Is your string retainer correctly set up?

[@cimen9793]

one of the best guitar channel came back ;)

[@DevilAndSons]

Thank you, what a very kind thing to say. It's good to have content ready (or nearly ready) to start sharing again.

[@algrundau9441]

One thing that really helped me on attaining that desired "break angle" without having to crank the retainer bar so low is to wrap the strings to the very bottom of the posts. Of course this won't work well with locking tuners. (But who has those on a Floyded guitar?") Anyway, just as simple as it sounds. I go one wrap OVER the string at the post and all other wraps DOWNWARD until I hit basically the bottom of the post. You will notice much less need for the retainer bat, and if you do need one, it won't have to do as much work. Give it a try, you might like it. Thanks for listening. Cheers!

[@DevilAndSons]

I think that is a great tip regardless of the bridge type, it definitely will help on all guitars. I like locking tuners for the ease of changing strings, so they do have a bit of an advantage on a Floyd even if you don't need the locking part.

[@algrundau9441]

@@DevilAndSons Yes, Locking tuners, and a Graphtec nut and saddles ....maybe a bit of Nut Sauce. Stretch those strings. Stable tuning.

[@billysunday1391]

Thanks for the info Daniel. I didn't fully understand that, until you explained it

[@DevilAndSons]

My pleasure. Thanks for the commission!

[@edochtabienski8434]

Thx for the vid. I never understood with my old Floyd Rose everytime I tightened up the screws the pitch would change and I’d have to compensate with the fine tuners. My string tree wasn’t screwed down far enough. Great tips… thx🤘🤘

[@DevilAndSons]

Thanks for commenting. Glad it was helpful. Thi gs like this can easily be missed.

[@AlfredNazGates]

I was thinking of using a fender style string tree on my wolfgang guitar but after this video I dont think it will work cause of the floyd rose nut. Thanks. I just wanted something to make string changes more easier. I hate removing the string retainer each time I change the strings cause of the room needed.

[@DevilAndSons]

It depends on the angle, you may get away with strat style but obviously it won't be on the bass strings so if the angle isn't big enough you may see some tuning issues when you tighten the locking nut. Inwould recommend stick to the bar retainer even if it's pain. Thanks for watching

[@barrymoretzky8084]

Great video, please make one on how to measure it out to install it

[@DevilAndSons]

Oh, next time I get one in thatbwould be a good next step for a video.

[@tun-tunninc.6492]

How interesting. I'm thinking of doing this to my bass. Great tutorial.

[@DevilAndSons]

I think they look really smart, it could look good on a bass. Are you having a floating trem on your bass too?

[@tun-tunninc.6492]

@DevilAndSons I am!! I was thinking maybe it was the bridge. Never tool the saddle into consideration tho.

[@jhacobu4936]

Incredible video 🙏🙏🙏

[@DevilAndSons]

Thanks so much for such a kind comment.

[@olebrumme6356]

Is it possible to use a string retainer at an angle, on a fixed bridge guitar? I very much like the look over those string trees.

[@DevilAndSons]

Absolutely.

[@garychen483]

Now I understand how this works and why it’s needed. Question: will the retainer be pushed out of headstock wood due to the tension it creates by pressing down the strings???

[@DevilAndSons]

Thanks for watching. That shouldn't happen if it's been screwed in properly, the screws should easily resist that much force.

[@borgonianevolution]

I see the function and how you used the string retainer. I agree they are needed in some cases for non locking nuts. My thoughts are first the break angle on that particular nut is far too steep. That compounded by a "cosmetic" choice of tuners rather then a "functional" choice make this a really extreme case. I would have planed the seat of the nut so there was a less steep angle. Couple that with staggered height tuners for that particular neck and all that added tension on the head stock side could be lessened by a lot. I see a lot of people, builders, players , and techs that set up a guitar nicely from bridge to nut then shoot themselves in the ear with extreme angles before the bridge with stop bars or after the bridge with string trees and retainer bars. To me that steep angle kills sustain and adds a ton of extra tension on the strings (mostly in non trem / locking nut) set up making the playability more harsh on the fingers of the player. This extreme angle is also why I am not a fan of string thru bodies. That added tension on all those step angles is unnecessary. Those angles just need to be low enough to keep the string from jumping slots which is pretty much anything just below straight off the back side of the nut or leading edge of a bridge.

[@DevilAndSons]

Thus one actually has staggered pegs so doesn't really need the string retainer, but it looks cool. Are you suggesting I put the locking nuts in at an angle? That could work. I never thought if that. It would mean cutting the end of the fretboard at angle though so a bit tricky. The part of the string that goes from the nut to the tuning peg is locked off separate from the the string from the jut to the bridge and shouldn't vibrate at all when the string is plucked so won't make a difference to sustain.

[@borgonianevolution]

@@DevilAndSons I would probably make a shim to raise the tuner side of the nut to be better aligned with the tuners. I know on a locking system that will not effect sustain much if at all but it does however still put extra tension on the head stock having to pull strings in several directions rather then an un impleaded straighter line. I think that added tension transforms the entire head stock into a dampener killing off the resonance of the neck as a whole. It is probably subtle if my thoughts are correct but anywhere you can remove stresses you lessen the chance of twisting or warping when natural changes from humidity and temps occur.

[@DevilAndSons]

@Borgonian Evolution I understand what you mean about the headstock in greater tension. The only issue I have of putting the nut in at angle is adjusting the front end of the fretboard to fit perfectly l, but I guess not too difficult really.

[@borgonianevolution]

@@DevilAndSons Shouldn't be any issue regarding mounting up tight to the neck. The angle is still going to point down and away. It will just be less of an angle and an even better fit to the fretboard as it will meet more flat to the end if it.

[@DevilAndSons]

I think we may be talking about different things. The end of my fretboard is perpendicular to the to the top, the nut sits against it as it is also the same shape - I.e. they are both 90 degrees. If I shim the nut the part of the nut that touches the fretboard is no longer at 90 degrees and therefore there will be a gap at the top between the end of the fretboard and the nut. So I would have to cut the fretboard at an angle to match.

[@loegansamra6089]

Thank you very helpful

[@DevilAndSons]

My pleasure. Thanks for watching and commenting

[@davidmorgan130]

Thanks for the great video definitely subscribing! I just installed one onto an old Charvel i just picked up. Should the bar be even all the way across the strings or do the larger strings need less tension?

[@DevilAndSons]

Thank you so much, I really appreciate that. Essentially it's all about getting the angle correct when the strings leave the nut and go under the retainer, as long as the angle means the string is held correctly in the nut it really doesn't matter how far down the retainer goes, although the further down the less likely the string is to slip. So you may find there could be a difference in height at each end, but I like to level it as I think it just looks better and doesn't really make a difference. I hope that helps.

[@Tommi_D]

I have a Jackson warrior that I love but Ive spotted that with their Hockey stick heads the B and E strings are pulled to the right as they leave the locking nut. Can you use a string retainer to keep the High in a straight line as it exits the nut or will the rubbing on the retainers post cause issues?

[@DevilAndSons]

The retainer post won't really help I think, it doesn't have any grooves or anything to help line the string up, so it will probably still pull a bit. A traditional string tree for just those two, like on a strat, will help keep it straight but once the string passes through that it's going to pull anyway as I presume the thing that's pulling it to the right is the position of the tuning peg.

[@MattHazeMusic]

I have a Jackson flying V. It seems they have a natural angle built in, without using Retainers. Would adding one help some? or are they made to be without?

[@DevilAndSons]

The angled headstocks don't normally need them, but with a Floyd the angle may benefit from being tighter (so using a retainer). Do you notice the pitch change as you screw down your locking nut?

[@johntchb]

Have you any thoughts on the string butler?they seem really expensive for what they are.l think they are only for 3x3 set ups like l.p's. I try not to be too small about tuning slips that are only noticed by mechanised tuners.enjoy your work .

[@DevilAndSons]

They look very interesting, I'd live to try one out buy don't want to buy one especially. I'm not sure how useful they would be really.

[@algrundau9441]

I have 2....They are AMAZING......To be fair I did a few things to my Les Paul and Epi. I was having so much difficulty staying in tune with my Les Paul I was going to sell it. So I took a 5 point approach. 1----String Butler 2---Switched to using a wound G string ( I was promised this would help) 3---Graphtec nuts 4---Graphtec bridge saddles on Les Paul and roller bridge on Epi. 5---Started using "Nut Sauce" on the friction points/ All of the above and the tuning is now ROCK SOLID.....Among the best of any guitars I own, Some say it might only be 1 or 2 factors necessary. All I know is ALL my tuning issues are done with and over....Hope that helps. Cheers.

[@DevilAndSons]

@@algrundau9441 Excellent. All of these sounds like great points so if your guitar is that good now keep them all up!

[@algrundau9441]

@@DevilAndSons Thanks for the response.....Actually I HATE Floyds...hahaha....Especially the "floating part."....My heavy ham hands just can not handle the "Warble"....Believe it or not my favourite trem's are old Bigsby's and Fenders with 5 springs......And I am a METALHEAD...hahaha....ALL of my Floyded guitars are BLOCKED. ZERO movement.....So why the hell would I own ANY guitars with a Floyd.?....simple. Second hand sale's. Despite the Floyd, a lot of killer Metal guitars come with Floyd's. Often some kid will be told that "if he gets a Floyd he won't have to tune is guitar as much anymore."....Not explaining to the kid what a pain in the ass the rest of owning one is. So they immediately return them after they have to do one string change. (I can sympathise.).....Voila. Barely used Metal Shred guitar, on price reduced sale. Thanks for listening. Cheers.

[@DevilAndSons]

Ha, their loss is your gain!

[@Zashx99]

Great 👍

[@DevilAndSons]

Cheers 🤘

[@onlyfromadistance7326]

I have a Les Paul with a factory installed Floyd Rose, and no string retainer. Any suggestions? Doesn't really seem to need one, but i would appreciate your thoughts...

[@DevilAndSons]

The angle of the les paul headstock should actually be enough. You could check but loosening and tightening the nut to see if the string does move there, but my guess is you are fine. Thanks for watching.

[@patrickjamesworrow1130]

wish I had seen this video a way back,

[@DevilAndSons]

Thanks for finding it now though, and commenting.

[@patrickjamesworrow1130]

I let my guitars with FR’s go, as I started to struggle more & more with the set up’s. Have currently changed to guitars with 2 point floating tremolos and am now starting to regret it. Anyway we live and we learn.

[@DevilAndSons]

@@patrickjamesworrow1130 Absolutely. You have to do what is best for you. If you're happy with you have it then it may have even been a good change.

[@striderc1467]

Cool thaks

[@DevilAndSons]

My pleasure. Thanks for watching.

[@fobsternd]

should i tune with the retainer on or without it?

[@DevilAndSons]

With. It needs to hold the tuning when the locking nuts are screwed down, so everything has to be in tune with the retainer in place, if you put it on after tuning it will pull all the strings sharp.

[@fobsternd]

@@DevilAndSons one of my strings isn't changing pitch when I turn the peg

[@DevilAndSons]

Is it caught at the nut? That would mean it would get too tight and break. Or can you tell that when you turn the peg the piece that sticks through the headstock and the string attaches too isn't turning? In which case the peg is broken.

[@DanielHuman1996]

Ah ha, that's why my strings go sharp after I lock the nut!

[@DevilAndSons]

It's a simple fix, bit if you didn't know why ot happens you wouldn't know how to fix it. I hope this helps.

[@beyondinfinity3876]

🙏🙏

[@DevilAndSons]

Cheers

[@HoshijiroTS336]

My retainer bar keeps popping off 😂

[@DevilAndSons]

Do the screws come out? A quick fix is to stock the end of a cocktail stick on the hole then re-screw. It normally holds well like that.

[@HoshijiroTS336]

@@DevilAndSons yes they do. I will try that, thanks .

[@DevilAndSons]

@HoshijiroTS336 hopefully it will sort it out.

[@HoshijiroTS336]

@@DevilAndSons it worked like a charm. I meant to let you know yesterday, but I forgot 😂

[@DevilAndSons]

@HoshijiroTS336 excellent, I'm so glad. Thanks for letting me know.

[@kenbevis981]

Anyone ever tell you that watching you, feels like watching Tiny Tom Logan, only with the core subject being guitars? That's not a bad thing, by the way :D

[@DevilAndSons]

I just looked him up and watched the start of a few of his videos and really like the way he cones across, it feels very personal and like there's a story coming. Great call, thanks