The TRUTH about buying from a SAWMILL

[@Lincolnstww]

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[@cristianpopa6696]

Hello, there, have you removed some of your videos? there was one i saw couple of months ago but not able to see it anymore:(

[@brucewilliamsstudio4932]

Great interview with Matt and very informative. Thanks for sharing this content with us.

[@bretticus4]

this *totally* should become a series. fantastic premise and Matt sounds like he's got a wealth of knowledge.

[@talhakhalid2402]

Matt is incredibly knowledgeable!

[@Lincolnstww]

We will have a follow up

[@BStreet666]

As a beginner, the idea of going into anything other than a home center for lumber is super intimidating. This video was super helpful and also let me know that there's a reputable outlet in the upstate. Thanks for making it!

[@Stwarrior23]

I think for everyone it’s super intimidating, my personal experience when I went to my first lumber yard was they where extremely nice and helpful.

[@luctoulouse]

don't be intimidating, everyone started somewhere. Tips: get an app that calculates board foot price, it will help you to find within your budget.

[@jgonzo1995]

It's definitely intimidating if you aren't familiar with shopping at hardwood lumber dealers or urban mills, but you should rest assured that these are businesses and they want you to buy something. Don't be afraid to ask questions - it's almost as much in the dealer's interest that you leave with ideal boards as it is yours, because that's what creates repeat customers. Also, remind yourself that pretty much everyone in the business is the same as the rest of us - huge nerds and hobbyists at heart and they're probably excited to help out a new woodworker to get deeper into the hobby.

[@guapsbull]

I totally get what you are saying, and i felt the same way. But I had the opposite experience when I finally went to a real lumber store. People there were super cool, super helpful, and went above and beyond to help me figure out what to do/buy. It's a place where they love woodworkers, and I like people who like woodworkers. The home improvement store is a big chain retail store. Most lumber stores are small businesses that make their money because they give good service. Go try it.

[@jayp6990]

Matt with 731 Woodworking has a nice video where he interviews a hardwood dealer & feelings of intimidation was a big topic.

[@AKdesignsandhardwoods]

As an owner and operator of my urban salvage lumber company, this video is a damn good break down of what to look out for. Props for keeping it right to the point in a timely fashion as I talk with a lot of customers and now will just send them this link to save me time. Maybe I’ll have a TV in the show room with this video on repeat lol

[@carlosreira2189]

Hey, I'm interested in your business. Do you take logs from arborists and home owners or how do you obtain the wood. Is it reclaimed from building, all of the above. And how do you sell it. The waste around my hometown and all over is so insane. In fact the better the tree the more likely it will make firewood as the diameter is too big for long lengths.

[@AKdesignsandhardwoods]

@@carlosreira2189 I get trees from all the above and land clearing companies. Cheaper and easier to drop them off here especially the larger one. I reach out to as many people as possible and now have good group that just drop off logs and I pay. They know what I am after so I trust them and have been reimbursed if the load wasn’t the best.

[@carlosreira2189]

@@AKdesignsandhardwoods And what kind of rig and who is your typical buyer? It's smart what you're doing. It's the future. Every municipality and county should do it. A couple of men, a sawmill, some volunteer at risk youth and put them to work learning something rewarding. Money grows on trees!

[@AKdesignsandhardwoods]

@@carlosreira2189 I would shy away from getting any volunteers around. Logs are heavy and it is a lot of work. One false move and someone is going to get hurt who Dosent know better. Plus insurance wouldn’t like it. I get everything delivered for 220$ a load. I run a portable bandsawmill that can cut 36in wide and handle a log up to 40in wide. I also have an Alaskan mill with an 8ft bar. Believe it or not everything is moved by hand. We are looking to sell our house and find a house with property and a shop. I’m in a very unique situation as all my neighbors love me I live almost in the heart of Tacoma right up the road from the Tacoma Dome and all the logs are dropped around my house since I’m on a corner lot and I have to mail them fairly quickly my entire backyard and side yard is nothing but stickered and stacked lumber. I own two lots so it’s wider than a normal property is in Tacoma especially inner-city. Most of my buyers are anybody getting into woodworking as well as quite a few people who do woodworking as a profession. I have recently gotten three full restaurant bids as I do everything from standing tree to fully finished Piece of furniture so I would be considered fully vertically integrated so there’s no cost to mark up on anything as I also downed trees and used to be an arborist when I was a little bit younger at the age of 16 so through that I met quite a few people already had connections on getting logs.

[@carlosreira2189]

@@AKdesignsandhardwoods Ok, thanks for that reply. I'm sure you all get some big softwoods around there. I'm East Coast and it's trees everywhere, all wasted to make "firewood," even walnut. I know bros with mills but they already have 10 lifetimes worth and woodworking is a hard go economically. So not many buyers. Lots of machinery needed to do large work. I've done it. You burn more kilowatts than a small city. My thinking is go small. The young don't need to make a mortgage and all that. If they beat minimum wage they're doing good. Wayfair and Ikea are the competition not other artisans. As for the risk, Baltimore is way more likely to kill you. Tree work is done by money grubbing arborists who are lucky to find a qualified climber. The hardest job by far is finding a place to dump. Latinos are starting to do it all these days, and they work well, pretty safe. They have no idea about our North American woods. If you tell them that this is worth more than "caoba" (mahogany) then their eyes light up. Blessings of continued success to you!

[@Metal_Vistas]

Matt is a natural. The camera likes him, and he should consider a KZbin channel for marketing... in my opinion. I have worked at a lumber mill, exotic wood retailers and as a woodworker for many years, so I knew pretty much everything in this video, yet I still found it entertaining and enjoyable to watch. That's a really good sign!

[@Lincolnstww]

You will see Matt on YT soon enough

[@patty109109]

Yeah I had the same impression. Seemed like a guy who’s been doing it forever. People will watch a channel about a saw mill.

[@TGravy-wp4rc]

🤣

[@SeeburgMusic]

@@patty109109 No they won't.

[@jerbear7952]

Yeah we will

[@HyperactiveNeuron]

I would definitely like more about different wood species and when you might use them. This was a great segment and Matt was the perfect guest. He reminds me of the guy that runs a local sawmill here. Awesome image and staff.

[@Lincolnstww]

We are planning a follow up!

[@clearcut6818]

Walnuts are black, maples are white, cherry and oak are red, birch and hickory are yellow, poplar is piss green.

[@bmiller1958]

Agree that your guest was awesome!

[@bank80]

@@Lincolnstww Follow-up? Matt's about to make his own KZbin channel and you'll be his guess this time.

[@Smokeyr67]

@@clearcut6818 If your piss is green, you might not to see your Doctor😳

[@DanGarrettBlueGrass]

The wind blew over a large oak tree in my yard, being an amateur woodworker the idea of having a large load of oak literally fall into my lap was pretty cool. I was happy to learn Matt's shop was just a few miles from me. In short order, he had had the lumber milled for me. Very easy to work with.

[@rbzbreezy]

Dude, your content is on point. As a noob woodworker with hardwoods this video brings together all the questions I have about hardwoods. I don't care if it takes several months for your new content, it is exceptional.

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks!

[@csbarbourv]

That was one of the most informative videos I’ve ever watched. Very helpful and great presentation. I would definitely encourage you two to continue this collaboration!

[@darodes]

I was thinking the same thing… the guy has great video presence and they seemed to mesh very well

[@ilive4livemusic]

I totally agree. Super well done

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks Charles - I'm sure we will do a follow up

[@clearcut6818]

@@Lincolnstww He actually should start his own channel.

[@NoahHayes]

Your videos are so great. They’re focused, funny, and offer great tips without coming off as “the only expert on the internet” like so many other people do!

[@marcomontpetit4635]

This is one of the most informative woodworks videos I have watched. Thank you for putting this out!

[@whatever_12]

You 2 got a synergy that goes so well together.. Please do make some more vid with him or maybe try talking him into a YT channel on the lumber side of things

[@Lincolnstww]

We will be making more vids! If Matt doesnt wise up and realize he should have his own channel ;)

[@josephmiller997]

@@Lincolnstww Matt is a complete natural. He was funny and very engaging.

[@laurencool9926]

Thank you so much for making this. I was so nervous going anywhere but a big box store for lumber because I’m not an experienced woodworker. I hope all mill owners are as friendly as Matt.

[@Dave5843-d9m]

Big box lumbar is generally suitable for framing. If you are careful pick out the good sticks. Otherwise it’s expensive with poof choice.

[@dancoleman1269]

First, thank you John. If it weren't for you, I would not have learned about Matt or M2 Lumber in Laurens, SC. I live in Tennessee, near Nashville, and paid a visit to M2 today. Matt treated me like family. He was busy, but gave me all the time I needed. He helped me select some great pieces and introduced me to some species for my projects that I had not yet considered. In the end, Matt made sure that I got what I needed and he saved me money in the process. I bought more wood than I expected. I am extremely pleased that I met him and can't wait to get back to Tenn with my lumber. Thanks again for this great video. You are doing the woodworking community a great service. Keep up the good work and consider making a series about what each species is best suited for. Blessings!!

[@FearsomeWarrior]

I’d love an extensive multi-part guide to all the wood. Especially going through easiest to find, or lowest cost, to most difficult to find, expensive. Something that speaks to project size/mass and how well it does with stain/finish. How it cuts. How bad is I to snort the dust. Curious how well it works as a table top, shelving, or wide flat boards. And how it turns... on a lathe.

[@Lincolnstww]

We've been talking about something like that - you have a lot of great ideas I hadn't thought of. Thanks

[@segamble1679]

Tons of good ideas here! It would be a lot of work, but setting up a number of fixed "experiments" and then going through them on each kind of wood would be cool. Make common joints out of them, see how easy it is. Try out a few different finishes and show the difference. Show some simple tests that demonstrate strength, weathering, warp/cupping, etc. You could just tell us all the things, but it would be way cooler to see them all in action. Oooh, and then maybe a project that plays to the strengths of each particular species. That would be a cool cross-over with other channels, either with projects they already have posted, or as an idea for fresh content. I'm full of good ideas!

[@segamble1679]

@@Lincolnstww Tons of good ideas here! It would be a lot of work, but setting up a number of fixed "experiments" and then going through them on each kind of wood would be cool. Make common joints out of them, see how easy it is. Try out a few different finishes and show the difference. Show some simple tests that demonstrate strength, weathering, warp/cupping, etc. You could just tell us all the things, but it would be way cooler to see them all in action. Oooh, and then maybe a project that plays to the strengths of each particular species. That would be a cool cross-over with other channels, either with projects they already have posted, or as an idea for fresh content. I'm full of good ideas!

[@keatonbeyerwoodworking]

I usually go to a hardwood distributer but this video inspired me to go to a mill. Contacted a local one with listed prices 10-20% lower than where I usually go and I'm heading there tomorrow. Thanks for the inspiration!

[@rtgray7]

Love this! Hope for part 2... I would love a video on choosing different wood species for projects.

[@cliffgroce1492]

One thing I wish I knew earlier on was that most local hardwood dealers or sawmills have full shops with the larger machines that they will rent out for you. Also, that you can save money by requesting they just do S2S as well.

[@richardlee2488]

I have over thirty years running both a sawmill and planing mill and were always willing to help our customers with whatever they needed. We had machines that were built to do the work which even joinery workshops could not justify. We would offer timber processing to any level needed and even the best equipped could see they saved money purely by reducing the labour they would have to put in with undersized machines.

[@markp6062]

Good stuff! Thanks so much for taking time to explain the ups and downs of buying from a small firm! I would love to see a series on different wood breeds and their uses!

[@Lincolnstww]

You got it!

[@Firedog-ny3cq]

You two are the Abbott and Costello of the rough-cut lumber world. I highly urge you to collaborate much more often. That was a great presentation. Liked and subbed without hesitation.

[@jeffkuykendall2028]

Dude this video is legit!I love the format... the humor.... the pace.... just an overall awesome KZbin video! Please rinse and repeat! Go M2M!

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks Jeff

[@kellyb7321]

Thank you so much for putting together this video. I want to go to a sawmill for lumber soon but have no idea what I'm getting into or what questions to ask. I feel much more informed now and a little more confident. No one wants to get taken for a sucker.

[@VinceBlas]

Speaking as a beginner/aspiring woodworker (who has been devouring your videos!) I would *love* a video or series comparing pros/cons of various wood species

[@WillN2Go1]

Good video. You make a great argument for finding a good small sawmill and paying them whatever they want. I've only made a few pieces of furniture in my life and these will long outlive me or my grandchildren -- so getting the best possible wood is well worth whatever it takes or costs. (The best matched wood I've ever seen was in a desk made by a ships carpenter 'on the beach'. The desk is in the royal palace in Hilo, Hawaii. If you've ever used a block plane and you get close to Hawaii you owe it to yourself to find this piece. Clearly a labor of love.) I live in Los Angeles, right now about 36% humidity - so desert but not quite. My breadboard ends do move. They tend to work in one direction so about every 2-3 years I'll tap the ends back towards the center. The movement of course is changes in moisture which surprised me in this part of the desert. A number of years ago I bought a large cedar beam to build a strip kayak. I let the yard rip it for me. I'd done all the algebra to figure out saw blade thickness , best possible results, but letting the lumberyard do it... I wasn't going to be a jerk so I didn't even mention my calcs. Then I picked up my wood. This tiny little round clump. I was in shock. What happened? Then I started counting. The yard guy was every bit as efficient as my best calcs. What I finally realized was a big flat slab looks a lot bigger than the resulting bundle. This is why cereal comes in big rectangular slab boxes instead of cubes. White cedar which is probably only northwest and Canada. I bought a pile of this from my local lumberyard. It looked like pretzels it was so warped. However, I built a deck and an outdoor table with it. Very tame, laid right down. It's been flat ever since -- almost 30 years. It's really hard to find because it looks like a stack of 2x lumber that is seriously wrong. After I bought out my local lumberyard's supply they never stocked it again.

[@WoodcraftBySuman]

Matt lets me drive his tractor. Just saying...

[@m2lumber]

Dude, I thought we agreed to keep that between us!?

[@arnoldpadgett1975]

Lol

[@trappedinroom1014]

😂

[@michaelshelnutt3534]

Lol

[@ZetaReticulian]

Oh…. I’m sure he does 😉

[@stevecorcoran9869]

Great knowledge for those looking to use wood for fine woodworking projects. For farm outbuildings, we pretty much ignore most of this as, first, there is no mill nearby with vacuum kilns and, second, farm outbuildings here in the FL panhandle are normally board & batten so the shrinkage is allowed for. Since building wood here is pretty much all southern yellow pine, it actually shrinks much less than I would expect. We have been doing outbuildings here for over 20 years and never had a bug issue yet.

[@davidewing1779]

I love the educational aspect of all of your vids! I would love a video breaking down the types of lumber and where to use. Thanks!

[@wackojacko1997]

That was fun. Well done. Fast, with some nice edits included, dense on information, and the Abbott & Costello routine went great. Quite good.

[@needstacos4892]

I went to my first hardwood dealer the other day. They were really nice and took the time to explain board feet etc.

[@studio9400]

Just getting started here buying wood from something other than a box store. It is a tad intimidating. Figuring board ft and worrying about how much money is spent on waste. That being said it sure is nice having more options than Red Oak and Pine! :). I need to find a place like Matt's here in Iowa. Thanks for another great video.

[@AlejandroGonzalez-eo3ne]

This is one of your best videos!!! Very informative and Matt was a trip!

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks!

[@bjsmithart]

Perfect timing! I'm going to a sawmill Friday to pick up some cherry for a table project. Thanks for this info

[@justinb1382]

A wood species video covering the pros and cons of each species would be awesome!

[@wm.perrykillam4243]

I love the idea of urban tree lumber. Here in Atlanta we have several options of local sawmills, and I try to go there first as a matter of principle. Great episode. Thanks

[@CLove511]

Absolutely thrilled by this. I moved near Laurens and have been looking for a lumber supplier, so I'll check it out!

[@andrewsanders5774]

Definitely do that!! I've bought a few slabs from him over the last few years

[@skywatcherca]

Please, always with respect: I do not know your market, but up north, the material you call waste, is sold as firewood (sometimes called slab wood), and I am sure you have heard of a machine called a 'finger joint(er),' which takes short lengths of lumber and finger joints (combined with glue of course, in the finger joint) the material into longer lengths, such as 16' lengths, and this is, in turn, turned into paint grade trim/moldings. The machine which turns square stock - whether finger jointed or regular solid lengths, goes by a myriad of names, such as 8 to 12-head routers, sticker machines, and trimmers, but this also is a major component of the lumber industry. Trims of all sizes, and shapes are extremely important to the building/construction industry, which also includes trims made of softwoods and hardwoods. This video is wonderful and filled with accurate, honest data: anyone who is new or seasoned to the lumber industry, should consider watching this video. Thank you, gentlemen.

[@robinleebraun7739]

my experience is that by the time you purchase the rough wood at the sawmill, have it planed so it is flat, jointed so it has at least one true edge, and thicknessed for use, (assuming you don't have several thousand dollars worth of jointers, thickness planers and large drum sanders), you pay every bit as much as you would at the home center. You will have a better selection, though. I buy small scraps from the mill. I have tools that can deal with the smaller dimensions. And sometimes scraps are incredible inexpensive.

[@brooksbrooks6805]

My solution was to be hired by a mill and then get promoted to their woodshop 😂 all their resourses are now at my disposal ecery day. Im so thankful for my current situation and incredibly priveledged and lucky

[@totallynotawizard]

I got more quality information from this video than 4 other I watched first, thanks for putting together something so clear and concise!

[@andersonolive4553]

100% would love to see a species breakdown. This was a great video. A lot of great information to help me connect the dots as a beginning woodworker. Love your content, thanks as always!

[@ClashDoE]

Super glad this video hit my recommendations. I’ve often looked for a breakdown like this and could never find it. Thanks for the great work.

[@YoungbloodFamilyFarm]

I teach High School Woodworking and have a great relationship with a local Kiln facility. They sell to us by the pallet (we use around 4000 bdft a school year), but they also sell by the board to the public. It may be helpful if someone is having a difficult time finding kiln dried wood, it maybe helpful to preach out to your local High School Woodshop. I would not sell my my shop but I would aim someone to my vendor.

[@Lincolnstww]

Great suggestion

[@GeeZeRFroG]

I'm liking the new direction of the channel! Great video, very informative!

[@rickbratto6167]

I always enjoy (and learn) from each of your productions. I especially liked this one, very informative, and here in lower Michigan (Detroit area) I will now look for local sources. I typically have just made purchases from Woodcraft, because, we’ll just because. Your partner in the video was also terrific. Thank you to the both of you!

[@Lincolnstww]

excellent

[@jgdeyo]

Thank you for your honest approach it is so refreshing , I really enjoy your videos. One comment there is a wood working school near me I have taken classes at, some of the best wood workers in the country are guest instructors there. The hand tool only guys there tell me they will not work with kiln dried wood. I'm not sure why I believe it may be more prone to break out when working near an edge with tools like chisels and hand planes and may split easier. Here in the Pacific Northwest there are a lot of one man saw Mills and I don't know of any that have kilns. For many years the lumber yard I buy dimensional lumber from sold green fir as well as kiln dried (KD). I found the green fir would not split when toe nailing. From the reading I have done they say that over time (laid up in the lumber yard) green wood and KD would will reach the same moisture content (makes sense) of course depending on weather this might be 6 month.

[@markkuneman7820]

By far the best video I have seen covering the in's and out's of a sawmill. Absolutely loved it. Now all I want to do is travel across the US to visit M2 Lumber.

[@m2lumber]

Come on man! I’ll buy you a beer!

[@Lincolnstww]

Go for it!

[@DavidB-tj3rj]

I’ve learned the lesson about asking a local mill to “prove it” about moisture content the hard way. So true to watch out for a “guy with a saw” on marketplace as well. The guy I go to in upstate New York is super. I always plan an extra hour to the trip as he is always showing me something new he is doing or wants me to see. I didn’t drive the tractor but I did get to drive the forklift to dig through the pile

[@horatiobeaker]

Another great video. Who were those two actors you hired to play the wood guys? Is the actor on the left related to Clint Eastwood? Seriously, a ton of useful information, concisely delivered in a light-hearted Dan Ackroyd sort of way. I'll end it here because I don't want you too spend an inordinate amount of time re-reading your review--just make more videos. Also, it would be very helpful if you threw in a comment that we could share with our wives about how practical it really is for us to buy lots of expensive tools and stuff because it in the end it all benefits children and small animals, and of course helps bring about world peace.

[@ilive4livemusic]

“Comment that we could share with our wives about how practical it really is for us to buy lots of expensive tools”- I love it! And yes, that would indeed be a huge public service and likely his most watched video. 😂

[@n40tom]

I think you may want to visit an optometrist very soon.

[@ma2zak589]

A breakdown on what wood to use for what would be really helpful, I like how you keep videos fun while packing a ton of knowledge.

[@sportstertaco]

I think this is the best information I have heard regarding sawmills and lumber. Great job and hilarious video.

[@simoncra29]

Dude I've watched this video over and over, I'm not in the US but loved the production so much that I watch it again and again

[@alexistaylor969]

It is called a sticker because orignally: It was just sticks, and you lift the board and stick em right on in there. There was a carpentry service that would make equal sized sticks just for stacking wood to help prevent warping as it dried.

[@40Figs]

This was SO helpful! I've always been intimidated to buy from a lumber yard but now that we're gearing up to start our backyard deck, we quickly realized Home Depot wood is just not gonna cut it. This video definitely shed some light on the whole process. Thanks for sharing!

[@makenchips]

Excellent high level overview good job kept me engaged all the way through and lots of good points! Been nice tohave a tips sheet or a checkbox sheet that goes through all the point. I have to go back to the video and make one! I would love to deal with my local mill but nervous if I'm being over charge as you stated!! You guys did a great job and I like the fact that he's saving trees like that it's a shame that any wood gets burnt or tossed away into a landfill shameful use of resources!

[@Lincolnstww]

Glad it was helpful!

[@JasonJones-br3or]

Very good video! Having lived in South Carolina, one thing I would recommend is when it comes to trades/contractors out there, be reasonable, yet cautious, with the ' locals'; they play lots of games... especially the closer you get to the coast. More often than not, we were better off swallowing the shipping, and getting materials elsewhere, such as Penn., or farther north, or simply just going to the box-store, depending on the work.

[@m2lumber]

If someone is playing games with you, then I agree you should not give them your business!

[@tonysworkshop3379]

I'm now planning a trip to Laurens. Great video as always. You two need to collaborate on more in the future.

[@Lincolnstww]

You will be glad you made the trip, we are planning on more videos!

[@andrewhochberger8748]

Probably the most informative woodworking KZbin video I’ve ever seen. Imagine that, someone educating us woodworkers on… wood! Love your channel. If only Kenobi was as entertaining as LSW!

[@andyliu9158]

Really good video, informative and educational. i would love to see more of this type of content. Maybe a series of one particular subject, say chisel's. differences between western and eastern, good buying choices, sharpening and maintaining and basic usage. im saying this because im about to get my first set of them lol either way great video and keep up the good work !!

[@karl_alan]

I've been buying from hardwood dealers for about a decade & local mills for years. This is one of the most comprehensive videos I have seen on the subject. Wish I'd had it years ago. Only thing it's missing is stating that another benefit of local mills is you might find some of the most beautiful wood. Oftentimes I have found locals look for particularly interesting logs that yield really figured, beautiful boards.

[@m2lumber]

Thanks Karl! Yeah we definitely specialize in beautiful wood cuts and logs. I thought we mentioned that but I guess didn’t stress it enough.

[@pedullastudio]

Another awesome video man! Well done!

[@twistedlimb4053]

came here to say that

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks Nick!

[@FirstFruitsDesignCo]

Great information. And yes, lumber here in the desert is expensive.

[@Erik_The_Viking]

Very informational video! This will definitely be helpful for me, as going to the hardwood dealer (aka. a "real" lumber store) can be somewhat intimidating. I would like to learn more about types of wood for certain types of projects. I've never thought about using white oak for outdoor projects - good to know.

[@Lincolnstww]

White oak is an all-around great option. Sadly, getting really expensive as its become really popular recently

[@Erik_The_Viking]

@@Lincolnstww Good to know - thanks!

[@avap2677]

Fun ,and thanks . I'm from the Netherlands and we sell and prepare only about 200 year old wood from old buildings from east Europe and we love it !

[@hale_yeah_texas]

This is a ridiculously fantastic video.

[@oceanmariner]

I built and rebuilt wood boats and found local sawmills could supply much better lumber than any of the lumber retailers. At a retailer, if I need a 2x4, I buy a 2x12. If I'm lucky I get 2 2x4s, but usually 1 and some firewood. Custom sawmills can give you exactly what you need. The best ones will dry and plane. Even better, I let them know far in advance of any new builds or replanking and the wood is ready to use when I need it. It costs more but saves many hours. I'm on the Oregon coast so mostly use fir.

[@threesonsrestorations4043]

Thanks for the video! Apart from asking the help, is there an easy way to trust but verify whether I'm looking at air-dried vs kiln-dried wood on my own? I understand the difference can matter when it comes to appearance in some species (e.g., walnut).

[@m2lumber]

That’s a good point!! Specifically, walnut will mainly look different only when it is Steamed! Large industrial kilns will often steam walnut and it has nothing to do with better quality and more to do with money!! They steam it so that the heartwood blends with the sapwood and they can provide a “more consistent color” but also so they can sell you a bunch of sapwood lol. I’ve seen commercial produced walnut with up to 80% sapwood per board-face!? Again, I would ask them to measure the moisture in front of you if you’re suspicious…and don’t let them measure from end grain and if it is a thick slab, make sure they’re using a meter that can measure in the center of the board. With enough experience you’ll be able to tell if wood is kiln dried just by the feel and weight of it.

[@threesonsrestorations4043]

@@m2lumber Thanks for your reply and advice!

[@richardlee2488]

Buy yourself a moisture meter. Some have probes which may upset the seller but there are also non invasive metres that you just hold on the surface. Be aware that kiln dried may not be any better for you than airdried. It depends on the specifications and how you want to use it. Your location can also have a major impact on your moisture content needs. In Europe 11% is the norm but in california this could need to be 6%. It's the relative humidity of the area and the equilibrium moisture content of the timber.

[@dontfit6380]

@@m2lumber you don’t have to steam the lumber to bleed the color to the sap wood. Just let the log sit. It’ll bleed.

[@kingofcastlechaos]

This is the video that got my subscription. Been in this business almost 50 yrs and always made certain apprentices were on their best behavior around the sawmill folks- just like pissing off a waiter can get you crappy food, offending a sawmill operator will keep you in BORING material forever. But if you show up with fresh cookies and polite apprentices you will leave that place with GOLD. Smart man not letting you run the tractor. lol

[@byronboniface]

This is a fantastic video with excellent info. If you have the opportunity to collaborate with M2 Lumber again, I would love to see more! Thanks!

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks. Glad you enjoyed it. We will do something again for sure

[@karl_alan]

That wood species thing makes a lot of sense. I have long thought walnut is priced stupid...it's roughly 3-4 times the cost of maple or even sepele where I am...and given the choice, I'd go with sepele. Looking at your graph though, I'm not in a walnut region.

[@BMSculptures]

super informative. I learned a lot.

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks Blake!

[@dougschack9341]

When I need a hood laugh, Lincoln Street doesn’t disappoint 🤣. Keep up the good work man!

[@UhYeahWhateverDude]

It’s just a theory, but… The difference between “dunnage” and “stickers” to me, as a long time flatbedder, depends on the size and use. Dunnage is typically larger and is reused to keep everything off of the deck regardless of what it is. It typically spans the width of the trailer and is retained. Stickers are typically smaller and are cut to length to match the product. The biggest characteristic though is that they are often banded together with the product, and…’stuck’ to it. That way the entire bundle can be moved numerous times without constantly having to move ‘dunnage’ underneath.

[@monkeyboysworkshop]

Loved this video dude! It’s interesting to hear any differences between the states and over here in the UK 🤙🏻

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks Sam

[@Not3xactly]

This was excellent. Great job fellas. I'm just getting started and just made my first purchase from a hardwood dealer, the first time not getting stuff at a big box, and was super intimidated but had a great experience. Videos like this are really helpful to noobs like me

[@Split1431174]

Thank you for this video. I am local woodworker that has been following you for a while now and I am in Greer SC. Thanks to that Video I know know of a new place that I can get wood from.

[@Lincolnstww]

Glad to help

[@TheWoodFly]

I am not a beginner - been to my local dealers, outlet and sawmills. THIS IS THE BEST VIDEO EVER for discussing how one should handle this. One additional thing to discuss is S4S boards don't come in pre-packaged 5.5" or 7.5" - they are random. So you walk in thinking "I need 5 @ 5.5" wide" and convert that to "They have a 10.5" wide which replaces two and I can joint these 4" boards together etc." "Plastic persuasion" was priceless (see what I did there?) Damn kid, you have a future here. Funny, simple, straightforward, and your partner in crime here is also VERY good on camera. Total Keepeer! Oh, a mention about bugs. My house burned in 2017 (along with 6500 of my neighbors in NorCal). Lost 26 trees on the property. Turn lemons into lemonade right? So hired a portable mill, cut, stickered dried for 2 years. House rebuilt, build kitchen slab table awesome (!?). Nope. house warms up and out come the bugs from the "natural edge". Put on the paint on treatments - they lap it up. So ended up cutting "natural edge" off, reshaping table etc. Could have avoided with a little Kiln drying, but didn't have access. SO KD IS VERY IMPORTANT if you don't want to bring the bugs into your home.

[@Lincolnstww]

Sorry to hear about the wildfires. Appreciate the kind words

[@braincraven]

The eye roll by Matt at 3:30 regarding lumber pricing by other mills is priceless

[@brianbahn5411]

Outstanding! Great information and great delivery again. One thing I was wondering if you would bring up is the ability to "pick through" the lumber. I saw a local place in my area specifically say you are NOT ALLOWED to pick through the lumber. You get what you get. Uhhhhh, no thanks then.

[@m2lumber]

Most larger mills will have statements like this and it’s because they want to sell in mostly bulk/packs and they of course don’t want to be left with lower quality boards…

[@mattfleming86]

I can kind of see their point. However if that is the policy the price needs to be adjusted appropriately and i'm sure as shit going to be going through it all to determine percent rejects.

[@tmiklos4]

We restore antique boats . Air dried wood is preferred... Especially for wood that gets bent. And twisted. We use 2x2 clear white oak. Anywhere from 15 to 25% moisture works well.

[@soujrnr]

This video is just plain outstanding!! I learned a whole bunch that I never knew before. There are three or four sawmills near my house and so I'm looking forward to going to check them out to see what I can see and perhaps find a better source for lumber than Blowe's or Home Despot. Their lumber SUCKS. Most of the 2x4s I get at either store would make Robin Hood jealous, were he making a new bow for his arrows. Looking forward to more great videos from you, boss!! Thanks for all you do!

[@jgonzo1995]

Resolve to never again buy any lumber at a big box store. It's overpriced and terrible quality. Even if you need construction lumber for a construction project, you're better off supporting a local lumber yard, who will have an interest in delivering the best quality boards at the most reasonable price, because that's what gets contractors coming back and placing large orders. Also, I just checked, and so-called whitewood 2x4s are going for $4.48 at big boxes in my area - that's $1.28/bdft for the softest, most crooked junk on the planet (and that price is WAY down from what it was a month or two ago)!!!!

[@elicoon]

This is an awesome video with tons of great knowledge we wouldn't otherwise get. Thanks for the high quality content!

[@NotATrainedProfessional]

This is the best, most informative, most valuable, wood procurement video I've ever seen - thank you!

[@Lincolnstww]

🙌

[@davidbriscoe822]

You guys are just absolutely the best! Clear, articulate, thorough, zero ego bs, VERY informative....BUT...zero stars for not being in northern Wisconsin!!!!😜

[@odbo_One]

I am 50 years old, just started woodworking. I am interested in wide ranges of products like chests, cabinets, tables and more. I am figuring out wood type pros and cons, drying times, and more. Thanks for this video.

[@Mr.GucciClass1A]

Class act!!! I’ve said it before and I’ll repeat it again: What you provide in your channel is Content with a purpose, that is intentional, informative, instructional, well executed, concise, fun, and entertaining. You and Matt both feed off each-other in style and I just love it!!!! 👍🏽 Kudos!!! PS: I like both shirts, but.. Matt’s tapered style shirt shape wins this round. 🤩

[@Lincolnstww]

Thanks bud! hope you're doing well

[@markgambalie7378]

Can't wait for your follow up video on wood species and uses but a quick question in the meantime -- why is walnut a poor choice for outdoor projects?

[@xIChaosReaperIx]

Another tip for the pricing, ask to see a copy of this week's HMR, or hardwood market report, (I think there is a softwood version too, I'm not sure. I'm a Appalachian Hardwood grader) it's a weekly report that a lot of mills receive as a guide to what the fair market price is. It isn't generally available to the public, as you have to be a sawmill owner and pay for a subscription.

[@camojoe83]

Lol! What, you think the sawmill cares if the guy with a pickup truck knows market value? Hahah! They're going to charge you what they're going to charge you no matter what paper you look at. The conversation goes: "Well i know what that's worth because i looked today, so..." "Yeah? Well we charge this, take it or get the fuck out of the way of the semi."

[@thomasbacon]

Once there were two lawyers arguing about where to put the stickers in the pile. They just kept yelling back and forth "stick her there!" The apprentice was watching and next time they stacked lumber he said where do you want the sticker. And hence forth it was called a sticker.

[@oliverworley5162]

I'd love to go to a hardwood dealer or a sawmill, but you kinda need space, and as a 19 year old still living with family, you need something that can fit in 1/3 of a shed you comendeered from your garden supplies. Let alone the tools to cut them to size. That's why when making even small things like pens, I'm buying the blanks straight up. When I get a full shed for myself, this will changes. I swear mum it will change

[@Lincolnstww]

We all start somewhere. I worked out of a shed for years, we make do with what we have!

[@winterfar2814]

I build with green wood that I mill all the time. Timber framers and log cabin builders also build with green lumber especially on-site cut-mill-build scenarios. My neighbor is getting this done now. They hired a master forester who just finished cutting the white pines for their timber framed structure, the green wood is milled on site and they will begin construction soon. The building shrinkage is factored into the design. Not a big deal. As for bugs, there are natural substances that can be applied to the wood, and also on-site or mobile kilns can be used. I personally use Bora-Care.

[@samsboringchannel]

Another video packed to the rafters with great information, even for someone who is in another continent from you! Many thanks!

[@donwilburn2470]

First and foremost.... bad ass Stache. Second, I appreciate all the info. As a hobbyist woodworker I've been thinking of buying a small wood mill for personal use. Tried the band saw jigs and that works of for cutting board material. Gonna have to look into drying a little more. Thanks again fellas

[@Gogreenoo3]

A discussion of tree/lumber species would be great. A focus on domestic species at a medium level of depth would be my interest. Pine vs fir vs SYP? Lesser discussed varieties like ash, alder, hickory?

[@Lincolnstww]

We might be able to make that happen

[@coreygrua3271]

Articulate and intelligent, plus a thin spread of humor, to create a fine wooden learning experience. Gracias señors.

[@petermartucci6534]

Dude your videos are the best. Tons of “useful” information and funny as hell. Thanks so much.

[@scottdelorme3166]

Thank you, Matt for this video. It makes it understandable and a lot less intimidating.

[@dangoldbach6570]

Great tips here, one thing worth looking into for lumber drying in a kiln is case hardening. If it is rushed, the outside dries and shrinks faster than the interior. This isn't necessarily a bad thing because when the interior does eventually dry it pulls the outer layers into compression, which makes it much less crack prone, but if you plane it on one side only you release the tension on that side and it can cup a lot. Best advice I ever got was to seal the end grain of raw wood with paint or paraffin and a heat gun. It allows the wood to dry without a gradient and buys you time until you can use it

[@robohippy]

One big difference in kiln dried wood compared to air dried is the way it works. Rip a kiln dried piece on your table saw, and you get dust. Rip an air dried piece on your table saw and you get shavings. Also, it takes some one who really knows what they are doing to get properly dried wood from a kiln. Too often, in the interests of saving 'time', the wood is 'case hardened', which translates to hard on the outside, and softer on the inside. This is why boards can 'spring', cup, twist, curl, and probably a few other terms. The air dried boards I have used do not do this when I am ripping for book match. I have had some wood that was dried in a vacuum kiln, and it worked like air dried lumber.

[@m2lumber]

The "differences" you mention in kiln dried vs air dried lumber are almost always due to drying defects, high quality kiln dried lumber will have almost no noticeable difference in appearance or workability.

[@robohippy]

I would attribute it to not really knowing the processes and taking short cuts. Without exception, KD wood seems to spring more than air dried and vacuum kiln dried. I do mostly lathe work, and green logs, but did a bunch of furniture work, and am getting back into the 'flat' work part of wood.

[@lifestooshorttostress519]

nice to see professionals at work. keep going, wood is the future when we finally get that everything else has a downside we cannot sustain.

[@Thundermuffin93]

This video rocks! Thank you for an excellent resource. Will point people your way, if that's okay. However, will point out that walnut is actually a pretty excellent outdoor wood. Rated as very durable on the wood database. Sure, bark and sapwood will vanish, but that heartwood will last outside a long time. Thanks again, encore!

[@michiganmoto7687]

Great video. Very informative and detailed. Also, you guys are hilarious together. Your personalities and on screen presence compliment each other quite well. 👍