Linus Re-Evaluates his Investment

Linus and Luke discuss the launch of the Framework 16 laptop.
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[@L1PiD]

Framework has the chance to be the undisputed king in repairable laptops. Pray there's a day where their mission includes phones as well.

[@andyH_England]

I don't even think there is a sector for repairable laptops. It is 2024 and the lifetime of laptop this and last year are likely to be 10 years plus making repairable laptops moot unless you are careless and break them. I have a three and a half year old MacBook Pro and an 8-year MacBook Pro. Both are going great. I think repairable laptops are niche and a lifestyle choice by a tiny minority. But I'm glad there is something for you even though it is rather expensive for what you're getting.

[@L1PiD]

@@jimby812 just doesn’t feel refined as a product. That’s just my opinion tho,

[@Kaenguruu]

@@andyH_EnglandTheres also the aspect of upgradeability meaning being able to modify the components over time to adjust to greater demands either because of the tech generally (e.g. video games, so RayTracing, DLSS etc.) or simply because you aren't utilizing your laptop for the same type of work anymore. Ignoring this is a pretty big oversight.

[@tuannguyenminh2870]

I don't exactly care about repairability but upgradability. My electronic doesn't break that much. But also for most people if the laptop is broken, they won't order new parts but bring it to the repair shop anyway.

[@andyH_England]

@@Kaenguruu Again, that is a minority. Most of us buy what we need with headroom just in case. Businesses and enterprises will buy new laptops and pass the older ones down the line to those needing lower specs. In their late 70s, my parents never needed more RAM or SSD. I have seen the upgrade prices for 13th-generation Framework motherboards (not even the latest), which are close to £1050! I cannot see this as a sensible option. I can buy a whole 13-gen laptop with OLED for that! I am glad you have what you want, but to me, this is an unsustainable business model, and we see that with price rises,

[@RolandsSh]

48 minutes?! Jeez, I need a Clips channel of LMG Clips channel.

[@SufyaanDewan]

and for that Clips channel of Clips channel, we would need a Shorts Channel

[@SolidNate99]

Haha for sure

[@MattA-fi5qe]

I think Linus himself is all the shorts content we need /s

[@SolidNate99]

@@MattA-fi5qe i was excited when Linus made a video about him retiring but he's still making lots of videos

[@MattA-fi5qe]

@@SolidNate99 I was last excited when in 1998, the Undertaker threw Mankind off Hell In A Cell, and plummeted 16 ft through an announcer's table."

[@mrwerder616]

Linus skipping the add in his own video is absolutely priceless

[@ВикторФирсов-е9ф]

Remember, that's piracy!

[@Tmtrnr]

adblock is piracy - linus

[@mikeuk1927]

You can't really pirate your own IP, can you :p

[@SeeMeRoland]

Linus Thievery Group

[@raawesome3851]

​@@ВикторФирсов-е9фskipping ads is not the same as blocking them outright. You'd still get money from skipped ads 💀

[@hrmmmmmm]

WAAAAAH - them watching it at 1.75x while i'm watching them at 2x is a LOT

[@FBI_Master]

I have a plugin for 2.6x

[@johnmoore1495]

@@FBI_Masteris there something special about 2.6x or is it just the fastest that you can generally understand?

[@mike4402]

zoomers

[@MR-vj8dn]

May I ask, what do you do with the time you don’t have to spend when you watch videos at 2x?

[@_r4x4]

​@@MR-vj8dn I'm spending it at watching other videos at 2x speed. Isn't that obvious?

[@ericbonanno5214]

Framework is looking into the deck flex too. I'll post an excerpt from the pre-order emails that they sent which calls out the LTT video as the reason to start investigating it. "Keyboard deflection - We’ve seen largely positive feedback on the input deck feel, but also specifically saw LTT’s video in which they flagged keyboard deflection and the workaround they applied. We’re investigating whether there could have been either an issue on that unit or a scenario that can result in the mid plate not being flat. In either case, if we find that there is an improvement we can apply on this, we will do so and ship out any parts necessary for that to customers whose units have already shipped."

[@benjaminoechsli1941]

They mention that at 25:09, but thank you for sharing the actual excerpt! Keep improving, Framework.

[@Varadiio]

"Keyboard deflection - We’ve seen largely positive feedback on the input deck feel..." That market spin BS tho. Not winning any hearts like that.

[@Fosellar]

@@Varadiio I mean, if it's true it's true. As long as they actually address the issue some people experience then it's fine to mention that others have no issue.

[@OverAndOverAndOver]

I uh.... I think he knows this.... Large investor in the company and whatnot...

[@lurifaks92]

@@Varadiio How else would you say that it's an issue that happens to a minority of the devices?

[@dazley8021]

Elijah somehow being the only one capable of doing backflips and linus immediately dismissing it is hilarious.🤣

[@thatitman9554]

i just want to know why it was such a fast and hard no

[@Slayer666th]

@@thatitman9554 i know at least of the 5000$ upgrade video that he is a magnet for insuring himself. it was actually hilarious in that video

[@dazley8021]

@@thatitman9554 in the few videos he was featured he managed to injure himself a few times. i mean it just can be a fluke but that hard no from linus kinda speaks volumes and linus likes his insurance rates not raised 😁

[@Teraplexor1]

​@@Slayer666thwhat video was that?

[@drackar]

@@thatitman9554 specifically where the dude slipped and fell down some stairs in a upgrade video.

[@Smart-Towel-RG-400]

hes only watching their own video because then its a double tax write off

[@jackeyboy6538]

double tax write off means they have to pay taxes to you, thems the rules

[@VuLamDang]

2/2 Linus swear at NVIDIA (Sebastian and Torvalds)

[@BigDogHaver]

looool

[@ranid0072]

that's.... Bad and Good joke at same time.

[@emiliskog]

19:25 Linus* quoting Linus** (*Sebastian) (**Torvalds)

[@aseemdua5086]

It would be fun to see a mash-up of this.

[@nankinink]

The first thing came to mind when Linus was swearing the f out of nvidia was Linus middle finger and saying "f you nvidiax lmao

[@fedor-kokosik]

Yeah, every Linus must say " fuck nvidia"

[@leonro]

could have just said "ltt linus quoting linux linus"

[@kraio-sfu]

Ligh-nuss quoting Lee-noos

[@iso_2013]

I mean the Verge's poor review of a build-it-yourself computer makes sense, given the way they build computers edit: this is a joke

[@WarrenGarabrandt]

got'em!

[@carlwheezer1544]

ltt audience try to have any other joke than the verge pc build challenge (impossible mode)

[@angelaizen2231]

​@carlwheezer1544 In this context, it made perfect sense lmao. Linus was the only tech creator that didn't shit all over them publicly for it, and even got stephan on show to rebuild the whole system, and they both explained where the bad points were. Linus is a G for that. Didn't shit over them, and instead gave constructive feedback, while teaching him how to build one for real.

[@iso_2013]

@@angelaizen2231 twas a joke

[@angelaizen2231]

@iso_2013 I was replying to the guy above me, not you, dw.

[@watercannonscollaboration2281]

Honestly the Verge’s review is pretty fair considering the circumstances of their unit. It actually reminds me of Doug talking about a Tesla engineer showing up with a pre-prod cybertruck

[@CorneliusCornbread]

Based on them saying their unit ran hot and loud, it sounds like a bad unit. Which isn't something to ignore, in fact quite the opposite, but I think understanding that it was a bad unit is important context. Hopefully these bad units aren't that common.

[@CodeAsm]

@@CorneliusCornbread Frameworks support is pretty chill if you provide the right evidence. Also hope not too many ppl overload their support. if its a fault they can fix with a new part or boardswap. that be great. I got my fan replaced (FW13, 12th gen) for free (cause it was making noises and looked clean). a video before and after "cleaning" proved it for them. But they get alott of support tickets from ppl breaking their own stuff sadly

[@kendokaaa]

I wish more outlets did like some PC reviewers do which is to contact the company, see if they know about the issue. Sometimes you just get a lemon and that shouldn't affect the review

[@cameronbosch1213]

​@kendokaaa I can confirm The Verge had a lemon. My finalized unit is perfectly fine. No BSODs or kernel panics on it, and the keyboard flex by the L key isn't more than say an HP Omen.

[@heroninja1125]

@@CorneliusCornbread Well, if anything its to be expected that they get bad units. Framework themselves said that the review units were chosen because most of them were deemed as not acceptable to send to consumers. And instead decided to send them to reviewers.

[@topmandog1]

love hearing linus swear even when partly bleeped

[@jacobfaseler5311]

Especially to the tune of “fuck you NVIDIA” - following in the footsteps of the great😂

[@LittleSpeedyCat]

@@jacobfaseler5311 it seems like it's a default mode for all Linuses

[@joee7452]

@@jacobfaseler5311 It was interesting. But the tune seemed to imply that there is only 1 GPU maker and they are the only one that matters. I was waiting for him to say that they would be working with AMD for something and he basically ignored that they even exist. Am I the only one that wonders why AMD wasn't mentioned as an option for working with to make a modular GPU like that or roasted just as hard for not allowing it like Nvidia? What about Intel?

[@jacobfaseler5311]

@@joee7452 people tend to focus on the negatives - hopefully omission of discussion on the others implies they’re still viable futures.

[@alexrose1ukv2]

@@joee7452 its because Nvidia is by far the larger GPU partner in desktop/laptop, and a lot of people will ignore anything that doesn't have the Nvidia stamp. They have the mindshare, and as shown here, aren't afraid to abuse it. Even in GPU enthusiast circles, where people know more and realise modern AMD is viable and has reasonable drivers, many still go with Nvidia because of DLSS or other reasons. So in a sense it DOES matter if Nvidia won't do it, because AMD just doesn't carry the weight that Nvidia does.

[@Melchirobin]

32:28 Linus you made my point as to why the position on graphs should be fixed between tests. Just choose something alphabetical, price, or even the writers mood and keep it that way. Having the graphs be fixed in position makes for much better viewing experience.

[@andreirachko]

100% Just a few days ago Linus was defending the switching scheme somewhere, but now he visibly suffers from it himself. Karma is all I’ll say. They gotta fix it.

[@Melchirobin]

@@andreirachko If you can find it please let me know. I’m honestly curious to what the reason is for switch ordering every chart. The only people it helps is for people to take screenshots and post to other websites but I thought that’s what Labs was for. For the format of video it makes no sense in my opinion

[@kluevo]

@@Melchirobin not really applicable to this specific graph, but for cases where there's five+ devices being compared, or if there are close scorers, it does sorta help establish relative ranking

[@CodeAsm]

agree here.

[@leonro]

In my opinion, it should be ordered based on performance when it's more products (like a GPU review), but the places should stay the same when it's two or three products being compared. That, or make it obvious which product you're talking about by using a different colour, like instead of everything being magenta, they could give the framework numbers a different colour like turquoise. (also, inverted colours are better for colourblind people)

[@aseemdua5086]

I love the Linus doing the Linus. Flipping the finger at NVIDIA.

[@GaltJohn2008]

MXM was a nightmare. I had a 17" Alienware from the old days that came with a 480m?(might not be right with that). I upgraded to an Nvidia 980, which on mobile had 6gb as compared to the desktop which only had 4gb. What a nightmare,the case had to be dremelled in places, the card was slightly offset to the right from the socket, I had to use a grinder on the heat sink and lots of thermal pads to accommodate the different ram locations. You also had to modify the info in the driver bios because Nvidia didn't want to allow you to put driver's for a card that wasn't on its list of official builds. In the end it worked, ran cool, was fast, it was a good gamer even in 2020. Then 6 months down the line it popped something during a stressful load. Like $450 total down the drain for a short run. MXM sucked rhinoceros balls..

[@DrBunhead95]

As far as i remember, it was not really standardized (or rather enfoced strictly), and whats worse, Dell/Alienware was one of "those guys" which tried HARD to deviate in shape/placement of components as much as possible. Clevo/MSI/Lenovo versions of same cards were not compatible with Alienware bodies and vice versa. Also - it was highly adivised to buy proper, complementary to chosen GPU , heatsink. I BET MY ASS, if your laptop originally came with 480m it was not "meant" to be upgraded further than 6xx/7xx/8xx (which were basically same cards in laptops, but reheated burgers...). 9xx and 10xx gen of cards were different in some major ways which meant that no eng. could have forseen than 4-5 years into the future. As some useless info - i believe anything higher than 1060 needed some externar clock signal or something, which rendered old MXM laptops unable to run them. In the end - fact that (not without issues) you actually could do it... was unbelievable in laptop market. Hence my opinion is MXM was great, albeit not used "correctly" - not standardized enough, no major official manufacturers support for swaps. Kits for upgrades were wery rare to be distributed in any major and official way (not that there were none of 'em to be clear)

[@Lollllllz]

@@DrBunhead95 it was nvidia dropping support for LVDS display output(requiring eDP or atleast optimus to have the igpu handle the video output) in the 1060+ cards and legacy bios support in the 9xxM cards that crippled compatibility with older laptops especially the former. As for physical compatibility goes I think AW/clevo/msi had at one point shared a 'standard' type B layout until the maxwell generation sharing the GPU/Vram/Screw hole Placement and PCB Sizing. Signaling, power and physical constraints seems to limit that "standardized" type B to 1080/2060/3060 cards that led its use being discontinued in favor of custom solutions. I dont think the framework gpu solution on its own would gain traction in a similar scale as the "Standardized MXM 3.0 Type B" as used by Clevo/AW/MSI and Industrial/Medical applications(which refuses to allow the format to die and seems to have created Type B+ for the 2080/3080) as people are upgrading the laptops beyond what the manufacturers are willing to provide and support.Unless more manufacturers adopt the format and create upgrades for it this would end up like DGFF or Clevo/MSI's variation on the MXM format.

[@tacokoneko]

MXM standardizes the *slot but **_not_** the screw hole positions or the board size and shape* . that's the problem. every single MXM board has a chance to have completely different screw holes and board shape meaning it is impossible to transplant. pack it up thats all folks go home.

[@Wooksley]

I mean it is the verge, they may have forgotten to isolate the PSU from the case or something like that.

[@MrWillypanda88]

they might even forgot to update or even installing the any drivers even. It's the Verge, any sane user won't even look at them for technical knowledge

[@colinmartin9797]

​@@MrWillypanda88but it's still important user info and it's good on the verge to update that they're getting a non-pre-production unit and might update their review. The bigger issue is how dumb it was that framework sent preproduction units.

[@Yasokuhl35]

@@MrWillypanda88 The verge is aimed at a casual audience without much tech knowledge. It makes sense for them to test things as they come out of the box as most current production laptops simply come ready to run since their target audience doesn't want to hunt for drivers on some OEM website. Manually installing drivers isn't really a thing anymore anyways, Windows does a decent job at doing that for the user. I doubt any casual user needed to install drivers since Win10, maybe on a Desktop for the GPU (even then, the default windows graphics drivers usually work okay. A bit outdated but it's not like you only get 600x800 anymore) but not on any known brand laptop. Framework is really at fault here for shipping a pre production unit, maybe even without including relevant information (like, we still update drivers to regularly to ship them on the device - get them from here [url])

[@tdata545]

41:53 YEAH... It's Luke's insightful commentary that keeps bringing me back to this channel. YEAH.

[@jacobroeland]

Yeah.

[@bite_hls]

50 minute clip, whoa

[@IamYuto]

The new channel "LMG Clips of Clips" will launch soon!

[@benjaminoechsli1941]

I appreciate clipping by topic. 👍

[@arisakathedappergoose4796]

if that connection is a full x16 PCI, I'd love to see that connection used as an eGPU dock.

[@JessicaFEREM]

why would you do that? the GPU turns off when it's not being used. You're not saving any room by doing it, and battery life difference is negligible. plus the GPU connection needs to be screwed in and you have to have the laptop turned off while you do this. it is an internal PCIe connector.

[@akiesa559]

probably 8 lanes

[@peterhindes56]

@@akiesa559iirc it is

[@pmc_]

@@JessicaFEREM cooling and power delivery for ultra high performance - good luck cooling and powering something like a desktop 4090 in that module's form factor

[@p3chv0gel22]

​@@pmc_tbf cooling a 4090 is hard in nearly any formfactor

[@D1n75]

About the Screen lifting with one finger, let's all remember what the greatest sages of consumer electronics said a while ago about a similar issue with certain phone. "You are lifting it wrong!"

[@robertt9342]

I hope you’re not one of those people that mercilessly mocked him for that statement given your post…

[@D1n75]

Mocking apple and their statement about the antennas in the iphone 4. Let me rephrase to better match what Jobs said at that time: "Avoid LIFTING it that way! @@robertt9342

[@D1n75]

@@robertt9342 you mean apple? Anytime!

[@jedics1]

Imagine if user upgradeable and modular laptops continued to be developed 25 ish years ago when Apple brought out the Pizmo where the framework would be now?

[@renderedpixels4300]

Id love a framework, but theyre just too expensive. Its a cool idea though

[@552jacki3]

Yeah that's the price of a (relatively) low production, niche product. Hopefully it'll get cheaper as it becomes more popular.

[@KptnAutismus]

if i ever needed a laptop, i'd buy a used one anyway. once the framework is a few years old, there'll probably be a coule of used 13s for sale.

[@TCLe]

If you don't mind older generation ones you can find cheap 11th gen units on their marketplace

[@joergsonnenberger6836]

@@552jacki3 No, it's not the price of a low production. It's the price of a business machine.

[@MrDummyisDumb]

I actually don't think the laptop initially is too bad, but it's the upgrades. For what a new motherboard goes for you're better off just buying a new laptop every 4 years which is basically what the business model has been the past decade

[@ravenof1985]

MXM upgrading was a total nightmare and was nothing like upgrading a desktop graphics card. i had a Alienware M17X R4 and changed the dead MXM out these are the issues faced on that platform: Power delivery issues thermal solution issues output/input issues UEFI/BIOS issues Fan speed issues you could swap one MXM for another but it was essentially an EXPERT level only upgrade, and required custom VBIOS and BIOS in many cases to make it work.

[@Will-sc3hw]

They should have made a mxm2 with a full redesign. It could have been fixed. Shitty oem bioses didn't help

[@Dreams_Of_Lavender]

It's what I'm having to deal with playing with a 2011 iMac. Those Terascale GPUs are ticking time bombs and if you wanna use OCLP to put newer versions of macOS on it, it's not compatible with the Metal API so you're missing out on acceleration in most applications. There's a pretty wide variety of MXM cards that could go in them, and a large thread of BIOSes and cards with methods used to make them work, but a good number of them require modifications either to resistors and solder jumpers on the card itself, or copper shims to increase the die height, or pieces that need to be cut off the heatsink to make room for coils and other tall components. But they ALL need custom bioses to function.

[@JamesJones-zt2yx]

High point of the day: finding that there really is a company called Big Ass Fans.

[@myrealusername2193]

They make fans for Costco among other companies

[@reoencarcelado5904]

@JamesJones-zt2yx: I wonder who their Biggest Fan is. 😂

[@willmons1197]

I’ve seen them in airports sometimes lol

[@sanguineel]

I've been watching LTT for years but this was my first WAN show. Pretty great stuff.

[@Wongseifu548]

This is the verge we are talking about I trust them as much as I would trust a sleezy car salesman

[@TmanT321]

After the "PC Build Guide" from the verge a few years ago, I disregard any of their "reviews". There's been more than one instance of them having the incorrect information and it causing problems and making them an unreliable source for accurate info.

[@TheTechnoPilot]

Yeah it kinda permanently removed them from being a trusted source for anything but a very non-tech savvy consumer POV.

[@MrGamelover23]

Apparently, the other reviews corroborated their claims.

[@bvoyelr]

46:57 - Wow, Linus seems to legitimately hate Elijah at this moment. Not even a trace of mirth on his face while he rejects the proposal.

[@Ray_Blanchette]

Use this comment as a petition to Linus that we need to see Elijah back flip

[@locusm]

I just got my FW16 and am very happy with it, was a bit anxious that the screen wouldnt be up to it but its excellent quality. I have had 4 MBP's since 2013 and am looking forward to upgrading this beast.

[@Tieyus]

Wildest way to find out about how asus got their name

[@renchesandsords]

All it took to convince my family that the framework 16 is worth it was the page with the customizable deck and the user changable ports, since so many of their prev laptops died due to dead ports or dead keyboards

[@bandito241]

48 minute is a clip on this channel. Jesus

[@bradhaines3142]

WAN show has stretched to an easy 3hrs now. so its still a clip of it.

[@javierflores09]

@@bradhaines3142 that's a third of the whole stream, so it is ehh. But to be fair, they do only make it long when there's a need for it, as in when the context of the clip stretches that much. If anything, I prefer longer clips rather than out of context takes, since there's no room for misunderstanding that way

[@benjaminoechsli1941]

Thanks, editors. I don't want to watch 15 clips of one subject.

[@ReasonRaider]

Elija out of everybody at the company being the only person who can do a backflip is crazy 😂

[@JamesJones-zt2yx]

If I get another laptop, it will be a Framework. Nvidia won't support it? Well then, insert Linus Torvalds video clip here. I'm a Linux user, and I've sworn off Nvidia anyway. (BTW, good work, Linus. I think you may have outdone Mr. Torvalds in this respect!)

[@calebrasak6941]

I’ll buy a framework 16 if they give us an occulink module or tb5 module. Egpu support for full desktop replacement potential is what I’m looking for.

[@pptemplar5840]

Aren't the Verge the people who published the thermalpaste bukkake PC build guide? If they are who I am thinking I would assume the PC "crashed" because they didn't have a battery installed.

[@angelaizen2231]

Yea nah it was the verge who did the worst PC build guide in historym

[@4.0.4]

Ah yes The Verge, famous for their PC building abilities. Certainly one of the publications of all time, and deserving of our continued acknowledgement - they do, in fact, exist, 9/10 IGN points.

[@MikkoRantalainen]

46:10 I would love to see this kind of transparency from all manufacturers!

[@Sup3rB4dVideos]

Bro if I hear this fucking crab song again Imma lose it

[@fakjbf3129]

Watching Luke and Linus watch a video at 1.75x speed while already watching this video at 2x speed was pretty funny.

[@adrianomuller3569]

Linux ranting about Nvidia is gold.

[@muskaos]

I upgraded the MXM card in one of my laptops once. I had to buy a compatible MXM card from eBay, and I had to stay within thermal and power delivery spec of the laptop in question. It was, in essence, like upgrading from a 4070 to a 4080.

[@noxious89123]

24:58 The issue I see with the thermal pad thing, is that itll potentially make the keyboard hot. So perhaps there was a small air gap left there intentionally to thermally insulate the keyboard to some degree? Some sort of firm heatproof material would be preferrable to a thermalpad, no?

[@carsonsulzner3129]

Watching wan show at 1.5 times lees and y’all play another video at speed

[@Rukhage]

Imagine when you're watching it at x2

[@the_maker1841]

After having to go through 3 battery replacements, sata cable breakage ( can't find replacements), had to re-soder components on the board, and 2 fan replacements with my Dell, I will 100% be going framework with my next laptop. The ability to repair and upgrade is the most appealing part. Adding on how many talk of mostly upgrading as when they need to repair it was an accident, doesn't seem to be manufacture error. I probably won't roll with the gaming unit as I game on my tower or steam deck on travel, but I like the larger screen space of the 16 inch

[@POLESTAR757]

my only problem with framework is the price, you're never going to actually make any difference to sustainability or repair ability by producing laptops for one of the smallest laptop markets besides gaming laptops. from experience aswell, people with that kind of money just buy a new one when something is wrong or there is an upgrade cause they can afford to do so.

[@clavius5734]

I think in this case it might be more about caring about repairability as a principle rather than economic motive. But yeah, how big is that group.

[@DAveShillito]

I'm waiting on my order and know I am paying a premium over a laptop of a similar spec I could have bought to get one that aligns with my values. Plus I am showing my support for the company and the concept. However I admit, I am lucky this is an option I am able to take.

[@eppssilon]

In this video look forward to: - Crying about nvidia (deserved) - Simping and constructively criticizing the new framework 16 laptop - The team's review without any input from Linus, they did a fantastic job - Company liable backflips

[@xamindar]

3:40 those screen bend tests are pointless. You need to take into account the stiffness of the hinges. I have a Dell Precision laptop with more bend than the Framework16 examples....but the Dell also has really really stiff hinges.

[@mitchellsteindler]

I dont think the verge would highlight an issue like that and somehow not mention the world's stiffest hinge.

[@fuseteam]

Linus the creator (of linux): f- off nvidia Linus the destroyer (of linux): f- off nvidia

[@cyangalaxy]

Linus @ 5:35 : ""You have audio from me elsewhere." What does that even mean? I didn't even fart" *no reaction from Luke or Dan* 😁

[@slayerdwarfify]

I had to rewind to make sure I'd actually heard Linus right.

[@cyangalaxy]

@@slayerdwarfifyoh sorry, wrong timestamp. I fixed it now.

[@CianMcsweeney]

I have the 13, almost perfect, if only I could get an old school thinkpad keyboard into it...

[@train3616]

I know Linus sped up the video. But I can just imagine if he did every video like that. 😂. Like he's had tons of caffeine.

[@rapauli]

How to hack a locked wall mounted thermostat - Make 2 small shelves to hold your beverages. One shelf is above for your icy cold drinks. One shelf below for your piping hot beverage. Adjust the beverages to make your thermostat deliver comfort.

[@MauriBT]

Framework laptops look great, I like the idea of being able to upgrade it whenever and however I want, but the problem remains the price, they can't afford certain prices, I get a laptop from another brand with highly superior features. Maybe when you get down to earth and realize that you can't ask for certain prices for your product even though it's very good, at a price of high notebooks like HP/Lenovo with similar hardware features would be the first choice of many.

[@benjaminoechsli1941]

Framework is a tiny company compared to the brands you describe, and as such their costs are higher (not to mention the intrinsic additional cost of making parts this easily replaceable). The high price tag makes sense for what it is. Don't buy outside what you can afford, but the ability to _actually, truly_ make this the last laptop you ever own is worth the premium in my opinion.

[@kovelamanas9905]

At this point I'm ready to hear linus just talking. Like he can just talk about what how his dinner tasted and I will happily 😊 sit and listen

[@electricbluee]

Nvidia is truly the bane of existence of all things fun

[@milandalosur1850]

Without Nvidia graphics tech would be way behind where it is.

[@electricbluee]

@@milandalosur1850 I don’t deny that. But after the exit of EVGA, death of MXM, no more wildly custom cards. I can’t help but feeling Nvidia hates fun.

[@smileychess]

I have never lifted a laptop screen by the corner.

[@miikahamalainen5343]

17:48 Linus is starting to sound like Linus Torvalds when talking about Nvidia

[@teddymasters1347]

I've had the 13 for a few years now. It has a few things that annoy me (mainly the battery and some heat issues) but the few times I've broken it I was so grateful to have it. I recently sat on it by accident, cracking the screen and bungling the upper chase. I'm looking at a ~350 investment instead of 1000+ for a new computer

[@FrostyShadowYT]

I never understood how people can watch videos with a higher playback speed, I can't comprehend information that fast.

[@robise.5886]

Mayb ur brain has low clock speeds...

[@david_strike]

skill diff

[@Redmanticore]

i cant understand complicated information even on 1x speed anyway.

[@synniestar]

man. the section where they watched their own video at 1.75x was a trip, because i watch KZbin videos on 1.5x as default 💀 suddenly going 3.25x was certainly something to adjust to.

[@AudioPhil84]

I love the idea of the framework 16 unfortunatly the price does take away from the advantage, i keep my laptops for about 4years (currently running an "old" xmg with 9750h and rtx2070). but for the price of framework with gpu i almost get two complete laptops.

[@_Davepocalypse]

A "tape enthusiast" is the final firm of every engineer.

[@chessdude1977]

The Verge was probably using the livestrong static braclet 😂

[@spacehornet]

I think the confusion over the statistics here highlights an important point about data visualization. If you're focusing on comparing a specific product on a chart it's best if either the order of each line stays the same between charts or if they are always sorted and the product being reviewed is highlighted with a different color or bold text.

[@zt9233]

Yea amature

[@o0shad0oo]

Regarding screen bend: Might be a tight hinge on that unit.

[@TurtleKwitty]

The hinges are super tight on all new units to reduce the screen shake, its a concession they made to solve the hinge being a little wobbly but the build itself is strong so it's not actually a problem

[@benjaminhough8804]

I was shopping for a laptop in October and Framework (13 or 16) was so close. Ultimately, I found it way too expensive. I really wanted to support the concept, however, day-to-day it would be years before I’d want to upgrade it. I purchased a Lenovo Slim 7 Pro X with 32 GB RAM, Ryzen 9, and an RTX 3050 for LESS than the Framework 13. This laptop will last for years (at least for my needs). I am also nervous purchasing a Framework as they are still a fairly new company. They aren’t promising future GPUs for the 16 (yet) and the entire point of an upgradable laptop is to have parts 10 years in the future and I’m not confident, yet.

[@spdcrzy]

47:00 NOW I understand this joke lmaoooo

[@AlemooDoty]

i watch videos in 2x speed anyway so them adding the 1.75 atop that was *wild*

[@John_1920]

48:18 Those trampoline nets are such a danger for anyone that doesn't just skip and hop and slide on the trampoline...

[@andyradford4574]

I love the idea of framework, and the ability to then upgrade the laptop. But for the normal user who wants to get value for money they have made it very difficult to go with. Considering I can get a similar (non upgradable) for like half the price . Until prices come down I'm gonna be stuck with buying a new laptop every 3-4 years which would still work out cheaper.

[@PrograError]

IMO it's still better than the "macbook of the conventional laptops"... at least Framework have a track record of making the upgrade to the current with the same specs and is part replaceable

[@andyradford4574]

@@PrograError I agree that it's the best option long term, but for right now it's not affordable for most people. But it's the same with a lot of recyclable/reusable stuff it needs to be made more affordable for them to make a real difference.

[@elpookay]

if people don't jump onboard now there won't be a long term purchase. just the idea of framework makes it valuable enough for me to pay more.

[@jodysin7]

I refuse to sell on ebay for the last few years bevause between the ebay and paypal fees, you can lose up to 20%

[@TFAmbience]

Linus at 2x speed sounds like Ben Shapiro 😂

[@alanb76]

I have a Framework 13 just over a year old, and the keyboard keys started flaking paint and turning all white. I ordered a new keyboard and swapped it. There were nearly 100 microscopic screws to change. It is stiff and I enjoy that but what a job to change it. but at least I could do it. I hope they can also make keyboards which are a bit less subject to flaking.

[@JessicaFEREM]

I don't mind not owning an nvidia gpu if owning an nvidia gpu stomps on my rights. plus AMD GPUs have historically ALWAYS had better linux support, in some cases better than windows.

[@sl06bhytmar]

Intel Arc Pro for framework 16 would be nice..

[@lrmcatspaw1]

The verge gave it a 5/10? the same verge with the PC building guide? There has to be a joke somewhere in there. But maybe Not, I did not see the laptop yet. EDIT: Linus skipping his sponsor segment in a reaction is something strangely ... relatable.

[@TabalugaDragon]

*4070 laptop* "That's a big GPU" Please tell me Linus was sarcastic here. It's 4060 ti is that 4070m is. Now 4080m has desktop 4070 ti specs(mostly) and 4090m have desktop 4080 specs. That's a HUGE step up compared to 4070M. 4070 laptop GPU is a scam by Nvidia, one of the biggest in years.

[@micgalovic]

25:00 if you dont give Alex a financial bonus at the end of the year, you are not a good boss. The guy found a way how to be honest, how to FIX a mistake that he wasn't even remotely responsible for and to save the situation. What a legend.

[@micgalovic]

25:58 nvm, Linus went to the other direction xd Alex go start a business.

[@CodingtheRoad]

If framework makes a nicer, heavy duty looking black version-- I could see it being a hit, with a little more input from designers before the engineers go gung-ho.

[@harambeexpress]

I don't think I can justify *not* getting a Framework for my next laptop.

[@pr0xZen]

Another *MASSIVE* issue is that not only did the various OEMs and ODMd not only _not_ standardize the _component and dimension_ layout - they even went haywire with mixing up the pinouts. Even within their own brand ecosystems. So not only are MXM GPUs not _physically_ compatible among different laptop chassis types, they're not even _electrically_ compatible on the pinout. And as a cherry on top, they kept their changing arbitrary pinouts proprietary and locked down very well, so a bunch of them aren't even fully known or reverse engineered to this day. MXM was a great idea in principle. But everyone involved with implementing it completely screwed the whole thing by doing their very best to force it into being non-standardized.

[@pr0xZen]

And yes, this includes mixing up pinouts between signal and power, so in multiple combinations you would instantly brick that $500++ MXM GPU you spent months trying to find, when powering on the system. In some cases taking the primary motherboard down the drain with it.

[@mukunddhar6657]

I would totally buy this. But the problem is they dont ship to my country. Otherwise this is my dream laptop

[@PeterWolfe2012]

RE @25.28 gaps and electrical tape Since it IS designed to be eminently modular for DIY; can you spray paint the frame to minimize the negotiability of the gaps? Can Framework do that without TOO much gouging? Perhaps even a dyed anodizing at the supplier level?

[@kaseyboles30]

The verge has a credibility issue after their infamous how to build a pc video.

[@AntLeo-sl8jk]

these are not clips its 40 minutes

[@Nighthawkofficial]

If they don't offer extended warranty I'd buy it just for that.

[@er_guan]

Will you go with an 13" i5 framework or a Lenovo Thinkpad? Any final thoughts?

[@NightWindZero]

Question: Are they using Ublock on their personal laptops to watch the review? - Can anyone tell from the verge article?

[@StickyickyStickyicky]

no their not and why would you care?

[@NightWindZero]

@@StickyickyStickyicky Linus had an opinion previously that watching content on youtube while using adblocking software was piracy (using the definition that, the price of watching content on youtube is to view the ads). I wanted to know if he his words were backed up by his actions.

[@hoodie_cat]

How long must the video be for it not to be considered a "clip"?

[@coolestrock2008]

One thing that was not noted in the review is that not ALL USB-Cs are equal on Framework, whereas all four ports ARE EQUAL on macbooks.

[@ellielikesmath]

nvidia and not playing nice with literally any hardware ive ever bought or used, name a more iconic duo. me with my first computer: nvidia: "im special, this is the special nvidia part of your operating system" me: "what the fuck is nvidia?". seemingly hasn't gotten any better in my entire life, and by now im fully not expecting it to.

[@steamerSama]

What would be a acceptable premium for a framework 16 over a comparable non-repairable laptop in terms of percentage. I'm just curious...

[@kelvinstokes996]

Not really sure who the Framework's customer is? I've never known a situation where I'd want to upgrade my ~6 year old laptop without simply replacing it with an all-new one and selling the old one. The sale of the old one easily covers the difference in cost, with the net result of having the build and general niceness of an X1 Carbon or a MacBook to use. Losing some repairability adds the ability to have a lot more density, leading to a thinner / lighter / longer battery life / etc solution, with lower costs.

[@android175]

I can see upgradability on a 2 year basis being a good thing for the GPU.

[@GlaucusBlue]

I'm so sad about the speakers, I hope they can do something. As I wnat this laptop in next year, but that's probably a deal breaker, it would also be nice if they fix the keyboard flex seeing as that's an easy fix, but what other laptop can I keep for ~10 years and upgrade as needed. Current laptop is 6 years and showing its age, ram is to small, battery needs changing, I've cracked the shell in 2 places and the gfx is to slow, and 1 of the speakers is blown but new one on its way at least that part is an easyish fix.

[@TheStevedie]

I've been watching Linus Media Group for years, but i've never watched a WAN show broadcast. Well, seeing Linus go off on Nvidia....I'm definitely going to be tuning in lol.

[@Marc.Google]

Great to see Linus’ take on the this =)

[@poogle9368]

The verge guy being mad that the ceo said it was one issue is a bit of a strike on the verge tbh. As an engineer it sounds like some sort of thermal issue. So yes, you will get multiple symptoms. Instability, crashing, running hot. But for example if its due to thermal paste non-contact, then yes there is one issue. The verge and medium are the IGN of the tech world.

[@Bradlifer]

The framework screen bend picture looks like they are forcing a bend, not just lifting the screen