Li-Ion vs Li-Po Comparison on a Cinewhoop - 21700 Molicel P42A 4S

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I'm sad to say I don't fly the Cloud-149HD anymore, I've since switched to the HGLRC Veyron35 CR Pusher which I modified to include a camera-tilting servo controlled by a headtracker. Works alright so far, and made a video about it for those wondering: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bJyyoJWuet-Hr80 And yes, at some point I'm gonna' stick Li-Ion batteries on it 😂

[@davincifpv3983]

Li-Ion can be taken down to 2.8V easy (cut off at 2.6V for most of them) so you need to set the Betaflight warnings for that and keep an eye on Voltage when you fly Lipo as there will be no warning at 3.6V anymore

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Oh no, totally, but I'm just super conservative - barely have enough budget to buy and build batteries, so I baby them to make them last as long as possible. As for Betaflight warnings, since I'm using a mishmash of different battery capacities, I don't really pay attention to all that, I just make sure to monitor voltage in the goggles to be safe. Sorry for the late reply btw, been really busy recently.

[@maxbar4166]

​@@STRIKINGFPV Bro, if you want max life from any Li-Ion or Li-Po cell, used them at 3.0v to 4.0 volts. That limits the plating proccess inside the cell that causes it to go down in capacity and go up in resistance.

[@The1188am]

​@@maxbar4166 nop

[@neutronpcxt372]

@@maxbar4166 Plating is dependent on temperature and internal resistance mostly.

[@johnwalter6410]

I've seen 2.2volts still in the air

[@ryanokeefe12]

Hey mate. By stopping at 3.6v when flying, you're stopping far too early... Your pack is going to recover to 3.85~ per cell after 10 minutes or so. You can safely fly until your pack is at 3.6-3.7V AFTER resting. You should try using your mah consumed reading instead of the voltage. That way, you can just fly until you've reached 80% of the pack's capacity and then land.. You don't need to worry about sag or the weight of the quad or anything. You just know that your battery will recover to ~3.7 volts. Doing the quick math.. If you're pulling 14amps and have a 1550mah pack that you want to fly for 80% of capacity (1250mah = 1.25ah), your flight time should be = 1.25ah / 14amp draw = 0.08857 hours or 5 minutes 20 seconds.

[@randomstuff-cu4of]

many can be flown down to more like 3.5v or even 3.3v after resting. not the best for health but most every li ion is rated to be discharged to either 2.8 or 2.5v at a 1c discharge rate and it will recover to those voltage ranges after resting. rated for like 300 cycles of this btw but yeah you can get 500+ if you only discharge it so it recovers to 3.7 ish and also keep it at storage voltage when not used and all the other similar things as with lipos

[@STRIKINGFPV]

You guys are totally right, and it's stuff I've given some thought to previously, but as I've mentioned to a few other commenters, I'm criminally conservative with how I treat my batteries. Seeing as how I currently fly as a hobby and cash is fairly tight, I'm just making sure that my current batteries are treated as "gently" as possible so that they last me a long time. There might be the odd occasion where I take the battery down lower than what I usually do, but that'll either be due to me forgetting to check battery status, or if there's a particularly strong headwind when trying to fly back home, hehe.

[@tommcdonald6371]

Facts bro

[@tommcdonald6371]

Thanks for the equation

[@gargolaconrad3188]

I was just going to say the same thing as DaVinci FPV, I've seen many people repeatedly go down to 2.8 V many times and their batteries were fine. With a bigger quad with bigger props, you'll be able to get longer flight times without heating up your motors. I like the fact that you chose the 21700 batteries also, I will be doing that for my next build. Good job, I subscribed.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I did actually get myself some 3.5" props that work on a stock Cloud-149HD as long as I remove the ducts, and I've got custom arms to mount 3.5" with custom ducts as well, so that's something I may toy with, though it does change the form-factor quite a bit. The more I fly and test, the more I think a pusher setup with large props will likely be the way to go in terms of keeping the size down whilst improving power and efficiency. But now I'm also thinking, will lighter 18650 batteries improve things more in the Cinewhoop size?

[@SC-rk6zt]

2 years later, the Molicel P50B is promising 400 watts per cell.

[@iamatuna]

I am only commenting to say thanks for the vid and to help the algo realize that there is great content here. Awesome job Sir! As someone who is not a native speaker of English, I must say I also really like the way you speak.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

That's very kind of you, thank you for your encouragement. Never thought too much about how my speaking style comes-across to others, but if it works for you and other non-native speakers, then I'm glad I'm understood 😊.

[@zefixx6659]

I build my own 4S / 6S / 8S Li Ion Packs with these P42A cells. They are awesome. You can charge these up to 4.2V per cell and run them out to about 3V to keep is save for the cells. So there is much more flight time in it!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Yeah, people definitely run these batteries harder than I do and they still seem to hold on fine. I'll probably abuse mine a little more in future, but I still like to be careful

[@The1188am]

​@@STRIKINGFPV read the specs.

[@David-ty6my]

If the specification says 2.5V, you can definitely fly until 2.5V, you should start to go home at around 2.6-2.7 though. They go up a few 0.1V after rest, so they will be fine. I'll be building a Quad with these as well, I actually wanted to go with 4S2P on a 5" if 4S1P is not enough Amperage.

[@zefixx6659]

@@David-ty6my Yes you are right. But in my experience the voltagesag @3V will kick in harder. So you can go to 2.5V when you have to…

[@justinSEEPS_GEO]

I am using the same battery's in a 4S 2P and a 6S 2P, they are working great!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

That sounds awesome, I'm guessing you're doing the long-range thing, what are you actually flying? 6 or 7 inch setups, or bigger? I swear Molicel seem to be making the best Lithium Ion cells at the moment, good stuff

[@여-n8f]

LiIon batteries can be used up to a cell voltage of 2.5V (2.7V recommended) just before landing. The increased weight of the quadcopter may be a disadvantage.

[@AsgardStudios]

I really appreciate your testing methodology. I’m in the same boat. I don’t have limitless funds, so I fly rather conservatively. But I still have a great time and it looks like you do to! I look forward to seeing more of your videos. Best wishes from canada.

[@devopsrealitycheck]

hello I have a dumb question, I am new to drones and I see always drone pilots talk about voltage as a way to quantify how much storage they have on a battery, but all the places I search about the meaning of voltage, refer to it as a way to measure the force of the current that is pushing eletrons from point A to point B. Shouldn't drone pilots refer to battery capacity in Amps? As I understand the quantity of battery we have on our cells on a given moment, is (max mah) - (the already used mah) and based on the amount of voltage that is used, we are using more or less of the available mah that we have on the battery Am I saying a very dumb thing? Am I missing something?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I mean, technically batteries should be measured in Watt-hours instead of Amp-hours, if you want like actual available power, but battery voltage plays a crucial role in what spec of motor you need to get, so batteries are spec'd with the voltage (or cell count), then how many mAh it has in the tank, and then the current (C) rating to see how aggressively one can draw from it. I currently think the status quo on how we differentiate between battery configurations is pretty good, though I really don't like C rating. It's like a function of its own capacity, whereas I wish they'd just give peak current-draw numbers instead of making us have to calculate it, haha. As for determining how much power we've used, one could theoretically calculate mAh used using the voltage curve on a battery's datasheet, but then different batteries will have different curves. We could count the number of amps used assuming a correctly calibrated current sensor, but then battery capacity diminishes with use, so eventually you'll be running out of power even though your reported usage is within the battery's original spec. In the end, I think watching voltage and getting used to that is pretty good for most FPV pilots, especially ones expecting to do aggressive flying where voltage drop is something significant to consider (and the battery will bounce back up after a heavy current-draw, so there's that). A battery floating above 4 volts per cell won't have much voltage drop when doing a punch-out, but a battery at 3.8 or lower might seem to suffer more. Being able to watch that I think works out the best in this particular use case. Different for more standard cinematic drones by DJI and the like, but the batteries are all the same, they can't fly aggressively so the batteries aren't abused, the batteries have charge/discharge circuitry onboard which can probably aid in determining usage and age, so they can actually do all the fancy checks and calculations and stuff and get pretty accurate readings. We could do the same if you read the charge info on your battery charge to see how many mAh it dumped into the battery, which can tell you if the battery is losing capacity (assuming you stop flying and the voltage stabilises around the same point after you stop drawing current). But yeah, not really worth it. Not sure if that's answered anything for you? It's late here and I'm a bit sleepy after a long day of work, so maybe I went off topic, haha.

[@devopsrealitycheck]

@@STRIKINGFPV thanks for the detailed explanation, really helped me understand all the questions I had

[@STRIKINGFPV]

@@devopsrealitycheck No worries. After re-reading it the next day I'm glad I managed to be somewhat coherent in the explanation, but it's a complex topic to cover. This is I think yet another reason why it's easiest to just monitor voltage and get used to that at first. You can further build-upon your own understanding of how batteries work later on, picking up bits of knowledge here and there.

[@StraightUpRC]

WOW - amazing video - great info - and man... I am insanely jealous of that location... Such a pretty location. Would love to run RC models in general in an area like that. Very cool. I feel you on the "Full send" all-day aspect too. Small channels like us don't have that luxury early on. And your channel is going to grow easily! One day we will be up there!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

It's a gorgeous place, and still relatively quiet compared to the rest of Phuket. Good place to fly during the day, though late afternoon the locals start to do their rounds exercising so gotta' be more responsible. It's actually the first place I flew my Mavic Pro back in the day, so despite it being quite a long drive from my house, it kinda' holds a place in my heart so the drive becomes worth it. Will be cool to garner a small following, if anything to share info, teach and learn about the hobby, get some ideas and do a few crazy things maybe. I can tell you're heading down the same road on your channel, so here's to us growing (threw you a sub too, keep on rockin'). Cheers bro ✌️

[@StraightUpRC]

@@STRIKINGFPV Rock on! And I know where I will be directing anyone who comes to me with drone questions for sure haha!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

@@StraightUpRC Joshua Bardwell, right 😅? At least until I'm swimming in quads, haha 🤣!

[@VodooFeed]

Try a 4S pack with Molicel INR-18650-P28A cells. You can assemble such a pack keeping the weight at about 200g. Charge this battery pack to 4.2 V and fly it down to 2.8V. This will fit your Cinewhoop much better and increase efficiency a lot.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I might give that a go later on yeah - it's always interesting seeing what the trade-off would be in terms of required amp draw for the weight, vs the amps that the batteries are capable of providing. Would be an interesting test later-on, though maybe unfair since this 4S pack is now a year old. Still relatively young in terms of flights though, probably around ten or fifteen.

[@TheRobojay]

@@STRIKINGFPV A number that is very important is the efficiency of the motor. It usually gets more efficient the less weight you lift on top of having to lift less. So with those two working in your favor, shedding weight increases flight time considerably. I'm working on 2 hour flight quads. It's all about motor efficiency and using lithium ion. I've found that sometimes adding more batteries reduces flight time because the motor efficiency drops so much.

[@WindjumbieFPV]

this was a very clear concise test that you did, you seem very comfortable behind the camera 😅

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Oh cheers, glad you thought so (both the conciseness and my apparent comfort with the camera, which is still kinda' weird for me, haha).

[@WinWitWon]

Amazing video, what camera are you using, and what LUTs because that footage is amazing

[@gregorydahl]

Then one for goggles and tx . I get abiut 3 flights oer set of charges with no replaying video ir running batteries idling l>e it's cool or waiting around wasting electricity

[@DFEUERMAN]

Out of curiosity, I made a 6S-2P 2170 pack (crazy heavy) for a Tyro119 with an air unit powered off off the pack at 600mW vtx and flew it a couple weeks ago down to 18v (about 10-15 min) but recoils to 3.3v/20v after landing/ 20.4v during charge next day. While flying towards the end, it was struggling to stay in the air at 18v. Cells were BAK 21700 5000mAh 15A Battery N21700CG $4/cell on sale ($48 total). I had much better results with 18650 Samsung 30Q in a 6S-2P. Much more punch and flew for 25min (no air unit). The BAK C-rating is a little too low but ok for cruising and weight really is too much. 2170 might fly much better as a 6S-1P. I'm planning to use the pack on a land or water vehicle instead, eventually. (if I don't lose the quad :)

[@STRIKINGFPV]

That sounds intense, would love to build a battery like that one day, but need a quad large enough to make it viable, like a 7" LR of some description. I'm no expert, but maybe the brand also has an effect. Haven't heard of BAK, and a lot of the reading I did seemed to suggest Molicels were the way to go, certainly in terms of the kind of power draw it can manage. All batteries have some kind of curve when it comes to voltage and amp draw, such that getting closer to "empty" will also affect the amp output. Perhaps it's how the BAK cells behave outside of their basic specs that makes them not as ideal for quads. Who knows, I'm just guessing, hehe.

[@DFEUERMAN]

@@STRIKINGFPV You're right, Molicel sounds like the best way to go. I went with less expensive cells since I'm no expert as well, and I'm working on my cell-soldering skills. I rigged up a spot-welder using a harbor freight spot welder! I should do a video on it. Works pretty well on a new pack I did last night of 6S-2P Sanyo 18650s also were clearance but are low C rating, so we'll see if the Tyro likes it. Yes, my goal is LR cruising on a budget along empty beaches. Check out nickeltesla.com/files/2022-02-21-Bayville-Beach.mov

[@STRIKINGFPV]

You had me at "harbor freight spot welder," that sounds jank and awesome at the same time. The 6S-2P setup sounds promising though, I would be interested in knowing the kind of cost vs performance analysis of using higher amp cells in a 1P setup vs cheaper cells in a 2P setup. Obviously the whole weight thing is crucial, but on proper long range drones I feel like that has less of a bearing on flight time considering the efficiency of the setup overall.

[@DFEUERMAN]

@@STRIKINGFPV Yes, I think at 2170 you got a lot of weight but might be good on a VTOL or heavy-lift. VTOL more likely. I haven’t done a 1P vs 2P but I have done a 18650 15C vs 4C both 6S-2P, the 15C samsungs total 5600mAh (2800each cell) vs (4C Sanyos 4500mAh total (2250mAh each) on the 4Cs). The 15C samsungs mathematically are 24.4% more amp-hours. The 15C flew for 22 min, whereas the 4Cs can do about 17min I estimate, so maybe about 5%-10% flight time loss due to voltage sag on the 4C at just cruising. I think it helps that I’m doing a 6S pack on a Tyro119 that’s really designed for a 5S Lipo, so the voltage sag with the 4C cells isn’t too much of an issue. I guess if you go with a quad and motors designed for 5S but use cheap 6S Lions you can make a budget pack. These 4C cells only cost me $4 for 12 cells. Can’t argue with that! batteryhookup.com/products/10-pounds-of-mixed-18650-packs-60-80-cells?_pos=8&_sid=cf689f740&_ss=r I think the 2P 2170 is a bit ridiculous for the Tyro119 but I trying to now use it to power a bigger ardupilot quad I’ve been tinkering with, in which I 3D printed the frame, but the frame oscillation right now is terrible. I could be the FC is an old pixhawk 2.4.8 clone. I’m still an advanced-beginner and I may want to do some rolls during my flights, so these heavy, low C packs ain’t gonna cut it. I did feel like the 15C lions could roll (before I failsafed from a flysky receiver and the quad disappeared in a river, last year), so now I’m hesitant to try rolls and especially to fly over water, but I will return to the rivers! I would want a bit of altitude before trying to roll the 18650 6S-2P 4C pack, but really, I just want to cruise around, but it would be nice to throw one roll per flight when I’m ready :) Keep up with your videos! Great scenery and narration!

[@JaydenLawson]

Very cool. Was thinking those motors might be a little warm :) Great video - well done mate

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Haha yeah, they weren't happy, but they held-out. Those same motors are currently going into a spare-parts drone for testing my latest propeller designs, so they're going to continue to not be happy, lol. Btw, we share a last name, maybe share a distant ancestor, haha

[@xpertcrush]

I made one for myself as well, what's it's the charged amp after flight? And diff you check the capacity on charger. I discharge upto 12.8v in flight and then charged it back, it took 49.7 Watthour of charge. Technical it should be 16 * 4000 mah at least which is 64 watthour.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I honestly haven't really checked - I've approached this from a casual point of view since I'm not really an expert of any sort when it comes to quads, batteries, electronics, etc. I'm also at a point where I've used my 4S Li-Ion battery enough times that I've probably degraded its capacity from when I first shot this video, and that also doesn't take into account how long the batteries were sitting in a warehouse somewhere in Thailand. The cell serial numbers suggest manufacture a few years ago, hehe. I think we end up in the same boat as regular LiPo batteries, with people reporting their charge amperage not going quite as high as the rating suggests it should. Also one of the reasons why I don't think about this too much. I'll probably pay more attention to that in the future, certainly if I build myself another battery. Maybe a 6S, hehe.

[@GTRFPV]

Great review! I’m thinking about using Li-Ion for my Jacks Splash to get some more flight time for interior flying. I usually use 4s 1550 mah battery and was wondering what size I needed for ion battery. You just answered my question through your video. Amazing. Thanks!!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Oh so glad I could help! I have a friend also flying a Jack's Splash and it's a bit heavier than my setup, so that might affect things. If you're not as conservative as I am in terms of flight style and amp draw, maybe 18650 cells, like the Sony VTC series, might give you more flight time without as much weight as the 21700 Molicels. More testing to be done, maybe, haha.

[@GTRFPV]

@@STRIKINGFPV yea I felt the weight when I flew with the Li-Ion pack but got about 10-15 min flight out of it! Works goood. Thank you.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

That's fantastic flight time, I'm not sure what I'd do with myself with all the extra free time in the air

[@wordbyword69]

You can actually discharge to complete zero volt and revive them back and you won't notice capacity loss. Only if you leave them at 0 for long then it has effect. I once revived a 10s 18650 pack after 2 years at 200mV (forwhole pack) and It was perfectly balanced, and 86% capacity

[@jukkapekkaylitalo]

Voltage is not the biggest problem it is C rating. Most Li-ions can handle 4-5C continuous current. 20A is high, if you go higher amps 2p is must. Mostly Li-ion is used with larger probs.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

C rating is a funny measurement, I actually don't like it, but it's been in use regarding battery ratings for so long I can't escape, hehe. 20A is high for many Li-Ion cells, but I am using the Molicel P42A batteries, which I specifically chose for their 40-45A continuous discharge rating. Works for what I'm flying at the moment, and I aim to keep my amp draw lower than 30 to be safe. I like to over-spec and under-stress anything electrical. Motorcycles, on the other hand, I'm happy to under-spec and over-stress 😅.

[@divingfalconfpv4602]

Ask the 18650 & 21700 manufacturers say 2.5v minimum should bounce back to 3.0v them storage charge been told 3.7v but everyone seems to do 3.8v now for li-ion too.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I recently pushed a LiPo to its limit on the job by accident, and noticed that at a certain point, giving it gas just didn't go anywhere, like hectic voltage drop and just couldn't climb. I wonder if my Li-Ion pack will do a similar thing at a certain point. Might be a viable method of finding the safest lower voltage point.

[@divingfalconfpv4602]

@STRIKING FPV oh yeah when it gets close to 3v u need to just start cruising not punching it. It's for long range so u should be cruising back. Like my 8" I'll take off 20% thr but landing at 2.5v I'm at like 43% 🤣 (explorer lr 62%) Yea I run my lipos alot to 3.4v ish. But some quads I got to be ready at 3.6v cause after that it tanks so fast 🤣 The bounce back after being unplugged is important li-ion over 3.0v Lipo I say 3.5v but I storage charge as soon as I get home.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

@DivingFalconFPV Oh I would never punch out on a Li-Ion in normal operation anyway, just wondering if doing so at varying voltages could give better insight into voltage safety margins, more so than staring at the datasheets, anyway 😅 Speaking of, do you fly Molicels as well or prefer another brand?

[@divingfalconfpv4602]

@STRIKING FPV it let u know amps available. More it sags less amps its able to give. Also they get hot. I run a 6s4p that can give 120amps so it's not so bad. Drone does about 80a max (still sags a lot but so much better than when I did 6s1p or 6s2p)

[@STRIKINGFPV]

@@divingfalconfpv4602 6S4P wow, what are you flying that can carry such a monster battery? I know how big 6S2P can be and seen guys flying those on 7" drones, but 4P sounds huge 😅.

[@FranciscoMunoz-g3x]

Hola amigo, excelente video con las baterias Molicel, una consulta; sabes si puedo crear un pack de baterias 11.1v 4200mah para el Drone SJRC F7 4K? es un Drone casero, gracias

[@Super_Mario_Fpv]

Is that the minimum they could go? Most liions can fly to 3.0v ssfely

[@avolarstudio]

2.5v maximum

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Yes, like @fruscianting said, the lowest they'll go according to the datasheet is 2.5v, but I'm quite conservative and extra safe with my batteries so that they last longer. If someone asked me to fly as long as possible, I don't think I would even allow my battery to touch 2.7v.

[@goobisoft4873]

yesterday i also tried heavy battery 3s 4200 lipo on my 250 size quad and i got around 11 minutes of flight time was using 2205 2300 kv motor with 5154 props 3 bladed and the auw was around 900 grams sure it felt heavy but it was still flying better then my 10 inch gps drones and with the 2200 mah 3s i get around 7 minutes of flight time i think it was worth it and the motors were barely getting warm

[@RCGemblung]

you always found wonderful spots for fpv

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I try, yeah

[@michalis5817]

Can we have a video on how you made this li ion 4s pack?

[@neikhy351]

You just blew my mind with this video, can I know which drone are you flying in here ? And it's specs? Greetings from the other side of the world (Colombia - South America), keep going man!

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Glad you liked it - full specs at the time are as follows: ⯁ Reptile Cloud-149HD (slammed ducts) ⬦ Xing 1408 3600KV ⬦ Mamba DJI F405 MKII + Mamba F50 ⬦ DJI FPV Air Unit ⬦ HappyModel ES900RX (ExpressLRS 1.0 firmware) ⬦ Beidou BN-180

[@CloodyTube]

What would be the equivalent for the 6s version?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Sorry for the late reply, been super busy recently. What do you mean by equivalent for 6S? As a general reply, we've got that whole rocket equation thing going on, where more capacity = more flight time, but more capacity = more weight = less flight time, so really depends. Also, higher voltage (6S) kinda' requires less amperage to be able to spin-up the motors, so maybe the trick is to use a 6S Li-Ion at 18650 size, which'll be lighter than the 21700 (also lower amp rating). Stay on the higher KV motors, then limit the throttle in Betaflight to 0.66 to protect the motors. Hmmm, this'd be something worth testing actually, haha.

[@AlyxFPV]

why 3.4? i used 21700 6s pack safely down to 2.5 per cell and all great

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Like I said in the video, I'm super conservative with most of my batteries and want them to last as long as possible, so I don't discharge nearly as far as I really could. If I did, I'd get much much better flight times, but I think my battery capacity would likely drop faster too.

[@Shruti01K]

if i want to make lio battery like 6s 22000mah lipo battery which molicell should i use. And how it will work for hexa copter . how many parallel 6s will needed for it.

[@chestergt7765]

After a year. What's your thought on this brand of battery cell? I just came across these and am thinking about buying them over the samsung 35amps. Ill be using them in 7in freestyle 6S build.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I can't say I've used and abused them like some other commenters, but mine still do work and seemingly as advertised. In general online feedback on these seems consistent with what I've found, so yeah, I still recommend Molicel.

[@_bs5349]

Hi bro , could you please help, maybe u know about vortex immersion 250 ,i bought it few days ago ,and i am new in this hobby,can i change something on it if i want for example,to modif or what, thank you.

[@christopherconkright1317]

I believer the low voltage for lion is less than lipo

[@k1ortia]

Great video and enjoyed it till the end. But people need to realize, its a point of deminichen returns. You add the extra weight on a lighter craft and your performance is only going to be marginally different to running a lipo.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Exactly, it's the whole rocket equation thing. Add more fuel to carry the payload, but now your weight just went up because of the fuel as well. Different though in that batteries, unfortunately, don't get lighter as you use up them milliamp-hours 😅.

[@jaxonfpv]

@@STRIKINGFPV gas powered quads coming soon?

[@큐큐-f9e]

Hi~ Let me ask you a question. It's a 3 inch cine hoop. In the video, there are videos of making a pack with 4 lithium-ion 18650 batteries and flying it with an FPV long range. With excitement, I ordered batteries and made a pack. LGDBHG21865 3000mA. The problem is... When I hovered, the yaw tick symptom reappeared after it came up, and, after a few seconds, the low-voltage buzzer sounded and the aircraft sank. If I open it again, it opens again,,,,, repeat... So, I changed the low voltage warning in Beta Flight to 2.7V, and when I turned it on, there was no sound. If I take a break for a while, it will float again. But it sinks again... The battery is hot, and the voltage is 3.8V... TT I bought 40 tablets... but I can't use them all? How do people use? Batteries were also made by buying anything. Is my FC the problem? Or is there a special setting for Li-ion? FC is IFlight SucceX Mini F4 V3 Stack, and the manual says 2~6 Lipol. Do I have to use only Lipol? Can I change FC? Why is this happening? It's a waste of money/work time. I'm serious~~ Please advise.~~ TT

[@GuilhermeBarroso]

I used to fly a 3.5inch drone with 4s li-ion and get about 7min of flight. 4s2p is too heavy for a 3" in my opinion. Maybe your cells are not legit as well... A lot of fake ones on the market. Good 18650 cells tend to have about 12mohm internal resistence.

[@TheGreatExplorer]

Hey Ashton, great video and top notch color grading. Do you mind sharing what microphones are you using? Do you tune your sound, It sounded perfect 👍

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Cheers, the camera is a Sony a7III shooting in Cine4 with some random LUT I found years ago which does the teal orange thing, but I dial the LUT back and pull up some of the shadows - it's my standard colour grade, but I'm no colourist, haha. That might change if I decide to move to DaVinci Resolve, then I might start shooting in S-Log instead and see if I can up my colour game. Sound-wise I'm using a Rode Video Micro with the included deadcat to reduce wind noise. I do spend a fair bit of time doing noise reduction and compression to keep the audio levels level (lol), plus a touch of EQ for clarity since it tends to sound more muffled through the deadcat, especially at a distance.

[@TheGreatExplorer]

@@STRIKINGFPV Cool, thanks for sharing your workflow & equipment list 🙏, making a high quality video like this does take a lot of time with all the behind the scene going on, really appreciate that. Looking forward to more of your future videos 👍👍 *Will be cool if you could make some behind the scene videos of your FPV cinematic shooting in beautiful Thailand 🇹🇭 I’m sure you will get great response with video of that topic 👍

[@STRIKINGFPV]

@@TheGreatExplorer Oh I'd love to, but I recently left my full time job to have more free time and accidentally ended up with less free time 😅. I've got a bit of a break in work coming up mid-June so hopefully will be able to do some more tutorial stuff, but who knows at this point. Will see how I get on 🙃

[@ConPraesto]

Great test! It just feels like a little less weight would help by running the 18650 package?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Very possibly, but there aren't any 18650 batteries with the same amp rating and capacity as the Molicel P42A - the closest would be the P26A. That could be an interesting comparison in the future, actually, since lower weight would have a lower current requirement and lower power usage as well. For reference, the 21700 P42A is 3000mAh at 40A, and the 18650 P26A is 2600mAh at 35A. Idea for another comparison video maybe, haha.

[@غخخخخخخخخخخ]

thanks for the video , nice work , am thinking of buying a pack of 21700 for my new iFlight Nazgul5 V2 5 Inch 6S , i wonder should i use 6 or 4 batteries ? i also live in thailand , koh larn island, near battaya

[@The0nionKnight]

Like others have said, you can run these safely to 3.0V.

[@pettz18]

nice video👍🏼 this is exactly what i wanted to know. please go ahead with this channel✈️💪🏼

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I hope I can do more videos like this, but as you can see I haven't posted in a while thanks to my day job. I'm trying to find the time!

[@abidafser5]

I want to make a 4s pack with molicel p42A (4200Mah /45A )battery for my cinewhoop 3"How will the flight time and speed be? Does anyone use plz help me🙏 motor -2004 2900kv

[@prateekchauhan3104]

29:00 Ya, I know thhat feeling when I get afraid to get my camera out to film me in public....

[@STRIKINGFPV]

The struggle is real 😅

[@timserius5707]

Possibly you have to use a gopro naked or BetaFPV Insta360 SMO 4K, the sportcamera naked weigh only 37 grams. Very important!!!! use a lighter sport camera, you can go beyond 10 minutes maybe even more, I don't know the data of your drone. Very beautiful your video shots, I wish you luck for your channel on youtube. Greetings

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Yeah, like Alexander Roch also said, but I'd definitely prefer the naked GoPro option, something I plan to do in the future. At the moment the image quality is the best compared to the Insta360 stuff, but I have to muster-up the courage to do the disassembly, and find the time too. Day job has been hectic recently, so haven't had much of a chance to fly for many months already.

[@큐큐-f9e]

Thank you very much for your kind reply. My drone is Taycan 3 inch, ESC is SucceX Mini 35A V3 (Constant: 35A / Burst: 40A), motor is 3600kv. As you said, the LG battery is 20A output, so is it impossible to operate normally? Or, if I purchase the 21700 Molicel P42A you mentioned, will I have any problems? Is there any way to use the LG 18650 without throwing it away? I'm also thinking of replacing the motor, but I don't know how many kv would be appropriate. Or, if you tell us the specifications of the drone parts you have configured, we will follow suit. Even if I give up everything else, I can't give up on cinewhoop. 1. Change motor and purchase 21700 Molicel P42A. If so, how many KV? 2. Is it possible to use LG 18650 by changing only the motor? If so, how many KV? 3. Do I have to change everything except the frame to use Li-ion? So what configuration?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

The motor type is not going to make a big difference I don't think, but I have a few ideas. Do you have access to a 6S LiPo battery? I think if you run a "4S drone" on 6S batteries, the higher voltage will result in using fewer amps. Before you try this, you need to go to your PID profiles and setup a motor output limit for when you plug in 6S batteries - you can find information about this here: oscarliang.com/4s-6s-lipo-same-motors/ Anyway, if you can setup the motor output limit, then try flying with a 6S LiPo and check the amount of current you're using. If your drone uses less than 20 amps on the 6S LiPo, then I would suggest building a 6S Li-Ion from your LG batteries. If not, then the only other two options would be 3S2P, or even 4S2P, to double your amp output. I suggest 3S2P because that's a total of 6 cells, which might be okay in terms of weight, whereas 4S2P is 8 cells and will be even heavier than my 4S 21700 battery, which I don't recommend. These are the only ideas I can think of if you cannot sell or change your LG batteries for something different. In the end, if you're not quite prepared for so much testing and tinkering, I would simply try to sell what you have and stick with larger capacity LiPo batteries in the future. And please, if anyone else reading has any other ideas or advice, feel free to chime-in.

[@큐큐-f9e]

@@STRIKINGFPV Thank you very much. I'll try what you said. you are a really good friend. 👍👍👍

[@kjsj2304]

Great video bro Can you share the 3d files of the slammed propducts please

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Sorry for the late reply, here you go: www.thingiverse.com/strikingfpv/designs I think I also linked to them in my tutorial videos, in case you'd like to learn how to design your own

[@abidafser5]

I want to make a 4s pack with molicel p42A (4200Mah /45A )battery for my cinewhoop 3"How will the flight time and speed be? Does anyone use plz help me🙏 motor -2004 2900kv frame -shendrone squirt v2 with dji air unit with gopro 8 black

[@dadabooey]

Really good practical field test 👍

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Glad you think so! I was second-guessing myself at first, but I figured if it was interesting enough for me a few others would appreciate it as well :).

[@panugothuchakru2153]

My quadcopter draws less than 20 amp I want to make a li ion which cells did adviito me

[@STRIKINGFPV]

So sorry for the late reply - honestly, I'm not an expert, but if you really draw less than 20 amps then some of the Sony VTC6 or is it VTC5 batteries I think are capable of delivering that amount. There's plenty of information online, and I believe most 18650 cells that you can buy for FPV are using the Sony VTC cells, though I have also seen people use one of the LG models as well. I would avoid "no-name" brands that over-promise and under-deliver, best to stick with known good companies. For me, I believe Molicel make the best Li-Ions in both 18650 and 21700 sizes, but this is only going with the one battery I already made, and the advice available online. The issue is I believe the Molicels are getting harder to find nowadays and getting more expensive.

[@loprekira6512]

I don't have a lot of knowledge but just wanted to know that if my drone is around 2kgs with payload then to hover it around 10 mins which type of battery should I use polymer or the ion

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Not that I'd be able to calculate, but to really know what kind of battery you need we'd also need to know prop size, motor count and the overall configuration. 2KG is heavy, that's like cinelifter heavy, and I don't recall seeing anyone flying Li-Ion with a cinelifter. The amount of amps you'd have to push might be too much for any configuration of Li-Ion unless you did like a 6S3P setup in which case now the battery itself is quite heavy, adding to the issue of payload. At that point, I'd recommend sticking with extra large Li-Polymer batteries.

[@Serius-ware]

Very important!!!! use a lighter sport camera, you can go beyond 10 minutes maybe even more, I don't know the data of your drone. Very beautiful your video shots, I wish you luck for your channel on youtube. Greetings

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Oh totally, I haven't done it yet but I plan to rip up the GoPro and nakedify it, hehe, maybe add servo tilt as well. Weight savings will make a big difference, as I get much better flight times without the Gopro onboard.

[@pironiero]

Hi, im in pattaya right now, where would you recommend to buy these cells? also one more question, is it really necessary to register your drone in thailand even if im flying around empty beaches and other places where there is no other people?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Hey, sorry I've been inactive for a while now, barely check KZbin since been really busy. These cells I ordered from Lazada I think, also available on Shopee, but need to check the photos to make sure you're getting legit cells. I was a little worried the first set that I got weren't legit but a quick charge/discharge and checking the mAh on the charger confirmed that it's legit. As for drone registrations, I've actually been diving into this more seriously recently, and it seems that it's easier for us as foreigners to register FPV drones than it is for Thais, due to some quirk of the laws (aside from the DJI FPV drones which are registerable for Thais). In general, I myself and plenty others have had few run-ins with the authorities over the years so my general rule for most people is don't be irresponsible and be discreet, regardless of being registered or otherwise, and you'll probably be fine. We come across as hobbyists more than anything in the end. This being said, the potential consequences of getting caught can be very serious, depending on how lucky or unlucky you might be, so it's up to you to decide.

[@pironiero]

@@STRIKINGFPV okay, thanks)

[@큐큐-f9e]

If the drone is heavy or the motor KV is high, can it not fly due to voltage drop? Does 21700 discharge rate matter? Please tell me the detailed specifications of your aircraft. Especially the motor and aircraft weight are important. Also, what kind of product is the 21700?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Hi, I'm sorry your experiencing issues with your setup, but it's hard for me to advise much since I'm also not really an expert. First is the battery choice - I chose Molicel P42A because it's rated for up to 40 amps discharge, which is almost double that of your chosen LG battery. I'd check to see what kind of amperage your drone is using to fly, because if it's higher than 20 amps, this can be why your battery is dropping voltage so quickly and getting hot. You can see in my video that I call out the estimated amp draw and it doesn't go higher than what my battery can give, and so my voltage is also quite stable throughout the flight. If your amp draw is lower than 20 but you still get the same problem, then that suggests that something is wrong - could be the batteries themselves, if they're not genuine. Or if they are genuine, how did you build the pack? If you soldered, maybe too much heat for too long damaged the battery. If you spot-welded, what thickness nickel strips did you use, because the nickel strips also have an amp rating. If your amp draw is higher than 20, then these batteries won't work well and you'll need to consider one of two options - choose a better battery, or double-up and make a parallel pack. A a parallel pack would be like 4S2P, which would double your amp rating (in theory) up to 40 amps, which might be able to support your setup. At this point I think your next step is to check your current/amp draw to see how much power your drone is trying to use, and work out if your battery is capable of providing that kind of power or not.

[@큐큐-f9e]

@@STRIKINGFPV I'm not from an English-speaking country, so I'll go home and translate your article and read it carefully. But I'm also curious about your motor KV and drone weight. My motor is 3600kv, is it possible to lower it? And will it work if I lower the KV and install 18650 6 cells?

[@ApexCapture]

Thanks for the test! Nice video🔥

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Cheers, more tests to come I hope!

[@EpikStudioz]

Interesting test 😎

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Glad you think so!

[@Haleskinn]

try p50b and put amp limit to 60A

[@BrainDeadEngineering]

I love tests like this ! I'm test the hell out props right now . Can't get 18650 lion bats here no more . If you can there more then 20 bucks a peace . Green car movement has gobbled up them all (

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Electric stuff in general, like skateboards, solar batteries, scooters, DIY OneWheels, etc. Great to see more and more people getting into it, but yeah, becoming a battle to find the parts, hehe

[@lmapicas3279]

Not that I recommend it but I use to torture my Lipos (6S) 11.1Volt 30C back in 2015 and they would get super puffy and too hot to touch at times and dunno why it didnt burst into flames I had the odd failure but they were cheap batteries and out of the 18 or so ones I had I only lost 2 with a dead cell. Still had good voltages and current pulls the only thing that killed them was not using them for a year or more. Back then I would fly until I had no lift swap them out run the next ones and was pulling 80 Amps at one point before the meter got fried but yeah these thing can blow and when they do you never want it to happen again thats for sure...Been there blew that up :-)

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Hehe, well, one day when I've achieved unlimited wealth it'd be interesting to try flying a drone until the battery either didn't have enough juice to achieve lift, or until said battery caught fire. Will definitely mount a 360 camera to capture that absurdity 😅 Until then, my batteries shall be kept free of such abuse

[@ryanokeefe12]

6S is 22.2v.. I think you meant 3S

[@lmapicas3279]

@@ryanokeefe12 well spotted dude yeah 3S is what I was using

[@rchobbotic9658]

is all cell live because i made the same 4s pack flight is good but 3out of 4 cell are dead

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Depends how you made it, if you solder but take too long to tin the ends, the excess heat can damage the cell. Trick is to use very very high temperature and only touch it for as short a period of time as possible - I even used a damp cloth to cool the solder faster so the heat doesn't go into the cell itself. Ideally, you'd use a spot welder, but then the nickel strips themselves also have an amp limit which can hinder the overall performance. The other thing is that there are many brands of batteries that are dishonest about their ratings, and even worse there are copies of reputable brands which don't live up to the original brand's specs. I can't say what the problem is, in your case, because it depends on what brand you used, where it came from, how you built the battery pack, etc.

[@GodsHermes]

You can discharge Li-ion to 2.75 volt. This cell have 30-35 amps discharge rating.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

The official datasheet actually states 2.5 volts as discharged, and 45 amps continuous current, but of course the closer you get to these limits the more stress the battery is undergoing, which is why I try to fly conservatively, to get the battery to last longer.

[@lililililililili8667]

do you think this pack would have enough amperage to use on a 4s ultralight 5in with 600g auw battery included?

[@STRIKINGFPV]

I can't say really, but I believe I've seen configurations like that before. It kinda depends on how efficient your ultralight already is. A standard long-range drone kinda starts at the 6" prop size, 7" ideally, but I've seen some people get good results with 5" long range drones, so if you've got the efficiency going for it then a Li-Ion could work for you. Of course, efficiency is crucial because the more efficient it is, the fewer amps the whole setup will need to draw (better for Li-Ions) and obviously the increased weight from said Li-Ions won't be as big of a problem. I used to do test flights on my 6S-configured Roma F5 V2 using the same 4S Molicel P42A battery as this video, and it needed a little over half throttle to hover without a GoPro, which would've made the weight around 600g. A 6S P42A pack would've suited a lot better so as to reduce amp draw, but then a 6S would be 50% heavier than the 4S, and then I still haven't added the GoPro, so I'm not sure it would've been a good idea. Roma L5 on the other hand, being a much lighter drone at around the same size, and maybe with a naked GoPro, perhaps more likely.

[@lililililililili8667]

@@STRIKINGFPV It ended up working out great can cruise at 40-50mph and stay in the air for 19min. I set a motor output limit that kept the amps just under 45 if I do full throttle.

[@dediirawanirawan6034]

will 1S2P increase the value of C rate..??

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Basically yes - batteries in series will add up voltage, batteries in parallel will add up their amperage.

[@SavagerobFPV]

Great job keep them coming 👍✔

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Thanks - trying to scrape together the free time for more testing

[@rajeshbhati77]

thank dear done well best wishes from india

[@mahmoudelsayedshahin]

powerful content bro :)

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Appreciate it!

[@_Kevlar]

Thanks for the great video and the experience. I am a newbie and I am very interested in your experiences. I'm from Ukraine and we currently have a ban on flying drones, but I hope for the best. I happily subscribed.

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Sorry you can't get out and fly at the moment, hopefully things will change for the better sooner rather than later and you can get out there and enjoy like the rest of us.

[@danialaire]

Excelente video, gracias por compartir!!! :)

[@STRIKINGFPV]

My pleasure, glad you liked it!

[@gregorydahl]

Lipo get ruined and puff if you drain them past 3.7 v per " s cell" Lithium ion. Lio. Batteries are like power tool drill batteries expensive but can drain until it quits creeping and crawling and dying

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Yeah, that's why I'm quite conservative with Li-Po voltages, though to be fair if we drain to below 3.5 while we're flying, when we disarm and stop drawing power it sometimes bounces back up to 3.7, so it's kind of okay. Li-Ion though, rated to drop down to 2.5 which is massive, haha, but I still wouldn't recommend going that low, especially since our specific application is quite high power draw.

[@ChrisParayno]

Smood!!

[@digitalghosts4599]

There's an even more badass battery now - Molicell P45B which is 4500mAh 45A discharge and also Samsung 50S which is 50000mAh 35A discharge. I wonder how long those would last!

[@ggLP42]

nice job! very interesting

[@STRIKINGFPV]

Thanks!

[@dragosdiaconu629]

Put an naked 03 on it then u don't need a gopro, save some weight

[@LovesM855A1]

You are losing so much flight time and for what? Lipos can go much lower and it doesnt save your batteries at all! Lipos go by charge cycles NOT how low you go…… the molicells I run to 2.5 and its fine! Its a very dense batt you cant hurt em if u stay above 2.5….. geez

[@djSpinege]

when your costly digital FPV gear makes it so you can't buy batteries :(

[@STRIKINGFPV]

When your day job and other responsibilities in life limit spending and time on a fun hobby 😛

[@djSpinege]

@@STRIKINGFPV that's why i still fly analogue 😉

[@PhuckenTacoz]

Too much yapping not enough flying

[@ORLV_]

lol