Last communication between pilot and control tower detailed by South Korean officials

[@namelessone5968]

a bird strike is survivable, that emergency landing is also survivable, what isn't survivable though is crashing into a solid concrete structure at very high speed

[@srilanmellawa913]

Spot on

[@helenas7948]

They landed at the end of the runway, with no flaps deployed, lost virtually no speed. If not this, they would very soon hit another obstacle.

[@CMill78]

@@helenas7948 This is what seems to be lost on everyone blaming the Localizer. If you leave most runways around the world at 150+mph with no gear down, you'd have the same result.

[@Camel_Jockey]

@@CMill78only have the same results if fixed object are at the end of the runway. Beyond the concrete wall was water. They’d have walked away had they slid into water.

[@paperplane-db8qf]

Airports are also built on cliffs or in the middle of cities. You can always say “if” but landing halfway down the runway at a high speed is the primary problem.

[@Stefch2]

You can see that these guys did not sleep.

[@michaelmkhize4650]

How kindly explain?

[@JB-sh9nf]

You have eyes right?​@michaelmkhize4650

[@GoldenEDM_2018]

They better dont they're being paid a huge amount from taxpayer's money to deal with these exact situations

[@haz4892]

@@michaelmkhize4650 so tired that they can barely keep their eyes open

[@HotdogVendor1337]

im not sure you can say things like that these days mate

[@richardschindler8822]

I’m a retired corporate pilot with 20k hrs in my book, and I would say were things done in haste, maybe, we don’t know yet. We won’t know until the black boxes have been throughly gone over. This way we can see what was happening in the cockpit. So,until then, I will not pass judgement. My thoughts and prayers go out to all that were lost.

[@reihydra]

What do you think about the concrete wall? i mean is it even illegal to have one at the end of the runway

[@minac1590]

i would like to know if there shoulda have been a concrete wall there or not as well...dont runways usually go for miles?

[@A-Ra1111]

❤ wisdom and professionalism.

[@AM93000]

@@minac1590 why solely blame on the wall when a tragedy has occurred? That wall had been around for some time. Why nobody in South Korea raised a concern all these years?

[@LoriM-ez3co]

I know the plane was doing 150 according to another expert could they have turned the plane earlier and avoided the collision at the end or would it have cartwheeled...that berm has to go. what a tragedy

[@fraserweir538]

Still doesn’t explain the hasty landing with no time to go through checklists and not deploying landing gear.

[@ykst6685]

during the go around, the pilots retracted the landing gear and forgot to deploy it on the second landing- while in a state of panic.

[@johngreydanus2033]

@@ykst6685 All the more reason to keep flying, prepare the aircraft for emergency landing as per the check list.

[@SlimShadyTinBaby]

I suspect they attempted to shut down the bird strike engine but chose the wrong one. Low altitude with both engines out and insufficient time for air ram turbine to deploy, nightmare scenario for even excellent pilots. They might have been worried they wouldn’t make the runway so didn’t deploy flaps and landing too fast. But we will see

[@rotyler2177]

its called panic

[@azpilotd4351]

@@SlimShadyTinBaby737 doesn’t have an air ram turbine, it uses batteries for backup in case of total power loss.

[@mansnotprot1544]

Seems like panicking pilots, and terrible airport design.

[@beepbeep5153]

Definitely both

[@youtubechangemynamewhy]

Exactly

[@EzioAuditoreDaFirenze99]

Absolutely because a plane has the fuel necessary to remain in the air for up to 3 hours so that they can circle the airport in just such an event. Also, the pilots are supposed to dump the fuel before an emergency landing so that there isn't a fireball.

[@ImDayv27]

​@@EzioAuditoreDaFirenze99 exactly what I thought!

[@B88-h6n]

Exactly my thoughts

[@hyrenaj2888]

The only reason the pilots to attempt that landing that quickly is a dual engine failure, which it certainly didn't sound like from 'that' video.

[@zacgan1845]

it seems they mistakenly shut down the wrong engine, did not have time to start APU and probably panicked. unsure if there was miscommunication regarding the go around leading to landing gear not being manually deployed

[@saltymonke3682]

There was no dual engine failure, he forgot the landing gear and his flaps.

[@kentaylor2416]

​@@saltymonke3682Or did the plane indicate that the landing gear was down?

[@frankmueller7660]

Even a dual engine failure would not impact flaps, slats and gear

[@petergerritgroen3157]

Theye want to make a go around...?

[@alicemalt5099]

The word "CONCRETE WALL" has been erased from Korea vocabulary

[@CoolchipN3325]

They were going way too fast anyways and landed halfway down the runway. Even if there was a grass field with barely any buildings on the other side, 90%+ people would have died. And they actually hit the embankment not the wall.

[@AKL89]

@@CoolchipN3325 finally someone who thinks logically not emotionally.

[@alvinyustiansaputra9131]

@@alicemalt5099 737 should have emergency gear extension. even without the hydraulic, the landing gear will still be able to be extended using gravity

[@alvinyustiansaputra9131]

A 737 should have emergency’s gear extension. By using gravity, the gear should still be able to be deployed even without hydraulic

[@kewintaylor7056]

Idk what is that wall for at all…😂

[@leokimvideo]

These two guys look really stressed

[@agps4418]

i suspect they're under the pressure to both provide information to satisfy public, but also to save face for the airline and airport. people already indicate that the fault is most likely at the pilots first, the wall (airport) second. these guys about to blame the bird first, and boeing second

[@user-pf5xq3lq8i]

Yes, faces of pressured liars.

[@cathybrind2381]

You reckon? Not so stressed as the victims' families.

[@sophieedel6324]

Let's put a WALL WITH REINFORCED CONCRETE at the end of the runway. What could possibly go wrong. Genius.

[@irqittuq415]

My thoughts, precisely.

[@UnlicensedOkie]

Yeah every expert I’ve seen is baffled by this incident. If that wall hadn’t been there, they would have survived

[@spdaltid]

Yes there are standards for frangible antenna, not berms. But let's see what the actual report throws up, rather than under the bus. My first thought is: Why would you go around after a birdstrike? There may have been a reason not to take the easy option and continue the approach to landing. I hit many birds on approach in my 45 yer career.

[@Jupiterloobncj]

Precisely

[@markz989]

Exactly and all they blame is some birds. Dont you guys see that every major fatal event in korea is due to their stupidity?

[@WilliamFeeney-q8z]

Bird strike 🦅 didn’t explain why the landing gear 🛞 wasn’t engaged !

[@toraguchitoraguchi9154]

Apparently the bird strike damaged the landing gear - But then there were back-up systems like manual landing gear etc. And the plane probably crash landed too fast.....I think the pilots panicked....

[@WilliamFeeney-q8z]

@ no reports from ATC That plane had a landing gear problem !

[@FrenchFili]

If S.Kor pilots panic like this, im not sure how theyre gonna handle N.Kor. ​@@toraguchitoraguchi9154

[@FrenchFili]

If S.Kor pilots panics like this plus their declining birth rate, i'm not sure how theyre gonna handle N.Kor's tantrums.

[@wqv5423ln]

​@@toraguchitoraguchi9154no they didn't panick. They lost all controls including speed and landing gear.

[@GameOn0-d6d]

That wall killed everyone 😢

[@kuyre2239]

there is a chance the pilot shut down the wrong engine

[@Wazurd]

​@@kuyre2239either way the pilot successfully landed the plane until it hit the concrete wall at the end of runway 😢

[@WilliamFeeney-q8z]

@@GameOn0-d6d minced comes to mind

[@Shirokuma15]

Doesnt matter, that plane already landed, which mean if they have long enough space to dampen the momentum, they would survived​@@kuyre2239

[@HKim0072]

The landing gear is the first thing to look at. There is no reason why it shouldn't have been down.

[@F30-Jet]

To the families;sorry for this tragic loss

[@Rockman99Fiction]

Me not sorry

[@anjanashyam9333]

​@@Rockman99Fictionno one cares what a heartless person like you thinks. Bye

[@sheikmohideen3505]

@@Rockman99Fiction mentally unstable?

[@Rockman99Fiction]

@@sheikmohideen3505 you xD

[@laxativeerosion4518]

I think this is human error. Bird strike's has been implemented on the training and simulations there is no way they could messed it up unless the pilots panicked or got too incompetent with their idea.

[@isataejin7060]

Desde ayer supe por medios coreanos que el piloto tenia mas de 10000 horas de vuelo. Al parecer era un piloto experimentado. También hablaron de posibles fallas en el sistema hidráulico debido al choque del pájaro y que esto pudo producir gases y humo en la cabina. Supongo que hay que esperar meses para que expliquen lo sucedido, aunque conociendo algo a los coreanos dudo que digan totalmente la verdad. El avión estuvo anunciando su llegada a las 8:30am y el accidente se produjo pasadas las 9:am Hay que tener en cuenta que las acciones de esa aerolínea habían mermado mucho su valor dos días antes. Por favor, disculpa lo extenso.

[@andrewlim7751]

There maybe fire spreading into the cabin.

[@dighawaii1]

It's a compound situation, though. Bird strike + human error + runway design tragedy. Pilot never needed anything. Didn't need a go-around. They just needed to continue their landing as planned.

[@colin8696908]

Pilot has brought 179 generation's of shame onto his family. 🥷

[@JB_Hobbies]

Bird strike or not, this seems like panic and pilot error due to the failure to use the back-up emergency gear deployment.

[@bethe006]

💯% That is my conclusion. And why the police RAIDED like Storm Troopers the Muan Airport control tower, the Jeju Air offices and confiscated the airline CEO's passport is beyond me. It's clearly political posturing to make it look like they are doing something. Crash investigations can't be done quickly. As a matter of fact, rushing this is gonna produce the same results as the pilot being in such a hurry to land that he didnt even bother to raise the flaps. He took 0 steps to slow that plane down. That's only the 2nd biggest prblm. The 1st is that the landing gear could've been extended manually. Since this story made headlines there have been endless experts consulted. The Guardian and NYT are excellent sources. Biggest Q being asked is: Why was the pilot in such a hurry to land the aircraft? The experts have commented that it didn't appear to be an imminent threat. SOP is to circle until ground crew have EMER preparations in place. THEN land. Also, landing gear has multiple back ups.

[@i.like.chicken.nuggets.17]

i think the cause of the crash was a combination of stuff like pilot errors, the wall and the birdstrike rather than just one cause.

[@ayamhitam9794]

The pilot is Korean and fly many times already on that airport, so it's no way he didn't know there's a concrete wall at the end of runway.

[@Jessman5]

it's mostly not just a single cause.

[@AM93000]

Definitely pilot error and also controlling tower error.

[@mautre]

There's almost NEVER just one cause in a crash like this.

[@johnlucas6683]

This is why it is still under investigation. This is why investigations are done. It is not one thing only.

[@kenthompson5723]

Sounds like "officials" are going to blame the tragedy on a bunch of birds. There were, in fact, serious problems with the landing itself that had nothing to do with birds.

[@luckybuddy1234]

Bird accidents do happen look it up

[@milyu995]

​@@luckybuddy1234 yes, but not a concrete wall at the end of the landing runaway

[@OzekiYoo]

Probably some official in Jejuair company will resign after this and compensate the family.

[@charleshowarth9944]

@@luckybuddy1234 It should still be possible to land

[@borismedved835]

A bird strike directly into the cockpit would explain everything, including why they didn't go around and land from the right direction. The engines and controls seemed to be working, so they could have gone around for a landing in the right direction if they were fully conscious. Turning around and landing without proper configuration sounds like they were seriously injured or somebody else tried to land the plane way too fast, not configured at all, too far down the runway.

[@cazhgacel]

Who's here for the comments from non-aviation experts?

[@proudbirther1998]

Well said. The comments from those that know nothing about aviation are staggering

[@sonnyh.8212]

Everyone is an expert and knows nothing about aviation, smh...

[@gladitsnotme]

People are evil. Blaming the pilots, blaming Korea, blaming Boeing. Meanwhile these armchair experts can't even get through a level of Microsoft Flight Simulator without crashing.

[@DwightStJohn-t7y]

Yeh, I waited three days for Blancoleiro's post and ignored all t he "experts" including some REAL experts knowing we'd interrupt Blanc's Xmas. He posted yesterday.

[@brians9508]

the number of people saying they "think" or "believe" it is the pilots' fault is so depressing. They have zero knowledge, but want to be sure they tell us what they think. they jump all over the pilots that were likely doing the best they could with sytemic failure/s. The pilots lost their lives. They have families and loved ones. Stop the ridiculous guessing, respect the great number of people that died, and wait for the full investigation to be completed.

[@itsmemiracle0928]

I think South Korea authority doesn’t want to be blamed for having a poor airport safety standard and operation…(which is understandable for any authorites regardless what the truth is) lots of criticism about this are in the western media… just my guess. Whatever the cause, my heart goes out to those who lost their lives and their families in this tragic incident.

[@Matthew-zv8qe]

Airport safety only plays part of the problem here. The aircraft shouldn’t have been going off the runway at that speed in the first place. Either some very unlikely catastrophic damage from the bird strike or pilot mismanagement of what should’ve been a non catastrophic birdstrike. My guess is the plane was not catastrophically compromised by the birdstrike.

[@jackmayor3574]

There were no safety standards. There clearly was at least one operating engine, the landing gear should have a backup hydraulic system in case of any engine failure, there should have been a faster emergency ground response, and there should be NO REINFORCED CONCRETE ON THE RUNWAY FOR GOD'S SAKE.

[@agps4418]

definitely! and they're saving the airline/pilots too! the narrative here is gonna bird and boeing

[@ag3957]

If you read local paper, search chosun daily english, it has an article on causes, no mention of the wall.

[@sourrlemons]

@@Matthew-zv8qe yup -- sounds like pilot error to me -- gear wasn't down, same with flaps, speedbrake, etc. aircraft was NOT configured for landing.

[@Connief1990]

A bird strike is not going to prevent landing gear to be deployed or flaps to be extended……

[@emiratesrobloxavation]

that Birdstrike disabled the systems, and the exrea gear deployers were too out of reach for the pilots.

[@Lukashoffmann94]

⁠​⁠@@emiratesrobloxavation Highly unlikely. They wouldn’t have gotten one engine into reverse, if they truly lost both hydraulic systems and the backup. The manual gear release being somewhat hard to reach also doesn’t really matter. It is not like they jumped up and down like the Azerbaijan plane. Going by what is known this was either caused by a blackout/panic of the pilots, or maintenance/manufacturing issues.

[@tessanvt7260]

The Ministry said themselves it did not seem like engine or landing gear failure, or one being caused by the other

[@lontarian2228]

@@emiratesrobloxavation There is enough redudancy. At least there is an extra standing-by hydraulic circuit and electric circuits to operate critical components. There could be something else we are not aware of, but it seems like the Pilots panicked and were unable to control the situation.

[@HeliBenj]

The bird strike couldn’t have disabled all 3 hydraulics systems. You don’t know what you’re talking about

[@DustyRolle]

So they came in on a normal approach configured for landing, had a bird strike on final approach, then decided to go around because of a bird strike?? instead of continuing the landing when they were right there on short final?? The bird strike wouldn't have prevented a landing at short final. It looks like they overreacted with the go around.

[@colin8696908]

It sounds like they hit the bird while landing, panicked and tried to pull out of the landing which might explain why the landing gear wasn't down. Anyone know if they reported a landing gear malfunction prior to the landing?

[@sourrlemons]

either way, they should've had plenty of time to continue the go around and go through checklists. why didn't they?

[@robertsmiarowski5908]

It's bother my a lot why pilots decided to go around

[@kimdavid6865]

I think both engine are out. Airplane need engine to descend.

[@alexc5449]

Forget the wall, the aircraft was not configured to land.

[@kitony]

Pilot error is likely the key culprit

[@chromatic2006]

@@kitony I doubt it. If the pilots thought the flaps were down, the plane would have stalled before the runway. They knew the flaps were not down, they came in fast for that very reason to prevent stalling. It is possible that the bird strike caused a piece of the engine to fly into the fuselage and disabled some of the hydraulics.

[@liufeng2095]

@@chromatic2006 But you shouldnt Land in a wrong position, near to the Wall, unless he is not aware That there is a solide structure at the end of the runway,More than of the landing Runway was not used for the emergen y landing and speed reduction

[@stonew1927]

@@liufeng2095 What happened is that he floated down the runway due to the high rate of speed, which only compounded his inability to slow the plane on time. Ultimately, the wall at the end of the runway was a poor design, though, precisely for this type of scenario.

[@liufeng2095]

@@stonew1927 we dont know that he is trying to do the normal landing or landing without gear unless you have the data of Blackbox

[@mrkeogh]

We still don't know why the crew decided to land so quickly when they should have had plenty of time to keep flying, run through the emergency checklists, and get the aircraft ready for a landing. We also don't know if the airport authorities advised the crew against attempting an emergency landing in the opposite direction to most landings at that airport.

[@infinitebeing1119]

Should investigate their schedules over worked/intoxicated pilots are susceptible to make errors.

[@MyBelch]

@@infinitebeing1119 Holiday weekend in Bangkok. I've had 20 years of those.

[@tessanvt7260]

From what I saw, they were cleared to land in the opposite direction after the request from the pilot at 9:01, two minutes after the declaration of the emergency by the pilots. Whatever conversation they had, it would have been short

[@brians9508]

@@infinitebeing1119 over worked/intoxicated commenters are prone to make insesitive comments about someone with zero evidence. wait until the investigation is complete before you start throwing your "theories" around about people that just lost their lives.

[@mautre]

They were given tower approval for the 2nd landing attempt in the opposite direction.

[@lordjim3109]

Are they trying to gaslight the Korean public that the airport was perfectly ok and put the blame on the dead pilots?

[@irqittuq415]

Pilots are trained to deal with birds, and airports in electric, NOT GAS LIGHT .SMH 🙄

[@liamwisner3580]

There was literally no blame placed, he just said the emergency happened too fast and that with such little warning firefighting crews couldn’t be pre deployed

[@chizusakuraa]

How you have arrived at that question baffles me. He simply narrated what transpired between the pilots and the atc tower during the first crucial minutes of the bird strike. Very low comprehension long with 43 likers, I see.

[@ПобедавРоссии]

Yes. The government doesnt want admit their mistake. What do you expect from korean corrupt government?

[@Jupiterloobncj]

@@irqittuq415dude, the pilot landed the plane! Only to meet a concrete wall

[@49ersfan62]

Condolences to all the families.thoughts are with the 2 survivors

[@BenjaminPiraux-ou7yw]

Seems like pilots did not do a go-around but a go-half-around. Why ?

[@BosworthMcG]

Shut down the wrong engine after the bird strike

[@joso5554]

This hurried maneuver is very puzzling indeed. Will be a key part of the investigation.

[@azuremain]

Exactly, why this hasty 120 teardrop and landing with tailwind?

[@kevint1911]

People keep talking about the “wall” at the end of the runway but this diagram makes it clear that the “wall” is actually well before the beginning of the runway. Perhaps the purpose is to deflect jet blast during take offs?

[@janinsweden8559]

@@kevint1911 yes, if you land in the other direction as they did on the first attempt. But the second landing was made in the opposite direction.

[@EyeBalz93]

The lack of pre-deployed firefighters had nothing to do with the outcome here. A hasty, high speed landing with no landing gear or flaps deployed is the main reason this crash happened. The concrete wall obviously made this much worse. But, the question remains, why no flaps or landing gear? Every expert I've seen comment on this crash keys in on these two things.

[@AlasdairMorrison-z8m]

Several pilots have suggested both engines appear to have possibly lost power hence the change to a hasty landing with no landing gear or flaps deployed to reduce drag. .

[@bizzz.R]

Pilots seeing that they're headed towards a concrete wall... that black box recording is going to be horrifying... People who review black box recordings... don't get paid nearly enough...

[@RameshRam-tr4zn]

I disagree they are paid ok to listen to tape recording

[@spdaltid]

A tragedy. And yes, listening to or reading transcrpts can be harrowing. FYI There are two orange colored recorders. Generally, "Black Box" = Flight Data Recorder" [FDR] . Cockpit Voice Recorder [CVR] = CVR.

[@beepbeep5153]

They actually don't know it's concrete i bet

[@beepbeep5153]

They literally made the decision to rush a landing, then overran the runway, and without landing gear soooo

[@bizzz.R]

@@beepbeep5153 Don't make it so obvious you grew up without a father...

[@mq46312]

Why did the pilots not do a proper go-around? Instead they took a short but messy and unconventional turn to land in the reverse direction.

[@tubethis777]

Exactly, pilot error could also be a factor, he didn't fly around far enough to start the landing from the beginning of the runway but its middle

[@wqv5423ln]

You don't understand. They lost ALL controls!

[@FrenchFili]

Probably panicked. How theyre gonna handle N.Kor if their pilots panic like this. Not to mention their declining birth rate.

[@The_CrackedPot_Christian]

​@@wqv5423ln so how come they line up precisely with the runway, and steering inputs can be seen in videos? This loss of controls isn't accurate nor explains why it happened.

[@YoItsANI16547]

The question is why did they go around in the first place, having been in full landing configuration, it would have been safer to just keep flying the approach and land safely with brakes and reversers.

[@world_peace775]

If it weren’t for the wall, people would have been saved - this is an indisputable fact

[@eugeniegrandet8077]

It is not a fact since you begin your sentence with "if…".

[@BillsKoreaninput-u7q]

You could make many sentences like that: if there was no bird strike, if there was no blah blah blah.

[@paulholterhaus7084]

every thing is disputable...........Paul

[@KaybeCA]

Unless someone actually lives in that city and knows what's on the other side of the wall, I don't think anyone is qualified to point fingers quite yet.

[@JESpivey]

​@@KaybeCA everyone can see it on google earth

[@sirenity8839]

My condolence to all who had suffered a loss of a love one 🙏

[@JasonPutschker-xw9uf]

Pilots error. Bad decisions. He had plenty of time to lift off again and do another go around and find a safer place to land with less than half the runway at 200+ mph. Engine not cut off, landing gear after two attempts to land nowhere in site but no mayday for that situation. Flaps not deployed. So many horrible emergency procedures by passed its crazy. Clearly the pilots panicked instead of calm, cool thinking.

[@YAWSSSSSS]

Raises more questions. Why wasn't the pilot and first officer working as a team to get the plane configured for an emergency landing. I am interested to see what comes out after the plane's flight data recorder are examined. Off first assumptions I feel like this is definitely a mix of factors that went into this crash but we can't say for sure what they are yet besides poor runway design.

[@DavidThomas658]

Can i offer my deepest gratitude to the emergency services who have to work under horrific conditions, often a thankless task and some of whom undergo trauma therapy for the grim but vital work they do.

[@Krishna34619]

Well said . Truly selfless people

[@killar56137]

Considering the plane survived the belly landing without breaking up, it would have survived,had there not been a concrete wall at the end of the runway.

[@miguelmelchior986]

Who told you that? At that speed there’s no way to know if the plane would stop safely..

[@DwightStJohn-t7y]

@@miguelmelchior986 it did not hit the concrete wall. the wall is fine.

[@lilmamagc]

@@miguelmelchior986 if it just ran off the runway into grass, it would have been slowed down from the terrain

[@thebasketballhistorian3291]

​@@miguelmelchior986 No guarantee but definitely a much better chance it wouldn't have exploded instantly like that if there was no wall.

[@pccnamusic]

@@miguelmelchior986US airports have grass or flat terrain. that slows the airplane down in the event that there was no landing gear deployed. this has happened many times in aviation history where people came out unharmed. the problem was the concrete wall.

[@Misterword20]

Fire fighters? Would they remove the concrete wall before the plane landing?

[@cylonred8902]

No - no way to remove concrete walls in hours much less minutes.

[@haa4252]

@@cylonred8902it was obviously an ironic comment 😅

[@cylonred8902]

@@haa4252 If you say so - but it is not at all written as if it was ironic...

[@haa4252]

@cylonred8902 sounded like ironic for me, though. I might be wrong 🤷‍♂️

[@fafileblond9202]

Fire fighters could spread carbonic snow over the runway to prevent fire when the landing Gear can't move down.

[@m.kazemakhgary1336]

the designer that thought putting a concrete wall should be jailed life time

[@alexsky88749]

They put a concrete wall to protecte planes from going into the road traffic just behind? What was the use of this wall really?

[@Jamenator1]

I agree that the wall is not ideal, however the wall is considerably further from the runway than minimum legal distance. This aircraft went off the end of the runway at the same speed it should have been at at the beginning of the runway. The designers complied with and went beyond the regulations, it's not their fault a plane went off the end of the runway at 250km/h. Wall or no wall, at that speed, there is no way they are stopping within the airport confines.

[@m.kazemakhgary1336]

@@Jamenator1 they could design a breakable wall that would slow down the airplane with less casualties. not a reinforced concrete wall.

[@m.kazemakhgary1336]

@@Jamenator1 im no expert at this, i just said what i heard in other videos. but south korea media don't want to talk about it

[@m.kazemakhgary1336]

@@Jamenator1 for clear reasons. they messed up big time and don't want to be responsible for it.

[@carlosjrm01]

"I believe the pilots did not handle the emergency properly; they rushed and did not prepare the aircraft for the second landing, which led to the tragedy. However, what I don't understand is why the transponder stopped transmitting."

[@paulthrocko]

From who did you get this quote?

[@lydiacooper9260]

The situation is strange. Seems it could be pilot error, they could have manually pulled out the gear, the wing flaps were not put up. The pilots seemed to rush the landing. Also why use a short runway with a concrete barrier at the end knowing they would be skidding at full speed? To all the families who lost loved ones and to have the anxiety if they watch the video of the airplane actually crashing, hope they find the answers they need to fully understand what happened and find some level of peace.

[@brians9508]

do you really believe that the pilots knew the antennas were placed on top of that concrete wall?

[@vireaknou8835]

@@brians9508well pilots communicate with control tower all the time so the control tower must informed him that there is an obstacle(antenna) at the end of the runway.

[@colin8696908]

The concrete barrier doesn't matter, they landed way to far and without flaps.

[@brians9508]

@@colin8696908 if they had not hit that concrete barrier, they would have continued to slide, along the grass, then out onto the roadway. far more people would have made it out alive.

[@savannahm.laurentian1286]

Pilot still had no landing gear and came in at high speed.

[@beepbeep5153]

And overran runway

[@joaoroman9583]

thats because the slats/flaps were not extended. Also no ground spoilers deployment. Also, probably no reversers activated. Without those its very hard to control the speed.

[@stoomkracht]

@@joaoroman9583true, but why? Fatal pilot error like shutting down wrong engine? No landing gear is also totally strange. It was apparently extended on first try...

[@shaunmulligan8717]

@@stoomkracht How about the hurry-up syndrome that pilots on low-cost airlines experience; having to land on time, every time.

[@airsouthwestfan]

It’s untrue what he says that pilots usually request emergency services. ATC, well certainly in the U.K., place emergency services on standby regardless of pilot request. Standby meaning the airport emergency services kit up and are waiting at the runways edge ready to hit the accelerator. I used to work in ATC so I’m familiar with this procedure.

[@airsouthwestfan]

@ they wait at the threshold and runway sides in order to chase the aircraft from behind. Not at the end. I’m not justifying what the pilots did btw. Just stating what ATC procedure is here.

[@VolkovAlexandernovskiOfficial]

There was. It's a 2.4km runway. And if you suggestion is to be waiting at the end. Then you definitely don't have experience in this field. I definitely do. And runway length factors in. And the plane touches down with 400m left. With gear or not it was going into that wall. It was literally 1.8 KMs off the perfect landing zone on that runway (I've landed a 737 here I have over 9000 hours flying the 737 mostly cargo runs, maybe 2000 hour commercial) I'm sorry but the runway and airport wasn't the issue. You can't make the runway infinite. And this is a massive runway. Literally any commercial plant on earth. With any fuel load. With any passenger count could land here with around 800m left. Maybe 700 on a single reverse thruster. I refuse to believe a pilot willingly touches down with 400m left going flight speed. Unless they have to.

[@ykst6685]

would it be a reasoned decision for the pilot to decide the plane should continue on its path to landing instead of a go-around - even after the bird strike?

[@zitnbit]

Some experts in Korea assume that First engine failure due to birds Second engine failure while going up for “go around” So the plane couldn’t go up enough then the pilot decided to land immediately. It’s just assumption though. Seems reasonable for me.

[@deejay-su7uf]

Absolutely correct...! What's the point of having training for contingencies if their is no ABIDING protocol....yet again...poor excuses for massive loss of life....

[@Jim-fp3kt]

Why would you “go around “ ? Stay on the approach and land!

[@ErLeuchten]

depends at what stage the strike happened, after an engine failure you can not just continue with the typical routines.!

[@allieannette3712]

because that's procedure, depending on what has been hit.

[@jameshayes1024]

By making such an abrupt change from runway 1 to runway 19, the pilot gave up nearly 1/2 of his available runway landing distance, and he gave up time to think, analyze his situation and perform a proper landing checklist.

[@johnstuartsmith]

There's only one runway. The numbers "1" and "19" just designate whether it's being approached from the North or South.

[@jameshayes1024]

@@johnstuartsmith Exactly.

[@you463]

In a true "emergency" the only checklist items needed are: 1) Gear down, 2) Flaps extended, and speed brakes armed - outcome will be reasonable. No gear, no flaps, no speed brakes, land 2/3 of the way down the runway, and successful outcome is doubtful.

[@jameshayes1024]

@@you463 Hopefully the flight recorder can shed light on what was happening with the plane and the pilots.

[@allieannette3712]

@@you463 that is so far from correct. There are dozens of memory check lists that pilots are required to know for specific emergencies. These lists have been written in the blood of dead passengers of other crashes.

[@jgrazzi]

Fire trucks on the runway or foam wouldn’t have mattered. He was coming in too hot (fast) with gear up and he touched down half way down the runway.

[@SnakeWhite-i9q]

As a pilot I standby the fact this 100% could have been avoidable. Your engines were clearly working perfectly fine there was no reason to land with a tail wind and no reason to raise your gear

[@matthewtovey9771]

avoidable if you don't build structures at the start/end of runways

[@rafikdjarmouni4656]

« It’s like having a flat tire but deciding to speed up, skip the spare, and drive straight into a brick wall without your seatbelt, poor decision making»

[@MarcL1313]

If not for that barrier they would've skidded across a road into a series of buildings, probably killing many more as a result. Most airports in the world have some permanent structures, roads or barriers off the ends of the runways. Chicago's Midway airport is carved out of a city block with walls at the ends of all runways.

[@NekoCat0417]

If you are established to land, even if you have bird strike, you are able to land. I really don't understand why they decided to go around.

[@Spartan9567]

The seemingly rushed go around and lack of communication is very strange. Hopefully the plane data recorder and cockpit voice recorders shed some light on what was happening.

[@johngreydanus2033]

There is ATC voice recordings also!

[@Sugas_Girr]

I don't know about lack of communication....? It seems they were in continuous contact with the ATC tower.

[@Hen71557]

This tells nothing other than the mayday call re the birdstrike, text msg’s from passengers seem to confirm that a go around was announced in flight so this was being dealt with.

[@VolkovAlexandernovskiOfficial]

They lost hydraulics pressure. Let's see how your procedure serves you in a similar situation lol. Dudes legit would have been fighting just to line this thing up with the runway.

[@VolkovAlexandernovskiOfficial]

Flaps in flight position. Only one reverse thruster going. Gear not lowering. Tells me an engine blew. Probs spat shrap into the wing. Cut the hydraulics line. Captain unaware until his hydraulic pressure dropped to levels that effected flight surfaces ect. By this point he would be in fully blown panic as any pilot knows these are basically your last moments. I think he knew a go around was useless with no hydraulic pressure and had to try and land. As much as it does look like he doesn't realise he has no gear. If that was the case why the late touchdown? I mean gear or not. No pilot on earth is stopping this plane. With 1 reverse thruster. No flaps. With only 400m left after touchdown.

[@johngreydanus2033]

Was the bird strike even during the 1st landing? It looks like it overhead, they called Mayday then? I just don't get the timeline of events.

[@johngreydanus2033]

@@VolkovAlexandernovskiOfficial And yet still made a very tight turn to return to same runway?

[@naomichisholm7709]

@@VolkovAlexandernovskiOfficialwhy not manually put the gear down do you think he ran out of time

[@TheTritan408]

Who is the smart architect that want to build a concrete wall at the end of a runway?

[@takatoo]

The wall shouldn’t exist - Eren

[@thedompatrinhoofficial]

Why is the wall made of CONCRETE?

[@alexisrodrigues4767]

There are concrete walls in some airports but they are all of brittle powdered material except this particular one which was solid concrete.

[@allieannette3712]

@@alexisrodrigues4767 thats because it was built far enough away from the end of the runway to be within regulations. The plane was moving so fast, it's hard to tell, but there was a considerable distance. No one expects a plane to overrun a 1.7 mile runway, especially landing in an atypical direction.

[@TuBui2]

Facts: 1. In the event of only 1 engine out, the pilots had the choice to circle for a while to devise a better planned landing. 2. no flaps or landing gear were deployed prior to landing, even without primary power (loss of both engines) these systems have manual overrides which could've been used but they were not. 3. pilots missed half of the runway, critical to their slow down 4. If the pilots had done one more go around (as originally intended) they wouldn't have landed in the direction of the concrete wall

[@spicy7302]

5. Placing concrete walls in front or behind plane runways is a terrible idea because it can cause airplanes to burst into flame upon impact, killing virtually everyone there

[@stellatan9485]

Bet the pilot didn't know there a wall there

[@sblack48]

I doubt it would have changed anything. They were desperate to get to the runway which indicates they had no power. That's the only rational explanation for no landing gear or flaps. That would have meant there were no options. But this is all speculation at this point. We'll know what happened in a week or so

[@ronron_gaming]

RIP i think that plane can fly with 1 engine but probably the pilot panic and rush to land

[@moritoAreapaxixhagi]

Yes…i think thats the case… it doesnt have anything to do with the wall

[@Epic3Dmodelling]

@@moritoAreapaxixhagi well it does cuz the wall is the reason the plane is in pieces but other factors have a part. It seems like a lack of proper training tbh.

[@thebrassbandit]

You're correct. Modern jet aircraft are certified to be able to takeoff under full weight with 1/2 engines running.

[@lontarian2228]

@@moritoAreapaxixhagi It does ! nobody is supposed to build a concrete structure that big and heavy in the same path of an aircraft. We just saw why.

[@rexduranzelandony]

Why did the landing gear not open? The design of the airport with a concrete wall at the end of the runway is terrible

[@apple-on5pq]

why don't they just release the conversation between the pilots and the ATC? hiding something?

[@TheOrigamiPeople]

Yep,the pilots shouted there’s a wall in front of us made of concrete.

[@sofyarsadiwaachyar1773]

So, the firefighter should always be ready, then? Will this be the new standard?

[@caughtnyfish6073]

Why would bird strikes not allow the pilots to lower the landing gear. Did they forget to lower it on the second approach? Also the flaps were not extended into landing configuration

[@joaoroman9583]

theres a gravity backup system to lower the ldg gear. But i think theres no other option to extend the slats/flaps other than with the hydraulic system. And one of the possibilities is hydraulic failure due to eng failure

[@caughtnyfish6073]

@ yes. Can’t understand why they didn’t lower the gear

[@lilmamagc]

no matter what happened, they still landed the plane successfully, it was that wall that killed everyone.

[@janedoe4316]

More time hypotheticals??? The pilot requesting firetrucks? Ridiculous. Longer runways & no obstacles at the end would have prevented this...

[@milosmartplug]

why was there a wall at the end of the runway ..

[@helenas7948]

It was at some distance from the end of the long runway. People seem fixated on this structure. The fact is that there were so many things wrong with the landing that the plane would probably hit something anyway, because it was going with great speed at the end of the runway.

[@spicy7302]

@@helenas7948 maybe it wouldn't have hit anything and it would've been, you know, stopped by all the mud, terrain, grass etc...? You act like it was going at the speed of a space rocket

[@helenas7948]

@@spicy7302 It was going with very high speed. That's the reason it completely disintegrated after the contact with this mound, which was in fact not that big and not that close to the end of the runway.

[@spicy7302]

@@helenas7948 The fact that it exploded upon contact with it meant that it had enough stopping force to not break apart and allow the plane to push through. That's because it's a thick, reinforced CONCRETE BLOCK. I don't wanna argue with you though, as you seem to be as dense as that block.

[@allieannette3712]

@@spicy7302 It was going ridiculously fast. And no, there were trees and then other concrete buildings past there. The wall was built far enough away that it wasn't in violations of any rules- the plane was moving so fast, it ate up the distance like nothing. Then again, no one expects a speeding plane to overrun a 1.7 mile long runway in the wrong direction.

[@timduggan1461]

Look, I have thousands of hours in the B737. Retired now (United) but? IF they were on Final, cleared to land and already configured (Gear & Flaps) for the landing, and ingest bird(s) in one engine?? You DON'T GO-AROUND!! Just continue the landing!!

[@bartybollocks]

There is no reason for the gear to be up. 2 independant hydraulic systyems, a standby electrical system and , as a last resort, a manual gravity system. Same with the flaps, 2 independant hydraulics and a hydraulic reserve for the leading edge. Landing half way down the runway didn't help. Something bad happened in the cockpit, either panic or heavy smoke.

[@YeeLeeHaw]

It didn't look like there was heavy smoke from the video as you can clearly see through the windows to the other side. My bet is pilot fatigue. They push their workers too hard; seemingly irrational accidents constantly happens to industry workers that hasn't gotten enough sleep; and pilots are just as human as they are. That barrier didn't help either.

[@finderskeepers7293]

Passing on the buck to the air crew which unfortunately isn't alive to defend themselves

[@frankyeneews168]

Did they forget to lower the landing gear and deploy flaps???

[@oteckie]

from what i understand, they forgot about the landing gears and shut off the wrong engine causing the plane to loose hydraulic pressure to deploy the flaps. Also shows the right engine that was struck has it's reverse trust deployed on while the left isn't.

[@mocneeuq]

@@oteckie so the pilot probably panicked?

[@oteckie]

@@mocneeuq can be many things -lack of training -panic/stress -complacency

[@wonghow]

aviation expert says, you can open the landing gear by hand, but it was not done, I guess the there was no time to do it, because the plane is too low to the ground.

[@Epic3Dmodelling]

@@wonghow time would not matter because of ETOPS which basically means how it performs on one engine so they could have gone around again

[@WhatMattersMost88]

Why did the tower instruct the plane, or pilot made the decision to land from the "END" of the runway instead of the approach direction where the wall was?

[@allieannette3712]

If they had landed at the threshold it would have been fine- the runway is 1.7 miles long.

[@Mark-ph5nh]

how and why was the wall there??? they died due to the wall!!!!

[@richard_M7116]

The pilot landed the in the wrong direction, the wall is at the start of the runway😢

[@Sugas_Girr]

They never touched the wall. What they hit was an ILS berm. The outer perimeter wall is behind that and was not hit.

[@TheTravellingTeacher34]

Can someone explain to me why the pilot didn’t attempt to land during initial approach on spot 3 at 8:59 ,but instead he did a short go-around and landed in opposite direction of the runway?

[@Jessman5]

Calling "mayday" simultaneously with "go around" doesn't make sense. Either you need to have an emergency landing, or not. Then "go around" means to climb again and try a seperate new approach, NOT to make a u-turn and land opposite the operating runway. 01 was operating for a reason, maybe 19 had too much tailwind at this time, thus the aircraft not slowing down.

[@ktmdoug]

Most likely pilot error. S Korea is not known for quality pilots. Look up Asiana Airlines flight 214. Total incompetence

[@MinhBui-vr2oz]

Why aborted the landing when strike birds on the landing phase ? Why not just continue the landing ? Isn't it easier to continue the landing than abort the landing then set up to land again with a damage engine ?

[@kev596]

Bird strike doesn't cause the under carriage not to work??. RIP

[@doolgi_mom]

No, it obviously doesnt but it was a factor to this transpiring

[@sara.othman]

What confuses me is the single reverser deployed when they were skidding along the runway with landing gear up

[@soulsoul5780]

Why is everyone blaming on the pilots before the investigation is concluded? The news just revealed a video that shows both engines making sparks. If both engines had lost power, the plane would have been out of control. Also, the plane disappeared from the radar before landing. He shouted Mayday. No one knows the answer now. You shouldn’t make a conclusion especially blaming on someone.

[@you463]

Both engines without power does not necessarily mean that the aircraft is "out of control" FYI

[@whaledriver5457]

Bird strike on final?!? Why the heck would you take the plane around with unknown damage? You are literately on a stabilized final. Just proceeded to a landing. I know it's too soon to tell but with the info available so far I am questioning the logic to go around.

[@emperoroak7331]

Both Pilots and Airport designs are wrong here

[@NewbieLam]

Bird strike doesnt cause hydraulic failure. If it boeing i aint going.

[@PeacefulRallyCar-pw3cs]

Plane was going 240kph at the end of the runway. It would ve hit something.

[@starvisor751]

I’m still confused how a bird strike that took out one engine caused all of this. From the video, it looked like only one engine flamed out. Airliners have to be designed to fly on a single engine…even on go around, and there have been numerous such cases of this happening. I feel there‘s more to this than we know at the moment.

[@ack6668]

Incompetent all around

[@you463]

Well said, I am sorry to say.

[@lifegeek5742]

A bird strike took out both engines? You can do a normal go around with 1 engine without requiring such a tight turn

[@hectorar7890]

- concrete wall at the end of the runway - landing gear can be dropped with gravity as a back up - pilot did not go around I guess we’re just throwing blames on one another

[@naga2015kk]

sounds like a panic pilot, bird strike does not NEED immediate landing. He could have taken his time.

[@johntaylor5968]

These men look scared of saying the wrong thing, bottom line , THE WALL.

[@109sssss]

piloting mediocrity kills not walls

[@azuremain]

Lots of questions, but a major one is why were the pilots in such a hurry to turn around and land from the opposite side of the runway where they may encounter tailwind. Going through the checklist and preparing for a stabilized landing takes more than just the 6 minutes it took from the bird strike to the touch down.

[@megadavis5377]

So, the question remains: Why was the flight crew in such a rush to get the aircraft onto the ground?

[@you463]

And if they were in such a rush, why didn't they just eave the gear and flaps where they were for the first landing attempt...You CAN fly around all day with the gear down. No reason to retract the flaps to up, when all you are doing is a quick 180 turn.

[@aidenwrenn5342]

I am a pilot of very small planes and really have no idea of what went on in this tragedy but I can't see why a bird strike would prevent lowering gear and flaps. There's much to learn.

[@BaoKimshi]

Terrible event.

[@Vshashank]

The wall killed everyone, however, need to know more about the landing gear malfunction.

[@oteckie]

I'd like to hear the actual audio. assuming they will release it publicly. We don't need another sewol ferry incident

[@Planetrainguy]

I don't think they ever do that

[@beepbeep5153]

Skorea incompetency: Sewol ferry Seoul stampede Muan crash

[@friendlynoona]

Thats exactly what they are trying to do again in here.

[@stoomkracht]

Yes there is audio available of multiple fatal plane accidents. But probably a bit too early to publish it.

[@sonyemerson6675]

Why not on the water?but the pilot choose the concrete wall...

[@ajiosa-h8k]

I can see how commentators from the US struggle with grasping the logical impossibility of linking a bird strike to the hydraulic failure. But to the rest: come on people, neither birds nor the wall were the cause of this crash in the first place!

[@borismedved835]

((snicker)) Weak.

[@humanproxy930]

We all know the blame is Jeju Air company but in SK so corrupt that they will never take any consequences all blame will be on the employees or bad political laws

[@punkfingerboards6283]

Your third world jealousy is shining bright for all to see.

[@doolgi_mom]

Yeah the armchair experts opinion is so valuable 🙄

[@doolgi_mom]

@@humanproxy930what are you talking about? It is the only country that consistently commits to impeaching their presidents for corruption.

[@rafikdjarmouni4656]

One engine down? No problem. Forget the landing gear? Definitely a problem.

[@riz4141]

Pilot fumbled it seems

[@piespeafield]

Whoever decided to put the wall there is at fault.

[@miguelangelruedarios]

Se deduce que los pilotos no tenían la experiencia debida y al primer problema que se presentó se pusieron nerviosos y no actuaron correctamente llevando a la muerte en forma espantosa a 179 personas, caray es pensarse de subirse de nuevo a un avión, posiblemente ya no lo haga en el tiempo que me queda de vida.

[@rakeshrajkumarmeitei8593]

That concrete wall 😢😢😢

[@stoomkracht]

Shutdown wrong engine? Human error in multiple locations.

[@jefferi78]

hrmm there are more questions than answer after this press conference

[@joshuaryu5890]

I hope they reveal the truth without hiding any facts.

[@aliayub5475]

Runway had a cement wall at the end that’s way the plane exploded. If the runway had a long run and not a wall .passengers would still be alive only a few casualties

[@Fomites]

A bird strike is not a reason to go around. What can be achieved by going around?

[@allieannette3712]

A lot. They run through checklists to make sure everything is configured properly and if not, fix it, and then land. It would be safer to land knowing if/what is specifically wrong than just saying 'oh well, already here' and winging it.

[@gc825]

According to the aviation expert from US, the pilots have not utilized Manual landing gears, emergency routine procedures, so its gonna be a Pilot error, plus its too fast to approach runway.

[@EvilXtianity]

They probably shut down the wrong engine after the bird strike.

[@MastoAlvinoPygo]

Or they tried to abort the landing but failed

[@tubethis777]

Yeah things are leading up to the pilots seemingly panicking

[@wqv5423ln]

your wring.Get informed. They lost all controls including speed. Total malfunction

[@tubethis777]

@@wqv5423ln you have no idea what you are talking about. The investigation is barely starting as they just got the black box.