Five Reasons Waterford Distillery Failed.

[@EG-xq8mj]

Love Waterford. Love how clean they taste. Love the complex barley notes. Above all, love the myriad of bready notes their juice has. Singular whisky. Sad to see them close.

[@Whiskyrover]

Sad news for those that were involved everyday and relied on it for a job. Sales just never materialised to sustain the concept.

[@whiskyonthewestcoast]

Fantastic breakdown video. I feel like nailed it. Awkward branding, lack of a set identifiable core range, high prices and the whisky generally not living up to that price tag in quality was alot to have to overcome. Sad because i had hope that things would get better. A couple months back though a half dozen expressions of Waterford were put on sale for £40 which should have sent alarm bells for me. Thanks for the great video. Cheers 🥃

[@JohnsDrams]

I was wondering if others had picked up on the mass sales that seemed to be happening - a lot of retailers were selling stuff off which said to me it just wasn't shifting - and if that's the case then a lot of retailers are going to be hesitant to stock any more of the product.

[@grbadalamenti]

This is a shock to me. Their bottlings were quite pricey but I perceived them as honest and hard working to put out a quality product on the market.

[@jameswrightesq]

I feel sorry for the people who work at Waterford. The reason i didn't buy a bottle was like many others who have commented. Price. It was very expensive here in Canada, especially for a young whiskey. I loved the look of the bottle (genuinely, it was a piece of art), but a simple bottle and a cheaper price would have resulted in a lot more people pulling the trigger i think. The price they were asking put it in a hyper competitive and illustrious-packed bracket of whiskey options

[@JohnsDrams]

There seems to be a lot at play here as to why it didn't work, but that failure to have a core bottle at a /reasonable/ price is what really killed them. That and inflation, I guess.

[@stevenj3152]

I missed this news. Initially I was excited by what Waterford represented. I have always felt the Octomore and Port Charlotte Islay barleys were often the more interesting offerings. How much that was terroir offering or just the casks used was hard to say. Certainly though exploring terroir as much as trying new yeast, and barley types and new casks it did appeal to my inner geekiness. However with Waterford I didn't feel like I could really explore the terroir as much as I thought I would. Each farm used a different cask make up from another. Besides that, each bottle was very expensive for the age. When there is so much good whisky being made, and new distilleries arriving all the time and a cost of living crisis - where Kilchomon got lucky almost 20 years ago. Waterford sadly got the timing wrong. They won't be the only one. A lot of new distilleries will struggle over the coming years, some that haven't even been built yet, as will some of the established distilleries that have upped production. What I never understood, when each bottle was as expensive as it was and the idea to play with the experimentation of the terroir exploration - why there wasn't a bigger marketing push of a collection of small bottlings so you could actually taste and compare farm bottlings together. Seemed like a missed opportunity to me. That surely would have got more people tasting, and talking about, the brand.

[@JohnsDrams]

The tasting sets idea has been a common one mentioned on here, and I'm sure there are some logistical reasons behind it, but yes, that could have helped. The issue then comes in that if they try three and none of them are doing much - which was also a problem.

[@Stephen_Curtin]

One of the things that put me off buying a bottle from Waterford, other than the points you mentioned, is that all the reviews I came across said that the "cuvee" releases (blends of multiple farms grains) were way better than any of the single farm ones. This gave me the impression that their central premise is flawed. I mean the bottles they made in the same way as any other distillery were better than the ones with their unique selling point. Kind of defeated the purpose IMO. Also, I feel like, unlike some of the other newer distilleries in Ireland, Waterford laked a face, a charismatic personality to draw you in. Intellectually, I can say its a shame that they're closing, but I was probably never going to be a regular customer of theirs, because I feel no particular way about anyone who works there, or for the farmers who I don't know.

[@matthewmorin7016]

It failed because they didn't have an affordable flagship offering to support all the one-off bottles.

[@JohnsDrams]

Agreed.

[@bobsander4589]

Too young, too expensive and too many releases. Sad for the staff but probably won't be the last irish or scottish distillery to cease production I reckon.

[@TM-og6hd]

I agree. I would think, Wolfburn is going to be next on that list.

[@JohnsDrams]

It better not be >:(

[@JohnsDrams]

We saw this with the gin craze - what goes up, must come down.

[@AdrianSlainteMhath]

Spot on

[@johnoconnor5358]

I think you are spot on with your analysis. I'm a proud Waterford man and I am very sad to see the demise of the distillery, I've been to the distillery for tastings and have bought the odd bottle , but it was too expensive for the ordinary person when you just didn't know what you were getting in the bottle. The average price here in Waterford was about €80, which is a lot when you consider the other offerings available at this price point. Personally i would prefer to spend €80 on a bottle of Redbreast. At least I know what I'm getting.

[@onewomanswhisky]

It's great to see your FACE! 😊 Very sorry to hear this news, mostly in regards to the people involved who are losing jobs and livelihoods. Fascinating premise, execution perhaps overly hopeful. There are still a few expressions floating around in Ontario, Gaia Organic 2.1 and Biodynamic Luna 1.1...$99 and $169 respectively. This was exceptionally well presented. Appreciate the update. Cheers, my friend! 🥃🥃 Marian 🇨🇦

[@Franklampard-KS]

Yes, lack of brand identification was an issue, but the bigger problem was pricing. In a very price sensitive market, Waterford was just too expensive for what you got. My whisky club tried several expressions and none of them stood out to the point where anyone wanted to rush out and buy a bottle.

[@flexexpress4296]

I was told by a distiller at Bruichladdich, that the Botanist is generating more revenue for them than all dark spirits combined, and kept the distillery alive for years. Just saying, even with a strong core offering, Whisky is a hard industry, without diversification.

[@tuomok2343]

Really sad, peated Woodbrook was an incredible whiskey 😢

[@JeffWhisky]

Always great to see you appear on the screen mate. It is a shame for Waterford, but like many others, the two I tried were fine but I couldn't tell you what the names were. Do wonder if this is a bit of signs to come for Irish Whiskey. Cheers.

[@JohnsDrams]

Irish as a category seems to be going strong, Pernod Ricard acquired two more brands only a couple years ago, so there's clearly a market still. Having a vision is all well and good, and I know as whisky geeks we malign a lot of marketing efforts and corporate decisions, but this is on the other side of it: with out a strategy to make the product marketable, it's going to fail.

[@welshtoro3256]

Hi Jeff, I never thought Waterford represented Irish whiskey anyway. Most Irish whisky is overpriced and mediocre anyway but that could be said of Waterford too.

[@cascode1192]

I was sad to hear the news about Waterford going into receivership. It was a distillery that I ignored completely in its early days, but after tasting some at a whisky festival, and then going to a masterclass with Mark Reynier, I became a disciple. Clean,crisp and precise whisky even at just 3 years. I still don’t know if terroir or biodynamic farming matters, but their cask sourcing and management was stunning. I guess the distillery and stock will all be sold as a package, and maybe someone will take it on and produce something at least half as good. Perhaps Billy Walker is looking for a new challenge? Oh yes, and I am one of the “it’s just delicious crew” because it is.

[@HostileButHonourable]

Waterford were on to something. But the marketing was woeful. The blue bottles and heavy corks were a turn off, especially as this was a brand that nerded out on subtle differences between barleys and soils and you couldn't see the liquid through the bottle, as well as being too ' laboratorial' and expensive and certainly lacked even an attempt at a core recognisable line up. Its no surprise that I have yet to hear of anyone who warmed to the Waterford brand. But , Bravo to Mark Reynier and the Waterford team for their innovative approach. Alas, as it stands now, there are way too many distilleries in Ireland to be sustainable. With the coming economic downturn, more will be folding soon.

[@-xirx-]

Good to see a video. You are missed!

[@JohnsDrams]

I live!

[@Vortex1988]

I always thought Waterford's concept of terroir was pretty interesting. The only problem was that I never picked a bottle up to try for a few different reasons. The real deal breaker was the price. The cheapest bottle of Waterford you could get in the US was $80. That's a pretty steep price already, and when you factor in the fact that it was a fairly young distillery releasing NAS whiskey, it just always felt like a risk I wasn't willing to take. The whiskey was almost certainly guaranteed to be young and taste closer to new make than an aged product, which definitely did not encourage me to buy a bottle. Add to that the indecision of which bottle to choose, since there were usually about 4 different terroirs on the shelf to choose from, and I didn't want to get stuck with the wrong bottle. Trying to choose one was always a dilemma, because if you got a bad bottle, then was it just that batch or that particular farm? Could the rest actually be really good, and you'd just never know because you wrote them off after one bad bottle? How many chances can you give them when each bottle is at least $80? It just always felt like you were more likely to choose an inferior product from a bad farm or simply because it was young whiskey. When you don't have a consistent product on the shelf that people can be confident in, it makes it very hard to spend money on the brand, even if the concept of terroir would be a fun angle to explore. You still need a fairly priced flagship that tastes good to get people interested.

[@portnaluinge]

I’m aware this is a nerdy comparison, but Waterford struck me as being to Mark Reynier what NeXT was to Steve Jobs. At Bruichladdich Mark had people all around him, like Jim McEwan, who kept him in check and ensured there were enough commercial offerings to offset all the micro provenance stuff. But at Waterford, like Jobs at NeXT, he got to indulge all his pet ideas and obsessions with nobody to talk him down. And as you say, the Waterford whisky I tried was fine, but I wasn’t blown away.

[@whiskyjourney175]

Great breakdown mate. I am honestly not surprised. Several month ago news came out that Renegade Rum Distillery (owned by Waterford) was on the market for being sold, and back then I felt it was the writing on the wall for Waterford. They tried similar themes with Renegade - single farm origin, emphasis on traceability etc. As you have said it all becomes rather expensive, and again as you said, who really cares. I would suggest that the rum just didn't sell - the releases have been on the shelves for years, and even heavily discounted still not selling. It's a shame really - I cannot speak about the whisky as never tried any, but the rum was rather good in my opinion.

[@leonperler9619]

I think back in the days of the Bruichladdich resurrection, this might have worked. Maybe even 10 years ago. When Bruichladdich started pumping out releases it got convoluted at times for sure, but experimental and provenance focused scotch was nearly unheard of in the early 2000s and the concept sold easily. Nowadays we are spoiled with choice and the revolutionary factor is somewhat diminished, even though it is incredibly what Waterford have done.

[@JohnsDrams]

I don't want to say that this was the one chance for Irish whiskey to be taken seriously, but it sort of was - and they fucked it.

[@GOTAisMe]

I enjoyed the Cuvee and bought multiple bottles. The biggest issue I had with Waterford was the price. At least here in America they were very expensive. Gorgeous bottles with glass stoppers are nice but do I really want to pay near the same price as a Redbreast cask strength for that presentation? That should have been cheaper and become the core offering to compete with Dingle and Knappague 12. Excellent video. Too bad they didn't hire you as a consultant

[@edplatt4946]

Can't disagree with any of the points here. I am a fan of Waterford and always enjoyed the nerdy side of what they did. Had a special love for the Hook Head single farm origin because my dad and I have a special connection to the place and have really enjoyed the whiskey together. That being said my nerdy whiskey obsession isn't reflective of the general public and the price point was always tough to justify for young whiskey. Sad to see them go, hopefully other Irish brands can learn from this cool, fun experiment and incorporate elements of it in a more economically feasible way

[@BrewabitRick]

I love your knowledge it always impresses me. Another entertaining informative video I’m a BIG fan cheers 👍🥃

[@JohnsDrams]

Thank you! Cheers!

[@Scotchnow]

Agree with the thesis. Sipping on Ballybannon Peated now, which is somewhat of exception to the theme of the video. Phenomenal dram -- one of my favorite peated experiences all time. Hope that they drop the prices on the offering so that I can stock up.

[@danandrews8102]

It was the branding for me. I know thats shallow but i never looked at it and thought "i want a bottle of that".

[@-xirx-]

I've been seeing tons of these bottles being sold off on websites recently

[@JohnsDrams]

That was an early warning sign for me too.

[@marty_sugar]

hey John, good to see you here again. I am one of those who did actually enjoy Waterford's stuff. I liked most of their expressions I could get my hands on but I have never bought a whole bottle in the end. I loved the concept on findig nuances between single farm expressions but it did fail with me as well, because it means I must pick up at least two bottles to deep dive into this concept and tbh 1 bottle was already way too expensive on a market flooded with amazing whisky in this price range... let's see how the story ends. cheers✌🥃

[@JohnsDrams]

Well there we go. It's possible someone would pick it up still, but I think they'd need to do some serious reworking of the offer if they did.

[@davieislay]

Well considered observations, John, and smart that you avoided the elephant in the room. I think that particular elephant was a huge turn-off to many in the whisky world and as a result they wouldn’t touch the drams with a barge pole! (*purely my “personal” thoughts.)

[@GregsWhiskyGuide]

100 % right ! (I talked about it 2 years ago, wasn't crazy about it even prior to tasting, despite the good initial idea, will probably speak about it soon as here in France we have sometimes better choices made by some distilleries about that so to speak "terroir" approach), well done !

[@teddyballgame25]

Stubborn is the word I would use to describe the fail. Many examples of other new dist. that know you need a budget core range until your finished product is ready. Yes, the whiskey was challenging, interesting, maybe complex, but most importantly it tasted VERY Crafty. They should have blended their stock with distillate to create something that would connect with the masses, until their stock came of age. They chose to be stubborn and not sell enough instead.

[@Fudjo]

Even if you were to buy into the idea that terroir matters for whiskey, you'd still have to buy at least two overpriced bottles to try side by side to see for yourself if there's a difference (or luck out with a pub that has multiple bottles to try). And even then, with smaller batches per bottle, are the differences really in the terroir or just from normal cask variation? As it turns out, there's also a difference in cask types from bottling to bottling (and therefore from farm to farm) which you can see in their Whiskybase entries, making the terroir differences much more difficult to notice. It makes the whole endeavour seem pointless. If they had consistency in cask types across the single farm bottlings and offered them in tasting kits of 100 mL or 50 mL samples so you could readily try them side by side, maybe they could have sold us on the idea of terroir. But in the end, they really should have focussed on one good bottle of whiskey.

[@JohnsDrams]

Agreed - RMW trade were doing a promotion on Waterford for St Paddy's just gone, so I got in two different styles and stocked them for £5 a pop for 35ml. Literally no-one gave a shite about the nuances of terroir. Most didn't even really like them.

[@masterdad-zf9po]

Great info! We just started seeing Waterford here in Canada! Sad news. I have a few of them. Personally, I love the whiskeys that are unique - they make for great sharing and conversation. And I’ll buy them without trying first, and often without reviews. The downside is they’re often quite expensive (think Octomore, which I love, particularly the .3’s). If I buy smthg and I don’t love it, hey I have boys who are always happy for a free bottle! And they’ll always help me open a new whiskey bottle 😀

[@JohnsDrams]

Hello from Scotland! You sound like a good friend to have!

[@whiskyguidedog6558]

This is sad. The Biodinamic Looner release was quite a fun and tasty product. I always felt That they needed to keep the cask balance the same if we were to spot the diference in barley.

[@JohnsDrams]

The 'Where's Wally' idea to spotting the differences made by the barley was such a niche concept though, it's hard for core drinkers to latch onto, and I think as enthusiasts we sometimes forget there is a very real commercial element that musnn't just be remembered, but actively fed like the merciless monster it is.

[@Stephen_Curtin]

Another thing I've heard is that they were releasing their whiskies too young. Maybe they should have sourced other whiskies, and made gin or vodka while their own liquid matured?

[@markmarley2556]

Great Northern Distillery is supplying brands with very approachable and affordable young single malt whiskey. Waterford's offering was un-competitive in comparison, unless you bought into the single farm gimmickry, which not many did.

[@welshtoro3256]

Nice one John. If Waterford have gone/failed then I'm not surprised either. I completely agree with you about the lack of core range but that links in to the complete arrogance of Mark Reynier (ex Bruichladdich) and the his Waterford acolytes. If you questioned the concept of the terroir in whisky, which is so obviously bullshit because it's a f*****g spirit which can be made anywhere and not organic matter like wine, you got verbally assaulted. Every time I questioned that obvious marketing crap I had to endure some verbal assault. First of all Waterford and Ireland were never an easy fit. They clearly weren't like regular Irish whisky despite all the farmyard terroir junk and fancy website. They were an uneasy modern Scotch desperately trying to graft a distinct identity which happened to land in Ireland. Nothing Irish about it apart from the bollocks of the wheat which could be replicated anywhere in the world for spirit distillation. I've never bought a single bottle of the range and that's partly to do with the issue of choice. Which 'terroir' should I buy? Plus, let's be honest, there was never an age statement (correct me if I'm wrong) and so we always factored in a pre-conceived idea of youth in the brand. That's a possibility if we think it's getting older like Kilkerran or Bimber but that wasn't the case with Waterford. Also, the price. It was sold as premium from the get go with all the issues you and I have described. As a marketing exercise it's obviously failed. There's a whisky loch out there and they wont be the only ones. I know for a fact that many distilleries and bottlers are finding it very tough. The price of whisky is far too high for most enthusiasts now. There has never been a chatter about Waterford in the Whisky sphere and that is the obvious problem. Fancy website; bullshit terroir marketing concept and expensive whisky that people haven't connected with. Where's that going to go? That's worth a thought to all those other wankers that jumped on the investment whisky wagon. Cheers John. Hope to see you again soon. WT

[@JohnsDrams]

It sounds like you had quite an experience, and I suppose you get the last laugh with this one. The notion of distillation does bring up a fair point in that you lose a fair bit through the process and then gain it back in the maturing stage - that said I've been privileged enough to try a fair few new makes from distilleries I probably had no business trying the new make of - and a strong barley character does indeed shine through with those.

[@thespiritsafe]

I loved the clean taste and the concept but (having tried and enjoyed the single farm varieties) I tried the Cuvee and the cask recipe just failed to make the liquid shine - too much European oak and French wine which just screamed lack of confidence and coherence. Your comments about the Irish are probably fair but I would sum it up more as a lack of sentimentality and/or not wanting to be taken too seriously.

[@GlubChumbus]

"Now, before you get all up in arms over what I'm about to say: this is not an attack on the Irish, so put that out of your mind. The Irish are just creatures of extreme habit with shit taste." All joking aside, the reason they failed is two-fold: as a company, they were a whiskey producer that was trying to run itself like a wine producer, which you touched upon, but in different terms. This sort of marketing simply does not appeal to the vast majority of whiskey drinkers, who tend to have a "stable" of core releases that they like from their preferred producers that serve as their daily drinkers while mixing in a few "special" or "unique" bottles that either offer a different experience or are used as special occasion drams. In addition, in pursuing more of a "winery" model, I would argue that their native Ireland was not even their primary "goal" market and that they wanted the brand to be a unique, "premium" name that would primarily be an export product. They recently (within the past few years) made a significant push to get into my part of the US, and the language they used in the event tents really pealed back the curtain on their strategy: to have a unique, premium product that told a story and was never exactly the same between releases. It's nifty in concept, but just isn't what the whiskey drinking public goes for, especially in the states, where Irish whiskey is having a bit of a hard time breaking free of the Jameson/Bushmills "bottom shelfer" image. The only Irish whiskey brand that is having any level of consistent success gaining traction in my neck of the woods is Redbreast, and that's because that stuff just speaks for itself and is doing well everywhere.

[@abraham2174]

Teeling and their Great Northern distillery is the future for Irish whiskey. Not foreign owned and still successful.

[@tonychettleburgh8953]

Always sad when any business fails as people have put lots of time, effort and above all money into these ventures. I have to agree with one of the comments here about trying to apply wine making methods and practices into whisky. Two different products aimed at different drinkers. I like an honest product, I don't like E150 colouring and I Like my whisky matured at the distillery it was made, beyond that I don't really care what day the barley was harvested or what the distiller had for lunch the same day. What the whisky tastes like and is the price point right for the quality of the whisky are the most important things to me and also the identity of the product ie age statement and product range.

[@weeg743]

Sort of co fixed by you take on the Irish whiskey market - many small distillers doing unique things with a lot of success (relatively). I do agree in your points about these guys.

[@NeilImmortal]

Most reviews were kind of "Tastes similar to the last release, not blowing any socks off" So an NAS whisky in a wine bottle (just because it is blue does not make it better) at a high price with a generic taste. No real suprise TBH.

[@ElieJobert-v2u]

Hi, I am huge fan of the concept and the whisky and I never understood why the whisky community has so little interest in waterford... Until now ^^ I an understand what you are saying and agree unfortunately... But I still think it is a wee shame people don't get the concept of " terroir"... Maybe it is just the French in me ^^

[@ninetyZeven]

A shame in any case. I was of course one of those people who was holding off on Wtrfrd until they had some older byt not too expensive bottlings.

[@ErikWaitWhiskyStudies]

It was a funny science experiment trying to be a business that I found curious but not compelling. I’m a certified sommelier, in my opinion the error is due to one thing: trying to overly apply wine principles to whisky.

[@digitaldemocracyai-rob]

Probably good to buy up a few bottles. Can see existing bottles appreciate.

[@hanggo24]

Ralfy could save waterforddd could have!!

[@JohnsDrams]

I think they're open to offers...

[@Aircraftsystemst]

Ralfy would have turned Waterford distillery around for sure!

[@placeswithspirit]

Very interesting take on it - well, I say that because it's what I was saying about not having a core product so... 😂 I really like the idea of what they have been doing and the ambition of it, one thing that (for me anyway) I always found a bit "off" was the blue bottle - to me with Whisky, if you can't see the colour and it's not a brand you know, it makes it much harder to pick up from the shelf... maybe just me that one!

[@jaydeenibanez4819]

I love Waterford so sad

[@valentin8696]

Nice breakdown, but HOW IN THE WORLD can you talk 20 minutes on Waterford without mentioning Mark Reynier at least once?! 🤯

[@digitaldemocracyai-rob]

Was a really interesting, unique whiskey based on some novel ideas. Pity

[@MrBillybonka]

Sick and tired of paying 80euros for a 6 y old bottle

[@Robertcollopy]

Waterford couldn't spell Whiskey properly on the label either. They spelled it Whisky and not Whiskey. Only two countries in the world spells Whiskey with a key and are America and Ireland.

[@abraham2174]

Cause they don't call it Whiskey.

[@ikiruyamamoto1050]

Good video! I appreciate the analysis of the Irish market, but I think this terroir, hipster stuff may have been primarily aimed at the US hipster market. It was a cool bottle, but the story and blah, blah, blah farm in this or that county is pure marketing. Terroir is almost ALWAYS overrated. It's about materials and techniques...especially with a spirit. I think the "Judgment of Paris" sorted that terroir stuff out back in the 1970s (for wine). I would have tried a taste at a bar, but I wasn't going to spend that much on an unknown with just a story. I've got the Redbreast lineup, Powers John's Lane, Teeling, Dingle and a few others....and I just didn't see the need for another, absent good word of mouth. This may be unpopular, but I don't think Irish whiskey has as much flavor variety as Scotch or American whiskey.

[@arielkotler]

Very disappointed