Is There A Powercreep Problem? | Honkai: Star Rail

[@mrpokkee]

38:05 My neutral tldr: powercreep exists, but not by a single unit, more specifically the super break team. I personally define powercreep as: If X does the same thing as Y but better/easier, then X powercrept Y. Doesn’t matter if X can still clear content; I will not, in good faith, recommend new players to pull for old team comps instead of superbreak. This is considering endgame content (MOC/AS/PF) only, no waifu factors. When an old team can’t clear content in HSR, then it’s not about powercreep anymore, it’s going to the territory of actual p2w (and I hope it never gets there). A new player starting out in 2.3 RIGHT NOW have an infinitely easier time clearing endgame with ruanmei/firefly/superbreak compared to 1.x units/team comps. Free weakness implant, free HMC, free gallagher (which I believe EVERYONE should invest in), easy to obtain relics, no sig LC demand, all while dealing NUCLEAR damage with exception to toughness lock, and even THAT isn’t game breaking (superbreak can still beat Sam albeit more uncomfortable. Trotter OP though) Whether mihoyo nerf super break next time by making a new meta (toughness lock), we don’t know, but as of right now super break is OBJECTIVELY a comp that powercrept any other previous comps, investment for investment (be it relics or units/eidolons). Leave your thoughts below

[@GamesGoBrrr]

dont worry, blade will never be powercrept

[@XiasGaming]

And for that E0S0 Firefly is better right now than E0S0 Acheron or any other dps, more easy to build and just need the best gigachat support Ruan God. Will be hard powercreep Firefly E0S0.

[@leeteckguan1775]

​@@GamesGoBrrr Yeah he's a glass cannon

[@leeteckguan1775]

Holy yapping by mrpokke

[@ch1dd]

I don't think we can say that just because that's predicated on Firefly's/Boothill's implant and extra high toughness damage. The new characters get amplified threefold by how synergistic they are with the supports as opposed to the additive increase other dps usually get when buff stacking after the first one. The investment is definitely lower, but power-wise it's pretty much comparable to when using other dps characters in the comp I think, and every unit you replace shapes a very different team. FF had me worried because she ended up slightly overtuned since the community/testers didn't understand how strong she was. The devs still did a good job removing some power from other areas before buffing the last kit, but that was a close call to spawning powercreep in the game. Right now, luckily it doesn't exist since they locked anything that could cause it behind limited eidolons, outside the reach of most of the playerbase.

[@Ankiraa]

As a SW E1 with her event LC haver, I approved that she is a totally different unit than her E0S0. Basically from 4 turn Ult to 2 Turn Ult. Combine them with wind set. Boom, Insane. And the thing is, I'm not talking about her kit to implant weakness, but her debuff man, no one beat her. Def shred 45% + 8% from ult and talent. 10% + 3% All type res reduction. And ofc 20% element res reduction from implant. Yes she's is bad on pure fiction due to enemies keep changing, but she's super good on MoC and AS because even though there could be several unit on both of these mode, you only need to focus on 1 or 2 enemy only. And ofc you can pair her with Pela to achieve more than 100% def reduction.

[@Borovski213]

People just use the wrong term for the situation. There is no powercreep in the sense that older units “cannot” clear anymore. They still definitely can. Its just that new units have significantly higher floors compared to old ones. Thats all

[@Thedoorway123]

Hook anit clearing shit

[@deedee3355]

Yup powercreep here is making the old character looks weaker not makes them cannot finishes the end game content, people just cant handle the reality of there are and will be characters better than their favorites characters.

[@jiunhaoneoh3482]

@@Thedoorway123 Multiple people have used Hook to clear MOC 12.

[@vickdinvick5485]

@@Thedoorway123 hook is garbage since day 1.... lol... but i bet theres ppl out there that can clear everything with her.... but... with tons of premium suports do help to do it

[@Thedoorway123]

@@jiunhaoneoh3482 e6 I presume

[@larrywoolfolk8224]

After watching both videos, I definitely like your TLDR of powercreep which is simply making something that is already not hard to do even easier. Personally i think the Hoyo games stimulus package brought it so many new players to gacha games that we forgot the dark days where powercreep was and in some cases of games that come out only to EOS shortly after or ride that fine line because they will release a unit with content that can literally only be cleared by said premium units (like current brave exvius for example).

[@pieman2025]

a fellow FFBE player, man i dont miss that game lmao.

[@andrewhaydock5557]

@@pieman2025 Same man i remember the days of hyoh into raegan. Now look at them literally unplayable based on a tier list. Also remember the days of holiday units that where stupidly powerful and never came back until next year and by that time they sucked ass. God this game is a god send between actually bad gatchas.

[@Qopa]

I mean, have there ever been a version update where the unit isnt game changing and OP in hsr? The amount of new powercreep that we get in each update is so apparent. I cant see why ppl can just pretend like HSR is still the perfect game after all this time when they themselves cant even beat it f2p and without ruan mei.

[@pieman2025]

@Qopa edit: I will concede acheron and hmc are stupid units. the thing is that you can beat all the content without Ruan mei, if your account is invested well enough you should be able to clear any content in the game, albeit a bit slower. Ruan mei just allows you to slack on your account progression and she is the first limited harmony we got access to.

[@Qopa]

@@pieman2025 the problem is all content that we're getting are now centered around the devs balancing difficult content for ruan mei users, aka break first to do damage. Even a completely f2p player like ZMM barely beat AS floor 3 relying on xueyi + mhc, and dr.ratio on the 2nd side. Your statement is only true if ppl had e1-e2 meta harmony 5* supports to elevate somebody like arlan to be strong enough to beat everything without relying on recent op dps like acheron, hmc, boothill, and firefly. And thats the sad part about HSR to be honest.

[@razergarcia6323]

Your account review with Xethrion was actually very insightful and he has a great take about powercreep in HSR. Powercreep in HSR is gonna be more noticeable since it is one of the few ways for people to pull characters since there's no pvp.

[@sadisyourlife]

Most people saying "old characters still clear" fail to realize that the literal definition of power creep is same result for much less effort which is exactly what is happening with every new character released recently. Saying "its just acheron and firefly" is so funny because they are the only dedicated dps in 2.x and they were miles better than what we had. Its not like we got other characters that were less overpowered. This pattern will not go away in the future.

[@17ch18fn3ooo]

nah bro, for hoyoshills, they will never realize bcs hoyo games are perfect there is no such thing as powercreep😍

[@totallyregulargiorno]

@@17ch18fn3ooo Honkai Impact 3rd powercreep would like to say hi

[@bruh6267]

FINALLY WELL SAID

[@bencegergohocz5988]

But muh "skill issue" and "some no life fuck can clear vontent with 4stars that have100000 stamina artifacts on them"...

[@oyfum2638]

Managed to clear AS on a 100% F2P account without using Ruan Mei, Acheron, Firefly, Boothill, E2 Dhil, Silverwolf, Aventurine, and Gallagher. So yea, I can vouch for Iyo’s take.

[@moonawilks8240]

Congratz, mind telling your teams? :))

[@deepprakashamin9129]

Good for you. now please look up definition of powercreep on Internet thank you. I swear ppl dont know what powercreep means. Makes their own definition. If you think there is no powercreep then you are just blind

[@xCritStar]

i mean nice clear you have all the new chars that are good for the current meta i guess?

[@inventedbaton958]

elaborate

[@oyfum2638]

@@inventedbaton958 showcase is up on my channel if you’re interested, builds are at the end of the

[@PopsDoesWork]

40 mins of yap. Another classic from MrPokke

[@raymondtan892]

Powercreep does exist, a low investment Acheron or Firefly without Ruanmei will still beat the shit out of Seele. But i respect those who uses Yanqing to clear moc 12 that is fking insane 😂 there is a video on that

[@feyandhisstuff9888]

yea but at high investment Seels >= Acheron > dogshit > piss > puke > firefly

[@riri_e2]

Arlan > Acheron (I'm joking pls don't hurt me)

[@kismyers5207]

blud wants every single new character to stay the same strength level as day one units💀 Newer products are always fundamentally better relative to older ones.

[@tnb4509]

@@kismyers5207 I mean that's how it should be tho right? People should pull for new characters because they like them not because they're absurdly op and are the only way to clear endgame content without relic farming forever. Sure, they can be slightly better or have a different niche but FF and Acheron probably outdamage e6 Jing Yuan or Seel.

[@darkgrundi9543]

@@tnb4509 Mate, the new chars are not absurdly op, HMC is. You can clear the boothill stages with Sushang and the Firefly stages with Hook. The FREE unit is the one powercreeping not the limited ones.

[@kaanpai4319]

Ya'll just need to ignore Tectone. The guy absolutely sucks at every game. He has no idea what he's doing and what he's talking about.

[@Thedoorway123]

Archeron vrs yanqing

[@Emmanuel-v1q2r]

Oh yeah ? Then clear moc with Yanqing then lol

[@kaanpai4319]

@rez_2529 No. I don't have Yanqing. And even if I had him, I wouldn't build him. Yanqing always sucked because his kit is flawed. He was never good and never will be. A unit that was never usable is no argument for power creep.

[@Zer0Hour17]

@@Emmanuel-v1q2ra bad unit existing has nothing to do with power creep. Day 1 Yanqing was dog shit.

[@ameerr0812]

Hah dicktone

[@pillowhead4456]

Tectone always says that he wants the game to be challenging, but the moment it is inconvenient to him, he's saying its a powercreep and you need every new mechanic in the game to clear it. All i can say is, im a low spender (express pass only for a month now), cleared all endgame 3* no issue at all (tons of people did it too), and you just have massive skill issue on every games you play.

[@feyandhisstuff9888]

Teccy just a crying baby thats it. He never really wanted challenges

[@krazyaim]

At the end it's an opinion. Feel free to debate

[@kaete_7]

You did not even undesrtand what he was saying. He was talking about how hard it is to clear for casual players.

[@moober_]

@@kaete_7 it depends what you consider as casual because if people arent using their resin or using random ass teams with 3 dps no sustain then they should not be clearing. however anyone with even very low investment should be able to clear atleast uptil moc10 and pf3/4. the last levels should be reserved for people who know how to play the game, if youre that casual you wont mind missing out on the 60 jades or whatever anyways

[@kaete_7]

@@moober_ You literally have it in the word casual players. Someone who plays the game at their own pace, without dedicating extensive time or effort. And ofc casual players should not expect to clear everything. Still casual players can have different goals like either only goin for characters they like not caring about the end game content or someone who wants to clear it but still wont play everyday and stuff yk

[@danoel676]

I really liked the point of how minimum effort cannot give max rewards. I grinded a lot on th game (except the new DU) and for that, I got a perfect firefly team, an acheron team Im working on but is good, and I can say proudly I arnd it since I really sat down and did the thinking and grinding. HSR is dependant on investment, and not only that of money, but also time and brains.

[@cktan523]

lmao that keyboard smash subtitles at the end Was struggling in AS, then just pulled E1 for my E0 RM + updated/ geared her up better = got additional 300 to 400+ more points, helped me clear max stars.

[@tufol33k78]

Ruan Mei is the best unit by far in the game, getting her E1 made my Jing Yuan look good, that's a chad achievement

[@hachi_wasabi]

hey i pull firefly just so i can clear every endgame content more easier, idc if it a skill issue im not trying to show off how good i am by clear moc and as without using ruan mei, acheron and etc. If i can be able to bruteforce with firefly team and acheron team then i don't have to worry about anything in future

[@peterjutsu]

i actually did try that this MOC's floor 12 with Himeko and without Ruan Mei, using Asta instead. full rewards. Ruan Mei is a must pull but is not necessary in every run.

[@Violet-0]

Powercreep doesn’t exists when I’ve set my expectations low nowadays and am fine if I don’t clear the last floors of the end game. 🗿

[@jeffrenjr]

Most relatable take

[@sycamorewest]

If you're getting panties in a bunch by missing out on 60 jades (ie. 1/3 of a single pull) and milking a whole series of a content bitching, you might be a cc rather than a "casual lower spender / F2P" Because powercreep as the current allegations stand only impact the last star out of the 36

[@cutcorners6005]

I went from e0 SW to e2 on her rerun. The difference is night and day, I would not use e0, I have seen both sides of it. you can actually ult two targets in 0 cycle with her e1. it is in another universe compared to e0.

[@HazardTone]

This is definitely a powercreep from a meta perspective and Hoyo is capitalizing on it. Starting from patch 2.1 to 2.3 all banners are the pillars of def break.

[@CTY547]

What does "def break" even mean? If you're referring to break-focused characters, then that's just not true since the only ones are HMC, Gallagher, Boothill, and Firefly. If by "def break" you mean defense shredding, then that's also wrong since the only Penacony characters that do that are Black Swan and Misha, who both came out in 2.0

[@HazardTone]

@@CTY547 the def break effect meta

[@JJennerUK]

Break meta is literally the exact same thing as Hyperbloom in Genshin. It basically allows lower skill players to win (Not a bad thing), or those with lower investment to keep up. It's a new archetype of course we are going to get a few characters in a row focused on it. E.g. Single target DPS, AoE DPS and supports for them

[@fuumaruu7486]

​@@JJennerUK Unlike Hyperbloom, Break Team gets easily cock blocked by enemies that locks their toughness bar.

[@BigAl2-u7e]

If by "all banners" from 2.1 to 2.3, you mean only 2 of the 6 new banners actually being break characters. Then sure, I guess.

[@raymondtan892]

Correct statement: Tectone is no longer f2p plus, he is now a disciple of the gem gods 35:25

[@PoyoPoyomfs]

He was never a f2p to be honest xd

[@Wolfyyy]

​@@PoyoPoyomfs Let's not lie ok... You can hate him all you want but at least be honest

[@gandi8959]

correct statement: teccy is a now a semi whale acc, but stil cant clear second side apocalyptic shadows with the best team possible

[@PoyoPoyomfs]

@@Wolfyyy haha i've been called many things, tectone fanboy, tectone hater etc lol

[@IshyMimic]

I actually watched a video by zmm where he cleared on an account without pulling. So he only used free characters that were available in game from events. It was really close but it was so cool I recommend watching it. Also sidenote, imo I think even if powercreep does exist, it isn't ever going to be a problem since players can just get the newer characters. I mean there are a lot of f2p players that can clear end game, myself included.

[@santiagoserial3670]

If im not mistaken He cleared stage 3

[@corylowe2703]

i feel like power creep isn't only new unit comes out and now older units are now useless. there's obviously a big enough difference between boothill acheron and firefly especially if you have ruan mei compared to other characters . and some of those teams are just way better and more future proof than your seele. it's that simple

[@godofnil6644]

Do people really believe that, ON AVERAGE, Year 2 units aren’t stronger, have more mechanics, have higher damage ceilings/floors, easier to play with lower investment etc than Year 1 or Launch units?

[@kennethyoung7457]

People are more talking about the content being able to be cleared by older characters when powercreep is simply new characters being better than old characters. I don't think people can seriously believe that the content didn't get harder though after Acheron released though it was a massive jump in health we never even had a 2 million hp boss until Acheron released now every boss has a million plus hp.

[@Tiasung]

@@kennethyoung7457 Well with the arguments many use you do have to wonder what they actually believe or not. I think a lot of them really do believe that. They dont understand that their accounts are massively more invested, having a larger roster of build characters and their stats being off the charts now. That makes it feel like their Seele is still doing similar despite now having a much stronger team and having way more stats.

[@zap7737]

Yes, Iyo believes that lmao

[@destock1637]

Idk what people have in his mind power creep its as easy to see by yourself loking at jingyuan vs adventurine: 10% critical rate(JY) vs 48% (adventu) just by doing nothing. 😂

[@kenkaneki3873]

​@@kennethyoung7457This is just Iyo using his own definitions of words again which he does sometimes for some reason. Same as him taking F2P+ as a serious thing instead of a meme. There is no F2P+ if you buy anything in the game you're by definition not F2P lol. Same thing here, powercreep means a new unit is better than an old unit. Doesn't matter if the old unit can still clear content or not it's irrelevant for the powercreep label.

[@hidefhq]

for charcters like seele they could make niche sets that improve damage something that triggers resurrgence without a kill for example. something niche enough it works for only them.

[@XiasGaming]

10:16 very true RM made the meta since 1.6

[@marcusbullock2753]

The real question is do people want to spend time building a character more than necessary to clear content or just simply pull for a stronger unit with less investment. It makes sense why people want new units rather than building one ones.

[@hachi_wasabi]

If a characters that can be able to bruteforce like acheron and firefly invest everything for then and you have a easier time for future moc

[@stego-]

@@hachi_wasabiissue is, you may not have enough pulls to even vertically invest as a f2p. meaning you will have to wait for the rerun. and by the time it happens a new character will be even better

[@RygarFang1599]

It depends on what the person is pulling for. I can see what your saying, but your forgetting you'll still need time to invest on the new character. Also, time to learn the new kit. In addition, there is a reset period to get use to the new comp. As low spender or f2p, would you not hit a wall call resource limitation, if there chasing the new thing all the time?

[@RygarFang1599]

@@stego- there's an issue with the your first part of your argument, if you not horizontally investing, shouldn't you have pulls to vertically invest? Meaning you have two teams up and running, clearing content, there shouldn't be a need to chase new units, unless they help the current team you have or fill in holes. ZMM's free to play account is a good example, it has no horizontal investment, just vertical investment, look at how much his save. Is waiting for a rerun that bad? Also, you don't know if the new character is better, than the old one, until the community get to try them out.

[@ch1dd]

This is the mentality trap the majority of players falls into. The banner characters have an easier time because the content is tailored around them so the people who already wanted the characters get to use them right after pulling. If someone pulls because it's easier instead of building something that will be permanently easier, they'll have to do that every banner and end up with 10 characters who can't clear the content instead of 3 who can. Then they complain about not having resources or the game being too hard, when it's entirely their fault.

[@Dr-Durag]

background music at the start was: Digimon world 3 central park BGM 100% certified banger

[@vietanh2101]

the game is mostly pve, and everyone can do the most difficult contents completely F2P with proper planning and time. There is powercreep, but a game without powercreep and nobody is going to feel excited for the new characters. I would say HSR is in a pretty healthy state now, where everyone can clear all contents, but having meta characters helps a lot.

[@hackedgames2032]

Been playing day 1 as f2p lost 50/50 5 times, seele, our general, silver wolf, fu xuan, and now firefly. You win some u lose some, if u are wondering who the 50/50 loses are 4 bailu and 1 yangsh*t. Such is f2p

[@andro5t]

I myself will hold the judgment on how good firefly compared to other unit when the Turbulence or the other modes buffs doesn't favor her or break teams

[@kennethyoung7457]

Shes is at least on par with Acheron and for the average invested player she is better than Acheron. Play Memory of Xianzhou stage 6 with Firefly and see how easily she 0 cycles it while being off element.

[@feyandhisstuff9888]

@@kennethyoung7457 xianzhou stage 6 is nothing compare to moc12 tho. There is no BOSS with high toughness bar so ff is free to deal any damage. Will look at her in new moc released with Yunli

[@-Him--]

The real argument is on how to define power creep. We must agree on the definition first before doing all of this. If not then it is just milking content. No real discussion.

[@hdngyn]

So... Ruan Mei Star Rail. Got it

[@eckology016]

Yes, the most important character in the game is pretty important. Every game has one.

[@clownasuka4490]

Ur not clearing moc12 without her unless u have incredibly high investment on everyone

[@Hobbitfeet01]

Powercreep only exists in what form of what MoC-Buff they bring, personally i see a few ways to build partys now be it Hypercarry, Follow up, DoT or Break, one of them will be Meta and the others will be slightly off depending on what the MoC buff it is. Its more about being able to utilize the MoC buff then to have the the biggest units. Thats why 4* teams are still able to clear cause most of those players understand how the buff works and build teams around it. Ofc the MoC buff will also always benefit the latest char that came out to make em look super strong and powerfull. As of now Xueyi Galagher and HMC are ripping through MoC, noone needs a Firefly though she makes it easy for people who arent as skilled in building chars and teams. I see all the 5* as pay for convenience units rather then must have. Ruan Mei maybe aside since she can really be used on whatever team u throw her especially with her LC.

[@Iyoverse]

Queen Mei supremacy. :D

[@highwaytoheaven99]

I think powercreep is real, recent DPS units have been better than old DPS units, same thing with sustains. That is undeniable. But I think people are "overblowing" the powercreep a little. You see, MOC has increased in difficulty to the point "brute force" isn't really an option for players anymore (unless you're a whale with Eidolons and Sig Cones). If your team can't properly use the current rotation buffs, then good luck lol. You can't just slap a hypercarry team into any side of any MOC without even reading the buffs like back in 1.x and expect to clear. Current rotation of MOC and AS favours break, so of COURSE break teams are going to get inflated into high heavens above all other teams. You see the huge numbers that Firefly is doing in MOC 12 and think its all her, when half of is the current rotation buffing break damage. You guys seems to be forgetting that. **TLDR:** if you're using a hypercarry team in a MOC rotation that is clearly NOT made for hypercarry then of COURSE you won't clear it! Its not because of powercreep, its because you need another team!

[@marley7659]

I am going to wait until next region launch. whatever place that black swan suggested.

[@OGSharquan]

i think they just gotta make a 4star ruan mei that isnt as good as her but does essentially what she does and make her free to get initially cause it's just the lack of multiple chars that do similar things imo and as in lack of characters that do similar things i mean like bronya and sparkle. They are both 5 stars but they essentially do the same thing but then again that may decrease comp diversity.

[@toddyn2666]

But the bothill and fireflye implant is just a prerequisite for them to work, they don't reduce anything with their implant like the wolf or when the enemy already has its weakness

[@vannoah]

“E2 dill e2 Acheron e2 firefly”… Me here with all 3 of those…

[@Silvonaut]

Respectfully, Teccy has a skill issue. Second, power-creep is when characters become obsolete, that definition doesn't apply to a single limited 5 star. Third, 2.0 units have a higher floor than 1.0 units, Acheron + Boothill + Firefly are better than Disappear among the sea of butterflies + The General + Emo dude however this is healthy, they're not obsolete but the meta is tangibly changing which makes it interesting and alive. Fourth, old characters have aged like fine wine, like Himeko, Herta, Topaz, Pela and so on. TLDR - Get gud baldy, Mei is the only "must pull", SW is mid/Pela clears, pull better (in all seriousness as it stands it isn't an issue imo and until i cant clear content with Blade it power-creep doesn't exist).

[@ciofurinone4225]

I think the greatest lie, that comes right from genshin is how "weapon banner is bad, don't pull". But in HSR, there are so many good t4 LC, it can affect a lot the account. Like, not having Luka's LC, dance dance dance or memories of the past. Even if you wait to take into account Simulated Universe free LC, you cannot forget it takes 4 weeks to get a copy, and another 4 for s5.

[@NoName-kg4ve]

This! , man I still don't have the Luka Lc and these people make videos saying you need this and that like everyone has that .

[@andrewhaydock5557]

I so agree. Light cones are such a big part of this game. You really got to look at what light cones are on the banner because they make a huge difference. Acheron is so much worse without a unit with pearls of sweat. Even sometimes it's better to skip a unit and wait to get both unit and light cone. Since it's both base stats and ability made for said unit.

[@JohnStamR]

The power creep of this game: Gallagher > Loucha, Built in element application > SW. My salty self would say Firefly > Dr. Numby, but super break power crept every comp in the game, which is the most worrying part for me. Star rail could definitely indirectly nerf super break, but given breaking shields is a core mech in the game, I do not know how likely that is. Something tells me every major patch (2.0, 3.0, etc) is going to introduce a new meta but its just a feeling, its only happened once.

[@XiasGaming]

23:03 RM is must pull of course. SW for old players is not worth it for me But for new players with few characters could help have SW but after can be easy replace. I got SW in 1.1 , and before Acheron i was not using her. Btw Firefly and Acheron Firefly E0S0 is more easy to build than Acheron E0S0.

[@thornszk]

Really weird for people to put huge emphasis on tierlists while denying powercreep. Obviously newer units have easier access to higher numbers. Almost like, the only 5star worth rolling in 1.x is Ruan Mei. But I can understand them releasing 2 units per patch, they are are filling up the niches. Heck, Argenti/Misha hasn't got his premium support yet.

[@jiunhaoneoh3482]

People who complain about powercreep should take a look at Ruri Goko who cleared AS with only 4*s. If you can't clear with 5*s then it's purely a skill / teambuilding / brain issue even as a F2P.

[@Ianlbl6225]

To add in your comment you have the relic system, which is the worst one ever created making some people stuck and not enough power on the characters because of the relic system, where the difficulty to clear the endgame. If you can't clear floor 12 is fine, but the moment they can't do the last floor and the third one of Pure Fiction and Apocalyptic Shadow then there's the build issue where it all start

[@Borovski213]

Or zmm who cleared AS full stars using free units with majority having 0 eidolons

[@Dimpslilbro]

​​@@Borovski213zmm didn't full star it but tbf he hasn't pulled on a banner ever

[@Borovski213]

@@Dimpslilbro he made a recent vid where he built Xueyi and picked Gallagher from the event then he was able to full star it. Him not pulling on any banner was my point. If a guy who never pulled was able to do it, those with complete rosters dont have an excuse

[@Yuukine2365]

Team building and brain? Yes Skill? Hell no😂😂😂😂😂

[@ArchAngelKnights]

bruh ofc the mocs are different....the buffs change. So if you use a dot team on an moc that is actively working against dot...ofc youre gonna do worse....i swear this community.

[@zxcentsensei.sunder]

Correction: Both boothill and Firefly are considered specialist since they are not hypercarries and can be allowed to be played both at the same time in break archetypes (DoT is like this as well), they are more of a support rather than a DPS since they're a niche amount of break characters that works well together if you put them both, just make sure HMC and RM is on the team when you put both good break characters at the same time in a roster

[@vertarix]

ah yes my support which does 90% of the team's damage yes. not really hypercarries since it's not like their teammates are amplifying their damage or anything. firefly and boothill helping the team out doing a little break no biggie. gotta remove that toughness bar somehow.

[@Haru_no_ki]

I’m a waifu hunter. But that’s fucking funny, because in hsr I only enjoy Jingliu, Kafka, Firefly and Acheron. Maybe a couple of 4 stars. I don’t care how good they are if she cute

[@SirGamalot]

I consider powercreep, when a unit becomes completely obsolete. You can still clear with Blade, Luocha, and Jingyuan, so I don't consider them powercreep

[@julianjg9001]

You can't clear with blade actually, sadly his damage is the worst from all the limited DPS and now he is only used in pure fiction. The problem with Blade is that he was ahead of his time, his kit was too unique(HP scaling) for the time he was introduced in the game where the classic crit DPS were the norm, I'm sure Blade will make a good comeback when we get to HP scaling meta and we get units that can unleash his full potential, but until that happens our emo bro will keep setting at the bottom

[@SnakeNews10]

​@@julianjg9001What do you mean by not being able to clear with Blade?

[@vickdinvick5485]

what ppl need do understand is... "0 cycle" is not the way intended to play those modes, it is just a flex, but if an older unit can not "0 cycle" anymore.... (wich is true for most of the older units) they call them obsolete.. wich is not true at all... atm

[@julianjg9001]

@boi3248 that's blade damage now can't keep up with the high HP of the new enemies on MOC or AS basically you can't clear with before the 20-cycle limit ends unless your blade has extremely good relics, he pretty much relies on ruan mei and even with her Blade's performance isn't that good

[@lsmsm9]

@@julianjg9001 skill issue, cleared aventurines moc off element with blade.

[@ak-1832]

Yeah there’s no way you can tell me that the Seele hypercarry team has the same output as superbreak, it’s just so much damage

[@archerkuro4158]

I still disagree that there is no power creep looking at Acheron firefly and arguably adventurine the power creep is there however the power creep is minor and not a current issue and unless something changes likely never will be There are 3 ways to play this game spend money to get who you want and get easy 3 star clears Pull for meta but that means you have to skip character that you like Or pull who you like and accept you will have to fight for 3 star clears like your on hard mode Lastly friendly reminder if you can only Get a 2 star clear on the last stage you are missing half a pull at most so just play in whatever way is the most fun for you

[@analoque2412]

Is there powercreep? Yes. But does it reach "unplayable" or "no new characters = can't clear the highest content," as Bald Man said? NO, NOT AT ALL. And I'm going to throw out the "hot take": That won't happen in HSR. Bro, they nerfed and even REMOVED a boss from ROGUELIKE GAME MODE because 'it's still too hard.' I just want to say that you shouldn't listen too much to people who use BASIC ATTACK TWICE IN A ROW while Firefly Ultimate is active.

[@nebulagray88]

Im new and I planned to be completely f2p but because of Ruan Mei, I was kinda pushed to get the express pass to guarantee to get her.

[@TheLastGhostLegendario]

I think slow controled and well done powercreep is really healthy for a game, if they dont powercreep, you can look at Genshin that 80% of the characters are skippeable because you can use the same teams with the same supports forever since 1.0 (and i dont mean the same or lower in damage i mean in mechanics and gameplay) and if they do too much, whats the point of using a unit if 1 month later it will be useless. HSR has the healthy one, 2 years to feel a character feel somewhat behind is good (without eidolons, any dps you get his E2 and then this doesnt apply because its broken) because you will never should be in a position to feel stuck with the same team for more than a year and making it fresh and if for some reason u want to, you can pull their E2 and done welcome back. Thats why, in my case, I finally have all the pieces i need, so i will pull for 1 more character and i will just save for a long time(unless there is a support that helps my actual team) because i dont need more and here from 1 year later, i can say security with how HSR is doing, the new teams will have new mechanics like here from another universe of diference from todays (you can look 1.0 and how the teams are in 2.3 lol) My acheron team AOE for MOC, PF and AS (holy this was an amazing buy) and i will get certain fox to just fix my only problem with this team in all gamemodes, My Boothill team for MOC, AS (2 modes out of the way) and for the last spot, the funny thing is a Clara/Herta team that does very well and my last missing piece is just himeko and probably i will just pity her XD

[@kennethyoung7457]

80% of all characters in a gacha game will be skippable as their is no way you can use the dozens or hundreds of characters anyway. In Star Rail Firefly and Acheron made all other dps redundant because of the unhealthy powercreep. They literally do everything better even while being off element compared to the old dps being on element with signature lightcones and full premium teams. The powercreep is just a kick in the face for people who pulled characters before 1.6 as vast majority of those characters has been supplanted.

[@TheLastGhostLegendario]

@@kennethyoung7457 Idk bro but people are clearing MOC, AS and PF max stars with only 4 stars charactersand ligtcones so idk what are you talking about and u can use any team, idk where is the "supplanting" And i think you didnt understood my 80% take I mean NEW units not OLD units are skippeable, in genshin 90% of the teams uses the same 4 stars characters that were released in 1.0 and in there powercreep doesnt exists, because newer characters are worse that the previous ones or do the same + outside dendro and now with the hp thing since 1.0 there is no diference in mechanics, that is a game without powercreep or change. And if you are not happy about not using your older DPS , just like the video said, pull for their LC and invest on it, personally if you like them that much, you can just pull their E2 and they are back instead of a new shiny unit. In MOC i am using DHIL premium team and i am having a blast, and i saw people with Seele having a lot of fun 36 star clearing it. Plus every patch we get from 1-2 free characters so idk why everyone is doomposting.

[@TJKuro]

@@kennethyoung7457could not be more wrong lmfao the stats are out there. Do some research before spouting nonsense

[@smoltoaster]

Yea ur right, hsr does have powercreep, but imo its a more nuanced and healthy amount. I feel like the main powercreep is the floor of team output. If you look at absolute highest cieling dps, seele is still the best or top 2. But when you look at mid tier investment in gears, you have boothill and firefly absolutely smoking that tier of investment. The dmg floor of new units seems to be a lot higher, but they do have some notable caveats. Fly and Booty are strict team wise, you kinda rly want hmc + Rumei for them. They also need to break to function, have a lower cieling, and need pretty specific qualities from a future new character to improve their cieling any more. Acheron is similar, with a higher floor when using 2 nihility supports, but also being somewhat restricted. The issue is harmony units are the ones with action adv. While acherons floor and cieling are quite good anyways, shed kind of need a nihility with turn manipulation to really break her cieling (unless you run no sustain) Basically if you invested stamina well into old units (good relics+teammates), their cielings are still hanging in the top tier, even beating new units. New units just get up and running very quickly with poor investment, but their cielings take a hit for it.

[@Tiasung]

@@TheLastGhostLegendario I agree with your sentiment of requiring powercreep but it having to be healthy. The problem is that your accessment of the current state isnt accurate. Its only been 1 year so far, not 2, and we are already at a point where older characters feel behind significantly behind unless you have newer units to boost them up. Also, most dps dont get broken with their E2. Its only select ones like DHIL, Acheron and FF to which that applies. Which in turn means that many eidolons are just a trap and only give the illusion of vertical investment (for those units) being good when its not. Your idea about ''people are clearing endgame with 4* etc'' only applies to extremely few people. Most 4*s just arent used anymore because they arent good enough without actual perfect relics and perfect tuning. So most people only use a couple of 4*'s like Pela or Gallagher. You cant use exceptions to argue the average experience.

[@banan6216]

If you're paranoid of powercreep then I think the most future proof thing you can do currently is to invest in universally good signatures Even if they are powercrept in the future they will still be way ahead of most 4-star lightcones. Got ruan mei's lightcone just recently and the sp gain is insane on top of the energy and dmg buffs and it will most likely never be replaced by a future 4-star lightcone. But that's only when considering clear-speed/meta, you will lose out on some cool characters in the long run if you're f2p like me.

[@MefoWho]

thats 1 lmao. I used to think IL lightcone is universal enough. Look at me now, regretting that i couldve spent that pity on acheron's lc

[@eckology016]

Or just don't pull for multiple characters in the same patch, and instead pick your favorite each time and get that character. The more you spread out when you need to pull to keep up with the game's evolution, the easier it is to stay F2P. That's my approach in WuWa where I'm not looking to spend. Finally pulled for a char with Jinshi and now gonna hold off for a while since she'll be able to tackle all the hardest content.

[@MACA_Zeon]

Why are you f2p

[@thebrigade7684]

Ah yes there is and it started becoming more of a thing after Acheron but for a turn based game this is a completely expected outcome we all knew it denying it that there is none is weird.

[@AeryMP3]

I’ve seen four stars clear all the content albeit the person who did was really strategic and had well built characters but if you play long enough you can guarentee a five star especially with how generous the game is

[@rizzz___]

wdym, I did 3 stars cleared Apocalyptic Shadow 4 without RM , using my 3rd F2P account (made during Acheron release), all limited banners are E0S1 or lower. Power creep does exist, but even with those you can still pretty much clear most if not ALL content with 4 stars and standard banner units. The game is easy, IT AINT THAT DEEP. Don't think too hard and just enjoy the game...

[@sp-exos3517]

Ppl just feel “power creep” because DoT teams are underwhelming this patch

[@wat6440]

As a firm devotee of IX, lowkey kinda true LMAO

[@_LQT]

Tbf dots team don’t have dedicated harmony unit yet like break and fua

[@kdog3k]

My E1S1 Kafka and E1 BS are fine, thank you. It's the other side that's struggling

[@areyoutrippin9730]

​@@kdog3k I don't remember anybody speaking about you personally

[@eckology016]

How did we get like 6 videos off of Tectone not knowing how to manage his skill points enough to not do multiple non-ult basics with Firefly? Insane. Literally none of this happens if he just got 3 stars on AS, lmao.

[@Hiro.the.God.]

He's OUR streamer. Get him to 100k

[@atlus3669]

Iyo made a whole ass 30min video about powercreep without even knowing what powercreep is, insane

[@changen4125]

my dudes, a content creator has literally beaten the new mode and got 34* in MOC without freaking summoning. Yes there is powercreep, we get it. But there is plenty of power on the player's side as well. The only problem is that people want easy button and just auto MOC. I can do that with my e2s1 Firefly and Acheron. But if you just play the game and actually think, it's actually proven that you can clear all of end game as f2p.

[@tangerine569]

10:10 - 10:48 Never felt the need to pull Ruan Mei personally, it is not rough out there lol

[@sahilm483]

Conclusion: YES ITS REAL

[@jeanettehonkai8075]

34:10 I don't have Ruan Mei, Acheron, Firefly or Boothill , and have gotten maximum stars in every MoC/PF/AS since v.1.2. f2p btw , and definitely not a lucky one, since I've lost half of my 50/50s (and one of my two 75/25s) , and I've hit soft pity in all banners except Kafka's (who is still using S1 GNSW ;.; ). My E6s are Serval, Tingyun, Herta and Trailblazer.

[@RJMeister21]

3 words "Tectone Skill Issue"

[@XiasGaming]

37:04 clear any content just with 4 stars is just for flex. We always wanna to use our 5 stars characters.

[@tuananhdang7385]

People HAVE NOT played other gacha games and have no clue what powercreep is. The best example is cookie run kingdom.(funny ik, but thats the last game i’ve played) People dont realize that the tier list there IS ACTUALLY VERY VALUABLE. Like no one ever will be able to clear with B or lower tier units simply because of the actual powercreep. Like u can still clear moc with Luka, sampo and others(apart from arlan, lets exclude him everywhere please)

[@AraYuannn]

Admittedly i brute force a lot of things esp in moc as long as the enemies don’t have super high imaginary res i can get away with my ratio hyper carry (he is e0s1 but i do have e2s1 aventurine which let me to run double harmony with him) in 1 or 2 cycles clear

[@cronoluminara6911]

Arlan has been powercrept lmao

[@Astamingo]

Why no one is talking about the background music at the beginning (after the Wii Theme) ? I need this banger please where's my hero ?

[@TheNeoDaedalus]

Iyo has some good points, but his vids would be much easier to watch if half or more wouldn't be "boo hoo some of you aren't listening to me" on repeat.

[@Starrky923]

bro is talking about time investment for the game like you can in any way influence what you do with the time while your daily activities are not only locked by time, resources but also rng lol

[@shotgunshogun4707]

Here's the reality..."powercreep" can only exist through in game mechanics and not playable unit releases. For example, if enemies from now on have an effect stating they're immune to debuffs, acheron and DoT are dead. Not weaker, completely and utterly dead. If said enemeis instead have none-removable tougness lockout (like sam before combustion state) then firefly and even boothill somewhat as well as all other current break focused units (luka, sushang, xueyi etc...) would also be dead and yes even ruan mei in terms of her break focused aspects in her kit. And as we saw with the new gamemode, all standard crit based dps/hypercarries are essentially "dead" unless if they break toughness well and even then they do nothing UNTIL they actually break. Powercreep does absolutely exist but not in the way the community loves presenting it by telling everybody their older units are now allegedly dogshit just for zibes and cause there's a new toy on the block. Seele has been called "bad" and "useless" by people since DHIL to this day and yet, she's the only unit to clear every single final MOC floor with 0 cycles as E0S0 with ONLY 4 STARS on record yet people still dunk on her despite NEVER even playing a day with her and just parroting what they hear(seele ain't the only example but it's the most clear one of how clueless people are about this game sometimes). So, as it currently stands, powercreep with how the community describes it doesn't exist and not even close to existing. If it did in the way people deem it, then how come everyone's only gotten vastly better and stronger than their initial release...literally everyone.

[@Ilasperr]

You really think firefly casually hitting 200k with half bulit artifacts moving at 200+ speed almost permanently isn't just flat out better than Seele in 99% of scenarios? In turn based games it's just numbers.

[@shotgunshogun4707]

@Ilasperr tho true (mostly), it's not the point of the argument...the point people make when they mention powercreep is that everyone else that came before is automatically bad by default yet that's not been the case in the game yet. People just can't fathom that just cause u have new toy don't mean u gotta discard the old one. And to touch on ur firefly point u made , I'll mention Sam...again. I can assure u 200 speed to only do 10k per turn is not impressive. Not to mention, Firefly can reach those numbers ONLY with HMC and ruan mei. Firefly is all nice and broken once the enemy weakness itself is broken but otherwise she's worse than dps march and that's being generous. Does that mean firefly is ass now? Fuck no, she's busted af...when she's allowed to which tbf is most of the time (but for how long?) That means it's a "it depends" scenario and not an automatic she's superior to seele or anyone else for that matter in "99% of scenarios".

[@IlyaV2]

​@@Ilasperr200k is her own super break alone I think, with HMC she's gonna do 400 500k most likely And as you said she has bad relics With 4 piece cavalry and good BE and ATK rolls she's gonna do way more than that My Boothill literally one shots argenti the moment he breaks him which takes 2 turns at most and 1 if you had Gallagher ult up break characters are objectively better than older DPS characters And even enemies that do lock their own weakness canbe defeated by them Sam boss just has to take 2 turns to unlock hes weakness Yanching locks he's weakness until you get rid of he's swords Or you could just kill him before he does that move The only one that can still be considered as good as firefly and Boothill is DHIL which I mean that's to be expected

[@latitude990]

Power creep is not the ability of a player to beat endgame content, it's a comparison of raw power level from launch to the current time. You are talking about direct and indirect buffs/nerfs. If Hoyo says that in 3.0 they are going to remove all the content in the game and restart fresh with completely new enemies etc, and you asked Prydwen to make a 3.0 tier list, most of the characters at the top of said tier list would be ones that were released later in the game's lifespan. It doesn't matter that you can insert a bunch of caveats to adjust your theoretical tier list and prove your own point, you have to take every thing in a vacuum. The fact is that even when a targeted MoC leaves, the characters that were good during those time periods still remain at that same level. The bias included for a targeted MoC isn't weighted as badly as you make it sound. Your example of Seele even further proves this point, because the general community shits on her (aka says she's not mega-god tier anymore) for a reason. If you're going to call everyone that fails with her an idiot with skill issue, then why don't they have skill issue with other characters? Her playstyle is not the most complicated thing in the world, especially having been out forever. She just has a higher bar to meet to get the same results, otherwise people would still say that she's top tier.

[@ch1dd]

Even those examples aren't powercreep, because they're not forcing one playstyle but instead making people use different alternatives. And they're all extreme, not something that would ever happen, and even then they're not powercreep. AS did the same, with buffs for specific playstyles that would be at a loss because of the new mechanics. To understand powercreep you need to usually look at pvp games, because that's when meta becomes the clearest, then pve games with the most egregious stage mechanics forcing units, to then look at HSR and realize powercreep never existed. Anything that could cause it the devs hid behind limited eidolons. In the gacha sphere, if anyone played Epic Seven, Arknights or Fire Emblem, they know for a fact what powercreep looks like. HSR is balance paradise. You're right about the community behavior though. It's been a year now and they haven't learned anything since 1.0. I have a theory that people are this clueless because they're from the genshin community without any perspective on the matter, since the game reached an audience that wasn't used to these concepts. What confuses me is how they have so much to say and dispute everything while being so ignorant about the subjects.

[@PJASSASSIN]

As a low spender, I don't think it's too hard to have that many teams. I have dot, fua, and break rn. They all perform pretty well and just use whatever I feel like playing. Just up to you, how much u wanna grind relics

[@Mr.Baba-Yaga]

Waiting for the next Gacha Cast so we can get a nice conversation about this going :)

[@TapewrmDFT]

almost at 100k, insane

[@burstterran6450]

As someone who started like 3 weeks ago, I just beat the last story and got caught up. Without Firefly, there is no way I'd have been able to beat up to now as easily as I have. I was able to beat the first snow area pretty easy with whoever, then the 2nd area was a ton harder until I pulled firefly and then I was clearing again. Even with her Pecony was still tough.

[@hoshisoul8529]

But isn't it normal for a new player to not be able to beat the hard content, especially endgame? As a day 1 player, I was able to clear MOC only after 3 or 4 months of actively playing (not all stars even, just finishing the last stage). In GI, it took me around 5 months, and even longer for my f2p friends.

[@ZWakeup]

Just started the game for 2 week-ish and definitely agreed that Ruan Mei and Firefly basically make me get through early of end game content very fast without good gears, now i need worry about 2nd team to finish all of end game content and i’m still thinking which team should be.. any suggestion?

[@clownasuka4490]

Acheron team, if u have a team with Acheron nothing will give u trouble rlly

[@tommyluo1409]

its so easy to make break teams useless. Make a boss that disables its own break bars until you break his shield-oh wait

[@MefoWho]

it does just make 4 teams 4head when they demand another kind of teamcomp just make 5 teams 4head It just wont stop lmao. First its double hypercarry, then you can add dot, then fua, and now break. At least thats all the archtype we can see on the surface, surely they wont add another one soon

[@kennethyoung7457]

They can easily make any team useless if they want enemy that is immune to crits would tank all hypercarry comps. Enemy immune the debuffs would tank all DOT and make nihihlity useless as a whole.

[@willburning6955]

The situation is even worse... Exist alread 1 enemy immune to super break

[@tommyluo1409]

@@dante19890 i get you, but my main point is that some type of damage are easier to be rendered useless than others. In this case, break team already got countered by the SAM boss. Compared to other cases, like if they want to make Acheron team useless, they have to either make enemies unable to be debuffed, or just not take crit damage, which has a way wider range of impact to the game-which makes them consider more before trying to implement it. Comparing to break teams, its a lot easier to implement as it won't affect other teams that easily.

[@howsitgoing84]

Should link the video with full 4 star clear too.

[@jere_miahc1]

Brute force does not exist.... Acheron E6S5 - Hold my beer.

[@rohit_boga]

There absolutely is significant powercreep lmao

[@Starrky923]

it didn't enter powercreep yet because it entered it 8 months ago with dan hang, then acheron and now firefly

[@regail7143]

Iyo hates it when people call him out but he make outlandish claims that he can't back up with proof. He also insults people who disagree with him only to do 180 flips. Anyone else remember when he said that Seele needed a sub dps???? Now she's a top 5 dps... Even as a dot main, this guy is talking crap. He said kafka deserved to be in tier 0 because she was strong as a hyper carry or with other dot units (not bs), but JY needed to be bumped lower... I saw his kafka at that time, it was dogshit.

[@NoName-kg4ve]

This!! , the number of times i saw him switchup , the sentence always pisses me off is when he says you don't need Signature Lc and edilons but proceed to contradict himself by saying this is not genshin bla bla bla and you need to vertically invest in character doesn't this means you need the character signature Lc and edilons brother pick a side man .

[@ch1dd]

Dude literally made a whole new account just to back this up, and you think he can't back it up. When anyone who can actually think agrees, even pokke who's always saying powercreep to everything as a joke agrees, and you guys missed the memo. He may not be right all the time, or rather be bad at presenting his point at times, but this one is both well presented and correct.

[@Tiasung]

Yeah that is a weird take. Kafka and JY both need another premium unit to be very good (BS and Sparkle).

[@Tiasung]

@@ch1dd I'm a theorycrafter myself, and still kind of shocked someone like Iyo can make an absurd take like this. Pokke btw is disagreeing with his overall point. He does recognise the existence of powercreep. Which ''anyone who can actually think'' agrees with. Its just so absurd to claim theres no powercreep when it so obviously exists in HSR at this point in time. Its no longer 1.2 or 1.3 where people were questioning if powercreep was a thing or not.

[@ch1dd]

@@Tiasung No, pokke said there's no unit powercreep, and the entire point of the video is that. f2p thinking they need every character or they can't clear the content because of powercreep, when it doesn't exist. Tell me what other games with powercreep you've played, that makes you think there's even a shadow of a hint of powercreep in HSR when the devs made sure to hide it all behind limited eidolons. I'll repeat, anyone who can actually think knows there's no powercreep, same with pokke, same with iyo, same with the theorycrafters clearing content without pulling in the entire account. Anyone with no perspective thinks there is, and is clueless.

[@r-jaybolante2144]

Hsr only needs to patch older dps characters damage ceiling or remove their niche because their kit was built for the early version of the game. Now that bosses have 1m hp most of the early characters fall off in clearing compared to newer. As f2p, now that hsr is increasing difficulty I'm considering getting idolons of my favs instead of newer characters. This way older characters will sell on reruns

[@daniellin569]

How else will people keeping pulling if the difficulty stays the same? Even Genshin is slowly introducing power creep to win back players.

[@kennethyoung7457]

Powercreep doesn't win back players if players are leaving genshin its not because of endgame content as 99% of the playerbase is casual and doesn't care about the current endgame or imaginarium theater.

[@pokestevers71]

As I believe that powercreep exists now, it doesnt mean that you cant beat the endgame content. Bro there's a dude on YT who has never summon on the account and he's beating content left and right with only the units that was given to him for free

[@DementedWisdom]

My first time clearing it 3* was with the same teams i 0 cycle last moc 12 with, jingliu hypercarry and acheron team. No break team and didn't even read the boss buffs and still did it first try. Yes jingliu team struggled a bit but you can still brute force game modes as of now. No im not f2p but not a giga whale either.

[@XiasGaming]

13:57 i clear Moc 12 using himeko too, but is more safe with Gallagher and not Boothill.

[@LichtVoltere]

The only power creeping issue in HSR is that its better than Genshit now

[@arslanabner572]

Powercrept is Yukong

[@shaka2tu]

I did study one hour before exam and graduate my computer degree😂 Sad thing is ,i dont remember anything after that exam😂

[@ParadoX-os]

Respectfully, who cares about what casuals think? If they decided to be casuals in a game, then they shouldn't expect to have the same results as someone who actually tries. I am a low spender (I buy monthly sub only) and I clear everything on auto max stars. If someone wants to cry about powercreep, then just try for once in your life, instead of being lazy to commit to something.

[@k.h6635]

Every patch, new unit have unique kit and capability applies weakness, that's all i can say. Powercreep = stay relevant.

[@PixlByPixl]

I've watched several videos of people who only use 4* characters to clear end game content with all rewards. Sure new units will always be stronger it has to sell but being F2P is not an excuse to not be able to clear content , even at low investment.

[@XiasGaming]

3:06 MrPokke and the bad take, for F2P the obvious answer is E0S0 in any character and if have luck S1 in DPS. And vertical investment mean E1 or E2 and S1 mostly the time, if the F2P get bad luck, will have just in E0 or E1 character and bad supports for the team. Example: where it is now DanIl E2 F2P player? I don't know nobody F2P with E2 DanIL so far.

[@kennethyoung7457]

People vastly underestimate how long you have to save jades to get a E2 character that might be 6 months or more of saving jades just for one character that will still be underwhelming without premium supports. Nevermind all the characters you have to skip its not even worth it. By the time you get E2 DHIL he will be powercrept anyway so trying to pull his eidolons for more power is wasting pulls at that point.

[@ReeStick]

TRUUUUE. As someone who cleared every piece of content since the release of 2nd sustain for my acc (fu xuan), I can say: you care more about support unit more than lightcone. Even playing f2p it's a viable strategy because you can juggle your core supports between teams with different core mechanics and clear content without ignoring current mechanics at all

[@generalsaverngild]

There's a difference between powercreep and playstyle. Skill makes up for powercreep and money makes up for playstyle. Choose whichever one you like and stick with it until the end. At the end of the day, were all playing the same game.

[@Qopa]

Theres no skill in hsr, it's all just luck. You could spend a whole year farming a god piece on acheron and by then, she would be like a B tier unit in v4.0. This is a common marketing tactic with honkai games since they priotized powercreep more than GI to have people keep on pulling for new units.

[@andrewhaydock5557]

@@Qopa Dude it doesn't take a year. Sure for optimal pieces it take a year. But why in the fuck do you need that. Just get something at all reasonable and you will fly through. Don't look for the SSS pieces. Just look for S pieces and they will do fine for clearing.

[@Qopa]

@@andrewhaydock5557 you would need godly builds if you want to beat the game with an underrated/old units via relying on no new op 5*. Literally 99% of the youtube, "i clear this", videos all abuse ruan mei, because every end game now wants ruan mei. Thats just how hsr is. I spent literally 4 months on acheron relic 4-set domain and i still havent gotten a single chest or boots with at least more than 1 crit roll on each. I basically gave up and put her on a no set build with 90/200, so i can work on recent new dps but shes still outperforming every 80/180 on-set characters like Jingyuan, blade, seele, and others. It's fair to say your statement is only true if you're abusing acheron.

[@generalsaverngild]

@@Qopa Couldn't be any more true. I've spent 140 caverns (5600 trailblaze power, which is around a month of power) on getting 4 DPS units to ~70/170 Crit Value and the only problem I have is damage. I can tell you right now that I don't fit in with the rest of the casual players since my luck is just a little higher. I can only clear 35/36 stars but that's what I get for not farming relics for 8 months. I also joined pretty late in HSR so I don't have some of the sustains. I enjoy other games but HSR is still something I go back to play once every other week.

[@mistick1709]

⁠@@Qopathat’s just not true at all considering we still have Mocs sometimes where dil just outperforms Acheron in average clear times.According to your logic he is a “B tier” just because Acheron and Firefly came out?Can this community think for once outside of the box when talking about character strength?

[@krazyaim]

Every niche has its strongest unit. It's not powercreep it's balance. Hot take