Let's talk Poa Annua management with NuFarm / Velocity PM

[@motzstev]

Wow, what a great video and discussion! Getting an expert on who is knowledgeable and seems like a good honest person, not there to sell a product! Love the long form and detailed conversation. Best Poa video out there :)

[@FescueFreak]

Thanks for that!!

[@simonamaral9904]

so if I use it uncool season Kentucky blue grass will it kill the grass too?

[@tashrayt4398]

I’m confused when Aaron was talking about spraying his fescue that it produces a PGR effect. Was he referring to the growth slowing on his fescue from velocity of the poa? Because I just put my third app down blanket spraying and my entire lawn has been suppressed and isn’t growing nearly as fast as it normally does… is this what he was referring to? I’m def seeing a PGR effect on my desirable turf.

[@Stegs]

Great news!! Great show. Can't wait to see it on the shelves!

[@FescueFreak]

In two weeks !!

[@josh.kaptur]

Did a glyphosate and reseed this spring on poa triv spots. I missed some… how long after fescue germination should I wait to spray velocity?

[@MrFergusonLawn]

Brother, I feel like you are speaking on behalf of me haha. Great topic and talk Olee!

[@FescueFreak]

Definitely something that everybody struggles with in cool season Turf ! heritageppg.com/products/velocity%C2%AE-pm?_pos=2&_sid=5d73ab85e&_ss=r

[@FescueFreak]

chemicalwarehouse.com/products/velocity-pm-2?_pos=1&_sid=e41dcceba&_ss=r

[@user-kj5uc9vo9d]

NuFarm could signifcantly increase their revenue if they sold this in much smaller bottles (or more diluted). The 16 ounce bottle is way too much for a residential lawn (dilution rate is 1.5ml/gal/1,000ft).

[@chevyvega6622]

i have never been able to figure out that string pull on the bags...it just does not work for me...i always just say enough enough...and get the box knife

[@richardwilliams2969]

This information was so important

[@FescueFreak]

Thanks

[@RockBass14]

Really great stuff! One thing I'm struggling to understand is which program and associated app rate to use. For the fescue freaks to there, what is the best route? He says 2.25 floz/A twice in the video, but the label up to three applications at 0.75 to1.1floz/A on a 21 to 28day interval OR Make monthly applications at 0.38 to 0.75 fl oz/A.....So we have 3 choices.....what are you going to do?

[@stevesower387]

Go green!

[@tashrayt4398]

Can you spray velocity pm on trivialis in the fall as well? Or just spring? Thanks

[@FescueFreak]

When it is actively growing

[@josh.kaptur]

@@FescueFreak which seems to contradict the advice that you'll have more efficacy in hotter temps.

[@tashrayt4398]

@@josh.kapturyes indeed. Ive applied three times in 21 day intervals. Can’t really tell in some areas if it’s just doing the usual dormancy matting down or if it’s dying off from velocity.

[@tedallen5002]

If I did the math correctly, if 2.25 oz treats an acre and it costs $75 for one treatment of an acre at that rate, then a 16 oz bottle of Velocity PM would be around $533.33. That probably isn’t in my budget.

[@FescueFreak]

Find another Lawn freak to half a bottle with you..

[@tedallen5002]

@@FescueFreak That would likely be my only option unless they were to come out with an 8 oz bottle that is similarly priced which is highly unlikely. It does sound like a promising product though. Thanks for the great video!

[@MrFergusonLawn]

I was gonna ask this, but Aaron answered it near the end; how does this affect the tall fescue? Sounds just like Fusilade ii or Ornamec 170. It slows growth, stuns it for a time, then recovers (if mixed properly). Again, awesome convo man. Thanks for sharing this topic.

[@ianthegreatt]

Has Nufarm released which cultivars of KBG they have tested it on? Would love to know that even if they don't stand behind any of it. Just interested in the data/findings/results.

[@FescueFreak]

That data is out there on some older cultivars

[@greggkathy1892]

If I’m spot treating is there a mix rate per gallon for my backpack sprayer?

[@FescueFreak]

2.25 oz to the acre 43,560 sqft.. you’re talking drops for a backpack spot spraying.. Would have to really check the label to give it correct answer

[@richardwilliams2969]

Thank you thank you just for the information

[@sj7601]

Nufarm stated they have a list of the safe KBG cultivars that were tested, but I cannot find this online. Let me know if anyone has it, I'd love to lookup my cultivars.

[@justinbailey2806]

I emailed the Nufarm rep in my state of PA and got the list, he asked if I knew what cultivars I had because if I didn't know that list probaly wouldn't help me much. I told him I have some Bluebank, Bewitched, Mazama, & some BlueNote. He than sent the list of which none of those are even on it. The list has cultivars are categorized in 3 groups, severe, safe, & marginal. All the data is from '04 and '05. The list requires study. The data entries show when and where and some cultivars are in more than 1 category based on where it was noted and entered. For example, Midnight was in the "safe" category in WI, but also Midnight was in the marginal category in NJ, so that tells me climate is a consideration. Nufarm noted that's is more effective on the undesirable Poa(s) in the 70F temp consistency range, can be used up to 90F, but I think risk in a KBG presence application especially in Summer with possible drought conditions I assume would be most severe for KBG's also. We agreed that the newest high performance, darkest, "Elite" KGB's are going to fare the best over much of the older cultivars, a lot of which have little or unknown market presence in seed form anymore and you wouldn't really plant today anyway. If you are researched enough to know and care what annua and triv are, and can afford Velocity PM, then you are probably also willing to overseed and will opt for Midnight, Everest, Bewitched, Beyond, Impact, Award, Nuglade, or Bluebank, and various other cultivars that constitute or qualify as "Elite" KGB's anyway if killing the Poa T&A would necessitate overseeding due to any high percentage of loss of undesirebles or damage to desireble KBG. If it takes killing or severely damaging any older, less performing, more primitive KBG cultivars to kill the Poa T&A then so be it because it's kind of coming with the territory as far as being that much of an enthusiast, and how annoying it is to control otherwise is my attitude. I bought a bottle recently and am researching it's application and affects and will use and experiment with this product this year for the 1st time. I have a Bluebank monostand section and the rest of my KBG presence is in a blend of PRG's, TTTF's, & FF's The Bluebank's winter and spring greenup performance I feel is lacking, and want to add some BlueNote or Bewitched in there and some Hatrick PRG anyway. There is hardly any poa T or A in the monostand at all but would like to confront it with spot treatment with Velocity PM, but will focus on light rate, more frequent apps, and try to avoid compounding any damage during the hottest and driest periods.

[@knox2660]

Thanks for the great information. My fescue lawn is being taken over by Poa Triv. Maybe there's hope after all. Where can the average homeowner purchase a bottle?

[@FescueFreak]

Heritage PPG will have it soon

[@ericnoland6466]

Why was this removed from market in 2018?

[@FescueFreak]

Wasn't selling at the old price.. New price is less

[@ericnoland6466]

At around $533 a bottle, I’m interested but many others will not be. What do you think the idea behind a 16 Oz bottle is when you need 4.5 Oz for two apps on an acre? Seems like you could vastly increase market demand by simply offering it in smaller quantities at same price per unit volume. You have people with 5k sq ft lawns that would like to purchase small packets to be tank mixed, etc.

[@FescueFreak]

@@ericnoland6466 the 16 ounce bottle is intended for people out, spraying for a living.. maybe in the future they will be a smaller bottle for homeowners?? but I don’t know that

[@brianconner1389]

@@FescueFreakDIY lawn care "nuts" a.k.a. homeowners are pretty dedicated if you take a look. The one weed that has no selective herbicide available is Poa Trivialis. I'd argue that there's a huge market waiting for a bottle that'll do sub-acre properties with a label rating of 2ml / 1000sqft . We're all devising plans to divvy up 16oz bottles and split the cost. Please send the message upstream if at all possible :)

[@ogsan1296]

Sir, this was outstanding. I am locked into your channel. Will you provide an announcement or link me to where I can purchase this ? Thanks again. Here in Charlotte, NC as well.

[@FescueFreak]

you can sign up here for a notification when it will be available!! heritageppg.com/products/velocity%C2%AE-pm?_pos=3&_sid=bc9a26097&_ss=r

[@rezanorouzian8198]

Can this product, Velocity PM, be applied to actively growing warm-season grass (ex. Bermuda)? Because otherwise, almost any non-selective herbicide can be used to kill Poa Annua when the warm-season grass is dormant.

[@MikeStrauss-v2p]

So how much is the 16 ounce bottle? I couldn't do the math!

[@ericnoland6466]

At 2.25 Oz per acre and $75/acre that 16 Oz bottle is $533

[@caprisingh7793]

I thought he saying $75 for 16oz bottle? I got 8000sqft that be ok.

[@ericnoland6466]

@@caprisingh7793 I wish it was that cheap

[@caprisingh7793]

@@ericnoland6466 man that’s a lot, Back to start digging spots and putting seed down.

[@ericnoland6466]

@@caprisingh7793maybe find someone to split it with

[@tedallen5002]

I just did a full renovation with GCI Cool Blue (85% TTTF varieties, 15% KBG varieties) last fall. It is now mid-March in piedmont NC and I have a lot of Poa Annua and what I think are large areas of Poa Triv, particularly in the wettest areas of my backyard. The Poa Annua has been showing lots of seed heads for at least a month and I have mowed and bagged a couple of times and will be mowing again in the next day or so. Would it be safe to use Velocity PM on the TTTF/ KBG mix? Given the seed heads I already have, should I look to treat as soon as I see a week of projected highs in the 60s rather than waiting until late summer when Poa Annua will already be toasted by heat here and already had the opportunity to seed multiple times?

[@bhaycraft]

So I am currently fighting Poa Annua in my GCI Cool Blue tall fescue. I have about 5K SQ FT. I have currently been trying different mixtures of herbicides trying to find something that works. Latest mix is Sulfentrazone, Ethofumesate 4SC, Triclopyr 4, Drive XLR8. I also have tried Tenacity and Speedzone in the past. I have considered the Xonerate but at 700 bucks for 12 ounces it is just cheaper to do a total kill and start over. Frustrating

[@FescueFreak]

Honestly, it’s not cheaper to start over you have valuable turf there that has grown roots! Etho works best as a pre-emergent in the fall has done wonders for me! The best way to take care of this is to grow thick, healthy turf to keep the ground shaded and not let other plants germinate

[@bhaycraft]

@@FescueFreak looks like I am going to get some Velocity PM. I will say I am 3 days since I put down my mix and the poa is turning a little brown.

[@tashrayt4398]

Thanks for your great content! Do you know how many Oz per gallon in a backpack sprayer? I’m getting mixed answers. 2.25 Oz per acre but what about per gallon/1000 sqft? Thanks for any info!

[@joshherron7]

Man I wish there was a bottle small enough for 5,000 square foot.😅

[@mowman7777]

I was excited until I found out it’s not registered in Va, where I’m located. You say it’s most effective sprayed in higher temps but poa annua is a cool season annual so by the time the temps are right for spraying the poa is full of seeds and starting to die out on its own. The seeds will produce a crop next season. Also Burmuda grass is dormant when it’s cold so again the temps aren’t right for spraying. What am I missing?

[@maggarlion]

Too darn expensive. I would never buy it

[@MikeStrauss-v2p]

How much product over 1000sq ft? Having a hard time doig the math. I have 5k sq feet to treat. Thanks for anyone who can help.

[@FescueFreak]

heritageppg.com/products/velocity%C2%AE-pm?_pos=3&_sid=bc9a26097&_ss=r

[@danielbreslow6242]

Would ripping the poa triv all out and redoing the entire lawn with new top soil and sod help this situation or will the triv tend to come back? Will velocity pm help me?!?! And how can I get it?!

[@josh.kaptur]

I can confirm... I beat poa triv, then the following fall I aerated... and then I had hundreds of new spots. If you've had triv before there's a seed bank under that sod just waiting for an opportunity to get to the surface. This was AFTER a full renovation with 2x fall glyphosate, but poa triv isn't really growing in early fall and did not get 100% kill apparently.

[@johnjrkean7008]

My yard is over 2 years old from bare dirt using GCI seed for whatever reason this year I got infested with poa it's like 30% of my yard hit me hard

[@caprisingh7793]

Hi Olee, I’m hearing right $75 for 16oz right Sir?

[@FescueFreak]

No sir $75.00 per app.. 16oz is like $500.00

[@caprisingh7793]

Thank you sir, I only got 8000sqft, but I just need to spot spray, I need to start asking ppl in south NJ that can go in on this lol. Let’s see who got Triv in nj.

[@JPMPS3XBOX360]

What’s the shelf life? I have 10k sq ft so I could put a total of 180 applications from a 16 ounce bottle- could last decades!!

[@FescueFreak]

Don't let it freeze keep it out of direct sunlight store it between 50 and 70° will last for years and years

[@todd6068]

I got 4000 ft.². This is going to cost me a fortune, but it will last about 85 years.

[@FescueFreak]

Find a friend and split it

[@monkeyslawncareandgardenin473]

Hi Olee, it’s Rob Dennee. Is Velocity labeled for Bluegrass? If so!!!!!

[@FescueFreak]

It is safe for some varieties, but not all Like he was saying, in the video you would have to do some testing ..

[@monkeyslawncareandgardenin473]

Never mind, but I might try it in the couple areas I do have annual

[@monkeyslawncareandgardenin473]

@@FescueFreak i will try some area for sure, so Mountain View KBG and Midnight

[@monkeyslawncareandgardenin473]

Nut sedge 4 oz acre three times in the spring with Sulfenthrazone

[@kennethmcclamrock4735]

Poa Triv is the bigger devil for me!

[@FescueFreak]

Same here!!

[@sjm1978]

🔥🔥

[@FescueFreak]

Thanks man

[@Tundra_Guy]

Velocity in the past still wasn't really effective against triv. This is most likely a waste of your money. They need something more potent to actually get rid of it. Heck even roundup has minimal effectiveness against it, it usually returns the following season.