JLCPCB Prototype Inspection

A look at the 4 layer prototype PCB's from JLCPCB, for the Gigatron TLL Computer.
BTW, you can hide the manufacturer ID using this instruction:
support.jlcpcb...

[@Liam-bs7cu]

You can put some text in the design "JLJLJL..." And they will place the customer number in that position apparently. So you could hide it under a chip or something. Don't know if you can remove it completely though.

[@tuttocrafting]

I tried but they didn't :(

[@leisergeist]

Huh, that's clever I recall from the factory tour someone made, they have people reviewing the designs and numbering stuff; that's not automated, so it prolly depends if the guy had his wheaties that morning

[@RWoody1995]

Also they say if you choose "Panel by JLPCB" when ordering they will put it on the edges of the panel that you break off anyway so you can hide it completely support.jlcpcb.com/article/28-how-to-remove-the-customer-id-on-the-pcb

[@EEVblog]

Interesting. You usually do this with manufacture panel notes, but cheap proto houses like this usually ignore them. You are relying on someone in the loop to see that and change it, so I wouldn't rely on that.

[@Liam-bs7cu]

support.jlcpcb.com/article/28-how-to-remove-the-customer-id-on-the-pcb

[@azmrblack]

5 years on, and they are still a great company. Every board I've ordered from them i've been more than happy with. Truly a good company to deal with and they care about quality. Prices are still excellent.

[@jasonmhite]

It's worth noting, JLCPCB has garnered a lot of goodwill in the hobbyist community. They sponsor like 90% of the small KZbin electronics channels. That might seem shady if they weren't good, but they genuinely offer a pretty great product and good service as well.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

I use them sometimes but they will regularly reject designs with a lot of routing, with no option to pay more to get it done. sometimes they don't even email to tell you - this totally hosed me on one job. IME Allpcb email you for additional payment, and have a lot more options. Costs aren't much different.

[@yaghiyahbrenner8902]

I just did a 4 layer board with a jungle of routing and they were fine. I will try Allpcb. JLC marketing looks like its wining.

[@gamerpaddy]

i once ordered some 0.6mm pcbs with slots cut out to make them springy, they didnt reject i.imgur.com/ZeViLpQ.png but i allways look at pcbshopper, sometimes jlc isnt the cheapest when adding shipping

[@electrodacus]

I can confirm that as I ordered recently a 4 layer board from them that needed 2Oz copper (70um) and after I paid quite a serious amount for the 2Oz option vs default 1Oz I only got 1Oz and after I mentioned that they tried to convince me that I do not know how to measure copper thickness with accurate 4 wire measurement but agreed to send me another board and that was the same 1Oz (no real communication between manufacturing and sales). I ended up with another PCB manufacturer that did of course made the board with 2Oz (almost 1.78Oz but good enough). I also ordered a similar board that was just 2 layers at the same time from JLC PCB again 2Oz much more expensive but those where 2Oz. Those where 1.6mm thick despite me ordering 1mm using their online tool as they can not make almost anything other than most common 1.6mm. So they are great as they are low cost but only good for simple prototypes and as soon as you want anything different they will not be able to do so or worse send you what they want and no chance to get a refund.

[@rutgerdejong9616]

Hi Mike, can you elaborate why it was rejected? I had a board ones reject from them and they told me this message: "But really sorry to tell that the size of your panel is too small to be made, it needs to be 5 .5 cm at least, could you please kindly check?" My board was 10cm x 5.3cm with 1 v-groove.

[@otherbasis8505]

I think that your designs were hitting hard limits for "Electrical Test" step (respect). They probably can manufacture your boards, but there are so many connections to test that it will clog their manufacturing pipeline if they try to do so. And because it happens fairly seldom, they do not bother adding "no test" option. Edit: Ok, I think simbone (below) is right - "routing" here is milling.

[@TheRussianhippie]

as an electrical engineering student who does a lot of personal projects because making things is also a hobby, JLC pcb is amazing. like, my design capability went from "whatever i can hand solder" to "whatever i can fit on a pcb" which was a massive upgrade, plus 2 layer boards are always $20 delivered and arrive within 7 days everytime. Seriously it's difficult to not talk about JLCPCB without sounding like a shill.

[@bigclivedotcom]

The slight tracking of the screenprint looks like the disk-roller marks when you use a non absorbent medium in an inkjet printer. I wonder if it's been printed in a dedicated inkjet style system

[@Decco6306]

Great Shower thoughts right there

[@kjur18]

You can even make more boards. I managed to make 80 small boards for 2$! They were small enough to put 8 of them on single board within 10cm by 10cm. And 10 boards of these. Great deal!

[@jchelm1979]

If you put multiple designs on a single board submission they usually charge you more!

[@p_mouse8676]

John Helm . Just be clever with your design.

[@kjur18]

I had one design, board was small enough (21mm by 36mm) to use "Panel By JLCPCB" option. You can put two circuits on your board and cut them later, without additional charge, if you manage to fit in size.

[@reeseyme9613]

only if you require for panelization on each board which will cost more, but if you were to mark out on the silk screen and make you own cutting that will still cost you 10 by 10cm with 10pcs for $2.

[@kjur18]

My boards ( imgur.com/RZRa9QN ) were v-scored, also their serial number is where it's ok to be.

[@azbesthu]

Stranger Parts visited the factory and made a video about the whole manufacturing process. They showed there are two different method for putting the writings to the pcb, for bigger volumes they use the silkscreen method with stencil, but for small volumes they are using inkjet printing indeed.

[@StreuB1]

Economy of scale with a world class dedicated manufacturer operating in a country where labor is extremely low and the processes are all still nearly completely automated. There are a few videos inside JLC doing a complete job and their facilities are impressive to say the least. No expense spared and thats saying a lot for a Chinese mega-manufacturer. Thanks for the video Dave!

[@jort93z]

yeah, that price is insane. 12$ a piece or something for a 4 layer board of that size, done in a couple of days. You really can't complain.

[@vejymonsta3006]

It's a huge game changer. I shake my head now everytime I see engineers trying to make their own boards.

[@tpjs]

Scotty from Strange Parts did a factorytour at JLC-PCB. Can really recommend that :)

[@yeet1337]

Yeah he gave the JLCPCB guys a tour :D

[@dentakuweb]

I couldn't watch that whole video. It was so annoying.

[@tpjs]

@@dentakuweb no one forced you to watch the whole thing ;)

[@Stabby666]

I've toured quite a few of the Shenzhen PCB plants, and it does get monotonous after a while. The guides all go through the same routine, and they look practically identical on the insides (this was for work, so i had to go). The biggest thing I took out of it was how soul destroying it must be to work on those production lines... I also got in trouble at a place for taking photos of the prototype Nvidia 2080 GPUs they were making :)

[@_--_--_]

Would be interresting to see you measure the capacitance between ground and power plain on a quite big empty board like this. Maybe something for the upcoming comparison video 2 layer versus 4 layer?

[@SelectLOL]

you are bug user

[@Not-Only-Reaper-Tutorials]

5 years after this video, they improved enormously. they are excellent. you can omit the order number, silkscreen is very improved, and tons of other things. Indeed you pointed out a very true in the start of the video: with such quality and prices, it doesn't make ANY sense to make PCBs home. Great stuff for great prices.

[@KX36]

It really is amazing what you can get for your money. I was impressed with PCBway a year ago, but JLCPCB blows them out of the water when you consider the standard tolerances for JLC are apparently 5/5 thou (I'll be testing that soon), PCB thickness down to 0.6mm is the same price as standard 1.6mm, 0.3mm min drill is standard. The silkscreen may not be up to Dave's standards, but PCBway was very obviously dot matrix, whereas with JLC it's hard to tell without zooming right in, and even then you could put the jaggies down to the surface profile of the fibreglass.

[@sergeantseven4240]

Also, The customer ID they slap on the board can be placed optionally anywhere you want by putting "JLCJLCJLCJLC" somewhere in the silkscreen layer. They will make it fit. Or if you have it panalized you can put it on the strip.

[@Willem-Bever]

There is however a catch, from the JLCPB website: "The font size should be larger than 0.8mm in height and 0.15 mm in width" Or you pay an extra fee, then the number can be removed completely. Third option, you do a panel with frame. Then you can place the JLCJLCJLCJLC string on the frame.

[@annaoaulinovna]

jlcpcb is a great company. its a time saving pcb producer. some companies lives with their cheap prototyping solution.

[@deltapparo4451]

They rejected one of my boards. I gave up trying to fix something that wasn't broke and just sent it to PCBWay. They made it, no problem. Use them all the time now. Glad to see that at least one EE KZbinr isn't being sponsored by them.

[@MkmeOrg]

Looks great Dave. I've found the same with my orders from them. Can't justify even messing around trying to make a few cm board for what they charge and how quick they turn around. Great time to be in the electronics world :) Cheers

[@rutgerdejong9616]

I think they are the best for the money, I had a mistake on 2 vias, I saw this on the their online board viewer (great feature and you can zoom in), I emailed them right but because they put board in production so fast, I though for sure they would not catch it. The board arrived within 1 week here in the USA and they had corrected the issue, so happy with there quality and price. As far as them putting their tracking number on the board, they usually pick a spot under a large component, but not always. I prefer no numbers on the board, but for the price and service I will live with it.

[@ourplesoop]

I was actually comparing PCB manufacturers to get some large PCBs made when this video popped up in my feed. Looks like they're getting my business now.

[@Steve_LSP]

Great review, as usual Dave. Thanks! I will also give a try to them soon. Just wondering for the ultra low price... I hope only they do correct waste disposal and do not charge the planet... Regards

[@Dunkelheit667]

No free pencil included? Something went wrong with your order. ;o) Thanks for having a look. :o)

[@Wizardofgosz]

I've been using JLCPCB like crazy lately. I love Oshpark's AFTER DARK boards, and I order them when I want something special, but JLC is impossible to beat. I've done decent sized boards in nice quantities (a couple dozen) where the cost of the boards was less than freight. Freight for me is like $12 typically, and I figured I'd add on some extra boards just to justify the order. They take solder nice. There's little to dislike. They ship stuff to me from China in about 3 or 4 days. I live on the east coast of the US.

[@DJlegionuk]

I have used them for the past year and have had no problems at all. If you want cheaper delivery to the uk use the HK DHL service. It's a shame they don't offer E-packet like pcbway, but they are normally a little more so it's balances out.

[@hikaru-live]

As of price, you get 10x double side boards within 10cm on each dimension for less than $10 + shipping. 10x 4-layer for less than $18 etc.

[@wilipno]

You could have ordered 10 boards and you wouldn't even see the difference in cost! I've ordered two different sets of boards from them. I got 10 boards both times. I paid half of what you did! My boards are green by default. My boards too a week longer to receive but I'm very happy.

[@electronash]

I keep trying to encourage people to try services like this. I've had several 4-layer designs made by them now, and I can't fault the quality at all. It really is insane how cheap they are now, compared to the €65 I paid for just ONE 2-layer board (12cm square) in 2008. The only thing I would request is that they add another courier option that is in between the DHL and snail mail options, since DHL very often charge extra duty if the parcel is a bit heavier. (I don't mind waiting 10 days or so with a courier, but the average three-week wait via snail mail is a bit of a killer. lol)

[@electronash]

For example, my last order was for four different designs. Two 4-layer boards, and two 2-layer boards. There were 40 boards in total, but they still fit into the same sized box as in this vid. The PCBs were £65.95 total, DHL shipping was £21.22 (to the UK), which is fine for the weight, but then I STILL got charged an extra £27 duty, which I had to pay via the DHL site before delivery. If there was an option for a slightly cheaper courier who might take a bit longer, but are far less likely to add extra duty, it would be ideal. (£21 for fast shipping from China to the UK is pretty good, but £48 with the extra duty is crazy.)

[@Sixta16]

Itead.cc is offering "SF Express". Slower than DHL but certainly faster than snail mail.

[@sparkdoctor5773]

You were charged VAT not Duty because the value of the goods + shipping exceed £45.00 which is the threshold for VAT exception from China. PCB's have a 0% duty threshold from China. JLCPCB have a sister company, LCSC where you can order the components for the board and have them shipped together. I ordered 30 boards plus a stencil last month but i made the mistake of ordering some parts as well and they combined the 2 invoices together which exceeded the VAT level and i had to pay an additional £19.00. If i had just ordered the boards, i wouldn't have had to pay any VAT.

[@electronash]

@@sparkdoctor5773 Sorry, yep, VAT. I keep calling any extra charges "duty", and it's a bad habit. The thing is, I'd rather have the site itself calculate the VAT if they know the destination Country. It should be mandatory on all sites, IMHO. I'm sure there are some logistical reasons I'm not aware of, but I thought that was fairly standard across other sites? If it's due to the tax threshold in China though, I guess it makes sense.

[@lasersbee]

6:37.... I wouldn't be worried about the quality of the Silkscreen as long as I can easily read it. BTW... You just scratched the PCB surface with the tweezers.... LOL.. ;-) I've had my eye on JLCPCB for a while now and everyone seems to like their quality, prices and shipping times. I'll give them a go on my next PCB requirements.

[@movax20h]

There are still benefits to making own PCBs. Weird shapes, single layer board with just dozens of components done in single day and quickly move over. Sometimes you just do PCBs by hand, on a piece of paper, pen and pencil, or even directly on PCB copper layer, and you can eliminate all the software / CAD / gerber / routing complexities, waiting times, custom fees and taxes headaches, failed prototypes, etc. It is not always about the price, but about flexibility and extreme rapid prototyping. If I want I can go through 6 different revision / variants of ideas of a PCB in a single day easily at home.

[@SianaGearz]

Some Chinese companies will route the weirdest shape for you dirt cheap, though it's been a couple years since i looked for that specifically. But as to going from idea to a prototype or a one-off product in a day, certainly no business will help you with that at any hobbyist- or small-business-friendly cost, neither in China nor locally, so homebrewing is a good skill to maintain.

[@jchelm1979]

Dave they wont produce your board without an identification number that they choose, But they will put it in a different location if you ask, like under a component

[@shawnmelanson9828]

cool vid dave. I've had good luck with JLC as well. You think you could do a vid on how to evaluate a PCB manufacturer?

[@p_mouse8676]

That shipping price is extremely low. Guess because Australia is close to China. Shipping to EU is 4-6 times more.

[@knier]

There's a $20 (or there abouts) shipping discount on the first order, so that might explain it.

[@EEVblog2]

It's obviously subsidised/absorbed in some way. It was the full DHL courier service, and even China do not get those rates.

[@EEVblog2]

Knier - Ah, that would explain it, thanks.

[@p_mouse8676]

Knier. So using multiple shipping addresses and you will have cheap boards for a while 😎😁

[@beopstek]

Shipping to NL from them is a lot more expensive, and DHL will slap on import and additional handling fees. When the shipping costs are missing on the declaration, DHL will fill out their highest overnight shipping fees, and calculate tax over that. DHL is totally unreasonable and with JLCPCB there was no way around it. However now they seem to offer non-DHL delivery as well, so that is great news.

[@scienteer3562]

I ordered a test batch of 25 boards (150x90mm 2 layer) on 20th. Was meant to be 3 day build time. They only made it into production today (27th). I may stick with ALLPCB if the quality isnt better with JLC. That solder mask alignment was not great.

[@blaser80]

For the price they are excellent, I got 30 PCBs made with 3 different designs (10 of each) ordered on the 31st July and they arrived on the 6th August in the UK. All for around $30-$35 including shipping.

[@meowcula]

Glad you approve Dave. I've used them myself a couple of times. They are a godsend for poor hobbyists such as myself. As you say, no point to etching your own!

[@simonbaxter8001]

Dave, PCBWay are similar price and quality and they are great at putting their identification marking number under a chip footprint so you don't see it when populated.

[@daviddavidson1372]

Is that not the order number?? It has a box u can check to not have it on the board. Look at list of options. Its near bottom of the list. And you can select where you want to put it. But that button doesnt do anything when i push that.

[@bakuhost]

They are great. I've also expected crap for 2$ but boards came out great. Thick and sturdy fiberglass and solder pads are hard to lift off.

[@MSM5500]

I can give you a reason why there is a need to make PCBs at home sometimes. The thing is some people share their pcb designs as a plain picture for some reason, Adobe PDF for 'instance. Trying to reproduce that kind of PCB in CAD you'll likely realise that many footprints required are missing in your database so you'd have to draw them extra. But the biggest issue is there is a chance to make a mistake while transferring traces which are quite hard to reveal at first. The best results are achieved with use of POSITIV20 photoresist and ferric chloride for etching. All that requires some skills and UV equipment though as there's no clear specification for the process cause it depends on a variety factors, such as temperature, UV exposure time etc. Sure, all that looks just archaic nowadays.

[@ebb2421]

I've used them. low cost PCB's will open up a lot of innovation possibilities, was so expensive before....

[@TheWhitde]

Just sent off my 2nd order to JLCPCB... AUD$23 for 5 copies of 3 boards including delivery. There is NO WAY I'd be bothered with making my own for that price and quality. One is quite complex as it's a shield for a STM32F407VET6 so has to line up exactly with the board pins. An earlier one was perfect however I revised the board a bit after some testing. The other smaller boards are daughter boards that can be used with the shield for specific functionality. After uploading the designs was amazing to see the production start within the hour. My next challenge is a board with some SMT components because I really suck at soldering such small bits. I mainly just need some resistors and leds.

[@SebastiaanSwinkels]

I just received an order from JLC as well (same day as this video was posted). JLC took maybe 4 days total to make the pcbs and add the two LCSC orders to it. It then took DHL Express another 2 days to ship it to Germany... where it then spent 5 days in DHL Express' customs trap. While JLC and LCSC is great, I'm going to look at different options if UPS / Fedex isn't an alternative option because DHL Express is simply a nightmare. To get back on topic, the PCBs also seem to have a slightly shifted soldermask, which I hope isn't going to cause too much trouble with smaller pitch QFNs etc.

[@MSM5500]

I can confirm that JLCPCB make top notch quality boards. Firs of all their lamination can handle high temperature soldering regardless whether it was specified. Second of all they are fast. One day I placed my order on Wednesday, a DHL courier knocked my door in Sunday noon. Also I can confirm that JLCPCB use robotic probes to test every piece of PCB for galvanic connection/isolation. The traces left by those robotic probes can be seen on SMD soldering pads.

[@EEVblog2]

Sunday DHL delivery? Wow.

[@MSM5500]

yes. In Melbourne. I got really surprised on that day. "Your DHL EXPRESS shipment with waybill number 7397218931 from SHENZHEN JIALICHUANG has been delivered as requested at 15:58 on Sun Dec 10 2017. Thank you for using On Demand Delivery."

[@sophtware]

I just ordered 30 custom Arduino shields from them using their web based software for $30 USD and it took 5 days! And they came out beautiful. What a bargain. Express PCB wanted almost $500 for the same thing.

[@EEVblog2]

Wow, no contest.

[@AnunakiLAMDA]

This is plain misinformation. I have just received 20 boards 350mm by 200mm ENIG finish, plus framed stensil for top and botom layer for only $300 shipped.

[@AnunakiLAMDA]

oups my mistake, I meant pcbway , yes expresspcb is expensive..im sorry

[@zodak9999b]

A few years ago I scratch built an XY pen plotter and found some nice Staedtler pens that resist etching... I made a couple of single sided boards using that, but Osh Park and the other cheap places have made that thing obsolete. I've gotten a few things from JLCPCB. They've always been fast and good. The most recent was 5 of the Mk52 heatbed for a DIY Prusa i3 Mk3 printer. It was like $58US and delivery in a week or so.

[@BlockWorker]

My own 4 layer JLCPCBs are arriving soon, I paid about as much as you for 150mm x 92mm with ENIG finish. I'm eager to see whether they turned out as well as yours!

[@OldCurmudgeon3DP]

Do we automatically assume any designs sent in for fabrication are "in the wild" now?

[@ryanzheng8735]

Depending on the manufacturing location, some boards made by JLC may have a weak soldermask bond at the edge. When heated, especially when using a iron, some of those near the pads tend to come off.

[@EEVblog2]

They have more than one location?

[@MetalPhreakAU]

Recently did a 46x46mm PCB that I don't care if it arrives in a couple of weeks. DirtyPCBs were $14.95 shipped airmail (any PCB colour and I wanted black). JLCPCB were $8 but green only. At those prices I wouldn't even consider etching a board and if I need it ASAP DHL is super fast and reliable to Australia. It feels like prices have gone up slightly over the years for small 2-layer boards, but have dropped significantly for 4-layer. It's to the point you might even consider 4-layer just for ease of routing power/ground!

[@EEVblog2]

Yep, not much price difference for 4 layer now, so might as well!

[@JamesPotts]

Thanks for this video. I had similar conclusions when I ordered a board, but my expertise is limited to writing software for the (very high-end ) prototype boards that land on my desk. It's hard to compare my prototype boards to the 24-layer insane-pitch "prototypes" at work.

[@nihonam]

Try PCBWAY - they provide different colors of solder mask for the same price. JLCPCB makes only green for low price.

[@MrEdwardhartmann]

Watched a vid on their factory, and if you get a bunch of boards, they use real silkscreen, but if you only order a few, it is faster for them to use the dot matrix silkscreen printer. I have had about a dozen small boards done by them and all were perfect for my needs. Also, if you are doing SMD, their stainless steel solder stencil is only $7 and it is spot on also.

[@robertbrede6199]

Hi, JLCPCB has informed me that they don't do buried or blind vias! Thus, my order was cancelled. How can any boardhouse make a 4 layer, or for that matter, 6,8,12,32,40 layer board without buried or blind vias??? Did they do buried, or blind vias for you? Would greatly appreciate your feedback.

[@rolaroli]

I've used both them and Elecrow for my PCBs (only 2 layers till now). And I think when you get multiple designs (I usually do that when ordering prototypes - I collect PCBs for projects in a folder and when I finally need one I just order a bunch at the same time) Elecrow is cheaper. At least when you include shipping to Europe. But they are both priced reasonably and I agree that making PCBs at home is slowly getting out of fashion. Unless you really need something that day.

[@stefflus08]

"Sorry, this is not 4k, back to good old 2k" Watching in 480, upping to 720 when there's detail XD My glasses aren't clean enough to see HD anyway

[@kaimac1]

For front panels PCBWay are good. They will not add any markings to the board if you ask them.

[@EEVblog2]

For front panels I like a photoimageable silkscreen.

[@JamesPotts]

I tried them before their current ad blitz, and was really pleasantly surprised. Silkscreen was aligned, vias were centered. And they arrived 6 days after I uploaded.

[@JamesPotts]

In fact, drills were better-centered than I've had from OSH Park.

[@Shubham-po2tp]

But in my country exactly opposite, 2 $ for printing and 30$ for shipping

[@k1zmt]

I used JLCPCB for making boards and I was pleased with quality. I built tiny SWR meter and bands switch for SSB6.1 transceiver. I have it on my channel if you are interested. JLCPCB is a good choice for hobbyist. I would doubt that for large scale but small parties under 1000 PCBs should be good.

[@AshenTiger]

With their identifier, I may just be lucky, but I've had seeedstudio chuck their identifier under ICs or plop-in modules. Regarding DIY vs Machined, while it's nice to experiment with diy, I agree it's far better to get them done properly - plus you can do silk screening and mask colours!

[@pyromanci2736]

nice to see a non sponsered review of them. been looking at them to do a few boards for me.

[@daneru]

Matte black solder mask is the coolest but adds a little bit more cost.

[@666aron]

So far I've ordered really complex but only 2 sided boards, I was hesitating to order a 4 layer board, but after this I will give it a try. My ESP32 - Lattice Mach2 board will be the lucky guinea pcb.

[@billmoran3812]

I've had several prototype boards made by them recently, and I've been very pleased. No way would I make my own boards. I done. Even bother with vector board construction, it's easier and cheaper to get a board made. I'm considering a reflow oven for small production runs. The stainless steel stencils are really cheap too.

[@hikaru-live]

JLCPCB does double side silkscreen for free, and you can tell them exactly where their identifier should go. While they can not remove that mark, you can tell them to put it in the back of the board or tuck it under a chip.

[@SurajGrewal]

What's the difference between prototype and production grade if prototypes are of such high quality?

[@jojoposter]

Free choice of color (they will mix you your choice if the volume is big enough) No id markings on silks Better silk quality since its actually silkscreeened and not printed buried vias/plugged vias most times tighter specs (depends on the fabhouse, but china is only now catching up with 4mil/4mil and 0.3mm vias) ENIG maybe? Depends on the volume/pricepoint i guess. PS: don't know if the question was rhetoric but have an answer anyway :)

[@Matthias051]

Thank you Dave for having you with you on this pcb

[@reeseyme9613]

you have to admit this is probably one of the best pcb quality for the cost of just wun hung lo price

[@jaideep1337]

Was wondering why it's not a good idea to use these for production boards? Even though as you say they are prototype PCBs, if the quality is good then why not use em for production too?

[@RyanVasquez6089]

Everything else ASIDE. I found their silkscreen resolution to be amazing! I tend to do boards with QFN and 0402 res/caps. I usually make my lettering 30mil tall and 8 mil line width and it came out perfect!!!

[@Agent24Electronics]

There are several reasons why someone might want to make their PCB at home. Do these budget PCB houses accept photocopied artwork from a magazine, for example? Suddenly want a breakout board to connect an SMT SDCard slot to breadboard, today? I can do it for next to nothing in an hour or so. Low volume and simple designs really don't justify the effort of getting it done professionally. Yes, these boards are cheap and fast for what they are, but it's still often cheaper and faster to make a one-off board yourself, if you don't need PTH or over 2-layers. That said, I have a design or two I'm working on which need PTH, so I shall send away to China for those, but in all other cases I DIY it or use Veroboard.

[@k1zmt]

I think it all comes to a complexity level and space. For example I live in small apartment with my wife who will not enjoy any kind of chemistry in the kitchen/bathroom. And I don't have space for CNC/milling machine which people use to scratch the copper off the board. Therefore I have no choice and companies like JLCPCB are real deal for me.

[@Stabby666]

Not sure what you mean by "photocopied artwork"? You'd just scan it, and convert it for use on the silkscreen layer, then submit it as normal? I've done this for company logos (well, actually had PNGs or SVGs to work with, but same idea). I'm not sure it's cheaper when you factor in your time, the chemicals, clean up etc involved vs ordering boards at just over $1 a piece (or less) from China - and obviously the end result is a hell of a lot better, and each trace is tested at the factory, so you know it's going to work.

[@ws_stelzi79]

Wow Dave goes JLCPCB crazy!

[@TimBell87]

I watched this while making my own PCB, I was going to use JLCPCB for the next stage though.

[@royh4305]

Incredibly cool! I will use them soon. Thanks Dave.

[@nickkracht7520]

Strange parts has a factory tour and you can see the different process that they provide and learn how they are able to deliver the speed and quality that they do

[@gaoyichuan]

As for the identifier, we can select to have it on a special location by an option. But don't know if the intl site has this feature

[@rikardandersson3584]

Can you order 10 pieces of your current board and compare with your regular supplier :).. I have not had any problems with JLCPCB usually sending an email separately with the order and saying that they should be for customers. the end result is awesome. packed and ready and tested to Sweden for no money at all. When I do the circuit board myself, a card will cost about 50kr / pc to get my circuit board. The price per pcb from JLCPCB is 5kr / pc

[@proyectosledar]

Do they know it was you?

[@mc_cpu]

That's what I wonder, should of done it in Davids name without the video first. But I'm going to give them a try myself.

[@leisergeist]

His board doesn't look any better than any other boards *I've* seen from them FWIW

[@EEVblog2]

I greatly doubt it. They promised 4 day turn and delivered it. And price was standard web quote.

[@totoxahc]

They must

[@electronash]

I've used JLC for several orders now, and they very often make the boards that fast, and with the same quality and price. I doubt they knew or even cared if it was Dave or not, as they make thousands of boards a day, which all go onto giant panels. If they were THAT worried about making a good impression, they might have redone the silk screen. (which is still a very tiny glitch for prototype boards.) (btw, I'm not shilling for them, I just think the turnaround time and quality is great for the price, especially for 4 layers.)

[@gaoyichuan]

Yeah, here in China we loves JLC's PCB service. We can spend only 50CNY(about 7.5 USD) for 10*10cm 10PCS double sided board. And we can get it in 72 hrs INCLUDING SHIPPING! Yeah, but their solder mask is totally rubbish :(

[@OneBiOzZ]

i had a JCL PCB 2 layer dirt cheap option that contains a 0.2mm pin pitch package and an BGA package that worked fantastically $25 delivered for 5 (plus a cool pin) i mean, the previous proto was $150+ shipped and 2 months from OSHpark

[@TMS5100]

love jlcpcb, always had great results from them. also like easyeda a lot.

[@AL_O0]

I believe JLC uses printing machines for small volume orders, and uses actual silkscreens for bigger orders

[@jort93z]

Thats correct. kzbin.info/www/bejne/opuyoHqveNiibtUm25s (it is said explained and shown around that time in the video)

[@acwrench]

JLC is the first choice for many Chinese electronics engineers.

[@tubical71]

One big downside is: If you do mostly OneOffs like me, i need to do it all in protel (ok - old but i barely touch its capabilities (hobbyist use only) as it´s a full featured protel dxp) incluing schematics and usually some footprints as well as the whole layout (no autoroute for me, as i usually deal with audio stuff and ...no thanx). By the time i´m done with the software, i could have also done the same on a PerfBoard and have a working (more or less - i usually need some rework done) board to work with.

[@SomeDudeInBaltimore]

Can't do SMD on proto board. We'll you probably can using bodge wires, but I do not recommend. A lot of hobbyists sometimes are scared of going to SMD, but hot air stations are cheap now and it's actually easier to work with that THT. Just heat and lift. No need to pull out the solder sucker and pull your hair out trying to clear a hole of solder.

[@SuperBlackReality]

There is an option so they add a little bit more on the edge of pcb with the number that you can just break off, mostly seen in panel boards but if i remember there's a way of contacting them or something

[@sparkdoctor5773]

Yes, you can ask for them to be panelled but there is a charge for it but they will put the markings on the edge. There is a 10mm break off piece all around.

[@TheHuesSciTech]

So Dave, you didn't make it very clear in the video: do you think this is acceptable for the price?

[@alexreeve]

for simple boards they are really great. I will never etch my own again thats for sure :)

[@mcconkeyb]

Looks like DHL in Australia has their business in good working order, too bad that is not the case around the world! Here in Canada, they certainly can't get simple things like this through customs in anything less than 4 weeks, and it will at least double the price of the goods!

[@antoinehamel5765]

I routinely order from them in Montreal and it only takes 4-5 days via DHL Express. They charge 25$US for this Express shipping. So for around 30$US you can get 10 PCB delivered in less than 5 days

[@mcconkeyb]

I've only had 1 order of PCB's shipped via DHL, and it was terrible. 2 other times I've ordered things on-line (Photo equipment) and DHL was the only option for international shipment, and both times they were also terrible ($50 - $60 custom clearance fees, then $25 for additional handling plus the added 3-4 weeks of delay). Maybe if you have a business account it might be better, or maybe they are just better in higher density regions (like eastern Canada).

[@antoinehamel5765]

Too bad DHL is not providing the same level of service everywhere. I'll keep that in mind in the future. Thanks for the info

[@fase144]

how much it would cost an order like this some time ago???

[@Su67377s]

4:45 There was an option whether to put identify code by jlcpcb, when you placed order.

[@DoctorWhom]

From a June 2021 perspective, it looks like they offered the "JLCJLCJLCJLC" user determined positioning for awhile without it being listed in the website, but its in the ordering form now. Can also pay extra for no customer ID marking what so ever.

[@mrjn6940]

if im from southeast asia. how many days i will wait if i send my pcb layout today in JLCPCB?

[@sergeantseven4240]

I've had good luck with them so far and the 2 layer boards are so cheap I've been able to do 3 revisions of boards within a month.

[@thechris84567]

The only reason I can see for making your own board would be if it’s a small one sided board because shipping to me in the us is $15 for the cheap one and over $20 for dhl

[@BrianLough]

You got $20 off shipping for your first order. Still insane value even without it :)

[@uwezimmermann5427]

I do make my own pcbs from time to time because my employer does not give me the ability to order stuff officially from outside Europe. I have ordered boards for my students from China and paid out of my own pocket, but for a simple board I just do it using toner-transfer.

[@johnfrancisdoe1563]

Uwe Zimmermann Yeah, too bad Olimex left the business in such a confusing way, leaving up a message that it was temporarily suspended as of a certain month (no year!) due to too many back orders. But the EEVblog Wiki seems to have a more up to date list of European options.

[@SianaGearz]

Well if the employer pays for materials that you need to perform your job, but only as long as they come from Europe, that's an opportunity to support a local business. 20 times more expensive than China, but if you can make it not-your-problem, that helps. Look on mikrocontroller-net wiki under 'Platinenhersteller', and scroll way down for the small businesses which also happen to offer the least expensive options.

[@uwezimmermann5427]

Thanks, yes I am aware of European and Swedish alternatives, but what I have received from these was not of the same quality as e.g. pcbgogo. On the other hand minimum order quantities are still in the range of 10, which is a lot when you want to order a single board for a student project's first iteration where you only need a single pcb.

[@dhpbear2]

8:02 - Check the focus on the camcorder. Tweak it along with the Tegano focus to get a clear image.

[@andreamancausoft595]

Why do your PCB at home? to don't wait 2-3 weeks to have one. And maybe when you receive, you notice that you amde a mistake and need to print onother one :) For beginner and hobbyists it's yet good idea make it at home. After when you have a working prototype it's better to use a service like JLCPCB

[@jort93z]

He only had to wait like 4 days for it though? He ordered it on thursday and it arrived it on the next monday. Thats 4 days and thats including the sunday. So I am not sure how you get to 2-3 weeks. And do you really think it is a good idea for a beginner to attempt to make a 4 layer pcb at home? Thats a completly different story to a 2 layer board.

[@CyberlightFG]

How do you make 4 layer boards at home?

[@andreamancausoft595]

No a beginner usually don't need a 4 layers board, for a 4 layers board of course it's better to send to on of this service... For little board wiht one or two layers, an homemade protorype is usually faster than very cheap service for PCB. In this case if you use service that allow you to have it for 12-20$ (10 PCB) usually have to wait 2-3 weeks.

[@andreamancausoft595]

it was not a criticism of the video, this video is very useful. It was an answer to the question: "Why are there still people who want to print pcb at home?"

[@laharl2k]

Not sure if at home but maybe locally for single and dual layer boards in some small local business that maybe offer services for like electricians or electronic students. If the business isnt a total organizational mess it shouldnt take them long.

[@naasikhendricks1501]

Dave, make a video on pcb layout for emi on power, ground and signals please?

[@anthonyk8027]

They claim that material is tg140, will it cope with bga soldering at 190c?

[@GRBtutorials]

Why would I want to make my own PCBs? Time. I can make a PCB in 15 minutes instead of waiting days or even weeks for it to arrive. Sure enough, 4 layers would be difficult, but for simple prototype PCBs (which don't have to be as small as the final version) it's worth it.