Lightfastness Results after 1 Year. Roman Szmal, Jackson's, White Nights, M.Graham and more

[@barbaraconnolly9000]

I am just putting RS choices for new pallette together and was going to get Hansa Yellow medium, not now. Thanks for ghis.

[@chollatisnopwachiramasamra1516]

Thanks for your valuable lightfastness test ! Hansa Yellow Medium from Roman Szmal fades while all Hansa Yellows from other brands don't (I highly recommend Hansa Yellow Medium from Daniel Smith). Similarly, NIickel Azo Yellow from Winsor & Newton fades while that from other brands doesn't. I still don't know why some pigments fade from one brand, but the same pigments don't from others, maybe it is about where the pigments come from or how they alter them for different hue 😊 Rhondonite Genuine is a lovely pink but it will turn into brown soon due to oxidation, not UV Last but not least, Viridian + Quin Coral + French Ultramarine from D.S = the lightfast Moonglow

[@CATAZTR0PHE]

Thank you 😊 it helped me! I have Szmal's PY74 Hansa Medium too, now I know it's not lightfast! 👍

[@mikepolo2887]

Thanks a lot for sharing your results! I have my tests on a window for 2 years, 1 year, and 6 months (not too much light here in Berlin, but still), and I’m thrilled to see your PR264 being ok: I had some doubts about it, but seems ok. My PV19s from DS and Schminke have faded a tiniest bit over 2 years, but not enough to be worried.

[@morrisonwatercolors]

Fantastic video. Very informative and worth watching to the end. Thanks for sharing your results. Happy painting! :)

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks for watching. Glad you found it informative 🙏

[@ceec165]

Thank you for doing this. I bought a watercolor from a stresst artist in Prague and it completely faded. So bummed. Now I need to be aware of lightfastedness when I give a watercolor away 😅

[@ArtBrain]

The Kuretake is a lot of fun and worth trying, but only use in sketchbooks. DS Moonglow contains a red pigment that is prone to fading (escapes me the name). But it's fun to mix moonglow. Use French Ultramarine and Viridian for that nice granulation and then add some Quin Red to make the purple. Breathtaking and lightfast. I use Moonglow, but I use it as a "wine red" by mixing with an overpowering, but light-fast red. I won't buy the paint again and I'm really careful about DS paints now.

[@artbycatfitz]

Hi Teresa, Yes, the Kuretake is a great fun paint, but I don't use it on works that will be displayed. The pigment in the Moonglow that is fugitive is the PR177 anthaquinone red, my swatch of it also showed fading but not as dramatically. I love making my own mixes, often they are quite spontaneous and really are a version of "palette grey" mixed with whatever I'm currently using. I think DS is a good brand, but just very expensive here in Australia, so I'm always on the lookout for more affordable options.

[@awatercolourist]

Another informative and insightful video. Thanks, Cat!

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks for your continued support and encouragement!

[@awatercolourist]

@@artbycatfitz Your testing is very useful. You are now one of the resources that I turn to when I want to find out about the lightfastness of a paint.

[@Flampivia]

That is very interesting, nerver thought kuretake would fade that much 😱 For most of the well branded watercolors, like schminke our lokal retailer in Germany called Gerstaecker has a full catalog with swatches and all information like lightfastnes, transparency and Pigments

[@artbycatfitz]

I was a little surprised myself, I expected a bit of fading, but not that much. They are beautiful paints, but best suited to journal work, cards or work to be scanned and printed. It's worth enquiring from your local retailer if the lightfastness results are from the manufacturer or an independent test. I do wish more stores would have all of this information more readily available, especially for watercolours!

[@LCLand]

@@artbycatfitzso good to know. Thank you for doing this

[@tzerpa9446]

Thank you for this 👍

[@grannysmithart]

well done,thank you for useful info.

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks. Appreciate the support!

[@lizziequinteros5577]

Me ha encantado el video y es de gran utilidad , agradezco el tiempo que se ha tomado para realizarlo.

[@EugeniaLoli]

You should not expect any of the Magentas/Purples to stand the test of time. From all the LF1 pigments (high lightfastness) they would still be the first ones to go, given enough time. The reason is because that spectrum vibrates very fast compared to the other colors, and it barely keeps together chemically-speaking. That's why we have so few purples in nature. So don't feel bad about PV19 or a purple not holding up after, let's say, 25 years on the wall, even if indoors. It's its nature. To keep these kinds of colors for longer on a hanged painting, you'd need to use oils or acrylics, not watercolors. In these mediums, these are usually mixed with white when painted (no one really uses them in mass-tone). The mixed white color in them deflects UV light, resulting in these colors fading much slower than in the thin washes of watercolors. The reality is, watercolors need more protection than oils/acrylics. Most of the watercolors we have from old masters (most of them used them occasionally, even if they were mostly used oils), have faded. Watercolors are best kept inside protected envelopes in a drawer, away from sun, but scanned and printed for the purpose of putting them on a wall (in which case, the prints become replaceable). When printing in watercolor paper with a proper pigment ink printer, the print is almost indistinguishable from the original. There have been many cases lately with instagram artists who their buyers thought that they were sent the original by mistake! So for an artist, depending how many followers they have, it might make sense to invest in a good printer and sell prints, rather than buying too many watercolors or trying to sell originals. For artists with fewer followers, selling originals locally (e.g. portraits, pets etc) makes more sense. For those with lots of followers, prints make more sense (you make it up in volume).

[@artbycatfitz]

Hi Eugenia, Thanks for that detailed response. My lightfastness testing came from my wanting to understand the materials I used. Yes, oils and acrylics do stand up longer, but I love working with watercolours and I very much doubt anyone will be looking at my art in a museum 100 years from now. I just want to know that since I sell original art, I am making an informed choice when selecting paints for a given work. Printing on cotton paper with pigment inks has made a huge difference to the quality of prints and reproductions, but I don't have the audience to justify that expense at this stage. It is something I would love to do sometime in the future. I really love exploring and experimenting with colours and pigments and sharing my discoveries with others in the art community. Thanks again for that very detailed information, I appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge. Cat

[@PauloEAbreu]

The reasoning about "spectrum vibrates very fast" is not correct (it is also scientifically incorrect as spectrums do not vibrate, the waves that compose light do vibrate if you assume a wave description of light): reds which are on the opposite side of the spectrum and have the lowest frequency would be the most lightfast of colours, which they are not. Also something is violet because it is reflecting the colour violet, or the colours that when mixed will give the impression of violet (light mixing and not pigment mixing in this case). Scientists do have a working hypothesis on why blue is so rare in nature (See for instance the scientific paper "Fragmentary Blue: Resolving the Rarity Paradox in Flower Colors"). From the conclusions part of the paper: "Flowers did not evolve under the pressure of human color vision, so modeling pollinator vision with established techniques may provide a less biased insight into color mediated interaction between animal observers and plants that enable biotic pollination. Indeed, when considering harsh environments like high altitude in the Himalayan mountains, we observe that short wavelength blue flowers do indeed become more frequent suggesting that biotic pollination is a key factor that must always be considered in mapping flower biodiversity. " The fact that some colours are lightfast and others are not is related to their structure and we do not have a cover-all rule that explains why some are more lightfast than others.

[@artbycatfitz]

@@PauloEAbreu Thanks so much for that detailed response. The physics is a little beyond me, but I think I understand the point you are making. In some ways, I think it backs up my decision to do my own testing. Because there are no easy answers, I'll continue with testing to be more confident in my own decisions.

[@BlancaVarguesArt]

Beautiful video!

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks 🙏

[@lisathaviu1154]

I know these are expensive in Australia but you might try Qor for the PV19 ? colors that faded a lot. The reason I mention it is because of the substance Qor uses as a binder. It was first developed in the field of painting restoration so I am only guessing, but it might mean less fading. Also, I would love to know whether the Caran D’Ache Neocolor II’s are very lightfast. I am thinking of getting some because they are a bit like gouache in stick form.

[@LCLand]

I don’t know the answer to your question but I will say they are super fun to play with! I recommend

[@katpaints]

This was interesting! I started watercolors in the mid 90s and that was when the lightfast issue was becoming more known. I remember when Holbein was the only one who made Opera and because it was popular (UGH) so many others jumped up and down saying Look at US - WE have it too! It makes NO sense. I grew up looking through my mother's photo albums from the 1930s that were ruined by the acid in that black paper. The disappointment of ruined photos was real! Who is to say that something we paint won't be just as special to someone as the years go by! I have had some of my paintings framed and hung in the living room - not directly in sunlight - for the past 20 years and they really seem to be fine. I have been careful to pull those paints I've found to be a problem. I take out my Rose Madder Genuine and swatch it - and sniff it - once in a great while. It IS beautiful. Such a delicate pink with an orange cast. Sadly, substitutes aren't quite perfect.

[@artbycatfitz]

Kathleen, Thank you so much for sharing your experience and perspective. It is a great reminder that for some of us, the worth of the art is in the eyes of the beholder, not necessarily the artist. It is partially why I decided to embark on my own journey of lightfastness testing. Having a background in science, it seemed a logical thing to attempt. I have tried over my much shorter time as an artist to consider the known lightfastness of pigments before I buy, but sometimes a colour is just soo pretty. Since I also enjoy the methodical and repetitive nature of setting up and recording information like this, I thought it was worth sharing.

[@katpaints]

@@artbycatfitz I understand. :D I have bought some just to see what the fuss was about, but things are a lot more expensive now so I have held off on that kind of play! The thing that I love is seeing how things mix - how a cadmium red would chase other colors in a puddle of watercolors. I never knew that kind of fun with oils and acrylics! Some colors just react wonderfully. There is a red/pink that reacts to cobalt blue but I keep forgetting to rediscover it when my paints are out. The texture of the colors is an independent thing - cannot be forced. Makes you NEED to paint!

[@NAVYWhistleblowerAssassin]

Frugal Crafter said pretty much every Opera Rose is fugitive in every brand.

[@natlisan]

Such an informative video!!! What I've started to do with all of my work now at this point is to use a UV archival spray fix/varnish. If I have any doubts about lightfastness I rather give myself state of mind by using a UV spray.

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks for the suggestion. I have only just started trying out fixatives and varnishes on watercolour. Have you had any problems with colour shifts, like can happen with soft pastels? Also, where I am in Australia, our local art shop charges $70 for a single spray can of UV varnish! That's a very expensive experiment. Have you ever done or seen results from light fastness tests of pigments under the varnish to see if it works?

[@natlisan]

@@artbycatfitz I have not had any issues with colour shift so far! It could also depend on how heavily you apply the spray. I apply the fixative in very thin layers so...I haven't really noticed any difference. I also use cold wax medium which does tend to make your colours a bit richer, as a protective barrier.

[@artbycatfitz]

@@natlisan Thanks. I have been looking at doing this to some of my works when I mount them on wooden cradles, as an alternative to framing behind glass. Good to hear you have not had any issues. Something I'm going to keep working on.

[@LCLand]

Can you share what you’re using please? This is all good to know but sometimes I’m playing with fugitive paint and create a masterpiece! 😅 so I may,Ike to have some on hand in case I need to use on something I want to frame and hang in the house

[@natlisan]

@@LCLand I use Krylon Gallery Series UV Varnish (Matte) or Schmincke Universal Fixative which states that it's archival but not UV protective. So I would lean more to the Krylon.

[@LCLand]

Nice thing about moonglow is the reason one might use it is for a moody look and the faded is even moodier. I think the faded is prettier you can kind of see the red almost like a granulation effect

[@MrQuuze]

Is bit hard see what colours are what. i mean brands and colour names. mostly care Roman Szmal (i try get them) and White Nights becouse i know lot people use them even i dont want them.

[@jennw6809]

Yay! Lightfastness, my favorite!!! Handprint does say that unfortunately, PR 170 is not super lightfast. But what's new for reds? 🤣 PV19s are some of the best, but, they aren't 100% perfectly lightfast if hung directly in the sun. It really is the best you can do though, so don't worry about it too much. One could always treat it with a UV protectant spray or glass if one was really worried. I haven't tested myself, but I hear the Rhodonite fades a lot more than regular PV19. (I'm sure there's PV19 in it BTW!) Some feel it browns upon contact with air, sort of like a browning apple. That is fascinating about how the masstone of the PB27 faded more than the tint! I would have expected PY3 to fade more than PY74! Sad to hear that PO71 faded.

[@artbycatfitz]

Hi Jenn, Sorry I missed your comment. Yes, I was aware that some of these pigments were known to have lightfastness issues, despite the lightfastness ratings published by the manufacturers. Yes, reds are notorious for being fugitive. Kim Crick has very detailed results on her website. My testing came about out of curiosity about how different things might be in the harsher climate of the southern hemisphere. In a quirk of fate, my testing has been done in one of the wettest and coolest years we have had for years. I was very sad PO71 faded too, such a beautiful colour and I do use it quite a bit. Thanks for your feedback.

[@jennw6809]

@@artbycatfitz Thanks so much for the amazing work testing. Where I am, my tests would not be as meaningful (I still want to do some just for fun!) Oh and yes, the PO 71 breaks my heart. I love it too. I guess I blocked that out cause I didn't want to know :(

[@everartokelli]

Rhodonite doesn't have PV19 in it, it's the natural version of manganese inosilicate, but it is known to not be completely sunlightfast. Many natural minerals and gemstones like turquoise, amethyst, etc can fade in direct sunlight even as intact stones.

[@artbycatfitz]

Hi Everart, My understanding from the discussion a few years ago was that there were probably some other pigments (in addition to the stated minerals) used in the Primatek range, but DS is not required to disclose them to protect their manufacturing process. Maybe I misunderstood the controversy at the time? Thanks for sharing your knowledge about the minerals involved. I think they are a lovely range and really enjoy their granulating characteristics. Thanks

[@everartokelli]

The claim was made on one instagram post about one paint, with no evidence offered, so is total speculation that spread as fact. I've seen other artists spread speculation as fact about other brands as well, which I guess is the point of social media, but for some reason it's always surprising to me when artists do it.

[@jennw6809]

@@everartokelli It was more than one Instagram post, and there WAS evidence, proof no less. World Pigment Day, who is a pigment expert, posted microscopic photos showing definitively there were mostly synthetic pigments in some of the Primatek paints. There was a sprinkling of colorless quartz. Rhodonite was not tested. However, some of the paints that claim to take their color from certain minerals, could not possibly be made from them. Some minerals lose their color when they are ground.... this information is easily referenced. So that's one tipoff. Another is the Sleeping Beauty Turquoise. The mine is closed, the sleeping beauty specimens are very expensive, paint made from sleeping beauty would cost hundreds per tube. So that's another giveaway. Apparently when the range was released, when Daniel Smith himself was in charge, the claim was that the paints were made from 100% minerals, and they were terrible, extremely low tinting (as the Lapis still is today). Now, the claim is there is 100% genuine minerals in the paint, and the paints have high tint strength and behave mostly exactly like modern watercolors. When the pigment expert asked the company, they made the same reply - that the minerals are 100% genuine. And they acted all offended instead of having a legitimate discussion. They tried to imply the expert had no idea what they were talking about, instead of addressing that the paints were mostly synthetic pigment.

[@PauloEAbreu]

@@everartokelli Sorry but she provided evidence, the scientist in question was very forthcoming and showed her microscopy photos and explained why she did think that the paint contained only minimal quantities of the minerals. She is a published scientist working in pigment conservation issues so it is not "total speculation" as you claim to be. It is Daniel Smith that lists "Primatek Rhodonite Genuine" as having maximum lightfast in their website which according to you, it can not be true. There are some weird stuff going on with the primateks paints (like Maya Blue being listed as a primatek when it is a man made colour and their version not being as lightfast as the real thing). At the time the CEO admitted they added some other things to the Primatek paints as to mantain consistency across batches as the pigments were obtained from natural sources, but he never said what was being added. These doubts with primateks are well know for some time and you can find reports on that on the website handprint dot com and on the videos of thespindoctor on youtube.

[@elvenham1]

I noticed the hansa yellow fading in one of my tests, too, which was upsetting, but they had comparable replacements. Same with the transparent orange until I learned that there were issues with that pigment in other brands, too. (I think I replaced it with Aquarius Orange.) I've replaced the worst offending colors, and simply notated on my swatch cards the ones I did leave in (such as the genuine Van Dyke brown... irreplaceable). Those are still perfect for sketchbook/practice use! I'm needing to do another full, comprehensive test across all my brands again, so it's interesting to see other people's results. Thank you for sharing!

[@artbycatfitz]

Thanks for sharing your experience. As you saw, I was quite shocked at the result. I am glad I have other options. The oranges are a little harder, I think just being aware that it is problematic is the first step. I love that the online art community is so willing to share, so we can all learn from each other. Thanks Cat

[@everartokelli]

As far as I know, Jackson's doesn't claim that their watercolor paints are handmade, so I assume it was just a misspeak. They're made by Sennelier so are similar (probably not identical) to Sennelier artist grade watercolors.

[@artbycatfitz]

Hi Everart, Yes, sorry, I misspoke but did put up a correction onscreen rather than re-recording. I did this in a few other places too. I'll consider rerecording the voice-over in future videos if necessary. Thanks for the correction.

[@everartokelli]

Sorry I missed that, thanks for letting me know.

[@awatercolourist]

First!