KingSong S20 | First In-Depth UK Review

[@christopherspencer63]

Love your reviews! Always neutral and honest.

[@CrossroadWater]

Best review on the S20 so far, thank you so much for your honesty and objectivity!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

My pleasure!

[@davidmitchell2766]

Thanks Ian I have been waiting on this from speedy feet 100% trust in your review

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers dude!

[@YourAubsome]

@1:02:42 - it is incorrect to state that the gearing is different because of the tire size (V12 16" vs S20 20"). The "gearing" of a wheel is determined by how the manufacturer winds the motor (in combination with other electrical components). Sure, a small tire has a mechanical advantage over a large tire at low speeds, but that is largely irrelevant. Example: I have 4 high powered electric scooters with tire sizes of 10" and 11". I also have 5 different unicycles with tires ranging from 10" (mten3) to 18". Every single one one of my unicycles has vastly more low end torque than every one of my scooters, even though they all have much larger tires (mten3 is only exception, and it actually has the least amount of torque of any of my EUCs but that is due to power constrains not tire size). The scooters all have motors designed for high speed (my fastest scooter goes 60 MPH). The EUCs all have motors designed for high torque (even if they call it a 'high speed' motor variant). This is because EUCs need a massive amount of low end torque to stay balanced at low speeds - scooters do not. The myth that tire size has a significant impact on the "gearing" or power band distribution (low end power vs high end power) of an EUC needs to stop being repeated. Sure, if you wind 2 motors identically and give them the same amount of power and the the only difference between the two is tire size, then the tire size is effectively your determining your "gearing", but this is not how EUCs are designed. The motor of each EUC is designed for a specific purpose and powerband distribution and it is the main factor in determining your 'gearing'. Thanks for the great review, I watched the entire thing. I'm very excited to get my S20!!!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

One factor in the ‘gearing’ that is overlooked is not only physical size of the motor but also combined with leverage on the pivot point, i.e rider size. Taller riders will be able to harness more torque and get to top speed quicker (only caveat would be unless they are extremely heavy as to negate the leverage increase). Glad you enjoyed the review.

[@naincarmona]

Finally a TRUE in-depth review!!! thanks Ian you never disappoint!!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

My pleasure!

[@supercurioTube]

14:09 honeycomb pedals: when you ride in snow below freezing point, your foot pressing with all your weight creates a layer of solid ice on top, which it very hard to get rid of later on. Pedals with holes avoid that happening. Hi from Sweden's winter ❄️👋 Agree on scraping roots and rocks tho instead of sliding over them, that could trigger some crashes off-road.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Good to know that side of it, cheers!

[@grb1969]

A possible solution to this problem is to machine the hexagonal holes into the footplate while the base is tilted at >55 degrees to the cutting axis. This would effectively put a ski-tip type slope the webbed structure from the top surface downward to bottom surface rear, which could aid in deflecting fodder. It's an almost insignificant change that would infrequently be needed but it would appear an aesthetically appealing design choice. Similar styles can be seen on some mountain bike pedals, which can have the same issue with debris. A much more necessary location to aggressively slope is on the bottom front edge of the pedal hangers and the battery casing.

[@supercurioTube]

​@@grb1969 I like your idea! Can you please start to design and manufacture EUC pedals? Nothing too difficult right? 😋 Thanks 😄

[@terkelalgevind529]

I have done like 500 miles this winter in Denmark and about 200 was in heavy snow on my standard v8f... never had ice? :S

[@supercurioTube]

@@terkelalgevind529 maybe you also use this trick? never putting your feet down 😆(at least in the snow) Otherwise your sole tend to bring snow on the footplates, and then it stays there and get compacted into ice.

[@Gebeleizis.]

There's a hell lot of work and time put into this review. But the result made it all worth it. And the YT stats say the community loved it! Thank you for your dedication Ian 👍

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@theDigited]

Honeycomb pedals for unicycles were originally made in Russia (Hextech and others) as a solution against collecting packed snow on top of pedals, which made any grip tape and even studs ineffective. It's a must have to ride in climate with snow.

[@optimusprime6453]

Woo the eagle has landed ! Pretty wheel to have , I am amazed with those advance features .

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Arrived pretty quick - good to get on it finally!

[@apexcapital1328]

The best review hands down. Get this man a Begode Master to review.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Thanks!

[@hanxor]

Hey there - in regards to the powerpads - I saw another video where they stated that the red boomerang piece was installed on the wrong sides - the correct look should have the LONG portion on top. HOPE THIS HELPS!

[@freeforester1717]

Most test riders (elsewhere) so far have advocated the removal of the boomerangs, as they are found to get in the way of the individuals’ preference for pad siting. More broadly, given that the general suggestion is that the wheel be deemed by the manufacturer as being suitable for off-road and trail riding, the protruding lights, shock damper cylinder, and rear stand have already been demonstrated as being not really sufficiently robust or found to be quite vulnerable to damage from such usage, quite apart from the by now largely discounted (ie laughably fragile) plastic front bumper. The London boys have already taken to taping up the interface between rear lock switch and the housing, the sharp edges of the latter making inroads into the switch handle where they meet. It looks like it would benefit from a protective cage/basket around the rear shock, as well as a ‘Splyce’-type front end protection extending beyond the fragile front lights, of course others may disagree, but time will show whether these leading/bleeding edge protruding parts last the course. The switch and motor cable to motherboard interface appear to be somewhat vulnerable to water ingress, but again, time will tell. The plastics used are certainly making Gotway wheels look better than hitherto!

[@v4v777]

Yes.. the long must be on Top.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers Hanxor and others. (Mine actually sit nice now, so will leave as is and see how it goes over the next 970km)

[@lashley370z]

30 miles range seems very low, even if not quite fully charged. The California riders got 60 miles. I'm not sure what to make of that. If your charger went green at 93%, maybe there's an issue with the bms or battery cells. Thanks for the comments on the seat. We taller riders need to know how the seat is going to work. Great review. Very thorough.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers! Full BMS details here, BMS confirmed all good by kingsong; electricpeople.org/post/our-s20-current-bms-stats-note-kingsong-engineer-states-there-is-no-issue-w--6210d15cd765f240026ba8fb

[@smoxesss]

in the UK they steal parts out n swop for cheaper so in the US will be a Panasonic battery or a LG battery looks like in England they swop the battery to a 15AH 18650 cells battery 28 miles range at 28mph , 30mph in England the shops do the scamming same with the KZbin promoters they know you wont get the specs unless get from china, US THAT YOU SEARCH N BUY YOUR SELF they sell xiomi scooters for 800.00 pounds in England worth 200 pounds at best i have 4 scooters all do the correct speed n range

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@smoxesss who is swapping the parts out?

[@smoxesss]

@@Speedyfeetuk the shops in UK do thats why dont get specs and they all so get heavily restricted same like scooters have to mess with all the settings the app is whack weakens the scooter by 60% plus more than that and they swap the battery voltage from 60v down to 36v so can never max them out. this why i hate you U i have 4 scooter 2 are restricted cant do nothing with them by 2 new ones i can up the watts ,speed , power even change the acceleration to the point were the wheel spins out on start when trigger throttle is just barley touched. i ride mine daily in UK will never stop no matter what rule changes are made.

[@frankbuckner5101]

The pad guides are installed backwards. The short side should be on the bottom. Essentially the red boomerang thingies are on the wrong sides. Move them and then put the power pads back on.

[@frankbuckner5101]

Jack from Electric dreams had the same issue with his.

[@coolhawk2003]

​@@frankbuckner5101 do it come not installed on the euc and you have to put it on yourself?

[@coolhawk2003]

OK thanks

[@timwatterson8060]

Does lifting the trolley handle make plugging in the charger easier? Tyre change easy, hard? tubeless? Are the pedals solid, can you drill then tap a thread to add adjustable grip with set screws? Any ability to adjust pedal angle? I think we will see people adding side panels to support the rear of the pads.

[@graemebuchan1919]

Use sugru moldable glue to make instant caps to cover screws on top, even comes in red

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Good shout!

[@omidel.]

Also make a front bumper from sugru!

[@enjoimangos]

Just received my s22 today and rode 36 miles. I still had 68% battery when I got home. The average speed was 20 mph with a few bursts to 35mph.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Brilliant! Yeah riding it sensible will yield more miles for sure.

[@dialecticalmonist3405]

Does anyone have an answer to why there is such a massive discrepancy with range? You are literally reporting OVER DOUBLE the range that he got in this video.

[@enjoimangos]

@@dialecticalmonist3405 I have a feeling I ride much slower than Ian does. I rarely ever go over 50kph (31mph).

[@dialecticalmonist3405]

@@enjoimangos Ok. Nice to know. Also, I assume it gets less range off road? It looked like he was off road most of the time.

[@Roskellan]

Great review, not just a repeat of what has already been done. Right on the money :-)

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Glad you liked it!

[@Duf]

Great job Ian, that mileage number was very surprising. I have heard of a couple riders in the states that got 60 miles out of the wheel.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah, hoping BMS update will yield a few more miles to make it mid 30's or maybe up to 40 for me.

[@supercurioTube]

37:13 to handle going down stairs it'll be like on Sherman with a seat and mudguard: - You flip the wheel backwards - Hold both the front and the rear of the wheel (front bumper and maybe some suspension linkage here) - gently accompany the wheel down each step - wheel won't bounce or spin. I do that every time I leave home. To go back up, you can push it step by step no problem, from behind.

[@grb1969]

A creeper speed, torque-only mode would help for stair climbing. This would be a firmware feature that could could be activated by recognizing the lifting the trolley handle, so possible in the future. As implemented, the lift-switch being divorced from the trolley-handle is a bit kludgy.

[@coolhawk2003]

like he said i the video no where to grab . maybe you put a strap around the shock just for the stairs or something

[@peterneilwoodhead4064]

Enjoyed the review Ian. This could be my next wheel, especially for off road muddy tracks.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Nice one!

[@kenspaceman3938]

Nice review👍 I’d like to know how hard it is to change a tire on this one.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

I best get a puncture then ha ha

[@supercurioTube]

Regarding tiltback behavior, I find the 16X one very good at 50kph. It does deploy kind of quick and linearly (beginning is not smoothed) but not too quick. That way you can sense immediately it is happening unlike some other OEMs where the transition is so smooth that you can't tell and react until the angle is really significant (and your balance on the wheel now precarious) On the 16X, tiltback also stops immediately as you reduce pressure on the pedal, so it's all very interactive. I hope they can make the S20 tiltback just as good and clear, so then you handle it with the lowest delay with muscle memory.

[@baubelepreux1561]

"Please, decelerate !"

[@grb1969]

Clearly, a user-selected "smart tilt-back" option is needed that could signal to the rider that they are approaching the limits power necessary to maintain dynamic stability. The static metric of instantaneous current spike demands requires a much larger margin of safety than would a dynamic feedback response algorithm. I would expect this would require more engineering than the current set of manufacture's are willing to invest, so it'll be a few years before we see this being as ubiquitously standard as are BMS systems (for example). Designing this is relatively simple but just doesn't seem to be on the radar of potential solutions.

[@anonymous98730]

Regarding the holes in footplates - they are absolutely a must when riding in snowy conditions. Maybe in UK it's not a common usage scenario.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Correct, dont really get that issue here - good to hear that side of things :)

[@jameshwang4750]

same thing with mud.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@jameshwang4750 not something I have experienced and issue with in mud (having ridden in mud predominately over the years)

[@idrissamorehouse5776]

Daaayummm bredren!! Supreme deep dive =Best Ever!!! I’m an Escooter head but becoming more interested in these E-Uni’s because they get better mileage :)! Hitting the sub button!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers dude!

[@BotFDR]

I got 23 miles range of mixed on/off road riding. I didn't want to risk trashing the demo wheel so I was even holding back a bit.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Thanks for the honest feedback. Quite a long way adrift of Kingsongs claimed ~200km!

[@belkenator]

One can often get 40mi on a 1500wh 16X. 2200wh being 50% greater should in theory yield 60mi all things being equal. My guess is the pre-prod firmware is gimping the depth of discharge. Should be 30 cells in series for 126-- so what is the voltage indicated when it is out of juice so we can actually get the state of charge? It should get down to 100v when empty.

[@EvilSpeculator]

Boy that's less than my V11 gets and I weigh 175 lbs.

[@arcrides6841]

23 miles is pathetic. I would never get this wheel if that's the case.

[@BotFDR]

@@arcrides6841 It's not for long cruising for sure. However, off-roading and jumping is truly next level.

[@banzaibob6569]

Regarding the range test...I think you'll get 50 miles before the wheel gives you a nod.

[@Auld_Moaner]

Excellent feedback Ian, looking forward to the upcoming/ongoing review 👍

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers Stu!

[@bellot1]

This is the best video ive seen that explains everything. thank you and hello from California

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers! Glad it helped!

[@YASAJTV]

Did I hear this is 39 mile range wheel? I get 30 mile range out from my S18 without tilt back or low battery warnings.

[@WILSONsHobbies]

this is where i was confused too, i think he meant to say the speed he hit before the tilt back. I would have to watch this again. , Ian....what is the range of the wheel for real? ty. If it is 39 range, im out llol

[@BlackSheriff84]

Was thinking the same

[@anonymous98730]

Seems like 2220 Wh battery is not enough to drive this 35 kg 3300 W motor knobby-tyre machine for much longer, unfortunately.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

29.34 until tilt back is what it did for me.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

29.34 until tilt back is what it did for me.

[@aleckay7039]

Loved the video very informative. I know you said the range was about 29 miles. Was that going 45 MPH?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Average speed 18mph, but highs of 50kmh up to around the ~20 mile mark approx

[@wutruriding1355]

Yes on increasing top speed, in fact prefer allowing all available speed/power and let rider decide where to set alarms and tilt back. Also, I agree w you, 20 degrees is fine if it’s more gradual, it should not be abrupt which dangers the rider. Power pads are getting bad reviews, in fact, being replaced by aftermarket pads already. Are they planning to improve them? Needs more robust headlamps too. Best overview and review so far. Thanks for doing this!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers!

[@1young-geezer]

Great early review. I believe that you can also adjust the spring, I think I saw the guys @ eevee's (Canada store) do that. Also it appears some people are taking that front boomerang shaped piece off either side - for fit of top pads? But again, you covered so many points of interest - thanks, and looking forward to your future reports on this wheel.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cool, thanks. Yeah loads of adjustment on the suspension, we put together this: www.speedyfeet.co.uk/blogs/help-and-advice/kingsong-s20-eagle-suspension-setup (also listed in the description)

[@grb1969]

@@Speedyfeetuk This excerpt from your set-up guide should be prominently written on the side of the suspension arms... "Never attempt to use your shock with both rebound and compression adjustments to maximum settings. If you do, the shock will not operate properly and it will be damaged possibly beyond repair." Maybe a sticker would do the trick. Also, if the customer's weight is known, then it would be useful to adjust the preload ring accordingly. Some have suggested that the tool should be included from the factory. Either way, an examination of the benefits/drawbacks of off-design preloading of the spring would be interesting. At 21 stone (nearly 300#), I would definitely consider upgrading to the next level of spring constant.

[@FinnBjerke]

Great review mate - a lopt of wonderfulkl things about this wheel. I love seated riding I bloody well need tO sit and still be able toi stop the wheel, so the seat design seems like rubbish to me. Coul you eloborate on what difference the extra volts makes? The mudproblem is very real for me - sherman just collects chunks of it - how is S20 different is the mud just scrabed off - On the Sherman I need to scrape off inside mud from time to time, the S20 design is it eliminating that problem? thx again mate... Ill prob wait for Inmotion V13. Tho this wheel is very tempting.

[@Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay]

Absolutely superb review, and ideas for manufacturer ! I really hope they listen to you ! Will be ordering soon !

[@meuconmyeuc1337]

Thank you, Ian. Your reviews are the best.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers!

[@Dennymolv]

Thank you so much for a very thorough review. I'm so glad you have covered some of the fiddly bits and the things you really like. My question is what do you think a tire change will be like? Its obvious a battery change is straight forward but I have yet to see a tire change. Thanks again! Love your content!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers. I cant see it being much more complex/less complex than say the S18 / V11 etc. At the end of the day all models are a bit of a pain as they hang on the axel and have 'mirrored' left and right construction.

[@CrunchyTire]

Something you'll do once a year or less shouldn't be a huge deciding factor in buying a wheel. Thats not me defending this wheel or anything, I never wanted one and thought it was overhyped lol

[@arcrides6841]

@@CrunchyTire Once a year if everything goes perfectly. There's a very decent chance that you get a flat and find yourself changing the tube within weeks or months. I think it's a very important factor but that's just my opinion.

[@MatthewStacy-st3df]

I'm guessing this probably isn't over, and will talk to you soon!!!!!

[@pauljr]

Great video! How wide and thick is the battery case. I ask for the purpose of making a stand. Thanks!

[@antoniocanete1177]

Thank you very much for the video. I would like to know to circulate freely on the road, what permits are needed, what insurance is needed. Thank you very much. Toni

[@RobUKTH]

Really enjoyable, in depth review 😎. Many thanks Ian! 👍🙏

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers Rob

[@coreKORD]

Good review. Thanks for timecodes.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@bradhammond923]

Great review as always mate. Always appreciate the in depth test. Looking forward to the 250

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Thanks Brad!

[@Andre-Mostert]

Boom, watch the whole hour and bit. So much good details in there. Thank you Ian. On the shock, there is a ring on the top that you can turn to put more load in the shock for heavier riders. So nice to have that compared to the air shock. I do like the lights where you can adjust them separately. That tyre also looks like it clears really quick and that is key for here in the UK and the muddy/clay canal paths I ride. Also the tyres looks really chunky that also helps with the comfort. The rear shock assembly stays nice and clean and there is allot of space for cooling between the tyre guard and the top of the wheel. I hope you can disable that lift sensor like I did on my S18 so that back flap does nothing. Its a good looking wheel and looks like they cover all the basics right in the box.

[@Bodybuilding_Lifestyle]

Thank you for the very informative and revealing video with many detailed shots. 👍🏼

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@jez0022]

Best review yet!!! Extremely informative and honest 👍 thank you!! Finally a proper range test 🙌🙌🙌

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers Jess

[@eucfng]

AWESOME REVIEW🔥 lots of things covered with answer. thank you🤙

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@Nautical33]

Hi guys, just a couple of questions, not got my hands on it yet but concerns about the power switch being hard plastic a possible problem if broken, plus the water ingress were the motor cables go onto the motherboard!!!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

As per vid, you could seal the motor cable better, but remember - it would have to run uphill to get to the board, really unlikely. Button, cannot see that getting brittle and breaking - and if you pulled it off, its actually really simple - 1 screen and its replaced!

[@alejandroespinosa8303]

Very nice review thank you ... can you tell me please the pressure on your tire at the time of this video and around how much do you weigh ?

[@jedi22300]

Great review! Btw I think you need to start the chapter markers at 0:00 for it to work. I'm not seeing any markers on the video at the moment

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Interesting tip, will try that out!

[@AZREDFERN]

I wonder how a Kenda Trakmaster K760 would handle on this. They’re my favorite Dual Sport tires. The most aggressive you can get while remaining DOT highway legal.

[@patrickmckowen2999]

Excellent -- brilliant -- bang up job sir! Cheers

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Thanks Dude!

[@anonymous98730]

Hopefully KS will squeeze more than 30 miles of enjoyable range out of S20. Thanks for review!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Summer will allow me that…or I could lose weight ha ha

[@leonking11.11]

I’m so confused about the range test. I have the s18 & weigh 120kg like 19 stone & i get 18-24 miles. Was hoping minimum 35 miles. Do you thing a software update would let you use more of the battery capacity? Plus also let you charge it up fully possibly?

[@leonking11.11]

P.s if you get 30 miles out of the s20, with me being 19 stone I’d probably only get 25miles maybe 30 miles if I don’t go over 20mph or something

[@rcxotic1]

Temperature affects range dramatically IMHO. At 0c I lost 30% range on my electric skateboard vs. 20c+ temperature

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@rcxotic1 yeah makes a massive difference.

[@mrandmrswheels1142]

Excellent stuff chaps. Really enjoyed the review. Ohhhhh I can see really wanting to add one of those to the collection. Love the suspension on the S18 and the stability, Power and feel of the Sherman so this just seems the perfect balance between the two.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers dude! Yeah its very shermany - aside from range

[@mrandmrswheels1142]

@@Speedyfeetuk awesome, sounds perfect for me. I don’t need the crazy range of the Sherman so the suspension would make a great swap for the Range. Looking forward to your thoughts after more riding.

[@freeforester1717]

Hey Ian, re the problem seating position - how about affixing an inverted triangle-shaped support either side, with top plate bridging the gap, going from the stud fixings below and behind the light, the ones for the cutout handle? A ‘plate’ extension to the seated area above and rearward of the cutout handle would offer the support required to permit the rider to sit comfortably further rearward, as well as offer a strong and stable support for the seat. I think it could work even though it was only fixed at the (lengthened) studs, and with a bit of Velcro on the upper side of the support plate to mate with a bit placed on the underside of that otherwise flimsy rear seat area would keep it in place, the riders bum and weight would stop the support plate from tilting away. A bit of rubber or baby bump tape placed on the top side of the cutout handle or between the rear of the screen and the cutout handle top flat surface and you’d have a bit more rigid rearward seating, with the associated legroom with which to brake with having your feet then located further back, closer to their ‘normal’ placing on the footrests. Version 2 can have enough rear top plate to sit the pillion passenger or fish and chips carry out, lol! Worth a bit of a consideration as a “Speedy Feet Neat Seat Accessory”, for which I’m sure Jon will be delighted to provide the jingle (even though you may not be so keen, lol), send North 5% on the royalties and we’ll say no more, lol! Serious again for a mo, it is an issue that needs to be addressed, because we know it’s unsafe to ride seated as at the present if you’re over 5’7” - a rear seat extension support is really needed if you’re going to make use of the otherwise flimsy and otherwise redundant rear of the seat. Anyway, best of luck! And don’t let Mario short-change you on the loctite for the pedal screws again - take it off his wages - that’ll teach him, lol!

[@norihiro01]

A rear end rack/grab-bar/bumper/roll cage would make the S20 so much more useful, just like a rack on any outdoor off road vehicle. Although some people had a knee-jerk "oh, no it must only be used for sending it on extreme jumps and stairs!" I'm going to graft one onto it, regardless of whether KS manages to make changes to specifically address the issue in the early batches.

[@freeforester1717]

@@norihiro01 it’s a bit of a no-brainer when you look at it, it solves 3 problems in one fell swoop and it offers the possibility of carrying a sandwich box with you too - what’s not to like about that?! If they don’t go with it, someone will make something like it, my blacksmith will for a start! One thing is for sure, when the naysayers take a tumble and break the oil reservoir or rear light, then they’ll be reconsidering - as ‘good’ a wheel it might be ‘hyped-up’ to be right now, none of that hype. Or hype-stars are going to help them when they have a part of their lovely but fragile wheel in their hands as they moan “Oh NO - What have I done!” Prevention is aye better than cure. Time will tell. 👍🏻

[@PaulA-pm3gx]

Maybe remove the boomerang shaped plastic to enable better positioning of the pads.

[@sabotrax]

Very good review! You could design hole caps and put the STLs on thingiverse or such. Print them out of TPU. Should work.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Good idea, a comment was made also about ‘sugru glue’

[@mikeintampa250]

I'm hoping and guessing that you'll get 80 miles on the range test.

[@RabidTribble]

I'm having trouble reconciling your range numbers. On the eevees site, they list the range of the S20 LG 21700 cells as "up to 200km of riding". Your range of 29 miles seems really low. Am I misunderstanding the estimated range? Please forgive my ignorance on this, as I'm a fairly new rider. Based on your review, the s20 has a lower range than my V11, which is really surprising.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Kingsong advertise it as a ~200km wheel, this is normal practice for them AND others, its a total nonsense figure. Its always decimated by real world riding. 200km is a total joke. But do take note of the issue with only charging to 93% (according to app, but lets assume this is accurate for the sake of it and not really 100%) and it did severe tilt back at ~20% this leaves almost a 30% possible uplift with a change in software / fix issue with BMS (battery management system). Then it would be close to the 40mile mark under the same conditions. NOTE: Our range tests tend to always give real life lowest, i.e. high speed than would normally be travelled. In summer (21c) it will do around 30% more.

[@aliasghari8530]

I love your reviews! Remembering your review on Ninebot One e+.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Wow that was some time ago!

[@lefotografion]

regarding tiltback: would love to see a variable tiltback lie on inmotion, where f.eg. 71 kph is 4 °, 72 is 8°, 73 is 12 ° etc. but smooth, not sudden

[@CarlosGarcia-dr7bd]

From TIMES SQUARE NEW YORK CITY YOU GO GUY 1 LOVE & PEACE

[@RonnieRides]

Regarding the stairs test, you can flip the kill switch down without killing the motor by doing it with a tiny bit of speed, you demonstrated this very thing earlier in the video ;)

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yes in exact right conditions (i.e. having a run up) it should be possibe to keep it balanced with that down, and then as long as you dont take any weight off it wont then spin up half way down the stairs. (the issue with doing this is its not then possible to stop it spinning up as the sensor is bypassed)

[@TroyArn]

excellent, thank you. any chance you'll review the Veteran Sherman max?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

We are getting them in, but not sure about a review - probably though!

[@195Bucks]

When the trolley handle is extended is it easy to walk around with or do you have to stoop?..From dimensions ive seen from Kingsong the handle extends to 1 metre from the ground is it tall enough? 🤔... Good comprehensive review Ian!... thankyou!.. 😊 👍

[@mikeintampa250]

Hi Ian, what's the display in kilometers per hour or mph? As to range, I weigh about your weight and I used to regularly get 45 miles of range in the low 20's mph on my S18. That's why I guessed you would get 80 miles of range. I don't understand why it's so low, unless in response to my question above, you were literally going 41 miles an hour and eating up the battery.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Display in KMH All stats in the video for the range test (with the added metric of altitude gain and loss), average speed was just over 18mph.

[@mikeintampa250]

@@Speedyfeetuk wow, I just don't get it, how could it have twice the battery of my S18 and get such low range. Thanks for all the information on this wheel. My Minipro gets 14 miles of range, lol.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@mikeintampa250 Bear in mind I got 26 miles in summer on the S18 range test / unboxing. The lowest I saw from my S18 was ~20 miles flat out. It speed and weight that does the most 'damage' to range, then our cold weather, my weight etc etc. Its fairly comparative on a WH to WH basis, its not like it has huge loses or anything. Actually I think with the BMS update and maybe being allowed to go to 10% until tilt back will yield a few more miles and position it a little better against other wheels.....we shall see!

[@eucridez2062]

Eevees said they got 58 miles on first charge and 61 miles on second charge

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@euc ridez thats mega. Wonder what the stats/environment were for those results.

[@trickk2754]

Thank you for the detailed review! Have also seen the 250km review. But i have a favor which you may can forward to KingSong regarding the battery status in the built in screen: Maybe they can also give us the possibility to change the batterystatus that it is displaying it in percent rather than the battery picture. Kind Regards!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah that would be nice....although currently on mine it shows the APP percentage (which is my latest video released today would appear to be inaccurate)

[@scottharvey9764]

HOLY CRAP was just about to sit down & watch then saw the length so went & got a flask of tea & a bacon sarnie & my massage seat cushion

[@Speedyfeetuk]

ha ha, lots of questions were asked, and therefore we attempted to answer. One good thing is that instead of just a sit down, you get a sit down, food and a cuppa! Enjoy!

[@supercurioTube]

41:10 range test is likely invalid, yes both mainboard and BMS firmwares have to be updated. Raphaël from Bonheur sur Seine couldn't use the wheel at all before updating both.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah, sadly multiple update failures on BMS (firmware updated fine). No response from Kingsong nor solution from them for this so far. Hoping they will be able to assist soon. BUT - even with a charge to 100% and severe tilt back starting at 10% say, the range will be sub 40 miles.

[@supercurioTube]

@@Speedyfeetuk Did you try with Soft Tuner? (can send link if needed) I know Raphaël also struggled to get all the updated applied. It took a while but worked at the end. BTW your charger also outputs 124V? I wonder if you measured it.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yes soft tuner. 5 attempts, contact Kingsong, no response yet on how to fix. It would free up ~8 miles potentially

[@supercurioTube]

@@Speedyfeetuk to be continued then! (Maybe the Android version works more reliably)

[@coolhawk2003]

see how easy the handle fell down and thats your kill switch. glad it dont work when moving i was thinking the same thing about the pads. i though you just slide them up and down

[@bepriceless]

Great review. If they don't fix most of these negatives, I can't plunk down $3200 for this wheel. It's worth maybe $2500 to $2700.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@dylanupdyke2745]

I'm 6'-4" tall and weigh 320lbs. Which wheel would you think best to support me around town??

[@thefoss721]

Great review! Thanks!! And Dang 29 miles is kind of a bummer but coming from the S18, that wheel could get about 12-15 good riding miles so it could be worse, and total actual mill age would have been higher if you wanted to ride 10-14km/h right? Or was that all the battery? Also still absolutely love the wheel still can’t wait for mine to come! Look forward to the small upgrades in parts that will be upgraded but not big of a deal , if you take care of the wheel and ride sulwhat safely, this wheel will last many many years. And replacing pieces won’t cost much at all for the plastic pieces, suspension seems super solid If anyone finds out a way to keep the seat more stable in the back, or if you know anyone who will create upgraded parts, definitely let us know! Thanks again man!

[@grb1969]

If this wheels is as popular as it seems, I'm sure that an aftermarket seating option will be available soon. The seat does look nicely padded, which should help protect the screen on controller housing from damage in a tumble.

[@thefoss721]

@@grb1969 yes exactly! I know some vendors will make some pieces to add to the Eagle . And this wheel is very popular also because it’s very controversial, but usually things are because they have such high praise so I don’t doubt seeing someone build a seat attachment, a handle rubber grip, protective padding around the suspension, custom pads etc … and I think this wheel will be perfect as long as it has those pieces added or changed out from the less durable plastic pieces but we will see what happens with the actual production wheels, they already are upgrading those plastic parts which are the most negative of the wheel

[@EvilSpeculator]

I weigh around 175 lbs and usually get around 30km out of my S18. Mostly country smooth roads though, so I guess that helps.

[@donvee2000]

Put a mark or price of tape on the outside off the male pin part off the charge cable. You can line up with the port alot easier

[@Speedyfeetuk]

A dot of tipex also helps. On mine the notch is facing forward, so as long as I hold it with groove facing me it makes it a little but easier - especially now the cable has ‘formed’ to naturally face that way.

[@keithmurakata5359]

Great review ! So reports say it’s not as “torquey” as an RSHT, but can a software fix give it that extra zip --or is it a wiring/hardware issue ??

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Down to the motor mostly (as well as volts that pass through it) followed by software. Usually with HT top end suffers and with HS torque suffers - can’t really get both at same time.

[@Ay0hh]

Amazing video answering everything, thanks

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@CrunchyTire]

The app should let you bypass the 12km speed lock if it registers that you have had other wheels connected to your phone. Also, companies should start putting velcro on their pads and wheels instead of the 3M tape. I've never once stuck a pad on any wheel and had it be the perfect angle the first time.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Agree!

[@EUCSerbia]

Is suspension for 105kg rider? Someone say some limitations...

[@bushmaster4481]

Good they send out tester wheel to seller so they can get the wheel right for buyer and what a wonderful wheel. Congratulations kingsong

[@atsswing8256]

Thx sir test on S20,I am very interesting to know the S20 long range distance 70km ,how many battery need use?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Full batteries were used, and turns out the app showing 93% might not have been accurate as the BMS reports true value and that shows more or less 100% charge. BMS stats are here if you are interested: electricpeople.org/post/our-s20-current-bms-stats-note-kingsong-engineer-states-there-is-no-issue-w--6210d15cd765f240026ba8fb

[@jesustyronechrist2330]

As I was worried: Such crazy design comes at the cost of good ergonomics and usability

[@CrunchyTire]

The lights look good but purple on a red wheel is a strange choice. Maybe not red because it would blend in with the wheel. RGB option would be cool and doesn't seem too complex to allow changing within the app

[@SuperGeert123]

Hi man, so does it come with stubbed tyre ? Because on pictures " where to buy " link shows a different tyre ( road tyre ) . I would like stubbed tyre . Road tyre is useless for muddy conditions .

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah the renders of it show road tire, but it comes with offroad tire thankfully! www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle-one-wheel-segway/products/kingsong-s20-eagle-2220wh-3300w

[@Glass_Nkoaa]

Wow! At long last the beast is out

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Took a long old time to film, edit, render and upload…tired now lol

[@EdLrandom]

What? you don't like perforated pedals? I had to install pedals like that myself as regular flat ones just don't hold if you have mud or snow on your shoes, they also collects dirt making pedals super slippery, I love how pedals with holls are a default thing now and not an aftermarket issue you have to deal with.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah I think for those riding in snow this is key it would seem...we basically don't get any...just rain and that doesn't pack under your feet lol. I have never had an issue with mud, but certainly can see snow making them really slipping unless they are honeycomb.

[@EdLrandom]

@@Speedyfeetuk Having some mud stuck on the inside of my ks 16x I learned that mud can be diferent. On other hand I never had any issues scraping pedals or needing protection on the inside of my foot with my perforated pedals like you are saying. Great vid though.

[@GeO82]

WHatt only 48km of range? at what average speed was that? I have to ride it first but ill stick to my gotway monster best allrounder!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

As in the video average speed just over 18mph.

[@steveo6034]

Great review!! I'll definitely be getting a Master!

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers!

[@xrpbelieverxrpbeliever5093]

Can you use the handle on the front to pull on and break harder. Like you could just reach town with your right hand and pull on the handle and lean back?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yes absolutely.

[@rapozo107]

What EUC do you recommend for road riding besides the S20 in your opinion?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Checkout the video we did on the V12, is here on this page: www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle-one-wheel-segway/products/inmotion-v12 (all the videos we have done are on this page) Also sign up www.ElectricPeople.org

[@omidel.]

More "what so ever " next time...we all hope this wheel be issue free after 1000km....thank you for the initial impresions

[@Speedyfeetuk]

No problem!

[@noelleonard2498]

Of this thing can only do 30 miles then whats the point? I can get 30+ miles out of my 16X

[@smoxesss]

exactly

[@uneroue4446]

the holes in the footplate are for snow, keep them absolutely need them

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah lots of other peeps from snowy environment's have mentioned this.

[@Colin-kk8rz]

Will the s21 be anygood🤷

[@jaredboulderterry3912]

what would you say would be the range cruising at 30mph average

[@Speedyfeetuk]

30mph average would not be attainable in real life unless you were on a race track I guess. Note the average speed of our flat out test was just over 18mph. So if it was possible range would be a lot less than what we got.

[@rdgw_uk]

How does it compare to the s18 is it worth upgrading?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Weighing all things together I think so if you want more power, speed and stability on and off the road. It is a LOT more chunky though, so its more of a handful to lug about.

[@jaredboulderterry3912]

will you be reviewing the veteran abrams?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yes sure will, we have them on order (+1 to review)

[@HungrySpinz]

I think that the seat and the killswitch is one of the most rushed decisions they have made. Trapping your hand to carry 35 kgs? 😑 Edit1: WHAT 29 miles wtf?

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yeah a little lower than expected!

[@ratmanmurray7137]

@@Speedyfeetuk And the nanny stuff... having to do slow speed for 10 miles to unlock?? (I would be too embarrassed. I would run it on a stand rather than do 10 miles of embarrassment)... then, tilting that far back at 20%? KingSong was saying 200km range... so, in reality, half of that would be acceptable... but 46km??? sorry... deal breaker for me. They would be better going back to 100v? The higher voltage (untried) seems to be a stumbling block? To pay the gross amount for these 'new' wheels... one would expect MORE range, not less? I can hammer my Nikola plus (1800Wh) and get 65km range out of it and still be doing 50kph until I stop... My Sherman... no need to comment. Hopefully the Master will live up to expectations... otherwise, I am happy with what I have. cheers

[@EvilSpeculator]

@@Speedyfeetuk That basically reverts any reason for me to buy it. I'm more than happy with the range I'm getting out of my good old V11. And if I want to go off-roading I've got my S18 - best of both worlds.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@EvilSpeculator Yeah, having those 2 in your arsenal certainly helps!

[@coolhawk2003]

@@ratmanmurray7137 ya they got to have option to turn off them kid lock and pedal tilting. nik plus 17in tire / for the road vs 20in tire / off road and rim wider . more weight the motor has to spin up nik plus 1800wh vs 2220wh all most a extra 1/4 but nik plus 1900walt motor vs 3300walt motor thats like 1 and 3/4 more power drain

[@kevinfrancis5518]

What’s the price seem to have missed this

[@Speedyfeetuk]

£2495 + VAT in UK (£2995) *currently, hopefully wont go up

[@ElectricunicyclesUK]

BTW probably the best review I've seen

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Cheers bro!

[@ivanmorales3265]

While I agree with your assessment of the tilt back speed, if it were to happen at a slower rate a lot of people may completely miss it and maybe not notice which presents more danger. Idk just my opinion. It scares me every time it tilts back, but if it did it slower I may keep pushing passed maximum power possibilities

[@Speedyfeetuk]

I think just marginally slower not a drastic change, just enough to stop people losing control

[@ivanmorales3265]

@@Speedyfeetuk I agree with you. But I was just thinking that may be why. I know I'd feel because Everytime I get tiltback I already kind of know I'm going to fast. So I expect it.

[@Speedyfeetuk]

@@ivanmorales3265 yeah, actually after the first few times, you can get conditioned on what to expect. Its just those first time occurrences that suck

[@nonammmmme]

Just want to know how the bearings will survive after riding in the rain... it rains a lot here

[@Speedyfeetuk]

Yup! Your question will be answered in due course 😎

[@nonammmmme]

@@Speedyfeetuk Thank you sir!