Karate Sensei Reacts To ITF Taekwondo Tul/Forms! Ep#2

[@frankking781]

I admire your open attitude my friend .

[@Chainedbrit]

indeed not an ounce of bias at all in anyway shape or form! ive been impressed for a few weeks bein subscribed now

[@SasquatchTX]

Third form is "Yul Gok" - its a color belt pattern, usually taught to intermediate level color belts. First was "Moon Mu" - a higher level black belt form. I believe the middle was "Yoo Sin" or "Yoo Shin" depending on how the school pronounces it, another higher level black belt form. That mae geri that was off to the side is called a "twist kick" - its one of my favorite kicks, and works very well in tournament sparring applications. Usually your opponent if they see it will think it's a standard front kick, but the angle of attack comes in from the side and its harder to block. It works well to the body or the head. Its one of the hall mark kicks that differentiate TKD and Tang Soo Do from other forms of karate, because it is not seen as often in other styles. Most of the ITF forms you will see the foundational karate patterns - those who came together under Gen. Choi to create the patterns for TKD were black belts in varied karate styles. The first form in the Chang Hon (ITF style) style of TKD called Chon Ji (sometimes written as Chun Ji) is derived from Taikyoku Shodan and Taikyoku Sandan for instance. The TKD form "Won Hyo" is VERY influenced by Heian Nidan for instance. As a TKD practitioner, its very interesting picking apart TKD patterns and finding their karate kata roots.

[@basuraeterna]

The name of the kick is Bituro-Chagui

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

I've never used a twisting kick in sparring though. How do you do that? I heard of someone who used high twisting kicks in sparring but I've never been able to do it there.

[@Hy-jg8ow]

@@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729 Good timing at the right moment?

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

@@Hy-jg8ow I guess..still don't got it though

[@kevinbihari]

@@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729 go for a dollyo to the head a few times and chamber with the knee up rather than sideways. After a few times, the guard should shift to block to one side. That is when you go to the other side. You can see it is time when he anticipates your kick. Same with yeop and Bandai with the same leg.

[@matthijsvanwijhe864]

The first tul was Moon Mu, the second Yu Shin and the 3rd Yul Gok.

[@hanbyeol12]

tfw no one does juche

[@Gabbe0611]

I can perform up to hwa rang yet im still a green belt lol

[@tjoey2112]

@@Gabbe0611 , yes brother that is very2 good. Now days we can learn all tuls from media. But if u want perfection,u can follow the colored belt seminar, the master will teach u the perfect movement. Greetings brother

[@Gabbe0611]

@@tjoey2112 the fun fact is that i get to practise those patterns whit higher belts ik my club and my masters teaching me very good anyways thanks for the tips 👍

[@Gabbe0611]

In*

[@07Fernando07]

Whoa! This was my first time watching ITF Poomsae. I've been training under WTF and I didnt know it was complete different between the two. Thank you sensei for opening that world for us to see and for being humble to talk and understand different styles. Please continue to do amazing things.

[@noahhoch668]

Not poomsae called tuls or patterns

[@07Fernando07]

@@noahhoch668 Poomsae is the term we use in Korean which means just that (FORM). Look it up :D I use Korean terms.

[@sebastianzdravlje9373]

@@07Fernando07 @Noah Hoch Both are correct. Because both ITF and WTF had particular names for their patterns. As stated WTF calls them poomsae, karate calls them kata, and ITF calls them tul.

[@07Fernando07]

@@sebastianzdravlje9373 I never meant that he was wrong, just that either way, Poomsae, Kata, or what ever else means Forms or Pattern movement, its all in the same :D

[@emmabrummer6174]

I train in the ITF style of TKD. It is strange how different they are in some areas. Sparring is very different, as ITF uses punches (to the torso and head), and I don't think WTF does.

[@loveymushtv3985]

The "diagonal kick" is "high twist kick" in Taekwon-Do, that one in particular is supposed to go to the side of your shoulder.

[@tadghc.9648]

Yes - to strike somebody standing to the side of you!

[@cychan.tkd.krt_]

And in WTF sparring, we also use it to strike the other side of the opponent’s head compared to a roundhouse kick. It’s pretty hard to see coming.

[@adoublelastname9229]

Yes. You can see a good demonstration, application, and tutorial from an ITF practicioner here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pYXCaWWXaqiVhqM

[@sirdeetoh]

@@cychan.tkd.krt_ right Bitureo chagui, in this case they do in the classic way hiting with the ball of the feet. In this case is used when you are in a very cross range in a hanbom kyerugi situation for example. In judo there is a part called atemi waza, that has something called “naname geri”, a ind of diagonal kick, technically is a low kick, but the lack of development of that part of the curriculum can make fit a kick like this in that category.

[@Waizzie]

That first “mae giri” wasn’t actually a front kick, it was a “bituro chagi” a “twisting kick”

[@GWhitetkd]

The twisting kick in this pattern is to an opponent to that is stood next to you.

[@Smalkey]

@@GWhitetkd Also useful against oponents leading with the opposite foot, so leading L vs leading R. Makes it feasible to get a headkick on this opponent at striking range

[@Dougwun]

@@GWhitetkd Canterbury TKD unite!

[@blahblah4847]

7:43 The movement is actually a measuring movement. This is because the pattern or form is practiced by green belt with blue tag students, which is the level they start breaking planks, so the movement is giving them a sense of measuring the distance of the plank before executing to get optimum results

[@michaelnurge1652]

A little bit more than 20 years ago, breaking planks was something you had to do to advance every level. I started TKD just after the WTF / ITF split, and we originally learned both forms. I didn't get beyond yellow with green tag, but I could kick through several boards, and break stuff with my hands too. I got a bit disgusted on my green belt test that I knew everything but my form was too sloppy. Also I got dq'd from a tournament because I made someone bleed from a punch to the head (it was point sparring and he was coming in so I hit harder than I'd intended...but seriously, wtf? I had been a wrestler in HS and I had to get both nostrils cauterized from too many nosebleeds from being cross-faced so many times, and one little cut...) Anyway, I was very short on time and money back then, so I stopped TKD. Got attacked on the streets a couple times and never used any fancy kicks, even though I still know them. Power-generation for strikes and kicks and balance is useful, but it isn't unique to TKD. From what I've seen recently, ITF seems to be the one that's more useful than WTF, but it still seems like TKD is still suffering from fun / flashy vs. utility.

[@stormcrow1970]

1st tul: Moon-Moo. Named after the 30th king of the Silla dynasty. 2nd tul: Yoo-Shin. Named after General Kim, Yoo Shin. 3rd tul. Yul-Gok. The pen name of the scholar Yi I who lived during the 16th century. Regarding your comment at 3:42 about the kick being to the diagonal, not to the front, the kick isn't actually a mae geri (front kick). It's called a "bituro chagi" (twisting kick). Executing it is *almost* like doing an upside down mawashi geri. In other words, the arc of the kick travels from inside to outside, instead of in a "roundhouse" kick direction. The "bituro chagi" in Moon-Moo are to the high section (head is the target) and are executed after you step so ideally you should be kicking almost over your own shoulder. In other words, the opponent starts out in front of you but you step up to him or even past him and then kick him as he's at your flank. Hard to describe so I hope you follow what I'm saying :-) Moon-Moo is very technically difficult and also requires some real athleticism to do well and the gentleman performing it did an excellent job.

[@N3onDr1v3]

I've just come from a video from a seminar on Moon Moo, and he makes a big point of the back kicks having the foot pointed down. so i noticed that the practitioner was actually doing side kicks. other than that its great

[@rolandgdean]

2:14 OmG! He punched so hard, his hand came off!! 0.0

[@thatguyontheinternet8320]

This was really fun to watch as someone who practiced ITF Taekwondo. Have you ever heard of the vietnamese martial art Vovinam? That would be interesting to react to as well.

[@bryanking1428]

Great videos, hard to believe this is from the middle of lockdowns. It's very cool when people respect and appreciate others martial arts.... they mean so much to peoples development I feel.

[@optimusmaximus9646]

Another great video, Yusuke. Great interpretation, too. Good to see you've picked up on the similarities with the Karate kata. It used to drive me nuts when people showed their ignorance about TKD. When I started ITF TKD in the late 70s, we definitely trained our hands as much as our feet (as the TKD patterns clearly demonstrate) and incorporated some throws and sweeps as they do in Karate. You have to remember, this was only a few short years after the end of the Vietnam War. The South Korean government dispatched taekwondo masters to South Vietnam to instruct soldiers in hand-to-hand combat during this time. My teacher was the all army Korean champion at the time and I learned my TKD from him. All I can say is, there was plenty of handwork in our training. These days owing to my age I tend to use judo, which I took up a number of years ago, but I can still draw on my hand strikes and kicks from TKD if I want to. As for the ITF patterns, I much prefer these over the WTF variety. The practitioner in this video shows perfect control. One thing I remember when I first learned the ITF patterns was the complete lack of the so-called sine wave which we see today. I'm not sure where it came from. It just seems to be something that people have picked over time without ever questioning its validity. Some people say it is to increase the power of the strike, but this is the wrong understanding. You cannot convert a downward force into a lateral force as there is no component of the force in that direction. Basic physics. I think the sine-wave movement is to generate more energy, but how much energy it adds is debateable. TKD is derived essentially from a combination of Karate and Korean Taekyeon, and so it is expected to have many similarities. The principles behind the techniques are the same; it’s only in the implementation of the principles where the differences are revealed. WTF TKD has more emphasis on kicks, which is what you see in the Olympics. Traditional ITF TKD, however, is a different story. If you watch the 2016 ITF World Cup, for example, you will see far more punches being thrown and hitting the target. Likewise with TKD fighters in MMA, who tend to use just as much straight out boxing and grappling. IMHO, the Olympics killed TKD the same way it killed off traditional Judo. But that's just my personal opinion and I am sure many will disagree. My apologies for the length of my comments.

[@Madheim777]

that ignorance is possibly from WT being more popular due to Olympics, so people mistake TKD relying only on kicks.

[@optimusmaximus9646]

@@Madheim777Tae kwon translates as "The Art of Hand and Foot". Karate, on the other hand simply translates as the "Art of the empty hand". 😉

[@zenseiplays]

3:43 To answer your question, the technique in that pattern (Moon-Moo) is called a twisting kick. It looks very similar to a front kick, but it twists to the side near the end of the kick. You can strike with the top of the foot or the ball of the foot, and instead of striking straight forward or upwards (as you could do with a front kick), the direction of the strike is upwards at a 45 degree angle.

[@silafuyang8675]

Amazing performance. The "mae geri" is actually a specific Korean kick, called "bituro chagi", an outward twisting kick, which is meant to kick someone who is next to you or behind you. It is an excellent counter to mawashi geri btw.

[@raven69600]

I love the fact that you pointed out the myth of us Tae Kwon do people can’t punch. It’s definitely a myth 🙏🏽

[@paulz4667]

Itf taekwondo punching is an integral component

[@barendsnyman1862]

Good day. I'm a ITF instructor for last 10 years and before that when I was young I did 7 years of shotokan. I also found it very similar but my biggest challenge was the knee position in normal forward stances. Shotokan is knee in line with toes if I remember correctly, but ITF is knee behind heel. I enjoyed your video. thanx

[@odojang]

You have an inquisitive and respectful spirit; the mark of a true martial artist. First two patterns, Moon-Moo and Yoo-Sin, are learned at 4th dan; it shows the higher level of technical standard required as you progress through the expert levels (4th to 6th dan). The third pattern is Yul-Gok for 5th grade (green belt with blue stripe) to 4th grade (blue belt). As many pointed out, the ''mae-geri'' puzzling you is in fact a high twisting kick which is used to strike a target behind you. The middle twisting kick strikes a target on the side and the low twisting kick aims at a frontal target. The downward forearm block from the double middle forearm block is in fact the main reason double blocks like this are performed instead of a standard one-arm parry; to go rapidly from one parry to another without the need to cross arms first (you can also go from a parry to a strike faster the same way). it also teaches the importance of hip motion to generate power especially when standing in place. In Yul Gok, the first motion that puzzles you is done incorrectly. It should be a slow natural rising, not this exagerated circular motion (it was done like this some thirty years ago). It is intended to help the student emphasis action-reaction motion in punching and the slow motion execution is meant to practice balance and coordination. In practical application, it is used to stop an approaching opponent at the correct distance to punch (i.e. someone coming to grab your neck); a stop-defense if you will. I had the opportunity to study those patterns extensively with their creator, General Choi hong Hi himself and teach them for thirty years while following their changes along the art's evolution. That's where I myself got answers of those same questions back then, from the horse's mouth so to speak ;)

[@EmmanuelReyes]

Correction Yoo-Sin is for 3rd Dan

[@odojang]

@@EmmanuelReyes Correct 1st dan you learn: Kwang-Gae, Po-Eun, Gae-Baek for 2nd dan exam 2nd dan you learn: Choong-Jang, Eui-Am, Ju-Che (or Ko-Dang for some groups as of old) for 3rd dan exam 3rd dan you learn: Sam-Il, Choi-Yong, Yoo-Sin for 4th dan exam 4th dan you learn: Ul-Ji, Yong-Gae, Moon-Moo for 5th dan exam 5th dan you learn: So-San, Se-Jong for 6th dan exam 6th dan you learn; Tong-Il for 7th dan exam I should not post at 3 am ;)

[@robertboer3026]

Thanks for the engaging and respectful tone of your videos. In ITF our first tenet is Courtesy. You understand that ;-)

[@markandoyo2204]

Fun Facts; Late General Choi Hong Hi as an International Taekwon-Do (ITF) owner and its known Father of Taekwon-do were cannot denied by the World TaeKwonDo Federation (WTF) he is the original TKD one although many WTF 9 head of Kwans already revised the claims that they found the TKD names enough to deny Choi Hong Hei under their explicit political circulations

[@rafaelsantiago5079]

The kick that appears to be a front kick but goes slightly to the side is very common in ITF Taekwondo, twist kick. Very visible in form Ge Baek.

[@bet7733]

Your analysis is just amazing and instructive, thank you!

[@johnhynson1940]

ITF forms were name after events and people. Because General Choi was a history person so he named his kata forms by famous people. ITF forms modified the traditional kwan forms

[@VLADIMIR007ISH]

Taekwn-do ITF is very similar to karate Shotokan I gess, due to the general Choi Hong Hi practiced Karate when he studied in Japan.

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

Yep, that and Taekkyon.

[@anas-432]

It’s very satisfying watching a master do his thing.

[@Artahe]

08:03 This reminds me of Shito-ryu kata. Look up Tomari Bassai, it's at the beginning-ish of the kata.

[@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv]

Sensei when you look back at the first pattern performed here you'll notice something a little unusual. Near to the end of the pattern the side kicks are performed with the ball of the foot, this is a variation of the regular side kick where you normally use the edge of the foot. Also a little known fact about ITF taekwon do is that our front snap kicks are always performed middle or low. We never kick a high target with a front snap kick. The only way we would hit a high target with a front kick is if we do a flying or jumping front snap kick.

[@ralfhtg1056]

Simply logical. One simple rule: never kick higher than what your opponent can grab. And i like the fact that this is taken into consideration in ITF Tkd.

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

@@ralfhtg1056 No, that's not the reason. That particular kick, ap chagi, front kick loses effectiveness as a smashing tool if it's directed higher than your own solar plexus. It simply planes a target and cannot punch through it. If you try hitting something higher than your own solar plexus with that it will skim the target and do no damage.

[@ralfhtg1056]

@@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729 thx for the explanation. But this doesn't mean my point would be invalid.

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

@@ralfhtg1056 I don't know. We do lots of high kicks. In sparring and in self defense. What I'm saying the primary motivation for that particular kick being the way it is is that it doesn't work as a sky high attack. But, none of the kicks do really. Sky high stuff is just for show.

[@ralfhtg1056]

@@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729 just what i meant. it is a nice means to keep your body trained and stretched. And i do not say that kicks to the head do not work. It is just way more likely to get countered when kicking higher then what your oponent can grab. He/she can use this to throw you and or just for a groin shot. And i wouldn't want either of that.

[@karmaaina]

At 3:45 Twist kick, it goes the opposite direction of a diagonal kick. One comment said it's intended to the shoulder, but I find it effective to the side of the face.

[@hmuphilly9129]

3:40 crescent kick also known as sneaky lol

[@0352usmc1]

Excellent video Sensei. I trained in ITF taekwondo in the past so it was nice to the see the comparison with the root art Taekwondo came from. You should also do one on Tang soo do. I believe their forms look even closer to Shotokan forms

[@leelee8662]

Very nice analysis! You pointed out many things I would have missed. Ty

[@Liquidcadmus]

That diagonal kick is a Gyaku Mawashi Geri, in ITF it's in a lot of patterns once you reach black belt. the Korean name is Bituro Chagy (Twist kick). The slow motion with the fist closed can be to measure the distance (aesthetic purposes) or as a slow motion horizontal hammerfist. By the way, the most difficult teul for most is "Juche" (2 Dan form), you should ask them to show it to you.

[@Hy-jg8ow]

Wow, thanks for these, I love ITF TKD, and Karate too, subscribed! I find the sine-wave (up and down motion) helps with timing and gives a sense of power behind the technique.

[@emmabrummer6174]

In my dojang, that is what the instructors have explained. If you include sine-wave (both down-up-down, and side to side) it adds power to your movements and techniques. You can turn your hips or shoulders more to put more power in that way, as well as helping with balance.

[@michalischristofi1273]

Indeed, sine wave is very useful. The up and down movement adds a lot of power to the strikes and blocks and makes self defence more effective. For example in won-hyo first two movements, if you put sine wave to the inward strike to the neck, you can cut neck arteries and stop blood circulation which causes even death.

[@jackbutler3432]

at 3:27 (ish) there's a reverse turning kick that he just flat stops directly behind him that's a thing of beauty

[@danielhaire6677]

An interesting lineage of the ITF forms that shows the link to Karate, particularly Shotokan is this: The original forms practiced by Tae Kwon Do after Gen. Choi gathered the 9 Kwons (school or halls) following the Japanese occupation were brought to Tae Kwon Do by the Chang Moo Kwon. Chang Moo was one of the most influenced by Shotokan and their forms were modified Shotokan Katas. These forms still used by the ITF were the Ch'ang Hon Forms (or tuls). Ch'ang Hon Tuls were the first developed specifically for Tae Kwon Do to showcase its own specific philosophies, but still had their roots in the Chang Moo influence with minor supplementary influence from Goju Ryu and Shorin Ryu.

[@elaineli6700]

That's my Taekwon-Do sister school! They are amazing! 😁

[@silafuyang8675]

I good school1

[@suchasin]

i like your open mind and respect for other arts

[@PETURK]

that unfamiliar kick at 3:41 is found in all the korean kicking arts and is not consedered a "mae geri" but goes by names usually including the word pit (pit chagui, pitureo chagui (chagui meaning kick in korean and pit referring to a serpent)). It is therefor a "serpent kick" that instead of coming directly form one direction, crosses the center line and enters from an opposite side (if that makes sense)..It can be difficult to block, you think it´s one thing but it becomes another thing, deceptive like a snake: You should try it ;-) And the "low kick at 3:54 is probably a sweep (countering a roundhouse kick or such ), and the "low" kick at 3:58 is a stop kick o stop the opponent from lifting his leg, then followed by a side kick. ;-)

[@simonbyatt1264]

Sir, very interesting video and nice to see the respect you are paying to another martial art.

[@patoguzman4275]

3:48 its callled "bituro chagui" or twisting kick

[@emmabrummer6174]

I'm sure some others have noted this, but as Yul-Gok is the tul I am currently learning, I wanted to share my knowledge. The movement he noted Shotokan does not have, at around 8:10 or so, it a hooking block. It is designed to catch or divert a punch. It is fun to use in step-sparring!

[@Smokie1306]

This Channel is a Goldmine , ありがとうございました !!

[@sadbuttrue183]

From what I have seen, most ITF practitioners don't move their back leg between moves. In this video I think it might be because of the size of the room they're in not allowing a lot of moves sideways

[@andrewkuan5226]

That is correct. The back leg should not move. I also suspect he was compensating for the small space.

[@davildos]

Good how you appreciate all good stuff from every disciplines

[@tlewisAK]

The kick that goes to the side is called a twisting kick. It can be performed low (inside the thigh just above the knee), middle (opponent is in front of and to the side), and high (the person is behind your shoulder). In this pattern. It’s a middle twisting kick.

[@joumasepoes88]

I am a Shotokan karateka of over 3 decades. I have also trained in Taekwondo and Matsubayashi Shorin Ryu. The sine wave movements are for generating power using gravity for momentum

[@tm114paul]

Is it able to adapt or apply into another style???

[@Hy-jg8ow]

Also it helps with forming a sense of timing. I love it.

[@joumasepoes88]

@@tm114paul okinawan styles have their own way of producing power. It's called koshi, or hip twist. It actually begins in the feet and transfers an insane amount of kinetic energy and ridiculous speed out through the hands.

[@tm114paul]

@@joumasepoes88 You did get me wrong half of them. From the beginning, I was training WT TKD when I was in Jr High for a couple years. I just started training Gojuryu Karate a half year ago and stuck on the way of generating power with hip (Tsuki). Another one was "Gedan Barai" in wrong way (because of focusing on shoulder too much + affect from TKD punching). The question "Is it able to adapt or apply into another style???" meant about can SINE-WAVE apply or adapt into WT style or not.

[@joumasepoes88]

@@tm114paul no it cannot because goju has a distinct ugoki or type of movements that distinguish it from other styles. Adding sine wave to a Japanese or okinawan style would take these distinctions away and cause a rift in the space time continuum destroying the entire universe

[@taekwon-tobi2404]

3:41 that kick is called biteureo chagi or bituro chagi. Of course in TKD you don't have as much hand and armwork as in Kung Fu but its about 70% kicking and 30% punching. I think in ITF its a bit more punching because in Competitions you are even allowed to punch to the head.

[@georgemckelvey2850]

I commented a few months ago, asking if you could review Yu Shin, because imho, it's one of the most Shotakan like forms in ITF, and you did it. Thank you Sensei! And your analysis is spot on. Also enjoyed seeing Yul Gok, although my school's interpretation is a bit different.

[@praetorian11]

Love the kicks taekwondo has, and the seemingly easy way they kick in general. But what I cannot get used to is the high-low they have in kata. Not wrong ofcourse, but different than karate.

[@tjl4688]

That motion (sine wave) was introduced in the 1980s. It's not meant to be so exaggerated, it was brought into be more relaxed and generate power more like a boxer. It's quite offputting to watch, though, agreed.

[@davidbarnwell_virtual_clas6729]

Sine wave...I love it. It's the only motion I know

[@Hy-jg8ow]

Sine wave helps with timing and gives a sense of power behind the technique. Check out Donato Nardizzi's channel here on youtube for a full explanation.

[@MishtahPoog]

Not all ITF styles use the sine-wave ("high-low") method. In contrast, some others make it really exaggerated.

[@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv]

@@MishtahPoog Hi MishtahPoog this exaggeration has come about due to competitions where the participants want to impress the judges or onlookers. Real sine wave is more subtle.

[@manorueda]

Simply awesome 👍 I liked a lot, both their execution and your comments.

[@stevecastro1325]

@3:43 and 3:47; I believe that is a “peet chagi”, sometimes called an inverted roundhouse.

[@Titan500J]

Live your videos. There is a difference between ITF and WTF. I'm in Im ITF and love watch Karate video's. Best

[@jonathanrobinson9208]

The kick you were inquiring about we call it a "inverted round house kick" ( American terminology) and is used to attack the head by traveling between the opponents guard, and can be executed with the ball, instep, blade edge or heel. Usually done with the lead leg, but it can be executed with the rear leg as well. On a side note check out the older Pal-Gue forms on KZbin ,you'll find a number of similarities the Heian Kata also. ❤

[@th3ninja327]

I love seeing this form performed

[@jerosa07]

That front kick in diagonal fashion is called a twisting kick!! It's very useful since it can sneak in through blocks! Specially the mid section one.

[@cgorino8717]

Nice analysis and great attitude, acceptance vs. criticism.

[@davidruizdiaz5217]

Min 3:50: it’s call bituro chagi, it’s a reverse kick to strike at a back oponet, in this case.

[@jacobvillavicencio9272]

Soft floor helps the heel stabilize as it acts as a center or root as you turn with your feet in the air

[@briang53]

Moon Mu, Yu shin & Yul Gok That Kick you where asking about was a twist Kick for kicking someone next to you or behind you.

[@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv]

Sensei in the last pattern (called Yul Gok) you were curious about the opening movement? That very first movement is a 'measure up' with the extended arm before the punch is delivered.

[@Thandius]

Fascinated by seeing another view on the forms! I study both ITF and Kuki style (WT) Taekwondo I would love to see your thoughts on some of the forms from Kuki (WT) style as well!!

[@tm114paul]

May I ask about what is different between ITF & WT style??? (Regardless ITF SINE-WAVE)

[@Thandius]

@@tm114paul Short unpopular, but honest answer? Politics aside from that, the forms taught are different And the sparring is slightly different in that Kuki Style (WT) uses Hogu (Chest protectors) which lets you kick harder in sparring with less risk of injury. And no punches to the head so there is less risk of actual injury in sparring. This is so to conform to the WT tournament rules to allow TKD to be in the Olympics, however Kuki style TKD does have punches to the head as well as elbow strikes etc, they are taught in the forms and self defense. ITF does not use Hogu so sparring has to be more controlled, but does allow hand techniques to the head. Aside from that the only other differences are small things such as chambers for certain blocks etc. But for the most part the core techniques are the same (ignoring sine wave) A lot of people claim that Kuki Style TKD is just a sport and not a martial art because of the WT tournament rules set but ignore the fact that it does teach the techniques. BUT just like any other style, it is indeed a martial art that has sport aspects for tournaments due to safety.

[@tm114paul]

@@Thandius Because Mine is WT style plus just for sport (eventhough they claimed TKD as Martial Art or Self-Defense Art) not for Practical also there's only one ITF Dojang in my country. I have no interest in sport from the beginning but practical self-defense & physical training. In that case, are WT style's basic & core techs the same as ITF (as what GEN Choi taught)???? Moreover, does WT Poomsae still useful (especially about Taeguek)? PS - I think not just Politics but there's another too.

[@Thandius]

@@tm114paul the Kuki / WT Forms (Poomsae) are just as useful as the ITF Forms (Tul) If someone who doesn't know the forms watched both Poomsae and Tul, if done without sine wave most people would not be able to tell the difference between a Kuki style form and an ITF form. They both have kicks, punches, elbows, blocks etc. This is true of the Taeguks, as well as the black belt forms such as Koryo and Keumgang. "Because Mine is WT style plus just for sport " do you mean your Dojang only teaches for WT tournaments? if so that is your dojang being sport oriented and does not reflect all WT/Kuki schools. My WT Dojang teaches self defense with WT as well as training for tournaments. So it depends on the Dojang, but that is also true of ITF schools there are some that train for self defense only, some that train for tournaments only, and some that train for both.

[@tm114paul]

@@Thandius That's long story.... I had been practised TKD for couple years in 1997 and quitted at BlueBelt. I just want to go back and practise once again. However, most of Dojangs just have the Kids till High-school students but the upper age (College students & older) are very rare (exclude Sport competitors). Moreover, the curriculum & system still emphasis in Sport not Practical. Therefore, I still haven't found suitable Dojang yet. PS - Only one ITF school is at the sub-urban area, that's too far.

[@jerosa07]

The second tul/form was Yoo-Sin (3rd Dan) and the last one was Yul-Gok (green belt with blue stripe)

[@west-Co_exploration]

The kick that you inquired about that looks like a front kick but veers off to the side is called (not sure on spelling) op-cha-gi... It is designed to follow the contours of the body up under the arm and then snap into the face, as if you threw a front kick that missed

[@justineandrewsilvia1206]

Taekwondo is the Korean Karate and I really admire their kicks.

[@KarateDojowaKu]

Quiz: Which karate kata did you see in the taekwondo forms? (Let's see who can discover the most!!!)

[@Buzzard061]

3:45 mai geri aiming to temple

[@Buzzard061]

7:59 hand movement similar to Seiunchin kata

[@YONGMOOKWAN]

The second Tul seems to be influenced by Bassai Dai.

[@Wombo_combo75874]

Patterns were Moon Moo, Yoo Sin, and Yul Guk. The slow punch in the last one is supposed to be a measurement for a punch, that slow movement and breath we call natural motion. We use measurements to teach beginners proper distancing with their punches. Good analysis. It was good how you caught the heel movement at the end and the linear vs sinewave motion, biggest difference between the two styles.

[@Johnny1angry1Johnny]

As I progressed in TKD I saw it take on things from many styles, it was only during the color belts and WTF tournaments that I saw the obsession of flashy kicks and the lack of punching. Once you reach black belts and the Dan's beyond it starts to have palm strikes, leopard palms, open hand neck strikes and my favorite spear hand strikes. There is also a lot of low kicks in practical TKD vs Tournament TKD. Another aspect not really pronounced at lower belts is "cut blocking" or using your blocks with such vigorous snap that they injure the attacker. I have studied a few styles of Karate, some styles of Traditional Chinese Martial Arts and 3 style of TKD (WTF, ITF, ATF) and many of the Katas overlap as do the moves.

[@stevenedmund5680]

0:45 was pretty impressive with the slow turn at the end ...the beginning rest was easy because it's similar to Tai Chi

[@bthomas1097]

Great video! I would love to see a WTF version of you sparring and observing forms 'kata'. TKD forms are a practice of facing several opponents. Great videos!!!!

[@buckaroobonsi555]

I was taught that the up and down movement allows one to pre-load the muscles to explode with power and we redirect that power to what ever part of the body we are striking with. If you are also moving forward the vertical motion and the horizontal combine to make more power than if one is rooted to the Earth. The down side of course is that if someone is able to strike you with the right rhythm and timing you are less stable than someone that is well rooted like in Shotokan. So then mobility and speed are all you have to counter. This is why being aggressive is so important to the proper use of TKD if you fail to be aggressive it gives other martial arts plenty of opportunities to shut down the strengths of proper TKD and turn those strengths into weakness to be exploited. This is why the McDojo types that pander to little kids and Mom's with "TKD is only for self defense" types set people up to fail since they discourage aggressive use of TKD. The second you know talking and fleeing are not options and it is time to use TKD you need to be proactive not reactive if you want to win with TKD. The soft flexible stances in TKD make this clear. To add insult to injury the WTF does not teach or train their students to use their arms at all in fighting in a real life encounter if you are not aggressive with TKD and using your kicks to keep the attacker away from you untrained people will always close the distance to grab you or punch you. The time to learn to use your hands in a fight is not in a fight. Look at all the rights in the USA this last year. Look at all the people pulled out of their cars and beaten to death. Look at all the cases were white people and Asian people have been attacked at random on a bus, at a store, out just walking for no reason in the USA this last 16 months especially. The official news almost never covers it for obvious political reasons. In these situations it is almost impossible to set up and get a kick off. You need balance in ones defense and offensive and your entire body must be a weapon not just your legs! You need self defense skills as well! these things have been forgotten. The USA is not as safe, polite and socially well behaved as Japan is.

[@Mako7eyes]

In relation to the mai giri not being to the front, i believe that is a twist kick (coming from a WTF perspective). It was not used very often when i was training but was interesting for 1 step and demonstration during gradings

[@danskarate997]

The diagonal mae geri looked like a twist kick, top of foot used like a mawash but going from inside to outside.

[@hanzorro1544]

3:45 this kick is called "Twist Kick" ITF TKD borrowed it from "Taek Kyeon" It's meant to be used to kick the side of the head.

[@luisjnieves-gonzalez7181]

Those are great forms from great practitioners!!!

[@jm7578]

The twisting kick is called a Peet Chagi in Tang Soo Do. It looks like a diagonal forward kick.

[@mattd6638]

This was so cool!

[@karmaaina]

At 9:00 ... ITF Taekwondo uses a technique called Sine Wave which utilizes an up and down motion between moves. The weight drops into the strike. Not all ITF style schools use it, but most do. Kukkiwon taekwondo doesn't use this method.

[@RoyalFizzbin]

I am not a fan of the linear arm movements in TKD, but this demonstrator had absolutely excellent technique.

[@richariot8325]

I want to learn this form so badly. Looks Badass.

[@doico]

Thank you for yours videos, maybe you make a video performing the 2nd tul in shotokan style, after all, there is a lot off similarites.

[@TheKeef98]

Moon moo is the only pattern when you kick a yop chagi (side kick) at 1st slow and after that fast. You can watch Jarosław Suska performance with that patterns because they are perfect.

[@raymondbaughn2260]

As a taekwondo student and a previous karate student I have to admit there is several similar patterns. The 3rd pattern is yul-gok and is a mid way pattern towards black there are 24 patterns representing 24hrs of the day there is a 25th pattern but its not a official pattern

[@mituc]

Quite similar to Shotokan in a lot of aspects. The only major difference IMHO is the way they use the dropping movement to anchor and transfer power from the ground to the punch while in Shotokan (and Karate in general) we have a more liniar movement and we anchor in the ground differently by grabbing the ground with the feet rather than dropping into it (which also works, maybe not as efficient but good enough to make the punches strong).

[@anonimoanonimo1354]

excelente forma. Otra similar es Juche Tul.

[@thewhinjaninja3610]

3:47 - It's a kick aimed to the head. You flick the ball of your foot outward. It's a very technical and very difficult kick. You have to be super flexible.

[@jadenclemow]

I'm a 1st gup in TaeKwon do so the only pattern (as my club calls them) I know is Yul gok. In Yul gok the measure up with a closed fist is futher away than the actual two punches you do. This is because the measure up is done in line with your shoulder while the two other punches are supposed to be directly down your center line.

[@ForeverHeavyMetal00]

moon moo 4th dan / yoo-sin 3th dan / yul-gok 5th gup green belt with blue points.

[@mattwittman450]

That looks like a very difficult form with all the slow controlled leg movements. Much respect to this man.

[@MarginalSC]

Situps and leg strength helps, but the extension's not terribly difficult. It's mainly about locking it in with the hip. Always felt the full speed reverse turning kick was much more difficult than then slow version. Rather difficult to stop it.

[@martinzavaleta658]

Hi .i just start follow you.. hope to learn as much is posible karate and english too. .. hugs to you

[@frankietricarico6900]

The reason for the fist being closed is, it makes the forearm stronger then open. That’s what I was told by my master many years ago.

[@moominpic]

The open handed "interesting" movement in the third tul is golcho magki- hooking block, and is a kind of knifehand block converting to a grab.

[@davildos]

This is great for condition

[@ivergonzales8349]

That part where a snap kick is diagonal is called a twist kick

[@maddmann]

These are the forms I grew up on 1979 to 92 ish moon moon was my last one I knew upnto

[@DavidAkubardiya-i8l]

This tul is called moon moo a 4th degree black belt pattern

[@minifig_studios]

The third form that is called “Yul Gok” and I am going to be performing it in my first competition in a couple of days

[@adamgebara9244]

on the 3rd tul he did the one I'm learning that's the blue strip tul in my class its name is joong gun i think

[@gustavopalacios133]

the three tuls had a lot of karate movements, kicks and punches, they are just prepared or executed in different ways, but they are as effective as shotokan karate and are very powerful and effective way of fighting. very interesting. I saw hein godan, heian sandan and some jion kata movemenst.

[@disharijana3957]

The 2nd tul was the mixture of shotokan katas.... omg

[@tattooartist22]

on Mae-geri, he kicks crookedly, so the kick enters the opposite side of the face than a mawashi-geri for example, using the instep instead of the tip!

[@FeldyMohrisar]

Hwoarang make me do taekwondo, but sadly no more ITF on that time.