Land Rover Series 3 Rusty Repairs Part 8 - TLS brakes -

A quick look at the twin leading shoe brakes on the front of the 1983 109, fitting new shoes and drums.
Also fitting the Rocky Mountain transfer box filler and dip stick conversion.

[@keonfrederic1857]

Thanks Phil, The bleeding of the brakes have been a nightmare but I think it is done now, tried, vacuum bleed, reverse bleed and regular old fashion bleed. I have a 1964 S2a 88. All drum brakes with only one wheel cylinder /brake. I put about 100 miles on truck since brake change and re-adjusted them this morning. Much much better now. I guess that's what it takes to have the brakes seat properly. Thanks again. Cheers

[@odc43054]

Nice work on the brakes, Phill. Interesting design with two single acting brake cylinders hung off the same brake line. All the designs I've seen in U.S. vehicles have been a double acting cylinder. Watching you update your shoes and drums made me appreciate how easy it was when I changed out the brake pads and rotors on my Ford the other day. Very easy and great stopping power. You are making great progress. You should be in great shape for rally season!

[@steamwally]

odc43054 Cheers! I believe the TLS set up was a post 1980 addition - so you could actually stop.... I did once lock all fours so it can't have been too bad. Apparently, this type is a sod to bleed, some even remove the entire back plate and turn it horizontal to get all the air out. I was advised, if their working - leave well alone! I rather neglected the old girl last summer, not keeping up the ongoing repairs/rebuild and it started to show. With the warmer weather, I am enjoying tinkering with things again. Phill.

[@pedro2130]

great video, just got a 79 6 cyl 2.6 petrol series 3 on the road, brakes give a terrible throw over to the right at any speed over 30, this video has got me ready to dismantle and clean up the drums and shoes, might give the adjusters a look too! cheers

[@steamwally]

pedro2130 Thanks, good luck with your brakes - not too bad a job. Might be worth your while checking that the shoes are sitting level on the back-plate, if not I believe that can cause the effect you describe. Phill.

[@nikhilshirke3293]

That's what I was searching for..thank you

[@ColinTonkasdad]

like the gearbox idea !! ill get one of those and hopefully fitting the fairey in a week or so , just got to extend the bracket being 2.6 as it was cut for normal 4 cyl ... but should be ok and give a little better mpg .. cheers

[@rakeshsooknananmarch]

very helpful, thanks.

[@christophermorgan8028]

Keep up the good work find these videos really helpful Do you have a video on changing brake adjusters if not can you offer advice and tips

[@warbirdflyer7276]

Great Job. Please help me with manufacturers name of the wire looms/harness

[@kevinbodnar448]

Happy New year to you, just need to pick your brains, I'm replacing front wheel cylinders on my series, would you fit aftermarket or genuine type, thanks for your time 👍

[@steamwally]

Happy new year! I would buy the best you can - the original makes, Girling, Lucas etc.. are no longer available so you might find "TRW Lucas" listed as genuine replacements. TRW and Delphi seem to be fine from my experience.

[@keonfrederic1857]

Phil, Thank you for posting this video. I just completed my brakes overhaul, new drums,shoes, cylinders,springs and hoses. Had a hard time to bleed the system but got it after the 3rd try. All the wheels are dragging somewhat with adjuster at 0. Pedal is firm and i'd say about 3 inches travel while engine is off, with vacuum booster assist the travel is somewhat more pronounced and the braking isn't that great either. Pumping brake pedal doesn't make any difference in firmness or travel. I was wondering if it might take a little while for the shoes to seat properly and need re-adjustement shortly thereafter. What was your experience with adjusting the brakes? Thank you Frederic

[@steamwally]

Hi Frederic, I had trouble bleeding my brakes too, a local Land Rover mechanic did it for me in the end and he had a hard time. I'm guessing yours is a long wheel base with twin leading shoe front brakes? The brake pipes are badly designed, it is near enough impossible to fully bleed the front cylinders without removing the brake backplates and bleeding them flipped on their back. I had trouble with the shoes binding too - the adjusters were backed right off and I have only recently adjusted them up having covered around 3k miles. It seems to be OK now and stops well. Personally, I would say your brakes still need further bleeding - it might be worth tweaking all the adjusters up hard before bleeding the system, in theory there is then less space for air. Worth a try... Phill.

[@johnsmith9161]

I was a Landrover mechanic 30 years ago I would put vice grips on the 3 flexible lines and leave all the bleeders open.Then I would bleed the brake system releasing 1 vice grip at a time up to the vise grips.I would get a rock hard pedal with no movement then releasing 1 vice grip at a time I would bleed the brakes at each wheel cylinder.On average I would use 500ml of brake fluid to do the whole system.When doing Landrover brakes you must have the brake shoes made to the size of the drum and then radius ground.If you put standard shoes on a oversize drum they only contact on the centre of the shoe and flex hence a very poor pedal.If you get a large round coin and put a small round coin inside it you will see it touches on one spot only brake shoes are the same.A brake shoe is a segment of a circle and there are different size circles. When depressing the brake pedal it must be done very slowly 15 seconds to hit the floor and 15 seconds to release that way you do not aerate the brake fluid.After a brake reline 2/3 of a pedal is OK they will bed in.

[@Zachry86]

What are the adjustment pins? Is it correct that they point outwards?

[@yves5435]

Hi, Just wondering if you knew a video of the brake shoes being fitted? I'm struggling to get my head around the descriptions of fitting buzzing around forums and the internet. Thanks

[@steamwally]

I would advise getting a copy of the original workshop manual, there is a lot of rubbish on the forums as well as plenty of good advice - easy to get it wrong. Back in the day, Land Rover even issued a bulletin to dealers/ service departments clarifying the procedure! Assuming you know the correct spring locations, it can be easier to hook the springs onto the shoes before prying the shoes into place on the cylinders. Beware that changes were made to the braking system post 1980. 88's usually have different front brakes (TLS on the 109) so the fitting descriptions may vary.

[@AGDHighValue]

I am in the process of doing my 1967 Series 2A 109 brakes. I have run into the problem that I can get the new front axle shoes on but I cannot get either the old or a new drum to fit over the new shoes. I'm not talking a few mils- I mean it is probably a 1/4 inch different and the cylinders are fully bled out and adjusters turned down to zero. Rear shoes were no problem. Any suggestions?

[@alwynvanwyk1851]

Sounds like you've done it all, but maybe the new linings are too thick... Take the shoes off, and place it inside your drum, laying horizontal, with the shoes "in place" touching the drum....If it only touches the ends at the curve, with a gap in the middle part, you need to trim them off on a belt sander until they meet face to face at the same radius as the drum ... Good luck...

[@alwynvanwyk1851]

Oooooooops, 7 years ago, sorry 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

[@mariacampbell6017]

Hello: i have a 1977 Series 3. My mechanic is telling me that the Rover rear brakes have no springs, so they always in a friction. Any advice with that?thanks so much

[@steamwally]

Hi, I think your mechanic is telling you a load of cobblers and I would look for a new one who knows what they are doing... With no springs, the shoes will just bind up - the springs are a vital part of the system. Equally, it is important that the springs are fitted the correct side of the shoes and in the correct locating holes.

[@98113y12]

There's 2 Springs per wheel on a swb series 3 unless the brakes have been upgraded. These stop the shoes dragging when driving especially the leading shoe which will try to drag the most . The lower one is positioned between the two shoes at the bottom , the top one goes on the leading brake shoe(front shoe)stud which rides on the adjuster and connects to a stud on the brake back plate. Theres a stud on both shoes so they can be used on either left or right hand side. Consult an expert or workshop manual if your unsure, also be aware there are several variations of rover drum brakes which could have been retrofitted.

[@neilcarroll4579]

I have a question re rear brakes , I have replaced the rear wheel cylinder on series 3 brakes , when I took hub off the peg that is on shoes that leans against adjuster was loose in the hub . I have replaced cylinder and put shoes back on , however now the peg doesn't touch the adjuster and it doesn't adjust when you turn adjuster , any ideas ? am I putting top spring in right place ? does it go on back of both shoes or does it hook to one shoe and the peg ?

[@steamwally]

Hi Neil, I would have a careful look to see if you have fitted the shoes correctly, it is very common for them to be fitted the wrong way round - it's very easy to do as the differences are subtle. Also seems to be common for the pins to work loose, some of mine have been spot welded in place to prevent this. The spring goes between the shoes and behind them - that way it pulls them back in towards the backplate - make sure the spring is between the correct set of holes too.

[@neilcarroll4579]

steamwally thanks for reply , they aren't actually new shoes so I put them back into position when I put the cylinder back in , I currently have the spring attached to the left shoe but not the right shoe , it is attached to a peg on the right hand side back plate , if the is incorrect this may be why the peg isn't meeting the adjuster , I thought the spring was easy compare to the front , so have I got spring in wrong place then , it should be shoe to shoe ?

[@steamwally]

My apologies, it has been rather a long day.. depends on what type you have - is it long wheel base/short wheel base? I am thinking back to what I did on my long wheel base model. From memory the pegs you describe are fitted with long wheel base twin leading shoe front brakes but not to the back, where the springs should be between shoes.

[@neilcarroll4579]

steamwally it's SWB , could it be that the pegs are generic? might be worth going shoe to shoe to see if it solves problem , as I took hub off spring fell out so I didn't get a chance to see setup