It was THEM all along!? - Solving the Mystery Leads to Farum Azula's Past Elden Ring Lore Theory

[@Greaseball01]

I've always assumed Greyoll is just weighed down by years worth of rot and can't move but also can't die

[@ghostly_number]

Don't think so we literally see what a dragon with rot looks like, and greyoll looks nothing like that. It's much more plausible that she's just really old and can't move much or that she wants to die

[@mushroomy9899]

Interestingly, Greyoll moves if you wait a very long time, weather this is intentional or not is up for debate, but it is cool

[@creativename2567]

​@@mushroomy9899It moves? Huh?

[@Pandemia616]

She's weighed down by her dump truck ass.

[@mushroomy9899]

@@creativename2567 yeah, you can test for yourself, just punch it with ur bare fists for awhile, she’ll stand up and kill you

[@Moss_and_Such]

It’s just that the giant giants seem way older than evrything else. The big big dragon seems almost freshly slain. I know that Elden Ring has some weird stuff with time, but i feel those giant skulls are embedded into the landscape to signify their prehistoric nature.

[@fireemblemistrash75]

I believe they were around before the start of the crucible. I cant source correctly what said it but often these giants whom are truly COLOSSAL as primordial and the ancestor to many giants ancestors

[@angryeric2961]

I was under the impression there were primordial giants before the arrival of the first Elden lord, Placidisax. After the rule of Ancient Dragons, the Fire Giant rose to power before Marika came around. Yeah the massive drake corpse in jagged peak doesn't look to old or decayed (unlike the massive giant skulls we find in Caleid which are delayed)

[@johnwaters1768]

theres an item that you can loot on the skeletons of those giants i cant remember what its called but the description basically describes it as a something that grew on the megagiants during the age of the primordial crucible implying that they predate even the adaptation of the crucible we see in Enir alim

[@highlightermarca-texto3281]

It also doesn't make sense sizewise, Greyoll is as big as the skull next to her. The dragons would've been the size of songbirds to these titans

[@xianfa1708]

i thought it was a pretrified dragon corpse owO

[@lockepersonal]

Ancient Meteoric Ore Greatsword: Fashioned from an excavated shard of an arrowhead that once was a part of the old gods' arsenal. A capable piercing weapon that excels at thrusting attacks. Pretty sure those gigantic skeletons are the "old gods"

[@ZayftheScholar]

I like it!

[@souza6945]

Tarnished archeologist video on the divine towers talks about these "giant" giants, in a nutshell they were the ones who built the towers and worshiped the fell god, same one from fire giants.

[@inkpendude]

​@@souza6945can't be. The towers are related to the two fingers or fingers in general. You can see the snake like enemy that you find at the finger ruins in the walls of the towers.

[@spicec3613]

@@inkpendudethey could’ve been repourposed

[@Elderester]

@@inkpendude yea, that was repurposed by the new religion, like Easter

[@a-rah9001]

Trolls partook in dragon communion,Thedorix's magma states the name of ancient troll warrior thedorix lives on-a hero of the war against the giants

[@maximedaunis8292]

The dragonkin soldiers look more like trolls than the wyrms do so it's weird

[@ZenzerAlfancar]

@@maximedaunis8292 he is saying the trolls that took part became the magma wyrms... probably

[@imannam]

I don't wanna see how big one of these ancient giants would get as a Magma Wyrm

[@TommieTheCommie]

​@@ZenzerAlfancar becoming a wyrm is the fate of all partakers of dragon communion, Theodoraxe is a troll who suffered this same fate as all, becoming a wyrm, a more powerful one at that, presumed because he ate more hearts, he drops 3 if I remember correctly, or was it 2

[@shiroamakusa8075]

The titans would have reached more than half a kilometer into the sky. Even mighty Charo (what I call the giant dragon corpse in SotE) would have only come up to their pelvis when standing up and all other dragons would be like cats and mice to them. I very much doubt they could have been lured into huniting dragons for power. The Fire Giants are probably distant descendants of them as we can see the generations become smaller over time. My theory is that Gransax stuck that crag-harpoon into Charo's neck. He is big enough and his own personal weapon has about the same size.

[@victorpedrosoceolin3919]

More likely than the acient colossus, it could also have been a gigantic ranged weapon built by the fire giants, or just a really big fire giant

[@Actual_real_ValStrax]

Gransax wanted to be the largest, so he killed the competition Until Godwyn

[@Omar-um4nn]

​@@Actual_real_ValStrax Godwyn?

[@Actual_real_ValStrax]

@@Omar-um4nn giant dragon corpse in lendal was killed by Godwyn who was a demigod

[@Omar-um4nn]

@@Actual_real_ValStrax The huge ancient dragon in the royal capital is called Gransax yes but It was a joined effort, the entire royal capital fought him, including Marika, the Elden Lord at that time either Godfrey or Radagon, and all the demigods inside the capital Godwyn defeated Fortissax and some other ancient dragons

[@jojothehamster]

I would assume that Malakith hides in Faram Azula to ensure no one can touch destined death. He would know of its existence and be one of the few beings able to go there after it became skyborn. I cannot help but find the idea of an entire city on top of a volcano popping of into the sky like a cork funny. But its more likely that Placidusax moved it there as a response to his era basically ending. Kinda like taking his ball and going home waiting for papa and mama will to come home.

[@Sohelanthropus]

That doesn't explain the statue of the child being guarded by 3 wolves at Malikeths arena There's some connection there we haven't yet figured out

[@jojothehamster]

@@Sohelanthropus the connection may go deeper but the reason he'd hide there is to hide destined death.

[@thepublicpotato3887]

Plasidusax is clearly in a desperate attempt trying to preserve his era and culture in anyway he can out of desperation hence why he’s waiting for his god to return

[@jimbo2553]

There's many statues of beast clergymen alongside dragons in farum azula itself, so clearly they were part of dragon society in some way. It's still strange to me that the only previous elden lord we know of before marikas reign is placidusax, and nothing points to the Hornsent ever having been involved in control of the eldenring. Whoever was the god that fled during placidusax era created the age of the crucible, and we have no mention of another age in between this and the age of the erdtree. When placidusaxs God fled, did this cause the age of the crucible to end, and marika was filling a void? Or did marika have to seize the runes much as the tarnished does to choose a new age? You would think there would have been at least a few dragons that would have had great runes in this case.

[@thepublicpotato3887]

@@jimbo2553 The shaodw of the erd tree trailers talks about seduction and betrayal could Marika have gained the trust of the crucible god and then usurping him and establishing the golden order

[@fredscoffee]

Placidusax setting itself in stasis through time is an anomaly big enough to fully distort farum azula and sent it to space

[@xianfa1708]

i thought that was just time travel, bkoz his bones are found someplace in farum azula

[@mansourshafei733]

@@xianfa1708nah that was debunked a while ago, the bones were just a normal ancient dragon

[@xianfa1708]

@@mansourshafei733 i see owo

[@Morrov]

I always imagined Farum Azula to have been located where Radahn's arena currently is, there's a lot of stone ruins there, and there's a huge circular piece of the land missing that's pretty much the perfect size for FA. The Farum Greatbridge would also connect the city proper to the Bestial Sanctum.

[@person-dm3ej]

thats actually really smart

[@Lazarus_Cardinalis]

Not likely at all. All evidence suggests Bayle's arena was the site where Placidusax's was located first

[@braedenaldridge8452]

I definitely think that Faurm was sent skyward after the fight with Bayle. As his wings were destroyed and both dragons seriously injured. This would have kept him from being able to return and finish what he started

[@SomeRandomGuy_818]

That might also be the reason why we find Bayle on the Jagged Peak because it’s the highest spot that he could reach on foot and is really close to Farum Azula so he might’ve tried to access it from there.

[@Ron_Jambo_]

Bayle can fly, he can spawn new wings out of pure hatred, like he does in phase 2.

[@braedenaldridge8452]

@@Ron_Jambo_ yea but we don’t know how long it took for him to get to hay ability. And by the time he was able, he was clearly locked away in the shadow realm by Marika.

[@ungratefulingrate1268]

Bayle ran away. Couldn't kill Placi even though he attacked first

[@AscendantStoic]

Maliketh might have been a beastman who was taken by the two fingers and elevated to become a shadow for Marika (same for Blaidd and Ranni), in a sense the two fingers are copying what the dragons did when they had beast men serving them when they were elden lords (kinda like how the wolf-like shadows serve those chosen by the two fingers). Also something I heard other people bringing up recently, Placidusax "god" who fled might after all be Metyr after she got slashed by the finger slaying blade (leaving her in a debilitated state we meet her in and with a clear wound on her chest) .. remember when we defeat Elden Beast it says "God defeated" .. so if Elden Beast and Metyr are considered "gods" (direct representatives of the greater will) and Metyr came first to the lands between it makes sense she was acting as a god for the dragon elden lords, her getting slashed and escaping left Placidusax in a vulnerable position, so Bayle took the chance to try and usurp his throne, that theory is quite strong IMO.

[@cardgameenjoyer7446]

But it says legend felled when u defeat metyr

[@AscendantStoic]

@@cardgameenjoyer7446 Hmmmm, fair point, but note two things, she has been severely injured and basically replaced by the Elden Beast as the defacto god of the world ... also she doesn't die at the end of the fight, she escapes through a black hole.

[@kag2576]

I have been puzzled for a while where the shadows come from and why only Marika and Ranni seem to have one (like despite being an empyrean as far as I can tell Miquella doesn't have one) And I agree with Placidusax having a god that fled that's not an outer god, if only because he is explicitly referred to as the Elden Lord of his time. I know less if it's Metyr or someone unknown. My brain goes to the Gloam-Eyed queen if only because she's in Farum Azula when she fights Maliketh. There are a lot of pieces here that are a mystery and I don't know the lore in enough detail to figure it out🥲

[@cardgameenjoyer7446]

@@AscendantStoic placidusax head is geq sword so its totally geq

[@Bodgie7878]

​@@AscendantStoicthat is her death animation, but then how do we obtain weapons made from parts of her if she isn't dead?

[@vollgereat]

Id argue that it was Gransax who did this. He is big, he is known to wield a spear and since he is one of the ancient dragons, he hates Bayles bloodline. The spear has throwable size and Gransax himself is the second largest dragon in the entire series (only topped by this Drake, who i assume is called "Charos", since the area is called "Charos hidden grave", and nobody else is burried there, so its likely that this is his name)

[@KogasaTatara514]

My personal belief is that the beastmen from the dragon's pit attempted to recreate Farum Azula after it took to the skies and as such were "abandoned" by Placidusax, then turned to Bayle as their new lord, but perhaps they were either killed by Bayle or simply refused to serve the tyrant long before New Farum™'s completion. It's very likely the beastmen were the ones who created the actual architecture of Farum, given their practices of literally burying themselves within its structure, as well as just simply being more fit to construct buildings than full-sized dragons. Additionally, the addition of the beastmen there is more evidence of Farum Azula's former location being there.

[@ZayftheScholar]

New Farum™️ is too good 😂

[@BovineIntervention]

When was it ever up for debate that it was the beast men who built farm azula? Like 15 items point directly to this and dragons are way too big.

[@KogasaTatara514]

@@BovineIntervention I always believed it, but I've seen people say it was the ancient dragons themselves in human form or the draconians (character creator lore)

[@Iffem]

"I'LL MAKE MY OWN FARUM AZULA! WITH BLACKJACK! AND HOOKERS!"

[@McDudes]

But I dont think theres any evidence to support that the dragons and drakes had any interest or practice with architecture and building buildings. The beastmen theory is more likely though

[@Shaboinki]

I agree with your map. These are the spots where I would also place Farum Azula and the Shadow Lands. Would be cool if FromSoft can now finally provide a completed map to confirm our theories.

[@ZayftheScholar]

They never will, but I agree it would be cool 😭

[@powerhcm8]

If they ever make any other thing with Elden Ring they give more clues but no confirmations while creating more questions, unless it's central to the plot.

[@samplexample]

@@ZayftheScholarthe shadow map isn’t meant to be placed on top of the lands between map as is. Disperate parts of the lands between map have been torn off, and congealed in the shadow realm. Evidence shows Rauh was originally in limegrave.

[@unbearable505]

​@@samplexampleWhat evidence is there for your last claim?

[@teno777]

@@samplexampleYeah but it’s a good enough approximation. I could immediately find similarities between the land of shadows and the lands between when I was exploring, and the locations’ counterparts. It’s the most evident with rauh and the jagged peak. That being said, they certainly had to take gameplay into consideration when making the new areas, so not everything could fit like a jigsaw puzzle.

[@johnwaters1768]

the japanese translation for greyoll is more close to "mother of many dragons" than mother of all dragons. its possible that both greyoll and the enormous corpse we see were both mates of Bayle since the dragon priestess seems to imply all drakes descend from Bayle. edit: another side theory based on absolutely nothing that i considered was that the dragon priestess is the one who killed and consumed the giant dragon and used the heart in the process of transforming her from an Ancient Dragon to a humanoid, because she tell us she was once an ancient dragon who sized down to teach men dragon communion. im probably totally wrong but just putting it there

[@DaSplorchedOne]

There is evidence of tool (or at least weapon) usage from dragons too. There’s Gransax in Leyndell, obviously, and the ancient dragons do use weapon-like spells. It would totally be possible that if a drake got that big, an ancient dragon could be at least as large

[@asterodon]

The item description of the Ruins Greatsword says: "Originally rubble from a ruin which fell from the sky, this surviving fragment was honed into a weapon." and "The ruin it came from crumbled when struck by a meteorite, as such this weapon harbors its destructive power." The use of words like "crumbled" and "ruin" seem very intentional to me. We can find crumbled ruins dotted about in Limgrave and Liurnia that share the same architecture of Farum Azula where we find ruin fragments which item descriptions read, "Stone fragment found near places where ruins have fallen from the sky. These shards of stone are believed to have once been part of a temple in the sky. They glow with a faint light from within." Something that's also noteworthy is the similarity in design that the Dragon Hunter's Great Katana's scabbard shares with the Ruins Greatsword, the sort of stone texture of the Ancient Dragons and the gold also associated with them. Anyway, love your videos Zayf, keep it up

[@Ron_Jambo_]

Gold is associated with the Golden Order.

[@BrayH-hz5db]

⁠@@Ron_Jambo_but the dragons also have gold on them like pacidusax or fortisax or the dragon tree sentinels who’s armor is made out of dragon bone which is gold

[@WanderedIn]

Notably, meteoric impacts in Elden Ring can make things float - the star loosed by the death of Radahn leaves a trail of gravitational distortion and rubble in the sky. Farum Azula could have been struck in the same way and remained in the sky as a result, after being first raised up by some other means.

[@joshbest1929]

I was just thinking to myself, the entire land being built around entombment, and having large inanimate fingers accompanying dead humanoid skeletons, it makes sense as a motif

[@YinTiger]

Super cool video, learned a lot. Long story short: I agree with you. Also, there is another lore video covering Story of the war between the Giants and the Dragons, and basically what happened to Greyoll.

[@Writh811]

There is a snag with your merged map. The Land of Shadows isn't that big compared to the rest of the Lands Between. After a lot of pain staking measuring and such (I don't have mod tools or anything like that I have to walk and count and really on others' videos showing the scale of things like the Scadutree) The Land of Shadow is actually a little bigger than the combined footprint of Altus and Gelmir. Once I got that scale figured out I aligned the Tower of Suppression over the immediate center of the map. I found Jagged Peak fit pretty nicely about where you have it and the Scadutree ended up overlapping where the Erdtree is on the map. With the maps overlayed I went back and made sure the structures I knew would be present before the Crusade would also be visible. The base of Limgrave Divine tower seems to sit near the Stone Coffin Fissure. The East Altus tower seems to rest at the fork just west of FingerStone Hill. Caelid Tower sits on the southern edge of Jagged Peak. Before we ever knew about the Shadow Lands I argued that the West Altus Tower us to be located just West of the Minor Erdtree Church, making it the destination for the Divine Bridge that runs out of Leyndell/Fortified Manor. Seems when the shadows lands were displaced the cliff sank and shifted east. But putting it back there and readding the Shadow Lands it would conjoin that part of Altus to the Rauh Base just north of the Bear Boss there.

[@ZayftheScholar]

Really interesting. Have you posted an image with the scale as you describe it? I did my best with the info I had and other threads I have seen on the subject but I admit I doubt I got it perfect in the end 😅

[@theycallmecoconutjones7175]

I need to see this map, the overlays people have posted have been great starting points but i have been bothered by a few things and I think getting a proper context and scaling of the shadow lands size will help peace together a better picture of whats going

[@Writh811]

KZbin didn't like me trying to post a link :(

[@MisanthropicOcellus]

This. No one has done an overlay correctly but you have the same thoughts as i do. Plus a few visual clues on the LB map help place the LoS map

[@yakanono]

@@Writh811chop the link up And we’ll assemble it

[@Behlial92]

Before the DLC came out I hoped the map would fit more or less perfectly in the center of the map and finishing the DLC would remove the veil and make it show up in the Lands Between again. I expected it to not happen but I think it would've been really cool.

[@ZayftheScholar]

Agree, that would have been amazing! I was actually of the idea that we might be able to reveal the DLC map using the towers somehow. Totally wrong in the end 😅

[@Behlial92]

@@ZayftheScholar Would've been an nice option too but I think they would've needed to change how the towers work because you need to kill the associated shardbearer of each tower to be able to go up, if I'm not mistaken.

[@jimbo2553]

I still am of the opinion that the divine towers are actually what is keeping the shadow lands seperate from the lands between. There is clearly an active spell of some sort with shadows flowing downwards in all of them, with the walls actively glowing with whatever magic is still being maintained.

[@mr_0bservant328]

@@jimbo2553 I just had a Jimmy Neutron brain blast! We see in SotE that the Scadutree is covered in shadows that flow down and all of the divine towers as you said have shadow magic flowing down, ALSO in a trailer for SotE, we saw Miquella cleansing the Scadutree of the shadow and all of the divine towers surround the suppressing pillar which is at the very center of both maps when overlaid. It may not mean this but I think that the divine towers are acting as miniature suppressing pillars that Marika is using to hide the land of shadow from the lands between! The towers always felt way more important than just great rune power storages and on that note, while yes the demigods have the great runes, their power is in these towers which may be a part of how Marika hid the land of shadow; by using the power of the great runes inside the Elden ring before the shattering. I have no idea when this would be, but I know it would be after Marika left the land of shadow and became a god, and before the shattering of the Elden ring. ALL SPECULATION, but I seriously think I’m onto something big here!

[@SaxSlaveGael]

Another absolutely banger full of fascinating things I never noticed! But thats probably cause of my current blindness from Bayle Fire Lightning attacks.

[@ZayftheScholar]

Thanks so much Sax!

[@maugwei]

Damn! I was literally thinking of taking the map and putting it in the same place as you did in the video, but I keep being distracted by dad life. I’m so glad my hunch paid off.

[@ohno-x8m]

8:30 I'll have to look through my inventory, but I swear there were item descriptions that implied Farum Azula had been struck by a meteor. That had led me to the assumption that there was something gravitational going on, similar to the vortices of floating rocks we can find above the impact crater in Limgrave. Or maybe the descriptions point to it being struck by a meteor after it was already in the air--I'm not sure. Guess I know what I'm hunting for between invasions tonight.

[@santiagolara4846]

I just found your channel, I have seen only 2 videos and I already love them, you do great content, just incredible; narration, research, theories and the beautiful scenes. great job man

[@Voidload]

You have a very soothing voice. Love to listen to it honestly. Anyway I would really love to learn more about Elden Ring's past civilizations. Especially Placidussax world of crucible and that pupetteer enslavement civilization in the siofra and ainsel rivers. Just a note - when you enter nokstella (or nokron not sure which one atm...) there is a really giant throne with a really giant skeleton on it (or maybe just a giant ring again don't really remember). So I wonder what were the giant's connections to the underground civilizations in the past.

[@Cardiocab]

While you were suggesting that it was the giants who chased down and hunted the dragons, killing the large one, I noticed something. At the grand alter of dragon communion, there is a very big but old bowl that contains the fire, oddly enough, the fire giant we fight uses a bowl very similar to it. It’s possible that the bowl with the dragon communion fire was used by another giant, and it dropped it there after being defeated

[@SmallOneEyedKing]

What the heck? Your theories have good evidences I love it. MY MIND IS BLOWN.

[@torg2704]

My thoughts are that the Land of Shadows getting separated from the Lands Between created the Crumbling Faram Azula (if we are to asume it was at the top of Jagged Peak) the elevation falls in place. The storm might be created by the surviving Ancient Dragons to keep the place from Crumbling (we can see dragons flying in the distance in the storm). For some reason (most likely Plasidusax's Power) Farum Azula did not get sent to the Land of Shadow with Jagged Peak and got separated.

[@Xanderj89]

I wonder if it was just out of reach, like it carved out a sphere and faram at the top of the mountain was just at the cutoff

[@ponz3974]

Some of those giant’s remains absolutely make those massive giant dragon corpses look small. I never even noticed the skull next to the mother dragon. From Software needs to make a giant that large for us to fight in a game.

[@jays.6843]

The engine can't actually handle it. Zullie The Witch has tried giving Greyoll proper animations and it totally destroys the framerate, then crashes the game.

[@darkbornelines4587]

Yea, that skullnis massive, wouldnt they just be able to step on the drakes instead of using a spear lol

[@luoxis]

​@@jays.6843as of today ? Sure. But in the future, it can always be done

[@mangodango1733]

I want a giant like that to just be a straight raid boss Have me and the boys coordinating attacks and builds together

[@thepublicpotato3887]

@@jays.6843also unless it’s a gimic fight the camera and hit boxes will be absolute cancer

[@DreadNadine]

Im just starting this video but i just have to say, thank you for finally adding the DLC map into the main map to try to explore theories. I think this is such an important aspect of what the games are trying to tell us, and no one includes the two maps as one in their theories!

[@NickCombs]

It's interesting that we got ancient bird warriors who can wield the power of storms in the DLC. I'm not 100% on it, but they seem like prime candidates for the storm that is tearing through Farum Azula. The time shenanigans would have to still be Placidusax responding to said storm to preserve his capitol, of course. It's also a bit weird that we have both humanoid bird warriors and actual birds that ruled in Stormveil. I'm not sure how the two are connected, other than through the crucible.

[@thecommentguy9380]

Well before the Erdtree and Scadutree were separated, they were the Crucible of Life. So it makes sense that is the case, as the divine bird warriors were likely humans who were gifted with avian features just like there are hornsent and beastmen. Though whatever Godfrey fought in Stormveil, it was certainly not a bird warrior

[@tarnished-ml3fr3jq8w]

Your point about Ancient Giants partaking in dragon communion and hunting drake hearts is compelling, especially considering Theodorix the Troll (trolls being descendants of giants) becomes a magma wyrm...

[@Psilo-gn1sx]

I think this is a huge piece of overlooked evidence, you're totally right.

[@angryeric2961]

The sword in the back of the neck is taller then any troll. Perhaps it was gransax

[@StephenOwen]

Aren’t all of the trolls and most giants disemboweled to prevent them from eating a dragon heart and becoming more powerful?

[@ShirosakiX]

I figured the giant dragon corpse in the DLC was Florissax because it’s stated that she shed her ancient dragon form to share dragon communion with the world.

[@slouch186]

I really dislike the giant dragons and giant-giant skeletons from a world building perspective. a landmass the size of the lands between, even including the now shadowlands, is simply far too small for these creatures to inhabit.

[@TalZadios]

Depends maybe there was only ever one or two alive at a time but it's been so long corpses have accrued.

[@TylerJohnson-bs8mt]

The lands in between are surrounded by more than just the land of shadows, there will be Atleast five more DLCs I’d estimate

[@NickelRacker112]

A second Addon with both maps connected again would blow my mind.

[@2oldskoo]

THANK YOU THANK YOU! I've been thinking I was crazy thinking the dlc map fits perfectly in the middle of the lands between! I LOVE THE SOULS COMMUNITY!

[@bastiancole3565]

When i was first finding Bayle's Talisman and that it boosted Magma Sorceries, i was so sure that Bayle was an apex dragon communion user at the height of his evolution due to the sheer number of dragon hearts he had consumed. For them to say that Dragon communion was committed by Placidusax's enclave as punishment for bayles ilk is kind of... idk odd. It makes more sense to me that Bayle was a mortal that either hated dragons or Placidusax's reign so much that he began to infinitely feast on dragon hearts that he became a rival to placidusax. And what tells me that Bayle was a mortal is that he's a magma type dragon, the same kind as the magma wyrms: Those who partook too much of dragon communion, turned into half dragons but with magma as their breath.

[@BovineIntervention]

His attacks are pretty far beyond any wyrm and he's nothing like them. This is all explained in lore and gameplay partaking in more dragon hearts makes you more powerful in your mortal form but when you become a dragon you'll always be a sh1tty wyrm... Unless the type of dragon communion was completely different, something far beyond just eating hearts. Eating hearts to gain power was popularized AFTER Bayle had grown powerful as a short term measure by the ancient dragons to oppose his reign.

[@Jerry-iw9sn]

I always assumed that he looked that way because of the fact that he canibalized other dragons in order to grow strong.

[@heideknight9122]

​@Jerry-iw9sn This is a good point! The sharp gravel stone mentions: the scale of an ancient dragon that has supped on the blood of lesser dragons.

[@EbonizerScourge]

Good map placement. Also the storms in Caelid and the Jagged peak make sense as well. Romina's church would need to be somewhere above the lake of scarlet rot as well.

[@addlc15324]

My theory is Maybe the battle between Placidusax and Bayle end up these two dragons heavily wounded. And it had also become the very reason why the god of dragonlord left them for good. What happened in Miquella’s storyline might just answer that question. According to the item description of Secret Rite Scroll"A lords will usher in a god’s return and the lord’s soul will require a vessel." Perhaps both Placidusax and Bayle losing their strength as a vessel to holding a god after the battle. And seems like the wounds of Placidusax never gets recovered. Their God is unlikely gonna return.

[@Eldenmofo1]

Bro we need a Elden Ring 2, so many unanswered questions and mysteries

[@codeine69]

you and i both know it's gonna take place an incalculably long time after and be totally unrelated

[@aettic]

The video ends there??? Oh man, you're on a roll. I like the idea that Farum Azula, the Jagged Peak, and Caelid all overlapped like that. It makes a lot of sense.

[@usedcolouringbook8798]

The Eclipse set Farum Azula outside of time

[@KashimoJoestar]

I do enjoy shorter lore videos sometimes, not every topic needs to be 80 minutes long so thanks for that :D

[@CrazyOne2521]

Amazing work! Thank you

[@LT.KiraHertling1701]

A boss fight against one of these giants would be insane.

[@ritesh2raj]

Dude what a genius idea combining the two maps!! Most of your idea seems very possible. There is something else that struck me immediately when I saw those two maps together. The Scadutree is quite literally called as "the shadow of the redtree" and when you put the maps together they both are extremely close to each other. It is worth noting that the Scadutree can be seen in water in the shadow realm and not directly on the landmass. I saw another video from ProfOrProf recently on "what is the Scadutree" there are evidences that suggest that it was the so called "great tree" before the erdtree existed most noteworthy being the descriptions on root and knot resins. As well as the architecture in enir-elim. Would highly recommend you to watch that video, would love to hear your thoughts on it aswell. And again great video!

[@Pietro-zk3zo]

You just uncovered the old dragon map AMAZING🧐

[@skullcrusher4458]

It would be so cool to bring back the zayf the humble scholar intro

[@TitoRohwedder-my1nh]

you're the first I have seen to draw attention to the colossal skeletons, and I like that.

[@RomanianReptile]

Something I find interesting is how all the heads of the dragons/drakes are different. Bayle is jagged and horned, all the drakes seem to have similar heads, the ancient dragons have more jagged but feline heads, and then Placiduseax has (4, 5?) heads that are different from them all. So who fathered who? How did Placiduseax end up being the only one with so many heads? Is Bayle the oldest of all dragons meaning even Placiduseax?

[@kuromori8877]

And the drake corpses on the jagged peak have horns unlike any we encounter in the game maybe those were the first generation of bayle’s line and then greyoll and her children lost the horns Not to mention the dragon temple corpse which looks like a placidussax head but way way larger Yeah the dragons are really weird

[@kuromori8877]

+placidussax head having different genders might hint that they were separate dragons that were conjoined

[@RomanianReptile]

@kuromori8877 oh interesting! I forgot about that. So maybe all the ancient dragons might be the offspring of a single dragon Placiduseax like some of the demigods were born of a single god.

[@yachisan]

I remember someone having a theory that Bayle is considered an “omen” like variant to the dragon species.

[@boxguytv]

Its possible that the lands were separated long enough that the dragons grew separately.

[@fredscoffee]

The lands between is merely a pond where old giants were chasing dragons, all the rest is mushrooms developing on dead corpses 🙃

[@gabadaba5436]

Something very important to keep in mind that wasn't brought up in the video is that the reign of the ancient dragons and Placidusax happened thousands of years before Marika and the golden order, which in turn started thousands of years before the events of the game, and the events with Bayle happened during the time of the dragons. It's likely that the separation of the lands of shadow from the lands between happened a long time after the fall of the dragons, probably thousands of years. This is all to say that there was plenty of time for this chain of events to happen: Bayle leaves and starts a new species Members of that species colonize the mountains far away from the Jagged peak and farum azula The now fractured dragon society collapses The drakes who had taken refuge in the mountaintops leave to return to their previous domain Placidusax, still waiting for his God's return and not wanting to be overrun by the drakes, separates as much of farum azula as he can The drakes properly colonize the jagged peak and northern caelid At some point in this, a race of giants, likely evolved from humans and intelligent beasts, takes control over the mountaintops, likely shortly after most of the drakes left Now, I think it's fair to assume that all of this happened, even if my stated motivations for it are off. From here on, it's mostly just guessing. Maybe the drakes attempted to retake the mountaintops, causing a war with the giants which resulted in many of their larger people being killed. However, this is all likely happening after the reign of dragons, meaning that at some point, the golden order has come around. We know two things about the golden order: they conducted a genocide on the giants and they were allied with at least some of the ancient dragons. As some people have pointed out though, while red lightning is a hallmark of the ancient dragons, forked red lighting is specific to the ones who sided with Bayle (I believe this is said in an incantation description but I don't know the exact one). The two important dragons to the golden order's dragon cult were Fortissax and Lanseax, both of whom use forked lightning in their fights, meaning they were with Bayle and the drakes. Therefore, I don't think it's impossible for the golden order to have allied with the drakes to wipe out the giants. Maybe this was a war the drakes were already fighting, and the golden order just jumped in at the end to help out. The lack of giant skeletons in the land of shadow is the odd part of this theory, though. They're all over caelid and the mountaintops, but there's none anywhere else. You'd at least expect to find some in Charos grave or jagged peak if they're presumed to have fought the dragons, but there aren't any, and caelid and the mountains being on literal opposite ends of the world also throws a wrench in this. Idk🤷‍♂️

[@jackalx2154]

I've always thought those giant skeletons were like the Titans from Greek Mythology, predating the gods.

[@jermjrich]

nice video, very thought provoking, thank you for all your content!

[@videocrowsnest5251]

Farum Azula long ago being in Caelid also makes sense, considering how Caelid was described as the Caelid wilds before the Scarlet rot took over. Considering, the Beastmen do need some way to hunt and harvest food, and a vast wild land tends to have plenty of sources of it, it would have been a fertile hunting ground for them to sustain their population with.

[@Konghammer1]

Looking at your map I realized something crazy. The crevice that leads to saint Trina has those gigantic coffin boat things, well with your overlay so does that exact spot in limgrave. They are the only 2 places in the entire game that have these things, blew my tiny mind.

[@-nery-]

the giants idea isn't bad, but again involving a yet unheard species that's not even hinted at in the current lore somewhat feels farfetched (yet again, you have a lot more knowledge when it comes to Elden Ring lore). When we consider that the dragon communion affair started off as a dragon-intern problem that only involved other races at a later time, would it be too farfetched to assume that the killer of the giant dragon was another giant dragon but of the ancient dragon variety like Gransax?

[@IngeniousNinja]

There are statues 1:1 with Gurranq in Farum Azula. Beast clergymen were clearly a role during its heydey - Malkieth was molded into a shadow for Marika rather than born one. He clearly was part of the beastman society during the dragons reign (which also makes him one of the oldest living beings in TLB!)

[@topdeckhelix8450]

First part, yes totally love the greyoll’s mate theory on every level. The dead dragon and greyoll were probably offspring of Bayle.

[@astrid9920]

Something really interesting is that the harpoon piercing the giant dragon has a greenish rust on it like verdigris. Verdigris is a rusted metal blessed by an outer god, probably the outer god of rot. There's a weird symmetry if both giant drakes were felled by different manifestations of rot...

[@rainbowkrampus]

I just don't think those map overlays make any sense. It would mean that the landmass where the mountain was had to be reconstituted, that the divine towers are relatively recent constructions and that the eternal city that's down there was always underground. Never mind all of the problems that occur northward. Where an entire landmass is layered over an existing landmass. And for some reason the Scadutree was in the north between Gelmir and Altus. There's an orientation and size problem that I haven't seen anyone justify with any of their attempts at this without completely ignoring all of the problems. .

[@Mockle07]

Yep, agreed - it’s head cannon. It is quite a close fit but there is too much physical crossover. It’s just one of those situations that From throws out there and people just go wild with assumptions.

[@rainbowkrampus]

@@Mockle07 Thing is, there's definitely a separation that happened at some point. The two land masses were connected somehow. I just think that layering alone doesn't really get us to where we need to be. There are signs in the Shadow Lands of some massive geologic upheavals at some point. The painting of Midras Manse shows a sunny area with flowers that are only found in one other place, Shaman Village. But now the whole region is down at the bottom of the world. Perpetually cloaked in shadow. Rauh Ruins has those bridges that are misaligned and broken. But their pillars are not shifted. It looks as though the northern section moved along with the ground itself. And of course there are the elevation changes. Something happened to the landmass at some point that went well beyond just being separated spatially from the Lands Between. And worse, there may be signs that the Lands Between have moved around a bit as well. Whatever is going on here, plopping one map on top of the other is not a useful solution no matter where you decide to place it.

[@joesusin8935]

We already knew that farum was in caelid. I was a little shaky with the combination of the maps, but with the memory of the skeletal beastmen within the ancient dragon man cave, I completely accept it. Also, bayle’s arena looks like the bottom of the colosseum in Rome. The bottom of a once epic arena. Very good theory

[@alithib]

I hear and subscribe to the theory that Maliketh is in Farum because Marika wanted to hide him slash the Rune of Death somewhere out of time and out of reach.

[@Greaseball01]

I was talking to someone on Reddit the other day about why their were reanimated beast men in farum azula and if it connected to the Godwyn eyes and death root we find there, but it's just occurred to me - what if Gurranq is able to reanimate them with the rune of death or maybe because of his consuming death root? I've always kind of assumed the beast men were just the predominant humanoid species in the time of placi's reign, and I've considered the idea before that maybe some human life in the lands between evolved from the beast men, and that's what the whole five fingers representing intelligence thing is all about.

[@jordanmeyler9239]

I always figured it was Graansaax, giant ancient dragon that uses a lance. Based on its position in leyndelle it is clear it throws down when the occasion calls for it. Perhaps the golden order is responsible as they did kill graansax, but the spear makes me think it was the big dragon itself. Dragons and drakes are also enemies so it adds up.

[@Idea_of_Lustre]

2:45 Based on Florissax' dialogue I think it's safe to assume that Bayle is her mate, although it's certainly possible that she had more than one. The drakes are referred to as Bayle's bloodline, and Greyoll's Roar describes her as the mother of all dragons. I'm not proficient in Japanese, but I recall it being mentioned that the more accurate translation would be "mother of all modern dragons". Which makes a fair bit more sense, as beyond her size she has all the distinct characteristics of a drake rather than those of the ancient dragons (no gravel stone scales, two wings instead of four etc). As for Farum Azula, I actually think it used to be located further North than the old Jagged Peak. In the base game map, Farum Azula is only visible from the Isolated Divine Tower. Even if you use a map marker or something, Farum Azula is not even loaded unless you go to the ruined structure, or the aforementioned Divine Tower. So it seems pretty clear that they're connected in some way, but the Tower seems completely separated from the old Farum Azula if we assume it was once attached to the Jagged Peak. I haven't seen any direct size comparisons, but Farum Azula also seems too large to fit on top of the Jagged Peak, although it's certainly possible that the mountain itself changed after Farum Azula's liftoff. Although the funniest part is that I just realized that regardless of where it was, Florissax would be facing directly away from it even when speaking to Placidusax during the nighttime.

[@toxicjester]

Nice video as always. The Tarnished Archeologist suggests in on of his video that the first beings on this planet would have been the titans and the Dragons . Titans worshipped the fell god and presumably created the divine towers , while dragons surely come from outer space or multiverse , drown by life and sentient emergence . At some point they surely came to a fight for either territorial, power or faith issues , or a bit of the three at the same time . Anyway , regarding Farum Azura's fate , my guess is that it is the result of Plassidussax being leftover by the being to whom he was the consort while being Elden Lord . It is stated that he entered this kind of hibernation state out of time and space , in the waiting of his "Lord"'s return . Performing such a "spell" is certainly not a surgical strike and may have brought a big part of the whole place with its arena all together. My 2 cents 😊

[@coreyrachar9694]

I've been a fan of this theory for awhile - that caelid and the mountaintops were connected. I noticed the dragoncrest talismans then all these other clues keep popping up linking the two areas together. One thing I noticed on my most recent playthrough provides further evidence: "Map of Eastern Mountaintops of the Giants. The remote, desolate eastern summit is the highest point in all the Lands Between, overlooking even the Flame Peak to the south." I remember being confused by that my first playthrough, even looking around for some evidence of this 'flame peak' but then totally forgot about this description for like more than a year. The DLC now explains this item description which is really cool. Makes me wonder if the whole veil thing is a result of a lot of the dlc being cut content or at least planned to some degree from the beginning. I don't know about farum azula being directly on top of flame peak though. To me it seems more likely it was connected via the farum greatbridge and occupied the area around the isolated tower, between caelid and the mountains. That dragon is so big and I somehow did not notice that rock in his head is actually a huge sword! That's crazy. It's clear there was a lot going on even before the history we know about, like these titans are so big that the actual lands between would be like tables to them. Maybe they walked around on what is the sea now and formed the lands for some reason... I don't know it doesn't really lineup with some other lore but the point is it really makes you wonder.

[@coreyrachar9694]

I doubt that dragon took out two of those titans. Let's be real, that's like a house cat taking out two humans with weapons.

[@Vioblight]

Amazing intro man! I’m assuming a strong gravity gigs Giant form the passed launched Farem Azula into the air, or maybe Radahn did at his peak when he was told to conquer Caelid. Or or maybe it was Midre I think I saw purple gravity magic and maybe that’s the power the fingers and other visitors coming from meteors use. Maybe idk spitballing quick thoughts

[@eRpeGiee]

I agree with basically everything. And this Theory related to Farum Azula very interesting, it really looks like Placidusax arena, I have to think about it in my free time. I think I know who killed that dragon whose body lies near Florissax, probably it was Hawkeye Gough :P

[@PickleMonster5565]

7:29 The details of Cinquedea (dagger found under (around) the Bestial Sanctum) directly state, “Short sword given to high ranking clergymen of Farum Azula.”

[@aettic]

I would sort of love to see a reconstructed version of the Elden Ring world where the terrain from the Land of Shadow is overlaid back on top of the Lands Between. Might be interesting. I know it doesn't fit perfectly, aligning any one thing will naturally mean a bunch of other things become misaligned, but it would give us an idea of how these places are related geographically in space (as opposed to just cartographically). I'm referring to where things are physically located in relation to each other - elevations, etc. Maybe someday...

[@OwllightA]

Wow your explanation is so accurate

[@macro4904]

Even during my first playthrough I assumed if Crumbling Farum Azula had been somewhere else before the events of the game, it'd be part of or above Limgrave. There are multiple ruin chunks that have similar architecture to Farum Azula and a cave with a beastman. As for the storm and why Farum Azula is so high up, it could have something to do with the "Storm Lord" tying it with Placidussax and all the storm-y stuff going on near Stormveil. The whole Caelid was the HQ of dragons is also a solid theory though, it could tie a lot of lore pieces together.

[@dcruisee]

To add onto what you said about Maliketh’s connection to Farum Azula & the beastmen, the cinquadea description states that “The design celebrates a beast's five fingers, symbolic of the intelligence once granted upon their kind.” We can assume that the “beast” is Maliketh, and so this pretty safely tells us that the reason for Maliketh being in Farum Azula is that he is the one that gave the beasts intelligence, which would explain his status as “clergyman” of the beasts.

[@froggie610]

For those last points of Farum Azula and Placcidusax, I have a few conjectures: 1. It is stated that a large meteor may have hit Farum Azula, causing the ruins to be scattered and formed into a sword. Gravity magic can do this by fusing what would be formless rock into actual weapons. There is a similar weapon with the Ancient Meteoric Ore Greatsword with the power of smithery. So I think the Smithery is connected to Gravity magic with this in mind. Perhaps Smithery was connected with Gravity magic and cragblade? And combined with Caelid and the dragons may have lifted Farum Azula upwards? Displacing it both in space and time? 2. Placcidusax and the other dragons in combination with the meteor and gravity may have propelled the area upwards. This may have been done physically as seen beneath Farum Azula with the multiple dragons infused to the soil of it, as well as the meteor as for my previous reasons. This was likely done out of necessity or desperation to prevent Bayle from ever attacking them again. (It may have been a reoccurring issue or because Bayle wounded Placcy.) Therefore, with a combination of a large gravity meteor and Placcy's time distorting scales placed Farum Azula outside of time and outside of space given that Farum Azula is nowhere seen when Marika removed it from the Lands Between.

[@Nope-ity-nope-nope]

Rauh and Farum both show statues of a Giant culture. It's great how, when the Dragons moved into Farum Azula, they jam their statues in front of the Giant's.

[@Kryptnyt]

I wonder about the Four Belfries and the existence of Banished Knights and Crucible Knights at the locations that it teleports you to (Stormveil, Nokron, Farum Azula) and whether these one-way transport installations were used as a method to banish said knights to these places. The teleport to Farum Azula is particularly interesting because there's no other way to travel there without whatever happens at the Giant Chili Bowl.

[@Elden-Lord294]

It is most definitely the case giants took part in dragon communion. Great Wyrm Theodorix, in consecrated snowfield, was an "ancient troll warrior" who was a "hero of the war against the giants" - Theodorix's Magma you get after killing him says that in the item description. Trolls, being lesser giants, taking part, means that atleast it is very possible giants did too

[@SagasOfUnendingLoss]

Magma wyrm Theodorix is confirmed to be a troll who became a wyrm through dragon communion via the description of his incantation. That, at bare minimum, proves giants performing dragon communion is possible.

[@kullervo3289]

I think the launch of Farum Azula into the sky is the result of the same event that separated the Lands Between from the Land of Shadow. We've not been given any info I'm aware of, of a force which could do it - the only powers of that nature that are apparent seem to be the duel between Bayle and Placidusax. Maybe thats how things got split. Placidusax' power kept it flying, Bayle was locked back in Realm of Shadow, and Lands Between(between the Realm of Shadow and Farum Azula) were left to Marika.

[@someothercobra8360]

This is now my head cannon thank you

[@kdkxchronicx1872]

is there any way to separate the weapon in the dragons neck from its body to get a better look at what couldve wielded it?

[@ZayftheScholar]

Would take someone who actually knows what they are doing with mods haha 😂 Not me, but I'd love to see it if its possible.

[@kdkxchronicx1872]

@ZayftheScholar yeah exactly. Hopefully one of the guys who does that sees this and gets to work haha. Great video dude

[@averageyoutubeuser8130]

If we were to look at the shattering war, specifically the sieges of Leyndell, we do see giant bolts that seem to be filled with types of poison being fired from Leyndell which means that humans have discovered how to launch bolts that massive. Because of this, I believe the giant harpoon was launched by an army of drake knights some time ago.

[@cincameron]

I wonder if Farum Azula went skyward as an attempt by Placidusax to reconnect with his fled God. We know the Spiral and Erdtree each reach into the heavens as an attempt to do something similar, so perhaps Placidusax attempted to go higher than the summit of Jagged Peak. And the Storm twists and looks similar to the spiral iconography. I wonder if the Hornsent took the storm as inspiration for their religion. Semi-unrelated to the theory in your video, but something to think about, I guess. Perhaps Bayle's rebellion against Placidusax was a result of Placidusax having been chosen as Elden Lord by the God over the Dragons. An act of jealousy or even revenge, perhaps? Bayle wounded Placidusax in their battle, but was forced to flee (I think the 2 Placidusax heads embedded in Bayle's back and neck might have been Placidusax's attempt to restrain him, but were torn off due to his injuries, allowing Bayle to flee). I think the battle was fierce enough to persuade the Dragon God to flee... perhaps abandoning the Elden Ring itself since obviously it is inherited by Marika one way or another. Placidusax would have enough incentive to have his Ancient Dragons hunt down and kill every last Drake including Bayle, thus he enlisted Florissax and presumably the "ancient" giants, like you suggest. Placidusax abandoning Jagged Peak in an attempt to rise higher via the storm in an attempt to commune with his God seems possible. However, we are told that a massive meteor struck Farum Azula, causing it to crumble, so it is more likely to assume the damage caused to the city forced it out of place, so Placidusax had it moved out of the Lands Between. Maybe even more meteors were falling around this time, so it became dangerous to remain... Granted, we don't know when the meteor strike happened. It could've happened before Bayle's rebellion, which makes sense, or it could've happened well after Dragon Communion began. It would be funny to think that Marika's civilization came down and they accidentally forced the Ancient Dragons to flee upon impact.

[@flanberry]

Another awesome video :)

[@ZayftheScholar]

Thanks Flanberry! Long time no see :)

[@flanberry]

@@ZayftheScholar Love seeing you and your channel flourish! :D I'll be with ya all the way!

[@NotSpoiledMilk]

ANOTHER ZAYF VIDEO!

[@HallstaR35]

I love these rabbit holes 🥰

[@shermanwilliams9248]

Something I don’t know if people have considered yet, is SOTE’s idea of the “Crucible current” spoken of in spiral sorceries, and how its regularly depicted as a spiral rising from the ground. Also the Hornsent (and Stormveil’s) regular usage of storm based sorceries. Wheras Farum Azula (a place beyond time) is located high in the sky, being kept aloft by tornadoes. Perhaps these are what the Hornsent end up calling these normalized crucible currents.

[@sladoid]

Good production quality

[@Socherbal]

I haven’t studied the lore yet because I still haven’t beat the DLC, but I just assumed all the dead dragons were Bayle’s work

[@Babygoblin924]

Love this theory!

[@Slaheir]

I think watching a few of Vaati’s videos may help fill some gaps in this theory or potentially change a few things for it. The obvious one is would point you to is the Lore of the Dragons

[@leonjenkins5741]

Zullie the witch made a video about the dead dragon case. I was thinking it was another big dragon with a sword or those titanic skeletons refer to as the primordial giants or old gods. But seeing the fire giant put the heart in its mouth stomach would be cool

[@lilvampire7439]

I’d imagine the slaying happened somewhat recently, at least within a few years considering the grass and plants havnt grown back from the fire it breathed

[@solrac4270]

I'm from the theory that the GEQ was in fact the empyrean god of the crucible. Placidusax its consort, weaken after the fight with Bayle, Marika took the opportunity to strike and kill the GEQ with maliketh. Perhaps at this moment the greater will send the elden beast as a meteor, the strike of the beast was the cause for the destruction of farum azula, and its gravity magic stasis. Similar to what happened to limgrave after radahn, but at a larger scale. Another theory i love is that after you die, thad "bloodstain" is actually in the form of a tree. The theory says that the erdtree is actually this bloodstain of a being of immense power, the previous god GEQ. Afterwards it would be masked as being a creation of Marika and the golden order.

[@DanielGarcia-rx3kt]

Regarding the map, I'd be interested in seeing how the trail of damage on the summit of the Isolated Divine Tower lines up with in game Farum Azula and the Shadow Lands map. I theorized that Farum Azula was hit by a meteor (likely golden) that came from the Sun since the pillars of that Tower are damaged in a way that shows a straight line from the Sun, through the Tower summit, and directly to Farum Azula. Maybe it has something to do with how the city wound up in the sky

[@Ozmourne]

Excellent theory mate

[@SygMan]

I'm under the impression the meteor that brought the Elden Beast was the cause for Farum Azula to float

[@CharlesZane_]

The old giants are also why the stone coffins that look like ships are so large. Also, in Norse mythology, the Aesir are descended from giants. There’s also a big tree that’s pretty important.