Just how gay WAS Ancient Rome?

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[@mysticpearl16]

Georgia: Just how gay WAS Ancient Rome? Rome: Yes

[@SurferJoe1]

One of the all-time great talk show jokes comes to mind: Johnny Carson's guest was Michael Landon, in his final appearance, I think, and terminally ill. Asked (suggestively) about the fact that none of the Cartwright Boys ("Bonanza") ever got married during the show's twelve (or so) year run, Landon replied: "Yeah, people have always asked me if the Cartwrights were gay. I tell 'em 'no, but thank god our Chinese cook was!'"

[@SurferJoe1]

Great topic and well-covered, GM. As you mention, this curious attitude about active/passive persists into our time. When I was in high school, my friends and I worked in a warehouse with a man who'd served a long sentence for armed robbery, and he regaled us all day with pornographic memories from the prison showers just to watch us squirm. (We hadn't even been to the Prom yet). When we finally asked him about being gay, he exploded with denials. I'm cleaning it up for you, but the gist of his memorable response was that in prison sex, there could only be one gay man at a time. We were astounded.

[@patchoulikid]

loved this video! i know someone else already said this as well, but i would love a series of this looking into other cultures as well

[@Greenkitten45]

From what I remember learning on this subject in history class, homosexuality in ancient Rome was heavily context dependant (it was seen as weak for a man to submit to another man's sexual advances so topping was ok, but bottoming was not) and not necessarily consentual from the submissive partner's side of the relationship since a lot of stories I recall were usually an older, richer Roman choosing a younger, typically lower class boy to dominate.

[@grievesunderground7924]

yeah, as Georgia said in her video- it was VERY context dependent. good tldw tho (too long didn't watch) ✌

[@noodlesauce2553]

Perfect timing, I just sat down for lunch❤❤❤

[@niwoida7041]

absolutely loved this video!!!!! honestly it could’ve been over an hour long, this was so interesting! great work georgia :)

[@Emrose93]

This was such an interesting topic that I myself have always wondered about.. well done.

[@annaroberts2829]

I love your history vids

[@Nobody-s824]

Another intelligent and informative video! I adore your history content especially, and listening to your perspective.

[@rileyschmunsler3681]

SCREAMED when I saw this title! YES

[@Commedeshommes]

Julius Caesar was called “every woman’s man and every man’s woman” 💀

[@lolo_z]

He was for the streets

[@isabellafogal3244]

A video I did not know I needed٫ but I am so glad we have.

[@jasminegomez160]

Very interesting😊Thanks

[@ummarah2000]

thank you so much i really learn something new from you keep up the good work

[@TheVirtualFashionista]

That was really interesting! Please do other ancient cultures. If I remember right, in parts of Ancient Egypt and Greece, men being feminine was actually DESIRED, so that could be an interesting angle to investigate.

[@CarpeNutella]

Not only desired but complete normal for a teenage boy to have an older "mentor/sex partner" for a time and many of them would marry women later. It was just a rite of passage towards manhood in Greece.

[@Nobody-s824]

@@CarpeNutella That would be an interesting deep dive too. And maybe a look at how the trend continued in history and how it's viewed today.

[@sarahleony]

The queer girlies talking Roman Empire - here for it!

[@johnring7042]

How did the public know who assumed which role? Surely these acts were done in private

[@Nobody-s824]

I know there is the idea of Roman orgies being common, but I don't think there is much history to back that. Maybe sex wasn't considered as private of an act? Maybe being more public about it was a way to show your display your power? I'm sure someone else knows more than me about this, just speculating here.

[@huhhhh5508]

wow i love this topic!!!! history and fun stories about the culture back then is my fav

[@LindaUrsin]

In the time around 800 BCE - 1100 BCE in Scandinavia, there isn't much mention of gay sex being illegal or "a bad thing". As long as you weren't "the bottom". They also had a number of stories of gods and people crossing later gender borders more than once :)

[@CarpeNutella]

Georgia, not sure if you've ever watched the HBO series Rome since you're quite a bit younger than me, but it's so worth a watch if that era interests you. There's also a new series "For Those About to Die" (Peacock) starring Anthony Hopkins in the gladiator world. I can't wait ❤

[@stunod05]

lol my ancestors as gay as me 😂😂

[@DragonKingGaav]

We all spend our time thinking about the Roman Empire!

[@ashcraft555]

What a great video this is. Thanks for telling us more about these people who were just good friends. Besties and nothing more. Sincerely, historians

[@grievesunderground7924]

Thank you Audible! 🌈

[@clarissamoss9268]

Can you do Roberta Elder she was a serial killer in Atlanta I. The early 1900

[@TheScarletAlchemist]

If you haven't seen the HBO show Rome, I highly recommend it! I think you'd like it.

[@andrayellowpenguin]

Yes, this was pretty much the case over the whole of the ancient world. It wasn't about who you had sex with, but what "role" you had in sex. Only it wasn't always quite as strict, in most cultures you didn't risk your whole social standing if you were at the "receiving end" as it were, but only your reputation. At any rate it was all about power. What's concerning is that unfortunately we haven't moved much from that point...

[@maryscott9430]

Oooooooh. A gay history video??? Heck yes!! You do such a great job on all your videos, but im a big history nerd( only now as an adult. Go figure) and absolutely love all your history videos!

[@georgiamarie_]

Thank you Mary!! ❤️

[@LisaBabe85]

My all time favourite TV series is Rome by HBO. There are some instances of homosexuality in it. Thanks for this video, Georgia, it was really interesting x

[@moomsof]

i havent watched it yet but im going to guess.... super gay lmao

[@garret6464]

Unfortunately that is not true. Ideally we use primary sources and verified evidence to come to conclusions but I guess not

[@rickspigot2205]

Very interesting video.

[@georgiamarie_]

Glad you think so!

[@DannyWildmen]

I'm going to be serious, things haven't really changed that much. The people at the top still treat us who are lower to be used.

[@mytruecrimelibrary]

Happy Pride everyone 💜💙💚💛🧡♥️🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍🌈

[@Freak80MC]

Idk how gay ancient Rome was, but I do know that one Roman emperor was probably trans. They literally promised half the empire to any surgeon who could give them bottom surgery.

[@Greenkitten45]

Nero married two males and from most accounts it seemed neither were well received. Emperor Nero married a man named Pythagoras who Nero called his husband and acted as a bride, which likely scandalized other Romans because the emperor should have been the husband and Pythagoras the bride/woman. Then Nero married a boy who resembled his recently late wife (who Nero may or may not have murdered). He dubbed the boy Sporus and made it clear Sporus was his bride. Some historical accounts say he would at times lapse into calling Sporus by his late wife's name so he might have felt guilty? I don't know. Nero definitely seemed bi to me, though, as he seemed to like submitting to men but he enjoyed dominating women (and young men who resembled women).

[@thomashavard-morgan8181]

I asked and you delivered, great topic, I've always loved Hadrian queer icon, knew a thing about walls and nothing more gay than going to extremes, your lover dies, create a new religion :p.

[@KeithPrince-cp3me]

DNA Evidence has revealed graves of two people intered together, assumed to be male and female, were both male, 'explained' away as comrades fallen battle, rather than conclude the obvious. The Roman army did have women in its ranks, in its auxiliary forces, front line troops, non Roman citizens, 'recruited' from among the barbarians. For example, during an archaeological dig at a Roman military cemetery in Cumbria in 1966-7 a couple of interments were discoved with military equipment and assumed to be male, yet recent DNA testing showed both were biological females. Evidently of high status, judging by grave goods, and horse remains buried nearby suggest cavalry. Historians said it changed our perceptions of gender roles in 3rd century Britain. As grave goods were of upper Danubian origin, a suggestion is that they were Sarmatians as these people who lived in that area were renowned for their warrior women, the term 'Amazon' is reckoned as Sarmatian. Following Roman defeat of the Iazages tribe the then emperor was so impressed with their cavalry he conscripted them into Roman service and of these some 5,500 were stationed in Britain.

[@Con_blue]

Maybe you could do one about ancient greece too.

[@HolldollMcG]

So much could be solved by people just minding their own goddamn business. I do not care what my neighbours do in the bedroom, why should they care what I'm doing?

[@HolldollMcG]

thank god for Chappell Roan.

[@SageK253]

I can't recall where I read/heard it, but I had heard that your ideas about why there's no information on wlw sex and relationships is, in fact, because without a cis male being involved, there can be no sex. That sex = penetration. Three was also a heavy denial about women having any kind of genuine sexual desire as well, which makes me think of the alpha bros who tweet about how the female organism is a myth because THEY'VE never seen it lol

[@Olive-765]

A gay history ep during pride month, hell yeah!

[@RabiaSammy]

33:33 literally sounds like the redpill men today

[@CarpeNutella]

Spoiler alert: Gay as hell! Or at least bisexual. Source: Four years of Latin and several trips to Italy (Capri was a big gay hotspot for emperors)

[@Greenkitten45]

I'd say they were more open to the idea of bisexuality. Crazy Caligula was definitely bisexual, but he condemned men who were strictly homosexual and placed them in work camps. Of course, to my understanding, those men taken to the camps were allegedly those who enjoyed the role of being submissive. Dominate gay men were ok. Their partners were not. I can't follow the logic, but that seemed to be rules Ancient Romans liked playing by. 😒

[@ThatGirlShelbyy]

@@Greenkitten45by their logic, if they were high born and bi, they'd have to condemn every man after they slept together.... because that man would have been submissive if HE himself wasn't... it's redundant logic and makes noooo sense 😂😂

[@garret6464]

There is very little evidence for widespread homosexuality in Rome and a lot of evidence that it was looked down upon. Sorry.

[@HolldollMcG]

Rome and Greece being OG queers. Love it. Happy Pride Month, everyone!

[@ShonCon21]

More like OG rapists

[@DannyWildmen]

As a lesbian I want to try edible. Thanks for your add.

[@misery.maiden]

my lover died so I'll make the Egyptians worship him 😂😂😂😂

[@drangonfliepink79]

Always wonder why people throw the bible at us when there reading the king James version in church????

[@HolldollMcG]

Homosexuality is far from "contrary to nature." Same sex activity happens throughout the animal kingdom. Further, the modern idea that God opposes homosexuality is based on a mistranslation and further misinterpretation of a bible passage. The original text reads "man shall not lie with BOY as with woman" not "man shall not lie with man". This passage actually condemns pedophilia, not queerness. But, people will eagerly and happily use religious texts to support their bigotry whenever possible.

[@mir4924]

That's a lie. The Hebrew word used is "zakar" which means male not boy. Adam was also described as "zakar" in Genesis. Even the Greek translation uses the word arrén/ar''-hane which means man/male, not boy. Stop lying. Also there're other entries in the Bible which condemn such behaviour: Romans 1:27, 1 Timothy 1:10, Deuteronomy 23:18 also let's not forget the story of the two unfortunate cities filled with vice and corruption. What was one of the vices which doomed them and brought God's wrath upon them?

[@EmbalmerEmi]

Haven't watched yet but let me assure you that the answer is VERY GAY. 😂❤

[@mir4924]

This has been debunked.

[@barb330]

could u link some sources?

[@NixWingedOne]

Noo please dont use AI in the thumbnails.. AI seriously affects artists and is stealing labour for a shitty product that the actual artists who made it possible with the data (their work) stolen from them, and do not see a single penny of the profit. Like pleaaaase!

[@kieranmclaughlin8920]

Georgia Marie... I do understand you're gay. I've watched your channel for years. Used to be about fatal crime. Yet, now, every upload is related to gay people. That's fine, Georgia Marie. Is not very clear to people. Certainly not to myself. I don't wish to watch gay crimes only. Thanks. Peace and love. 🙏 xxx

[@georgiamarie_]

Please do tell me how every upload is related to gay people?! I want a list of every single queer video I’ve uploaded on this channel this year please and thank you, and then we can have a grown up discussion

[@muls9571]

😂 I don't think we've been watching the same channel 😂 she posts these very interesting videos sporadically, it's definitely not every video 😂

[@Vera-hm4uz]

I like more diverse topics, came here for true crime, got so much more!

[@jasminegomez160]

Just dont watch the videos then? Thats what I do😅 I watch them at a later time or not at all. The creator is gay so obviously she is gonna cover it😅

[@kieranmclaughlin8920]

@@georgiamarie_ Ok. Your most recent videos are gay topics. Are they not?

[@joecruises]

Not gay enough 🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍🌈

[@LauraX-xj6xj]

🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸

[@thevenbede767]

Julius Caesar was never emperor