Bill Ackman explains Herbalife saga and beef with Carl Icahn | Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

[@LexClips]

Full podcast episode: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpiqfJupjM2Iq5o Lex Fridman podcast channel: kzbin.info Guest bio: Bill Ackman is an investor who has led some of the biggest and controversial financial trades in history. He is founder and CEO of Pershing Square Capital Management.

[@humanbeing5300]

This entire interview is a goldmine of knowledge.

[@chrissv1gri]

I agree. Also, it reminds me of a 1983 movie "Trading Places" in which two multi-billionaires make a bet of one USD where they destroy a man's life for the bet. Regardless of what we thing of these financial moguls, after "they made their piece", some poor kid, fund manager, business owner, has lost all his capital, or life savings at an important point in his/her life, while the moguls, just "moved on".... I know, it is just capitalism but nevertheless sometimes makes me think and get sad....

[@RVCInc.-zm9fw]

Finally someone has a great explanation of shorting a stock

[@mutedmutiny9542]

Bill is a goldmine of knowledge. Any of his interviews or videos online, highly recommended.

[@InvestorCenter]

I work at a hedge fund so I’m an “insider” in the industry. It is incredibly impressive that Lex doesn’t have a finance background but knows the EXACT right questions to ask. Such a great interview

[@aaronmichaelmusic_]

Didn’t Jordan Belfort work at the investor center? 😉

[@hmq9052]

Get off your knees

[@YolandaSaldivar4eva]

These aren’t particularly incisive questions

[@wonderfulworldofmarkets9033]

@@YolandaSaldivar4eva lol Lex's gossip 💅💁‍♀questions: "He was a legendary investor. What was the backstory" "You actually said f u?" "For him it was just personal?" "Do you regret saying fu" "How much for him was personal vs investing" "There's a personal vengence here"

[@fanaticsoccersuper]

you're easily impressed

[@shreshthanand3006]

This interview is about as good as media can get as a source of information

[@markrichardson3566]

Thanks bill I'm a Herbalife victim, lost 10k, keep going from Canada ❤️

[@boukie85]

Carl hates shorts 🩳

[@humanbeing5300]

Its funny how these Wall Street guys are ruthless as hell but its all just part of the game to them

[@biotechno100]

Leave your emotions at the door - that's why most of us will never be at that level of investing. A unique skillset - but doesn't mean I want that to define my existence but hats off to the emotional intelligence regardless - should the same logic be applied to bigger global issues; we might have a fighting chance heading into the next epoch.

[@alicedoors4826]

@@biotechno100 "Leave your emotions at the door"? Ummm this whole thing was all about emotion and ego, nothing else.

[@Web3Future333]

Its a game for sociopaths. Those are the people at the wheel of our economy, sociopaths…

[@fearlv1rattata]

The guy proved they were a pyramid scheme and it basically resulted on a slap on the wrist for Herbalife.

[@Mr_Glass_Orlando]

Time is beautiful look at the Herbalife stock now. 😅 all the people that consumed their products are either gone just flat green skin color 👽, investors broke what a Joke!

[@xxxs8309]

He was ultimately right on Herbalife but it was too late. That's why you can't go a very big short position

[@golfinguru11]

Markets can remain irrational for longer than you can remain solvent -J.M. Keynes

[@itsjuanpabloo]

You are so uninformed . Herbalife is an amazing company

[@AcidicJO]

@@itsjuanpablooYou can’t be serious?

[@desmundlighten3603]

Incorrect! he trumped up charges to manipulate the government into investigating in order to artificially drive the stock price down on an American company employing hundreds of thousands of people all over the world. All so he could make a buck. He was willing to try and manipulate a companies stock to 0 on false claims because he thought he could. His claim is herbalife had no real customers only distributors selling to other distributors. This was proved false. There was no there there so the market reacted accordingly and he lost his ass. The stock being down now is no reflection of the 44 year olds companies legitimate model and More about down trend in the overall sales of their products due to serveral macro factors. Why we side with billionaires is beyond me.

[@desmundlighten3603]

@@itsjuanpablooi never understand people rooting for an American company employing thousands of people locally and abroad to fail based on the unsubstantiated claims of a hedge fund manager its like a wolf talking the sheep into attacking the sheep dog.

[@ConradMinnaar]

Bill Ackman shaves his head = Jeff Bezos

[@OUD4444]

Holy shit 😂😂 good call

[@bizzzzzzle]

Omg You can’t unsee it now

[@arthursfist7090]

Wowwwwww

[@marianavivanco4152]

They look all alike lol

[@JC-kz3ut]

I can't unsee this shit now fuck you 😂

[@michaelbryant2071]

I made a lot of money on Herbal Life back in the 90's. I bought dealers product at a deep discount who were tired of schilling the stuff. I then sold Herbal Life at Flea Markets. Hispanics bought most of the products.

[@kervisote20]

Hispanics are known to pyramid schemers and dubious product sellers as easy prey for a reason

[@henryzhang9915]

"Carl, Fuck You!" Best Bill Ackman line so far.

[@eddyd5169]

That’s the most expensive F… of the history of the mind kind

[@alwaysright5593]

The herbal life confrontations would take few episodes of the next HBO series (Ichan)

[@Kitties-of-Doom]

I saw the Documenatry. "betting on zero" Bill got absolutely obliterated by Carl. Great watch. I think he lost 750 million or something. Blew the entire Hedge Fund with the Herbal life short

[@RonaldEarlWilsher]

I thought he said 1 billion lost? Maybe I misheard him and you’re right. Still a large amount to lose.

[@Kitties-of-Doom]

@@RonaldEarlWilsher ya ya it was a billion

[@elfx09]

You dont have to make it back the way you lost it! Daaammm powerfull!

[@alwaysright5593]

Revenge is mostly destructive, take your losses and focus on

[@ew2645]

Imagine what positive things could have been built with all that time, money and effort. Instead it’s wasted on revenge because someone’s ego was threatened.

[@uberhaxonova]

very stupid thing to even comment.

[@lennyholder6883]

Word

[@KayFabe87]

His money. His choice. You sound like a communist who "knows best" how other people's money "should" be spent.

[@superdoobo]

I remember watching their fight live. It was awesome!!! Every couple of years I go back and watch it again.

[@96ej]

Two things can always be true at the same time, I really enjoy listening to Bill Ackman the history shows that if he's on TV telling you something is a terrible company and that you should be selling it, almost guarantee you that he is buying it.

[@jenghiskhan69]

Before Herbalife it was veema energy/vitamin drink just a pyrmiad scheme one person made a big impact. One of my friends won a car thru points gained thru sales. On top of getting money.

[@ericnelson9100]

I think it was always Herbslife; Veema is another pyramid scheme Herbalife was started by that guy who would go on tie of a cocaine overdose at the age of 44, Mark something!

[@phillipsierra2074]

I can listen to Bill Ackman all day. Interesting guy.

[@jasonparker5746]

A short squeeze isn't caused by a restriction of available shares. It is caused by the induced panic of short sellers looking to cut their losses as the security turns bullish and begins ascending substantially. There is a buyer, seller, or borrower in the case of short selling in every transaction.

[@shonnspencer1162]

The term spoiled brat comes to mind. When you don’t get your way it’s time to attack.

[@OffGridInvestor]

Herbalife is a damn predatory MLM. Forcing people to buy stupidly high numbers of products to retain they're buying rights. The amount of people who have lost their life savings is tremendous.

[@Peterpipe69]

I wonder what Bill’s opinion on Patrick Bet David’s PHP agency is?

[@billytuff8286]

I’m sure he hates it. I love PBD but his company is an MLM

[@VicDamoneJr82]

Same blueprint target low working class immigrants ie Herbalife

[@billytuff8286]

@@VicDamoneJr82the immigrant stuff should really piss us off. Imagine waiting 7 years to become a US citizen just to get sucked into a stupid scheme for the first year. Sad.

[@Art-is-craft]

@@VicDamoneJr82 But it is not selling weight loss.

[@anthonypallante4380]

@@billytuff8286lol I love this guy that is a scammer. Good god

[@zax8961]

Quite a frank, honest conversation and he explains stuff so a youtuber can understand. Half the problem with finance chaps being interviewed is you need to be in the industry to know what they're saying.

[@jesuschrist5488]

Bill is a legend bruv

[@Tormentality]

lol

[@Davidkhait]

For those who don’t know - Herbalife was forced to provide info to the FTC that more than 60% of produce sales end up in customer hands (not distributors). After just one month of implementation of this system, and Herbalife showed 90% of its product sold end up in customers hands. 10% is consumed by distributors.

[@ericnelson9100]

Many of those customers are made up by distributors., but r indeed purchased by the distributors themselves. That's how all these MLMs work.

[@romannumerals2855]

bill told the story the best here in this video over any other ones.

[@tradeforcharity]

Good for Bill. He stood his ground.

[@eddy9027]

a learning experience for me - keep them coming; thank you

[@Scratcherzzz]

Jim Rohn is a legend

[@dakotagrown8619]

What a good way to explain shorting a stock .

[@saketkulkarni1238]

8:13 that was sneaky, he didn't sell the shares nor transfer but the shares were taken from him during the merger

[@marianavivanco4152]

So whose fault was there? Who was right?

[@ramprat5812]

My favourite part is when Carl said “now we can be friends” he was kinda right 😂

[@charles_cody]

Bill is the top of the crop. Always right, often early.

[@profjcpodcast]

Real life Bobby Axelrod

[@EbongEka]

They say Steve A Cohen is the real Bobby Axelrod....

[@soulrider5655]

It was both of those two traits and how they operate in the Wall Street

[@2011blueman]

Ackman is like one of the guys that Axelrod destroyed. Steve Cohen was one of the main guys that Axelrod was based on.

[@Art-is-craft]

@@2011blueman Ackman is still in business and booming.

[@2011blueman]

@@Art-is-craft Ackman has underperformed the S&P 500 in 2013, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2021, and within 1% of the S&P 500 last year. Yes he's still in business, but after fees you're not getting alpha from him, you're just getting much higher volatility.

[@endgamefond]

THAT DOCUMENTARY OPENED MY EYES ABOUT FINANCE. I WATCHED IT 2 YEARS AGO. BILL IS THE GOAT.

[@cromcccxvi3787]

If only they actually had to borrow the stock.. instead of a synthetic version that doesn't exist

[@eddiegill]

Did you ask Bill about Valeant Pharma? I really felt his pain everyday I watched that stock price fall. I believe he was long …$220 to $8

[@SouL1Jacker]

I am a big fan of Ackman, but he shouldn't have picked a fight with Icahn, who was at the peak of his powers then. It would have been wiser to let it go and work with him. Imagine how much money they could have made off the Herbalife short together? There is also much more to the dislike between him and Icahn than Ackman is letting on here.

[@francisaugistino701]

Because sometimes doing what’s right is worth more than money. Any amount of money.

[@micheldecryptadamus]

imagine thinking it was a good idea to go to work for someone so deeply unethical that they refuse to honor their contracts

[@SouL1Jacker]

@micheldecryptadamus I didn't say working for. I said, working with.

[@micheldecryptadamus]

@@SouL1Jacker even worse. maybe you are the kind of person who wants to go into business with partners who renege on their commitments and attempt to bully their partners with the bludgeon of cash + the legal system but i personally would recommend avoiding that course.

[@untchableninja]

The "different instrument" they used to short mbia he references at 2.26, is that a credit default swap?

[@ktara1033]

Great interview. Bill is a very likable guy. Love his advice

[@anav587]

Outside the short term, bears always lose.

[@cpcreit]

Bill Ackman, I am actually very surprised how "pleasant" he seems, not cut throat biz like at all judging by his demeanor...His voice, I was expecting him to sound like someone w/ a "stuffy nose pitch" when he speaks, but pleasantly surprised how articulate and humble he seems (media tends to portray his arrogant side w/ certain unflattering pose)...Icahn and old gen financiers like him talk honor but does not do the walk, will do what's in their own interests/steam rolling a weaker counterparty....

[@jacobsolomon427]

It sounds like revenge by ichan but you always have to hear both sides to really know what happened.

[@TaggsR85]

All this is a scam to get money for all the lawyers to do all these cases

[@hansvandenberg8347]

I worked on a landscaping crew when I was 17 and we build an artificial pad of grass in the owner of Herbalife house in Colorado. That dude was a dick about everything little thing. For example “please tell your workers we don’t use disposable water bottles on this property. Tell them they’re only allowed to drink out of reusable water bottles.” Keep in mind we didn’t leave any bottles laying around he was just being a dick

[@amdave76]

Ackman telling Icahn to F off is great. Good for him

[@eddiegill]

Seemed irrationally personal

[@yashchaudhari7558]

does anyone believes that, Bill looks like Jeff Bezoz?

[@GungaLaGunga]

'weapons of mass financial destruction'

[@nikitakucherov5028]

Chess at the VERY highest level

[@filipinalipstick]

[@michaelbryant2071]

That was Bill's blood money from Ichan. Could not have been sweeter for him.

[@ron8979]

There is a documentary about an hour long on this. I highly recommend both investors and non-investors watch it. I saw it about 5-6 years ago. It Was awesome.

[@maambomumba6123]

Title/Link?

[@davidblake8612]

Yeah although, why are we so drawn to the fights and not the successes. As he mentions towards the end - why isn't there a doco on how he turned Chipotle around?

[@brianreeves8520]

What do you call two rats? Lex and Bill

[@jmw797]

He got Gamestopped haha

[@boukie85]

😂😂😂🚀🚀🚀🚀🦋🦋🦋

[@Tom0000]

This reminds me of my Carvana short that I just liquidated. Pretty sure Carvana is a scam but I couldn't handle the heat.

[@Silvisss266]

They own Adesa which is an underrated holding so there was value there

[@fadfaasfsafsasaf8235]

Jew vs jew amyrite

[@whotube357]

Larry the Liquidator trying to claim he's helping the little people... what a liar

[@tsancio]

With options, you can create a strategy to limit the downside and have a big upside, betting on a stock to fail.

[@tsancio]

I came to this interview snippet to see if I would respect Ackmann enough to listen to the full interview. Yes, I'll listen to the podcast episode.

[@darrick9495]

I Like Bill good business man get um bill, never short a stock

[@the.firefighter.realtor]

I wonder if he shorted PSTH

[@flyluv737]

Look at what Icahn did to TWA. He ruined a lot of honest people’s lives. He is the darkest side of greed

[@nthatomalope]

This guy has been a great role model for me growing up.

[@Thewhitekorean]

I made my entire retirement fund shorting Tesla/twitter this winter lmfao

[@Eye_sky_high]

wonderful, congrats on the windfall

[@uberhaxonova]

ah of course you shorted a private company, you genius white korean.

[@mcfly10146]

when did you close the twitter short?

[@billytuff8286]

Sick bro. I made my entire retirement fund this week on NVIDIA.

[@Art-is-craft]

That is highly unlikely.

[@TheMuskMultiverse]

Why does Jeff bezos look like a Walmart version of this guy

[@dickieknutz2933]

Lol. This clown. It reminds me of PoS Morgan going on tv every night. #selfawareness

[@eddiegill]

Was Bill involved in exposing Icahn enterprises?

[@RashidOmar]

What do these 2 men have in common?

[@antoniocarrasco5098]

So this is how billionaires fight

[@cromcccxvi3787]

Shorting is the real scam

[@VicDamoneJr82]

Why

[@sandworm9528]

If you can't short a company how does the price ever go down? Capitalism relies on price discovery, if you don't like that you can fuck off

[@TurboFrieza]

Dumb comment. I bet you still think AMC and GME is going to squeeze.

[@davehasenford3985]

i finally understand

[@dbsk06]

11:50

[@desmundlighten3603]

Ive been a distributor for 10 years. I own 2 brick and mortar herbalife smoothie bar serving the herbalife products to my community for a quick healthy meal on the go daily. It’s become a family business as my dad and aunt both have their own locations in different states. My dad used this business after being laid off by Walmart and supports my mom and little brother with his small business. all of my family use the products to help supplement our daily nutrition. They are actually the largest meal replacement company in the world based right here in America. This man attacked an American company with false charges of essentially having no customers and being solely based on recruiting people and making them by the products. Any research would prove this to be false to I have to believe he knew this was not true and simply wanted to manipulate the stock price down to zero to make a buck. This would make this guy a pretty shit human as outside of the 4 million global distributors, Herbalife owns and operates several million square foot facilities employing hundreds of thousands of people all over the world. It would be like trying to shut down Starbucks.

[@hotmess9640]

He’s a snake but he’s not lying. It is a pyramid scheme, doesn’t mean peopel don’t make money off it. You’re in the “diamond” category, everyday people lose their life savings in this though. Same shit as amway, you are the EXCEPTION to the rule you don’t represent the majority

[@PaulGappyNorris]

Good for you, but essentially the products are shite.

[@Johnnypaycheck77]

Hes a criminal

[@Steve410811]

How much money did he make on the covid pandemic?

[@whotube357]

Ackerman was trying to manipulate Herbalife with fake news and lies while shorting....and the dirty bstrd got his ass kicked. Loved it.

[@mithicash1444]

Idk about lies, Herbalife gas always been a scam...

[@SnoopDougg]

Title: "Extremely Rich Men Being Petty"

[@victorcreed3]

"schmuck insurance" - these clowns

[@2_Mikee_]

used a different method aka used swaps to short the stock to hid short exposure and take more leverage, screw financial derivatives not being used for its initial purpose of insurance and instead for means for hedge funds to multiply gains and riddle the market with systemic risk.

[@njigyfd]

could you imagine being stuck with this guy Ackerman as a neighbor? sooner or later he would start some kinda trouble over the goddamn fence

[@dede_fitness]

good

[@njigyfd]

beef - beef - beef - this guy is some kind of creep

[@tonysoprano1454]

Hello tontines

[@Jeffs_Corner]

This some wallsrteet buzz for sure.

[@Eye_sky_high]

hey Lex, would you interview Mukesh Ambani ?

[@romeo20maypole68]

Im not sure what i mean. I just love listening to these rich guys and plan to stay poor.

[@danielmankinde1706]

I-CON-nic investor.. idk if y’all see what he did there .

[@MrBings714]

The great manipulator.

[@beng3345]

Just bad timing. Herbalife is down 85% the last 5 years, lol.

[@wayneredd6776]

Green mailer nothing more

[@grybnyx]

Activist shortselling should be made illegal.

[@goodolarchie]

Pressure is pretty useful as a tool in the market, the issue is what size position do you define activist?

[@Art-is-craft]

Absolutely not. You cannot stop it.

[@grybnyx]

@@goodolarchie It's not the size of the position so much as it is about the fact that the success of the trade is contingent on driving down the price of the stock. It's market manipulation and goes against the reason why markets were set up in the first place, to help businesses grow.

[@architectinth]

Zzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzz z z!

[@libs-Suk-Balz]

Turns out Bill is a great humanitarian. When antisemitism broke out on college campus throughout the country, bill took the names of those who signed antisemitic petitions. He and his friends passed the names around in the financial industry and banned them from many many major financial companies.

[@dinomdanom8726]

Bill “the snake” Ackman

[@Steve410811]

Amway

[@marianavivanco4152]

All jews 🇮🇱🇮🇱

[@phantomcreamer]

Bill Ackman shorted an American business then spread a trumped up accusations, and while herbalife was not a great company, they weren't all that Bill said. Carl stepped in, Herbalife was not the boogeyman, and the market and US government realized it, and Bill failed at destroying Herbalife. Carl Ichan was a better man than Bill. Bill has done this sort of thing multiple times and had met his match on this one. I laughed when he called Carl Ichan charming. Carl Ichan was an ugly angry dude, Bill Ackman is the charming man who gives off an appearance of the clean upright gentleman. He's shown a lot of courage in what he is doing with the Universities, but he has a checkered past and it isn't Carl Ichan that is the charming snake in the grass.

[@uberhaxonova]

One look at Herbalife's balance sheet and you can easily tell it's a scam.

[@2011blueman]

Herbalife is a barely legal pyramid scheme. Everything that Ackman said about them was 100% correct, but he didn't seem to understand that after FTC vs. Amway the government doesn't really get involved with MLM pyramid schemes, they just let them implode on their own.

[@truthteller5521]

Herbalife is a phuking scam, stop it. US Government endorsement means absolutely nothing when said government is filled with nothing but crooks.

[@sinatra222]

Herbalife is a predatory company. Practically 0% of the people who get roped into it end up making any money.

[@acefromspace2727]

Obviously you can’t get to their level of success without stepping on a few bodies along the way but Icahn is a different type of animal. He is older than Ackman and he came up in a time when ruthlessness was the name of the game. Icahn didn’t care about Herbalife, he just wanted to bury Ackman. That is ruthless.

[@Mac33777]

Only the shareholders lost on AMC

[@MrToetoheel]

Dude Bill achman is a terrible person.

[@phantomcreamer]

Carl Ichan was right and stood his ground.