Kevin Smith & Ralph Garman debate Dark Knight Rises - Fatman On Batman Episode 12

[@andrewlawless9796]

i havent heard this for like 10 years+, thank you for uploading

[@satarez5151]

lol, same.

[@valkprince]

I've been looking for this for years, thank you so much for uploading this!

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

I need a little time, but soon, I will be uploading more

[@nolanl3343]

I used to watch this one in particular almost every night years and years ago when it was on KZbin, thanks so much for bringing it back.

[@anthonydematteo4686]

Thank you. I couldn't find this for years. Its so great.

[@jeremylawson6648]

“i’m not goin… ah fuck it im goin” 😂

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

I used to listen to this stuff all the time, and it would help me get through the day. "Your parents fucking died Bruce. Right in front of you."

[@thesundayseshlads]

OH MY GOD IVE BEEN LOOKING FOR THIS FOR YEARS THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

[@wallywest2038]

The app Podbean has all of them on there for free

[@gorkmusic]

Ralph is right about literally everything. It's so nice to hear it laid out beautifully.

[@musicisfree91]

I agree with everything Ralph says, but I still like the movie.

[@allenu]

Oh man, this is a classic. I've listened to it a bunch of times before, so I'm glad it's back up somewhere.

[@Solidftz]

My hero. I heard this when it was released & I've revisited it every few months for years now. Nothing brings my heart joy more than "Don't worry about it Batman, I got it over here OHHHHHH!"

[@streetlawyer]

Same. Plus it makes me want to revisit my favourite film😊

[@wallywest2038]

I said eh Batman ova der eh come ere sit down ova here OHH over der

[@davidholguin2532]

16:13 "Onetime I took pills Bruce...a lot of them!" 😅

[@mychalmallen5434]

Thank you for posting these!

[@wallywest2038]

I’ve met Kevin. He is a wonderful great man

[@briangilbert8733]

I REALLY thought that kid that Rachel was holding in The Narrows in Batman Begins was going to turn out to be the grown-up John Blake in DKR.

[@christopherducati]

I remember listening to this back in 2012 good times

[@cuneorama]

Man, i wish kevin and ralph would turn their podcast into just talking like this and drop every tired recurring bit on babble on. I loved this conversation.

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

Absolutely man. When Kev sits down on a podcast and talks nerd culture, it's great. When he's in front of an audience, it feels like he's trying to sell you something.

[@uncharted9097]

Ralph is right Bruce becomes Batman because his parents were killed in front of him….he takes eight years off for a girl that wasn’t his girlfriend great movie but wow

[@savvydev]

Batman stopped being batman because there wasn't any crime happening in Gotham. Dent Act put an end to major crimes. There's even a line regarding this when Gordon says something to Blake when he informs him of senator missing. And as soon as Bane is there in stock market Batman comes right away. So their point has no value.

[@uncharted9097]

@@savvydev Batman does not and will not quit, I’ll give you the whole he got his back broken I mean he can’t fight crime but Batman will go to the grave fighting because of his commitment to fight crime in his city 8 years off is a hard idea to get behind but the movie will still amazing in every way

[@craighicksartwork]

It's far from great.

[@Chrismw81]

Yeah, Nolan missed the mark big time. The story should have been rearranged. Batman takes time off AFTER Bane injures him. Then goes to that prison (remnant of League of Shadows) to rebuild himself. Batman doesn't just retire because he's depressed.... He's ALWAYS depressed!!

[@hellion7514]

I thought Bruce retired Batman because Batman took the blame for Two-Face’s killing spree (and killing Harvey), but DKR never referenced this 🤷‍♂️

[@blunderwomanthemyscira6224]

So glad to see this on KZbin again!!!

[@jimmysaloka7030]

Former Hollywood Babble Brother Ralph. They don't do it anymore.

[@willie1886]

They still do it but not often because they are very busy especially Kevin but they still do Hollywood Babble On

[@theianprender-cast3863]

I’m going to download this and store it away so I can listen to it whenever I want. I’ve wanted to re-live it many times over the past 10-odd years.

[@spearofconquest]

"What the fuck are doing put the cape back on?!" lmao

[@SomeOne-ce1gf]

I have been looking for this.....for years...

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

Your search is over

[@wallywest2038]

The app Podbean has all the episodes for free

[@frazmayne4139]

I've tried to find this again on and off for fucking years!!! Hell yea

[@budgethornet7498]

One of my faves! I got into Kevin in late 2012 when I moved countries. This stuff kept me laughing in a stressful time!

[@AAllen-br8it]

Many of his opinions are on target, but it also seems like he didnt take in certain details of the plot correctly. For example, the Dark Knight makes it explicitly known that Batman has spent the time in between movies cleaning up whats left of the mob and their peripheral activities.

[@montero863]

Hey man thank you so much for uploading this, I used to listen to this and the man of steel episode all the time I have a quick question though do you have the episode where ralph and Kevin talk about avengers age of ultron? I love that episode, too, and used to listen to it all the time

[@rogueprince1341]

And this is why Kevin should bring back Fatman on Batman and rename the other show SmodNews or something like that but bring back the true Fatman show even though kev isnt Fatman anymore.

[@michaeld1889]

Agreed. I miss this format for the show. It used to be a must listen. I think, back in the day, I got into it around episode 10, but I would relisten to it over and over. So so many great interviews, and I loved the commentary tracks too. When they switched to news only, I fell off entirely.

[@avace917]

I live 10 miles north of the World Trade Center and I could smell it up here

[@mrdamian1616]

The animated movie, Batman Gotham Knight is supposed to bridge the gap between BB and TDK. So there is time and action between the two movies.

[@sloppnbiscuiitz]

..

[@natturner534]

Thank you for this, been trying to find it for years. This ep made me fall in love with long form content 👍🏿

[@JasonOrtiz-ye1do]

@2:52 ...yes it does Ralph. Yes it does 😢

[@TheProphessionalGeek]

Goat upload.

[@robertjackson9005]

25:25-26:15 😂😂😂

[@multiversegeekman6349]

I'm so glad after years of people kissing the a of rises someone sees it as what it is a good film but a terrible batman film, as Batman is about the mission...

[@BraxtonWages]

I was hoping that Joesph Gordon Levitt was the kid in the Narrows from Begins.

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

Sadly, that was Joffrey from Game of Thrones

[@cgdimension]

i always got the feeling Nolan (Chris) wasn't totally invested in this one, probably just wanted to get it out of the way, maybe wanted to leave it on the dark knight which ended kind of open ended much like older batman films, not really setting up a sequel the way that batman begins did

[@cmdr.cannoli]

1:04:08 sums up TDKR’s problems perfectly

[@JasonTCollins75]

Is there a "discussion" followup on The Batman? I feel like the it could be the batman movie they were talking about seeing "one day" at the end of this podcast!

[@matterstoyou2970]

Never connected with BANE easiest villain to beat if you can take out his mask/venom. Yes; the character is an obvious challenge and has a fun mythos which is undeniable but he was still never one of Bat’s rogues I dug personally. Always know eventually somehow whether due to Bats or a cohort of the dark knights BANE’s mask will be negated, guess that’s why expectations were subverted at the finale and Selina just shoots BANE point blank which I’d argue neuters the character making the ferocity he achieved a “punchline” (pun intended) for Selina and her gifted Bat pod in the 3rd act nothing more. Easily stoppable opponent and Selina proved it.

[@andrewterleckyj7518]

I know my opinion means little if anything, but as a big fan of the series who admits TDKR is the most flawed film of the trilogy, I inexplicably felt compelled to contribute two points to the void of internet discourse: Batman Begins clearly establishes Batman as an extreme solution to an extreme problem of corruption in Gotham. If Gordon, Batman, and the Dent Act managed to eradicate most of the city’s major crime, I don’t think it’s illogical for Bruce to retire the vigilante approach and hand the reigns back to the system so it can learn to function again without a caped crusader. And as for the convoluted revenge plot, yes: there are perhaps too many complicated steps to justify the plan. However, I’m surprised the poetic nature of the plot was not brought into the conversation. She wants it to be Bruce’s device of Gotham’s salvation that brings the city to ruin. The Wayne family’s legacy of saving Gotham - first with the train and now with the renewable energy source - is what she wants to dismantle. So there is, I think, a reason for not “going to Afghanistan” to build a nuclear bomb. She wants the city to die by his own hands. Is that irony worth the labor/time intensive hurdles? Maybe not. But to say it’s the worst revenge plot ever written seems extreme to me haha Maybe I’m missing something, but those are just a couple thoughts.

[@George-de6hd]

I look at Batman begins and dark knight as one movie cut in half (like kill bill 1 &2 ) and it’s a masterpiece……and then there’s dark knight rises ….black sheep

[@Jakehatred666]

Joseph Gordon Levitt shouldve played Terry Mcguiness instead of pseudo Robin.

[@TheShockVox]

Bookmark 26:49

[@georgen5882]

I get where this guy is coming from, but it’s hard to take anything he says seriously right after he talks about Batman only being Batman twice in the beginning of this. Are people’s memories that bad, or are they just not paying attention? Obviously the movies highlight big events, but they also took the time to show a scene about a drug deal where the guy says “I don’t like it tonight” after he sees the bar signal in the sky. They established he’s out there and going after people nightly. “He’s only Batman twice” is a massive understatement and complete mischaracterization. I just can’t tell if people missed these scenes or don’t understand how the story was told at times. Movies focused on small time criminals would be boring as hell. They have to do the big sets and action sequences. But he’s there, all the time, and they show you in the movies. I’m honestly not sure how what’s supposed to be an avid moviegoer missed that.

[@avace917]

The 8 year thing was based on Batman retiring for 10 years in The Dark Knight Returns. Dunno why Smith didn't tell him that

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

They reference that, but they both agree that the reason why he hangs it up for 8 years was not nearly as good as the reason in DKR

[@avace917]

@@renaissancemanmedia2404 I missed that somehow. BTW, DKR could be either but I know you mean Returns in this case

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

@avace917 Oh yea, my bad. So, guess a batman question for you, but do you like the 8 year break he takes in Rises, or did you call bs like Ralph did?

[@avace917]

@@renaissancemanmedia2404 I actually thought that taking the blame for Dent's death was why he retired

[@avace917]

@@renaissancemanmedia2404 no need to apologize. I was just busting your chops. Hard to communicate that through text

[@diogorccarvalho]

I love this episode. I laugh so hard with this

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

Me too. I used to listen to this episode all the time

[@hectic105]

Dark Knight Rises was ruined by the twist. All other problems with the movie could have been looked past if not for the godawful twist which derailed the main villain COMPLETELY and replaced him with a character that was only in the movie a little bit and then dies in the most dull manner possible (they actually both die that way, as being shot by the bat bike is also extremely anticlimactic, maybe not as bad as just dying after crashing a car though…). I didn’t like the big gap in time with him not being Batman either. I know they wanted to do a Dark Knight Returns story, but it just felt jarring and isn’t at all what I wanted after The Dark Knight ended.

[@NoName-cz3wn]

Bats taking the fall for Dent was NOT a plot hole. Every cop living except Gordon is corrupt. Dent was hinted at having dirt in his past. If he doesn't die the hero, the gangs would all be freed in 3 months. You can maybe say Joker did it, but Joker never tells the public one single lie other than the "how I got my scars" bit. I think a bigger plot hole is the idea that Joker went quiet for 8 years. I know its because of Ledger, but the real Joker would not ALLOW Batman to take 8 years off. He'd be blowing up an elementary school every day until Batman appeared

[@PeeWeeHermitGames]

Batman punched bane in the face in the first fight like 7 times lol

[@hendrixisgod777]

Wow, this conversation is old.

[@BlackangelKatakuri]

Honestly it just isnt realistic for a character meant to be written as realistic to literally go out every night and all night without become ineffective due to being worn out. The police should handle the small stuff yes he should always keep his eyes on things but not actually show up until the cops cant handle it

[@sloppnbiscuiitz]

*For what it was.. kickass was puttin in more work in thr streets than bats 😅*

[@dandino9521]

I always okay with this movie tbh but wasn't till I felt I hit rock bottom emotionally, mentally and heck even physically. Despite the flaws and of course script rewrites which caused it to have flaws...I liked this movie probably even love it and especially the trilogy.

[@mbeland1114]

Thank you i appreciate it.🎉

[@Malsagov]

56:58 😂 1:16:20

[@avace917]

The guy saying nothing happened between movies forgot about the scene in Dark Knight where Ramirez asks why Batman hasn't shown up yet. Gordon's response was "hopefully, he's busy!"

[@sloppnbiscuiitz]

*Thats true but.. always better to show not tell. Even if a small scene*

[@avace917]

@@sloppnbiscuiitz of course. I guess they decided to do this once Ledger passed

[@savvydev]

Batman stopped being batman because there wasn't any crime happening in Gotham. Dent Act put an end to major crimes. There's even a line regarding this when Gordon says something to Blake when he informs him of senator missing. And as soon as Bane is there in stock market Batman comes right away. So the point that he stopped being Batman because Rachel died has no value. He became recluse because of that. Stopped going out even as Bruce Wayne. But for fighting crime he instantly puts up the suit even when he isn't fully fit.

[@Kders]

This is genuinely hilarious - but don’t listen if you ever intend to watch the movie in earnest again😅

[@thenightstocker4268]

Doing the lord’s work uploading these classics

[@wallywest2038]

Batman took 8 years off because he lost Maggie Gyllenhaal, and not just Maggie Gyllenhaal…..Katie Holmes

[@MegaMacReal]

_I FAilED YoU, I FAilED YouR SoN, I FAilED EvERYonE_

[@BenjaminHeyman]

I BUTTLEFUCKED IT!!!

[@craighicksartwork]

Batman should have taken an 8 year break after Bane broke him. It really was bizarre writing.

[@gezbanks1277]

Comedy gold

[@cejannuzi]

I hated Dark Knight. I thought Rises was a bit better.

[@Rohan2000-g8s]

I'm intrigued by your statement,I truly am. Would you please care to further explain, I would love to read.......

[@dplunk13]

This is so ridiculous. It's a fucking movie. It's a different type of story than a fucking comic book or even tv show. And this is the third movie with these characters. They've more than set up what type of Batman this is. Hell, in The Dark Knight they have a whole thing about Bruce not wanting to be Batman forever and no one had a problem with it because it made sense for the character in *these movies*. Sorry but if your first problem is "Batman wouldn't stop being Batman" I give the rest of your opinions zero weight. Glad I mostly read the transcript instead of wasting my time listening to bullshit.

[@SamS-tr2mh]

I totally agree with you. the complaints about this movie are usually based on not watching carefully. someone else commented here about how they establish that Bruce Wayne/Batman in this series doesn’t want Batman to last forever, and they put a stop to large scale crime before the movie starts. People can’t watch the narrative and evaluate this movie on its own terms they always insert some standards from other Batman portrayals. Those are DIFFERENT STORIES.

[@sloppnbiscuiitz]

*Even if you’re right, the movie doesn’t suddenly become great cause of that.. like it still has problems..*

[@SamS-tr2mh]

@@sloppnbiscuiitz No, it is a good movie.

[@thatguy4019]

To be true to the character, at the end he needs to kill Bruce Wayne and be the Batman full time. Bruce Wayne is the mask. Batman is his true character.

[@film-maniac]

The name Catwoman was never used in BATMAN RETURNS either.

[@avace917]

You know I never noticed that. That's really funny. 31 years later

[@TheLineOfTheCentury]

m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/mnLUdIl_lJirkMk

[@johnlossie467]

"I am Catwoman. Hear me roar." - Batman Returns (1992)

[@pdmore123]

@@johnlossie467exactly

[@craighicksartwork]

Straight up wrong.

[@zackbrown117]

I agree with him I thought that movie sucked

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

Recently I have been going through some financially hard times. I have a link for a go fund me page to help pay my bills this month. Anything would be helpful. I'm an Afghanistan combat vet that is currently waiting on the VA to process my claim but my truck has broke down and I lost my job recently. Here is the link if you would like to help. Thank you gofund.me/ffda5bab

[@cmofficial794]

Horrible take. I wonder if he feels the same now after seeing how bad The Batman was.

[@renaissancemanmedia2404]

I thought it was awesome

[@cowboyschad5x778]

Wtf? The Batman was the second best Batman movie only under The Dark Knight

[@cowboyschad5x778]

@@renaissancemanmedia2404it was 🔥🔥🔥💯🗿

[@Anonymous.Throne]

Most of their takes ARE pretty horrendous. The Batman is a good movie though.

[@cmdr.cannoli]

12:10