Ladder Bach Pre Amplifier World Premiere

[@leonardoortiz393]

I purchased one of this preamps, and so far I absolutely love it, it makes my Macintosh MC 2125 sound incredible playing through my Tannoy system 15 MK2

[@robk5745]

Wow what a deal this unit is! Thanks for getting these new units in so quick.

[@cpodurnell3701]

I purchased one used and it is wonderful. I have it paired with Gallion amp; it is fantastic. At the price, it is a giant killer. It replaced my LAB 12 pre, a $2,400 piece.

[@Infynyte]

Another great review, thank you! How is the Gustard P26 preamp compared with this Ladder? Any preference? I'm looking for a preamp under 1000$ too and those two are on my final favourites. Kind regards!

[@theodoroschronis2966]

Hello! Compared to Aune S17 Pro purely as a preamp, which sounds best according to your opinion?

[@gabrieljung6763]

Excellent review like always! Thank you very much. The Ladder Bach looks similar to Denafrips Hestia. Very curious which one will be better.

[@phetmoz]

It's the same product. Different name. Literally made by the same designers.

[@net_news]

@@phetmoz yeap they look the same!!

[@fletchermunson6225]

75% of all music is streamed and 25% is split between CDs and LPs, approximately. The trouble with steaming is the volume levels are not matched and one tune on a playlist can require a different volume level to sound right. Not a problem if you want to put on a CD and listen all the way through but that doesn't seem to be how the industry is tending. In the case of streaming a remote might be considered mandatory not a luxury. It's like Denon not putting Pre or sub outs on their more expensive integrated amplifiers. A glaring omission and they only put a single sub out on their cheapest models. Not everyone wants to add high output wires from the speaker terminals nor may they have a sub that take anything but low volume inputs.

[@Tharbamar]

Yes I totally hear you but for streaming If you're using Roon or Audirvana they do have built in volume leveler in case if you are not aware of it, thanks

[@fletchermunson6225]

@@Tharbamar Good to know. Thanks.

[@PaulClay46masonWV]

Yes, Room does, but i use Roon sometimes or coaxial, toslink on cdp. I guarantee that Ladder would sale more units to raise that to 959.00 and go back and add a Alps remote controllable on revision 2. I was inerested because of R2R but im one that won’t touch it. I see no reason to not add one on anything with volume control today. Just my opinion

[@victor1927]

Thanks for your wonderful reviews. I would really like to hear your opinion about two new DACs from SMSL - D400EX VS D400ES.

[@Tharbamar]

Noted

[@victor1927]

@@Tharbamar Ok, Two AK4499EX against one ES9039MSPRO😊

[@eddievega1100]

Best wishes enjoy the digs 🎉

[@ocme9210]

You compared the Ladder Bac to your beloved 20 year old Denon PMA 2000 IV Preamp and said it made it sound like a joke. Did you have a chance to connect it to your newer Denon PMA-SX11 Amplifier for comparison? Thank you

[@Tharbamar]

Yes Ladder is neutral SX-11 is a bit warmer, thanks

[@benoitdugas745]

Great setup and review sounds fantastic even on youtube

[@Jil8840]

There are two amps that look identical with this!!!!!! Musician Monoceros and Denafrips Hestia!!!!!!!

[@carlitomelon4610]

The Monoceros has a different red circuit board (One less group of power supply caps near the output). Reputed to have a warm presentation, which is why I'm considering it instead ... No photos out there of the Ladder Bach circuit. Might be identical to the Monoceros?

[@raeelliott8880]

I have the Denafrips. I wish someone would compare them to see what difference there might be in sound quality. What I found a little silly, is that this guy also did a review on the Denafrips but he never compared them.

[@carlitomelon4610]

Very interested in the silver option, however: WHY can't a microprocessor controlled volume control be setup with a BALANCE CONTROL feature?? Those of us with asymmetric hearing or room layouts are waiting for this feature! Maybe add the BALANCE CONTROL feature to the $50 remote control option? 🎵🎶🎶😮🎶🎵

[@eddihaskell]

All my high-end equipment does not have any tone controls, including my integrated amps and preamps. For example, my old Jolida integrated tube amp and my Music Hall integrated amp have no tone controls. I remember my Tara Labs Passge preamp did not have one either.

[@carlitomelon4610]

@@eddihaskell I was complaining about the lack of a balance control on most preamplifiers, Eddie 🤔

[@eddihaskell]

@@carlitomelon4610 same thing on preamps really. The high end preamps today lack balance controls for the most part. The ones in the 89's had bells and whistles -- usually with a "bypass" switch since all these controls add noise. I see your point though :).

[@AttilaBalla87]

Since then this preamp is available with remote too.

[@SHENZHENAUDIO]

Thanks for review! Take care!

[@TheNaka9]

Looks interesting but no remote?!! Deal breaker for sure

[@carlitomelon4610]

There is a remote for an extra $50

[@wisehybred]

I’m looking at getting the topping a70 pro but then saw this video. Which one would you choose? Is this one worth the jump in price?

[@Tharbamar]

This is a real keeper for me personally paring with Class D mono blocks they work really great together but if you want most transparency and quiet noise floor go with A70 Pro, thanks

[@20CycleMonger]

Denafrips Hestia comparison please? Youve reviewed both.

[@net_news]

they are the same device I think... they look suspiciously similar

[@PaulClay46masonWV]

Oooh, No volume control is a huge deal. There’s no set it and forget it when in comes to music. 16 bit, 24 bit, mqa all come out at different volume and theres no way id purchase a preamp today without a volume control. It’s a big complaint.

[@Tharbamar]

Volume control? You meant to say RC? There is set it forgot it volume leveling feature in Roon or Audirvana in case if you are not aware of it.

[@redstarwraith]

Man, it's on sale for a few days right now! $791.12!!!

[@gettcharged4982]

$764 on amazon

[@lesarnolfinis6775]

Another Ladder product looking just like a Denafrips; the Hestia in this case. Please show us the inside, in journalist fashion and tell us more about the origin of the Ladder company.

[@Tharbamar]

This is the first one looking like it from outside but not the Schumann DAC, I will have ask their permission and let you guys know.

[@xyzDonaldxyz]

Right. What is the origin and the company profile of “Ladder”?

[@beaverish]

Probably came from the same factory that makes Denafrips and Musician Audio products.

[@xyzDonaldxyz]

@@beaverish We're left to our own devices. We have to sit here and speculate as to who the company is and where this thing was made. This is ridiculous.

[@davido4872]

No remote "a good thing"? It's a preamp - not a desktop headphone amp. Most people (not all) won't even consider it if it doesn't have at least remote volume and mute. Enjoying good sound doesn't mean you have to be into masochism (-:

[@Tharbamar]

That is personal preference, I never want remote control in any of my two amplifiers.

[@alirezapouyafard5750]

You are right 1000%

[@beslemeto]

@@Tharbamar I agree!

[@easymike7176]

I use my Topping Pre 90 with fixed volume and control volume with the DAC remote because the Pre 90 remote sucks. Was going to return it just for that, but it sounds so good. So I kept it. Good point with the lack of a remote.

[@carlitomelon4610]

Remote now an option

[@eddihaskell]

How do you switch inputs? With the knob on left?

[@Tharbamar]

Yes

[@robertgreene1946]

Have you ever looked at the Pro-ject RS Pre Box preamp. It has 3 balanced inputs and 3 RCA 1 line level output on RCA for recording. And Balanced out for power amp. It's a class A desgin with tube output. I really love mine. Used with a VTV Purifi Eigentakt power amp.

[@Tharbamar]

Yes, I know you love it but I’m not a fan of all in one box. Thanks

[@Tharbamar]

@@cyphermote6857 You seems offended by simple comment and attacking personally. All I can say to you is grow up.

[@Davidbrompton58]

Hi, can you explain the advantages of not having a remote control?

[@Tharbamar]

Generally less component in signal path to get purest audio signal and inconvenient but this PreAmp has RC option, just have to buy RC separately for extra.

[@Davidbrompton58]

@@Tharbamarit actually comes with one now, my question stems from you saying its a good thing that there’s no remote control, why would you prefer to get up and change the volume or input rather than operate it from a seated position? Does this apply to your tv as well?

[@Tharbamar]

@@Davidbrompton58 I don’t care about remote control in general (for TV I can voice command via smart home) originally I thought they went with purist route because my sample unit doesn’t come with it nor stated in specs, and I know most Pre amps in this price range doesn’t come with top quality volume controls so simpler design is always better for audio quality.

[@nelsongracia]

Hi, is this a Class A preamp ? Thank you

[@Tharbamar]

Yes

[@librayak4651]

Hi Tharbamar, I wanted to buy a preamp ,don’t know what to choose ,ladder Bach or denafrips hestia, which one is more worth buying

[@Tharbamar]

They are pretty similar in performance, with and without RC, another great option is EverSolo DMP-A8 Review kzbin.info/www/bejne/hYrYe3-pm7ubfLM

[@librayak4651]

@@Tharbamar thanks for sharing Sir, but can this eversolo act as a preamp and DAC at the same time ?

[@edwinyak9041]

⁠@@Tharbamarthanks for sharing Sir, can the eversolo DMP-A8 act as a preamp and DAC at the same time?

[@HanifBarnwell]

Why aren’t the JBLs mirrored? I’m guessing the soundstage is not centered?!?

[@Tharbamar]

You’ll be surprised, mirroring is old news. It’s called cloning.

[@HanifBarnwell]

@@Tharbamar ok i need to audition one of these days.

[@rickp6731]

Add some Arya Audio Labs AirBlade HYPE Loudspeaker Drivers to your speakers to get that last 10% of sound quality ! 😍🤩😃Audio Heaven😇

[@fletchermunson6225]

Why is no remote control a good thing. I would not buy it for that omission.. Some of us couch potatoes are disabled.

[@Tharbamar]

I understood your point, It just personal preference.

[@azrecion]

Well, today it can be ordered with a remote control (it turns out that this was built into its design initially).

[@johan5660]

I am hearing the mid bass is a bit bloated and muddying vocal. I am not sure whether its the ladder preamp or the speakers that are causing it..

[@Tharbamar]

You are hearing the room gain.

[@wojciechczupta]

did anyone see the device interior? I can't find any photos

[@martinvegas1327]

Try the Ladder clock next👍

[@dougg1075]

Can I get that Denon integrated from you:)

[@easymike7176]

How does it compare to Topping Pre90?

[@Tharbamar]

Very different design but never had Pro90 to answer correctly.

[@easymike7176]

@@Tharbamar You have to review it when you have time. I own one and it's an excellent preamplifier.

[@acheresh]

promised r2r dacs comparison? :( "black friday" ends soon...

[@Tharbamar]

I got terrible flu but will try as soon as possible.

[@acheresh]

@@Tharbamar wish you good health!

[@liamporter1137]

Thanks for sharing.

[@siamxiii]

Will SMSL D300 benefit from external pre-amp? Or better upgrade it to SU-10?

[@Tharbamar]

Yes it will improve the sound if you have dedicated preamp. You don’t really need to upgrade the DAC I would suggest you to try Pre first even passive preamp will help.

[@siamxiii]

@@Tharbamar I'm going to try Topping Pre90, as I already ordered Topping LA90.

[@AjuVignesh]

@@siamxiii did you buy pre90 and did it improve the sound? I have a d300 and am considering to buy a pre90.

[@siamxiii]

@@AjuVignesh in the end I sold D300 and bought Gustard R26) And now planning to add P26.

[@AjuVignesh]

@@siamxiii Congrats :) How does D300 compare with R26? I know it is not an apples-to-apples comparison. Still wondering how good the upgrade was.

[@bernardoa.garciah.2316]

Thank you sir; great review, I enjoyed it so much. If you had to choose between Denafrips Hestia and Ladder Bach, which one would be your recommendation? I'm trying to decide between the two

[@Tharbamar]

you can't go wrong with either one, do you need remote control or not that will be major different, thanks

[@carlitomelon4610]

@@Tharbamar So they're the same sound? Which sounds warmer? Denafrips seem better established and has 3yr warranty, so there's that. Ladder remote is $50 extra but available;-) Then there's the Monoceros. $100 more. Different circuit and cool faceplate.... Ugh decisions, decisions!

[@Tharbamar]

@@carlitomelon4610 Personally I can’t advise you because sound is subjective but all of them are apparently made by same supplier.

[@carlitomelon4610]

@@Tharbamar Thanks for replying. You have had both in for review and can't identify any significant differences? I'm disappointed. The circuit boards and functions (Ladder has mute) are different even if made in the same factory ... So much for your "Influencer" status. Hmph🧐

[@carlitomelon4610]

@@Tharbamar Sorry I asked. My mistake. 🙄 I'm going with the Denafrips since Alvin has been so helpful and there's a better chance of ongoing tech support. 🙏

[@xyzDonaldxyz]

Why in the world would they bring this product to market without a remote volume control?

[@Tharbamar]

There are many people who don’t want RC, so Bach is for them.

[@xyzDonaldxyz]

@@Tharbamar It's shady. We don't know who the designer is. In fact, we know nothing whatsoever about the company or where this thing even came from.

[@Tharbamar]

Nothing is shady, no one is forcing you to buy it 🙃 very simple.

[@beaverish]

@@Tharbamar Nice job on telling your viewer to F off when his concern is valid one. Your viewers are potential buyers. You are not helping Ladder sell products with comment like this.

[@azrecion]

@@Tharbamar Well, it turns out that everyone who bought it earlier because of this is now simply obliged to get rid of it - for the reason that it turns out that remote control was originally provided in it, and today it can be ordered with a remote control for an additional fee (from which even the very first version of the device is perfectly controlled, so there are no changes in the design). It turns out that the rationale was very, how should I put it mildly, far-fetched...

[@eddievega1100]

Oh no , looks like you have some room for serous loudspeaker upgrades 😂

[@REX4340]

Sounds good! Probably not a 'great' pre amp tho... Try a Gryphon/Simaudio/Solution

[@michaelwright1602]

Looks like a Denafrips...

[@CarlosAlbertoEspinozaToledo]

Does it ladder bach have equalization settings for sound??? On the specs said it

[@Tharbamar]

There is No EQ, it just means enjoyable natural sound quality.

[@kopczas]

This is ridiculous : super big display but no remote, why would one need display like this if not to control volume from a distance? Another thing : 2x XLR 1x RCA make no sense since most devices are single-ended. I guess they could not figure out how to deal with ground loops on single ended connections. Another: it`s preamp so it should be able to cumulate inputs for variety of devices. With enclosure that big, they could fit inputs for 4-5 RCA`s, 1 XLR is enough, 2 is a luxury. For 450$ it would be something to think about for small room system, but with functionality highly limited 450$ I would consider as high price tag. For 900$ it`s ridiculous.

[@Tharbamar]

I would say please try to make a same quality enclosure for $450. Not going to happen by you or anyone let alone getting same quality craftsmanship. Talk is cheap and easy.

[@kopczas]

@@Tharbamar It`s great that manufacturer cared about details of it`s product such as enclosure but in this case it lacks some pretty basic functionality as preamp.

[@Tharbamar]

I should have mentioned that Pre Amp like Bach is designed for purists because more inputs and functions will increase the noise level, that is why one time I was using passive pre amp but to each of own.

[@kopczas]

@@Tharbamar If more inputs affects noise levels that means crappy design. There is no excuse in compromises in simple electronics like audio equipment. As I said, one RCA input shows that they could not figure out how to deal with ground loops which is funny actually, cause one relay would fix the issue. IR would not add any noise to circuit as well. Micro controller must be use to control relays of attenuation system so separation between analog ground and digital ground and all digital signals should be done by optoisolators (hopefully they did). It`s kinder garden engineering, no magic or rocket science there.

[@Tharbamar]

@Piotr Kopczyński One RCA input doesn't mean anything, in any type of amplifier with wide open inputs can cause noise no matter who makes them, noise is random no equipment can escape that in audio chain. I'm pretty resourceful with good connection but not gonna be able to make same quality product for this price. Question is can you or anyone make same quality product in this price point? This Pre is so good of quality and engineering for the price, none of HiFi brands have Preamp this good in this price point maybe except for Denafrips, sincerely.

[@Olaya_kawaii1922]

It seems really dry !

[@gettcharged4982]

Hmmm... sounds brass'y

[@AjuVignesh]

Looking at the way you respond to the comments and unnecessary justification for lack of remote, I guess this is a paid review.

[@Tharbamar]

I guess you don’t know how purists think.

[@TuneHead]

No remote? Really? I'm out.

[@carlitomelon4610]

Now a $50 option... Bach in?? 😅

[@wim1983]

Argh, not again another hell clicking sound when changing volume...

[@miquifaye]

No Remote is a Big deal Breaker. It’s 2022

[@azar3006]

Remote is an option now !