Lesson 1, Zornhau: Angle & Distance

[@Heebeejeebeeiceking]

I’ve seen a picture of a prepped zornhau where the sword is practically behind the back as the momentum begins with the bend of the back foot. The fencer is looking just above his elbow. Would that be practical in a situation like this? Or would you be looking for more ample celerity to block in exchange for power?

[@MrSilvUr]

I've found success with turning of the lead foot toward the attack, in the style of Meyer's secret step. This pivots the body so that you can engage the hips and shoulders thoroughly, while shortening the distance. You all warned against cutting across your body in the original video, but I've found this technique to largely resolve that problem for myself.

[@Swordsnstuff]

Thanks for explaining this!

[@SwordCarolina]

you're welcome!

[@tarkajedi3331]

This is enlightening.

[@JL-nb1yc]

I just noticed your 2.0 videos. When I first studied HEMA, I had a bit of trouble following everything you guys were saying. Now I have been reading Christian Tobler's book for a few months, and more of these things are starting to make sense. I'm getting the ideas behind the cuts, but I didn't quite follow everything you said about the footwork. I probably need to review that. Unfortunately Covid and distance makes it hard to find a HEMA school.

[@Mar6008]

Thx! now i dont have sword training due of corona this is real helpfull

[@matthewspringer1369]

Hey Sword Caroline great video! In the French style of fencing we call this -sliding of the blade a Coulé (it is generally the goal to establish leverage by moving forte against foible, or forte to forte). My question though is in these moves particularly in longsword what position do you guys move your hands? Do you use it in a supinated wrist turn , thumb from 12 o'clock to 3? Or maybe into pronation for strength? Or does it even matter since we are using 2 hands? Ive always wondered this when I do longsword going in for thrusts....Like my hand placement, the turning of the wrists... I use supenation when I fence small sword but im wondering if this is something I could/should use in longsword. Thanks!!!!

[@SwordCarolina]

Hello Matthew! Thanks for the information from the French style. I am always enriched when I see similarities between the systems. We turn our hands in both directions, depending on the situation. Two hands does change things over one hand. I'll be pretty strong no matter the position, but some are of course better than others. The simplest explanation would be to turn my wrist to bring the strong of my true edge against the opponent's sword or in the direction of his likely attack. Hand position is more a matter of control and defense than of attack.

[@PjotrFrank]

Don't wanna preach neither, but here's some (hopefully) constructive criticism. I like the video, though I could not help noticing, that (especially in the practice clips with the masks on) the oberhau of the attacker deliberately let's open the left flank, so your vertical zornhau hits perfectly. IMO an oberhau should be executed in a way that protects the fighting line and does not leave you exposed like this. That for I think a zornhau of an angle of 20-30 degrees is better to displace a well struck oberhau, instead of a completely vertical one.

[@SwordCarolina]

Pjotr Frank thanks for the thoughts! The attacker basically cuts into longpoint, which is common and not necessarily wrong. Is it the best way to throw an Oberhau? Maybe not. But people do attack like this all the time, and we must know what to do with it. Also, it was probably the cleanest way of showing the basic technique. There will always be more complexity that will not make it into a video of quick tips.

[@PjotrFrank]

Fair enough. Even though giving an oberhau more defensive value, can protect you a litte more from Liechtenauer‘s Zedel warning: „Wer oberhaut, Zornhau Ort dem draut.“ ;)

[@MrSilvUr]

For me, I found a big breakthrough to be adjusting my point of aim for the Zornhau. When I am cutting a typical Oberhau (funny that we say that "Oberhau" is a category of cuts, but we also use the term for our default 45° descending cut) I usually imagine a line through my opponent's head or body. When I throw the Zornhau, I usually imagine the line through their right shoulder.

[@PjotrFrank]

@@MrSilvUr IMO HEMA still suffers from a non-uniformed nomenclature, which leads to quite a few misunderstandings. In reference to the afore mentioned Zedel, I tend to use the term "Oberhau" for a category of strikes on the opponent, which - depending on intent - may end in Langort, Pflug (unteres Hängen), or Wechsel. In that scenario it is -as you pointed out - a good thing to aim towards a point beyond the actual target. This is also taught in boxing and various other martial arts. "Zornhau" on the other hand, I use almost exclusively for an intercepting strike to the weapon (much like the modern battement, or battuta), displacing the opponent's blade and lining up the point for an immediate thrust, initiating Zornhau-Ort. I am aware, that Zorn- and Oberhau are used almost synonymously by others, nonetheless the differentiating terminology I use (based on Liechtenauer's Zedel) served me well so far.

[@MrSilvUr]

@@PjotrFrank Most of my club and I differentiate the Zornhau the way that you do, but a lot of us also use "Oberhau" to refer to both a category of cuts -- as you seem to -- and as a generic entry in that category.