Lagoon 380 Catamaran bare-poles sailing, 50 knots, 20' seas (Ep6)

Seth and Elizabeth sail their boat, Honeymoon, from the island of Caracao to San Blas, Panama. Along the way they encounter a 32 hour storm dishing out up to 20 foot seas and 50 knot gusts. The boat sailed under bare poles and top speed peaked at 18.3 knots! Yikes. Learn more about their trip at www.sailblogs.com/member/honeymoon

[@TheSailingFamily]

Before you comment about the bottle, please watch our response to the many many comments here! We're sorry!: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rnaWmqCHbbqShcU

[@lowellmccormick6991]

This is the first sailing channel video I ran across years ago. Thanks for documenting your journey Seth. I hope the kids appreciate their experiences. BTW, Elizabeth has the nicest smile on the internets.

[@TheSailingFamily]

Thanks Lowell!

[@davekyle6096]

I'll listen to smart boaters like this all day...

[@davidhutchinson6377]

Agreed...I grew up in MD and have sailed for over 30 years. You are absolutely right...a cat dipping bow in heavy sea is ALWAYS something to watch over....and stand a watch you did. I have nothing but respect for you as a fellow sailor who has had his share of near misses.

[@prchampagne6132]

Elizabeth is so darn cute. Her eyes smile when she does. You are a lucky man and I’m envious of you both

[@TheFosterJourney]

Whoa!!!! Thanks for sharing this experience of the Lagoon 380 surfing bare pole... I've been very curious about her sea worthiness and now I know. Plus it's a testimony to your skills as captain 😀👍👍⛵

[@sherreeharris419]

What a great family...I’m only 11years late watching your journey! Happy there are many episodes yet to watch!!

[@smp22]

that's some of the best heavy weather footage I've seen on youtube

[@battlegoose5757]

Elizabeth is always smiling. What a delight she is.

[@hitmanhite]

I bet she's not off camera in 20 ft swells lol.

[@TheSailingFamily]

The passages we never her favorite part. This one in particular... :)

[@RayCasey2010]

Wow... An anxious moment watching that 20 footer swell behind the boat. Great job staying calm and in control!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Robert, this is a great comment. We thought about trying to jury rig something but felt it was too dangerous to go forward to the anchor locker in these conditions at night. Had it got worse I might have tried something, but in the end the conditions lightened and we made it through. But a drogue or manufactured drogue would have been the way to go for sure...

[@HighDefinitionVideo]

I had to comment on that sweeeet Wahoo! Great to see the boat can handle that kind of abuse.Congratulations on creating great memories!

[@merrittfallis6544]

It looks like you and Honeymoon handled those seas, no problem. I was once on a long passage on a 40 foot monohull, with seas 18-20 feet, and I was so afraid that we were going to get 'pooped'. A couple of times, in really 'confused' seas, we had a couple of feet of water in the cockpit, which took time to drain out. We had two days of that, with only three aboard, so there wasn't much rest. I've subscribed, and will be watching for more of your videos. Fair winds, my friends.

[@grimgr]

Very good management of this situation with nothing to help you to decrease speed. Huge skill. Respect ✊

[@lshafter1]

Great great videos! So many sailing videos are full of self indulgence. These videos are real people, in real situations and done in a fun and entertaining way. As a long time sailor, I especially appreciate their attention to preparation, detail, and and never getting in over their head. Well done, its been fun to watch:)

[@shaungur]

That is a really comfortable looking boat! Epic video. You guys handled it well. Looked scarey but it also looked like fun in a roller coaster sort of way :) What a way to start out your marriage. You see a lot of videos here where a few hardcore types are hitting this sort of weather, but never a regular couple like you guys. One of the best sailing videos I've seen on you tube. Thanks for that!

[@MichaelKallelisOn2Wheels]

Very dicey. Watching was stressful I can't imagine being there. I kept saying " throw out the sea anchor" and didn't realize you were without one until I read these comments. Wow. Glad you made it.

[@JaiCeeify]

Hello Seth and your beautiful wife, I keep on watching your sailing videos and you are both an inspiration. Thank you for sharing. In the next 4 years, I'm planning to sail this beautiful world of ours with both of my children before they start college. :)

[@bill739123]

+Joanna B Clark I bet unless your Kids study something like to be an MD they would learn more useful things from a long ocean voyage and travels to the different lands then they will at any school on land

[@JaiCeeify]

+bill739123 . thank you for the comment. I do agree. hence, both of my kids are going for pre-med. regardless this will still be an amazing trip for a couple of months prior.

[@Bumsonaboat]

That was absolutely insane!! You two were way hot casual during that trip. Awesome video.

[@TheSailingFamily]

Not much else we could do. Worrying wouldn't make it any better! :)

[@Bumsonaboat]

Can't argue with that although easier said than done. Well played:)

[@larrienadler1581]

I have a 37' powerboat on Lake Erie, but I absolutly loved your videos. I actually did the Welland Canal from Lake Erie to Lake Ontario and on to Toronto this last summer, and went through the Panama Canal in December on a cruise ship. Hope to see more from you in the future.

[@plum826]

Hi Seth, I'm digging the Old English "D". Rock on, sail safe and go Tigers!!!

[@veizour]

Awesome video! Thanks for a glimpse into sailing life... For now, I dream, but in the future, I hope to have my own catamaran and I look forward to the calm and beauty that can be seen, as well as the challenges. Thanks again!

[@roadboat9216]

Hey, great job on the video. Thanks for sharing this. My wife and I made the same trip a few years ago on our Peterson 44 monohull. Pretty similar conditions. I'm impressed how well you were handling the conditions. If I could afford a good multi I'd have one! Fair Winds

[@TheSailingFamily]

Thanks Fred! Happy sailing to you as well!

[@victorvandyke9898]

Blows me away! I dream of sailing a cat someday, and this shows what I may encounter. Fantastic video. Doing more than 10 knots with the mast only, wow! try that with a monohull.

[@oliverhowell3601]

We were sailing a 38 Lagoon between Antigua and St Berths in 2005 and got overtaken by TS Alfa. 4 POB pretty scary. Sailing dead sticks kept both engines running above idle to help steerage going down wind surfing and trying to maintain steering. Finally she blew through and we ended up 10 mi Ne of our destination.. Lots of fun. I've sailing

[@aj2674]

I hope you're back in the water! It's an incredible life lesson for the kids... Sometimes you just have to stretch a sheet and slow down so much that you want to speed up again!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Ian, this boat had a hull speed of 9 knots. Any faster and it began to surf/hydroplane out of the water. We also wanted to reduce stress on the rig, so when we approached 9 knots we would reduce sail area to be safe. 8 knots without sails was a new experience for us and we should have carried a drogue to avoid the 18 knot surf sessions down the wave faces. And finally, yes, this boat could easily sail around the world but probably not good in the higher latitudes (extreme wind and weather).

[@rebeccaeast6697]

Hi Seth, I'm sure you already know this information but, I was talking with Hans Bernwall about his circumnavigation. He said that the most effective drogue he used was a care tire on a 300ft rode that was deployed far enough aft to synchronize with the position of the preceeding wave. The rode was secured to the tire in one spot and tied tightly together there. Then, when they surfed down a face the part of the tire not tied would open up (due to increased speed) and slow them down enough.

[@bigredinfinity3126]

I love the lagoon 380 I sailed on one up the Australian coast A awesome yacht very well designed

[@THECARKUS]

I think you guys are very brave and I really hope you get all the satisfaction you deserve from achieving something so amazing! I wish you the very best!

[@ianrkav]

Hey thanks for that Seth. I like these cats for the room they have onboard and it's nice to know they can handle the rough too:-) I must do something like this myself soon. Excellent videos. I've learnt quite a bit from them:-)

[@lucatmiami]

All you needed was a litlle bit of your genny out and a dock line between your hulls in the stern...if it was too fast for you ! Beside that, perfect conditions for a quick passage ! We crossed the North Pacific with my wife in 74 days.... and what you experienced was a day at the beach in our crossing ! Good sailing ....

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Vanaru, sorry to hear about your cat. Yes, our boat had two escape hatches, EPIRB with water release, six person life raft, etc. We also packed a ditch bag with water, VHF, and other tools just in case. Scary scenario...

[@christinafindley1300]

That had to be so scary!!! Glad you're safe!!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Thanks Sugarsail. To be clear, the boat was not breaking up at those speeds, but given the short period of the swell in that area of the Caribbean Sea we were regularly catching the wave in front and burying the bow. That's very dangerous in a cat. Furthermore, the autohelm regularly needed correction, so I sat at the helm for 20 hours with my finger on the 'standby' button. My wife gave me a two hour nap in the middle before resuming and I'm glad nothing happened when I was asleep. Scary.

[@youtubynotme]

I love that so many people sail, but I wish that the ones that did had help. :-) stay safe, but it's awesome to see the fun you have.

[@RealEstateOttawa]

Can up not put out a warp ?

[@z06lingin]

That looked a little hairy Seth, 10-15 with an occasional 20 knots is a little sporty for that little cat for sure. happy to see you handled just fine with your lovely wife, quite the trooper that one. Saw that you conceived a little one through that trek. What a great story to tell him/her. In my opinion a lucky child to have such capable and adventurous parents. Oh yea today Team Oracle finished off race 19 to win the Americas Cup after an 8 race winning streak. Sure you were there to watch.

[@robbiefabre]

Those conditions look like a blast, I think you guys could handle that no problem, at sea its important to make those conditions part of routine as they happen more often than realized.

[@TheSailingFamily]

We had a sea anchor and thought that would be our tool for when things got bad. But in this situation it was the location that was an issue (with the sea floor becoming shallow and the current against the wind). We needed to keep moving to get out of there so we needed a drogue but did not have one... I'll definitely carry one next time!

[@tracyoliver550]

Knowing how much more severe conditions are in real life than when viewed on video, that must have been unnerving. Any thought of dragging lines to help slow the boat when there’s no drogue?

[@Anmeteor9663]

You are right to recognise when your ship is traveling too fast for safety. Please check out the Jordan series drogue. Ideal to slow your boat to a safe speed and keep her stern to. It is not a sea anchor and has an elastic effect reducing stresses on the boat and crew. That said, great handling of the situation and fab footage of the seas. Thanks and fair winds.

[@svbeto6429]

@Trius Pitchpoling is why

[@camielkotte]

Had to pull my earphones because of the wind noise. Like your video!

[@AquaticBuddha]

I saw a video once (search for Seawind Royce Black and go to the Seawind page and watch the Heavy Weather Sailing series) from a guy named Royce Black who delivers Seawind catamarans in Australia on how he used drag devices to slow the cat down in severe conditions. Worth watching.

[@mmmmmike1969]

you do a great job and i can't wait to one day get my boat. i've got to finish my award winning screenplay first. thanks for the great vid's.

[@AquaticBuddha]

PS: In that vid he's probably using the Australian Region Tropical Cyclone Intensity Scale so a "Cat 5" would be sustained winds of greater than 107 kn. 26 kn top boat speed with bare poled with drag devices out the back! Anyway it's a useful series to watch. Actually, it's on KZbin so just plug those search terms into KZbin.

[@bija0501]

its funny how much criticism and "you should have"s get posted on all high wind sailing videos. i think not capsizing and becoming shark food and maintaining a coarse is a great job in these conditions

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Rob, we could have manufactured a drogue as you suggest, but frankly we were caught off guard by the conditions and didn't want to go forward to the bow to retrieve our anchor (maybe more dangerous and potentially damaging). We opted to ride it out, but would suggest you rig a drogue for deployment before a storm (live and learn)!

[@clackamasoneful]

Awesome video, your living my dream! Thank you!

[@williamevans8377]

its amazing when 6 foot seas look like 20'. Way to go!

[@Venom2U]

The easiest way to make an expedient drogue is to use some spare line. (Spinnaker sheets work well) Tie a bunch of stopper knots spaced about a foot between, and pay that out from the stern and cleat it off. (on a cat I would use 2) Use more or less knots and length depending on how much drag you need. Just pay out enough to keep it submerged. Warning though, with enough line/knots out there will be enough force that you cant pay it out by hand so use a winch. Fair winds

[@kevankoya]

AWESOME video. Amazing experience !!! :))

[@TheSailingFamily]

Yes, we were both scared. We got caught in this storm and did not have the proper gear to protect ourselves. We needed a drogue to drag behind the boat to help slow us down but at this point in the voyage we had not purchased one. It's a mistake we'll never make again. There was true fear that we would lose the boat and Elizabeth got scared when she saw me packing "the ditch bag" just incase we flipped her. 50 knots and 20 foot seas in the blackness of night is a scary place to be...

[@xlrEAGLE]

I totally agree. Don't go out to sea without a drogue unless you have lots of fuel to turn around and motor into the wind.

[@mysticsailor9]

they are two different things... if you can run before a storm, you use a drogue. its purpose is to slow the boat such that you do not dive into the back of a wave and pitchpole (go a over t). A sea anchor is when you wish to ride out the storm... just like its name says, you deploy from the bow on 300ft or so of line.. hunker down and hope for the best... for serious passagemaking, you need both,

[@maverickmyrtlebeach]

Hey guys missed you and family need to post so me older vids..

[@TheJarhead70]

Well done. Fair winds folks. Jarhead 66 (Glenda and I have been married 40 years. I have a H26 am really like sailing. We still like each other too. Best wishes.)

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Freddy, I'm not one to exaggerate. I was more worried about holding the wheel than capturing footage when it got very bad. And the waves might have been larger than 20 ft, but the point and shoot camera has a wide angle lens on it. I surf, so I know wave heights when I see them and this was something I would never drop into by choice...

[@leopardsgowild]

wow those are some wild seas!

[@Freedo1234]

You both are very brave !

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Jeremy, two reasons. 1) Cats don't tend to heave to very well due to their design, but more importantly 2) we wanted to get out of this area in the Caribbean Sea where the depth becomes shallow and the current opposes the swell (causing big seas). We NEEDED to move through this area, which is why we did not release our sea anchor, but needed a drogue to slow down a little... Thanks for watching!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Yes, we needed a drogue but failed to prepare properly and did not have one on board. We had a sea anchor but needed to move through this region of the sea, not stay there, so it would not have been the ideal tool. Next time I will pack a drogue or try to manufacture one using tools on board. Live and learn...

[@davidkearney370]

I want to comment about the bottle. It's not a big deal. Glass is harmless in the environment. The paper label and glue are probably food for something. The bottle will make a good hiding place for small fish. Now, I was surprised but it didn't take me long to realize it wasn't a big deal.

[@peterreece2340]

5.33 I like your Mount Gay cap. I am in Barbados "where the rum comes from".

[@hntr45]

thats one monster fish! makes me jealous

[@dannymax852]

Hey, awesome video. Happy trails

[@louiscohen]

Great video. Somehow "Honeymoon" and bare poles seem to go together.

[@victorramsey5575]

Cool video. I actually got some ideas from this. But, dropping anything foreign in the ocean is wrong in my opinion. Unless its a vintage; unopened bottle on Dom when you cross the equator. Gotta keep King Neptune happy :)

[@MrChefjms]

The first thing I thought of was ... do these guys have a "sea anchor" drogue? I'm on a "who know when it will end voyage" to "who knows where?" I just missed Sandy, ducked into Port Washington Long Island, great place to stop over if your up here. Wishing you fair wind and smooth seas ....

[@TheSailingFamily]

Trust me, I was humbled!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Rabid, no, unfortunately we sold the boat. Check out our blog for the full story - from start to finish! The link is in the comments area above. Thanks for watching!

[@TheSailingFamily]

We had two engines! But didn't want to go any faster, thank you...

[@xlrEAGLE]

I have used simple chain and anchor. Dragging enough of it behind the boat will do wonders to slow the boat.

[@tincoffin]

If a bird lands on your boat give it fresh water rather than food. They are often dehydrated from trying to drink seawater

[@comicsans6330]

tincoffin just a little FYI for you . . seabirds have no issue drinking sea water . . they have special salt glands that take care of the salt birdnote.org/show/seabirds-drink-salt-water

[@tincoffin]

Yes thanks for that .i was talking about land birds. We have a lot of cross-channel pigeons in English Channel off UK . Always dying for a drink.

[@johnli6627]

tincoffin guess they aren't dying for a drink since there's so many and always there. I think there is lots for them to drink and eat since it's such a popular spot for them

[@saintboudreau1545]

A catamaran? The one that goes over and stays over. But I guess it takes a lot to get it over. Always astonishes me that little boats seem to never be afraid. Maybe they trust themselves. And yes I do believe they Know!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Thank you, I think!

[@seattlerain1]

If you were worried about going too fast, why didn't you deploy a sea anchor to help keep you from speeding down the waves?

[@maggie4834]

Lots of good posts here, but has anyone mentioned using anchor line or any other substitutes for a store bought drogue? A 300' anchor rode with each end tied to a different stern cleat will help slow you down.

[@Bspurr13]

Nice!!! You're living my dream. Hopefully my reality, soon! Maybe we'll run into each other out there, somewhere. I'm actually on my way down to my boat right now, to get going on the never ending "to do" list. Sanding and varnishing today. YAY! I bet that surfing was a little scary, especially after burying your hulls a couple times. 18 Kts - Yikes. Prob wishing you had drogue. If it had gotten worse, with bigger waves, obviously increasing the possibility of a pitchpole - at what point would you have just deployed the para-anchor, nose to waves, and rode it out? What size waves? What's your LOA? Serious question - I actually looked at a cat yesterday, and considering making the switch - so much more livable space. But, they are a different animal, for sure. Oh, and to everyone freaking out about the little glass bottle: Sand + heat = glass. Glass + sand (bottom) + surge = more sand. Give it some time on the bottom, it'll be right back to the form it started. Just always make sure you peel a plastic label off, if there is one. Absolutely no harm to the ocean environment - hell, as a kid I collected sea glass; smooth, rounded pieces of glass that started very sharp, after some moron broke a bottle at the beach, which is a whole different thing. Anyway - Fair Winds!!!

[@bill739123]

Very nice vid. The only thing I would have liked better is if you had an external mic. and then muffler on the mic so the wind noise in the recording would have been much less. Those mufflers and mics. don't cost much .They are what you will have seen on TV when the mic is covered in what looks like a fluffy fur coat. Really enjoyed this video. I get the impression that the cats. are much less prone to rocking side to side even in rough weather. Again very nice story. Thanks for posting it.

[@TheSailingFamily]

+bill739123 Hey Bill, I agree. Sadly we shot all of this on our point and shoot camera as this was before GoPros and iPhones (or even HD)! Old school. Next time for sure!

[@clymbonboard]

Wow, nice video. Great boat, she was handling those conditions well. Question: Even if you didn't have a drogue on board, did you consider jury-rigging one? Or just taking all the extra line you had on board and towing it off the stern?

[@RickPizzoli]

Great waves! Reminds me of the book 'A Voyage for Madmen' ... I'm sure you've read it ... and I'm sure you were thinking the same! Best of luck!!!

[@ZoneTelevision]

Dude i had no idea this was you.. I watched this video like 3 years ago. Who knew. LOL.

[@salaciayacht]

That storm definitely brought back some strong and vivid memories!!

[@ianrkav]

What would you say would be a 'never exceed' speed for this type of boat? Also, would this boat manage a return journey from Sydney to Norfolk or even SF? Great videos by the way. All of them:-)

[@mosipd]

I don't own a sailboat, I have a 40' Ocean convertible, so I would never be caught out in conditions such as these. However I'd take a mono-hull any day of the week over a catamaran if I ever were to give up the tournament lifestyle. Seeing how fast you were going down some of those waves I think the choice is pretty simple.

[@FreddyFrogger]

It would have been nice to see the 50knots and 18 knot boat speed but all I saw was winds of about 25knots and a speed of about 8 knots. The waves were about 15 feet.

[@sergeantsailorman]

First of all, I would like to say, your Lady is beautiful, and seems to have a sweet personality. Second, I've read about old time sailors in a hard blow who might tie a 35 lb, or so anchor on about 100 or 200 ft of line and trail it off the stern. You could also drag an old sail or all your dirty laundry to help slow you down. Maybe tie your rudder to turn into the wind, drop sail, go below and play cards, or sleep. Happy sailing and fair winds.

[@RoguishHound]

Hey Seth! Loving the older content. Was wondering if you would recommend the Lagoon 380. (I know the Outremer is better.. but kind of out of my price range). I know the magic number for cats is supposed to be 42 feet plus (?), but would you buy it again if Archer wasn't a possibility?

[@TheSailingFamily]

It's a GREAT boat, but only for the right purpose. If you are two people that want a boat to coastal cruise on (never going out in rough conditions), then this is the boat for you. But if you are more than two people and want to sail full time, or to cross oceans, then you should ideally look for a larger boat. If you google "Lagoon 380 User Review" you will see an in-depth review of our last boat. Hope this helps! ~Seth www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f139/lagoon-380-user-review-15-500-mile-review-36114.html

[@RoguishHound]

@@TheSailingFamily awesome. Thanks!

[@RoguishHound]

Well. After looking at that review. Lagoon is definitely out. As are boats in the size range. Super helpful. Thanks!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Sorry. :) But good on you for doing the research! What are your cruising plans?

[@RoguishHound]

@@TheSailingFamily I’m geared to Retire in about two years at the ripe age of 50. The three of us (wife and 11 yo son) want to cruise for 1-2 years. Plans will partially depend on where we find the boat that we want. But I want it to start in The US. I’d be happy with a monohull. But I think to make it work, gonna have to make it more comfortable for my better half. So looking at cats mostly

[@alphasxsignal]

You need to keep a storm drag shoot on the boat in the future.

[@PSYCHOLOGYZOOM]

Good work Seth !! At 6:18 you sound very nervous ! Like this is too fast !!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Our boat had engines, but we needed to slow down, not go faster! What we needed was a drogue to drag behind the boat to slow us down. Or a keel to keep us from hydroplaning and surfing down the wave faces...

[@Zihbol]

Hi Seth, I didn't really get what you did with the bottle. Could you explain? Thanks and great video. Great job.

[@peterreece2340]

He filled it with seawater and threw it in 5,000 feet of ocean.

[@blackdiamondmarine]

ocean crossings in boats where the most stable position is upside down, cat sailors are an interesting bunch

[@airethor]

I'd be afraid a weight like an anchor could possibly be thrown forward. A life jacket or something just to add bulk to the rode....you had a sea anchor? What kind? I'd have been pretty anxious there in a cat....I have a 40' full keel which would be more stable. But great video documentation...and good job skip! But take Neptune's grace humbly and have a drogue next time!

[@TheSailingFamily]

Gracias por leer! Espero que disfruten de nuestros puestos. -Seth

[@AndrewStokes1966]

Awesome video, thanks for sharing

[@scrumdownscott]

They are fantasic vids, I would love to have a boat like that..... it's my dream... thanks for sharing! SHIP AHOY!

[@jtechie3]

That looks like fun

[@alexalvesjr]

Hey guys nice video, what time of the year was it???

[@wookieknuckle1369]

I’ve read most of your posts about the lagoon 380, and in your opinion. Would you rather cruise in a bigger boat or does that seem sufficient?

[@tmattoneill]

Hey there. Great video. Question for you, though. Why no drogue, sea anchor, or warps off the back to slow down?

[@TheSailingFamily]

Hi Matt, we had a Sea Anchor but assumed wrongly it would be our only device needed if we ever experienced bad weather. But in this scenario we needed to get out of this particular body of water where the sea floor shoaled and created the steep waves. A Sea Anchor would have kept us there, and what we needed was a Drogue to allow for safe passage through. Live and learn! Don't be cheap (like me) and carry both!!!

[@tmattoneill]

Ah! Yes. That makes a lot of sense. Thank you! Happy and safe sailing!

[@cartmanrlsusall]

how did your sailing buddy fare ?you didn't say if they made it or not?

[@TheSailingFamily]

They did great, actually. I think in these sorts of conditions I would much rather be on a brick-house monohull like a Hallberg Rassy. Because they were a displacement craft with a lead keel, their boat would not surf down the waves like we did. In effect, the mandatory displacement of the yacht hull and keel acted as their drogue. They sailed, uncomfortably, the entire time and had a much better passage (and roughly the same arrival time too). Good question, I should have mentioned this in the video.

[@Anmeteor9663]

Hey Seth, strongly recommend you check out the Jordan Series Drogue. It can be built to match your boat and boats using it have never come to grief. I also have first hand experience of using one and it it truly amazing. Better than a single drogue and way better than sea anchor. Even trailing a long warp in a bite with or without a chain or old car tyre works well to slow the worst of the surfs and stay safe. Hope these ideas migjt help. Happy Moons'ls. Nick