Gatling Guns go Brrrr

[@Diego000793]

The fact that shogun 2 playerbase grew in 30% since legend started covering it again says a lot

[@Jeyeyeyey]

Also it's an actually good (amazing even) game, unlike anything they've released since Rome 2 (with the exception of Attila)

[@arturg3333]

Yeah. One of these videos popped up on my YT feed and I've decided to watch it, then another one and another one and eventually I started my own campaign as Hattori, because I wanted to see if I can effectively employ Legend's tactics.

[@shmekelfreckles8157]

@@Jeyeyeyey3K? Warhammer?

[@Pikilloification]

That's unfair. Shogun 2 is my favourite TW, but WH2 was solid from day 1.

[@SegaMegaLoh]

Best total war game

[@pablopablo3834]

The railway mechanic in FoTS is still one of the coolest mechanics in the entire Total War franchise. When I did my first ever campaign I had no idea it was even a thing until I captured Suo as Satsuma which had a railway node and I thought it was damn cool.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

It's a godsend really, considering how slow artillery moves over the campaign map

[@pisuoxide]

Naval transport is still waaay faster, especially if you have naval control and daisy chain your ships

[@MultiFloopi]

The only big problem I hate is unit movement in siege battles, if there is too much units on the battlefield they just stop to respond to your commands.

[@shmekelfreckles8157]

Still can’t get over the fact that chaos dwarfs don’t have railroads

[@captainnyet9855]

Yes, naval transport is a bit faster, but you need ships (upkeep), there is a risk of being intercepted by enemy fleets and you also need to plan your troop movements more (you need to have a ship available at the right place) Beyond that the railway lets you move troops to a couple of important inland places (e.g. you can get to Kyoto very quickly from the nearest railway station) Each method has its advantages, which is exactly how it should be.

[@TheArklyte]

The fact that his love for the proper hills became a meme only now when he returned to Shogun 2 speaks a lot about how little landscape matters in more modern games. Hopefully one day LoTW will also cover pre-Med2 games more so that people would see what unit pathing is and how cool a stylised map looks.

[@hugo3627]

If you had gun units in TW:Warhammer hills would matter as well, but not as much since things take a lot more bullets to kill.

[@daegon1985]

And there's like cave trolls and flying ligers and shit@@hugo3627

[@LiewLmao]

@@hugo3627Or the fact that gunpowder in warhammer are glorified crossbows which arch anyways so hills don’t matter that much Guns flying over heads and coming back down is just so janky to look at with long wet noodles

[@Shenordak]

​@@LiewLmaoIt is quite realistic though. Real world armies did lob musketballs to increase range on occasion.

[@Cba409]

It says people flock like sheep.

[@goruu]

If you look closely, you can find Tom Cruise.

[@emre30489]

Haaahahahaahahahah

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

He was my foreign veteran lmao

[@Rhainiac]

A couple days ago I accidentally said ratling guns in normal conversation.

[@Typhy7]

Ikit approves yes yes.

[@anteep4900]

Twatling guns

[@RKNGL]

Real human yes-yes.

[@SAMagic]

That is not a normal conversation.

[@Diegoshadow85]

@@SAMagic Don't you think about roman empire daily? What a pleb.

[@captainnyet9855]

Armstrong guns are better than gatling guns, but gatling guns are still worth getting for your late game armies; Armstrongs get more kills over-all, but gatlings deliver a lot of firepower quickly, making them excellent for causing routs; they fill different purposes with the Gatling gun acting more like a long range infantry unit than proper artillery.

[@ScarryHarry93]

ya, I feel the Armstrong's are great for long-range large groups, whereas the gatlings are better for short-range large groups - when you're getting swarmed in close-combat or against many lower-tier melee troops. That superior firepower will grind them faster than most single-units and their slower firerate

[@bonehed1]

Yeah it looked like the super-wide firing arc of the Gatling was advantageous too, you could see the Gatling firing into enemies way over on the right flank late into the battle. I think the army comp this guy had complimented itself well, Armstrong guns wiping out huge swathes of troops far away and the Gatling keeping the leftovers from actually reaching the troops in melee

[@freekvanderheijden6356]

FYI, you can use carbine cavalry to shoot over infantry in front of it to have an extra line of fire if you ever get a battle sent in with those units

[@Nelsonwmj]

Same for Revolver Cav. That's what makes General units that are revolver cav and not traditional Yari cav so dangerous.

[@bxbone5942]

It works like that for Tokugawa gunner cav in base Shogun 2, so you can shoot them over a yari wall (its as disgusting as it sounds)

[@tonedeaftachankagaming457]

In TW:Napoleon you can put skirmishers ahead, line infantry, then ranged cavalry for ridiculously concentrated fire

[@AwayWithYouVileBeggar]

This is a certified "Your honour Free Bird was playing in the BG" moment

[@inductivegrunt94]

Legend gets beast artillery, a sick ass unit of gatling guns, US marines, sharpshooters, and he's still complaining about hills. That just shows how much he's a hill addict. Still sweet seeing Legend plays FOTS, dude is now carrying the Shogun 2 fanbase singlehandedly.

[@hyperion3145]

Gatling guns, marines and sharpshooters are ephemeral but hills are forever

[@Predator20357]

I always enjoyed how the Older Total War games treated muskets, matchlocks, rifles and cannons. A bit finicky to set up but devastating when they get going. 50 to 1 indeed

[@arturg3333]

I'd love to see you zoom-in more on the enemy troops getting so shredded when they are still far from you and there is no risk of you losing control of what is going on, otherwise it was a great video as always.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

My only disappointment was no manual targetting Gatling Gun action

[@hippieyoda1993]

its the balance between: do you want a tactical conversation and to maybe learn something or do you want a cool af shot of dudes getting shredded by artillery. I think everyone wants *both* and its hard to do that in one vid xo

[@lucusmccluskey7664]

It would be great if he could post the replay file somewhere so we could download it and watch the replay ourselves.

[@arturg3333]

@@hippieyoda1993 You’re right, but once he’s set up his army and the enemy was walking towards him, that’s where he could have zoomed-in for a short while, risk-free. There is less space for that in the Feudal part of the game though.

[@whzpoor]

Legend reacting to the panicking advisor is becoming my favourite parts of these 😅

[@thecursed01]

there's gotta be a support group for depressed advisors becasue legend always insults them XD

[@Romahelten]

God I love these FoTS vids, gunplay is so much fun. Makes me wish for empire 2 even more, although I understand most want med3 ^^

[@buzter8135]

Keep up with the old world mod then, what they're cooking looks really cool.

[@pablopablo3834]

Med 3 would also have guns just very early ones. I think most people would prefer Med 3 like I would but if we got Empire 2 I would still be very happy. Ideally we would get them both that would be incredible.

[@inotaarto8719]

Problem isent whats next, but who makes it...

[@Niitroxyde]

I'd still be cautious about either. Devs who made these games what they were probably aren't working at CA anymore, so chances are you'd have yet another Troy disguised as a Medieval or Empire.

[@xXBisquitsXx]

@@Niitroxyde I think CA knows this and that's why they've never remade the fan favorites since if/when they messed it up there would be huge backlash and it would be obvious the difference in quality. Hopefully their recent shake up makes them reassess their priorities.

[@DakkonAkrossa]

Yeah not gonna lie, warhammer guns just don't feel like this. I passed on fots back in the day, but this has me craving. If I can stomach a total war game after bannerlord corrupted me, this will be the one I return to

[@Debilinside]

Dont know what it is, but guns in WH doesnt feel impactful. Maybe due the smaller map size or unit weight, not sure.

[@emre30489]

Yeah shogun guns have more weight. It really feels like you are punching through enemy when your unit fires.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

As Volound puts it, they're more crossbow than gun

[@Romczy]

HP bars is what makes these awkward. Sad necessity in game with single entites

[@Pellingtons]

I think unit/entity health being a thing also contributes to this feeling which is why in total wars from at least Warhammer 1 onwards you get times where the first volley will kill maybe only 5 entities, but then the second volley kills 50 because their health was now lower. Back in Shogun 2 and before, units had 1hp (generals an some elite units had 2hp) so if an entity got 'hit', it died.

[@barleysixseventwo6665]

Holy shit, peak "Last Samurai" moment in the center when those Saber Cavalry ran headfirst into the Gatling guns, to say nothing of the Armstrong guns laying into the troops in that town.

[@DeltaComrad]

Looks like you partially recreated the Last Samurai at 9:30 😄

[@GerackSerack]

"Gatling guns are really good at taking out cavalry" *Enemy cavalry fully MELTS in mere seconds * Yeah, that was an understatement, holy crap.

[@siegfriedgottz698]

goated movie but also a really sad one

[@pnutz_2]

they definitely leant into that shot when they made the gatling guns in fots

[@-Kidzin]

If only dwarf artillery felt this impactful (as it should)

[@marekstarzyk9355]

True

[@zeroner777]

It is, just not for the dwarfs you're thinking of ^^

[@FilipMoncrief]

If only gunpowder was this satisfying in warhammer…

[@blagerthorpnonersense1894]

Seem to really be enjoying these older historical titles. Like seeing you cover them.

[@valentinaskazimieras]

Yeah, I'm reinstalling, these last fall of the Samurai videos really made me want to replay it

[@MikesLeague]

The sound of guns crackling in this game is so good.

[@chickenhunt5163]

I love how fall of the samurai has little trains going arround 😊 0:02

[@chickenhunt5163]

And are also usefull. Railroads need to be build first and can transport/teleport your armies to the next station!

[@WombNugget]

@@chickenhunt5163 WHAT?! Well shit that would have made my campaign easier.

[@PG19871230]

Chu chu

[@NvJinx]

I really wish artillery and gunpowder units were this cool in TWWH.

[@729060]

Been loving all the recent Shogun 2 videos, one of my favorite total wars

[@RTEducators]

... That Scenematic Last Samurai moment... except there's no samurai on the enemy side...

[@kolpere1625]

Thanks to legend, it was today years old where i finally found out the usefulness of the siege units from hojo clan: as morale breakers. Cannons, matchlocks, fire arrows, whistling arrows, mortars and rockets apply morale decrease separately. Once the first fire at ranks from the matchlocks start to fire, the morale went like ploof. Proved with katana samurai (better matchlock frontline vs melee than ever the tokugawa with kisho bombs+mounted gunners lol)

[@Keckegenkai]

those clouds from the rifle shots and the sound of the armstrong cannons are so damn good

[@nonevahed5559]

this is great; LoS management was always the favorite part of my Empire, Dwarf, and Skaven campaigns, seeing a whole game based on it is super cool.

[@avalothoath8959]

Did anyone else noticed the message on the end battle loading screen, where Sun Tzu was talking about terrain awareness? I was like mind blown

[@zondor8123]

"On both difficult and easy terrain, you must know the tenable and fatal ground, occupy tenable ground and attack on fatal ground" That's what the pro emperor army does to beat Tokugawa Shogunate army many times and unify japan

[@fida6358]

I'd never touched FOTS even after 300 hrs of Shogun 2. But after watching Legend play I'm on my first campaign and it's absolutely a blast. I like it much more than napoleon and empire.

[@IlIlIlIlIlIlIIlIlIlIlIlIlIIIII]

it's such an excellent DLC - an entirely different game practically

[@feintfaint7213]

I'm gonna need a sale on it. I know its worth it but its hecking expensive.

[@IlIlIlIlIlIlIIlIlIlIlIlIlIIIII]

@@feintfaint7213 what does it cost rn out of curiosity?

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

$45 Australian, yeah that's an outrageous price. I don't think it was even that much when it was brand new

[@QuanNguyen-rr6pe]

That was a last samurai moment when you turn your gatling guns on the poor sabre cavs haha

[@thmaster1236]

Thank you for your amazing content, I have started playing because of you. I played Napoleon total war and was looking for another game with with muskets/single shot rifles and im glad I found you!

[@vilemzadrobilek583]

"I like small hills, they are not very usefull" I mean damage was already done with flat-ass map, some arent that gifted.

[@varun634]

9:31 Man that brought back memories of The Last Samurai

[@SofaMuncher]

Man I need to play some FOTS, never really got into it because the units didnt seem very distinct to me, but the aesthetics and soundtrack and weaponry etc. All just phenomenal !

[@brandoncampanaro7571]

It is the best version of guns in all of total war

[@zondor8123]

To be expected if you are not familiar with Sengoku Jidai or Japan in general. And you missing a lot

[@ayomri1914]

How tf was that a Decisive Victory? That was 100% a Heroic victory with that balance of power and that Kill Ratio?

[@CatroiOz]

Ammo used is taken into account. The more you used the lesser your score is

[@RobinTheBot]

​@@CatroiOzthat explains a lot lol

[@ayomri1914]

@@CatroiOz Really? Well that's shitty because then they're basically punishing you for using your units effectively. It should be a positive if your units were positioned so good that they could use all their ammo.

[@SamuelBlake83]

@@ayomri1914 Yeah the calculations factor in ammo usage along the lines of "these units X amount of their ammunition, therefore they would have lost their damage output if the battle lasted Y more minutes, therefore the victory was Z% less decisive than it could have been." So if you had a unit of 100 archers go up against a horde of enemies and the archers defeat those enemies with only a couple of losses, but they ended the battle with a dozen or so arrows left between them all, then that was technically a close battle because only a few extra enemies or a few more missed shots could have been the difference between total victory and total defeat. But at the same time I would also 100% define that kind of victory as a heroic victory too from a human emotional perspective. The battle outcome scale is pretty limiting in that regard.

[@Alex_Fahey]

The problem is that the balance of power values reduction for yourself and your enemy is the deciding factor for the calculation. The majority of a ranged unit's power is in firepower, and the power steadily reduces as they use the ammo. As such, an archer/gunner/artillery army that expends all their ammo loses most of its power over the course of the battle. Even a complete victory will no casualties will be a close victory in that situation since you lost ~75% of your power and the enemy lost 100%. Heroic and Decisive victories can be difficult to get when relying on firepower victories over melee shock victories where the only loss of power is the initial deaths in the charge before the targeted units break.

[@andrewwaldschmitt4757]

Armstrong guns have difficulty finishing a unit. They are great for shredding clusters of enemies, but the gatlings delete what remails, leaving your infantry to engage the enemy 20 to 1.

[@alessandrofinazzer2881]

Legend your videos of shogun 2 made me so much interested in the game that I bought everithing regarding this game with the current sales and I'm loving every hour of it

[@bryanduhart7218]

I love this guy

[@Kristjan0209]

Your evaluation of the cannons is pretty good since the tier list I looked at rated armstrong at S+ and gatlings at B. Also speaking of tier lists, I would love for you to make tier lists for the older games.

[@krossredvil167]

That was a bloody battle! nothing better than come home from work, grab a joint and enjoyed this master class of positioning.

[@BoomDowg]

I really wish FotS was on the scale of Empire, fall of the samurai just feels WAY better

[@serek_heterogenizowany]

Empire just gives you the illusion of scale. It's a small game with countries like France or Spain being one province.

[@Garret007]

@@serek_heterogenizowany interesting point, never thought of that

[@zondor8123]

​@@serek_heterogenizowanylol yeah empire sucks in terms of immersion of the world

[@serek_heterogenizowany]

empire sucks at many things...@@zondor8123

[@Iceman-135]

Watching this was like watching a reenactment of The Last Samurai.

[@sengleanu]

One of the best if you ask me! The unit combat animations are incredible, and they seem to have skimped on this in newer games.

[@jarskil8862]

Yup. In general in new games units behave like colliding animation blocks. In older games every solider was invidual.

[@blakewellman7016]

I will never not watch FOTS videos, my favorite TW. The gun batteries and rifle fire, the sound design, the DEVASTATION. 11/10

[@SirFloofy001]

"friendly units lost 114, friendly units killed 115" looks like you had 1 instance of friendly which is amazing for those times.

[@Neon-zq5of]

I'm adoring all these shogun diaster battles

[@HDrescher1]

In the few multiplayer head on campaigns I've played, Gatling guns are essential for protecting your flanks against any Cav units. I've never found much success with them outside of that as their range is too short. They have a lot more utility if played with darthmod which makes them a much better compliment to your armies. Shogun 2's fall of the samurai still has the best head to head campaign out of any Total War game released.

[@KimmoKM]

With Gattling guns in your arsenal, a crew of just four can do the job of four score trained riflemen, reducing the cost of your army, while at the same time increasing its effectiveness.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

Downside is you move at a snails pace across the map. I think it's movement speed is even slower than regular artillery

[@KimmoKM]

@@VanguardDeezNutz And the tech requirement. Since money is pretty tight in FotS, after kneel fire and armstrong gun techs (which I might or might not rush depending on the sort of campaign I'm playing, Legendary seems to reward building up more, while on lesser difficulties it's more feasible to just focus on military and snowball), I find it preferable to basically max out civilian line first because e.g. admin cost reduction lets you field bigger ⇒ more powerful armies than the power you would get from military techs. Gattling gun tech isn't easy to fit in there.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

I don't really have an issue with money in my campaigns, since I min-max my recruitment centres and make every other settlement money generators. In my current campaign I can generate around *23k a turn with 5-6 armies running around.

[@googleandsusansucks]

@@KimmoKM I am doing a republican campaign atm. Think I have 4k - income but still ok since I sent out two armies to do constant raiding. I can only imagine how effective it is playing as Jozai, since they can replenish in enemy territory.

[@Kalafinwë]

If you are worried about shooting your artillery/gatling pieces, you can always press the ''withdraw'' button for the front unit. This way, they will detach their limb and horses, but you have to quickly attach the unit to the gun/gatling pieces (if you hover over it, you will see a small hand, right click and they will go back from withdraw to the pieces).

[@commissarkordoshky219]

And then there’s me who has difficulty fighting the bloody pirates in empire total war lmao 🤣 well done, sir!!!

[@RuskiFuze01]

This is just making me hope that legends next stream is a shogun 2 campaign. FoTS or Base game would be amazing

[@yemannwaiphyo8817]

Those Gatling Guns ripping Sabre Cavalry is a Re-enactment of The Last Samurai Battle.

[@SuperAerie]

Love the smoke-effects in all the empire era-games. Even better with mods. Dont like how its basically non-existant in the wargammer-games

[@booradley6832]

Fun fact: Before going into WWI the US Marine Corps was very small, well under 10,000 men. They did an expert job of using recruitment propaganda(that doesnt have to be a negative word) to make their branch into the powerful entity it is today. If you made a full army of US Marines in game you'd have nearly half of all existing marines at that time.

[@VanguardDeezNutz]

I think there's a unit cap of 6 or so. Still, that's still more marines than were ever in Japan until after WW2

[@lecoutcritique8854]

kill ratio 50 to 1? I'm surprised it's not close victory (maybe pyrrhic ?)

[@juliovielma8703]

When you have good positioning and can keep continuous fire on an era with line infantry it is like bringing a machinegun to a musket battle

[@chachopaul695]

He stood upon a little mound, Cast his lethargic eyes around, And said beneath his breath: “Whatever happens we have got The Maxim Gun, and they have not.”

[@Drcrabs1484]

Hey Legend, you may have forgotten but you can take control of the cannons yourself and extend the range of the shot just for that extra bit a cheese for a bit more micro.

[@aidanmattys7488]

I'm also fairly certain the blast radius increases for manually-fired shots

[@righteousham]

Love a good hill defense. Really demonstrates why historically everyone wanted the hill.

[@MollymaukT]

"just cause the game doesn't have Skaven weapons team doesn't mean I can't play like it doesnt" -Legend of Total War (probably)

[@Ashes-Crime]

Отлично выполненный огневой мешок. Лучшая часть серии игр, в возможностях артиллерии и огнестрельных войск!😂

[@Achillez098]

"General! They outnumber us 6 to 1!" "We have Legend, so it is an even fight..."

[@Bagruz]

this guy is merely an average player, it's not him, it's his artillery and gutlings

[@Jayton.Olerie]

12:20 FIFTY TO ONE WHEN THE SWORD MEETS THE GUN

[@0KOrbU0]

"God is on the side with the best artillery" is so true in FoTS :)

[@SockNinja013]

Man, I can never tell when something's going to be a heroic or decisive victory, especially with aftermatch stats like these.

[@ihaveachihuahau]

Shogun is particularly picky about giving out heroic victories in my experience. You really have to beat like 500 with 20 or something and not use ammo or lose troops, it's insane.

[@divedweller4295]

Yes. Mighty hills with firm peaks make the best positions.

[@alannguyen5452]

1:32 "Flat-ass" man that make me laugh already

[@EpicAMV911]

So glad legend decided to start playing THE BEST tw. Shogun

[@isaacsayler2554]

Watching this video made me go pay full price for this game and stay up until 2 am on a work night

[@ragerancher]

WW1 generals: "That attacking army seemed to have the right idea..."

[@Monochromatic_Spider]

Those were some rather tall, rather beardless dwarfs. Must be using Manscaped. Still prefer WH3, though. But god damn, as a headphones-wearing viewer, the sound effects from those cannons firing was booming! There's just something about the rumble of a big gun.

[@tommyservo9660]

I like big hills and I cannont lie. -Sir Total-Wars-A-Lot, 2023

[@sgtbuckwheat]

I'm surprised there aren't more last samurai crossover memes coming from these videos.

[@planomathandscience]

Rattatatat. Shogun ratling

[@Daily_Sac]

I spit out my cereal when I heard “Sado Shogunal Vanguard”. Had to double check

[@rastafari6763]

I am definetly not an expert on the game, but it seems to me that a line of infantry and carabine kav behind it backed by some armstrong guns is a very efficient way of shredding the enemy. Any other ideas for an ideal army composition?

[@VarroxFur]

Its not the size of the hill, it matters what you can do with it.

[@trowachess]

They gots some great giant mounds... of hills 😂

[@BB8enjoyer]

1:20 flat is justice

[@VoPoHo]

Turns out this was a doomstack video actually :D

[@aaronburdon221]

The gatling gun is NASTY when it's fully upgraded. It'll wipe out like 3 units of men before they even get in range.

[@RX7FDfreak]

Been watching legend religiously since this historical kick, kicked off.

[@quint3ssent1a]

Whatever happens, we have got The Gatling gun, and they have not.

[@itsafshin8327]

it's so fun to watch legend weapons team around and expresses his feelings towards those damn curves and hills XD

[@FOB_the_Builder]

How to win FoTS in 3 easy steps: Step one: fast tech to top artillery building Step 2: recruit 8 Armstrong, 8 Gatling gun, 1 general, and 3 foreign legionary of your choice Step 3: stare at your fancy British/American/French bois the whole battle while your artillery is committing war crimes

[@danielangelo2135]

I love the cannon sound in that game, i think i'm not normal

[@HellRavennn]

2006: we have elephants with cannons vs knights. 2012: we have samurai vs gatlings... 2023: we have more guys in leathure with bronze stuff right after anoter game about guys in leathure with bronze stuff.

[@demomanchaos]

Man you just forget how powerful FoTS artillery really is.

[@CahitbeyAdiAlinmis]

This is like the movie Last Samurai all over again

[@huskyandhdftw]

This was so satisfying

[@johnnyreigh7988]

Legend: *slaps Shogunal Army* This bad boy can take so much fucken damage

[@ryanmelaugh7096]

I read guns go brrrr and just assumed a skaven weapons team video lol

[@anthroposmetron4475]

Legend likes big hills and he cannot lie

[@juliovielma8703]

Big hill sexual fr

[@jschex123]

You and l volound got me to start a new campaign. The fever has spread

[@WM-gr4qi]

How to fix corner camping: allow enemy a movement box beyond your side of the field.

[@NTLuck]

That's it, I demand you play a FOS Republic campaign. It would be so damn rad

[@anonanon6764]

Shogun 2 is amazing though. I used to think FOTS was much less tactically rich than Shogun 2 base because you just line up overwhelming artillery and that's it, but these videos are showing how little I understood of what was possible.

[@Tiber254]

Loving the Shogun 2 content. Keep it up!

[@elmertsai1312]

I guess this is why WW1 devolved into trench warfare

[@Meat312]

Just bought Shogun II 2 days ago, I really enjoy the innovative game feeling. Been a while!

[@NRSGuardian]

9:25 Legend literally Last Samurai'd that unit of Sabre Cavalry.