Let's Look At the Gruesome World of Victorian Medicine

NOTE: Thanks to everyone who pointed out that Ibn Sina was Persian, not Arab. Sorry for the mixup!
Come join me for a tour through the Victorian era's cities and hospitals, and meet one of the most famous and eccentric surgeons of the era. How bad was the medical situation, really? Come learn with me!
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Sources:
John Snow and the Broad Street Pump By Kathleen Tuthill, UCLA www.ph.ucla.edu/epi/snow/snow...
The Butchering Art by Dr. Lindsey Fitzharris
Mesmerized: Powers of Mind in Victorian Britain By Alison Winter
Blood and Guts: A History of Surgery By Richard Hollingham
Practical Surgery With One Hundred and Twenty Engravings on Wood By Robert Liston
Lectures on the Operations of Surgery And on Diseases and Accidents Requiring Operations By Robert Liston
Elements of Surgery By Robert Liston
Health, Medicine, and Society in Victorian England By Mary Wilson Carpenter
Time me, gentlemen! The bravado and bravery of Robert Liston by Andrew J. Jones, BS, BA, Robert R. Nesbit, Jr., MD, FACS, Steven B. Holsten, Jr., MD, FACS
www.facs.org/~/media/files/ar...
The Gory New York City Riot that Shaped American Medicine by Bess Lovejoy www.smithsonianmag.com/histor...
The Struggle and Triumph of America's First Black Doctors by Karen Jordan www.theatlantic.com/health/ar...
A Brief History of Women Doctors in the British Empire by Jessica KIrwan medicalhealthhumanities.com/2...
Dr. Mutter's Marvels: A True Tale of Intrigue and Innovation at the Dawn of Modern Medicine By Cristin O'Keefe Aptowicz

[@KazRowe]

Wow, talk about an editing glitch at the end there LOL. Sorry there's no sources scroll. But the sources are listed in the description along with links where applicable!! Sorry about that folks.

[@AWindy94]

It happens 👍 Absolutely Obsessed with your channel thus far 👏

[@theplotarmoredtitan5781]

The way you pronounce the Arabic name is superb!

[@dystrophic]

This is a fantastic video and filled with SO much information! Only issue I want to point out is that I wish you would put the names of the individuals on screen in text when you mention them. I sometimes like to look them up to read more about them if they're interesting, and it can be heard to hear their name properly from just the pronunciation. Particularly Ignaz Semmelweis, and the Middle Eastern physicians you mentioned.

[@HarborDay]

No worries! Also I’m new here and as a student of Arabic, your name pronunciation was perfect :)

[@kendallcarnahan4051]

Yes

[@fake-inafakerson8087]

Imagine being ready for surgery, waiting in front of a crowd, when some big muscle man walk in and yells "Time me!"

[@euansmith3699]

"The doctor will see you now." followed by, "The doctor will saw you now."

[@ana_d_73]

And then he just holds you down and saws your foot off.

[@cazz1844]

Idk about y'all, but i'm ready for the Robert Liston anime series.

[@euansmith3699]

@@cazz1844 "One Punch Surgeon"?

[@TheActualJeffery]

@@euansmith3699 “One Second Surgeon”

[@Vox_Rhododendron]

“I mean, when you think about it, surgery is just stabbing someone to life.” - Liston, probably

[@eirianstarlesschild521]

please never become a sur... oh wait... OH NO!!!!!

[@RavenTheValkyrie]

I told my son, "surgery is just a concentual stabbing." Lol

[@florenmage]

More like stabbing someone hoping they don't die while you remove a thing that might kill them or something lol.

[@blehbleh8396]

Best comment I have seen yet 😂

[@sunnyquinn3888]

Yeah, when I woke up from gallbladder surgery and was complaining about the pain, my doctor said "Well, you've basically just been stabbed in the abdomen about 4 times, so yeah that's gonna hurt for a while".

[@sunnyquinn3888]

Victorian doctors: "Dirty and rotten things cause illness because of the bad smells." Right answer, but wrong reasoning.

[@Grimpy970]

Right? Misama theory is SO close to being correct, but just far enough away to be a dangerous way of thinking

[@meatteater]

@@Grimpy970 nerd lmfao

[@Nathan-hv4qj]

@@meatteater I mean the topic is medicinal science what did you expect, some random words being capitalized

[@meatteater]

@@Nathan-hv4qj nerd lmfao

[@portobeIIa]

​@@meatteater friendless 🤡

[@lemon_boy_dom6208]

"Let's look at the gruesome world of Victorian medicine" Me eating a hot pocket at 2 in the morning: *yes*

[@missbraindamage]

Oh my god. I am going to order hot pockets right now.

[@christinegreene1986]

😆

[@ohnocringe1400]

me, just waking up and barely processing the title: *yes*

[@melancholycat3978]

😄😂🤣

[@jimenatierna3408]

Liston: “It is of the utmost importance to attend to the state of the patient’s mind and feelings.” Also Liston: *Kicks a door open and drags a terrified patient screaming into the operating room to remove a bladder stone.*

[@Oliver-kw3dk]

Sometimes it just be like that /lh

[@Amy_the_Lizard]

I feel like that patient may have given him trouble before, with that incident being the last straw...

[@delaneyharris4391]

This made me laugh

[@themaxterz0169]

@@Amy_the_Lizard AGAIN?! I swear, the next one ill just leave there!

[@nethanerusia9531]

hear me out...

[@hashtagwoke8506]

In another timeline instead of Tumblr editing flower crowns on serial killers they were simping for Robert Liston

[@sarroumarbeu6810]

They did what now 👁️👄👁️

[@basil5980]

Tbh that sounds like the better timeline, at least Bob over here isn’t killing people intentionally lmao

[@sacred-chan157]

Stop They will start simping now.

[@MidnightMimosa1]

What if Liston and Pasteur were Boyfriends 😍

[@maridarling3680]

@@MidnightMimosa1 PLEASE

[@franciscoandrade8588]

This helped me understand why medicine developed a "boys club" atmosphere which is still very present in some areas. The hazing, the competitions, the bravado it all sounds like a frat

[@franciscoandrade8588]

And I also heard that surgeons were resistant to wearing gowns because they liked the bloody look well into the 1950s or as late as the 80s. The fear of AIDS changed a lot about medicine and I assume it would have been the final nail in the coffin for bloody badges of honor

[@sarahrobertson634]

Male doctors were so d*mb they didn't think to wash their hands before performing surgeries. They were still butchering people in filthy environments, going straight from autopsies to delivering babies with bad hygiene, fervently believing in miasma theory and congratulating themselves on being super smart. To be honest, I'm surprised the human species has survived at all. Meanwhile, female midwives were safely delivering babies and tending their mothers in the same hospitals, because they were washing their hands. It's not much different now, male arrogance is just apparent in a different set of problems. I think guys need to throw in the towel and let the ladies run things at this point.

[@sirrivet9557]

It often was a frat!

[@donaldhysa4836]

And you have nice modern medicine and long life expentancy as a result. You're welcome

[@sarahrobertson634]

@@donaldhysa4836 Not good enough. The boys' club has outlived its life expectancy. Modern medicine would be way better if it wasn't full of clueless males.

[@kai_fatallysapphic]

I can't believe victorian doctors were literally using the five second rule in surgery

[@thecreatorsalad]

This is a gem of a comment oh my god 🤣🤣

[@Darkinu2]

I'm going to hell for laughing 😂

[@nobodyofimprotance7615]

Thank you modern medicine, for being so much better then anything else.

[@sadiemakesmesmile]

Are you joking??? What about non-invasive Eastern medicine?? I swear you're all so stuck in white privilege its unreal. Modern Western medicine is still clueless and cruel.,, and from seeing its history, I know why.

[@nobodyofimprotance7615]

Medical science isn't a white thing, and it's kind of racist that you'd think that way, nonwhite people have given us much of what we know about medicine today. Go to Taiwan, Japan, or South Korea today, and you'll see hospitals that have modern medicine. These traditional medicines are snake oil that doesn't work, and exploits stereotypes of about the east. Promoting these treatments kills people and gives the worst people wealth.

[@onyxth3ripper]

@@nobodyofimprotance7615 Get it, ig

[@nobodyofimprotance7615]

I never referred to it as western, I referred to it as modern. There is nothing western about medical science. In fact I was specifically referring to modern science in opposition to the medicine of 1800s Europe in my original comment.

[@onyxth3ripper]

@@sadiemakesmesmile How do you know that any of us are white? Or black? Or Hispanic? Or anything else? So what, Thomas here got a commonly stereotyped name, so what? You hacking into his camera? Watching him? That's what I thought

[@kylabarger1687]

Might I say, your "Victorian doctor" outfit is somth I am LIVING for lol. Wonderful video!!!

[@lukecarlson4710]

It’s very good, well done.

[@aoife3851]

@@lukecarlson4710 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[@amyq5137]

they look so cute

[@fartpee3837]

@@aoife3851 что

[@aveysquarerooted1417]

@@fartpee3837 r

[@victornoname7269]

Fun fact: The first successful operation the remove an ovarian tumor was performed in Kentucky in 1809! The guy who did it was named Ephraim McDowell and he's sometimes called the father of abdominal surgery. It was totally unheard of for someone to survive that kind of surgery at this time. His success was attributed to the fact that he was described as a super neat and clean man. So, you know, he actually washed his hands and stuff. Big props also to the woman who had the tumor, Jane Crawford. She knew that no one had ever survived this kind of procedure before and this was before anesthesia, but she went through with the surgery anyway. It must have been a terrifying situation. I grew in Kentucky so we went to McDowell's house and office, which are now a museum, on a field trip one year. It was a wild thing to learn about Victorian medicine in elementary school. I still vividly remember them describing to us how he had to drain the goop out of the tumor to remove it and how he actually washed her intestine in water before putting them back in. Super gross to learn about, but super neat!

[@daisymay6505]

That’s actually to freaking interesting 🤩

[@daisymay6505]

*so On mobile so can't edit

[@tomservo5347]

If memory serves correctly the operation took a few hours and Jane Crawford had nothing but reciting Psalms in the way of pain management.

[@JessHull]

as a double amputee, I can't imagine what being an amputee and that healing process must have been like back then with the little technology they had. Especially considering how horrible and long my healing process went even u sing the cutting edge experimental tech and medicines I had access to.

[@DarkVeghetta]

It would have likely killed you. Same goes for many of us that were born via C-section. Science and modern medicine has rescued many of us from an early grave.

[@chickedee1085]

Hideous.

[@k80_]

Yeah it’s kind of a miracle there were that many amputees. The recovery was so hard it’s kinda crazy they didn’t all die from complications

[@notme8232]

​@@k80_Throw 7 million darts, and you're sure to hit 20,000 bullseyes

[@killedbyrabbits]

Don't forget they used actual mummies as medicine as well. (they also used other body parts/fluids as medicine too) Oh and about the part where medical doctors started taking over delivering babies instead of midwives they used an anatomical dummy to practice delivery and because the dummy didn't feel pain and the fake baby was a bit more sturdy than a real baby they did a lot more harm than good. Compared to midwives that learned by working with actual humans and being trained by other midwives.

[@andreaadian4486]

Thank you for mentioning this! I read up on a lot of this as well before I gave birth a couple years ago. Even today, midwives have far fewer C-section births than regular doctors. I was so happy to have a midwife at my birth- it went a lot better than my mom's experiences and we had a lot of the same issues.

[@emyemyemyyyy]

(Sorry if this was mentioned in the video, I’m not finished with it yet!) Also, if you had trouble birthing, they would straight up saw your pelvis in half. Like literally. It’s the reason chainsaws we’re invented. Which I guess is more humane than the hacking through that was more commonplace before then, quicker at least? But goddamn no thank you.

[@killedbyrabbits]

@@emyemyemyyyy That's terrifying.

[@annaboogman3321]

They also used mummy to make a brown paint pigment

[@bea.of.ameadow8029]

Leading to women completely dreading going to the hospital as a pregnant women

[@sentienttapioca5409]

'Do you know how many amputees there were running around?' I mean, probably not many, if we're talking leg amputees.

[@nonbinaryDes]

💀💀💀💀💀

[@plaguewifedaydreamingastro8411]

that made me snort haha

[@screamindog8772]

take my like and leave

[@sophiahooper9267]

😂😂😂👌🏻

[@kawaiipotato9928]

HAHAHA

[@1TitanGirl]

Nurse Florence Nightingale is my favorite historical person. She made nursing a respected career choice as well as made many systems like laundry that are still used in hospitals to this day. She didn't take crap from anyone.

[@sarahrobertson634]

She was much smarter than the male doctors of her day.

[@TheGhostoftheCosmos]

You should look up Mary Seacole. She was also a nurse.

[@ryanm9566]

She was an early adopter of good hygiene too, and did a lot of advocacy to get the germ theory of disease taken seriously and implemented.

[@luckyhinton9912]

Mary Seacole deserves about half of the credit for what Florence Nightingale changed in the medical field. She worked actually on the battlefront of the Crimean War and was given nothing afterwards, basically forgotten in her time and in history as well because she was black. She's a brilliant woman and deserves the same appreciation as Florence!

[@EllpaFox47]

@@luckyhinton9912 absolutely, i was just gonna comment that. her story is amazing. Mary Seacole was certainly ahead of her time

[@bethanychomiak1399]

The increased use of tea (instead of coffee) helped to decrease waterborne disease as tea needs boiling water and coffee needs just under boiling water.

[@houseboundhuman]

Doctor's not wanting to believe they're wrong.... my chronically ill body pretends to be surprised

[@fawnieee]

Mine too. Nothing much has changed.

[@fawnieee]

Mine too. Nothing much has changed.

[@laurenmosley9008]

RIGHT THO?

[@megancrager4397]

@@fawnieee as a fellow chronic illness sufferer, I saw a drastic change around 2010... that's when healthcare went through a change, and not necessarily for the better. At least not on our end.

[@sophiahooper9267]

Ditto!!

[@victoriansquirrel]

The fact that surgery was made into a public spectacle doesn’t surprise me at all! The need to be entertained by whatever means necessary is so typical for the Victorians lol. Also, I love your outfit a lot!!!

[@jesseh.5223]

Exactly, if execution is public why not surgery

[@fp9204]

Considering how risky it was to perform surgery, and how difficult it was to get ahold of corpses for anatomy classes, it makes sense that they would have an audience for surgeries. If you look at those old pics of operating theatres the audience isn't made up of regular every day folks, it's the well dressed gentlemen that were already studying/working in medicine

[@issaki1641]

Yeah I'm so glad for the entertainment we have today. Like sure mom I'm watching TV all day but atleast my form of entertainment is not watching someone literally die in front of me💀💀

[@aderyn7600]

I wish I could uave filmed my surgery and watched it to be honest

[@gimmeyourankles]

Well we, in some aspect, have things similar to this nowdays, like tv shows like Botched and others focused on surgeries. The major difference is that we don't have to be there in person lmao. We as humans didn't changed that much from what we were, do we?

[@astrasillage]

1. Thank you for mentioning Semmelweiss. He was Hungarian and he is still known in Hungary as "the savior of mothers" and our largest medical university is named after him. :) 2. I give thanks that I don't have to live in Victorian-era England. 3. I just have to mention this but this outfit looks wonderful on youuu.

[@loudevanneaux661]

Can I just say that most doctors didn’t wear gloves or masks during a lot of procedures (not full blown surgery) until the AIDS epidemic in the 1980s, when it became widespread to treat every patient as if they are HIV+.

[@catus-cactus]

In modern times, with certain surgeries some infants and newborns were operated on without anesthesia or given pain medicine post surgery because it was believed their nervous system still weren’t fully developed or functioning. They were open heart surgeries.

[@jacobeii]

@@catus-cactus it's also been proven that these babies who are operated on likely develop severe mental issues further in life as a result of this

[@Roozyj]

@@catus-cactus I did also hear that using anesthetics on babies can be risky, so it's kind of a lose-lose situation. I'm not sure though, I'm no doctor.

[@sychuan3729]

@@Roozyj anesthetics is very risky for anybody including adults. I once speak with my friend anestesiologist doctor on this, and she said that she prefered not to have it on herself if it is possible.

[@sacredeight]

@@sychuan3729ive heard that it's because of how anaesthesia is a very personalised science - something that could put someone out for a few hours could potentially kill someone else or be much weaker due to differing variables like general health, weight, height and age.

[@alissamerz4648]

“in any case liston was an incredibly complicated man. he contributed quite a lot to the advancement of medicine but he was also a huge scary weird man with an incomprehensible moral compass.” my favorite part by far!

[@DarkVeghetta]

I'm really not sure what was, supposedly, so incomprehensible about his morals.

[@jessicahay9305]

@@DarkVeghetta me either, it's pretty obviously "choose the lesser of two evils when something must be done".

[@Bjarneyemma]

@@DarkVeghetta yeah, it seems to be "it's not okay to incentivize people to continue their serial killing by paying them for the bodies, but graverobbing is less bad. that person was dead anyway" as for the bladder surgery/lecture- my first thought was that this event was clearly notable and discussed. maybe he learned from it and then postponed surgeries if people were to nervous and wrote that quote. But that's just a guess as i am too lazy to research the order of events.

[@leondricklang]

The purest definition of “Chaotic Good”

[@Mr.Marbles]

The real TF2 medic

[@JesusAteMyFries]

I’m so grateful for indoor plumbing 😭😭😩

[@mallarieanderson6439]

And clean water! I was taking a big sip when they began discussing some of those horror stories

[@cam4636]

@@mallarieanderson6439 Same! The video mentions how they needed to stop throwing poop in their drinking water, but that doesn't cover, you know, the stuff that's _already in_ raw water

[@justinedwards5047]

Fun fact; not just green died items, they also used arsenic in mordants, so potentially any died textile could be loaded with arsenic, regardless of color

[@josephinebudd2676]

imagine getting asked what you do for a living and you have to say “i’m a poop collector”

[@KP-ki8ws]

Defecation Sanitation sounds fancier

[@smrtfasizmu7242]

You mean a sanitation engineer

[@bikecaptain8015]

Gastric Refuse Cache Administrator.

[@Omnywrench]

The Loathesome Dung Keeper

[@ziizification]

Obligatory shout-out to my favorite disabled medical icon Thomas Mütter, champion of the poor (he opened a teaching school specifically so poor people would be able to pay for their treatments via admission), early adopter of sedation and sanitization, and one of the first folks who realized that by keeping people in hospital *after* surgery he could improve outcomes. He also toured freak shows to buy their medical specimens because he thought learning was a better way to honor the dead than spectacle. Said collection is now at the Mütter Museum in Philly, and is well worth a visit if you can handle dead things in jars.

[@Cat-tastrophee]

The Mütter Museum has a great KZbin channel as well! I already had great respect for them and this made me appreciate their institution even more.

[@ziizification]

@@Cat-tastrophee Dr Mütter's Marvels is a great introductory biography if your want to learn more about him and the founding of the museum! CW: It's very graphic about the medical stuff, including images of specimens, surgeries and illnesses.

[@Boggythefroggy]

Yes I love Mütter! There’s a Sawbones podcast episode about the museum and it’s great haha.

[@sarroumarbeu6810]

Wow he sounds so good...never heard about this man..

[@berby2068]

A friend of a friend got married at the Mutter museum in a spooky goth wedding. So cool!

[@JaJani101]

THE CLIP OF BIG BIRD KICKING DOWN THE DOOR

[@mckenzie5509]

RIGHT IT KILLED ME🤣

[@thefuckwhat7851]

IMAGINE BEING DRAGGED BY BIGBIRD INTO SURGERY

[@lilli4864]

@@thefuckwhat7851 I would be traumatised from that

[@Blake1720]

A huge reason that they figured out that the miasma theory was wrong is that the hospital full of midwives had much lesser deaths than the hospital with the professional male Drs. Many people would actually prefer to go to the less reputable midwife hospital rather than the latter.

[@Java_Protogen]

so in other words, they would rather accept they were wrong than acknowledge women being better in the medical field? yeah that makes sense considering the era actually.

[@TheReuleaux]

​@@Java_Protogen what.

[@Java_Protogen]

@@TheReuleaux what.

[@beguiling_]

​@@Java_Protogen what? i thought this comment was about why they realized the miasma theory was wrong? am i misinterpreting it?

[@Java_Protogen]

@@beguiling_ honestly, I don't really know what I was thinking when I wrote that. I can sort of see the relevancy at least

[@allisonvaughn]

This entirely makes sense about the theories of Jack the Ripper having a medical background. If body snatching and killing for money was so commonplace, why was the Jack the Rippers such a stand out?

[@moviestargf]

because he was not snatching bodies or killing for money he literally was killing women just because and then taunted the police about it ?

[@thewizard1]

​@Secretary holy shit, mans a savage.

[@elultimo102]

@@thewizard1 ---Never heard anything about that before.🤢🤮🤮

[@JustMe-fb6oq]

@@moviestargfit make sense for him to have a medical background based off of how he dissected them. Absolutely horrible.

[@andynonymous6769]

The british: isn't it great that we've brought civilization around the world Meanwhile civilization in Britain:

[@KingFluffs]

I know right. We should have let people cannibalize each other. Smh.

[@andynonymous6769]

@@KingFluffs First of all, you act like every place that britain didn't colonize were just gnawing on eachothers femurs willy nilly. They werent. They're human like us and like anyone else, found that icky Second, why do you think cannibalism is inherently wrong?

[@sisuguillam5109]

@@KingFluffs not the sharpest tool in the shed, are you now?

[@laurenmosley9008]

@@KingFluffs What, like post-colonial value systems aren't just a less bloody way of people cannibalizing eachother?

[@KingFluffs]

@@laurenmosley9008 If your for cannibalism, slather yourself in herbs and butter, and let me have you for supper.

[@ananicholson6152]

No wonder there are so many Victorian ghosts 🤔

[@hleebeg]

😂

[@Anti-Gravity.]

Oh my god. It all makes sense now.

[@alexcurrie4514]

I think Liston's rage with Knox came with the fact that there's no way Knox didn't know that the bodies Burke and Hare were bringing him were freshly killed victims and not just bodies they dug up. There's a big difference between digging up a body because anatomical references are needed and outright murder.

[@afrikasmith1049]

Those doctors who refused to believe that they we're wrong at that time we're not enthusiastic about their work. Being a doctor means learning new things and sometimes learning new things means you will be wrong about something.

[@Yeetomato]

Looked up Thomas Crapper, and it turns out he didn't invent the flush mechanism. He did improve it, though, with the U-bend and the floating ballcock (oh my god)

[@KazRowe]

Oh yes thanks for catching my lil slip up there! And god yeah the naming choices for these things.... I have no words lmaooo

[@Yeetomato]

@@KazRowe i wonder if they knew. they must have been in on the joke btw, i found your channel recently and i'm loving your videos!

[@Dell-ol6hb]

What an incredible thing to name something the “floating ballcock” haha I feel like they must’ve been self aware right? Either way it’s pretty funny

[@lobomarcela]

fun fact: the guy who actually invented it (for queen Elizabeth I) was Sir John Harington, an ancestor of Kit Harington, the actor who played Jon Snow in Game of Thrones

[@lj9392]

I want to like your comment but it's at 69 right now and I can't ruin it

[@TheLadyDelirium]

I've had a lot of surgeries on my spine. Videos like this make me feel so lucky to be alive. I definitely wouldn't have survived in Victorian times.

[@Amy_the_Lizard]

Well, there's always a slim chance. I mean, Phineas Gauge survived in the Victorian era, somehow. Until he died of seizure 11 years AFTER an iron rod went through his head. He also happened to have a very good doctor (for the time) within walking distance though.

[@Rockinashy]

Lol same I have to have surgery every 6 months because my throat closes up and I would legit jsut suffocate without surgery so I’d just die so fast if it weren’t for modern science

[@k80_]

Exactly. I had to be hospitalized at 4 for pneumonia and if I’d lived in the past that would have been it for me

[@KingFluffs]

Back then they'd have just thrown you down the outhouse pit and left you there like they did with unwanted children.

[@Amy_the_Lizard]

@@KingFluffs Not necessarily. Not everyone is cut throated enough to do that kind of thing, even in when placed in a harsh situation. We've got a fossilized Neanderthal who survived for years after an injury that left him with broken ribs, a severe limp, a missing hand, blind in one eye, and brain damaged. He also eventually developed hearing problems. Yet this man who could not possibly have fended for himself in a hunter gatherer society with Stone Age technology and medical knowledge survived until his late forties. Based on the healing of his bones, the accident would have occured sometime in his twenties. There's also plenty of accounts dating from the Victorian Age iteself that reference people caring for their sick and/or crippled relatives. One famous example of this is Edger Allen Poe, who's wife was left bed ridden for years before she eventually succumbed to tuberculosis. It's also worth noting that Poe's great-grandmother was paralized and bed ridden for years as well. The Victorians weren't savages, they were just people doing what they could. The fact that they had surgeons and doctors in the first place (albiet often misguided ones) shows that there were plenty of people who weren't willing to just give up on their family and friends when they were sick, injured, or dying - even if keeping that person alive would be difficult and costly.

[@justkian6333]

I had to do a shit ton of research on dissections for my biology class and one of my favorite sections I had researched was the victorian era dissections because it was so strange how different it was from today. It’s strange because only a couple hundred years before then, dissections and surgeries like that were looked down upon and most people believed it was wrong or immoral to disturb dead bodies in fear they wouldn’t make it to the afterlife, the sudden 180 in the history of this was so interesting and made me want to look into it more

[@merlinsgirl9311]

My little sister was born via c-section and her birth was observed by a bunch of medical students (not the same as a crowd of complete randos). Just the thought that popped into my head when you said "dozens of spectators". Unrelated but I was also c-section and my mom's bed got stuck when they were wheeling it out after transferring her to the birthing/surgery bed...with the doctor stuck on the outside of the room. He had to crawl under the bed at one point to help unstick it.

[@wintergray1221]

That's hilarious in a hindsight way. Here's my story: After I was born (vaginal birth), they waited too long to sew my mom up so she felt every stab of the needle and pull of the thread. Also, her assigned doctor couldn't even tell she had two amniotc sacs (I cannibalized my as-then-unknown twin apparently) so her labor was drawn out until a new doctor took over. To this day, I don't know why she didn't sue.

[@I_am_a_cat_]

Yeah but they were still all strangers

[@viktorcordyceps1978]

It took me way to long to realize that when you were referring to "speed" being used in surgery you didn't mean the drug lmao

[@pocketsizedviking4555]

i mean some those doctors probably were completely zooted to think of these methods

[@jauume]

@@pocketsizedviking4555 everyone was probably extremely high. didn't they give out morphine for coughs and headaches? we're one of the most sober generations in history

[@rachelsings1001]

Imagine inventing something that improves society drastically and your name just becomes synonymous with poop 😂

[@chickedee1085]

Ironic.

[@icee8959]

I heard somewhere that germ theory revived the style of men becoming clean shaven. Many men wore thick facial hair in the Victorian era. The earliest to began shaving were physicians and surgeons. Since they were sort of VIPs in their cities and towns other men wished to mimic them. One of the easiest and most obvious was to shave.

[@SiiriCressey]

My maternal grandmother was born in 1922 in rural New Hampshire. The doctor who assisted in her delivery did not believe that newfangled germ theory. He did not sanitize his tools, change his clothes, or scrub down between patients. Therefore, my great grandmother + 4-5 other women who he had assisted in birth that week or two died of what was then called childbirth fever.

[@inquisitive-]

Depending on your mother's family background, that may not be entirely unintentional. Cacogenics was still in full swing then and very little recognition is given it. Whole families were sterilized across the united states. There is documentation on groups of native Americans and "lesser" folk in Vermont in the cacogenics documents online. I know I've heard of the same thing in Maine and NH when researching. The region Daniel Webster was from was mentioned. One demographic was called "nam family" in the sounth. Might have been Doolittle in VT. There were dozens such groupings. Some justification was just "multiple members implicated in frequent fights" "father arrested on two occasions" "mother birthed children to multiple men" "feeble minded" one man involved in CO still has schools and hospitals named after him and he was involved with the Pinkertons.

[@SiiriCressey]

@@inquisitive- I don't think I'd come across the word cacogenics before. The internet tells me it's the study of inherited degeneration. Ugh........why is intelligence + education wasted on such wicked means + ends? All I really know about Gram's birth family is that they were farmers, from old Yankee (meaning mostly Anglo-French) stock.

[@inquisitive-]

@@SiiriCressey it's a very hidden aspect of our history but very real. They get us looking at pieces of history and kick the rest of it under the rug. Like thanksgiving. We all know the story we're told. We've had it told and retold to us basically from birth. Ever hear of king Philip? Also recorded as king Metacomet. The pilgrims beheaded him. His father was the chief that welcomed the pilgrims. He and his older son died mysteriously before Philip became king and then died. They say he and brother pleased for good Christian names. So they chose Alexander and Philip? Names associated with Spanish royalty historically. So many holes in the narrative

[@inquisitive-]

@@SiiriCressey there's a lot of different logic behind the origin of "Yankee" which could have been pronounced "young key" and there were a ton of old buildings repurposed as orphanages and boarding schools and native reeducation schools and whatever other phrases got slapped on them to make narrowing down a search now so difficult. There were quite a few in and around Montreal and all over New England nevermind elsewhere. There were also huge asylums for towns just being built, per the narrative. Probably one near you, maybe an Oddfellows home, history of almshouses and structures that look like ancient Europe with no clear images of those buildings being built anywhere

[@inquisitive-]

@@SiiriCressey they could have even been using oriental currency, the yen. There were multiple presidents of the Congress before George Washington shortened the position to president and expanded the powers - which could imply that Congress is an anglicized spelling of "Khan jurist" and that actually makes perfect sense considering the same time period England first started getting slapped all over British claims. It had been Breton or Brittany or Britain on maps and in writing right up until the same time period. Maybe mongol is m"Engel (think French language) and Saxon merging with mongol is not remotely far fetched and the features are present in all native Americans (with more or less emphasis on Germanic or Asiatic features). What did native Americans call their chiefs? Sachem. Grand sachem. Saxon. X is often pronounced CH. Think holy Roman empire being overrun by the Vatican. That's got historical truth in Charles IV or Karl IV or Louis IV, depending on the region that told the story - the holy Roman empire that went to war with the clergy

[@anedgedancer5147]

When you said 300% death rate, I was like, did more people die on the way out of surgery or something? Then you explained that indeed, that happened 😂

[@alexstephens5877]

"Using corpses for practical jokes" perhaps I shouldn't tell on my fellow medical students but uhhhh...we sometimes still did this. Typically with the skeletons in classrooms, we gave our favourite one a top hat and a monocle and made sure to shake its hand when we entered and left the room

[@andynonymous6769]

Pff

[@MCLuviin]

Lmao thats nothing.. if anything thats respectful

[@kanerva123]

that is miles less horrifying than using severed hands as pretend swords though

[@paulmaccaroni]

We had a bright pink feather boa and sunglasses on ours. I still have a picture of myself with it. Good times.

[@tamarasorbo1550]

If it was my skeleton i would not mind being accesorized , and you could also shake my hand XD

[@taylorsimons1075]

omg can you make a video about the history / victorian evolution of child birth + birth control?? i had a baby and i researched the options for giving birth and it’s still super archaic and would super lové a history on it and how it got to be the way it is now !

[@kashiichan]

This is a late response, but you may enjoy the podcast Sawbones

[@taylorsimons1075]

@@kashiichan lmao i’ve been listening to them since i was in hs

[@kashiichan]

@@taylorsimons1075 best podcast 🖤

[@AnnieFannie82]

This was informative, but I'm really disappointed that you completely neglected to mention Florence Nightingale. She was the mother of modern nursing who deserves a huge percentage of credit for improving conditions in these horrible hospitals you mentioned. Her legacy spans across the timeline you're describing. I hope you'll consider continuing this piece by sharing her history. Thanks!

[@emmamcginley5121]

Liston sounds like he can’t be real. Your descriptions and depictions of his story had me laughing and also groaning at the mental images. Excellent video!!

[@_ZeroQueen_]

I wish I had this to show to my associates who very much in the "I wish I had been born in the 1800s" delusion.

[@jesseh.5223]

I'm hoping they use that as a figure of speech and just like the fashion/music/architecture or something...

[@_ZeroQueen_]

@@jesseh.5223 I wish...

[@jellyfishbeans94]

I spit out my food for a moment there, it’s hilarious

[@lj9392]

as someone with OCD and germaphobia, I wish to fight your associates. why do they want to live in a giant fart cloud

[@andynonymous6769]

@@_ZeroQueen_ are any of them female? Because christ I like the aesthetic too but the values of that time were something else

[@ooommm4024]

Having awoken under general anesthesia mid-surgery multiple times in america, I can definitely empathise with those getting surgery in the victorian era. Awakening with 5 doctors doing repairs on your belly and recalling their conversation discussing the innermost sutures like leather straps is quite the treat! 😆

[@Jezebel_Jaylin]

These videos about the Victorian era have taught me so much, I’m only 24 but my adoptive parents are in their 60’s and have always had some… interesting beliefs, especially when it comes to medicine, my Grandparents were born in the late Edwardian era and my Great Grandparents were born in the late Victorian era, so watching these explains a lot about some of the beliefs my family still uphold to this day, I remember you mentioned 7up in the tier list video etc. thanks for the insight.

[@chloebowne7153]

So the miasma theory was almost a step in the right direction. Things that cause foul odor tend to be dangerous or contain bacteria or other contaminants. So they kind of had it backwards it’s the danger that causes the smell which is a warning to humans to stay away.

[@wolfetteplays8894]

That, and also gases that smell bad are generally bad for you… though I’m a smoker so I’m coming off as a massive hypocrite rn

[@TacoLlamaYES]

While the mob killed 20 people, the surviving doctors probably saw it as a win when they got 20 new cadavers :>

[@aelurine]

Omfg this comment cracked tf up 😂

[@taylorrushton3882]

I’m playing a Barber Surgeon at a haunted house and I’ve been struggling for helpful research, this was absolutely disgusting to watch thank you so much for all the help

[@aniauq]

We can’t even say that they were dumb cause we couldn’t of gotten here without such times and evolution. Continuity is a special word… Tbh couldn’t care less this was two years ago, I love Medicine Through Time ever since I learnt about it in school.

[@sarahmarshall6008]

All you need is a white stripe in your hair and you’ll be really rocking that demon barber aesthetic. Hope you don’t take being compared to Sweeney Todd as an offensive, your look is genuinely awesome

[@franziskavonkarma7390]

On the note of musical characters, they kinda look like Grantaire from Les Mis.

[@leonineKelter]

We were watching Sweeney Todd in my musical analysis class and my teacher called Johnny Depp a "pretty boy" and I just think that's one of the funniest things I've ever heard

[@alishawilkinson3651]

@@leonineKelter Oh, but he is. Oh sooo pretty. Yum!

[@Cat-tastrophee]

Liston could remove a leg in 30 seconds!? HOLY SHI-

[@bevinhunter8204]

i’m currently taking a course on the history of medicine and it makes me so happy to know all of the names and theories mentioned omg

[@DimitriPoint]

The part where Kaz talks about the students using corpses for practical jokes and viewing them as objetcs made me think about a fairly (like a few years) recent scandal in Paris and more precisely at the Descarte University. It's (or was, it fusionned with another university and changed its name) a medecine school where the bodies donated to science went to be prepared for the students (if you don't know, medical students rarely work on full bodies, if they need to study some part of the body, the corpses are being separated into different parts, at least in France) and by lack of budget and proper ethical training there was HUGE abuse in the treatment of corpses. For exemple, without proper money allowed to repair, the drain of certain rooms was inoperating for a long time and people were working with bodily fluids up to mid-calf, and there is rumors that some student played football (soccer) with heads. Yeah, that's super gross, and I don't know if there are articles in English but you can look it up, it's a very interresting and horrifying case to learn more about that type of thing shappening nowadays and in a "developped" country in a supposed controlled environment and more specically about how the medical and university worlds are functioning in France.

[@panqueque445]

I remember reading a more detailed description of Liston's bladder stone removal. If I remember correctly, the surgery had already started, and they were literally shoving sharp objects up the patients penis to try and get to the bladder, and the pain was so much that he got up and ran away. That's when Liston went and dragged him back. I think he ended up dying not too long after the surgery.

[@_____________a_a]

Well that’s one way to go.

[@ivy7417]

This made me feel actual pain in my nether regions and I DONT EVEN HAVE A PENIS

[@juliusevola4135]

@@_____________a_a imagine having your wang dug out till death

[@_____________a_a]

@@juliusevola4135 that was the most concerning notification to get without context. Thank you Julius.

[@Jinx-512]

That’s awful, poor dude

[@theaverageglasses6197]

This reminds me of the article in MotherJones magazine about the first time women visited a medical theatre in 1869 in Pennsylvania. It's mostly about how the male students completely lost their shit, but I think it also illustrates well how medicine was so far removed from the average person's lived reality, they literally couldn't bear anyone infringing on what they considered a completely different sphere of people. You just DIDN'T QUESTION these people.

[@greencatsick]

I'm from Edinburgh and if you ever get the chance to come here I'm certain you'd love it. So much medieval/georgian/victorian buildings. I had a friend in primary school whose family own Robert Louis Stevenson's house and use it as a B&B! The Edinburgh Dungeon and Mary King's Close are great - but specifically to this video - Surgeon's Hall is a treasure trove of medical history. It's pretty grim but fascinating. There's so much packed in there and it's like it's frozen in time.

[@neetikapendse4988]

you know its gonna be a good video when it starts with them sitting down with a saw and saying ''have you ever had surgery''

[@mariojardonsantos7568]

When I heard 300% mortality rate I was about to complain

[@isthisdesiremusic]

there's a "you know nothing, jon snow" joke lurking around here i just know it

[@silversam]

I came here to do this exact thing 😆 Victorian Era: You know nothing, John Snow History: Ummm...

[@Moehre01]

Had to scroll so far to see that joke...

[@petermartinez4399]

Extra credits beat us to it.

[@marmartin9822]

“Hey guys I think there’s something wrong with the water” “You know nothing John Snow”

[@superrnovaaa]

Usually, whenever someone talks about history, the first thing that comes to my mind is "boring. dead people" (hence history being my least favourite subject at school). But this video was actually very interesting. Thanks for sharing it 👍🏾

[@pureicefire]

I love all their videos. It makes history super fun

[@gemmagomez3556]

Fun fact! The words "crap" and "grody" (gross, grotesque) come from Scottish words "cnap" (the 'n' here makes a nasally 'r' sound) meaning a lump or misshapen piece of something and "grodadh" meaning rotting or to rot.

[@Batnano]

nope

[@totallynotphoenixwright]

21:33 I'm really sad you didn't mention Florence Nightingale, since she really revolutionized nursing and how we look at infection, wound dressing and patient care alongside her girl squad of nurses during the Crimean War. She lauded cleanliness and wrote the "Notes on Nursing" a bit before Lister made listerine and shortly after ether was first used in operation. Her story is great and I would hugely recommend researching her and other fellow nurses, like Mary Eliza Mahoney and a few others. Extra funfact - Nightingale improved the pie chart. :-)

[@steel8231]

Liston is one of those historical figures who in spite of directly contributing to some of the biggest western medical innovations in the Victorian Era (seriously if Liston didn't do it one of his students probably did, and some of his inventions are still used in surgery today) is only really remembered for that time he might have injured his assistant during a surgery where he lost a patient and an audience member had a heart attack.

[@headstrong_warrior]

There is a Japanese Graphic Novel/Manga (Isekai Yakkyoku or Alternate World Pharmacy) that centers on this period of time (though in fantasy form, with magic) in which the superstitions are being proved wrong and the world of medicine is advancing. A lot of the prejudices and clique-ish boys club topics are touched upon in the series. I only mention this because I thought you might enjoy seeing how they portray these old scenarios in a way that is entertaining but also a warning to a broader audience.

[@sleepyhead8681]

Thx for the recommendation. I love JRPG's and rarely watch Anime about particular interests. Rarley read Manga but want to check it out. Is it translated to English?

[@starlightpanic]

your outfits are always immaculate 😭💕 glad I got recommended your channel recently!!

[@LathosZan]

Technically, "immaculate" means "clean in the Biblical sense" (primarily in terms of sin, but clenliness nonetheless) so in this case, I think the objective was that this outfit was absolutely not immaculate in the general idea of "clean" ;P But I absolutely agree with the sentiment, this costume and the rest are glorious~

[@classyhomo682]

@@LathosZan you just analyzed that comment and im here for it

[@barmingirl]

I studied the Victorian era for exams when I was in school here in the UK, and honestly you teach so much better than the teacher I had for the subject. Thank you for making this subject one I am interested in again!

[@barmingirl]

I was about to say you should cover the trains in the Victorian era, but you are way ahead of me!

[@laurendutton1840]

cool facts, appropriate costume, cool decor, acknowledgement of privilege and oppression, using accurate terms such as AFAB, spongebob references...this is truly the most enjoyable viewing experience I've had on youtube in a LONG time. well done!!

[@Ebvardh]

Modern metropolitan areas are starting to resemble their Victorian counterparts, on everything including the lack of proper healthcare.

[@creepydoll2872]

I have had that thought recently as well

[@laurenmosley9008]

I fucking hate how much of all the worst parts of history we're repeating.

[@normanouard2288]

AHHHHHHH I LOVE THIS SO MUCH!! I read The Butchering Art a little over a year ago and I loved it! I think you boiled it down very nicely!

[@mumplaysthesims8396]

So pleased I found your channel! I love your storytelling methods and attention to detail with your outfits and setting

[@seedhillbruisermusic7939]

yeah we can kind of blame the Victorian era as when Doctors viewed patients not as people but as symptoms. This attitude still remains amongst many doctors to this day. I've had experience of this as a chronic asthmatic having to be hospitalized many times over the years, having certain doctors treat me purely as a case of asthma rather than as a human being. Thankfully not all doctors are like this. The younger ones are generally a bit better. They're taught now to regard patients as people not just vectors of disease.

[@BelgianBisous]

Just a minor point about your intro: the danger of arsenic is actually blown out of proportion. While it was dangerous for those involved in the creation of the green colour, the effects of those using it in their clothes and wallpaper is greatly exaggerated. Nicole Rudolph has done an interesting video on it. Love this vid by the way!

[@sentienttapioca5409]

Sounds like something a wallpaper-licker would say, but okay.

[@ontxtteredwxngs]

you still can't use it without knowing what you're doing. you so much as breathe in the fumes from that stuff and your body will remind you why people don't mess with it. it's in a lot of foods naturally but you shouldn't go around playing with it just bc you think you're being edgy.

[@BelgianBisous]

@@ontxtteredwxngs nowhere did I say any fool could go and play with it. Or that it was a fun thing to use to be edgy. What you say about arsenic goes up for a million other chemicals that exist, be it in nature or lab-made. Many things are toxic in their pure undiluted not-made-for-the-market form, doesn't mean scientists or professionals can't use it, or that every product containing a little of it is harmful to the point of death.

[@ontxtteredwxngs]

@@BelgianBisous aka: I'm not getting vaccinated bc my body will naturally fight off covid if I want it to.

[@BelgianBisous]

@@ontxtteredwxngs you know what, little troll, you sound like the antivaxer with your fear of every chemical. If you can't stand someone nuancing without denying a certain fact like arsenic poisoning which doesn't even affect our daily lives you're too sad a person to even argue with.

[@brittanyhughes2198]

This is the history I love! Can’t wait to see your other videos.

[@Miicrowahvei]

Such delightfully well presented content. Well done!

[@desmond1431]

When I got to the Robert Liston part I couldn't help but picture him as a JoJo's Bizarre adventure type character 😭

[@giantlia2575]

LMAO no bc i see it

[@pixel.noises]

dio 🔪

[@peggedyourdad9560]

Someone with the necessary artistic talent and skill, please draw this lol.

[@rhys1264]

Society: memento mori Also society: AYYY LETS PLAY SLAP FIGHT WITH THIS DISMEMBERED HAND whooo!

[@beludrugueri7776]

LOVED THIS VID!! Thanks!! Plus love the editing

[@melrose0]

I’m so glad to have found this channel randomly! I love your content and your way of presenting it. Thank you so much for doing this. All these topics are really interesting

[@eliearle9900]

Me, wanting to write a fictional book on this exact topic with a villain based on Robert Liston: *IMMEDIATELY clicks on this video*

[@uhhhname2918]

Tell me if you ever published it, because I will read it.

[@nobodysnobody1668]

I would also read it😌

[@dbulgheroni5288]

Your hair looks great 😌

[@Avafaid]

Literally where have you been my whole life? New favorite channel ❤❤

[@erykasr1]

Great vid! I love watching all the dangers of that era. This was well done

[@thatonekidfromkindergarten4495]

I want a dromedy about Liston! The story writes itself

[@Mattmu12]

As an amputee, thank you for that little joke! 😜 I like to tell people I lost my leg from a tragic game of hokey-pokey.

[@williamvaux7500]

I honestly just love the way you present content and comment on history. Love this channel

[@carmencather9535]

Wow...just wow. I ABSOLUTELY loved this. Dunno how I stumbled upon this but it was the best. Thank you. You have so many talents that shined thru. Thank you and I am wiser because of you. Xoxo

[@uneasycylinder]

I absolutely adore your videos, they scratch a bit in my brain craving historical and entertaining media, scratches it real good. I love your outfits too! Really adds to the atmosphere :)

[@walf9084]

Wait you've only been doing this for 8 months? that's going to be a quick binge! Really interested in seeing what else you're going to work on! You're somehow pretty calming to listen too while i study. (especially looking forward to learning more about non-white history as well)

[@Princesskeywest]

What a fantastic overview, very easy to conceptualize and take in. Will be checking out more of your content as well as more resources about this topic maybe that book you mentioned.

[@alexandraclark5334]

I loved this!!! I was gonna just watch the intro, order food, and come back, but you kept me so intrigued I couldn’t! Lol. Got so excited when I saw this video. Youre great at these!!!

[@Ollebolle112]

Imagine you are getting a surgary and the Rock busts in yelling "Time Me"

[@isabellawong1096]

Such a great video! I definitely have to read more about Liston, what a neutral chaotic entity he was 😂 As a nurse I do wish you would have mentioned Florence Nightingale as well :3 But either way this was an awesome video!

[@westzed23]

Yes, the mentioning of nurses was missed. Pre Nightingale you had nurses who cleaned the floors and beds with dirty water, and fed patients food from slop buckets. They were hired to assist moving patients, so strength was most important. And of course without washing hands.

[@crimtan]

I'm living for these Victorian channels! Great job, very informative!

[@kaelang12]

doctors to Dr Snow: you know nothing, John Snow

[@theinternetisqueer]

I'm doing this exact topic in history! This is super interesting and helpful (: also love the fit