcher, give me like 4 events a year and im fullfilled.

[@smoothcannibal5371]

They need UE5 to take the staleness out of the game. Viewership had to also be way up because they dropped apexes. Tons of people only watch for drops. If they redid/restructure them so you didn't get so much of the same stuff (dozens of unpainted splash, titles) then that would also help.

[@moonman-sunhater9666]

Shoutout Austin FC! Definitely a tier one club!

[@GooberGoofy-lj5yd]

I love this game and I also HATE ALL THESE GAWD FORSAKEN SMURFS. Not even because of my personal experience with them, I don't mind playing them, I learn a lot from playing them but it scares away new players and damages the ranked system when they are also boosting players who shouldn't be higher than plat in the first place. It hinders the growth of the game as a whole.

[@chrisleggat4668]

Love rocket league esports and thought this RLCS was unmatched by any viewing experience I’ve had in the esport genre thus far! Side note, there is still a massive PUBG community, the latest worlds was insane and came down to the last game.

[@DreuScuhDoo]

so stoked to follow rule 1 as it progresses you've built an awesome team

[@lalaldka]

what about the FGC? is that on the tier system?

[@ThePerfectedCell]

It’s definitely in the tier 1, in my opinion, it requires the most skills. Yeah some say” oH wHaT aBoUt FoRnItE?” That needs skills too, also ov2, but I think rocket league requires the most skill. Your just constantly moving, rotating, and remembering all the controls to a move. Like you gotta remember the flip reset, air dribble, there’s so much new mechanics pros have to remember to do. Therefore, in my opinion, requires a lot of skills.

[@destroy_kreweta_june]

still doesn’t come close to League Of Legends

[@ThePerfectedCell]

@@destroy_kreweta_juneblud I said my opinion ☠️ and don’t u get powerups in LOL? All RL players get is boost, they ACTUALLY have to train to get mechanics or rocket leagues powerups.

[@waynecolosi5892]

@@destroy_kreweta_juneaint no way bro plays LoL 💀💀

[@nanni5230]

​@destroy_kreweta_june imagine pros being worse than AI in your game already 😂😂😂

[@Adam-fq5lu]

The skill required to play a game has little to do with whether it is considered a T1 esport. Ask anyone who is deeply involved in the esports industry (or even fandom); they will all tell you that RL is not Tier 1.

[@jakubliszka4689]

I agree with the storyline part. All the "Tier 1" esports have massive storylines with huge team specific fanbases. I think thats the difference between tiers, and so RL is growing towards that

[@hoovR]

the discussion is very useless for the audience but EXTREMELY valuable for orgs, knowing what is growing as time passes is great info

[@adriangranada4062]

give it up for the production teams!

[@SimplyTiffany2009]

Yes! its not about viewers its about the competitiveness! and rocket league is one of the most difficult and competitive Esport there is!

[@manuelbonelli3690]

Actually it's all about the views lol...that's what marks the difference between sports (and in this case esports)

[@SuperChimcham]

In other game championships- don’t people watch individual players? Like In fortnite you have 50-100 individual players drawing in viewers. But I’m rocket league you can view all 6 players from one camera.

[@smitty2821]

The chart says that the data is from esports AND TWITCH earnings. Obviously, Twitch earnings are higher for a lot of these other games, and is practically the only reason some of them are even on the list since their esports are kinda meh. I get why Valo, CS, and LoL are on top. Personally, I've played half the games on this list. I'm not big on esports, but RL is the only one I watch from time to time. The simplicity makes the teamwork and seemingly infinite skill ceiling more perceptible for casual players and non-players, and more entertaining to watch.

[@damky_]

Fun Fact : Rasmelthor is a french streamer as well

[@user-ef8bf5xk9b]

I kinda felt inspired to start a Real Club with a Real location where people could compete in my city :) My "region" doesn't even have a flag in the game- still part of EU My goal would be to put together a team that would earn a flag in-game. ( Sadly I'm a lowly champ )

[@DIGIFOREAL]

in my personal belief i think rocket league is one of the best esports and ive been into alot of epsorts like seige and counterstrike and pubg but rocket league is by far the most intense and interesting becuz of its unqiuness and how different it is to every esport but it also feels familiar to real life sports like soccer and basket ball becuz its very closly related in game play and intensity

[@otrenigmaandy7443]

I’m a fan of Rule One, I love the whole Org and team and you Sunnyless 😎 V1 is my favorite team but Vitality and R1 are tied for 2nd fav

[@ders972]

It comes down to viewership... Without an audience there is no money from sponsors

[@MemesNick]

As someone who is not really that much into RL let alone esports, its really funny to me to see we're all idiots, only with different topics, seeing this Tier 1 debate brings me to think about the wrestling wars, laughing at the TV viewers, arena capacity and everything else that involves WWE vs AEW, and it's really interesting how the topic changes but the debate is still that stupid "my thing better than yours... Blabla"

[@austinrowat5496]

From purely a numbers perspective, comparing rocket league to league of legends. Rocket League now would be similar to the original first 2 league of legends worlds events in 2012, 2013. The comparison is interesting to me because LOL has arguably declined since about 2018 however is very consistent with it's fan base now. Where as RL is slowly increasing that base, Over all I have a feeling both leagues will depend greatly on what generations actually gravitate towards the game and whether parents start getting their kids involved in the games they like or liked to play. No different then a traditional sport it will also probably be based in specific countries. Asia really loves LOL same with Spanish countries. While it seems Europe has some specific groups who gravitate to rocket league.

[@Brazz27]

Im not a huge esports follower in general but RL and Trackmania are my go to when I want some.

[@CowboyCorgi]

My fiancé had no interest in watching worlds but got sucked in by the production and story lines and said she actually had a great time watching.

[@andylizarralde3485]

Whenever Rocket League is released on UE5, it will surely have the ability to become the biggest esport in the world

[@gtrzmbe9390]

There are Minecraft parkour and building players who claim to be pros, but it's still difficult to consider the game an Esport, let alone consider the pros to be....pros.

[@mr-mackelmore]

9:12 I can officially say I was in a sunless vid😂

[@Hirokal72]

As a fan of rocket league, I really feel like the only people that would say RL is a tier 1 esport are RL fans because they're biased. But I don't think it's quite there yet. I agree the viewing experience is great, especially for casuals, but I don't think it can be considered a t1 esport without having a bit more viewership.

[@kento_suijin]

hm

[@Heatwave9000]

I mean csgo had more average viewers at one of the majors than rlcs worlds peak concurrent viewership. RLCS is not even close to tier 1

[@Frogbjb]

2-3 years ago I’d say tier B but now it’s definitely a top tier esport. Multiple tournaments per year that can afford to hand out 2mil in prize pools solidifies it.

[@manuelbonelli3690]

That is not hoe it works...it's like saying Chine's league is a top football leaghue because they can spend 50millions in a year to a player for 5 years....money is not the first way to define a tier, viewership is. That's why football is the top sport in the world, cause it's the most viewed one (even if in NBA they probably can give much higher contracts). Same thing applies to esport, Rl views are just not ther rn to be considered a top tier esports

[@GabrielLopes-ih8bn]

Why is this channel better than the main (also mans is spitting facts)

[@carterlove]

Minecraft has tournaments but only for youtubers so it lacks any actual competition being the most skilled players

[@THE1ONENEO]

congrats that was insane today don't know if we should even call it an upset yet idk will see on super sunday

[@kingiogaming5669]

Guys he said its only 6 years old (its 8th birthday was a couple months ago) 😂

[@chemicalx324]

Its also because the esport hasnt quite hit the asian market very well yet so thats where so many viewers come from in other esports

[@x8jason8x]

I was exactly like Sunless when I first watched RL esports. I thought Esports was stupid. Rocket League is different though, it requires more than being able to shoot the fastest. Never mind that it's the closest to a real sport since video games were invented, that isn't a sport sim.

[@StewChicken42]

Hype chamber? What's that? Have a bassilisk in it?

[@Hunter-th2fr]

Nah, it views. You can late Zen to somewhat of what Messi is doing in the MLS in American, Nation wide Soccer is nothing in American but when Messi came, it blew up, but still smaller than Football. I think RL is doing the same with Zen (also RW9 :) but still not at the point of the big esports

[@jtodd00]

If anyone hasn't seen Wayton's "Rocket League: The Greatest Esport of All Time", I highly recommend watching it