Jet Aircraft LANDS WITH NO CLEARANCE after Several ATC Calls

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Audio source: www.liveatc.net/

[@VASAviation]

Was there an issue for us? 😂😂

[@FencerPTS]

Translation, "is tower going to say 'possible pilot deviation?'"😬

[@eternalfizzer]

Hooooly crow. How can they just brush off a mistake like that?!? I did that *once* as a shiny new pilot when I was practicing solo touch and gos. After one landing, tower told me to exit at a taxiway. Then he laid into me. OMG. I was so shook at what I just did, I parked it for the day. (It was a military base, so sometimes my cessna 152 was in the circuit with hercs and other much faster planes.) Almost 40 years, and I can still feel the hair on my arms go up when I think about it.

[@z00h]

@@eternalfizzer 40 years ago when people cared about standards. Now people care about themselves.

[@philmann3476]

@@eternalfizzer As a student pilot years ago I was shooting touch and goes and at one point forgot whether I had clearance. A simple call to the tower with a "please confirm clearance for touch and go" confirmed my clearance and all was well. The fear of screwing up was strong.

[@mikhailjairnisbett441]

@@philmann3476 My trick is to always turn the landing light on after I have landing clearance, that way I can look up and see, it's always helped me out.

[@joe2lank]

Meanwhile passengers are wondering why they kept hearing “Go ahead for 529” over the PA.

[@concorde2003]

That's funny. Two thumbs up for your joke.

[@michaelconvery8871]

Perfect. Done that once but knew right away my mistake. It’s obvious

[@grouperkng1]

😂

[@Everything817]

😂

[@MrSuperawesome5000]

😂

[@AviationJeremy]

“Well we uuuuhhh are now.” I love the silence as tower tries to decide how to respond.

[@sbdreamin]

he was probably laughing his ass off.

[@douwehuysmans5959]

Either laughing or screaming and stomping in anger.

[@mercator79]

yeah what does that even mean? Oh right, means he knows his ticket might get pulled for a bit

[@mikek5298]

Whether the pilot thought he was talking to the tower or not, even if he could hear the tower, he never received a clearance to land.

[@trixter21992251]

is pretending to be a tower a thing? Could've been a joker on a different frequency fooling him. Felony, of course, but could happen.

[@pilotavery]

Search NORDO procedures. If he can hear the tower but he's not getting any response then there's a chance that his radio is not transmitting, he should have done a radio check, and if he gets no response squawk NORDO 7600, Then technically the correct procedure is to continue your IFR flight plan exactly as filed and look out for light and signals, if you don't see them land.

[@mallinois4978]

@@pilotavery correct

[@mallinois4978]

@Avery Kucan l had this happen to me once at the former mid continent Airport now Eisenhower in wichita Kansas. I kept responding but they were not hearing me .l was on a 5 mile final, and I didn't really know what to do so I squaked 7600 and ident ..they gave me light signal ,steady green for cleared to land

[@sarahalbers5555]

This is terrifying. What are these idiots thinking? Think of the innocent folks who could be taken out by this behavior. Pull this a**holes ticket!

[@daytonahypnosis]

I once had a light aircraft land at my airport without ever talking to me on either tower or ground freq. The plane taxied over to an FBO, so I called them on the phone and asked to speak with the pilot. She came on the phone and I told her she landed without talking to ATC; since Barnes has a Class D, it's mandatory. There was a long pause, then, "Barnes? This isn't Northampton?" (That's an uncontrolled field about 15 miles north.) 🙃

[@johnevans7006]

😬😬😬

[@KatTheFoxtaur]

Jeez, and Barnes is a joint civil-military airport! How the hell did she even manage to mistake them?! Like, you have Barnes - a multiple-runway airport surrounded by land; then there's nearby Westover AFB - an even bigger military airport also pretty surrounded by land; and Northampton, a tiny little strip of pavement with very few buildings around it, sitting in the middle of a corn field adjacent to the Connecticut River... (I used to deliver pizzas in Noho so I'm familiar with the area lol!) 😉

[@patersonplankrd]

Thats grounds to be grounded. Sent back to school to redo the entire thing.

[@cryptobox128]

I'm just imagining that pilot's calls on Northampton CTAF. "Wow, this place is bigger than I thought."

[@bravejango12]

Before i got to my first airport they had a guy land in the middle of the night without using the pilot controlled lighting or using any lights on his aircraft. He taxied over to the self-serve fuel area and refueled his aircraft. There happened to be a guy working in the FBO outside on a smoke break that only noticed him because he taxied past in complete darkness. He called over to the fire station and they went and checked him out thinking he was having an electrical issue. Turns out he was running drugs north from Florida and didn't want to get noticed. If he had used his lights and the pilot controlled lights no one would have paid even the slightest bit of attention to him.

[@matt_b...]

"If we weren't cleared to land, then how are we on the ground? CHECK MATE, TOWER!" -Jetspeed 529, probably.

[@marvinracer88]

this wins the internet.

[@TheGreyGhost_of43rd]

Sounds like a pretty clear landing to me 🤷🏿‍♂️

[@tipdub]

lol!!

[@dx1450]

Neener neener

[@insomnia20422]

Pilot: "We were talking the whole time." Tower: ...

[@patriot_pills]

This one SIMPLE trick will speed up your trip! Airports DONT want you to know 😅

[@spelldaddy5386]

Clickbait 😂

[@commerce-usa]

Act quickly before we get caught, uh before powerful shadowy forces get this taken down. 🤣👍

[@dougaltolan3017]

👍

[@BoBandits]

One Time Only! Conditions apply…

[@spelldaddy5386]

@@BoBandits you can do anything you want to, once in your life. You may not get to do it a second time though...

[@elwyrick]

So, this reminded me of my first solo cross country when I was 16. After I had 5 hours of instruction, my first instructor disappeared on a flight. They found him at the Andalusia, Alabama airport, drunk. After a couple of makeshift instructional hours, they hired an off-season crop duster to be my instructor. He didn't believe in altitude or radios and I was flying out of an uncontrolled airport, so I had no idea about how to talk to towers. My first solo cross-country was supposed to go to Rome, Georgia. There was a solid overcast and I wondered whether I should go or not. He didn't believe in calling for weather either. He just asked me if I was going to be a fair weather pilot. So, I took off, but I kept looking at the clouds instead of the ground and pretty soon I was totally lost. The only thing he had told me about a VOR was that I should keep the needle centered and you could do that by turning that little knob. So I tuned in Rome VOR and when the needle started heading off to the right, I just turned the little knob untill it centered again. Pretty soon the little window flipped from To to From and I was confused because I hadn't seen Rome go by and it's a decent sized city. Big enough so I should see it, anyway Pretty soon I started noticing mountains underneath me. They kept getting higher and higher until finally I was flying in a valley. This was in 1966 and, happily, I found an Interstate highway that they were working on, so I decided to follow it because I figured it went somewhere. After a couple more turns in the valley, it turned into a finished interstate highway and there were some big highway signs. I descended until I could read the sign and it said "Chattanooga Next Exit." I was pretty flabbergasted about that. The valley turned again and there in front of me was a big ol' city. I could see the Chattanooga Airport straight ahead and I wasn't about to go looking for some other airport, so I went straight to it to get on the ground. I had no idea how to find the frequency for the tower, so I just lined up behind a Delta jet and landed. I had never been in a big airport before, So I wasn't sure what to do. Then I noticed some buildings that had little planes in front of it and went there. A guy waved me in. As I was climbing out of the 150, he said that the tower would like to talk to me. I told the tower guy that I was a student pilot and was lost. He was very nice to me and he told me to call him when I took off. He also told me that right at the end of end of the runway was Highway 27 and that would take me to Rome. So I followed Highway 27 to Rome and got my log book signed and then followed 27 again all the way to my home airport. By then, my dad decided to take over my instruction for a while. He was a pilot and instructor for Eastern Airlines and had been an instructor in World War II. The first thing he did when I got home was teach me how a VOR works and how you're supposed to fly toward the needle and not just center it with the little knob. I hadn't thought about that experience for a while, so this video was fun to watch and imagine those tower guys in Chattanooga calling me over and over.

[@michawk2228]

This was a good read, thanks for sharing

[@dashford06]

What a great story, thank you!

[@nutandboltguy3720]

Good story. Thanks for sharing.

[@bbgun061]

Great story! Most people are forgiving of student pilot mistakes. Not so much when flying a corporate jet.

[@runarandersen878]

Interesting story. From a different time I would say also :)

[@fritz46]

Some say that an unknown controller on an unknown airport within the radio range of Bozeman is still waiting for Jetspeed 529 to land.

[@vbscript2]

Well, better than Rapid City. There have been a few cases of planes - including commercial airliners - intending to land at Rapid City and accidentally landing at Ellsworth Air Force Base instead.

[@jdthedjyt]

LOL! That was the same thought I had!

[@ropersonline]

If this were the UK, then I'd be willing to believe Mizzy got his hands on a radio nearby and cleared Jetspeed 529 to land as a "prank."

[@vbscript2]

@@ropersonline If someone did that, everyone on frequency would probably hear it, including the LiveATC recordings, unless maybe they used a very directional antenna. Even if they did use a directional antenna to issue a bogus clearance, though, the plane itself still has an omnidirectional antenna, so everyone on frequency would hear the readback of the clearance.

[@ropersonline]

@@vbscript2 You're quite correct. It was more commentary on Mizzy's recklessness with his "pranks". Like, if there's one person I'd be willing to believe might do something like that - maybe Mizzy. Actually, even that is dramatic hyperbole. I don't really think even Mizzy would do this, but he's certainly earned his reputation as a reckless rogue for clicks and likes, and see, it worked: Here I am, still talking about a person I didn't know existed before he did all that stuff. Stuff btw. a person resolutely could not do in America because they would be shot. Mizzy is the price Britain pays for an unarmed public and an unarmed police. And I don't know, maybe that's worth it. You tell me.

[@Xaelloss]

"Jetspeed 529, that "Tower" you were talking to - are they in this room with us right now?"

[@FamilyManMoving]

Underappreciated comment.

[@Saml01]

You know when you do something wrong and your parents dont yell and that usually means you did something really bad. Thats how I felt listening to this controller.

[@jrod_pilot_miami]

Oh you know that guy was going to get a pilot deviation. It was coming, except the pilot got to the controller first lol.

[@since1876]

"No problem bro, just gimme a call in a minute." A few minutes later.... "WHAT THEY FUCK WAS THAT??? DO YOU REALIZE HOW MANY FUCKING LIVES YOU PUT AT RISK????? 😡😡😡😡"

[@TankEnMate]

I'm not angry, just disappointed *OOFFF*

[@minirock000]

Yeah, good one.

[@fltof2]

It’s Montana, no way this guy got violated.

[@HobbitHobbit]

Pilot: I was talking to you the whole time. Did he not find it odd that the tower was not responding to him? Giving yourself permission to land at a controlled airfield puts you and others in danger. It might be worth investing in some retraining on how to handle a similar situation in the future.

[@DISOPtv]

Tower, if we have clearance to land, say "are you up." :D

[@babyj4154]

Just curious, what would the appropriate course of action be?

[@DrStrangeLuv71]

If he had radio failure and an IFR flight plan, yes you can land.

[@rubenvillanueva8635]

@@DrStrangeLuv71 If he had radio failure, it would be nice to squawk 7600, letting ATC know, and assure the rwy is clear. A missed apch, join the pattern and return for a landing, expecting the Green light from the twr on final, is a safer option.

[@HobbitHobbit]

@@DrStrangeLuv71 In this case, that would not be correct. The pilot did not state he had a radio failure, in fact quite the opposite, stating he was talking the whole time. FAR 91.185 and FAR 91.126 would address the topic. As the pilot has clearance to approach, if he lost communications, he would establish a hold pattern, per the approach chart, and try to resolve the issue before proceeding visually or to an alternate (after first switching back to the old frequency and attempt to establish communications). Since he did none of these things, the crew did not believe they had a communications issue. The most likely scenario is that the pilot accepted clear to approach as clear to land and did not listen for tower's response.

[@stamis22]

I trained at a towered field and on my second ever solo flight had a radio failure. That was a very nervous experience. I was on downwind when I realized that I hadn't been cleared to land or given any traffic calls when I knew there was a jet on about a 5 mile final (the last thing I heard before the failure was a jet checking in), so I gave my call saying I was in the downwind. No response. I waited a few seconds, called again, still nothing. Eventually I figured my radio must have crapped out and I was definitely getting a little nervous trying to figure out what I would do. As part of the presolo training we covered radio failures but it was something I kinda did for the test then didn't think too much about just assuming it probably wouldn't happen to me (I know, major hazardous attitude right there, and this taught me my lesson). I ended up turning away from the pattern and circling about 4 miles north of the field for a few minutes questioning if I go to the nearby non towered field or land and see what the consequences would be. I made a few more calls hoping that they could hear me even if I couldn't hear them, and sometime around then I looked back at the tower and saw a flashing green light. That is when the pre solo knowledge kicked back in and I remembered there was a procedure for it. feeling that I was ok I went ahead and reentered the pattern, got the solid green light and landed. As I was turning off the runway something dawned on me...I had a second radio I never tried using, so I tuned in the ground frequency on it gave a call and could hear them respond. they were nice and I apologized saying I was a new solo student and I panicked a bit and didn't think of all my options, I was a bit embarrassed to admit that I didn't even think to change my com 2, I had never once changed it and it was always just set on the atis frequency so it didn't even occur to my 16 year old new solo mind to try and use it to transmit while in a semi panicked state. Thankfully it was the receiver that failed, not the transmitter so they could hear my calls, and could tell that I just couldn't hear them. It was only after landing that I remembered 7600 existed. In the end I made a lot of mistakes in that situation that I could have avoided by better preparing myself beforehand, but, I also learned a valuable lesson. It can happen to you, so you better be prepared, and that's something I took to heart. I will never forget radio failure procedures again, and I will be prepared with thorough knowledge of other emergency procedures so I handle them better if and when I experience them for the first time. This is a story I use for all my students now to make sure they know to be prepared. I also got lucky that despite not hearing tower, they could hear me, and as far as emergencies are concerned, lost comms in the pattern at a relatively slow delta isn't the most life threatening. I doubt I would have been any more prepared for another emergency at the time, and those could have been far more dangerous. So to any student pilots, or even new licensed pilots, take this as a warning, it can happen to you, and just because you casually know how to do the procedures in a low stress classroom when questioned by your instructor doesn't mean you will in the plane when it actually happens and your stress levels increase. Don't practice your emergency procedures until you get them right, practice them until you can't get them wrong.

[@Enigma89]

thanks for sharing this story

[@weeknieunknowing]

This is a good story to share, thanks! And I'm glad to hear that everything ended well for you, good that the training suddenly kicked in when you saw the green light (kinda awesome how that works with the mind, though perhaps slightly less than ideal :P). One thing that surprises me though, you were 16 when this happened? Are you allowed to fly that young already?

[@stamis22]

@@weeknieunknowing You can solo as a student pilot at 16, and you can get your private pilots license when you are 17

[@stamis22]

@@Enigma89 No problem, thanks for the reply, I love your stuff. Just recently got into DCS multiplayer

[@thalanoth]

@@weeknieunknowing blows my mind you can fly solo at 16

[@notmyname998]

We were talking the whole time.... Well, did you ever hear the phrase "clear to land" and repeated that phrase by any chance??

[@maxxiong]

I have a suspicion the pilot thought the approach clearance was a landing clearance...

[@jaywung7616]

To clarify, the pilot did not claim he got a clearance, and may have been calling the entire time on a bad radio. What we don't know is if he squawked 7600 or not, and what else he did or didn't try to establish comms. With no response, the correct action is to continue the approach to landing.

[@Kathlanus]

@@jaywung7616 Did I get this right? When you're cleared for approach and comms are lost it is assumed that you are cleared to land, and therefore you land? I would have assumed the standard procedure is a go around. Unless you have an emergency of course. But then you'd squak accordingly wouldn't you?

[@tedsaylor6016]

@@maxxiong No way approach freq is issuing a landing clearance, not happening.

[@tedsaylor6016]

@@Kathlanus For a IFR flight, yes I believe you continue as filed/amended which in this case would just be landing. It sure sounds like there was a "human factors" issue that caused the comm breakdown. The alternative would be to have them fly where and do what?

[@Jeexer13]

Had this happen at my tower SUS last week, Cirrus Vision Jet was handed off but never talked to me on tower…when approach couldnt reach them i used the light gun and said over freq “NXXX if you can hear this transmission you are cleared to land runway 8R, observe steady green signal in tower” at least that way they “received” a clearance, and i held everyone else while i had a NORDO in airspace…they came over on ground when they exited and we got to talk to them finally…

[@FencerPTS]

I'd love to see/hear that event on VAS

[@VASAviation]

Share date and time so we can search

[@mikemalone4729]

I learned to fly at SUS.

[@albert109]

Spirit of St. Louis out in Chesterfield?

[@mikemalone4729]

@@albert109 yes.

[@colt10mmsecurity68]

That controller is the coolest one I’ve ever heard before. I’m surprised he didn’t go “pilot deviation” on the pilot. The pilot was lying too. Had he heard the controller, he would have hit the ident button when told to do so, yet he did not.

[@thomasbonse]

He probably did file a pilot deviation incident report with the FAA, but isn't going to give the pilot an opportunity to mitigate the potential ramifications, hence no 'I've got a number for you to call'. Basically a classic passive-aggressive response.

[@Datamining101]

@@thomasbonse that’s not what passive aggressive means 😂

[@sakumisan]

@@thomasbonse They literally gave him a number to call. Why do you people comment without even having listened to the audio?

[@ty2248]

He’s a good guy; very squared away and handles the traffic in Bozeman well

[@2011blueman]

Oh he definitely DID file an incident report with the FAA, he just wasn't a jerk about it on frequency like most controllers are in this situation.

[@JustAnotherBritishGuy]

2:27 Pilots literally just like "We're talking now so what's the problem?"

[@commerce-usa]

More like when you get caught speeding and ask the police, is there a problem officer? 👍

[@GoatzombieBubba]

@@commerce-usa what seems to be the officer, problem?

[@lo1bo2]

@@GoatzombieBubba I'm not as think as you drunk I am.

[@robot_spider]

Pilot was traveling, not flying. No permission is required!

[@davidfrench5407]

Pilot: "But did we die?"

[@elcheapo5302]

Tower didn't sound mad, just disappointed. 🤣

[@ChristopherKovacsToph]

In the vein of not throwing stones I was with an instructor doing a practice circling approach and head “circle to land runway 25” (don’t think they said land, think I filled that in). They intended me to do a low approach and I did a touch and go on the circle. Got “say intentions” from the tower followed by a light chastisement after it was obvious I was confused. On debrief my instructor and I BOTH misheard the circle instruction as a clearance. No excuse for these pilots, but my experience taught me that it is easier to land without a clearance than you’d think.

[@AviationJeremy]

In your case, I can see how you got confused. In the video’s case, they have no excuse. If they weren’t getting a response from tower, they should have executed a missed approach.

[@someguyontheinternet7165]

I’ve had something similar. I was shooting a practice approach with my CFII and originally we asked for the option on a straight in approach and had been cleared however just before the FAF they asked if we were able to circle instead. We agreed, but just before we were about to descend from the circling mins we realized the new circle clearance never included to land or the option, only to keep our squawk for the missed. Luckily my CFI caught it just in time, but had he not I absolutely would have done the touch and go. 😬

[@robertmog4336]

Clearance? We don't need no stinkin' clearance! 😂

[@airodyssey]

That pilot didn't sound sorry.

[@cruisinguy6024]

Oh he’s gonna be sorry soon lol

[@jcraigshelton]

Yeah he didn’t. What a plick.

[@airflo_muc]

No need to sound sorry on an ATC frequency, what change would that make? I suppose they didn‘t really understand the issue in the first place, but I‘m sure they sorted it out on the phone, and that‘s all that matters.

[@thomasbonse]

I'm guessing th is is why the ATC controller didn't give them a number to call because they're not going to give the pilot the option of avoiding a formal FAA report on the incident.

[@cruisinguy6024]

@@thomasbonse they DID give them a number to call

[@Furious321]

My theory is that Jetspeed properly read back the approach clearance (0:13), and then was distracted by some task concerning his approach. Afterward, he never pushed the PTT button while airborne. He then exited the runway, switched to Ground (which was being handled by Tower at the time), and said "I was talking the whole time", which refers to his communication with Approach. I don't think he was lying, he just interpreted his approach clearance as one to land and therefore never even switched to the Tower frequency. It's still totally negligent, but a bit less malicious than "Screw ATC, I'm going in."

[@since1876]

Yeah, I'm sure the call wasn't much more than a ding on his record and a lesson on how to get clearance. Definitely wouldn't fire the guy, but he's GOT to learn from this or he ain't gonna fly for long... 😂

[@brianm8642]

Perhaps they may have checked in with tower on the wrong frequency, but we can also say with 100% certainty that there was no landing clearance issued. Assuming they ASAP this one, it wasn't one of the Big 5 and it will all be addressed by the ERC next month. (ATC also proactively flashes green light gun signals to avoid the deviation paperwork. That may have happened here)

[@AdrianColley]

Why make it complicated? The simplest explanation is that he got the tower frequency wrong, and he was transmitting on a channel that nobody was listening to. But he was IFR and had started his approach, so the standard procedure says you land anyway.

[@Furious321]

@Adrian Colley I would buy this if upon hearing Tower, he said "Oh there you are! Never heard from you guys during my approach. What happened?"

[@minirock000]

hypothesis - fixed.

[@TiagoSeiler]

When you can't tell the voices in your head from the voice from Tower

[@n1msu]

Exactly what I was thinking!

[@jimmiller5600]

Nah, my extra voices are normally much angrier. ;)

[@n1msu]

@@jimmiller5600 are you claiming to be 𝘵𝘩𝘦, pilot involved in this incident?

[@jimmiller5600]

@@n1msu nah

[@w.ryanbutler8097]

I halfway expected this pilot to respond "Well you didn't NOT clear me to land"

[@paulstelian97]

To be fair that wouldn’t have been good for further investigation.

[@Jopanaguiton]

This had happened to one our survey company aircraft. The pilot admitted to me he switched to the other radio that he found out after he landed that it was muted and he thought he had a nordo. Tower did him a solid by transmitting to our aircraft with a clear to land.

[@FencerPTS]

Apparently it never dawned on them that they never heard the magic word: "cleared."

[@DoctorZaius]

They technically did hear the word “cleared” (they were cleared the approach earlier) but not “cleared to land”. How a pilot can land on a runway without being cleared to land and then act dumbfounded after is beyond me though.

[@jfelipe1987]

@@DoctorZaius Pilots are getting old. And most of them spent a long time around leaded fuel. It's gonna get more and more interesting.... also i think cleared to land should be the only time the word cleared is used in aviation. Authorized for approach should be used instead. in my opinion

[@mtnairpilot]

@@jfelipe1987 I don’t think that was the issue here. Approach control wouldn’t normally clear an airplane to land. This crew just forgot to contact tower and are trying to play it off to avoid getting in trouble.

[@andrewalexander9492]

@@jfelipe1987 Yeah, that's right we should stop using "cleared" in all of the dozens of other every day circumstances when ATC issues a clearance to an aircraft. You're not a pilot, are you?

[@xheralt]

"We were talking the whole time!" Yeah, but were you _listening?_

[@commerce-usa]

Breaks cardinal rule of landing without landing clearance and asks if there was an issue. 🙄

[@kaasmeester5903]

“What, weeeeeeee… are down!”

[@sarahalbers5555]

Unbelievable.

[@virginiaviola5097]

Can both pilots hear the tower when one is flying and the other one working the radios?

[@JayvynRhodes]

@@virginiaviola5097 yes

[@kristin7146]

"But I was talking the whole time!"

[@uprrslo]

That is one cool controller. Very professional.

[@mikeschultze3135]

Going way back in time, the whole family was flying from Mexico after clearing Customs we proceeded to North Las Vegas Airport. When in contact with North Las Vegas tower, I as copilot lined us up with Nellis Air Force Base. Asked tower why we have F-105 on our left wing. Just then, we both realized I was in the pattern for the military airport.

[@douglasphillips1203]

If you'd have landed, you'd have had quite a welcome party!

[@DonVideoGuy007]

@@douglasphillips1203 - I think that you actually mean - a very agitated welcome party of armed USAF military police, especially if it was during the early years of the Vietnam War, when the Republic F-105 Thunderchief was the mainstay fighter/bomber of the US Air Force.

[@Swordsfor200Alex]

LOL Wow that is way back in time if you had an airborne F-105 shadowing you.

[@douglasphillips1203]

@@DonVideoGuy007 I didn't say it was a friendly welcome party!😂

[@thomashenden71]

If there is anything Kelsey have taught us, it is that it is never nice to get a number to copy and call after the flight… 😄

[@spelldaddy5386]

I'm guessing either they transferred the inactive to the active frequency when that was set to something else, or they dialed in the frequency wrong. Either way, this is insane

[@mozvidz]

They said they could hear the tower the 'whole time'.

[@joshuahudson2170]

@@mozvidz Oof doesn't sound like a native English speaker and doesn't know the procedure for dropped transmit. That was not going to go well.

[@spelldaddy5386]

@@mozvidz they said they were talking the whole time. That doesn't mean they necessarily heard tower, just that they were trying to call (perhaps cold calls like tower was doing)

[@mtnairpilot]

@@spelldaddy5386 even if that were true they shouldn’t have landed without a clearance. They could have gone back to approach to sort it out.

[@spelldaddy5386]

@@mtnairpilot I agree, it is a problem, but it's important to figure out what went wrong so it doesn't happen again

[@jeffwads]

We are talking to you now, Tower. What’s the big deal?

[@Dream0Asylum]

You're calling us from the airport deli bathroom, 529.

[@zachboyd4749]

Dude, I can see 9S5 on that sectional. That’s my home airport, my dad managed that airport for 17 years and I was the groundskeeper. I learned to fly there too, can’t tell you how many times I took off and landed at that little airstrip and hopped over to KBZN for tower training. I also worked at Bridger Aerospace at KBZN for a summer, while me and my dad also helped take restore and care of two F-100s, a T-33, and a F-86 kept there. Good times…

[@challenger604pilot]

If the words “Cleared to land” have not been said, received or acknowledged then you are NOT cleared to land. Mistakes happen though.

[@elmin2323]

Relax mate

[@SoloRenegade]

radio failures happen, and you don't always know it.

[@alan_davis]

​@@SoloRenegadeyou do, because you don't get a reply...

[@SoloRenegade]

@@alan_davis sometimes it takes a while to realize you've messed up the coms, or that there is a problem. not saying the pilots shouldn't have been paying better attention. but stuff happens.

[@David-yo5re]

Those kind of mistakes get people killed. He should lose his pilots license immediately and indefinitely.

[@alexanderwalley2639]

This is one situation i cant quite comprehend. If you don’t have clearance you don’t land, just go around. If you’re on final. No matter the importance of your passengers, you go around. Why would this pilot assume i got approach clearance, so i can land. I dont get it. Where the thought process. Ive had a few close calls. Namely in so-cal, i was on visual final (i got cleared for approach) and was about 1 mile from the threshold and hadnt recieved my clearance to land, i contacted ATC (keep in mind: ATC notified us not to call in) and asked to be cleared. Atc replied: stand by. I Didnt have time to standby to i went around. No issue there, got back in the pattern and got cleared to land, simple as that.

[@derektoeppen4379]

This ATC audio reminds me of something that happened 40yrs ago and still makes me uncomfortable today. I got my private license in the early 80s. Flew for a few years and stopped. One night I wanted to practice some night landing and takeoffs. So, I flew from the uncontrolled field where the plane was located to a controlled field. I contacted approach, got clearance to runway 22 and was handed to the tower. I called the tower and was given clearance to land 22. From that point on, I mentally screened all ATC communication for my callsign. If I did not hear my callsign, I did not process/internalize what was being said. I was totally focused on the night landing. At some point, I became aware the tower had lost radio contact with some plane. They kept calling and giving instruction to follow if they had a radio failure (7600, turn on landing lights etc). But I blocked all thought of it out and focused on the landing. After the touch and go I called the tower Don't remember why (permission to enter the pattern or something). And they immediately said, "didn't you hear us calling you?" I took a few seconds to think about the radio calls to the other plane as I was landing and simply replied "I heard you calling someone, but this is 7TN". There was a silence on the radio for what seemed like a long time and then nothing more was said about it. I was amazed at how completely I screen the radio calls for my callsign. Proud that I focused on the landing as the radio communication drama unfolded. But always kick myself for not figuring out they had my callsign wrong. They had it right when they cleared me to land. In this audio they clearly have the callsigns correct. But something else went wrong. Errors happen. What's the rule 1. aviate, 2. navigate, 3. (then) communicate.

[@mercator79]

Yeah the heli did that quick check to see if they were being contacted. IMHO you definitely paid your mental dues for that one - 40 years is enough brother!

[@markbatarina4512]

Can you imagine if he was accidentally talking on guard and some random dude gave him a landing clearance on there? LOL

[@TheFlyingZulu]

Bruh... that would be f*cked up to the extreme... I would hope random other pilots or people would refrain from doing that.

[@johnbidwell2393]

That's going to be his *next* excuse for apparantly landing without clearance.

[@markbatarina4512]

@@TheFlyingZulu it’s pretty messed up. I only thought of that because while I was flying, a United pilot on departure checked in on guard and some dumbass gave him an altitude to climb to. People on guard were begging the United Pilot to not climb and that they were on guard!

[@JuanAdam12]

That was my thought, too, but I hate to accept that someone on 121.5 would be that stupid to pretend to be a tower controller and clear an airplane to land. It’s bad enough when idiots “clear” airline pilots to enter controlled ramps. They really ought to have their FCC licenses revoked.

[@EdOeuna]

Nah, someone would just have meowed at him.

[@BillySugger1965]

“We are now”? Are you serious? He was so gonna get a number to call. Man I bet his ass is toast!

[@wbball15]

Thanks for sharing

[@Dan007UT]

Thank you N807D for your words of wisdom :)

[@kristin7146]

If you were "talking the whole time" you might have noticed that it sounded like the Tower wasn't hearing you and held off until the issue was resolved 😅

[@YaroslavNechaev]

per lost comms procedures you are to proceed with landing (absent of some angry red lights pointed at you from Tower). There is no such thing as "holding" at a random location

[@kristin7146]

@@YaroslavNechaev Right, but you notice, the pilot didn't say "I lost comms, so I followed procedure." He got snarky and said "was there a problem?" and then "I was talking the whole time." It *really* didn't come across as someone who was concerned because they 'lost comms.'

[@FamilyManMoving]

Last week we had a clear to approach, and took it. All the way to about 500 AGL when we finally got impatient and asked TWR, "so, uhh...we cleared to land?" A quick clearance was heard by all. The tower there is great, but we're all human.

[@rickwiggins283]

I'm a low-time VFR pilot and a comm issue on short final can be a real pickle. Just happened to me yesterday in a busy Class D when my squelch went crazy right over the numbers so I just landed since I already had clearance, but it caused confusion with taxi instructions. On a longer VFR final prior to clearance it seems just continuing to land or deviating away and squawking 7600 would both have risks. Hopefully the lights would be visible.

[@user-gy8be9cf7i]

Yeah it happens. Once I had an issue with both radios flying light A/C. It happened 10 mins or so after takeoff around a busy airport. I put 7600 in the box and I knew I was cleared to fly a certain route given by ATC in order to exit that airspace. After leaving that airspace and on route to my destination I tried many things with both radios and both for some reason were not working when I tried using the emergency frequency it worked so I transmitted on the emergency frequency twice and someone transmitted back I told him I am having radio issues and am only able to transmit on this frequency, guy was very helpful he made sure all 3 airspaces I need to talk to on route are tuned in on that frequency. So I was able to talk to everyone on the same emergency frequency without having to change all the way to landing. Luckily I had two other GA pilots with me onboard as witnesses to the radio issue 🤪 because when I landed a flying instructor asked what was the issue and he went on to check the aircraft which surprisingly didn’t show any radio issues anymore. If I had no witnesses no one would of probably believed me 😂. I thought to myself maybe we were out of range but it cant be because on the first flight we didn’t have any issue it only happened on the way back, we flew the exact same route. Todate I have no idea what really happened that day, I asked other pilots I searched online for a long time but nothing came up.

[@gregdetwiler9220]

Landing without a clearance happens more than you might think. Usually it’s not a big deal, but errors happen.

[@j.a.3138]

it is a big deal. You could have your license suspended and be fined

[@danielrn133]

When he said they were talking the entire time I would say 'to who?".

[@andrewalexander9492]

I'm guessing that they somehow thought it was an uncontrolled airport and were thought they were on the CTAF frequency and were making traffic calls (It's Exec-Jet, they fly to a lot of uncontrolled fields) Not saying that excuses their mistake, just one possible explanation for what happened.

[@TheFlyingZulu]

@@andrewalexander9492 That's a huge possibility... Some fields have different frequencies for tower and CTaf when the tower is closed... I never thought of that happening so I need to watch out for that now that I am IFR rated.

[@smaze1782]

The cavalier attitude and arrogance of this pilot is really something else.

[@mrdan2898]

Well, I'm sure the ATC gave him a good long chewing!! lol

[@bmoulas]

Only matched by the cavalier attitude of the controller afterwards. Had the pilot not randomly asked, AFTER being cleared to the ramp, if there was an issue did the controller bother to give a number.

[@freham2001]

​@@bmoulasOh the controller was definitely still going to give him the number, the pilot's question probably just got him early access.

[@zacharypiech2930]

Why cavalier and arrogant? IFR lost com you are expected to continue.

[@deanfowlkes]

The pilot followed IFR protocol for lost comms. This included landing.

[@leardvr]

Was cleared to an IAF going into CLE one night by approach with a contact tower at 'XXX', the FAF. We were 25 miles from the IAF and 35 miles from the FAF. I was an IOE captain with an FO making their first landing. We had LLWS and a serious crosswind. We landed and pulled off before I realized we never contacted the tower. At no point did approach try reaching out to us on his frequency, which we were still on. I asked the tower if there was anything we needed to discuss and they confirmed there was not. IMO they would have been found at least partially culpable as well. Fortunately it was the middle of the night. But mistakes do happen, especially in high workload environments.

[@johnaclark1]

This is what all these armchair pilots who have never flown an airplane fail to realize.

[@tedsaylor6016]

While not procedurally correct, I'm sure your PAX were happier you "Flew the Plane" (in wind shear and crosswind) as opposed to "Talked on the Radio". Note that middle of the night with heavy weather there won't be any non-IFR traffic so the actual risk of a traffic deal is quite low.

[@Eric-oj5sj]

I've had this happen on multiple occasions. I always give the green light gun signal to the aircraft since that satisfies the landing clearance. When I scold them on ground for not talking to me, I ask if they at least saw the light gun. As long as they're smart enough to say 'yes', then I don't need to issue the pilot deviation. Win win.

[@bostonareapilot3911]

Amazing that EJM didn't get a Brasher warning on frequency

[@alan_davis]

Lower traffic = less stressed ATC

[@soupfork2105]

You can't take down and call the number if you can't hear the tower.

[@thomasbonse]

I'm guessing they didn't give them a number to call because they're not going to give the pilot the option of avoiding a formal FAA pilot deviation report on the incident.

[@jdsvedin878]

​@@thomasbonse they did give them the number. Last minutes of the video.

[@soupfork2105]

@@thomasbonse It was a joke. You can hear TWR ask the pilot to call them and take down a number.

[@ExplodingCow49]

I actually just finished working at BZN Airport, what a small world! Depending on what day and time this incident was, I may have even been working on the ramp at the airport

[@CascadiaAviation]

Didn’t read back their taxi clearance either… 🙄

[@user-mp9rd4hg8b]

Jet speed 529: "I was talking to you the whole time…" (Then, evidently…) "you weren't answering us, I didn't feel like troubleshooting the radio or giving an IDENT, and you didn't give us clearance to land, so I said screw it and landed anyway."

[@AdrianColley]

Why would he give an ident, if he wasn't able to hear ATC asking for it?

[@user-mp9rd4hg8b]

​@@AdrianColley We don't know if he could hear or not. He sounded like he was surprised there was a problem, so I assumed both scenarios.

[@EdOeuna]

@@AdrianColley - so why land if you don’t hear a landing clearance?

[@TrueSight_333]

“We were talking the whole time”. Okay. To WHOM were you talking, genius? When you are “talking” and do not hear your call sign followed by a “CLEARED TO LAND” you are NOT Cleared to land. Come on… these guys knew good and well they screwed up. It only makes it worse when you pretend like you did nothing wrong. Tower showed these guys a lot of mercy with his attitude.

[@AdrianColley]

Isn't it obvious that they dialed in the wrong frequency? They were talking but nobody was receiving the message.

[@llaughridge]

@@AdrianColley If you're talking and nobody is responding with 'cleared to land', YOU DON'T LAND.

[@penguin44ca]

Had this at the old buttonville airport and even once at the Toronto island. My radio was crap and never got a clearance. So I went missed and put the xpndr into 7600. Got the old light gun and landed

[@penguin44ca]

Also I was inside controlled airspace at that point. Otherwise I would have had to land somewhere else uncontrolled

[@galdavonalgerri2101]

I think it is a good solution. Will make radio much easier. Just land, then call the tower on the phone. Works fine, appearently.

[@HelloMyNamesNino]

It’s easy to judge - we’re not up there preparing to land a private jet - but talking to tower (and noticing if tower haven’t said a word to you) is fundamental! I can’t understand how the pilot missed this??

[@morganghetti]

I've seen air carriers do it. No harm no foul in my opinion.

[@Sam-Cain]

​@@morganghetti That is a bad opinion, especially for air carrier pilots. Planes aren't cars, the pilot is not the only one controlling their plane or its safety and they don't just get to decide when to land. There have been far too many fouls and fatalities from pilots who thought they knew what they were doing and didn't see any harm in stretching the rules just *one* time.

[@anthonyblacker8471]

Uh.. As if you've NEVER flown a landing before EVER in your life, ZERO training up to this moment you're piloting a JET aircraft (not a C152 first time) and nonchalantly just going to land with NO clearance at all.. like.. what?

[@sakumisan]

The worst is the people defending them in these comments trying to say the tower should have accommodated them by doing light signals or a post-landing clearance (those do not exist). If they are flying aircraft of that type but still getting approach clearances confused for landing clearances, that's indicative of a problem.

[@kopazwashere]

So this 529 was given clearance to APPROACH by APPROACH, was told to contact tower at 118.2, tower calls up for our 529 (probably set up for landing at this point), approach calls up 529 to switch freq and they never do. After 529 lands they finally contact tower. So it sounds like they got confused on clearance to approach with land somehow and never noticed they were not on tower frequency AND approach frequency (if they were on either one they should have heard both of them)..?

[@MarcioHuser]

They received a "cleared to approach" as a "clear to land" and just went through as they seen fit? 👀

[@deanfowlkes]

If they lost comms after receiving a visual approach clearance flying IFR, they can continue to land.

[@UnshavenStatue]

The pilot didn't react with the normal defensiveness of people who deny they did anything wrong. I'd love to hear wtf was going on here, did he somehow get a landing clearance from the wrong tower or something??? (Almost certainly not, I really doubt there's more than one tower within 50 miles of a small town like bozeman, right?)

[@carolynmacdonald8047]

Well that’s terrifying 😮

[@TimAyro]

"Talkin' to you the whole time!" Now where have I heard that before?

[@jdog340]

the second-hand embarrassment I get from these videos almost makes them unwatchable

[@EdOeuna]

American aviation just keeps on giving.

[@repatch43]

Who were they talking to? Or did they just lie?

[@Beaverslide]

My guess is they were on CTAF. I had a friend that did that at BZN several years ago thinking the tower was closed.

[@AdrianColley]

That's a very common mistake among the commenters here, and you've made it too. They weren't lying. They really were talking on the radio. But they had the wrong frequency, so nobody else heard them and they didn't hear anybody else. I don't know why so many people here are assuming that "we were talking to you the whole time" meant "we were in two-way radio contact with you the whole time".

[@repatch43]

@@AdrianColley You can't claim 'I was talking to you' without any response, sorry. If they weren't getting a response they should have either switched back to the prior frequency to confirm the new, or maybe look up what the proper freq was and correct the error. Landing without clearance is a BIG nono, and they claimed they had it.

[@GreenCrim]

If you were talking without a response why not go back to previous frequency and confirm tower freq and fly upwind at the missed approach alt. Or if you didn't think of that squawk 7600. He's in a jet so it's not like you can go I'm a student and didn't know what to do.

[@justingrind1908]

Nice Tower for not flipping out when he had the right too. Kept it off the radio.

[@missaisohee]

'we were talking the whole time..' maybe there was a ghost controller clearing this jet to land, the pilots read back the clearance to this ghost. they had a chitchat over what for dinner as well

[@johnbidwell2393]

Apparantly the ghost controller also gave them permission to land.

[@iflyuwalk]

"I never received a clearance but I was talking the whole time, so that's cool." 😐

[@brendonsmith2625]

"I was talking the whole time" Sounds like bravo buster hahaha

[@CatarineausArmory]

I have seen ATC (at busy airports) clear you to land as you are on approach and they know it is an issue with flipping the switch. Now, if there is a RW issue they may not clear and you now have a safety issue.

[@robertbutsch1802]

This is weird. It sounds like for whatever reason his brain processed the approach clearance as cleared to land (it’s happened before). Of course the latter comes from tower so he must have been talking to tower so no need to change frequencies until he was off the active.

[@JW_Wilco]

I listen to VHF Air comms - all. the. time. the number of times that pilots - of ALL FLAVORS - commercial/private/domestic/foreign - mess up radio calls .... is amazing - literally 50-100 times a day a pilot calls ATC on the wrong freq. I would have never thought this was as common as it is --- but it is. Kinda scary TBH.

[@bosshog8844]

It's crazy stupid to still be using antiquated voice comms for something so inherently risky and dangerous when things go wrong.

[@themilkman8554]

@@bosshog8844 what's a better substitute then?

[@bosshog8844]

@@themilkman8554 I received your message and understood it perfectly just now. You used a keyboard I presume.

[@Fenderak]

​@@bosshog8844 try using a keyboard during hand-flown IFR, on minimums, sequenced, at an unfamiliar field.. genius..

[@bosshog8844]

@@Fenderak then put in a voice-to-text computer that transmits the text of your radio comms. with an AI co-pilot analyzing the situation to give suggestions or send diagnostic data flows to ground. this would give the controllers unambiguous info to match with what they may-or-may-not be hearing on radio. safety culture has to be inventive.

[@jeffstewart724]

Cue up Strother Martin!

[@Thunder_Dome45]

Getting a phone number to call is like Bill Engvall's "here's your sign" jokes. You know, "here's your number".

[@dougaltolan3017]

Pilot's radio probably froze over, ATC was so chilled.

[@lastdance2099]

That explanation is not consistent with what the pilot was saying after landing.

[@RegularItemShow]

Jet pilots are the limbo space between GA and Airliners.

[@akshonclip]

Flight attendants and passengers heard the other half of the conversation. 😂

[@ninjaswordtothehead]

Now I'm having flashbacks of learning to talk to the tower at Elmendorf.

[@robertmorgan3947]

One trick I have learned as an air traffic controller over the years . Transmit in the blind EJM529 cleared to land! Also give them the green light gun signal . This saves on pilot deviations and paperwork . Then you can always say I thought you say my green light

[@areza15143]

If you were talking to them the whole time, how come you didn’t IDENT when requested? Also very odd first response by JS529 upon landing. 2:25: “but weee aaaare now?”

[@AdrianColley]

He said he was talking to them. He didn't say he was hearing anything they said. He probably dialed in the wrong frequency.

[@North_West1]

This is Montana. Near Yellowstone.

[@banjotheman1]

So what actually happened? Was he contacting a different controlled airport with the same runway number? The pilot seemed like he had that deer in the headlights look

[@benderandownz]

If he was on an IFR flight plan he did the right thing if that was his estimated arrival time. In the event of a radio failure on an IFR flight plan you are to follow the last instruction and continue your flight plan. If you arrive before your arrival time you hold until its time for you to land.

[@EdOeuna]

Also you’re meant to squawk 7600 and make all the appropriate radio calls adding “transmitting blind” to them. None of this happened.

[@AdrianColley]

@@EdOeuna Those are things to do if workload permits. They're not requirements. By the time the pilots realised they were NORDO, they were busy.

[@EdOeuna]

@@AdrianColley - they weren’t lost comms as they said they were talking through out the approach, so even my suggestions if 7600, etc, are a waste. They weren’t lost comms, just lost professionalism.

[@nelsonbrandt7847]

Probably landed with approach control frequency in the radio. Super easy to do in a jet; I’ve done that myself.

[@mppatterson7]

The first 2 guys that try to call him are the approach controllers, with no response from Jet Speed pilots. So no

[@prorobo]

No it is not when you’re a “professional.”

[@georgegoodroe]

I would loved to have heard the phone call ;-)

[@EMT_Artesania]

Clarence? No, this is Patrick! 😂

[@tabaks]

Yeah, that radio fixed itself miraculously right after free-style landing. Lying's bad, mkay?

[@MW-zm8sd]

Even if they aren't talking to you, and its safe to do so, you clear them to land. It's ATC 101. You dont know what might be going on in that cockpit, so you act as professionally as you can and go through the required steps, one of which is, if safe to do so, clear them to land.

[@BeakerSteve]

It's not a terrible take but where in the world is that considered ATC 101? Where in the 7110.65 is that mentioned?

[@MW-zm8sd]

@Steven U morning. In the 3 different countries I've worked ATC in, its been in either their IFER manual or their DMATs PT2. And what surprises me the most is that in the US, they will freely clear planes to land when number 3 on approach with departures in-between, yet suddenly, giving a landing clearance instruction to a possible emergency aircraft is looked at as strange. Anyhow, to me, apart from it being in the manuals I've worked, it's common sense to go through the steps as per normal in case there's an unknown emergency going on.

[@BeakerSteve]

@@MW-zm8sd i get your point but again, this is by 7110.65 guidelines, not foreign. It's not ATC101 in the US to give a clearance to someone you aren't speaking to. Honestly, if this guy landed and we come to find out there was an actual emergency, this may of been viewed differently but clearly that wasn't the case here.

[@imazombieable]

I’m a former Bozeman airport employee and we used to joke about this all the time

[@sqvision]

My guess….they were actually listening to the tower freq but had the mic accidentally selected on the other radio. For example: atc on com1 and atis/awos on com2, muted com2 and accidentally turned the mic to com2 as well and there ya go….. But still they landed without a clearance and should have gone around and find out what was going on.

[@rich3203]

The controller should have assumed the aircraft was NORDO and gave him a green light to land or what ever signal would have been appropriate. Just doing nothing was inappropriate,

[@prorobo]

Wrong. This is not on the controller. And you have no clue what you’re talking about because if they were NORDO, you don’t just continue straight in and land.

[@miggy_g8366]

The controller should have cleared him to land on the runway for which he was inbound on the visual approach, plain and simple. Furthermore I hope they gave the pilot The required green light gun signal. Just because a pilot is nordo does not mean that you can't issue them a landing clearance, baring any extenuating circumstances. I'm sure the controller wishes he would have handled this a bit differently

[@prorobo]

This is not on the controller at all. You have no clue what you’re talking about.

[@bencheevers6693]

People in comments thinking he gave himself permission, I don't know this stuff very well but approach gave him approach clearance and told him the runway number I think he was just confused and thought that was landing clearance.

[@kristensorensen2219]

#2k👍😤This is amusing! So I'm waiting for the tower to give this jet jocky a phone #!!🤣🤣🤣

[@SplashJohn]

The problem here wasn't so much the radio/communication issue. Stuff happens. It's the pilot's attitude that is the problem. A reasonable pilot, when made aware that he landed without clearance, would acknowledge his screwup and apologize. This pilot's attitude is totally f*cked up.

[@BirdDog.]

Why would you admit fault. Anything and everything can be used against you. Besides I guarantee nothing happened over this event anyways

[@AdrianColley]

But he didn't screw up. He was IFR, NORDO, and on the approach. The rules say the right thing to do in that situation is to continue as filed and cleared, and then land right where and when ATC expects you to. Doing anything else would be dangerous.

[@llaughridge]

@@AdrianColley If they were not aware of their comm problem, that's an issue. If they were aware of the comm problem and landed anyway, that's also an issue. They did not do the right thing in either event.

[@llaughridge]

@@BirdDog. The CVR captures the truth, lying/covering up is only going to make it worse. I guarantee this resulted in an ASAP being filed and EJM's POI is not going to be happy.

[@BirdDog.]

@@llaughridge I guarantee it didn’t. No agency would access those tapes over a procedure that was legal. If they wanted the tapes they would be erased.

[@c150gpilot]

Wow.

[@kainhall]

hey!!! an incident in my neck of the woods.... montana!!!

[@jenniferstewarts4851]

Seen the same thing... with an interesting excuse. Was a small plane, landed without clearance, and without transponder... The plane had a total electrical failure, and i mean total. glass cockpit, radio, transponder, even navigation lights were gone, and engine started loosing power immediately. he landed without clearance on the runway after veering off course to make a straight in approach. Something caused a massive short that took out all the electrical systems, as well as smoke to the cockpit. they let it slide.

[@CheatOnlyDeath]

@VASAviation Is it possible to access historical ATC recordings for famous air disasters and do your usual animations and treatments of historic aviation incidents from an ATC viewpoint?

[@VASAviation]

What are you looking for?