Updated PAY-TO-WIN Breakdown (Throne & Liberty)

[@KanonXO]

Streaming non-stop Throne @ twitch.tv/kanonxo - come hang out!

[@chaddamron2419]

Are you still streaming on twitch

[@kyleridgeway1363]

pedro pedro pedro

[@bobshagit]

WE HAVE TO STOP PLAYING THESE CANCEROUS PAY TO WIN GAMES IT IS THE ONLY WAY TO STOP THIS

[@ogcipher4967]

I am so happy that these days we're going "well it's not that P2W because the whale can't get to max gear score day one" like what the actual fk, I didn't realize that the standard was "beating the game day one"

[@MrTrun4o]

Kanon gonna spend 10k $ week one and is trying to explain to us why it's not really gonna give him much of advantage in PvP LMAO.

[@bitterbon]

@@MrTrun4o it will give him tons of advantage, but are you just gonna play for a week?

[@sample479]

I have a life and I don’t play with free to play players or in systems that reward/require no-lifing to compete. If that makes me a whale well then okay i guess

[@ogcipher4967]

@@MrTrun4o Yeah the dude's coping because the game having players helps his bottom line but he doesn't care that he's just lying to his audience. What can ya do.

[@ogcipher4967]

@@sample479 I mean we don't wanna play with you either, but sadly we have to. I don't wanna have to play a shittier game because of you buy oh well, this is the world we live in.

[@Muphet]

rare polished crystals can be infinitely farmed in dungeons as long as you don't complete dungeon (kill miniboss, quit, repeat).

[@MAMAvsGOD]

Example?

[@liparksgaming6063]

my opinion is that p2w players gets super geared early release so they get to farm f2p players. the thing is how fast can a "f2p" catch up to these p2w players without the game dying in 2 months

[@Ottobot2]

Gear is somewhat gated in the game so you cant just buy it all at once. Only so many boss events happen per day. Many guilds will keep the gear in house so the market could be quite empty early on. A few whales (20 players on a server)could get full traits on purples in 4 weeks but it would cost them a 1000 dollars or more. To some extent all levels of paying players are gated. If you went in with the idea that my budget is 10 dollars a month for battle passes, and you sell extra gear you get for lucent, while 100% completing all daily grinds you should be full build in 3 months. F2P players would take 4 months, dolphins with a 50 a month budget would be geared in 2 months, someone dropping 1000 a month would be geared in the first month. Its a guild vs guild game so a lot of times whales just get killed in the mix. A full build fully traited is about the strength of 3-4 fresh 50s in single traited purples. Arch boss weapons are very noticeable though but very few people have them. I would say they are 2x as strong as a normal weapon. Basically you only get 1 per week on a server. So by week 12 for example 12 people on a server will have one.

[@rokpepeshogun]

@@Ottobot2 But you forget about Whale-Guilds which is common in these days

[@bryantorres2060]

'' Ark Weapon ''bS is already putting a knife to the throat on this game. U think, m gonna let that pass? its ok , if its only used for pve maybeeeeeeee, but if u can bring this crap to pvp then its done ! .

[@falcor2325]

See this is also a gigantic problem for people who join the game later as well. They will never stick around long enough in servers populated by far stronger players, who got there far far faster than they ever will. Do you really think they will stick around to get farmed by swipers? Unlikely.

[@mja8433]

@@falcor2325 your mindset is extremely negative..youre not gonna last in any game..whether that poe, d4, last epoch, thrones, wow, black desert.

[@chelo136]

Same argument as in Lost ark, this game is pay 2 win just accept it

[@Denka_]

No lmao Lost ark is actually pay to win it has no limit.

[@TheZile24]

until f2p reaches the limit the new limit will be introduced do not be stupid please

[@chelo136]

@@Denka_ Lost ark have limits at the start, like first there was a cap even for spenders taht the last dungeon was the dragon deer thing , aftre it we got the minotaur raid (cant remember the names of bhosses being years) and the limit got higher and so on ... everytime f2p players even the ones that have max characters that can get gold and run all the dailys and weeklies on all alts were closer to Spenders the soft limit got push further and further, you just never reach them . Here is exactly the same , the limit is a carrot, they will move the carrot way before you reach spender,m but keep coping

[@Denka_]

@@chelo136 no shit it will get increased? There would be no reason to play the game anymore if it didnt. But the gap between f2p and p2w wont be as wide as lost ark because +9 to +12 can be done in a week lmao....

[@pedrothin]

There is nothing to "win" there, there is no competition, lost ark is a pve game. Throne and liberty has a lot of pvp, so it's gonna be worse if it's like lost ark.

[@ketsandhisgames]

Honestly, I feel like our perception of P2W has been warped over the years. This is the argument I made in my video, but to summarize: Sure, with grind, a F2P can keep up with a whale in T&L, and so people are tempted to say, "it's not pay-to-win, it's just pay-to-progress-faster", but that's kind of the same thing. You still are paying to win, because a whale that puts in 100 hours will ostensibly win _more_ than a F2P player that puts in 100 hours. The fact that a F2P player has to grind more or work more at _all_ is, by definition, pay-to-win!

[@Tsunam4b0z]

how is are they supposed to make money

[@ketsandhisgames]

​@@Tsunam4b0z There's two main options that other games take: 1. Buy-to-play or subscription models. 2. Only monetize cosmetics/power-related items like mounts. This is mostly used in competitive games like Valorant and DotA, but even MMOs like Once Human and GW2 have had a lot of success with it. Either would be better, imo.

[@sharp201]

@@ketsandhisgames Why these companies should not make p2w games when the most popular MMO is p2w on top of having a subscription?

[@ketsandhisgames]

@@sharp201 Haha, sure, if I were a publisher trying to make as much money as possible, I'd make my game P2W too. Thankfully, I'm not a publisher, so I'm just pointing out that defending it by pretending it's not pay-to-win is silly.

[@ogcipher4967]

@@sharp201 nobody said they shouldn't, a compayn's goal is to make money, we should not accept such anti-consumer practices, but oh well we're like 15 years too late for that. Sucks to suck.

[@Jabbadada]

the fact that this game is a major Guild-focused game, here is whats going to happen. The game is going to release on October 1, and the whales are going to be surfacing and leaping out of the water. They will find other whales in the throne and liberty ocean and absolutely dominate and destroy everything OH WAIT im sorry theres actually a 100 dollar bundle that allows you to play 5 days early and you receive lucent, the whales have already breached. SO now all the nodes, castles, and every guild focused content etc. will only be fought over by the whales in the game, meaning there will be no reason to create your own guild, but you're probably thinking, "Oh, I'll just join the Moby Dick guild." Nope, those whales will act as if they truly earned their gear and stats and look at you and say, "You need x amount of power, gear, etc." and if your free to play, WELP. This game will go the way of Lost Ark, another game with amazing potential, but will be suffocated to death by its monitization. It won't happen fast, but we will see the life slowly leave throne and liberties eyes.

[@erroneouse1929]

whales would rather play on the f2p servers on oct 1st, more players to farm lol.

[@Jabbadada]

@@erroneouse1929 Aye! you are not wrong my guy lol

[@JoeBobTheTROLL]

F2p players can't join the early access servers

[@cosminmocanu5254]

@@JoeBobTheTROLL whales can just switch servers and pay $$$ to farm you for content for more $$$

[@ThePuppet001]

Whales can't farm anything if you stay out of dungeons on nites and don't join any pvp area events 😂

[@BatzArk]

If I dedicated 12 hours a day, 7 days a week I will be able to compete vs a guy playing 1-2 hours a day, with a girlfriend, social life, big house, nice cars! LEZZZGOOOO!

[@Mortal_Indeed]

Now imagine the same guy minus all but the very rich part, and he now play 12hrs a day, 7days a week as well, imagine calling that not pay to win lmao.

[@TyeCozMusic]

Thats called paying to lose actually, because time is more valuable than money

[@nikolalefterov7472]

Well that guy, has a real life and he also wants to compete right? The game is not much friendly to people who cannot play much, there is almost no cap events, beside some low level DOmination events. If you go conflicts, Nodes, Siege the guy that play 1-2 hours a day and have a real life will do nothing therefore this guy will quit, therefore you will not have anyone to pvp... so P2W is not bad as long as it is balanced, if you can get 5k CP in 100 eur thats not ok... but let say if someone swipe 500 eur and he boost lets say 100 CP thats okey

[@Unchainedful]

Pro tip, don’t ever abbreviate CP. No it doesn’t matter you meant it for something else. That is all, thank you.

[@COOL-WHIP503]

Challenge Accepted.

[@justinasbar]

you should try comedy club :D. Funny to listen about progressing, p2w from a player who spent >30k usd already :D. Would be interesting to see your experience as a f2p player on global and insights after.

[@sharp201]

I played f2p in KR and spent 0 dollars and i have 4600 gear score. Now what?

[@justinasbar]

@@sharp201 yes, me too, 2 char 4600+, yet after hyperboost. And yes, u can farm etc, just dont be delusional. There is p2w, and no need to diminish that. I dont mind p2w, problem is f2p is limited HARD. Anyway, will see how it goes after ~2months. P2w isnt main problem of this game, evasion/hit based pvp IS.

[@DeityVengy]

@@sharp201 yeah and you played 10x longer than the whales essentially grinding the equivalent of $2 an hour and were outgeared by them for weeks/months until you caught up. congrats but thats not a W

[@sharp201]

@@DeityVengy since I have a job that pays well and can’t grind 10 hours a day, it’s a W for me and most people.

[@DeityVengy]

@@sharp201 if you had a job that pays well, then you wouldn't have played f2p in Korea and no life grinded without spending a cent 💀 are you a masochist?

[@Seiza_InSomnia]

Basically 80% of the build character progression is available for p2w, just a couple bottle-neck matterials, and weapon skills needs exp that you get by playing dungeons... So, as a F2P player, i will be lvl 30 with +4 green gear first weekend since release, and i will find streamers/whales who can afford investing 1k$ with full blue/purple gear +9 full traits and whatever the hell it is, farming me for content, is that right? I think we will see a 2-3 months of whales/streamers farming f2p players until f2p people get tired and leave. And everytime they release a new mechanic like runes or tiers or whaterver, will be a new 1-2 months gap for free farming f2p players until we all get to the same point. I don't care if my class can counter you if i will have a +7 blue gear, farming materials to upgrade it, while you have a purple +9 full traits in the first 2 month of the game... i will try the game as a f2p just to enjoy the experience, but it doesn't look like my new mmorpg tbh... I don't want another Chonation guild/alliance full of whales farming people with arch weapons the first month of the game, while 90% of us f2p users still go around with blue+9 / purple +5 gear no runes no traits...

[@jorgetinoco3574]

You are right, PvP is horrendous in this game, that's why I will only PvE

[@xkarzer]

Jeeze... This is a lot of systems. I'm still excited for the game but damn the currency bloat in all these kind of games is crazy.

[@TheNichq]

Lost Ark but way way worse lol. This game is literally DOA in the West. Honestly not sure why they are even wasting their time.

[@The_Captainn]

Korean MMO devs cannot understand the mind of Western gamers

[@jackgreenway4646]

P2W game and its terrible 😂

[@vewyscawymonsta]

It's intentional. They use similar tactics in mobile games.

[@nice8309]

It's not about P2W, It's about forcing people to P2W just to enjoy the game. The gearing is balances around people spending money instead of the average players spending 2-5 hours a day playing it. for example, No one really care if you p2w in Runescape or WoW because you can get gear cap pretty quickly just playing the game.

[@Gambit166]

Pay to win and Korean MMO is synonymous. Most veteran gamers know this. It's comes down to how egregious the P2W is.

[@dreadfiend1554]

p2w is now just as bad in western games too

[@Lexipumpkin783]

P2w has never bothered me depending on how bad the system is. Example Albion. You could pay loads of money to grind fame and gear but you can also make millions for free just by robbing and pvping. I've never even needed to swipe in Albion . But, archeage for example not only gear can break you can spend money to get the best gear in the game with no reasonable alternative. I'm taking player making 200 -1k gold a week with capped labor but someone who swipes can get ,10k gold a day or more With a system like ArcheAge if your 1 week ahead you are forever 1 week ahead. There wasn't any stopping point. Then there was the other issue of trion adding first battle pet with 3 ccs for 150usd And then nerfing the crafting mats drop rate and selling the mats on the auction house

[@therealharshlycritical]

@@dreadfiend1554 eve online is worst one by far and even that doesn't compare to Korean games. elder scrolls online isnt pay to win just has a terrible cash shop maybe wow is too with the gold system but you cant buy endgame gear off the auction house and their isnt any enchantment system you can skip with cash in any western mmo off the top of my head besides eve

[@user-im2te2fg9y]

yup.. this will be another archeage... where they ramp up the pay2win to insane ammounts, cash in on the whales and becomes a game where no one wants to play...

[@robertandrews6828]

@@Lexipumpkin783 Whales sure do love players like you.

[@BaidenFunny]

I was hyped and waiting for this game! But honestly I flushed it down in the the toilet...

[@ADesertVoice]

Sorry man but this system REALLY turns me off.

[@zagohcap]

It doesn't seem too bad from a holistic stand point. A It's just everyone's threshold they'd consider dealing with and how much they care if it's official or unofficial. I can guarantee you that every single MMO has a way to swipe for progress. Maybe not FF14? But I feel that's more of a single player story with people hanging around. There's also no real PVP.

[@SoulShiina]

@@zagohcap ff14 has story skips in its store and you can go third party for gold/levelling

[@MrsDragneel]

Man you people cry for everything play and enjoy damn game

[@ADesertVoice]

@@MrsDragneel I've played almost EVERY NCSOFT games since Lineage 1. So yeah I know who NCSOFT is and what they do. And NO, I'm about had it with NCSOFT and their crappy P2W push into the west, now that Korea has totally rejected them. If they don't reform, they need to be SHUT DOWN.

[@CyberdyneSystems435]

100% agree

[@Mutagenz]

Great Video Kanon! I played the beta and loved the world, the combat and much more. My big hang up is the upgrading. The number of systems, and mats and steps for those systems to upgrade is staggering.... They want in my pocket at every turn for a different point of progression. It feel a little like if a job, but at this job I'm paying them for the privilege of being able to work for them. In my opinion its way more complex than it should ever be. If you want my money make it fun, and make it simple please =P

[@HawkeBlackwell]

Sounds like hard copium. P2w is p2w. Stockholm hits hard. Some cant realize when they done up ny the suits.

[@Digitalgems9000]

LOOL

[@RamzaBehoulve]

You can certainly try to sugar coat it a bit, but no matter what, if paying gives any advantage over not doing it in PVP, even if it's only for a few weeks, then it is P2W. That's it, that's the definition. This probably won't go well in the West.

[@jollypolly1686]

If there's no p2w whatsoever then people who nolife and don't have a job have a disproportionate unfair advantage. So long as p2w doesn't give an advantage that one can't reasonably acquire in-game, I think that's fair.

[@SoulShiina]

@@jollypolly1686 Exactly, there are 2 wolves of MMO. Either it has P2W to get significantly farther ahead of other players. Or it has Play2Win where the people who can play 16 hours+ a day will be significantly farther ahead of other players. P2W games are passable if you can keep up with the P2W players by playing a lot, but Play2Win games always die quickly because if you can only spend 5 hours a day player while someone else is spending 16 hours, you will NEVER catch them.

[@Skyrus646]

@@jollypolly1686 and this is only fair trade off you can get in a MMO RPG and still have companys make money. Do the people complaining about p2w have any solution which still involves the company making the game make a big profit? Games are profit oriented buisness. When gacha games exists which makes millions for low effort single player content and releasing a new model with a few animations will make millions. How can a company convince their investors to invest in an MMO if it is barely going to make them money? Unless ofcourse they make it a buy to play model like FFXIV, but then again the success quite hard to match as FFXIV thrived and made a community back when MMOs were huge without the huge backing of a community that big , the b2p model will not return enough of the amount spent of development.

[@Shadowh8ter]

That's crazy cope because WoW is obscenely popular and last I checked I can buy any and everything in that game with money to gold.

[@user-im2te2fg9y]

pay2farm f2p players

[@Aruzhann]

Guild to win is the same as p2w Its obvious that guilds with archboss weapons will be full of p2w players or will have insane requirement for a f2p to join

[@higguma]

Never even heard that phrase but I know exactly what you're talking about from games I've played. Guild content getting access to better stuff and you can't get those things unless you're strong enough (mainly p2w) to get into the guild that wins those things since they're the strongest guild. It's an endless loop.

[@ZagineVideos]

If pay to win isn't a big deal then you should play the whole na launch without paying anything to prove it.

[@Raquilis]

That is just an absurd request. He can play the game how he wants to. But as someone who has played on the KR server for 3 months; The game isn't pay to Win, it's Pay for convenience.

[@ChuBerting]

@@Raquilisagreed.. the only reason you’d be behind in this game is if you started later than most. Even then, as long as you understand that fact, you’d have no issue catching up if you just be patient enough. Been playing for a month in KR and got to 4k CP on 3-4hrs of playtime per day, even had enough for cosmetics just from farming lucent as f2p.

[@Fushi-Hairui]

Word , guy has a point , play as much as u want and compete with the whales prove us then

[@pedroalgo3990]

@@Fushi-Hairui the fact that they call it pfconvenience instead of p2w and it should be called, people are dumber by the day.-

[@Raquilis]

@@ChuBerting Honestly bro. Some people have jobs and earn money. They trade that money for time and resources. Also, people forget that the gaming industry is a business. If a $100 price tag was put on this game for no cash shop, they still won't pay it.

[@Masabushi]

Im squishy to magic damage therefore p2w is not an issue

[@higguma]

😭 he's lying od

[@disanturabaikunekrecia9266]

I bursted out laughing when I read your comment SO TRUE

[@ragenk1062]

F2P will never catch up P2W in these types of games. Just as there's "trait reso" there will be "runes reso" or something like that. It's always one step forward, two steps backwards for F2P. You just gotta accept that and enjoy what's there for you, don't let them fool you. I will personally try it until I hit a wall.

[@gonzalocornejo9267]

U will catch their progress from a month in maybe 3 years xd

[@dmonkul]

Full F2P player here. Honestly, it's getting pretty disgusting watching top streamers defend the absurd amount of pay to win in this game. I feel like they must be getting paid for this. Let's break it down shall we; 1) You can play the game as a F2P player up to about 2400-2500 GS. 2) At this point, even if you have all purple gear, you now need to unlock the traits in that said gear. 3) Without unlocking traits, you are essentially missing HALF of your power 4) If you don't spend $$ on the game and buy their premium currency to trait out your gear, you will have to wait MONTHS (5+ at least) to get your gear fully traited while someone who spends $500-750 can instantly buy all the traits from AH and max out their character. 5) There is not only a paywall to progress your character past a certain point, but there is also TIMEGATE on how much you can farm a day, essentially making it so you either pay or can't compete 6) You can only put a limited amount of stuff in the Auction House to make the premium currency because of the above timegate as you can only farm for couple hours before you run out of tokens to do instanced dungeons or open world dungeons where there is a low chance of getting purple gear, which you have to get lucky to get a good trait on so that you can sell it on the AH. I could go on, but ultimately besides the gorgeous visuals and some great gameplay systems, yeah, it's extreme pay to win garbage MMO and will be dead in couple months. Already I can see that some of the achievements I got for finishing dungeons, only 1% of the play base have gotten...

[@Z0sHu]

i heard they make event in island at night in pvp u can open chests and get abysal contracts, so p2w can now dominate more. I mean lets be honest how casual player even can get in island when its pvp and zergs araund :] so its like update for whales and zergs, they will have access to to more daily dungeons :D i mean even now i am ftp 2456 cp i am getting melted in couple sec, when u enter conflict zone, its even not funny anymore D:.. well i still give a try and play this game for a while, becouse its nice, but i think not for a long time

[@greendayfan1041]

just give me a monthly sub. i dont wanna play these mental gymnastics to try and justify pay to win.

[@Shadowh8ter]

Crazy cope that you think a subscription stops companies from making their games p2w. Why would I want a monthly sub on top of my p2w when I can just have the p2w and be a f2p andy if I wanna.

[@greendayfan1041]

@@Shadowh8ter monthly sub instead of pay to win. all the mmos that have been able to make it in the western market have used this model. such as WoW, FF14, and OSRS. all the other just stick around for a year or 2 then die.

[@Shadowh8ter]

@@greendayfan1041 WoW is p2w what are you talking about lol. So is OSRS. Are you pretending that you can't just buy gold in both of these games and get whatever you want?

[@HiImRawr]

​@Shadowh8ter weeb nerds say anything to protect their new favorite p2w Asian mmo 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@cantbeseriousfr]

@@HiImRawr I could literally smell the sweat coming off his brow 💀 DESPERATE!

[@angelicspirit5938]

The more I see the more I decide not to play unfortunately.

[@liparksgaming6063]

same

[@sportschool3537]

@@liparksgaming6063 Why not? First of all, for a whale to buy endgame gear a F2P player needs to sell it to them... those Archboss weapons that sell for 100k lucent cost 2000$ worth of lucent... if you grind and get to endgame and farm ONE and sell it you can use 80k lucent (20% is tax) and buy power worth 1600$ FOR FUCKING FREE cause some psychopath decided to spend a month's salary on a fucking weapon in a video game... Sure, they'll get to endgame fast... but they can't get there by paying until some grinding players get there and start selling all that shit... they're buying it from the AUCTION HOUSE.. not the game store... until WE supply to them they can't buy jack shit... Man, my point is simple... if you REALLY like this game and wanna grind it and enjoy it then you will get your own power for free by selling power to the lazy bums that will pay you...

[@Y4nkStyle]

@@angelicspirit5938 same

[@flateric4815]

yup

[@Musashis_Finest]

Why

[@Crowjaw]

Ok i get your point......but also if you meet a p2w player playing your same weapon combo....hell kill you. If you meet groups of people that are p2w, wich this game focuses on....simple question, wich guild would win? one that has p2w people or the one thats f2p? i think we all can guess the answer.

[@podrekreinhard]

Whichever one has more hackers 😅

[@zedeco]

@@podrekreinhard that pay to win as well since most dunno how to hack and just pay for a program to do the hack

[@bryson8918]

the breakdown is ez. korean mmorpgs = p2w done.

[@abdelrahmanrad]

except TL. done.

[@skittlesindadum1625]

@@abdelrahmanrad cope more

[@nikolalefterov7472]

and NA/EU are pay to play, in both ways people that do not want to invest money in a game will struggle, thats the life mate sorry..

[@nikolalefterov7472]

You know they need to pay all the servers bills and also salaries for every person that is there for the game(software developers, designers and etc).

[@sportschool3537]

@@nikolalefterov7472 No, Western MMOs are P2W while also charging you for a subscription, Expantions, DLCs, cosmetics and "Pay for convenience", meaning more bag space etc... imagine your game being P2W (WoW) while also charging 180$ per year JUST FOR THE SUB and also charging you 60$ every time an expansion comes out... imagine that... at least this is a F2P MMO in which if you throw a few bucks every time you get a bit stuck you can progress very fast... and when I say a few bucks I mean throw literally 10-20$ every 3-6 months and the rest of your lucent you farm it from selling to the whales... Sorry, but that ain't that bad

[@brandengomez1812]

just know, ncsoft is known for implementing more p2w later into their games after launch

[@VinJow]

Yep ! People never learn.

[@beggingwhiletappingstuff1945]

its been out for quite some time now...

[@VinJow]

@@beggingwhiletappingstuff1945 Not OFFICIAL launch, use your brain please.

[@jotuthegamingguru8809]

​@@beggingwhiletappingstuff1945 oh remind me of how the global launch has already happened and the ps store is lying to me.. doofus

[@Dutchy_87]

Idc. I’ll be having fun tbh

[@Hostobi]

the two most important & impactful thing about Throne & liberty is buying gear & traits with lucent, this is what determines how strong your character can be.

[@iLuminoM]

So its a disgusting P2W, thx 👍🏻

[@mass-cp6jf]

all mmos are

[@yoink9148]

@@mass-cp6jf nahhh there are some not disgusting p2w

[@mass-cp6jf]

@@yoink9148 nope

[@Realblack_m0nster]

​@@mass-cp6jfGuild Wars 2 and classic wow are not p2w

[@vladmermi4400]

@@Realblack_m0nster GW2 is p2w too mate. Most of the items in AH are sold by gold that you can get for real money fast. There is diamond system that exchange them for ingame gold.

[@yayderenegade3806]

Hello hello, i am new to T&L, informing myself for the EU-Release. This vod is stupidly good even though i do not understand the whole gear progression 100% i have a brief overview what is p2w and what is not. Even ur roughly estimation for 1 gear to 300-400 buckets is helpfull. Definatly stayhing here vor more content. Thank u

[@Mrjvc163]

I’ve played a few mmos before. The cash shop won’t be a problem but the bots will be. It’ll be like lost ark and NW rmt.

[@WayneTwitch]

Hope you know bots make it cheaper for everyone

[@watashiwabryan3741]

"You will always be weak and strong to someone else." This made so much sense.

[@mw9771]

Soooo basically, unless you pay, fuck this game. Got it.

[@Juklax]

good to know.. canceled my pre-order. P2W garbo.

[@romangolob2279]

Bro you probably just spent $20 on wendys 10min ago and will be going back in an hour

[@ofensatul]

@@romangolob2279 yea but spending 1k usd on an archboss weapon is how many wendy's ?

[@ThePuppet001]

Roman, come on, now we know you tounge kiss your father 😂 no need to be a angry homosexual it don't suit you little fella

[@gokelis100]

New game of 2024 , Drink every time he says : p2w

[@iamjps]

i needed this, not only you discuss the p2w stuff but you also give me the tldr of how to get everything. thanks!

[@haythamelsady859]

What tldr means ?

[@iAnt414]

@@haythamelsady859 too long didn't read aka a quick run down about the topic/topics.

[@iAzwrath]

​@@haythamelsady859"Too long, didn't read"

[@WavyNavy1]

@@haythamelsady859 too long didnt read aka summary in this context

[@user-im2te2fg9y]

@@haythamelsady859 Too Long Didn't Read. its an abbreviation used mainly on reddit

[@petetam7394]

after lost ark, i will never touch another kr mmo trash again

[@greenprincess]

i wasted 9 months of my life on that shit

[@cosminmocanu5254]

@@greenprincess damn u really went in deep, i jumped out after 3 weeks

[@lorenzl8913]

​​Interesting, what did you expected to get out of it at start compared to after? that you call it "wasted time".​@@greenprincess

[@GunghoGunsGaming]

I know you are doing your best kanon to promote this game. I will be trying it out myself. However, the pay 2 win is bad here. We can’t hide from it. This game will NOT work in the west. Bc its integrity is gone.

[@romangolob2279]

They rather spend $500 a month on McDonalds than a game they play 1k+ hrs ?

[@GunghoGunsGaming]

@@romangolob2279 what’s wrong with McDonald’s ? lol and it’s about integrity. Look it up. Maybe you’ll learn something mate.

[@jeffharness5163]

@@romangolob2279 I mean if your argument is would I rather spend 500$ on food or 500$ to get a headstart on a game I think most people are choosing the food.

[@sameowtr]

@@romangolob2279 Dude, $500 is a lot of money for a game in the West. especially when fighting against games such as world of warcraft, guildwars 2, bdo and eso. I bet everything that all western players will spend 500 dollars on food and after they are full, they will go and play wow.

[@Shadowh8ter]

@@jeffharness5163 His point was people pay for excessive things they don't need in other aspects of their lives but don't consider it when playing video games. Which is true as the gamer playerbase are all sub 100 IQ and they think the gaming industry could be sustained with $60 price tags or $10 monthly subscriptions. Nothing wrong or weird about spending more money on a hobby you spend loads of time on. You don't deserve an opinion if you think you deserve thousands of hours of fun on a live service game and you have no expectation to fund it to some degree. If someone like that quits a game nothing is lost.

[@TheExyle]

Long time MMO player. I am thinking of playing T&L. I see videos telling me to get a guild immediately, or that I need to get to max level as fast as possible. Can I not just enjoy the game first? When I find a guild, will I be told what meta build(s) I have to play? Will guild sizes be maxed, or will there be stacked guilds on each server that no one can compete with?

[@nikolalefterov7472]

well if you want to enjoy the game it will be more or less solo game for you, like the MMO part will be gone, i did this way in korea and its not fun. The game is strickly oriented to a guild events, like boss fights,node wars, siege all those things in order to get some item or to have pvp you need a guild for it. Of course you can play like this and ttry find a guild a later on

[@Sephiroso.]

The main meat and potatoes of the game require a guild to do the content. And even then, a lot of that content will only be done by the top guilds (throne wars).

[@sample479]

@@TheExyle why play an MMO and not want to be social? There are plenty of video games filled with NPCs that you can become the hero of and interact with, why even bother playing a multiplayer online game?

[@TheExyle]

@sample479 oh I love being in guilds, as long as they don't tell me how and how much to play. I am an officer in guilds in 3 different MMOs. I just tend to try and figure out a servers guilds before choosing one.

[@sample479]

@@TheExyle the good news is there’s a system in T&L for easy server transfers to make this problem less. I think you get two server hops that refresh every day, but only if you use them, and will be available for the first several weeks. I agree this is a huge issue but I like the potential solutions better than problems and solutions that arise from faction vs faction. The game rewards playing with people early, so even if you don’t join a Guild asap I would try to find friends. I’m in a similar boat, probably an early adopter for my friend group and will be playing alone at launch until I find friends.

[@falcor2325]

TLDR: You can buy almost everything in the game with real money, but i promise its not P2W! If you want to be taken seriously. You need to make a video comparing time/gear of a p2w player and f2p player. Im not sure you will walk away with the same opinion. Not only that. You mentioned in the game they recently increased the gear score. It a hyper competitive PVP game that literally incentives you to buy as much as possible as fast as possible to take advantage of the gap. As the game gets older that gap is just going to get wider and wider. How in the hell do you expect f2p players to stick around if they get farmed by over geared, no life swipers? I hope im wrong, ide love a new MMO to jump into. But i don't see this game working out long term.

[@Aoewin08]

This was informative, thank. I will try it out, after all new mmos launch are always fun for me. My only turn off is seeing how the best weapons cannot be obtained really unless you are in a guild who control these Archeboss (I gotta admit I still dont understand who get the weapon loot if there is like 4 guilds tagging a boss for example). It would be nice to have alternatives, like a very long chain quest where you grind dungeons and open world stuff, bosses that would drop items (personal loot) on a % base chance, which would lead to the crafting of a strong weapon that can compete with these BiS one from Archebosses . Think GW2 legendaries grind basically. Oh well, I'll give it a go, will see how long it last. After all, I wasnt expecting to play LOA long and ended up putting 4.6k hours in, might be the same here.

[@chris2236]

From what i understand there is a alternative by crafting but it takes a long time like maybe a month or longer?? idk.

[@Aoewin08]

@@chris2236 Ah good to know. I guess I'll find out by playing, thank!

[@jw5280]

You mfs keep feeding the beast.

[@Shadowh8ter]

Buddy its never stopping.

[@NoxiousWhat]

Still trying to figure out why one would settle for number creep brain rot at this point. I don't really play it anymore these days, but what does this even have over GW2 at this stage?

[@ImaITman]

Hard counters exist in every game - that's the stupidest shit saying that because your equipment is God tier for what it is that it's ok that it wasn't earned because there's ONE hard counter. Like come on dude....

[@lisydia6332]

Lucents are just like Astral Diamonds in Neverwinter Online. There is always possibility to farm AD in Neverwinter, just as the Lucents in T&L. This mechanic has been with us since way baaack and you don't even know about it. I have spent in Neverwinter 5 years and it's not a surprise for me

[@XGraphixX]

I don't care if a game is p2w. Im f2p because i would rather play a game 100x longer than p2w players because my personal play time is where i get my enjoyment as long as the game is fun. I don't care about what other people are doing since I'm usually a PVE player anyways.

[@LeeShand]

Same

[@AngelSkies-mh4yv]

Same. Just chill and do PvE, play the game to relax and not to compete with others. I'll just keep playing and if I like the game, I know that one day I'll be strong in the game. If people can and want to P2W, its not my problem, because the way I see things is that P2W actually make the game boring for those who spend money

[@LeeShand]

@@AngelSkies-mh4yv Yeah totally agree, I just jump on when I can, I got nothing to prove to anyone!

[@cosminmocanu5254]

there are better games for PVE players. This game is PVP focused so for u to just play PVE content kind defeats the purpose of the game, no?

[@ThePuppet001]

Lol this game offers maybe 20 hours of actual pve free to play stuff before your forced to do pvp stuff for the best gear 😂

[@Sijuste0]

Any time an Asian dude tries to tell you something is not p2w just turn off the video and find another.

[@MT-jy8ip]

It sucks to see how people just hear the word the term P2W and absolutely lose their minds and disregard everything this video is about. From what you've explained and from how many other MMOs I've played, this is probably the most reasonable P2W system considering both East & West audiences. It's been not even a week since NA launch and I know several F2P people who are already nearly maxed in gear and traits playing just fine...

[@amirreza6088]

Nah fam its just p2w

[@bologna9204]

I hope all these devs know the kind of controversy they implement in their games. It's like they enjoy the turmoil and conflict it causes between people more than they enjoy the financial gain

[@zezerin9986]

Wow... that is actually more P2W then I thought it would be WTF?! Gear purchasing, Gear upgrade, Traits, then Traits Reso and the Runes system like is there something that is not P2W ?

[@sportschool3537]

Yeah, but he forgot to mention that all these purchases are being done from F2P players that list all these items... so let's say a P2W player spends 100k lucent on the shop to max everything... 80k of that (20% is tax) goes back to the F2P players... so if a 500 lucent costs 10$ then 100k lucent costs 2000$... so out of that 2000$ the 1600$ go to the F2P players to spend in game and gain power... the way he's explaining it it seems like you're buying it from the game... no... you're buying it from the Auction store... meaning you're buying it from F2P players that list their items and unneeded gear to make lucent... So in reality these people are fucking sponsoring you to help you buy your own power for free... it's essentially the same as playing Warframe... Warframe has platinum which is the premium currency and you need to pay money to get it from the game... but also there is the trade system where players trade mods and gear parts to one another for platinum... my friend, I own every fucking Prime Warframe that was made prior to 2021 that I stopped playing and I haven't paid a dime for them... why? Cause I sell any good drop I get in the game for platinum... it's that fucking simple... sell your shit to P2W morons and get free lucent to spend on yourself..

[@Denka_]

none of those items will be available on the auction house because everyone will be using them for the first month or longer lmao

[@Gleandra]

Tell me you didn't watch the video without telling me...

[@Tonytaru]

@@Denka_ This! People are so blinded by wallets. It cant be paid for if its not in the auction house and unless the developers put preplaced items into the auction house, there won't be many "extra" pieces to sell in the beginning.

[@yusufcankoroglu7760]

yes there is, you can create a character for free:D

[@aBait.]

You are forgetting about boss fragments from fishing/expedition/chests which are sellable and with the amount of players we will have across multiple servers in the same AH cluster they should be available very early. Whale should be able to easly buy them out even before we unlock actual arch bosses.

[@sameowtr]

I think the system is like this. As you said, it is actually possible for a f2p player to do anything. However, the system will constantly be strengthened with each new content and f2p players will constantly spend time catching up with p2w players in this cycle. I don't know, it doesn't look very enjoyable.

[@MrTrun4o]

Yes pretty much all KR games do exactly that. You spend your time trying to catch up and then they release next patch and you are behind again trying to catch up. BDO just released new weapons, day 1 there was KR streamer who dropped 8k $ and enhanced his weapons to max level right away. Normal players who cant drop 10k on a game will have to spend next 6 months+ trying to catch up. At least BDO have gear cap brackets for PvP so you can fight against equal players, but TnL have non of that as far as i know.

[@ReportTheHackers]

How would you suggest going about paying? Any lessons from paying into it in Korea. What would you buy and what you not buy with your lucent. Main purpose would be to save time. Work way too much to grind.

[@Sigfried2708]

the only question you need to answer is "will the pay2win affect me when I play ?"

[@flateric4815]

It will affect you in many ways, no doubt about it.

[@KeViNaNoViC]

U will get farmed by paytowin people

[@Musashis_Finest]

@@KeViNaNoViChow? Isn’t there a pve option?

[@KeViNaNoViC]

@@Musashis_Finest Might be but the main content is about pvp not sure if u have enouth content in this game with just pve .. i mean its free to play just try it

[@Lapis_James]

@@Musashis_Finest there is a pve option and it has a enough daily content for a regular player (not someone that plays for over 12 hours a day) to be happy

[@BS-pj2ww]

@KanonXO Can you please estimate the difference between players with Arch Boss weapons and those without them? 5%, 10%, 25% dps? I know it's a hard question, but just a ball-park would help.

[@Cavemanheartrock]

Looks and sounds like a typical f2p p2w system that we've had since the late 2000's, buy currency that lets you buy stuff on the AH or item shop that directly lets you get gear that boosts you. I can name off probably 20 or so mmorpg's that were f2p from late 2000's to 2020 that was just like this. MMORPG's really are in a darkage now and it's pathetic.

[@mattryan5393]

Haven't played an MMO for over a year, so i bought the early release. I am sad to say that I'm going back to gw2.

[@madmancasacreativa3]

This video just convinced me to play New World. Thanks!

[@realmach5]

Saying the trait system has no RNG to it is extremely misleading. The RNG is built into the conversions and gear farming for traits. The only time there isn't RNG is when you're using unlockstones and people should not be using those in the early stages of global.

[@TheAirak]

They better not pull another Argos on us.

[@ofensatul]

oh it's gonna happen don't worry.

[@rickk722]

Imagine an MMO that is "only endgame" from day one. You can only purchase skins with cash (like League of Legends), and you do not need to grind for anything. It's 100% skill-based, and the game devs focus only on endgame content. Man, this would be a dream.

[@vvhitevvizard_]

the main idea here is a free-to-play player can't get this items in time BEFORE the next update rolled out. That player never catches pay-to-win players.

[@iAzwrath]

I wouldn't be too sure about that.

[@Tonytaru]

That will be the key. If they balance it well it wont be so bad but they HAVE to balance between whale happiness and F2P playability. If they give F2P too much time to catch up the whales will feel like their large money purchases meant nothing and will stop spending. But if the gear progression moves too quickly so that F2P can never catch up and is constantly 1 tier behind, then the game will die because whales depend on shrimp for food. Whales dont want to fight other whales. They want to feast on the F2P when possible.

[@vvhitevvizard_]

@@Tonytaru We, regular players, ask for time between updates to be long enough to catch up. Otherwise, it should be called a plain pay to win win game.

[@SUMIRESBROADCAST]

So, just to be clear, if you want 1% more dmg with traits you will need to pay 1000$, I don't see the p2w wall, more like P2 be top dmg of the party by a hair. I see it as a "you are not enough for our p2w party" or a "you can't sit with us" kind of situation.

[@Etogg_]

in WoW we buy ARMOR with avoidance and sockets all the time for the 1% dmg increase. to play m plus you need at least 15% avoidance and its super rng to get

[@theonemvp5599]

Sounds pay to win. Lol

[@zae_llama9111]

@@theonemvp5599you get all armor in game so it’s not P2W at all. You just have to grind for the gear, at least in WoW.

[@continuepopping]

Definitely more p2w than TL

[@Etogg_]

guys stop. wow is not p2w at all

[@itslythx]

"You need at least 15% avoidance to do M+" Damn you love spreading misinformation don't you?

[@YutaBLv]

This matters a lot for world bosses because it's like participation points and any p2w guild will reap the rewards. in pvp i guess it's even and because of p2w it forms a hierarchy in guilds and gatekeeping. I feel that ftp players will enjoy the base game but will find it extremely hard to find any "good" guild

[@XeikZone]

TL is pure P2W from the roots.

[@keitaro7462]

in game currency can pe purchasable through real money but the ingame shop should not sell upgrades/equipment or anything that will enhance the characters, they should buy via auction/trade house that the players sell

[@MultiRedFan]

Yeah, I am just gonna stuck to GW2 that's not pay to win

[@BJLungLung]

Gw2 has auction house which u definitely can p2w in my opinion.

[@LiquidSens3]

Would be interesting to know the powergap between each system

[@Megaphy]

I got bamboozled into playing Lost Ark when that game came out, not falling for it again.

[@Y4nkStyle]

@@Megaphy bro, same. Content creators and their biased takes.

[@Shadowh8ter]

@@Y4nkStyle What did he say that was biased?

[@fragnugget]

I have 1400 polished crystals.. the purple ones, they are ez af to get from minibosses. Game is big P2W but its kind of alright as long as it can be admitted and accepted. I do get tired of people sayiing its not while it is... I am deep in this game and still have the brain to realize that a whale has a big advantage.

[@alinvornicu7734]

Im ok with skins in shop if they match the game (not like TERA).

[@shymigrain9338]

yeh in Tera skins gave stats very P2W this game is still very p2w they just hide it through playwalls

[@dreadfiend1554]

Its not as bad as Tera but its still not good.

[@StellaAlamarr]

They already said outfits wont have stats on them ​@@dreadfiend1554

[@scotty2344]

Lots of progression traps built into the game to increase the gap between p2w and f2p. As some would say to play "very efficiently" to catch up with the p2w players before new content widens the gap again.

[@DivineTFT]

are the early access packs worth it if you are fine to spend some money every 3-4 months(max 100$)?

[@MONSTERCRUSHER2000]

Its just for collecters, if you want the skins its worth

[@billy_cross]

Joe run to ramble on on stream without any kind of script. They’re gonna make numerous errors or runner reference things that are incorrect because that’s what happens when streamers try to explain anything.

[@riquelme121]

So basically u can p2w everything 😂 but u can get it free just will take ages and probably short after new gear will drop haha

[@bruddah_]

The cope of the century from these people. Be a NEET to catch up to them, and then get shii on when more p2w gets introduced.

[@RickSwanson-r2w]

Hi, you seem very knowledgeable and would love if you could help me with a decision between which class to play. I’m waiting for global release of game. I’ve narrowed it down to either sns/gs, gs/dagger, staff/bow, dagger/bow or staff/dagger. I mainly want to pvp but of course I will pve as I level up. Farm materials and weapons and gear so I need to also be strong for pve dps Of the combos I listed for PVE dps which one is best? Next question is in terms of 1v1 3v3 and if I want to try the bigger guild battles. Of the weapon combos I listed. Which do you think is better to 1v1 someone. Or in group scenario or more. Which combo can kill fast and stay alive well. I read that range is not as strong as melee but I seen some clips where range really does very good against people kills fast and seems to stay alive well. How would range compare to the melee gs builds if the range builds came into 1v1 or 3v3 etc against melee. Which of these weapon combos is easier to learn? Which has higher potential. And which is probably easier to go kill someone fast and pvp and pve idk.. Any advise please. Also which armor would I need and any info please. I seen tier lists and I narrowed down between those melee and range combos I mentioned. I rlly like idea of the staff and range etc. but I don’t Wana die fast and be squishy I want to be strong high damage

[@내로남불호구]

sns/gs = GOAT(tank dealer) , gs/dagger = pvp GOAT (hardcore dealer) , staff/bow = pvp,pve GOAT (safe dealer)

[@Paelmoon]

lol what a dumpster fire of a game. I swear they just re-release the same slop every few years with a different skin and paintjob.

[@colahsunclekush5187]

Sweet cant wait to play, got bored of once human after my server wipe so ready to play this.

[@Lain2-c]

That's a lot of p2w

[@AsthmaQueen]

the boss weapon stuff reminds me alot of how loot was done and server competition in lineage 2m. this seems like a toned down version of that overall, but depends on how much the boss weapons/zergs etc works for contested bosses. I think I'll give it a pass still.

[@demonmkd2332]

Everything is doable yeah just make sure this game becomes your day job... What a disapointment. 80% of the hype for this game is gone. Option 1: Make this game your day job Option 2: Swipe your card Option 3: Play causllay and get destroyed by whales who will outclass you heavily Thanks for the honest video at least. I hope this game fails so we can actually start moving towards MMOS that aren't a day job or P2w and that let you do awesome things by being good at the game not by grinding like it's my job or paying. I already have a job.

[@kamilkox8919]

Why do you want someone that plays the game more be on the same level as a person that barely plays it? It’s a purpose of MMORPG to progress your character. If you want only the skill to matter just play a different type of game like MOBA or something

[@demonmkd2332]

@@kamilkox8919 That does make sense on First thought. If you play more you should be rewarded more and therefore stronger than someone who plays less right? But think about it for a second longer. If you play for longer than me you are going to be better than me anyway because you'll be more skilled in the game than me! This way you'll actually have fun playing the game and getting better instead of just grinding like it's your day job. This benefits the player that plays more as well. Why are the top mmorpgs right now the least grindy mmorpgs? Why is wow number one? Because you don't need to make it a day job to get to a high level of gear. Same with final fantasy and guild wars 2. This is not to say that these games have no grinding whatsoever. They do but it's much less. What if mmorpgs became closer to fighting games? Think about it for a second, we'd get people Playing to get better at the game not to build power. And because it's an mmorpg we could reward the player for being good at the game with more currency and or items. I'm still going to try throne and liberty but it won't matter how good i can get if i get jumped by a bust class with full gear while I just got to purples. They'll destroy me and that won't be fun and I'll eventually stop playing. The mmorpgs players have grown up we have jobs now some of us families. We get one to 3 hours at best to play in a day and on some days there isn't any time. If the game was more skill based and i lose to you because you're better than me because you practiced and played for longer than i can't be mad at that. But if we both have to learn a simple rotation and then grind gear to make it hit as hard as it can then players like me will eventually get discouraged and leave. People like you who play more will slow down a certain period because nobody can play the same game for 5 hours every single day for years without a break or at least most people can't and a whale will kill you because you aren't on the same level as them because you aren't grinding and you'll get tired too and then the whales will be the last because whales don't swipe to kill other whales most whales swipe to kill those they are better than and then the game dies. This is why i want mmos to move away from grinding and p2w and become more about skill. People should get rewarded for being good not for playing 5 hours per day. I mean no disrespect of course and i hope that we both get to have fun in the game but my hopes are down in the dirt after i watched this video. Even if i can't keep up to experience the thrill of high stakes pvp and guild vs guild I'm glad that at least f2p players are given a fair shot to compete with whales provided they can play for a certain amount of time per day. The game is still p2w there's no question about it. The first people to whale will be in the top guilds and they will get to and control arc weapons first and the f2p people will be at their mercy in fact p2w people are playing early as well and they get to transfer their characters to the live servers so the whales are already ahead as we speak.

[@Olivian9960]

@@demonmkd2332 it is never primarily about who is the more skilled player for mmos, you lost me at 'look at why wow is #1'. WoW is literally running on a subscription model + wow tokens exist but boomers with nostalgia bias and is too scared to move on keep eating that shit (i am a boomer too). In an mmo, the more resources you put into your game and character, the superior you should become. Stop crying when there are people who literally lives in these type of games' servers and shit on you while you casually login after work for 1-2 hours a day. They earn it either by investing their time or money which brings us to the main case here: p2w. What kind of resource investment does this game require you to shit on others? Is it time? Is it money? Or something else? These are the real questions you should ask while evaluating. If you just want a learning curve and skill improvement centric environment you should turn towards competitive lobby games.

[@Lyudo]

Considering people spend thousands on gacha games 300-400 to max out a gearset (without those boss weapons) is really good. (If you decide to whale that is)

[@azraelfaust487]

gacha games are basically solo mode games, this is a PVP guild focused game, massive difference

[@TheDizzled32]

People coping so much here just because they're desperate for a new engaging mmo. Just give up guys this game is not it, it will walk the same path as Lost Ark did.

[@sportschool3537]

In Lost Ark you bought everything FROM THE STORE... here you buy it from the AUCTION HOUSE... if you don't understand the difference let me break it down for you... In this game if someone spends 1000$ to get lucent and buys things from the Auction house... the 800$ (the other 20% is tax) goes to F2P players which can in turn spend that to power up themselves and keep up with the whales... the whales will literally fund all the top F2P players that grind a lot to keep up with them for free... Which is why in Korea, the whales have been asking for more P2W for months out of NCSoft... they've been crying that they can't be the best player on the server just cause they paid which is also why the top players on KR server are F2P players that just grind a lot... Sorry but saying "everything is the same" is bullshit... get all the facts AND THEN decide if you wanna play or not...

[@unrelentingrogue5370]

Appreciate you being open about it all, thank you.

[@GravyFlavy]

I'm sceptical of the game but since its free I will try it out before making a judgment

[@m3zuss]

And then after a year they gonna implement some hard p2w mechanic. Blade and soul, aion are dead in the west because of p2w shit.

[@aldodzb]

​@@m3zuss Then I quit, happy that I had fun and play other games. Where's the problem

[@m3zuss]

@@aldodzb lmao xd

[@ofensatul]

@@aldodzb then you wasted a year :) while you could have played way better games.

[@aldodzb]

@@ofensatul nop, one day you will understand

[@tobiaswolf783]

what is the most chill effective way to play this game? I do not want to invest so much time into it or make it at least less stressful

[@내로남불호구]

Don't meet $10,000 users , $1000 users , and , you guild $10,000 users $1000 users

[@AWildRori]

was looking forward to TnL, but now, watching this, hard fucking pass.

[@TwoFiveFoe]

i miss when you see crazy gear you know they grinded for it

[@Touchin-Grass]

People hate it when you call their game p2w. Their bias is so apparent, lol. Solid video, Kanon regardless.

[@ivohage]

I would love to have more info on leveling weapons after your main combo and also leveling secondary armor sets. I would love to play 1 char with 5 weapons and the armor sets needed.

[@Vujkan]

So Kanon western version will be the same like korean i mean every fuckin stuff will be p2win?!

[@Jose-og909]

Look we all know eventually the P2W gap will grow larger and larger. First they get you hooked then 2-3 years down the line they will make it so that you have to pay to come even close. Dude this is a classic, this is how this business works.

[@higguma]

2-3 years lol, you mean 2-3 weeks. It's happening now. Market is terrible and you can't make lucent to even get stronger. And the dungeons are timegated.

[@Dc-wc2qf]

This guy is a massive shill lol, this game is the definition of p2w trash. If you don't swipe thousands you will NEVER catch up. He's already spent a few thousand dollars in early access and laughs at his viewers while swiping about how he's making it back from them.

[@higguma]

He's basically part of the marketing budget atp. Game sucks tho. I gave it a fair shake after 200 hours and several deletions. This will be the final one.

[@XT91]

Remind me if you've heard this before, "It's p2w but....." Boy do I have a bridge and video titled "This game respects your time." to sell and show you.

[@les121476]

just cancelled my preorder as well. not interested in anything remotely p2w, done with the whole upgrade system that black desert and archeage had. why cant we just simply have a good game to get immersed in and enjoy. everything now days is play this template this "meta" trash, or you cant be in the guild , guild events only blah blah maybe I'm just getting too old I miss star wars galaxies

[@내로남불호구]

i korean :) , you old , but you pay to win , lol

[@mariamkjm]

well i rather play bdo than tl at this point, at least i know in bdo there arent that much p2w players bcs it cost waaaaaaay to much and rng can always fk up whales for like 20+k and they still will get nothing or only like 1 bs weapon 😅 or maybe bcs the game is pretty old and the gap between f2p and p2w is almost non existing

[@kilua87659]

Old. Also keep in mind the game is free

[@les121476]

@@kilua87659 free or not shouldn't matter. I don't care if it's free. I don't care if I have to buy to play. I don't care if I pay a sub to play. I do care however about a level playing field. You're better than me? Grats! I'm better then you? Cool But you win because you paid more than me? Meh what game we playing next..?.....

[@Shadowh8ter]

@@les121476 That doesn't exist in modern gaming lol. Someone who plays a few hours a week because they have a job and family is far more often than not going to get absolutely obliterated in PVP and heavily outgeared in PVE by incel highschoolers who stay home and play video games all day. One guy raids once or twice a weekend with the boys and another has 12 characters and is raiding every single day on all of them generating way more gold and way more items on his account. This isn't a level playing field. Its a more level playing field when I can spend money to gain progress. A game like Warframe would be genuinely unplayable if I couldn't spend money on it to get things. Its a fantastic game. The gameplay loop is a lot of fun. I would never in a million years gain all the weapons and characters and mods if I had to play myself to get everything. Luckily they have a way for me to spend money on the game to get more things and I'm completely fine with that nor is there anything wrong with that.

[@jrocthewarlock5659]

Thank you for touching on this. Im still on the fence about this game because of P2W. Trying to find the courage to play this.

[@user-im2te2fg9y]

read up on Archeage... the same will happen here give it 5months and no one will be playing because the devs want to sell more stuff to whales

[@Asdfseh]

Thank for the video. I wll not play your game.