Laser Keyboards! Why Did This Company Die? - Krazy Ken’s Tech Talk

[@ComputerClan]

Enjoy the new episode! Also, I made a new playlist of tech flops & fails, so check it out and binge! 👉 kzbin.info/aero/PLFWeyvvxf1rjrzxzjt_6iGeYS0jiBBZfq

[@rensaudade]

Now you have to look at CharaChorder’s device. They're trying to reinvent the keyboard. I hope to hear your insights from that.

[@R.N.GPerformance]

Thank you for this video we was wondering

[@ComputerClan]

@@R.N.GPerformance my pleasure : D

[@sdewey4152]

I swear I saw something similar or it was this on Pimp My Ride ages ago, I thought it was so cool..but even back then I thought it can't be as good as an actual keyboard.

[@SaberRusty]

@@sdewey4152 I only ever saw something like this in a Law & Order / CSI episode, thinking "oh yeh, TV magic", never expected them to be real XD

[@steven_porter]

I owned one of these around 2015. I was so proud to bring it around to my college classes and various meetings to impress people with my futuristic technology. I believe I used it 3 times before relegating it to my prop bin, where I keep a stockpile of weird tech products in case I ever shoot a sci-fi.

[@FratDede]

Wow i have similar stockpile too, massagers lasers scifi boxes.. :)

[@pedazodeboludo]

From my family's bad example I learned NOT to stockpile gadgets I suspect I'll rarely use ;)

[@Gatorade69]

Massager goes brrrrrr

[@cardsfanbj]

If you were to ask me "Have you heard of the Magic Cube?" I'd probably say no the name doesn't sound familiar, but I do remember hearing about a wireless, laser keyboard that looked kinda interesting. I do remember it being featured in some crime procedural show, like on some secretary's desk at a techy company they were investigating or something and thinking "that's stupid, why isn't she just using a normal keyboard?"

[@HeadsetGuy]

So it turns out I actually _had_ heard of this product, but not by name. ThinkGeek used to sell a "laser projection keyboard" back in the day, but they never referred to it by its brand name.

[@shararm]

That's what my brain immediately went to as well

[@Liz_ArdE]

Yeah, definitely never heard of this product referred to by it's actual name but I saw these a LOT on gadget websites.

[@Chokah]

Same here.

[@chartle1]

That's where I saw it. I used to order lots of t shirts and other stuff from them.

[@clxwncrxwn]

I saw the TedxTalk with the creator of the technology and his teacher, he wore the device on a lanyard and demonstrated the light based keyboard and explained how the camera imputed the letters when he pressed on the lightboard so to speak, it was clever I thought

[@brandonbee1151]

I actually had one of these. And it was super cool... well... except. There was definitely a steep learning curve. I actually got better at typing the right thing. When I first got mine, it was before tablet computers were really a thing. So, at the time it was primarily a smartphone accessory. So it made a lot of sense that you would want something smaller than a tablet keyboard. My problem was the "solution" you talked about for not getting feedback when you typed a key. Having some kind of type animation on the key would have been great. Perhaps a brightness increase when you type a key would have been great. The tap sound that they used instead was a deal-breaker. The whole purpose for using this keyboard was that it was super portable to use in meetings. But the tap sound was unbearably loud and distracting in meetings. Everyone would ooh and aah when I turned it on at the beginning of the meeting, but it would quickly turn to "what is that tapping sound!?" and "please turn that off".

[@musaran2]

They… did not have an option to turn it off?

[@meetoo594]

@@musaran2The one I had which was a knockoff of this one I think (it was very cheap and very Chinese) did have a mute function. Trouble is, without that beep you had absolutely no feedback that a key was pressed which messed with your perception when hunting and pecking as you had no idea if the press had been registered. The mouse mode worked very well though.

[@EvocativeKitsune]

Fricking laser beams on their fricking desks.

[@nimblehealer199]

Fricking sharks with Fricking laser beams attached to their heads!

[@rukitomikutochi8764]

You know what these comments and comedy have in common?

[@MahmudulHasan-nv4er]

@@rukitomikutochi8764 laser

[@wrathfirex]

Fricking awesome

[@rustyudder]

It puts the lazer on the skin or it gets the desk again 🤔

[@MrJollyU]

We were looking into this product in the late 2000's for our clean labs to reduce dust etc from keyboards. However, the keyboard was "locked" to us/en layout and was missing numpad as well. But we would have for sure purchased one or two devices for testing if it hadn't been for those limitations.

[@ratatoskrnuts6354]

That would've been a great use case before touch screens and the like became ubiquitous

[@nomakewan]

I worked at an Office Depot back when this product came out. It was given its own special display right by the front door. I had a chance to test it and it worked exactly as well as you found. There’s only so much you can do with projection tech like this. Your own hands interrupt the ability to see what’s going on behind them, which is why the keyboard is so horrible using a normal posture.

[@soaringeag1392]

I remember one of these at the Office Depot I worked at too, except when the sun was setting, it would keep thinking a "key" was being pressed when it was the shadow of the automatic doors.

[@TheTruthKiwi]

I'm surprised he didn't mention that.

[@editingsecrets]

@@soaringeag1392 That would really enjoy Mr. Spock whenever someone comes in from the turbolift.

[@saberpv]

I remember these being sold on thinkgeek. They seemed to be more of a novelty than anything. I miss Swype 😢

[@drasco61084]

What do you mean? I can still type like that on my phone

[@Noah-Lach]

Oh wow, the name ThinkGeek really brings me back. I remember ordering one of those terrible Chinese MP4 watches that came preloaded with a Crazy Frog music video.

[@thecianinator]

​@@marknielsen9315 did they work?

[@wellfuckyoumr]

You can swipe type on IOS. Wtf kind of phone are you using?

[@Bandrik]

2024 and I'm still using the Swype keyboard. I'm a dinosaur, sure, but I like it.

[@twjonckheere]

I bought one because it was a cool and interesting technology. I didn't think it would be too practical and replace my standard keyboard though. I just wanted to promote cool and new ideas. That being said I used it for a few weeks and went back to a normal keyboard. :)

[@monad_tcp]

Know where it would be a cool and actually useful product, to replace a remote control for a TV. just pin it on the ceiling and project the buttons on the sofa.

[@arbitrary_username]

I saw it as some not too practical prototype product and hoped for updated versions/adaptions.

[@Jdbye]

@@monad_tcp Seems like it would be too easy to trigger by accident, and also the buttons/keys would be huge at that distance.

[@monad_tcp]

@@Jdbye that makes it even better for TV

[@kevinforth7618]

About 8 years ago, I retrieved one of these Celluon laser keyboards from the trash at work. I still have it, and my experience was similar to yours. Aside from the initial "hey, this kinda works" reaction, it doesn't function very well, and I really never found a use for it.

[@CoolerQ]

Oh my God, I wrote a Linux driver for this keyboard when it first came out! I thought I'd never see one again!

[@musaran2]

Out of curiosity, what was there to "drive"? Naïve me expected just standard wireless & keyboard communication. Were there configuration & options?

[@CoolerQ]

@@musaran2 It predates the Bluetooth keyboard standard, so it used a bespoke protocol.

[@jeffrey4063]

Wow. Great video. I stumbled across a knock off of one of these on Amazon and bought one in 2017. If I had paid $170 I would have been very upset but it was only $29. I couldn't agree more with everything you said in this video. I just bought it to see the technology and wanted to know how it worked. Hunt and peck typing was actually okay, barely. And like you I was surprised it worked as well as it did which was, well what was the point of this thing anyway. There are no practical uses for it. I just used it for 15 minutes and sent it off to a friend in Russia so he could see how it worked. Another great video! Thanks

[@thegreyfuzz]

First time seeing this was on an episode of the original CSI, something like a secretary used it to secretly blog while on the clock. I have one branded differently and it actually worked pretty well (perhaps my technique was better). It was best as a talking piece. Either way it's been in the junk bin for quite some time.

[@gordoncousins5544]

That's where I knew it from kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJmZk5-uodOsoa8

[@3Dsjk]

There was a similar laser keyboard prototype on this late-80’s cable show called ‘Beyond 2000’. There was actually a lot of really advanced stuff in that show; internet-connected smart homes, self-driving cars, even 3D printing or rapid prototyping.

[@meetoo594]

That was an Aussie show iirc, the UK equivalent was the BBC`s tomorrow's world. Both were great shows. Always wondered what became of the heatproof gel a guy in the studio coated his arm with then blowtorched it and had no burns.

[@davidlevy706]

@@meetoo594 A short-lived US equivalent, called _Beyond Tomorrow,_ ran from 1988-1989. (Apparently, the same title was used for a 2005 _Beyond 2000_ revival.)

[@meetoo594]

@@davidlevy706 I vaguely remember that one as well. Here in the UK both were transmitted on one of the Sky Satellite channels.

[@TheAllMightyGodofCod]

I remember that show! I really liked it when I was a teen!

[@carylittleford8980]

Originally this show came out in the early 80's in Australia and was called Towards 2000. As it go closer to the year 2000 and the show is about future tech they renamed it Beyond 2000. It was a great show.

[@xxyyxx2871]

The incompetent cutscene, I AM DECEASED. 💀🤣

[@EDreyer]

If I remember correctly, I saw it popular mechanics when it was still only a "magic" idea and then it was featured in CSI Miami or CSI New York. I then saw it in some niche stores, but it was probably $100 at the time, which is cheaper than the $160 you mentioned, but was far to expensive for me as I was only a teenager. It later just disappeared from the market completely.

[@Fladens]

The only place ive seen it. CSI Miami, a secretary was using it to upload to a blog or something in secret.

[@Ray_Vun]

yup, i saw it on csi as well. i assumed it was just some made up tech. those shows had quite a lot of fake tech for the sake of tv

[@1015SaturdayNight]

That’s it! It was CSI where I saw it!

[@ShitHappensRLY]

@@Fladens yeah, i rememeber this episode, and they couldn't figure out strange fingerprints on glass (?) table and then they found out about this device.

[@nalyom99]

😂 yeah csi miami you are correct

[@Trippp550]

I’ve actually seen this thing soooo many times, usually in tech videos of advanced tech “coming soon!” And they’ll use clips of this product as background filler imagery and I always get frustrated when I see it because I’m like “what about the laser keyboard thing!?” Finally a video about it. Sad it’s a failed product but at least my curiosity has finally been satisfied

[@emperorfaiz]

I still remember seeing a showcase video of that gadget on Facebook about 10 years ago. I was a bit interested to buy it and forget about it afterwards becasue the iPad's on-screen keyboard is good enough for me.

[@IlluminatiBG]

This really looks cool, as cool as glass/mirror screens we saw in Final Fantasy or Star Trek or any other Sci-Fi. However, while having an actual working screen that you saw in a Sci-Fi movie might look cool the reason those screen lost market is lack of practicality - screens are for showing things, seeing other things in the same picture is disadvantage (glassy screen are terrible). The same apply to laser keyboard - it is a Sci-Fi inspired thing with a little or no practical use. P.S. apparently those glass screen moved to "augmented reality" glasses, which had really cool demo from Microsoft, before they killed the project. Starting a business by Sci-Fi inspiration (instead of actual problem you have) is apparently a bad business practice.

[@48Boxer]

The best portable keyboard I've ever had was the Stowaway for my Handspring Visor. Folded it was close to the same size as the visor. Unfolded it was the size of a larger laptop. Portable keyboards were welcome on the Palm OS devices because all other input options were pretty cumbersome. I wish I'd kept that setup simply for the nostalgia

[@TumnusMr]

Yes! I had one of those too. Used it to write notes on my Visor at University until unfortunately one of the ribbon cables inside it broke. 😢 I have never been able to find another portable keyboard with the same design. All the folding keyboards out there now seem to be cheap clones of a few established designs with only one or two hinges and that don’t compress the keys to fold even smaller.

[@editingsecrets]

I also had a Visor with that awesome folding keyboard!

[@kyos2000]

I totally remember this. I always wanted one but felt like the lack of tactical feedback would make it difficult to use.

[@Amigafur]

You don't know the half of it! kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z3TcYpeGodRrhNE They sound cool but they're absolute dogshit.

[@Lorax2k2]

I had an original Magic Cube. I wanted one since I saw a corded version in Omni magazine, (so, yea, this product is old). I did not have issues typing with it and thought it was really cool. This was back when there were no real options for portable keyboards. Someone tried to get it in the mainstream when one was used on an episode of Monk...back when that show was a thing.

[@noname-zp1yh]

This laser keyboard could be cool if it was modded to work as adjustable keyboard shortcuts sort of like the buttons on the side of drawing tablets. You could also probably use it to make coding faster too. It would be cool to have one massive group of customizable labeled shortcuts. I just feel like there's alot more you could do with this idea than just keyboard but laser.

[@KamenRiderGumo]

I'm definitely a "laggard" when it comes to tech - I didn't start buying DVD until my VHS player no longer functioned and couldn't be replaced, up until a few months ago I refused to switch from Windows 7 to 10 (and still refuse to go to 11). I'm very much in the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" crowd because it doesn't cost any extra money to use what you already have. So perhaps I'm in a minority for your audience. I like to know what new tech updates are out there and follow the development of new things, but only buy what I need and don't jump on bandwagons or grab something because its the "hot new thing".

[@theussmirage]

Another laggard here, I like waiting for technology to mature, and feeling out how reliable and useful new technologies are before jumping on board. Also these cutting edge products get cheaper as time moves on, so you get better value for your money. Early adopters end up paying premiums for unreliable fault-ridden products unfortunately.

[@dmo848]

I'm with ya. I still use vista, simply cause it hasn't died and is still fast enough for me. I use everything until it simply can't be fixed anymore.

[@dmo848]

@@theussmirage so Tru I learned overtime although I did buy a ps5 at launch jus cause

[@Silburific]

I'm right there with you. When my Windows 7 laptop bricked, I switched over to Linux (Mint) not because I knew what Linux was, but because it was 1- free, and 2- almost exactly like Windows 7. I still buy DVDs and CDs and physical games whenever possible because I will never hop onto the "renting media is better than owning it" bandwagon, but I still like seeing other people spend their money on flashy things I'll never want or need.

[@thecasualcarcamper6775]

another laggard. I got burned a couple times on new tech and now wait till gen 2 or 3 to avoid being a Betta tester.

[@Rhoran]

In a 2011 computer class in college, we had to find the latest innovations to discuss in class and this was one of them. I thought it was neat, but quickly forgot about it. It's cool to see the history of what happened after!

[@finestructureconstant3921]

It is more suited for use as a replacement for wireless keyboards for smartphones not tablets or desktop personal computers. One annoying thing was only auditory feedback for key 'clicks'. Would have preferred either that they increased the brightness of the key being 'clicked' or have a second laser color like blue or green. Its technology has a number of other applications that immediately come to mind but I will not elaborate in case I decide to pursue one or two of them. A lesson in that if the use case for a new product is weak the product will fall into the novelty gadget category. In my experience it is still possible to make money from novelty gadgets if a company makes a number of such products. Changing out products as they fall away into the 'chasm'. P.S. liked your analysis - especially you pointing out one cannot type on their lap with it. lol .

[@editingsecrets]

My guess is that if you do pursue it, the original patents have expired by now.

[@bigdeagle1331]

I remember the advertisement using a credit card size device with a lazer keyboard!

[@totallybonkers76]

I was interested in this product, (you can still get them on amazon!) merely because it looks totally rad (isn't that what *all* marketing is supposed to do?) anyways you just saved me £50 because of this video showing me how difficult and bad it is to actually use! Thanks dude! appreciated :)

[@calorion]

You never know; maybe the new ones have fixed the issues!

[@totallybonkers76]

@@calorion maybe so, yeah! but I seriously doubt it ..

[@Tramwithacam]

in my experience it can type okay* the surface the light is shined on has a big effect with how the device reads your input. The one I have has the option to turn up or down the brightness of the laser which can improve typing depending on the surface or typing on. Also hunt and peck to be the best option because if you think about it the way it works it's detecting you breaking the light path from where the laser is more fingers means more chances for it to miss read your input. Ultimately it's a fun novelty if you can pick it up for like 10 or 15 bucks

[@Oleg-oe1rc]

@@calorion Besides the lack of feedback for the key presses and questionable accuracy you also don't have any kind of physical frame of reference like on a phone or tablet keyboard, and you had to be able to find a table with enough space to use it With virtual keyboards on devices you can get used to your finger positions quite easily and consistantly to type without needing to look where you're typing because you hold it a certain way or can feel the edges which places your hands and fingers in a consistant fixed position. But with the laser projected keyboard you lose all consitancy, even if you go out of your way to get some kind of frame of reference before typing like setting your wrists down at a certain spot or setting it a certain distance from the edge of a table, you're always prone to drift in several ways which causes you to contasntly need to readjust to keep any consistancy

[@calorion]

@@Oleg-oe1rc The lack of feedback issue, at least, would seem easily fixable. It could blink the key you pressed as you pressed it.

[@marklechman2225]

Totally remember seeing either a web ad or article for this way back in the day. Thought it looked cool and I really thought we'd be seeing laser keyboards everywhere in the near future. A few years later I remember thinking "whatever happened to that cool laser keyboard whose name I can't recall?" and that was pretty much the last time it crossed my mind. Every so often I'd see something on a sci-fi show or music video that would have a mocked-up version of something similar and it would jar that memory back to life, but it never occurred to me that beyond looking cool, it didn't really serve a purpose that wasn't already being served. Glad you did this video, nice to know the whole story on this venture.

[@AaronOfMpls]

I vaguely remember hearing about these back in the day, but the name must've never stuck. And yah, I can see why they never caught on; looks like I could do better with an on-screen keyboard or a cheapo rubber-dome keyboard.* And yah, unless your laptop keyboard is broken, there's really no point in using this with a laptop. 😆 * PS, I'm typing this on a Unicomp New Model M keyboard. I don't think I'd do well with almost _zero_ feedback like that laser thing! 😀

[@johnvongoeler7936]

I love you're "marketing 101" type lessons for tech on this... most vloggers are much more inaccurate when explaining successes or failures

[@marcorothley6039]

I could imagine something like that built into a tablet or tablet type-cover but only for replacing mouse/touchpad. You'd not project anything, just turn the desk area next to the physical keyboard into a big touchpad. That would be something I'd be willing to spend a few bugs on (then again, not that much either).

[@unbearifiedbear1885]

IIRC, I think this was the original mission of Windows Surface.. "screenless" tablets on any surface

[@editingsecrets]

@@unbearifiedbear1885 No, the original Surface was a big-ass touchscreen coffee table for teamwork. Then they reused the name for tablets.

[@aroberts3213]

Whats interesting is that i could see this as a cool trackpad/mouse. Maybe that's where they should have focused

[@tamiusoftheshitpostlegion5082]

No kidding. I sometimes use a touchpad if I'm getting too much strain on my wrists from using mouse. While touchpads are cool (except for the part where "cursor coasting" appears to have gone extinct in the last 10-15 years), they're much less cool to actually have under your keyboard. A compact laser-projection touchpad that would project to space under the keyboard would be pretty neat.

[@Allurade]

The issue overall with the product, to me anyway, is if it ever made it to mainstream adoption, it would have died under a mountain of lawsuits pretty quickly thanks to the laser. I don't know how powerful it is, but Ken says in the video it hurt his eyes to look at, and anyone who has looked at the "mad laser scientist" section of youtube has been told you don't need to look right into the diode to damage your eyes. The light reflecting off a surface from this product was clearly not safe to use without laser safety goggles. And really, who the hell is gonna pull out laser safety glasses every time they want a track pad? And that's before you consider someone's kid grabbing it and going "oo pretty red light" and staring into it.

[@klausstock8020]

I've been on a job interview at some company where I would had led development of such a device. Seems they went bankrupt faster than the ink on the contract could dry. Don't remember when that was, must have been like the very late 1990s. In any case, there was no laser involved, just a regular projector. And the projection is only for the benefit of the user, it's not really needed for the function. A camera would watch for the finger. Recognition of a "click" would have been based upon gesture recognition, or, as an alternative, by watching the shadow. A blurry shadow means "no click" while a sharp shadow means "click". The shadow thing can't work with a single point-source light (like sunlight), so I think they wanted to use artificial IR illumination. Now, for the "click" recognition to work, you can't just slide your finger across a surface like you do with a touchpad. You need to lift the finger for a "tapping gesture", like you do on a touchscreen nowadays. And, like on your phone's touchscreen, careless finger movements may lead to an, ah, "inconvenient rearrangement" of stuff on your screen. Unlike with a mouse or a traditional physical keyboard, you cannot rest your hand upon it, making it somehow less convenient, especially for extended/prolonged use. Due to camera limitations, the "virtual touchpad" needs to be quite large if you want reasonable accuracy (well, at least in case of the device where i did the job interview for; they wanted absolute positioning, like on a touchscreen, not relative positioning, like with a mouse or a touchpad). It would have been useful to convert a video projection into a touchscreen. MS Kinect and similar systems have been around, for the consumer market, since at least 2010. Kinect also uses a camera to track the motion, plus a source of "structured light" to receive depth (distance) information. And while MS Kinect is the next generation interface to enable , it is about as inconvenient to use like the desktop computer touchscreen (yep, remember that the Windows 8 UI was based on the idea that you no longer use a mouse but comfortably smear your fingers along your upright 42" touchscreen sitting on your desk?). YMMV for gaming purposes, though. Now, the real killer is: why would you have a some "virtual mouse" slab sit on you desk when you could simply use a Bluetooth mouse? Maybe not one as tiny and unsexy as the ZeroMouse...but then again, you could secretly hide a ZeroMouse in your palm while pretending that you're using a laser mouse.

[@randomcow505]

that would be even worse why would you carry something the size of a portable wireless mouse around, only for it to cost 30x the price of a regular mouse and function half as well

[@Allurade]

@@klausstock8020 That was way more informative than anything I expected to see in KZbin comments. Thank you. And I recall skipping Windows 8 because I thought the UI looked "god awful", and it may have been the start of my incessant complaining about stuff being optimized for touch screens. Why would I want to poke the screen and get it filthy when I can grab a mouse and click stuff and still see the screen?

[@pellingt]

I picked up one when they originally came out for use in an extremely dirty environment. Application used about 6 keystrokes to control it, click a button, walk away, come back, click button, etc. Worked well for me. System ran for about 2 years like this before being shut down. I still have the cube in my drawer.

[@fourtyfivefudd]

I remember seeing one at Brookstone at the mall when they were still around a few years ago. Even their interactive display of this thing which they had linked to an old iPod, didn’t work correctly. I wasn’t sure if I should be amazed by the potential, or disappointed by what I saw lol

[@soyyo9827]

I have one of these keyboards bought it long ago to support the development. The main reason wasn't because of the lasers it was because of size vs a external keyboard this thing have, but the feeling of using it on a table is not great at all. So yeah it wasn't worth the save of space and dust.

[@MichaelP833]

i paid a lot of attention when these laser keyboards first became a thing. i was really looking forward to the advancement in the technology, and for it to be combined with a small projector on the back for the screen. add another sensor like it does there, and you also have a touch screen. that combination i think could have had real value

[@f.i.b3027]

Imagine how chunky it would be to have a working computer with it.

[@editingsecrets]

@@f.i.b3027 Could have snapped it to phone with a small tripod stand.

[@f.i.b3027]

@@editingsecrets the thing is, nobody is really asking for this since if you have a table, you can just bring and fully working laptop.

[@editingsecrets]

@@f.i.b3027 Agreed!

[@richardpeel6056]

I actually have an unbranded version of this product bought on Ebay in the UK. I was mountainbike camping in France using satnav on the bike connected to a solar panel mounted on my luggage.This gave me sufficient surplus power to recharge Ultrafire T6 cycle lights and a Kindle. I wanted to keep a diary but the Kindle wouldn't do it. I tried using the laser projection keyboard with a tablet in a tent but found it easier just to use a notebook and pen. However hard you try you can't get the groundsheet of a tent smooth enough to support the projected keyboard and when you moved about to type new wrinkles appeared. I think a voice notebook app may be the diary of the future, not this. There was a movie about an innovation team that created a computer that ran entirely on a holographic screen and keyboard, this product is a step in that direction but really it's just a prototype not ready for release to the public.

[@thaphreak]

Visual feedback? Your finger blocks the light doesn't it? I had one of these, it was pretty cool, the typing speed was horrid. It stayed in the living room for the media PC for a few years until it took a hit from a flailing Wiimote.

[@blankseventydrei]

so one possible use case would be in labs, my company had demostrated it for the "lab of the future" but it was not implemented. this way you can enter data into elab notebooks without taking off your gloves or fear of spilling something on the keyboard. this also allows you to have more space on the bench, as keyboards on the hanging stands still need space.

[@mduff94]

Used to see these for sale all the time on Think Geek circa 2011/2012

[@ComputerClan]

Interesting! That sounds like a good fit for a product like this, but I suppose I missed that… or I just forgot. : D

[@treimar]

I remember seeing this on "Room raiders" MTV show. It looked different and they called it the "virtual keyboard" but still thank you for bringing back memories I didn't know I had :)

[@jjstein1976able]

You mentioned about never seeing magic cube on TV. I remember an episode of CSI Miami had one (though maybe not the same name) as a main plot point. Something about a receptionist using it to hide the fact she was posting on social media during work hours. It was discovered by the fingerprints she left on the glass desktop.

[@Steelgramps]

Yes, thank you! I couldn't remember in what tv-show i had seen it, but i knew for sure i had seen it on tv.

[@thulean.uruk-hai]

I saw it on TV once, it was very prominently placed in an episode of CSI Miami, was how I learned about it and went looking for it. Never got around to getting one, though. Looks like that was for the best.

[@Isaac.Foster]

It’s a good idea in theory. Pocket-sized portability is a nice feature. However, I remember people saying how difficult it was to use back in the day. Which isn’t great because I wanted one 😂

[@Victoare]

If i recall right (and maybe there is a hint on your video as well around 0:56) at first they imagined this product as an embeddable keyboard solutions for palm sized devices (so you just stand up your palm/phone and it shines the keyboard in front of it) and these cubes are just the proof of concept products to see if laser keyboards would work in general. And .. they don't. Very futuristic, and hip, but as you mentioned they don't solves much and has mayor flaws even if the touch recognition would be perfect. For it's time, it probably would solve the "bigger keyboard without additional hardware" part if it was truly an embedded solution.

[@CaityE]

omg i remember watching those like top 10 futuristic products videos by like mr. freeze or something and this was always featured in them 😭 never believed in any of those videos but they were fun to watch lmao

[@donuteh2461]

I actually looked into this product because I had to deploy a computer in a food processing facility, where it was necessary to have a keyboard that was clean able. This would have been great as you just had to clean the surface. However bluetooth was kind of a pain at the time dnd not on most desktop computers since it didn't seem to work through USB according to the website and it was over $200 + shipping in Canada, we decided on the $20 rubber keyboard instead. I can see this being a good option at that time for the food industry, if they only gave it USB connectivity, or at least said it was an option, and lowered the price a bit. Now, however, rugged computers are more accessible and touchscreen keyboards are reasonably good so I don't see much use for them anymore.

[@DavidDavis311]

This had a lot of potential. If they would’ve continued to develope the visual aspect of the keyboard and figured out how to animate it I would imagine this would be something that could’ve eventually been integrated directly into a tab or hone.

[@editingsecrets]

Could have been like Apple's Touch Bar.

[@10MARC]

I remember this technology quite well, but somehow I don't recall the name. I was quite involved in the PalmOS/Handspring scene back in the mid 2000's and I very much remember all the talk about "laser keyboards". I am not sure if they ever shipped a product, but laser keyboards were certainly advertised for PalmOS devices back then.

[@cobrag0318]

I remember a laser keyboard shown in a tech mag even further back. Didn't seemed aimed at laptop users, and smartphones/tablets weren't really a thing yet. So I think it was intended as a keyboard solution for a desktop/tower PC. It looked kinda like an old school desk lamp. I don't really remember much more, but that seemed so cool at the time.

[@EeveeEuphoria]

i actually very specifically remember wanting this thing because i wanted a portable keyboard, but didn't want to lug a giant ass keyboard everywhere i went. i didn't always carry a bag with me when i brought my own tablet, so, yeah this would've been legitimately helpful for my case. so, this *does* actually solve a problem. it's just, they didn't do any convincing that this is a problem. and nowadays there are folding bluetooth keyboards everywhere, which i'm now realizing i might wanna use for my steam deck

[@michelmarcuse9218]

I remember seeing this in the inflight shopping magazines and being intrigued. Using it on the plane would have seemed like a good use case. I always found it hard to use a laptop in flight because of the cramped space, but using something like this with my phone would be much easier. There was a fantastic keyboard called the "stowaway" (I think) that was an almost full size keyboard that folded to about the size of a smartphone, and if it had been Bluetooth, it would have been a great alternative. If they had combined something like that with a pico projector, it would have been perfect to use a smartphone as a laptop when working on a plane (or leave the laptop at home).

[@Phos9]

Regarding it not solving anything, I think this was conceived to be paired with palm pilots and other early aughts PDA's, but was stuck in development hell for long enough that iPads were out by the time it finally made it to market. I recall seeing an article well before the iphone that was describing this concept, they already pointed out that you would have to touch whatever surface you were typing on.

[@AHaensel]

I had the CL800BT and the problem wasn't the lack of feedback, it was the high and variable latency for each keypress.

[@APyralis]

Interesting video. I was gifted one of these WAY back around 2011 I think... you mentioned you hadn't seen it on TV. It actually was! On an episode of CSI, the "killer" used it to covertly send information to lure her victims via messages and emails and they caught her because of all the fingerprints lefts on a keyboard-less desk (which then looked out of place). That's when I saw it, my then spouse bought this for me shortly after. You're dead on about the rest of the review... it blew it terms of being useful.

[@SWinxyTheCat]

I've known of this for a long time, but I don't remember where I learned of it first. I think Captain D did a video which made a reference to it a few years back. I would have answered 'no' to that poll, but I would absolutely recognize it and know what it is.

[@brendansmith9677]

3:48 even on mobile devices there can be physical feedback. Many devices are able to slightly vibrate when keys are pressed in order to accomplish this

[@jamesrowles9249]

Dude! I was literally thinking about this product today and immediately looked you up to see if you covered it. Color me surprised!

[@CnfuD-Choticstreaming]

I wouldn't remember the name too, especially the companies behind it but I do remember the product. I also remember assuming it failed and dissapeared for these obvious reasons

[@DragonJohn]

I remember seeing ads for this, ask me the name before today and I wouldn't have been able to tell you. I personally have a use case where a *good* device of this nature would be quite useful. I've got a thin-client PC and monitor set up on my work bench so I can watch youtube and such while working on projects. I use a wireless keyboard/touchpad with it, it can be a bit in the way a times and a "virtual keyboard/touchpad" would be good, I wouldn't need to move it since it doesn't exist. But, yeah, if it's difficult to use accurately then it's not a good product.

[@codingquantum2195]

I bought one of those (Celluon Laserkey CL800) back in 2006 for 165 EUR for use with my Palm. Worked okay, but the main drawback was that it had no battery indicator - just an LED that turned red 5-10 minutes before it died. Therefore I got rid of it after a few weeks and went back to a normal foldable keyboard.

[@Robert67010]

I remember seeing these at Brookstone. The only use I could think of was an ultra portable keyboard for network technicians. Something you can break out when you just need to type in a couple of commands. I have found that a pocket keyboard works just as well if not better.

[@klausstock8020]

I even question the usability for a network technician. Yes, I am talking about the case some appliance fails to boot, is not accessible via SSH or anything remote. The appliance is, of course, (since this this is an industrial setting) "installed" in some dark and tight corner. The hapless technician might be confronted with pointy protrusions from some machinery, or a garbage pile on top of the appliance, and about anything else, but the one thing which is notably absent is a flat surface. Luckily, this is not my line of work. Well, okay...it sometimes is. So I have a small compact wired USB keyboard, plus a wireless keyboard-touchpad combination (not Bluetooth, but with a dongle, so no driver needed). Yes, I usually work mouse-less. But there's one machine with a GUI application which can only be used with a mouse. Yes, the programmer must have been real talented to figure out how to program an "OK" button which cannot be accessed with any keyboard navigation or shortcut. Hence the trackpad. I can hold the keyboard in one hand and type (or move the mouse pointer) with the other hand. The only good thing is that this machine sits in the pointy department, not in the trash department. I guess that, as a network technician, you need to be happy about the small things in life.

[@theussmirage]

@@klausstock8020 I couldn't imagine trying to use a shell or command prompt using a keyboard with less than perfect accuracy. What a nightmare!

[@Listener11111]

I think the single most important advantage of physical keebs over touchscreen ones isn't even tactile feedback (after all, it can be quite weak in many keebs), but that you can rest you fingers on it and feels them WIHTOUT pressing them, which means you don't need to look at the keeb as attentively; since most people who type often has some sort of muscle memory, the key shapes help the fingers to the desired letters, even if the muscle memory isn't 100% precise. this? you either look at it or you can hit the spot perfectly, otherwise the result will be a mess

[@Drejkol]

I remember when I bought this together with mobile projector back in ~2015 for hard earned money from summer job. It was fun things to show off in the high school. Like, super futuristic things. I could just change simple corridor into movie theater while having literally laser keyboard projected on the ground. Anyway I donated both things to my college club. I can't really imagine using this laser keyboard as your main keyboard.

[@inachu]

I bought one and it went missing but they do serve a great purpose in some industries for sure! Imagine no more needing gloves if you do not handle money and shine it on a cutting board and still deal with customers and make food at same time. The device is accurate enough so typos are kept at a minimum and I think all around it is a great device. I do hope they are back in production and aimed at the proper industry they are meant for.

[@jonreams6090]

I remember seeing this on ThinkGeek a long time ago and I shared your skepticism. I thought it might be good for showing off but real computing would be hard. With touchscreens being so ubiquitous they don't even make sense in interactive experiences anymore

[@dpc4548]

Chyrosran reviewed one, how has nobody heard of this?

[@spugintrntl]

I remember seeing press about this back in the day, and that was about it. Then I saw it in your community post and thought "Wait, that thing actually came out?" Never realized they actually released it.

[@ryancoulter4797]

I almost bought this a decade ago. Was trying to lighten the load in my writing bag and thought this would help. So glad I didn’t. Thanks!

[@juand7779]

I never seen an ad for it. But I did buy one in like 2015 from Amazon and it was maybe 10 bucks, I don't remember the exact price. I used it, I thought it was kind of cool, but the on-screen keyboard on every single one of my devices worked so much better. It was just a novelty device that I only pulled out to say "look at what this can do".

[@Aldwick6635]

A friend of mine had one of these, and actually had a niche use case for it which made it better than a real keyboard. He hooked it up to a smart tv and had it on a table from which he'd eat off of pretty often while watching tv, so having an input device that didn't get dirty if he used messy fingers was optimal.

[@coeal2680]

when i was a kid when these came out, i REALLY wanted it to be cool and work well. I was, still am, a HUGE mass effect nerd. and in the game, virtual keyboards like this are everywhere, and it looks just like them in the games. and i had a crazy idea i posed to my friends, figure out how to mount it to your arm or shoulder and VIOLA, a OMNI-Device projected onto your arm, or any surface you look at. but..i was a young teen, i had no money to even get or try one xD

[@alericjohansen6775]

I saw it when Google reader was a thing. I was living with my mom, and had no job, so I had no ability to even remotely buy it. But, back then, I LOVED the idea. It was such an interesting and cool tech concept. Nowadays, with my larger subset of knowledge, and broke, and inability to ever get out of poverty, I wouldn't even bother with this anymore. If someone GAVE me it, I'd have fun testing it's abilities, but would only ever regard it as a novelty item. Something to inspire some crazy ideas, but never anything really .... Valuable, to society. When I saw the thumbnail for this video, I instantly recognized it, and watched simply because it made me realize again how bad it an idea it was, and I wondered who made it. Sad that they basically died out. They were willing to try a new idea, and it doesn't work out. Hindsight is 20/20 sadly

[@refraggedbean]

I saw ads for this all the time ages ago but just never wanted it, I was like "thats cool" and kept using a nice good traditional keyboard

[@maliciousbugman]

You said it best - this is very much a solution in search of a problem. You could certainly improve the experience in a number of ways (e.g. integrating a motor so that it can rumble on the tabletop surface and lend some tactility, and making the "pressed" key icon's graphic solid to give visual feedback, etc), but those don't improve the core technology or give it more purpose. The only niche I could see this filling is MAYBE being some kind of last-resort emergency keyboard... but even then you're screwed if you don't have a flat surface on-hand, unless it came with a non-proprietary foldable/rollable surface. And I'd imagine you'd rather have a rollable or foldable keyboard if preplanning is a factor. That said, if you wanted to throw out concerns of practicality or distinct purposefulness to purely lean into novelty and the rule of cool: how functional would an underside-projected laser keyboard work, provided the projection surface wasn't 100% transparent on the topside (to prevent eye damage), and affixed to the underside or inside of the surface in question?

[@jasonbarham1980]

I actually purchased this product back in the early 2010s... For a windows mobile device. The early iPhone keyboard was far and away better because of the screen. While the keyboard layout was essentially the same (my last windows mobile device was an hp hx4700) the screen was a resistive type which wasn't the most responsive and this is why I purchased the laser keyboard. Unfortunately, like you found, the laser keyboard wasn't much better than that provided on the windows mobile devices and I ended up selling it a few months later. I think that it's compatibility with Windows (pc) and ios was more that to the device it looks like a regular keyboard and all of these devices had compatibility with Bluetooth keyboards to start with.

[@Leo-sd3jt]

I remember people talking about this all over the place back in the day. Weirdly, if you look for "laser keyboard" on KZbin, most of the reviews are 5 years old or newer which is not what I expected. I do remember hearing that the issue with it, and why touch typing works better with it, is because it can't see anything that's behind your front-most part of your hand so if you're resting your hands like you do on a regular keyboard then a lot of the keystrokes won't get picked up. Also, I never knew about the fact that the period and stuff are on the numbers row. I'm guessing they moved the most common grammatical signs closest to the camera to improve accuracy but that makes it so much harder and more annoying to type.

[@mennomateo]

I bought a Lenovo 500 multimedia controller which has all these features including the trackpad like action across the keys but with physical buttons and handheld. Works great for my HTPC

[@twilightknight123]

Legitimate practical use case for laser keyboards: Use in any location the requires frequent sanitation like many hospital/cleanroom keyboards. They already have keyboards specifically for this which is basically just a normal keyboard but with a plastic cover on it so it isn't individual keys. The laser keyboard might be more annoying to use, but it would be better in public facing positions where you don't want the user to be able to physically interact with anything and potentially break/misuse it

[@interpol007]

It’s funny because I was just thinking why didn’t anyone invent this after so many movies having something similar 😂

[@editingsecrets]

Plot twist: the prop department bought the real thing and took it to the set!

[@seanlavoie2]

I wonder if the concept is older than bluetooth? “An optical virtual keyboard was invented and patented by IBM engineers in 1992.[1]”. According to Wikipedia. Portability and perhaps special needs / handicapped use might have been the original selling point / market. I think that thought comes from some kind of news magazine show I saw a long time ago.

[@seanlavoie2]

It really feels like the idea predates modern cellphones and the technology didn’t get finalized until the potential market vanished.

[@TheCoolDave]

I remember this, I looked it up in the day, I remember it being very expensive, then I saw some reviews, hard to find back the day, and most people were not crazy about how it worked.

[@billjohnson1094]

Always a fun watch, thanks. I even watched the ad this time!

[@kennylex]

By the way, in the group you call "Laggers", there you also find tech nerds and hackers that find new usage for old products, a laser that let you do hand gestures to control something, for me that sparked an idea, I have a XP-Pen 24" that I love, but it can not use hand gestures, so if I could have one of those and it let me program it and have different shapes projected I could use it as a way to rotate and scale my work area in Krita or Affinity Designer, so now I almost want to buy to test if that is possible, but it still a bit expensive for if it would not work. And GREAT video. and sorry for sounding strange when typing, had a stroke and still hard get words to work correctly.

[@BrianHartman]

I do remember this. I think the thing it had going for it, in theory, was the ability to project a bigger keyboard. If you cast your mind back to 11 years ago, people were using foldable keyboards that you could carry around with you. These generally didn't have the key size and key travel of full-size keyboards, and often had different layouts. If you could project a keyboard, theoretically, you could have a full-size keyboard with a proper layout. I never used one, but I think if it had worked as advertised, it would've beaten the portable keyboards of the time.

[@dreadskeleton]

I remember about 10 years ago this thing was on a site that listed a lot of either stupid expensive or just stupid things you can buy online.

[@ahmedjoo1858]

Great market analysis basics free course regardless of this specific product, You asked the right questions that any innovator group should ask before working on / introducing new product to the market.

[@neanda]

I just love your presentation / narration, so relaxed yet straight up. It's just so cool to listen to. I'd follow you into the dark

[@editingsecrets]

Following him by the light of his laser keyboard

[@fooman2108]

Perfect subject for one of your style of videos. I HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM.

[@DeLorean4]

They used to have a laser keyboard on display at the Montreal Science Museum. I think this was back in the early 2000s. It was mounted in a public kiosk and you could type text on a black screen (nothing else). Using it was just as bad as you described it. A natural asdf jkl; resting position would confuse it or make it unresponsive, and you had to be super careful when pecking. Even if the technology were refined, the feeling of repeatedly tapping a hard surface would be unbearable for any substantial period of time. The only thing I can imagine with a worse typing feel is the steel pin pad they use on public ATMs and gas pumps. Now that I think about it, a laser keyboard in a public environment has the advantages of being basically impossible to vandalize, and extremely easy to clean. If someone is looking for a product at a store, entering a pin, or looking up a name in a directory, they aren't typing much anyways, so in these specific cases, a laser keyboard actually makes sense.

[@h.Freeman]

I quit being overly interested in tech because I waited in line for an iPhone only for them to release another in the same year. That did basically the same thing. Now all I want to know is does it get the job done and serve my needs? It doesn't have to be new. In fact I prefer to wait until prices come down. And if it's obsolete when that happens, I didn't miss out.

[@editingsecrets]

I think you can safely buy a laser keyboard now without too much worry about depreciation

[@patrickhobbs8201]

Had a mate bring this to class a fewtimes. Iirc, he was mostly using it as a sneaky way to be on his phone. He put the keyboard on his paper notepad and used a regular pen as a stylus. Though now that I think about it, he may have just been taking notes on his phone in a way that wouldn't get him in trouble with the prof. Either way, from a distance, it wasn't obvious he was interacting with his phone.

[@solothkaroftrinsic3852]

I actually have two (different) ones of thems. And writing was pretty easy for me but I get the criticism. It helped type on an iPad without loosing half the screen for an screen keyboard. Still a keyboard case is easier and more useful. But it is great if you have not much space in your backpack.

[@kylemulkey9659]

I feel like learnability and use is a big factor. the same issues you had with this can sort of be applied to the steam controller. The two touchpads are awesome and once you learn how to use them effectively they can be incredible, but its a steep learning curve in a space that most people want instant gratification. Also when it comes to video game controllers, major innovations dont always work, sure the dual stick design stuck, but it started on the PS1 and it took a whole generation before it actually stuck. Motion controls while super popular didn't change the way we game forever and neither did the touchpad unfortunately. Cool video though, I remember seeing this keyboard back in the day and thinking the same thing about what purpose did it serve.

[@editingsecrets]

When I read steam controller, I immediately felt I missed out on some Victorian cyberpunk think with brass tubes and wheels and levers to put on the coffee table.

[@ItsMrLee]

Hmm just a note with that poll, if you asked me if I know what the magic cube whatever is ill say never heard of it. If you ask if ive seen laser projection keyboards I would say I have seen them.

[@kennylex]

I seen something similar in a museum, bit it was not a full keyboard but rather two buttons showing "Play" and "Stop" projected onto a wood surface, I do not know if it was the same technology or it used other technologies, but it worked and was for sure easier to keep cleen than a keyboard. So why do I say this? For I think that is a good technology used in wrong way, if folk had been able to customize the layout and it could show colors it could be used as Hot-Keys, like you just need to tap on the table to change "Game Mode" or maybe have as a quick "Ctrl-Z" or volume control, but the product was too static and boring for that prize and with that functionality and lack of customization, so if they rethink how the product may work and be used it can be a part of smart-homes or computer cool setups.

[@editingsecrets]

Yep, Or a media library controller, doorbell camera, pool heater switch, etc. Things with ten or fewer big virtual buttons.

[@StinkyBlack1]

Whoever designed this didnt know how to type in the first place, you dont look at the keyboard to type. You look at the screen and FEEL the keyboard. You would need like a matt with tactile bumps, but then youd just have a keyboard.

[@snowpython]

I remember this thing. I had a buddy who bought it and it took 2 weeks to get to our dorms. It worked okay but if you don't have a large enough type surface it's not usable.