Istanbul | Rahdo's Final Thoughts

[@ugurbicici2394]

I was born and grown in in Istanbul as a son of merchant father in old city district where inspired the game founder :) And my father even used to sell carpets like in the game, Rüdiger Dorn maybe passed by the shop of my father :)) So this game is special to me. Not something extraordinary to say but I wanted to get it off my chest :) Thanks for the videos btw, voted...

[@MassEffectFan113]

Easy Fix: Place the Dummy Merchant on the Sultan's Palace instead. Fixed. No cause for alarm. Paying 15 for a Gem Stone still takes longer than the method you mentioned. They would have to hit the tea house and post office to get enough money to hit Gem Stone dealer. If you would just try a different approach...

[@LarstigGeval]

Love the gemstone dealer/palace discussion. I almost never visit the Sultan's palace. I usually try to be the first to collect both tiles at the mosque thus earning me gemstones that way,

[@kevinregan6566]

Rahdo, I'm usually not one for Euro style games but this run through along with several others have shifted my opinions. May have to start picking up a few of these. Thank you again for taking the time to post these run through videos so we can all make intelligent decisions on board games that are available.

[@willang3433]

This is my pick for KdJ as well, although since I've not played Rokoko or Concordia, my ONLY pick, lol. I nearly spit my breakfast cereal out when you starting singing One Jump from Aladdin! That's exactly how I felt when I sent family members to beat out the competition just when they're one turn away from purchasing a ruby!

[@petec3250]

hey, i know its been a few years and you don't have istanbul in your collection anymore, but i thought i'd just weigh in for other future viewers who are checking out the game. 5:14 - That's assuming one player only focuses on the sultan's palace and the other player only focuses on the gemstone dealer. i noticed you pigeon holed yourself and jen into that when you did this run through. jen could have easily snagged a gem or two from the sultan's palace - making it harder for you to get the next because of your smaller wheel barrow. a couple of times she had her nephew just sitting in jail and she could have easily sent him to sultans palace and gotten a gem on her way to the gemstone dealer where she was going to buy her gem. she totally should have won in the run through. maybe group-think? from watching your videos, i know you prefer less confrontation in games, so maybe your gaming style affected your play of this game - you tend to go off and do your own things with minimal interference. when my wife and i play game (2-players) the winner does a little bit of both the sultan's palace and gemstone dealer. it just depends on opportunities that come up. but really, for most decent euros, going all-in with one strategy and neglecting other point scoring opportunities isn't as powerful as being flexible. having said that, i am actually not a big fan of istanbul. lol. i'll play it, but i prefer euro games with more weight. my wife likes it, so we play it :). the art is nice. it is a good looking light game. we also use it as a gateway game although i disagree your imbalance argument, i do have another beef with the game - abusing paths. i feel like it doesn't take long for you to figure out a path (call it your gem-making engine) and just go back and forth for many turns in row. You can really abuse that early in the game with the post office. I feel cheap when I do it, but the game lets me, so i do it :). i guess that's what you would call breaking the game.

[@jeffgoggin1394]

Sal Conz I did my own research on this myself. I used only the gem dealer/teahouse combo vs the black market/sultan's palace combo. I called "7" for every roll and applied the roll results to each player at the palace and dealer respectively. Once they had enough goods or money they spent the next turn redeeming them for a gem. The sultans palace earned a gem on turns 4,11,14, and 20 (after that it's not possible to go to the palace without a wheelbarrow upgrade which takes turns and money) the gem dealer earned a gems on turns 4,9,13,17 and 22. The gem dealer was also ready to get a 6th gem without an upgrade in 4 or 5 more turns. Purely between these 2 I wouldn't say the sultan's palace was more powerful especially in the 2 player in which case it's not even possible to get more than 4 gems without a wheelbarrow. Time the other player could be spending at the tea 🏠.

[@eeHalcyon]

Hmm, interesting. I asked about the palace vs. gem stone dealer on the extended gameplay video and it looks like you had the same thought! I will venture that the palace may be better at first, but timing and various other circumstances may make the dealer better as the game progresses, especially in the mid-to-late game after the Palace has been used a few times. Maybe it would be worth testing a house rule to put a starting merchant on the palace instead of the dealer?

[@TorIverWilhelmsen]

I feel the Sultan's Palace is balanced in the sense that it has far fewer gems than the gem stone dealer... as long as everyone knows about the "imbalance" they will probably start out going for the palace first until it is empty, simply because it is "easier" in the start.

[@rahdo]

that balance assumes that everyone is going to go for the palace because "they have to" because it's cheaper, which would be unfortunate because it means the gem merchant isn't (on average) a viable path to victory and the game becomes more scripted (in 2p) which is my worry.

[@kosterix123]

Totally agree. It is about pattern recognition, always amazing, plus hindering subtly others. Nil downtime, every time different. And shiny pretty rubies. An the sudden sense of urgency once 1 player is 1 ruby short of a victory... Announced end 2016 still one of the best games ever. It's not a 2 player gane, it's a gateway game.

[@mayneric]

DAMN YOU RICHARD!!!!!!! (fists shaking) Another game I now desire to own after watching you play it.

[@silverfang6668]

There is a variant that we play with that I believe would eliminate the problem you referred to while making the game more interesting. We use the gemstones from our copy of fantastiqa which come in several colors, randomly distribute them on the board, and have a house rule that your wheel barrow can't have two stones of the same color adjacent to each other. p.s., I agree that while this game is fun, Concordia is the better game.

[@rahdo]

neat idea!

[@slysof6436]

Hi, you read my mind! I was looking for a runthrough of this game and the next day TA DA a Rahdo runthrough appears. Thanks. Again, you did such a good job of explaining the game that I bought it.

[@TyphoidBryan]

I likened this game, in a different review, to Euphoria. Being efficient with your moves and not giving yourself a lot of downtime is a definite advantage towards winning.

[@MikeThomas-ws9tu]

In regards to the unbalance between the gemstone dealer and sultans palace with the two player game, I would just make a house rule to either put the neutral players at both locations or at the big and small mosc or use the dice and place them randomly like the governor and smuggler

[@ivanristov5835]

I think that gem stone dealer could be far better choice, if it is close to the tea house Also if you first maximize profits with the market then you can concentrate to getting gems for example 2 actions btw market and some warehouse. you dont have to deliver all goods to change the order so sometimes you will get more sometimes less Lira but once you stockpile enough lira you can go to gem stone dealer and you can also swich btw gemstone dealer and tea house or drop by the police station. But on the other hand you can do this with post office and sultan palace if they are close so it really depends on the game setup which is awesome. Also I would like to say that this place in Istanbul is called Kapali Carsi and it is very beautiful and the rubies you can see them in the museum, which is the sultans palace :)))

[@YakovPetrovich]

I think you're right about the Palace and the Gem Stone Dealer, but aren't there more ways to get money? There's the tea house and also special cards that give you money. If you have the re-roll ability you could be raking in the tea house cash to buy gems with. Seems like in a 2p game the Palace will get some more action in the beginning of the game but I can see the Gem Stone Dealer being very handy mid-late game (especially after the Palace prices have increased a lot).

[@YakovPetrovich]

Also how about just rolling for the dummy merchants at the beginning of the game? Doesn't seem like that would change much.

[@YakovPetrovich]

I've never played Istanbul though, so maybe I'm wrong. I'm still eagerly awaiting until it is released in Canada. Come on June!

[@rahdo]

right, but palace prices don't really raise very much over the course of a 2p game (with 4/5 it grows hugely, but not in 2/3). it's not that gem merchant isn't a viable way to get gems... it's that palace is so much faster, and doesn't require random chance of rolling for money... :)

[@YakovPetrovich]

***** Hmm good point. You know I really like the idea you (or was it someone else?) mentioned in the BGG thread to remove a second gem whenever somebody buys one. When I get the game I will definitely give that idea a try since I play most of my games two player as well. Seems like the perfect way to balance it. Thanks for the runthrough as always Rahdo!

[@mgmccoy100]

Hey Rahdo, I've been a fan of yours for a long time now (over a year) and I really appreciate what you do. You have helped me to expand my board game collection in a well informed way. That being said, I wanted to offer a suggestion. In more of your recent videos, it seems like you spend a very long time in the Gameplay Runthrough videos talking before you start playing. In some of your earlier videos, I think you would spend a few minutes talking about the game (if that) and then you would dive into the gameplay and explain as you went along. More recently, I feel like I want to skip to about the 15 minute mark of the video because you go through so many of the potential strategies and rules. I feel like you still explain whats going on as you play, so its like you explain a lot of strategy and rules at least twice, once before you play and during play. In my opinion, I would rather you just jump into the game play mechanisms right at the beginning of the video and let us see how they work as you go. Sorry for the rambling message, tl;dr, Start game play sooner, spend less time talking about the game and just play it.

[@rahdo]

yeah, it varies from game to game. i basically want to get into the gameplay as fast as possible, but I want the gameplay to make sense, and sometimes i think it helps to have a little bit of context before i jump right in. i'm not saying i get it perfect every time... i just kind of go on instinct. :)

[@mgmccoy100]

***** Yeah I understand that. Again, I'm a big fan of yours. I got Village, Race for the Galaxy, and Castles of Burgundy on your recommendation. Maybe I am remembering wrong (wearing rose-colored glasses) but that is just the impression that I have had for a while now. Thanks for the reply!

[@masterbridgemaster1]

***** For what it's worth, I appreciate the initial context you provide in the opening of the videos, be it 1 min or 15. I think it is important to "set the stage," as it were.

[@hotice88uk]

Hi Rahdo. I might be missing the point, but if the gemstone dealer were a blank tile would you have a problem with there only being the one "seller" of gemstones (the sultan) rather than having two options? If one is exclusively better, yes it might alter the decision-making landscape between a 3/4 player game and a 2-player game, but is that inherently an undesirable thing?

[@rahdo]

one of the game's strengths is that there are a several ways to pursue victory. if you took one of the major ways out of the game, I think it would weaken, especially since a big part of the game is avoiding "following in the footsteps of others". it'd still be a good game, but not as good a game :)

[@hotice88uk]

***** I see, fair enough :) Thinking again I guess an imbalance not only makes the gemstone dealer tile somewhat less relevant, but also any other tiles used in that strategy. Thanks for the reply, and for the excellent runthroughs you keep producing!

[@keseph7749]

I have played this a few times. It's all about never having to waste moves going back to that fountain. If you do that you are doomed

[@joeldalangin2427]

I've just played 2 games of this, thanks for the playthrough, it's as good as you said.

[@knehren]

Have u tired putting the dummy merchant on the Palace instead of the Gemstone Dealer? It may balance it out...

[@rahdo]

could be... but i've got to move on to the next game and don't have time to experiment with variants! :)

[@veerchasm1]

Would you consider this a PU&D? (I know you've said you aren't a big fan of those).

[@rahdo]

yup, very much PU&D

[@kosterix123]

What is that

[@rahdo]

pickup & deliver

[@DavidDoughan]

san juan card game or istanbul? trying to pick one. which would you choose?

[@kosterix123]

Always Istanbul

[@J-Wheeler-G]

We have played 4 and 5 players and we found out that the Gemstone dealer is way better than anything else.

[@FarkyJ]

ok since freaking english version of targi cost in my country 27€. i will pay the 5€ and get this game probably.i am kinda charmed by it.and i totally agree that this or concordia should win.i am one of those who would play istanbul very rarely with 2 players.so the unbalance issue dont bothers me that much. ps:seems like your camera starting to get some issues lately. it doesnt focuses some times. even the colour saturation is sometimes weird.

[@kipik2]

well, maybe you'd better save 5 and buy Targi ;)

[@FarkyJ]

nah targi is good but i rather buy a game for more people.i have some 2 players games anyway now. targi german version cost in my country 15€ and english 27 thats too much

[@kipik2]

well... targi is just a killer with 2. One of the best 2pl games to date ;)

[@FarkyJ]

well i believe you totally :D

[@Physiology-E-Paathshala]

I love it. Period.

[@raulsanchezyellow]

Nice work thanks

[@randybookman]

You should try the game royal palace

[@rahdo]

it's a very good game, we have it :)

[@EddieInzauto]

Just always call a 12 and roll double sixes at the Tea House. Problem solved.

[@joeldalangin2427]

Please do a KS where you will perform the whole Aladdin song👍🏻😀

[@rahdo]

+Joel Dalangin next time, better use a nom de plume!

[@ElScotterino]

You kinda look like the guy on the box.

[@LosthorizonPT]

Wa alaykumu s-salam :P