Kingdom of Heaven - Renegade Cut

An analysis of Divine Command Theory and how it relates to the Ridley Scott film Kingdom of Heaven. Want to request an episode or support the show? Patreon: / renegadecut
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Kingdom of Heaven. Directed by Ridley Scott. Starring Orlando Bloom. Divine Command Theory is a philosophical standpoint held by most monotheistic religions. Alternate monotheistic theories of moral philosophy include Natural Law Theory, popularized by Saint Thomas Aquinas.
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Please watch: "Thor Ragnarok - Colonialism in Asgard | Renegade Cut"
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[@MatthiasPendragon]

You managed to talk about a flame-war inducing topic with nuance, elegance, and fairness. Once again, excellent work.

[@danielallen3454]

This movie is a favorite of mine. Not for its politics or, God help us, its history. But for its philosophy. For the Hospitaller who has no use for religion. For the German who stands up for a man he doesn't know. For the King who says that he has no authority over the soul of another.

[@leo9753]

@@illerac84 Yes, the directors cut is really good. Balians whole motivations make much more sense with the larger context it provides

[@Lost-Lilim]

Perhaps the most basic problem with Divine Command theory is that the commands are not divine in origin, barring direct contract by the divine. It could be more accurately described as Divine Command via Claimed Intermediary theory.

[@zubstep]

Yep, in legal parlance we'd call it hearsay.

[@Natsymir]

This movie has the best director's cut ever. It has to be watched in that version. It changes the story substantially, inserts an important new character, radically alters the pacing and the mood, and reinforces the philosophical themes. It's absolutely excellent.

[@ThatGingerCuntFromTerminator2]

Both the directors cut and theatrical cut is terrible. The story is too convoluted with unnecessary sub plots.

[@davidallamericananarchist9220]

The Directors cut is one of my favorite movies of all time, inaccuracies or not...

[@frankpienkosky5688]

@@ThatGingerCuntFromTerminator2 ".Killing an infidel is not a sin"...who says so?....the pope, apparently.....

[@Ihaveyourusername]

The Euthypro debate has actually been one of the earliest debates in Islamic theology. Check out the book Defenders of Reason in Islam in particular for more about this. The quote from Robert Adams also reminds me of a quote by one of the most influentual Muslim theologians from the 14th century/8th century A.H., who said: "Every matter which abandons justice for tyranny, mercy for cruelty, benefit for corruption, and wisdom for foolishness is not a part of the Divine Law even if it was introduced therein by an interpretation."

[@ConnerNielsen6]

It's videos like this that I'm glad you moderate the comments section. I can't imagine some of the stuff you may read, but thank you for your efforts in making this a better community than most channels

[@lmallia6719]

Another argument could be "how can we truly know the will of God?" and thus, how can we claim that God wills something? Yes, theoretically religious texts can be a guide, but not necessarily for specific situations.

[@Donovaneagle2098]

My friend and I get together at the local Starbucks and talk theology from time to time, (I'm a Buddhist and he's a catholic, so we like to just talk to people who can understand what we're saying about our faiths without taking what's said the wrong way, or at least give each other time to clarify a point) and this video's themes are actually close to a conversation we've had before, and I think this will be really interesting to bring up next time we meet.

[@piotrkubica5854]

Renegade Cut is the greatest thing on KZbin.

[@jedigecko06]

My favourite scene is on the Muslim side. After setting this all up on the Christian side, we see Saladin pressed to hurry his attack. Unable to question divine command theory (his own authority) he asks, _'How many victories did He send you; before He sent you me?'_

[@03thirdkind]

I've actually never heard of Divine Command Theory in name, but I'm surprised how well I'm familiar with it when it was expanded upon in this video! Very fascinating stuff, I'm so happy to have stumbled upon your channel.

[@timephire]

I really enjoy your work and all the thought you put into every video. Thank you so much.

[@petersonj198]

Thanks for that info about suicide in the Bible, I never knew that.

[@darkservantofheaven]

would it be fair that Olando Bloom has been replaced by Kit Harrington in this decade?

[@nigelfuentes5763]

This is a fantastic analysis keep up the great work

[@Companion92]

You explain this really well

[@johnhanifin1952]

The directors cut is the true film if they released it originally this film would be remembered for the classic it is

[@disastergirl888]

This is so true. I was always indifferent to this film until I saw the directors cut and then I was just blown away. Everything is so much more coherent and meaningful in the director’s cut, it’s really an entirely different film.

[@Th0tsandprayers]

lol got an ad for pure flix before this, very appropriate

[@bb1111116]

I appreciated the video essay. I've found the explorations in "Kingdom of Heaven" of the mundane motivations of the characters on their 'holy' quests to be interesting. The video essay's discussion of the philosophies related to the character's behavior and the pitfalls in trying to use religious reasons to justify killing were illuminating.

[@GThe-su9kl]

The question of how wealth is linked to God seems to be a reference to a protestant concept, where the way someone's life unfolds is an indicator to know if God chose him. It is not an universal interpretation (for exemple, catholics tend or tended to view wealth less positively than protestants in theory). So, I guess that it is a hint pointing as to who is Ridley Scott's target audience.

[@NerdFiction]

I can't tell you how often I know one of the music tracks you used by name. My fellow epidemic sound editor I salute you for your exquisite track selection.

[@jec1138yt]

Woo thank you! This is probably Scott's most underrated and misunderstood movie ever. Hate to say it, though, it's gotta be the director's cut

[@morty1977]

Why hate to say it?.. the director is entitled to the version of the art they create, look at Blade Runner(Also Sir Ridley Scott, or Zack Snyder's Justice, Zodiac, Alien, Aliens etc) as an example a far superior movie.. don't say sorry.. you are supporting the point of view of an artist over the decision of a studio.. you are to be commended

[@slawdog8]

Is it just me, or was the dark, tenebristic aesthetic too "Riddley Scott" for a movie mostly set in the middle east?

[@lolitabubbles26]

A Dante Scholar posed the ultimate question that still has me on the ropes today "If God is all powerful, then he isn't all-loving. If he is all-loving, then he is not all powerful." This coming from the idea that we still suffer from forces beyond our control: cancer, natural disasters, and so on. I always love posing this to Christians, who disregard it entirely because it conflicts so heavily with their beliefs.

[@igsttef6294]

Lmao

[@giovannialvarez9289]

I love that you did this film, Leon, as since middle school I loved this film.

[@davidmurciaaristizabal5381]

I remembered through The last Duel... What an amazing film

[@mikevalenzuela3974]

To me, the director's cut is a masterpiece

[@user-xn9kd5lm8v]

Bravo..

[@beatrizfernandes1506]

This theory can also be used by or for authoritive figures (people) who justify their actions or their call to action on their authotity. Like, we should do something because the government says so, or our parents say so, or our teachers or coaches, in situations where they haven't explained to us why (in a reasonable way, and/or with a logic argument). This example, the cruzades, also reminded me (not just because of the geographical setting) of the war in Iraq - which we can now safely say that was more about destabilizing a reagion rich in an important resource (petrol) than what politicians said it was at the time (weapons of mass destruction). The same way the cruzades became more about control of the land rather than divine command or duty.

[@AB-xd8hm]

Love the movie. Interesting analysis, Leon. On a trivial related tangent, the word god has, ironically, the exact same pronunciation as does South Slavic word for "bastard" or scummy person. On the other hand, the all-Slavic word for god has the same pronunciation as English word "bog" (as in peat bogs in Scottish marshes). Just a trivial information that's amusing to me for some reason. Keep up the good work.

[@jackowasabi4985]

Do Deadman please I know you like the movie

[@jackowasabi4985]

your right i did know that

[@christopherblack5112]

I loved the movie

[@TheKersey475]

You talking about the meh theatrical cut or the far superior Director's Cut?

[@kissmyasthma3155]

Don't get me wrong I still like the director's cut of this movie, but the climactic battle scene that dragged towards the movie's end as well as Orlando Bland's wooden acting were major flaws for me for this movie.

[@andysmithmusic8330]

Great movie. The so-called dilemma fallaciously assumes that someone knows God's will.

[@betoar7639]

It is inaccurate to refer to Guy and Raynald as Knights Templar.

[@thomasburns2557]

I think you must look at these arguments in a different light. Few of the people in this movie were really religious. Most were there for their own benefit. They wanted to be victorious at war not Gods will. Many wants land and possessions not Gods will. St Francis would have said we have come to covert not kill . True religion before God is to help widows and orphans in their need and keep oneself unstained from this world. The movie was not about God or Gods will but about mans own vain glory. The hospitaler in the movie was a religious man. That’s why he said God must be in your mind and in your heart, implying he is not in your sword.

[@Mikezzz749]

This is a movie by atheists, for atheists, about Christians and Muslims. Particularly, it's western atheist making a movie for western atheists, who chafe at Christ and Christianity. The "God wills it" Christians are portrayed especially negatively. I can appreciate some of the conversation of a "God's divine command" theory here, but it's a much deeper conversation than the movie, and much shallower than the ethics and situations themselves justify.

[@moragslothe6449]

9:37 "challenging to prove"??? Try apparently impossible because nothing in all of human history has failed to come anywhere near anything that would constitute evidence for the divine. Lol ffs

[@w.h.matlock8219]

People in the 1100s likely saw wealth as a sign of God's favour because they couldn't read

[@themagictheatre2965]

"The film is more interested in philosophy and religion than it is with being a history book." Okay, then it shouldn't have had a historical figure as its protagonist. As a historian, this is what always pisses me off about these movies. They want it both ways. It's infuriating.

[@brucesnow7125]

When creating an art form, artistic freedom should always trump over need for historical accuracy. The reason why director chose this historical moment, was because it fit well with what he wanted to tell. You don't go to movies to see incredibly accurate story, it's not a documentary and it isn't trying to be.

[@konstantinoskotsomytis2544]

A mediocre movie at best. It is underwealming as an epic movie as the battles portrayed are full of hollywood clishes. It also reenforces the mistaken belief that the crusades were simply the result of blind religious fanatisism. Too bad because it was a missed opportunity for the creators to make something original.

[@user-et2vz]

blasphemy!