The Hauntology of Forbidden Siren

"PART I. ACTION HAUNTOLOGY" contains major story spoilers that spoil the overarching mystery of the game. The rest of the video contains contextual spoilers that would ruin the game if you wanted to go into this unique survival horror completely blind.
There is horrifying imagery and sound in this video.
I may be getting quicker at making these... hope you enjoy! It takes a lot of hard work to make these videos, but I am really enjoying them. Starting from my next video, I will be releasing them earlier on Patreon. I will post a notification on KZbin every time a video is uploaded to Patreon, just in case it was one that particularly interested you.
To Siren Maniacs out there wondering why my gameplay footage is centered entirely around the earlier chapters of the game - this is because my completed save file for Forbidden Siren is on the PlayStation 2, but as I don't have a capture card, I can't record footage straight from the PS2 - so instead this is footage from early in a PS4 playthrough. I would have liked to have truly relevant footage for the whole video, but given the time required to play through this beautifully complex game again, that just wasn't possible sadly.
Finally, it is important to note that this video was inspired by Christian McCrea's 2009 essay, "Gaming's Hauntology", which focused on digital artefacts from other media, in the games "Siren", "Michigan: Report to Hell", and "Dead Rising". A special thanks to both his great essay, and the work of Project Siren, who made a terrifying (and difficult) game that has stood the test of time.
PATREON: / hga
PAYPAL: www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted...
BLOG: horrorgameanalysis.wordpress....
TWITCH: / horrorgameanalysis
Chapters:
0:00:00 BOOT SCREEN
0:00:26 SPOILER WARNING
0:00:47 INTRODUCTION
0:06:39 PART I. ACTION HAUNTOLOGY
0:16:33 PART II. ANALOGUE HAUNTOLOGY
0:23:42 PART III. HUMAN HAUNTOLOGY
0:39:12 END.
Sources:
Augé, Marc. "Oblivion". 1998.
Bowie, David. "Filter Magazine". 2003.
Cain, Sian. "‘This song sucks’: Nick Cave responds to ChatGPT song written in style of Nick Cave". 2023. www.theguardian.com/music/202...
Derrida, Jacques. "Specters of Marx". 1993.
Hong, Seung Min.  Journal of Religion and Popular Culture; Toronto Vol. 22, Iss. 2, (Summer 2010).
Lovecraft, H.P.. "Selected Letters 1965-76". 2:356-57.
McCrea, Christian. "Gaming's Hauntology". 2009.
Melnick, Kyle. "VR Technology Reunites Grieving Mother With Her Deceased Child". 2020. vrscout.com/news/mother-reuni...
Mishima, Yukio. "The Temple of Dawn". 1973.

[@CrimsonValley]

As someone with a history degree in cultural history and a deep rooted passion for horror games, just wished to say that this was such a massive undertaking and such an interesting analysis. Siren is a gem in its own right to me and this was such a pleasant listen. Keep up the great work!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks for watching, very glad you enjoyed it! It was definitely something I spent a profound amount of time considering and working on, so I am glad it turned out well. Siren is a remarkably unique game and I wanted to ensure that it was preserved in a video like this in a valuable way. Thanks for stopping by!

[@pinarppanrapir9489]

When I was a kid with a ps2 I never found SH2 for sale but I saw Siren. In a way I think it was for the best because this game is kind of like a hidden gem.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

It really is a remarkable game - memorable in almost every sense, even though for some people those memories are overwhelmingly negative. I think so many people put it down because it is rather obtuse at first, but with practice and patience the game mostly opens up and becomes good, scary fun. Thanks for watching!

[@SOLIDSNAKE.]

Siren was such a mystery 20 years ago! The world is so much smaller these days, excellent work!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks for your kind words! Glad to hear you enjoyed the video. Siren is such a remarkable game, one of my all-time favourite horror titles, and I think that the element of mystery is a large part of that. While I may have pulled the curtain back a bit, I still like to think that people can still see their own terrifying visions in the static. Horror should always remain personal and slightly unexplained, if at all possible, because that makes it more memorable, more haunting, on an individual level. Thanks again!

[@elilass8410]

I regret putting this video in my watch later instead of boosting it when it needed it most. Excellent work.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Glad you found the time to watch it regardless! Thanks for your kind words, happy to hear you enjoyed it.

[@RyZ763]

First of all, great job on this video. One of the best videos I’ve seen on KZbin.. I recently beat this masterpiece of a horror game. And a couple weeks later after thought processing this game. I came across this video. And I absolutely loved how you did this. I believe this game is by far the most complicated and terrifying game I’ve ever come across. It took me so long to beat this game. And after beating it I feel so accomplished. You don’t see horror like this anymore unfortunately. I love how Japanese horror like this portrays the feeling of hopelessness. I’ve played many horror games but this one gave me a feeling I never EVER felt. And by far my most accomplished game I had to work my a** off in. Haha. Once again, great video!

[@ZephyrFate]

It’s interesting drawing a parallel between the endless void of Shibito existence, and the eventuality of human expression and self in a digital vacuum. And how we interpret our world when everything we consume is generated by AI.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

I appreciate your thoughtful comment. There's really something to be said for the repetitive bleakness of the shibito's actions as they attempt to reconstruct themselves. And then there comes the inevitable misery as their attempts merely cause them to cannabalize their experience further, to devolve deeper into more twisted forms of shibito. It is always important to see the human in the art we consume, and how generative art is more likely than not to remove that humanity. Thanks for watching, hope you enjoyed the video!

[@AdamOwenBrowning]

A fascinating script. The depth and texture of your analysis isn't necessarily what any regular Joe would produce in response to this video game. This video is so broad yet still interesting at each far edge... I have struggled with grief for some time. This idea of celebrating the immortalization of humans, to joyfully "haunt" the people of the future? I love it. Thank you.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thank you very much for your kind words. I am glad you enjoyed the video, and I hope that it could help you with your grief, even in the tiniest of ways. I am sorry to hear of your struggle, and I am wishing you all the best. Grief is never easy. I hope this channel will continue to joyfully haunt people long into the future, and I hope to see you around again. I don't plan to stop making videos that celebrate the human beings in the games we play, and the importance of finding each other in the digital. Horror is capable of so much more than some people give it credit for. All the best.

[@nimazsheik5152]

Also Bloodborne's DLC Fishing Hamlet gave me similar vibes to Forbidden Siren, especially the lore behind it.

[@Harpotos]

beautiful video, thank you. one of my favourite subjects and games. great food for thought and was just what I needed in this introspective moment :)

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thank you for your kind words & very much for watching, it means a lot to hear you enjoyed it. I am very glad that my video resonated with you - and did justice to a very special game. Hope to see you around in the comments again :)

[@77elvistheking]

My favorite game of all time! Always a pleasure to see someone recognizing this game exists... The greatest horror game of all time for me. The soundtrack, the dreadful atmosphere, the level design, the colours used... there's a hopeless feeling while playing this game that no other game has ever captured. You've earned a subscriber just for giving this awesome horror gem a shot : D

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks very much for watching - I hope you enjoyed the video! It really is a special game. Brutally difficult, but with so many wonderful nuances and secrets buried within it. Perhaps I should have spent more time talking about the village of Hanuda itself. Maybe I should return one day and do a video on just how great the town is holistically. The soundtrack is also something very special, as you point out - ethereally haunting. Thanks again for watching and sharing your thoughts!

[@nimazsheik5152]

Forbidden Siren 1 is not just my favourite horror game, it's my favourite in all of horror media. This game surpassed Silent Hill 4 in scariness IMO. While playing this game, it seemed like I had weird dreams from the game, the uncanny faces just actually gave me nightmares and I'm in my 30s. I also 100% this game, not because I loved it and wanted to know every detail of lore and story, but also because in the back of my mind I knew I will never pick this game up, it truly feels like a forbidden game. I also believe a 1:1 remake of this game cannot be done because the uncanny graphics and emptiness of the PS2 environments cannot be replicated with modern tech. However, the lore/story could be expanded and be made into a Netflix/HBO short, even though it'd loose some of its charm, because the Shibito idea of a Zombie is so unique and terrifying. Instant sub, thanks for the video!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Apologies for the lateness of my reply, but know that I appreciate your comment very much. Thanks for sharing your experience with the game - it's really a remarkable game, a landmark in survival horror, and never quite properly recognized. It is also a worthy horror game to have as your favourite. A 1:1 remake would certainly be a daunting task - as you say, it would probably be impossible, or at least, by necessity, would lose something. I'm also not sure it would be possible to recreate the atmosphere within the show - Forbidden Siren deserves to be played, rather than just watched. That is a part of its magic, that I hope I did justice with this video. Thanks for subscribing. Hope to see you again - I have plenty of other video essays you may be interested in!

[@vangoghsseveredear]

Beat Blood Curse as a kid, and just finished the OG Siren. As a kid, the thing I remember most is the atmosphere, and how hostile it was. To the player, to the characters in the world, to the village itself. Once youre trapped, you're trapped, and the utter hopelessness of these people's situations is really something you feel as a player. Its no surprise Siren never got as big as, say, Silent Hill or Resident Evil, but its still a shame. There really is nothing like it. Let alone playing a PS2 copy back in the day. It felt like playing a cursed Japanese game that someone had found somewhere.

[@SwainBjornstrandt]

Possibly the best analysis of one of my favourite and most fondly remembered childhood memories. Thank you for sharing this my good man.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks very much for watching! I am always really glad to hear that I could do this fantastic, unique game justice.

[@SwainBjornstrandt]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis Since i discovered your channel, i subbed obviously. Your level of research is insane. I also found out that you are one of the few people that appreciate silent hill 4, which is one of my favorites in the series, only falls a bit behind the 2nd one and i am thrilled to hear your take on it. Seriously excellent job my friend. My mind opens in a different way with these types of concepts and it helps me view things in my own life from other persepctives (not a native english speaker by the way, so i can't express my thoughts exactly)

[@RKoDaS]

What a beautifully written video, thanks so much for your efforts, I enjoyed this.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thank you for your kind words. I am very glad you enjoyed the video. Feedback like that helps motivate me to keep going and creating.

[@eden1536]

⁠man with an inflated arm

[@SilentChelsea]

I love siren. never want to play the game again but I love it. the frustration of combat & getting locked in loops b/c I didn't knock over a stone pillar was just too much, though I did play it when I was young & not a very experienced gamer so that may have had something to do w/ it... fantastic video & the last section really hit home. you're absolutely right about ai & the loss of a human element in art.

[@RatedRRaj]

Im so glad that people are still making videos about this game. Although I never had played the first one, I was terrified by Forbidden Siren 2 and Blood Curse on the PS3. It’s a shame they never made any more sequels and sadly I don’t think there will be.

[@MuteCircle]

Very glad this showed up in my recommendations! I make music inspired both by hauntology and (in the case of one album) this game, so the title of this video was like catnip to me!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Sorry I didn't respond to this earlier - glad the video appears to have been made specifically for you :) Hope you enjoyed it in the end - and I hope to check out some of your hauntology inspired music, that sounds awesome!

[@laynedennis3842]

I love this analysis. Siren is so underrated. The game itself is impressive for its time. I remember when i beat it i felt so accomplished. I even ordered 2 and blood curse. I haven't played 2 yet bc of the region lock but hopefully I'll find a ps2 that can bypass it

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks for watching! Glad you enjoyed it. Siren really is a precious experience. It is hard to think of a survival horror game that is more effectively terrifying and simultaneously infuriating at the same time. Delightfully, devilishly hard, which makes it even more satisfying to finally beat. Some of the best survival horror I've ever had the pleasure of experiencing. Hope you enjoy 2 and Blood Curse! I love 2, but I'm admittedly not as big a fan of Blood Curse as some people. The original two are the best. Always thought it was a shame 2 was never released in NTSC regions. Best of luck finding something to play it on. Thanks again for watching, really appreciate it.

[@RinLockhart]

I have an old copy of Siren and I never went too far without a guide. It's a difficult game for me.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

It is incredibly hard and at a few points certainly it feels almost impossible (but still doable if you are insane like myself) to progress without hints. But the process of discovery and achievement is never higher than after a successful mission. It takes time for the game to click in the first place and even after that it can still be a real struggle. A very worthwhile one though, I love the game to bits. Thanks for stopping by and watching, hope you enjoyed the video!

[@seventhsaint]

man, I remember seeing an ad for Siren when I was real young and it sticking in the back of my brain like tape that sometimes comes unstuck in spots for long enough that I remember the game in sudden flashes. I guess in a way, I've become haunted by the game as well, haha.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

It has that effect on people! That clip I reuse from the ad several times is one of the images that stuck with me. Thanks for sharing, and for watching. Hope you enjoyed the video :)

[@seventhsaint]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis haha, glad I'm not the only one that has Siren stuck in their head. And, yeah! It's a great video and really a good essay on the game. A great watch! I've watched twice already, lol. :D

[@alliestrauss]

I knew it was going to be a good video when I saw Dankovsky on your profile picture :)

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks for watching, glad you liked it! I have lots of other Pathologic videos if you're a fan :)

[@VieriTheArtist]

I remember getting to play Siren on the PS4, it was definitely an experience. Unfortunately I didn’t get too terribly far, but one of these days I’ll linger back to the village. Do you plan to cover Forbidden Siren 2? Just curious because from what I’ve seen it does more fascinating things with the facial technology they used to capture the faces of the actors.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

I absolutely would love to cover Forbidden Siren 2 - I suppose though in order to get gameplay footage I would probably have to emulate, since I don't have a dedicated capture card for PS2. I would also recommend having another go at Forbidden Siren, though maybe with a guide handy somewhere if you get stuck! Thanks for watching, good to see you in the comments again :)

[@tristanjones7682]

The thing you’ve been saying about computers reminds me of a line that Jeff goldblum says in the fly that went along something like computers are stupid they only know what you tell them!

[@Jacked_Dude_Loves_Wheyfus]

Fantastic analysis! I really learned something new and interesting when compared to other Siren videos. I would love to see if you have anything for the Fatal Frame series. My only point of contention in the video is how the music can sometimes be louder than your own voice.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks very much! Glad you liked it. I would definitely love to make something on Fatal Frame / Project Zero, hopefully next year! And that's definitely an issue I'm aware of, but thank you for raising it - such constructive feedback is always appreciated. If I could do the video over again, I'd make sure the audio mixing was better. It's something I've honed over the course of the year, so I think I might have finally sorted it out in my most recent videos. Apologies though - this was an early attempt at video essay making, but I wish I'd managed to get it right from the start!

[@Jacked_Dude_Loves_Wheyfus]

Thanks for taking the feedback so well. I definitely look forward to your other videos, and keep up the great work!@@HorrorGameAnalysis

[@jeanclaudethedarklord6205]

beautiful video, thanks

[@sarahthesarah2850]

You spoke from your humanity. Thank you

[@eem.5395]

goated video!

[@gwennorthcutt421]

beautiful video, both in style and substance! I really appreciate these kind of more... esoteric? analyses, using the medium as grounds to express ideas and feelings. that said, while i agree with the thesis about tradition and being haunted by the past, seeing hp lovecrafts comments on tradition sure is. something. when one recalls his extreme racism. not that i think your essay is bad, but i cant help but think about what lovecrafts own ideas about tradition are in that context. especially relevant is the other quote about tradition being seen in opposition to, among other things, "multiculturalism". i think that'd be another rich avenue to wander down on this subject, real food for thought. getting back on topic, i really love how you expanded on the game being about cycles, and patterns, and tradition, and humanity. i found the line near the end about the characters' journeys feelign worth it, even if they dont make it, because of the human nature of striving toward survival.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Firstly, thank you for your kind words! It's lovely to hear that you enjoyed my esoteric musings! Secondly, you're absolutely right. I should have couched the inclusion of some of Lovecraft's thoughts with some explanation or even a disclaimer as to why or how we should look at what he has to say. The use of tradition in Lovecraft's work is obviously different than the use of tradition in, say, Forbidden Siren, and I realize I should have made that clear. However I do think it is interesting to examine the use of tradition in horror works, and where that places the horror work if it was intended to be didactic. I imagine I will follow up with another video on that later - and again, thank you for that observation. The one problem I have with videos is that once they are rendered and released, they are static. I can't go back and add footnotes or extra evidence beyond the comments or the description - so I am glad to have these kinds of fascinating discussions in the comments! Glad you enjoyed the video. The game really is a special one - and it's simply not about the end point. It's about the journey - as hokey as that sounds. The act of trying is enough.

[@gwennorthcutt421]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis thank you for your response! for sure! i get what you were trying to say with the quotation in this context - the image of an isolated village, the ties of tradition being both a protection against a chaotic universe as well a being ties that bind - but since horror fans often quote hp lovecraft without thinking about that context, I wanted to bring that up. i understand! its like you said in the video! once you release the video, that "you" narrating it no longer exists, and unfortunately videos are no longer able to be edited, nor can they be footnoted. absolutely! i keep coming back to these games, not just for the atmosphere and story, but the characters and how each of their actions leads to supporting one another. i think of the stone markers that four different people find, not knowing that it'll allow kyoya to fight off datatsuhi later.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

@@gwennorthcutt421 Next time I will endeavour to do a better job. A shame that I can't easily insert anything into an already-dead video. But I do appreciate feedback like that - it lets me know what I need to improve on for next time, and I think more sensitivity is never a bad thing, and neither is telling people outright what I otherwise just assume they might know. A lovely point too about the stone markers, I should have mentioned those. One of the smartest bits of the game - when you figure out what the heck you have to do in the first place. It emphasizes collaboration and shows that the stories are considered and meaningful together, not just individually. Maybe another video is eventually in order :)

[@gwennorthcutt421]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis we can only ever approve! thanks for listening! it can be hard to navigate discussing theme in horror because people often take lovecraft out of context. (for example, i dislike his quote about the fear of the unknown, because while i get why people would agree with the broad, sentiment, i cannot help but feel its very much informed by his horrible views) so its refreshing to be able to discuss that frankly! yesssss i love that! its why siren never feels like a downer game to me. sure, most of the cast dont escape, but the way they help each other, without even knowing, the knowledge gleaned through each level... it makes for a very fulfilling story. mrs takato and harumi are in my top faves for sure, her rescuing harumi near the head against the principal was so moving. i cant help but wonder if its (at least in part) due to its japanese creators, since american media usually goes with the "exceptional man" archetype of one special person (or select group) in an way that has individualistic values rather than collaborative ones. not saying one is better over the other, necessarily, but it is very interesting to me to compare how different cultures handle stories and especially horror, since those reflect the values and fears of the culture as well.

[@matthewhyde1515]

22:34 nothing more horrifying than the ps2 boot trying to launch a game and getting the red screen, yes it is certainly haunting

[@nickbooze9766]

Hauntology w/r/t vidya games? Nobody on this platform is doing what you're doing, this is the only place for gaming analysis through the lenses of Theory even remotely of this caliber. It helps that I just finished my first work of Derrida's. You rock dude.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

That means a lot, thank you. I am glad that my work is appreciated. I am also glad that it successfully fills a unique niche, that I am doing something different, and broadening people's horizons. A lot of games deserve deeper critical reflection, and I hope to be able to provide that. Also cool that you too are reading through Derrida :) Thanks for stopping by and watching, again, it means a lot.

[@nickbooze9766]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis Of course man. It was your work on Born from a Wish's Baldwin Manor that got me hooked. I can't begin to tell you what a great surprise this video was, sixth-gen horror and theory? Inject this shit right into my veins bro. I plan to be a pateron come March, that's when I'll be able to. Excited for what's man.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

@@nickbooze9766 So glad to hear. I am incredibly proud of that Born from a Wish / Pathologic video in particular (though I was proud of how this one shaped up too) - glad there are other people out there who like the same classic horror injected straight into their veins too! Hope to see you around more, it would be an honour to have you as a patron. Cheers :)

[@LordJordanXVII]

Excellent!

[@danielpeckham5520]

As far as I can tell, the whole game happens because a bunch of hungry people eat an alien.

[@ericm215]

Its hard to upgrade your television😤 I want that memory card!!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Same! Maybe one day I'll be able to nab it. Thanks for watching, hope you enjoyed the video!

[@anttam117]

This game was unforgiving. It is the only game I’ve played that didn’t finish. Mainly due time constrains. I guess that if certain things hadn’t happened in my life back then I would have finished it, eventually, but then life happened and I started to be interested in other games and then I lost interest in gaming altogether. No, for the last five months, I’ve been slowly growing an interest in gaming again. I hope to find a way to play this game, one way or another, because I remember loving the atmosphere.

[@ZephyrFate]

PCSX2 is what I’d recommend.

[@masonjoy2803]

Something someone has to do is make a video on the connection between siren 1 and 2, and their connection to the world of silent hill. Ever since beating the first and second game I was suspicious of the connection, the otherworldly connection the alien like creatures datatsushi and "mother" have over another dimension makes me think of how silent hill is the same thing. The creature in silent hill "god" seems just like another one of these alien creatures just misunderstood by a cult that stumbled upon them.

[@frankaloons]

Great work! It's a small thing when compared to the quality of your writing, but I really appreciate the effort you put into this video's production. The game footage complements what you're saying really well without ever distracting from it. I'd be remiss if I didn't also mention the advertisement you use the start of a couple times in the video, aren't those first few seconds so viscerally unsettling? Speaks to the multimedia angle you're taking I think, a little injection of the real into an otherwise artificial world. I think some of my favourite horror is Japanese for a similar reason, or at the very least not English. The creators' fingerprints are everywhere, these tiny bits of evidence that this is art made by humans - but at the same time, some combination of the cultural barrier and the fact that it's intentionally trying to scare me makes me feel as though no person's mind could have come up with this. Some of David Lynch's work are western exceptions. I think this tangent is relevant to your points, even if I can't find the words right now to describe why! One tiny correction I bring up only because I think it's weird and amusing: the police officer from the beginning actually doesn't become a shibito until his resurrection. As far as I can tell, until then he's just very very drunk (and seemingly nuts). Whether he even has anything to do with the ritual at all, I've no idea. Probably?

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thank you! I am glad the footage worked out well - I feel as though the production quality of my videos has improved leaps and bounds recently from what I used to be able to achieve, but I still have a long way to go. That advertisement... I could have used more of it, but you're right, those first few seconds of the blood red lake really are something special. It almost functions as a kind of "uncanny valley" for places rather than people - as you say, an injection of the real into the otherwise artificial. And I like your point about cultural barriers adding to horror, I think there's a real thread to pull on there - Forbidden Siren is probably one of the best examples since it is so naturally obtuse anyway, even putting aside cultural differences. Maybe I'll investigate that further... :) And somehow I never realized that. That's a fun fact - I thought he was at that stage just like a half-shibito, but he's just mostly drunk? That sake drinking contest took a toll on him... Thanks for watching and stopping by as usual! Means a lot.

[@LordJordanXVII]

This video is art and history!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Appreciate it very much, I am sincerely grateful for your kind words. They mean a lot to me. Glad you enjoyed the video!

[@LordJordanXVII]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis This game left a deep, perhaps permanent, spiritual impresson on me! It always spoke to me. I live in a small mountain village full of people with old time religions and superstitions and a high volume of paranormal activity. It always felt just as kindred to me, as it did alien/foreign, despite being set half a world away in another era. Your analysis and interpretations were top notch!

[@AnnieBee43]

OH BOY A NEW GAME!

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

I got there in the end! Hope you enjoy the video!

[@nickyCage94]

bravo 👏

[@thatsharakiri178]

Not a horror game but i def wanna see you do a video on marathon, thats a philosophical rabbithole

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Is the Marathon you refer to the FPS series by Bungie from the 90s? I have heard of them but never played them. Will have to check them out! Thanks very much for the recommendation. Hope you enjoyed the video, thanks for stopping by.

[@thatsharakiri178]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis top 5 ever, insane shit, keep it up

[@ShadeUnderTheSoul]

I couldn't agree more with your point on AI-generated art. The fact that we are closer to automating art, which is the most centrally human activity possible, than we are to automating much menial labor, shows that the priorities of our civilization are very, very wrong.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Sorry for the belated reply - but I appreciate that very much. It's not necessarily that AI art is inherently evil or frightening, just that I'm afraid it will reach a point (or maybe has already reached a point) where people are more interested in the end result rather than the journey. Our society already struggles to value creative endeavours over "productive" ones, even just in how the professions are seen. I consider finding the words I want to say more important most of the time than actually saying them. Writing is a process, not just a result, and I want more people to experience the joy of creating something for the sake of the self rather than the output. I fear what AI will do to us as creators - as you say, the priorities of our civilization are very, very wrong.

[@deadspace4755]

The more l listened to your words, the less I understood. Perhaps because of the english language or the constant use of the "hauntology". What is "Hauntology"? A memory? Something that triggers a memory? Is there a synonym for it? Because if there was, l would get a bigger mental picture of what it actually means. So far, my image is too blurry to understand your theme of the essay. Not to say you did a bad job at it, nor missing the point of the game. It is a rare case for me, to not understand the author. Possibly because l got stuck in a pebble on the path(of understanding); looked at the wrong spot despite the answer being in front, or something else. Regardless, a good effort. This era of games(2000s) was and is very unique. Too mysterious as well. Lot of games having themes, feelings, beliefs that we will never see again. Take for example Lifeline on the PS2. Who thought of that game, how it would work, and why make it? Lot of questions, lot of dead ends and being forgotten. In this case, it has lot of oblivion on it. It is a game, for me, that can't be forgotten. It made a part in me, that l can't forget. The experience in it, is none l have seen in games or even stories. Few games actually make me remember it, like Binary Domain(another masterpiece) which uses your voice. It is gone now, the creativity of making such games. It may linger on some people(indies) but we are in a new era, an era that reflects exactly how a human being is. Looking at the root of everything, shows exactly why it happened and who is responsible. What I am saying it is, it all results/loops back to the person. What does he want to give, why he wants to give it and what was his intention. It could be to give to his own self something. It could be to give to God, it could be on his neighbour. Intention is the key here

[@NeoShameMan]

The flaw in your comment on art, and the void of ai generated art, is your ego. Art is made of connection and evocation, the universe is unfeeling, yet we found meaning and beauty in it, the ability to connect to that unfeelingness of the universe is what makes us human. Ai art is unfeeling but it's evocative, the ego is merely hurt of seeing its own made up relevance over everything else contradicted, it didn't need ai art to struggle to find superiority of its existence where there was never one. The sun will continue to sunset before and after artists try to steal and reproduce its beauty, before and after humanity roam the dirt. Memento mori oxymandias! Sturgeon's law didn't need ai.

[@HorrorGameAnalysis]

Thanks for your comment! You have actually helped to settle some of my reflection on the matter. I have been thinking more about AI art since I made this video, and I certainly find it wonderful that people can, and do, find AI art meaningful and wonderful. I made some statements yesterday in my Silent Hill 3 stream about art and how great it is that we can find meaning in the meaningless - which has been a step I took towards accepting the potential quality of AI art. You are certainly right regarding the anthropocentricity that we assume should be a quality of art. It simply is the way that education in a Western context at least seems to produce people, although I always try to be conscious of the environment despite that. I traced back the origin point of much of my anxiety regarding AI and it stems from the human practicality of AI. If we all lived in a society that allowed us all to live without earning a living, or at least provided some level of basic support, then AI would be a fun tool and I would probably be enjoying it a lot more. But as it stands it is losing artists work, and is also stealing independent artists' work, and there are no defense mechanisms in place really for those artists. A slightly different conversation is ChatGPT's blatant fabrications, especially around indigenous artists and their work, but if we were to rectify that, we would have to advocate for the further absorption of data into one enormous large language model, and that feels risky, to say the least. My other concern regarding AI art is personal expression. I am not saying that my experience is (or will ever be) universal, because that is not true for anybody, anywhere. However, I have always found finding the words to say something (or even my pencil to draw something, however terribly) a valuable process because it is a process of self-interpretation and introspection. You are interpreting thoughts and ideas when you are doing this, transposing it onto the page. The fear I have is that AI art will, for many people, replace personal expression in favour of an externalized version of this process. Edit: Our society already has an issue with seeing only the end result of a work of art as beneficial, when in fact the process is just as integral, if not more important, to the actual artist. Turning art into something that is both quickly produced and produced with only the smallest amount of human input troubles me, because we don't see what's going on under the hood. We don't get the process. This might not bother others, but it is an idea I am still grappling with because my life has been made better by personal expression and writing for myself (and others). All this is to say, though, thanks for watching and leaving a thoughtful comment. Hope you enjoyed the video overall!

[@NeoShameMan]

@@HorrorGameAnalysis There is 3 things in this answer: 1. subjugation 2. self expression 3. artist vs clients 1. Subjugation: The current work system is based on subjugation. Jobs are not natural or inevitable, but a product of an old and unfair system. In this system, a few people gain power by taking the value of many others, and make them depend on them for survival. They use big companies to control and exploit people, and make them believe they are important and irreplaceable. But times are changing, and new ways of working and living are possible. We can use technology to connect directly with customers, collaborators and fans, without middlemen. We can also use AI to replace the roles of the powerful few, and free ourselves from their influence. Let’s automate the bosses and keep the workers, in a new form! 2. Self expression: My research show that truly novel works always takes 5 years or more. It doesn't matter if it's a book, a game or a movie, from ideation to final work. Execution is really a small part of it, writing a book isn't hard and doesn't takes long, writing a specific story is an entirely new thing. Ai art doesn't change any of that, and we know because history repeat itself, we have been there before. Photography, computer, photoshop, algorithmic art, all challenged the way we "execute art", but nontheless, the time it takes to finish a piece stay constant. Look at notable ai artist, they take just as long to get a new piece, despite the instant result, because finding specifics is what art is about, not the result. It's not new either, David Cope with Emily Howell and Harold Cohen, that's the 60s! 3. Artist vs Clients: There is two old chinese folktales about art, the first is the emperor and the Rooster, and the other is the Emperor raised by the painting. Both talk about the relation to art and the artist. Art is by necessity pretentious, art turn the inert and material into a vector of the spiritual and emotional, but art over step itself when it pretend to be more than their simulacra, it doesn't matter how wet a water looks, it cannot wet you, it doesn't matter how lovely is a woman on a painting, she cannot love you back, art is in competition with the very thing it represent, it's doomed to fail. Pygmalion was a warning. The artist get lost in these emotions and pretend they are everything, and when a clients doesn't recognize emotion that is by definition not his own, the artist feel rejected, how dare you! Don't you recognize the poignancy of my emotions? The client, having it's own feelings, is disappointed, that's not what he came for, why are artist forcing their person onto them, it feel like assaults, thus art is devalued. Art will never be valued, because art represent person, art is subject to whims of both the viewer and the artist. Art is a relation, and relation are never universal. That's why finding your audience is key.

[@happystrawberry865]

Ai lacks a soul

[@KillNamniaR]

In 2023’s KZbin a good FS 2 analysis is missing. Please do it.

[@hazymist2985]

I concur.