Knitting Tech Editors and Why They're So Important // Casual Friday S6E34

[@xbaczewska4197]

Whew. I worked for many years as an art director in "print" (for me, magazine editorial, advertising & accompanying collateral). In the good ol' days, editing was assumed to be an integral part of the process, but sadly the structure began to be worn away. Care costs money. So bye bye proofreaders; copy editors, you can do that step! But wait. What are those writers busy doing?! They can take it on! Obviously, not every publisher goes that far, but there was a major cosmetics company with typos in their billboards! It is so refreshing to hear Sarah and Kristina speak. Instructions are HARD! Clarity takes much effort and skill. I do worry about compensation for those doing that difficult and important work. Especially since in the online world, the expectation is to get somethin' for nuthin'. Wonderful interview! Best of good fortune to both Sarah & Kristina. And to you, Roxanne.

[@karenalbery2773]

I sincerely apologize for being a new knitter who somewhat relies on long detailed hand holdy patterns. I absolutely recognize the work load difference and the expertise that goes into creating a pattern that is more than 2 sentences and a chart. And i very often try to support designers that give just enough tips on techniques and suggested methods so that i am successful. And i dont mind paying higher prices for those patterns or even further supporting those designers thru patreon or like platforms if they have them. To me the knitting pattern isnt just a pattern . Its my own classroom. Its a santuary from real life and a creative space where i am allowed to excell and be proud of my work. Maybe no one else will notice that i followed a tip in a pettern for a better finishing technique but i know that i made that thing better and i truely appreciate the designers , you tube instructors and tech editors that made my project possible.

[@phyllisburke4141]

Very interesting interviews. I’ve been knitting since the 70’s and I’ve said more than once that a designer should have had the pattern edited before publishing. So I’m happy to hear this is happening more often.

[@mrspilgrim327]

I love your interviews Roxanne, thankyou, that was brilliant, very informative. Tara

[@ellenferris3677]

One benefit that comes with the more extensive patterns available today is that they are accessible to knitters of multiple skill levels, and thus a larger audience for the designer. As an advanced beginner, working through what would otherwise be a pattern that was over my head and above my skill level means that I’ve been able to try cables, lace, brioche, and colorwork that I despaired of trying in earlier times. These more comprehensive patterns have opened worlds of knitting techniques that would’ve intimidated me had they not included so much information. As a result, I’ve found techniques and styles that I can take with me when I try older or less comprehensive patterns and I feel much more confident when I do come across them. So grateful for the tech knitters out there making theses patterns the best they can be! What a great interview, thanks so much!

[@adl1428]

Thank you Roxanne. Fascinating interview with two knowledgeable and well spoken professionals. I am a fan of highly detailed patterns, though I can understand that they may be frustrating to more experienced knitters. I started knitting at 62 yrs old without the benefit of a loved one teaching me. Hence there is no inherent emotional connection to the process. Instead, I think there are two driving forces behind my knitting adventure. First, I don’t love knitting so that the production of nice objects is an offshoot of this love. Instead, I want to produce nice objects and learn to love knitting through those accomplishments. Yes, I am type A. Second, as an adult, I learn selectively (adult learning principles). In my case, the internet is both a blessing and a curse. If a pattern simply states “use a stretchy cast on of your choice” and I search, I find many techniques, each producing a slightly different effect. I have no way of judging which is appropriate. Rather, I want to master the appropriate technique for this project. I am fascinated by all the different techniques but I want to reserve them for others projects. A highly directive pattern removes the guess work and, yes, gives me the promise that if I follow the instructions, I should end up with something acceptable. This is the carrot that I crave in order to continue to build my skill and knowlege. Perhaps one day, the skill itself will be the carrot… who knows. Thank you again for your interview.

[@donnagalletta4067]

I am a professional translator and I see so many parallels here! The importance of having an objective person revise a translation. After I have translated a piece, after I have read it and reread it, I do NOT see my errors, especially if I am working under a deadline. A pair of fresh eyes, a new perspective is so important...for the translator and ultimately for who will be reading the translation... Yes to tech editing, yes, yes, yes!

[@pamelawilkinson177]

wonderful interview with Sarah and Kristina! BTW love your glasses!!

[@techtiptalks]

ha ha! not sure if you mean ours, but thank you!

[@nestaverchwyn9188]

Technology teacher here. Key words… Intellectual Property and Copyright. That’s why some people write so much in their patterns, etc. it’s the same with any published item, pattern, recipe, etc. Tina

[@aroundtheworldfibers]

This was a terrific interview! This is a book I want to add to my book shelf. I am a big believer in Technical Editing. This English major is particularly picky about patterns and there are patterns I refuse to buy because they are so poorly written. I know many people question the cost of patterns. However, I am of a bit of a different mindset and wonder why we (I say we, because historically the majority of us are women, although that has been changing thankfully), but we undervalue everything we do. Our knowledge has value. We need to remember this. Having said that, if I pay a fair price for a pattern, I expect a well written, tech edited, tested pattern.

[@EsmereldaPea]

Thanks for this! I have a couple of decades of experience in writing, technical editing, and Instructional Design. I've just started writing patterns, and my experience with attention to detail and writing processes and flow charts has really paid off. I've also sewn professionally, so my garment construction experience has really served me well (at this point, mostly with animal construction). I still need to learn how to grade patterns, so I haven't designed any sized patterns yet that I plan to publish. I look forward to reading the book!

[@susant8166]

Great interview, thank you to all participants. I was intrigued by the discussion around test knitters. When I was a child, and I'm nearly 70, Mum had a friend who was a pattern test knitter for a major yarn company/distributor here in Australia. Her friend was paid to knit the potential new pattern, and while doing so keep a diary & record her experience noting any tricky bits, ease of understanding pattern instructions, how appropriate pattern size was for age and many other observations. The money she earned helped pay for their xmas family holiday

[@vdenegre]

As a craft editor (quilting) this was a FANTASTIC review of why tech editing is so important. I’ve purchased many knitting patterns that are disappointing, and do not buy from those designers twice. It makes me feel like a curmudgeon, but I am always tempted to reach out to the designers and suggest they hire a pro for this step. I’ve also been a test knitter and am astounded that I’m not given the ‘pre-final’ copy to knit or that the info gathered is used as a tech edit replacement. Technical evaluation and mastery is a fabulous skill and I’m thankful there are people out there who can do it with grace and clarity.

[@bonniel3679]

Even though I mainly crochet these days, I really enjoyed this episode and topic. As an inexperienced knitter, I have been frustrated trying to work from charts until I learned how to "read" them (by watching several different KZbin channels, including yours and Suzanne Bryan's). I've often wondered how well younger designers do when writing patterns, since schools haven't taught grammer and sentence structure in years and the advent of numerous social media platforms encourages the absence of any punctuation. Then there seems to be a free for all with volunteer test knitters adjusting patterns to suit themselves. It's like the wild wild west of fiber arts at times! Seems like there's more need for tech editors now because of these factors. Thank you for this episode.

[@vak459]

24:18 I love this interview. I never thought test knitting is more marketing than actual testing. A few months ago I had a question about the amount of ease in a pattern and I didn't get a good answer from the online shop. So I asked a test knitter on Ravelry and her response was very nonchalant.

[@kathleenhockin8057]

Excellent information. I think it’s really good for knitters to know what designers go through to produce a pattern. Too many knitters complain about a designer’s patterns not being size inclusive without understanding what’s involved. And I like that they talk about a designer determining who they’re designing the pattern for, we shouldn’t expect that they have to please everyone.

[@JesusJoy77805]

I surely enjoyed this session. Very informative foe the knitter. I've been crocheting for many decades and was witch to knitting due to tendinitis. I've only been knitting since 2008. Used to have classes with one on one instruction, but now that has changed. It's frustrating to begin a pattern with errors when you can't find find them. Everyone that design a patten can't write a pattern. Most, I believe, don't have testers or tech editors. You ladies keep up the great work. Roxanne, really enjoy your channel 👍🏼

[@laurenkendall1681]

Recently knit the entire yoke of a pattern, from 6 charts... the final instruction to continue in pattern resulted in a "how do you want me to continue increasing in pattern, over 6 different charts, when you've not given me the instructions" question. I wrote them out by hand to see if I could figure it out.... had to pull it off needles and eventually found out what was needed... but by then I'd got irritated with it....and it was frogged. So... can't agree more with this whole video. A little editing, would have saved me hours!

[@tishshaefer9980]

Thank you for this episode. So interesting. I have dyslexia and I've never lived near enough to a yarn vendor for instructional guidance. Until I retired and had time for KZbin videos to *show* me how to do something I just didn't knit more than a simple scarf. To this day I cannot read a chart with symbols that others find so easy. Independent designers have opened up an entire new world for those of us with reading and numbers difficulties. I am so thankful for the additional information in PDF patterns that would never have been available to me in a book. I don't need so much instruction these days but I love that it's there if I do. ❤

[@virginiamagann]

Am loving this interview. Sarah mentioned written directions that accompany charts. I recently had a difficult experience while working a cable pattern by a designer from the UK. Having both kinds of instruction available helped me to understand the intent of the directions and to successfully complete the pattern. I think the problem may have been a UK vs USA formating issue.. I don't mind virtual hand holdiing in written knitting patterns.. I can ignore excess detail if I don't need it.

[@Liz.Green789]

Thanks, Ladies, for your hard work.

[@CMeyer-ut3dd]

I didn’t know there were knitting tech editors. This was so interesting.

[@michelleellis1290]

I love casual Fridays and this was absolutely amazing. Thank you and your guests for giving me a better understanding into what makes a good pattern. ❤

[@sleepydrJ]

Great discussion! An interesting example is Claire garland’s frog. It’s a fairly fussy pattern but it is written so that beginners should be able to knit it. The end product is amazing but I had to rewrite it for myself. The pattern is choked and clogged with too many words and hand holding. Like couldn’t she just say “work three rows icord”?? Instead of -slide the stitches back and knit without turning- three times? For the advanced knitter, a pattern like that is no joy. Also the vast amount of paper to print it etc etc. but it’s a very cute frog….

[@cathycarbone1598]

Super interesting and informative! I appreciate the perspective and their knowledge! Great topic!

[@stephanieselb8329]

Excellent discussion! Thanks for doing this topic. I enjoyed hearing about pattern writing and editing from the technical perspective. I learned a lot about the differences between “bare bones” patterns and comprehensive patterns. I will be able to make more informed decisions as I select patterns to meet my needs and expectations. Keep up the great work. 👍🏽

[@verdandiknits]

what is the pattern of Sarahs jumper? Looks amazing! .... found it, it's "rainberry" by Fay Kennington 😁 this is a really interesting discussion! I recently downloaded a pattern from Purl Soho and was happy, that you are able to delete a lot of informational stuff to print out only the essentials for me. I do this pretty often by copying stuff into word to size the pattern down to my needs. This makes it easyer and I really appreciated it.

[@techtiptalks]

Sarah here: Rainberry was a pattern I edited and decided I needed to have on my body. It's a great pattern, but I ended up modifying it substantially to match the yarn I wanted to use.

[@karendavis7278]

This was fascinating. I am not planning on designing patterns to publish, but I learned so much from this interview. Thanks to the three of you.

[@genier7829]

This was a very interesting interview, thanks! I learned to knit from KZbin in 2020, but even I think some digital patterns are overwhelming in their length and sort of heavy handed. I recently knit a very complex cabled sweater from a 1989 Vogue Knitting issue. It was less than one page, including the photo and very minimal chart. It came out just fine, and everything I needed was there. For example, they simply wrote 'sew pieces together', so I had to figure it out myself. It gave me real satisfaction to see that I could do it successfully on my own. I do think the large Instagram test knits are more about marketing than testing. I have done several test knits where subtleties of language and technical details were confusing for some testers, despite tech editing in the original language.

[@cathiapizetta4957]

Thank you for such interesting subject discussion and lovely interview. It’s always a pleasure to watch your podcasts. ❤️

[@goswamigeeta]

Very interesting episode. Thank you.

[@mongrain8934]

Such a relevant subject of discussion. ❤❤❤

[@NYKnitter]

Loved the interview . Thank you, great topic. I watch for all the new episodes of Knit Talk with a Tech Editor by Meaghan - "The Unapologetic Knitter"

[@robinishmael7980]

I just saw a pattern this week that was for a beanie hat that was so confusing until I realized that the punctuation was missing between the crochet tasks. As for the internet and knitting and crocheting, I am one of those people that appreciates the detailed tutorials. I have limited knowledge as to types of stitches and terminology. I appreciate both written and charted instruction and detailed visual instruction. And I appreciate people like you who are aware that not everyone was taught knitting by their Grandmother and has a wealth of knowlege going into a new project. Thanks for your wealth of knowledge.

[@theastewart6721]

Terrific interview Roxanne. It was great to get a look inside the world of tech editing!

[@ellenhenrie4826]

Great interview! A succinct, well-written pattern is a pleasure to knit.

[@raquellak6551]

Thanks for the interesting topic! Although I knew about the existence tech editors before, this has made me want to look into it more for myself and find out more about what kind of training goes into being a great tech editor.

[@liesbeeckelaers3031]

This wa so interesting !!! I had no idea. Thank you ❤👍

[@nicolelafontaine1720]

Thank you for this very important topic, and for the great interview(s).

[@tomdevlin2791]

Very informative video! Thank you for taking the time to create this.

[@Rose-xc7wz]

I have had great experience with patterns and less than great experiences with patterns. The great experiences were actually ones that when I had a question because of a small difference in the result than what was expected, the designer responded, clarified or sent out a revision due to a mistake that was discovered. I am experienced enough to rip back, reknit and ask for additional clarification. I can modify to make it work but what I often want is what was created originally. The less than great experiences are the ones that get dismissed (we had an office knit along and didn't have an issue) or flat ignored when asking for clarification. If a company has customer service, is selling a kit and especially if that is the only way to get the pattern, the least they can do is respond to a question. I have recharted and gone with my chart on 2 like this.

[@andreabrancato7808]

What a great episode. I totally agree with you that patterns now are essentially mini books. That is very helpful for someone like me who is an intermediate knitter but I don’t have much experience with sweater knitting. I fell in love with a free Rowan pattern a few years ago and started the project - the pattern is minimal - partially because it was free and partially, I believe, because of the European style - they assume you have certain knowledge and they do not hold your hand. I made lots of mistakes and assumptions and now have a partially made sweater in a project bag and I cringe every time I look at it - my resolution this year was to go back to it and fix the mistakes and finish it - well it’s October and its still in the project bag - I have a few months to get to it - I will!

[@susannegulde5725]

Excellent information. Thank you!

[@claudiafigueiredo7969]

Wow! I loved this episode. Thank you.

[@GiseleBonenfant]

Thank you for this! This is SO important and a poorly written pattern can make or break.a new knitter. Not to call anyone out, but I will not use a pattern by Drops Design because I find the writing of their patterns hurts my brain. No matter how much I love what it looks like, I won't even attempt it. Thank you again!!!

[@mariehansen2534]

Hi there, thank you for your visit and your really interesting topic today. I never knew anything about that, I just thought when someone said they had a group of test knitters, they would be the ones who tested the pattern and sorted mistakes. So much to learn when the brain is nearly full of useful information. I am going to head off now, my friend and I are go to an Agricultural and Pastoral Show, A&P Show for short. We have a blueish sky but there is a gale blowing from the mountains, its coming from Australia so its warm but I am not sure if we will be able to stand up in the wind. I guess we can look, at the crafts and other exhibits. I hope you are keeping well and that you enjoyed your break with your daughter and her family. Please take care and I will see you when I'm looking at you.

[@Prinzenelleke]

Tech editing, yes! Of course! It should be a searchable variable in the Ravelry pattern database.

[@sonjanordahl3158]

I will never try to write a pattern for others to follow. That being said thank you one and all. Very interesting and informative.

[@Sequoya]

Great episode!

[@tomatotamale4546]

Great conversation! I'd love to know what people think is appropriate to pay tech editors and test knitters?

[@trishgould25]

I love Sarah's sweater/top

[@techtiptalks]

Sarah here: Thanks! It's a heavily modified Rainberry by Faye Kennington. btw an excellent pattern that has been edited.

[@judyhbaker]

Fascinating!

[@deniseengel1451]

Great interview.

[@teripersing]

Very interesting!😊

[@vadec5909]

Very Interesting!

[@sarabelle0312]

I've known of tech editing, but for some reason I've forgotten that it's an accessible job. As a new knitting mom, I can now check their site and look at a new job. Thanks ❤️

[@sonjanordahl3158]

Perfection is a goal to strive for. But what is perfect for one is not perfect for all. Just my opinion.

[@1014-m6s]

I may be in the minority, but I find the huge new patterns a nuisance and I avoid them. I do not want to read a book before I sit down to start. Every pattern does not have to teach the person how to knit.