Would you stay in Korea for LIFE? | Korean Pizza Club | EP.17

Foreigners who have lived in Korea for over 10 years talk about their decision to either live or leave the country with multiple angles of consideration (language, relationship, opportunity, living cost, vibe and more)
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🎤 Host: David Kim @justdavid_92
👫 Guests: Alex @itsalexsigrist / Mike @mikole86 @murican_mike /
April @april_lynn_777
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Timestamps
00:00 Teaser
07:54 Guests’ origin stories
20:00 Language
24:45 Cost of living
20:20 Safety and security
33:56 Fun and entertainment
38:50 Education and career
50:15 Culture and society
57:46 Advices for people who want to live in Korea

[@koreanpizzaclub]

Support the podcast and get early access, unedited full versions, exclusive bonus podcasts on Patreon - patreon.com/KoreanPizzaClub 🎤 Host: David Kim @justdavid_92 👫 Guests: Alex @itsalexsigrist / Mike @mikole86 @murican_mike / April @april_lynn_777 1⃣ Korean Pizza Club All-in-one link linktr.ee/koreanpizzaclub

[@sailor_sam3419]

i’m curious to hear about the perspective of foreigners in korea who don’t work in the entertainment industry. most of the foreigners on KPC have been models, content creators, entertainers, etc. i think there was one foreign woman who is a professor at yonsei who was on the show. it would’ve been cool to hear more about her journey. anyway, i think this could be an interesting episode if you’re able to find the people for it 🙏🏼 big fan of your channel 👍🏼

[@samanthaalexis5877]

Definitely need the perspective of people who are not in the entertainment business like students or people who are still currently teachers/other professions. Also need the perspective of people who live in rural areas and not Seoul. My life here in Korea is VERY different than most of the people who come on the podcast. Not saying I haven't had some of the same experiences as the guest but for my day to day life, it's different.

[@babychicky14]

Exactly

[@vidhyais]

Agree. Korea has a vibrant tech/ automobile industry. Would like to hear from immigrants and Koreans working there.

[@muricanmike]

What’s up? I don’t work in entertainmentish. I just have my own social media channels, but I worked for schools and business with companies (I’m in the podcast here 😅).

[@samanthaalexis5877]

@@muricanmike your incite was good as someone who doesn't live in Seoul or directly in entertainment. I guess from the OP and my perspective is the vast majority of the guests on the show are in entertainment, modeling, content creators/influencers and not everybody who moves to Korea would do that or on their level. I have KZbin but I don't keep up with my channels the way I would want to(don't judge me lol). I guess it would be a change to get the perspective of someone who is like an "average joe" in Korea. I live in Jeollanam-do in very rural area as a teacher so my experience might be a little different than some of the guests. I know of few of them came as teachers so they might have been through the same things, but their careers or paths have shifted so everybody might not be able to relate. I've loved all the episodes and everybody's incite, but I think a problem I had before coming to Korea was some of the things that I saw or was told about Korea was not what I encountered when I got here. Now granted, I completely understand everybody's experience is different but it's just helpful to get the perspective of people from different backgrounds and maybe live in different areas of Korea. Definitely don't want you to feel these comments were in any way a slight on you or other guests and your experiences here.

[@SunnySage122]

This was great to watch as someone who lived in Korea for 5 yrs and never once needed a car to get around (I'm contemplating returning within a year). I definitely agree that not knowing the language definitely isolates you from being more immersed in the culture, navigating daily tasks independently, and having a wider circle of friends that includes Koreans (not just other foreigners). I think having Korean friends can be grounding, especially if your expat friends are short-term residents. When they leave, you have to make new friends all over... I realize my decision to leave Korea was based on not feeling as integrated into the society due to the language barrier, however, I realize I was choosing to not be fluent, so I take responsibility for that. Now though, I'm studying Korean more diligently now and plan to continue until I gain fluency. I'm already fluent in Spanish, so I'm confident I can learn Korean too 😊

[@fangirl7914]

I don't know. I've worked pretty hard on my Korean (could always work harder of course) but have found it hasn't really changed my social circle or 'integration' at all. Of the people I know married to Koreans, most speak basic Korean at best. The foreigners I've known with the best Korean weren't very social and didn't go out much. Majority of socially outgoing Korean people I meet have very good English anyways. As I've stayed longer, (and as I've moved out of my early and mid twenties) I've been able to build a pretty solid circle of friends that have all been here 4+ years. Building new friendships as an adult takes a lot of time and effort that I'm less inclined to put in and I feel Korean adults my age feel the same, regardless of language barrier.

[@giovanaspiller]

07:54 Guests’ origin stories 20:00 Language 24:45 Cost of living 20:20 Safety and security 33:56 Fun and entertainment 38:50 Education and career 50:15 Culture and society 57:46 Advices for people who want to live in Korea

[@diannainkorea]

The reference at 50:40 "Sign me up!" I literally laughed out loud. The whole topic of this podcast was very interesting to hear whether staying long term or not. I've met many people who've stayed short term and ended up moving back home. Don't think that will be my case. I'm heading to 8 years soon.

[@flocontour9682]

I hear many young people complain about housing costs here in the US, especially in the cities - where most of the work is. It seems to be a common problem. This was very interesting! Is there any chance you might be able to do this with people living in Korea from other places such as Europe, South America, Africa??

[@tallylight7952]

I think every country and city has it's pros and cons. Living in the US as not as dangerous as the media often depicts and even if tipping rates have increased, you use your discretion about if the service was worth it or not. I never feel pressured about tipping. However job culture and family dynamics would be game changers for sure. Korea does not seem to have a proper work/life balance and the pressure to accumulate wealth for housing or keep up with others and what they think with the drinking culture/ networking game might not be for everyone. The grass always seems greener on the other side. This was a very interesting topic ❤ Keep up the good work David!

[@SirFingerLickin]

I live in San Diego which is a pretty expensive place to live. I don’t know anyone that tips more than 20%. That fear of gun violence is pretty overstated also. Yes, gun violence is way too common here, but I don’t worry about getting shot every day. It very much would depend on where you live. It’s a huge country, and there are good, safe parts of every state/city, and there are bad/dangerous areas as well.

[@zakithitwala2203]

OMG! FINALLY!!!!!!!!!! I have been checking for a new episode for weeks now. Haven't watched yet, I just HAD to get that off my chest. I'm so HAPPY!!! 😂🎉 Let me watch and I'll write a proper comment on the episode😊

[@krystavi05]

In the U.S., the only people (that I know of) that actually survive on tips is waitstaff in sit-down restaurants (not including buffets and restaurants where you pick up your own order at a designated place), so it's safe to say you don't need to tip anyone besides them unless you want to. Everyone else makes a general wage that isn't dependent on tips (whether that wage is high/low is beside the point. They knew the wage when they accepted that job). Workers is the US need to stop trying to supplement their income with tips from customers instead of demanding fair wages from their employers. David, thanks for another great episode. I love this podcast because of the insights into Korean living/culture from different perspectives (local and foreign). As a woman, I would love to hear more about what Mike mentioned regarding marrying into the Korean culture and the expectations/responsibilities that come with that. Don't worry about tipping so much. Just avoid those sit-down restaurants, and for the rest, just pretend you didn't see the tip jar lol. Your money is your own. You worked hard for it and only you get to decide how to spend it. Blessings!! ETA: avoid delivery services which also seems to rely heavily on tips. Plan your meals and know what food places are around you, instead. ✌️

[@allday.pizzaparty]

I used to research this topic in 2020 pre- and during covid, and the answers would be more or less, "living in Korea is difficult for foreigners." And now, almost three years later, due to various changing factors, Korea is more welcoming. You just need them dolla dolla beelz doe

[@Anonymous_422]

David this video is a bliss and so much useful especially for a newbie adult who's gonna settle here real soon......thank u delicious pizza with useful toppings ❤

[@kalmtraveler]

Alex hit the nail on the head of life in suburban America. I try explaining this to people as far as why I can't see myself staying in it for any longer but they just don't understand.

[@slavvalb3933]

Very interesting discussion 👍👍👍. Love KPC ! Thank you for inviting Mike . He is so articulate !!

[@MadeleineJosephineTozer]

He seems so nice and respectful

[@slavvalb3933]

@@MadeleineJosephineTozer Mike is always like that. He is very funny too, 👍

[@muricanmike]

Y’all are too kind 😂

[@slavvalb3933]

@@muricanmike 😀😀👍 truth Mike

[@giovanaspiller]

Living in South Korea seems to be a good option for people in their 20s, but could it be an interesting option for people a bit older?

[@curiousgeorgia11.11]

No

[@katieguid2005]

Great insights. Kudos to David for another great show ♥️

[@TizzyB23]

I’ve made the decision to move to SK. I’m learning the language so I won’t have the language barrier issue. My concern is I’m 51 and single and I wonder what that’s like in SK. I don’t see much content from older Koreans. My mind and heart is still 30’s but at the end of the day the reality of being older makes a difference on the quality of life. Would you be interested in talking about what is like for older people both Korean and Foreigners?

[@life_withandy]

I originally came here as a teacher and I’m currently a student. I met some people who came in their late 30’s/ early 40’s. Some found the language classes more difficult but from what I saw they enjoyed their time here in Korea. You may not be going to Hongdae like the university students but there are a lot of great exhibitions around. Also if you go outside of Seoul there are so many beautiful places tourists don’t usually see!

[@LG-rw6zf]

100% about the shootings in the US. Just this weekend there were three incidents. When I go out with my family, I always look for exits. Just the way it is.

[@willdanger6833]

no its not

[@17Chanty]

Interesting topics, good panel. More and more I’m excited to visit and experience Korea next year.

[@jumpsuitgirl3835]

This was really fun! Thank you to the guests who shared their experiences, it's always so interesting getting to learn more about these things.

[@mosuperset5963]

please make more episodes or longer ones. I know your busy. awesome episode and it was very eye opening. Thank you

[@colleenrodamer9497]

Love ur show thanks for sharing this with us ❤

[@koreanpizzaclub]

Thanks for watching!

[@shannonhill6938]

Love your show David ! It's wild how tipping always finds its way into the conversation 😊 If the percentage that I want to tip is not listed, I give/leave cash. Also, one guest mentioned being able to save money due to not needing a vehicle. Man, to not have that expense would awesome, but...I live in Texas, close to the Gulf. With the amount of distance we have to cover(sometimes less than 3 hours but can be up to 12--and still not cross the border) just to get to another city (for fun or work) can be daunting. Add in monster storms rolling in off the Gulf, I cannot imagine not having a car. 😳

[@Menow871]

Love the content and the diversity of the panel. David and April have serious couple vibes.

[@skier___7843]

What about women's safety concerning patriarchy and rights? I'm considering visiting SK for service design masters studies for six months and as a woman from Finland (one of the safest countries in the world for women). Reading a lot of scary stories from constant harrasments, I'm hesitating... ;(

[@user-yh7kf2mc8q]

i can say that patriarchy of korea is almost disappeared now. im korean and 26yo male. i'm not speaking for all korean boys but that's definetly exaggerated. If its anything, recent general korean boys are always try to be nice to all female. it's a matter of course to be nice for everyone! although there are some of dumbass but they are not representing korean society. As you know, the beginning of korea was a confucian country. So if you meet some elder koreans you might feel patriarchy from their words and behaviors. The result of the opposition of confucian is now korean feminism. But they are getting redical and crazy these days. Beyond protecting their rights, they are always hating korean male. Please do not believe in few cases.

[@giovana3988]

1:12 April's voice reminded me of a legendary Brazilian children’s tv program called Castelo Rá-Tim-Bum. There was a segment where two women wearing bird costumes sang and taught the name of a musical instrument, and her voice sounds like one of the 'birds' :)

[@karenbee4014]

Great episode! I agree about what you all had to say about violence, especially in the USA. I live in a small town and we had an active shooter at our annual festival with fatalities. Never would I have imagined that it would happen in my town!

[@peacelife]

Love the guests and the chat. Great stories sharing. So fun! 😂❤ I feel like S.Korea especially the big cities have so many things to do and explore. Safety and Healthcare are so good. Those 2 are what I value the most but the U.S is so bad with it.

[@wildrice3050]

The tip options in the US are ridiculous. We went to a popular restaurant in Newport Beach, CA, the "other" and "custom" options have been removed. We're forced to tip with what's on the screen.

[@SpringRae]

If I was not given the option to choose my own amount, that’s a sign that no tip would be left. It’s all a plow so that those at the top don’t have to pay their employees a livable wage. I’m not encouraging that cycle.

[@ssibal.inu1]

Wow, that's such BS

[@zakithitwala2203]

Awesome group of people you had today. I loved hearing their insight. They made me wanna come to Korea so much more. I plan on visiting for a month next year and the who knows what will happen after. Maybe I'll also become a Lifer. Great show, as always

[@KathyakaNina]

I think I’m a bit more city fast life then the slow life. I’m born & raised in LA & not to far from many things that happen around like concerts & events. Though I might want to move out & live elsewhere in the future. With what Alex said in making more & being more tired, I definitely want more stability too.

[@AisheKaise]

Thanks to the perks of having a strong passport, Americans can be so reassured to have a good life and opportunities no matter where they go in the world and still be seen as valuable. Not the case for others sadly.

[@katherinejimenezmatos2009]

In an ideal world(as this is what I'm currently looking for 😅), I would prefer to have a US job with remote work option, and live in Korea or Thailand, as I will maximize my savings with the cost that I will be saving from living outside of US. As a data scientist, I could get easily 30 to 40% more with the avg US salary when compared to the avg salary of data scientist in Korea.

[@MissRayneNerdiiChicK]

There is a new visa coming that is just that, working remote whilst living in Korea. Not sure when it's coming in effect, but I think late this year to early next year.

[@rebeccacristobal7511]

Thanks!

[@rebeccacristobal7511]

David, wish you the best on your trip to Los Angeles. I leave near L. A. Welcome to California.

[@AbdulAli-ku9he]

15:18 veru True point here in Canada as well.

[@tanpokio]

I came to Seoul from time to time for work and often incorperate some times for travel. I like the countrysides of SK but not Seoul for leisure activities (most expats I met share the same view). I know how expensive Seoul can get. A quick google search gives an average salary number of a person in Seoul to be about a bit more than 3k (US dollars), lets assume it is entry level (which it should not always be the case because I know many labour as well as office people live on less). To be honest, I dont know how can a person with an average income of 3k can sustain a good life in such a city like Seoul. After paying rent or monthly mortage (which I can guess is crazy), the rest if being divided among food, transport, some essentials, and some social life (eating and drinking out) there should be nothing left if not in short. In Thailand, 3k would give a young person quite a relaxing life with some extra for saving each month so at least one can travel from time to time. The transport system in SK is rearlly very great though, but to live far from city (to save cost of housing) and work there requires so much travelling time and most of the time the bus/metro is full so you stand for long period of commuting. It is exhausting. Life is so exhaustive in Seoul if it is a life of work and sustain oneself. One does not have time and money for personal growth activities. Not to mention pet, then a family. Really I understand why local people in Seoul dont want family anymore. I saw on google that average salary for women in Seoul is even less than men so it is so shitty for them to sustain themselves if they don’t live with families there. And as a woman, it is clear to us that we have some extra needs to spend rather than men (lets not say even without buying fashion and cosmetics we still meed to spend more on basic necessities as a woman). To be honest if it is Seoul, I would leave if I dont have a source of support from family and only earn basic income. And to earn above a local and some white guys, people of color like South East Asians, even with the same degree, must work xxxtra, according to my college friend who has lived and worked in Seoul for several years. She later was very happy to move to Australia and could bid farewell to Seoul. These kids in hipster places of Seoul must earn so much or live on their parents too much. Or too much in debt? “My Liberation Notes” speak more to many local people than other kdrama series because it feels real I guess.

[@tanpokio]

I would add that the income info is before tax.

[@AlexSigrist]

So, which one of the four here will leave Korea first? 🤔

[@-ydk]

maybe I am projecting but yall do not believe that future will be ok. I sensed the drowning feeling of despair you all are emanating.

[@mitzkt1679]

Hearing from different sources over there it sounds like people who move to Korea to teach English are looked down upon. Is that the case? Are teaching jobs just a gateway to move to Korea?

[@muricanmike]

Depends. I worked at two international schools and they always looked at me differently.

[@jw841]

Status is super important in Korean society. What you do matters. And yes many Koreans do look down on English teachers. Its very similar in Japan as well. In short if you want a great life in Korea as a guy. Be tall, around 180cm, have a job that gives you some kind of status and earn at least over $5000 per month.

[@fangirl7914]

While teaching jobs are definitely a gate way, actually moving out of teaching is quite difficult and honestly I'm not sure of it's worth it. Most people who move to Korea as teachers are very into traveling or Kpop. We're happy to have a tiny apartment, no car, and a decent amount of money to travel frequently or attend all the concerts and get the merch we want. We might not be 'impressive' but most of the time we don't have the same priorities as Korean people anyways. So it's a redundant point.

[@sarahm2005]

The thing is that not everybody is an American ☠️

[@marlena9860]

There have been other episodes that feature other nationalities. Check out those episodes.

[@sarahm2005]

@@marlena9860 Already seen them all.

[@marlena9860]

@sarahm2005 then you know they don't just interview Americans, cool beans.

[@sarahm2005]

@@marlena9860 "Korea is welcoming all foreigners"... is it?

[@marlena9860]

@sarahm2005 technically yes, that's what the government says but as in ANY culture, there will be people who are opposed and have reservations. I mean, have you looked at America and our "Give me your tired, your poor your hungry" and we have seen people opposed to that as well. Korea, as a government, is welcoming all kinds of people to come and live, for a myriad of reasons. The people of Kore are being inclusive to a point. Don't expect a seismic shift in a short time unless you just want to be disappointed.

[@francisimanuel8824]

I like hearing everyone’s reasons. But our reason would be to move closer to my husband’s family. For our son to be closer to grandpa.

[@LAartist2015]

Crime depends on where you live in the US. There are safe and dangerous neighborhoods. But yes, the US doesn’t have the threat of North Korea and nuclear bomb attack. S. Korea is still a young country and low population,…salary and benefits are really bad in Korea compared to US companies. Why do young Koreans want to leave Korea? Great topics!👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

[@TheRandomRoxy]

I'm also a 'lifer', I've been here more than 5 years... There's no reason to leave for me 🤣

[@kalvin1123]

Is the voice acting market big in Korea? How does it work compared to the US?

[@Anna08371]

I’m curious about those who are in Korea on a spouse visa. They’re not bound to entertainment… I think it would be very interesting

[@CindyPoole-oj7ed]

I live in America and it must be doordash you're paying 30% tips or maybe New York City. 90% of the time you're not paying 30% tips. You don't have to even tip if you don't want to in most places

[@tonyaschuder1163]

I think you said, you're dating an American woman? What ever nationality, so HAPPY FOR YOU. You are a lovely man. Congratulations, I wish you much love..❤

[@jordansarkisian]

Definitely felt less safe in the states ever since the turn of the century, something changed in the culture for sure. Feels like I have to have the map awareness of Faker when I leave the house I'm looking all over the place just walking in public. Sad that some peoples solution is to "just give everyone a gun so we can all fight crime" cuz that doesn't make me feel more free or safe in the slightest.

[@icingcake]

😢 yeah - I think we Americans are so desensitized to it it’s almost like a waste of time to talk about it sadly - too many crazy people in the news every day 🤦🏻‍♀️

[@raenakim-geyer]

There are new smaller cities popping up, I’ve heard. More geared towards families. There’s another YT channel that shows that.

[@st2251a]

I do hope you have a fun time in L.A . and how about doing your show in L.A.

[@icingcake]

51:30 Lol “make some babies for Korea”!!

[@ThePurpleYarnivore]

Im curious if older people move to Kore, like people in thier 40's and up. I get the impression that a move to Korea is only for the young. What is the dating scene like for older people? I love watchinh this channel, but i relate only as i mightve been 15-20 years ago. Is there a place for those not young but not elderly?

[@rubee8058]

Have you thought about having the same type of conversation but with non american foreigners? Specifically from safe countries. I've heard some people, particularly women, talking about how unsafe they felt. American, Indian and Brasilian, for instance, talk about being able to walk alone at night. For me that was never a problem. I've worked in restaurants in "night life" areas since 14yo and walking even through those places at 3am or 4am was never remotely dangerous (or going to bars and clubs after, at 16yo, of course, when it's legal). Even if I get drunk as a small girl and now woman (I'm 150cm) it's not scary. People help you and take care of you if they see you need.

[@octoberashley7304]

Is there an age limit to moving there? I live in the US, and I am planning to visit next year after I complete my degree in mental health counseling. I am not sure, but I don't think I can work in my fields of study there. I will have two different healthcare licenses but...

[@r.chiwon1708]

If housing prices in Seoul are considered expensive then housing prices in where I live (Singapore) are out of this world. Just like Koreans too, most Singaporean’s dreams are also to own a house!

[@cindypoole6792]

I may have not heard, but did David cover wages? From my understanding, the minimum wage, in Korea, is below $3. and if you have to have at least $10,000. for an apartment deposit, I'm curious how much would you have to make or what profession would you have to be to live in Seoul?

[@kimckawa]

Minimum wage is 10-11$. Avg annual income is around $30K

[@leeroyjenkins867]

please add cards/chapters

[@americaneagle76]

🤔

[@ssibal.inu1]

4:51 Alex making a joke about the term "lifer" drawing a sneaky analogy to the n-word

[@muricanmike]

What??? Don’t see the connection.

[@grownsimba8120]

@@muricanmike Believe what they're referring to is when he himself said using the hard "ER" when saying "lifer".

[@HolyCreamPuffs]

Was this filmed before all the stabbings

[@muricanmike]

Yes. It sure was.

[@Caroleenakoreaadventures]

So, am I the only woman in Korea who gets regularly approached by men in the subway station and other public places. Like are all the men in Korea are just saving their crazy for me? I wish Koreans hated small talk...

[@laughter95]

As long as you actually have a skilled real job in the US (not hard if you tried in HS or community college to transfer to a decent uni and have a real degree) you will almost always make more and net more in the US than Korea.

[@kimckawa]

Not necessarily due to cost of living in US is more especially transportations and medicals.

[@Anna08371]

Entirely false lol. Many people have moved to Korea to make 2k a month despite having a 6digit yearly income in the states…. And they stayed for years happier than ever. Interesting…

[@elenahilman9060]

David, I really love your show, but maybe you could be a little more responsible when choosing your guests. You are discussing such a topic and all your guests are Americans. They have the same pros and cons of living in Korea. Americans don't even need a visa to enter your country. People from other countries would give different reasons and talk about completely different experiences. Or how you had a topic about the "No kids zone", where none of the 4 speakers had children. I think the parents would express their point of view that could make others think. Also, I agree with the comment above that all your guests work either as models, or content creators or English teachers... But, I repeat, I love your channel. I'm just expressing my point of view as a viewer.

[@linnysheff]

VERY-VERY TRUE!!!!

[@isabellepearl625]

We want Arab guests next time❤

[@ssibal.inu1]

April is the equivalent of the mexican day laborers or chinese/korean restaurant workers in the US who can barely speak English.

[@zahrabjinu]

How about Westerners who are good value,educated and not running away from their problems back home and find Asia accommodating ? Living more than 5 years and don’t know korean ? Consider the brain drain from Asia to the West.Most people who immigrate are educated,hardworking from good families.

[@jenniferjeon3153]

Disgraceful... to live somewhere and not speak the language. 🤨🙄

[@davidkrall1046]

This entire conversation is BS. If you guys love Korea so much, enjoy. However, trashing the US serves no purpose. Making fun of Americans is not right either.

[@marlena9860]

I mean the US has a lot to trash talk about. Love my country but that doesn't mean that we shouldnt call out this the BS that goes on here on a regular basis. They are gonna of course pull from their experiences as AMERICANS who live in Korea.

[@SpringRae]

I would not say the entire conversation, but as an American I do feel like we have all been lumped together as gun toting people. America is much more than that. Maybe we just need to hear a few more positives. They did hint on one, I would never give up my extra roomy 1600 sqft town home I have down here in the suburban South to permanently live in a one bedroom apartment in the city.

[@mizzhelloo]

Someone’s triggered lol

[@kimckawa]

Our MSM trash talks other countries 24/7...there's sense of lawlessness in America right now. From mass shooting every other day, to carjacking/robberies, hate crimes against Asians/black etc..store lootings and closing. Shit really gonna hit the fan come election 2024....Wake up!

[@chiyuku]

there’s actually a yearly list where the safest countries are ranked and the US is very low and the SK is very high. Objectively US is less safe, healthcare is horrendous, and cost of living gets worse every year. These are all jus facts not even trash talking america