Getting Whooped on Zwift-With Post-Race Thoughts

[@NMGagne]

Lionel makes the world a better place with his positive attitude and work ethic....bummed out that Mont Tremblant was cancelled since I was really looking forward to meeting/seeing him! Kudos

[@rogerc23]

Yes I’m hoping Taupo isn’t cancelled for the same reason.

[@yogipool]

Agreed 🏄‍♀️🧘‍♀️

[@LJimmy08]

"The only way you can make it such that it's 100% correct is we all go to the base of Mt Lemmon..." - ..Yes Please, and have Talbot Cox film...I laughed so hard at this....I love this man's competitiveness! #nolimits

[@timob12]

I had a 6:05am race this morning, thought for a moment its too early my legs are tired but then I thought WWLSD so I signed up. Woke up on time and did the best I could do and had a fantastic start to the day. Thanks LS for giving me a superior mental attitude

[@jamesgibson6846]

WWLSD. Love it.

[@quengmingmeow]

Lionel Sanders.....making sport--any sport--better. Love the competitiveness, love the after action report, all of it.

[@williamward7801]

I just can't get over the BPMs of these stellar athletes at the crazy watts they can hold.

[@stevenhemstead6531]

I think Lionel's comments at the end are so true. The virtual world has so many uncontrolled variable to level the playing field. Its a great tool to train and have fun. Its so immersive and addictive. But all the serious racers and competitive people need to take a step back and relax. Enjoy it for what it is. Be true to yourself and have fun. The accuracy tolerances of online racing can't separate the real world strengths of riders down to the placings. So just be happy you pushed yourself to the limit and not focused on the position.

[@vanrielmarten]

I don't completely agree with the conclusion you made in the video. As you said I also dont think (or hope at least) any of the guys in front were deliberatly cheating. So I dont want to blame anyone or have people hate on anyone! They are strong guys and even without faulty devices they might have been up there near the front. In E-racing, the calibration of powermeters and or trainers will always be an issue, even weight scales have quite a big range in accuracy. But today it was clear pretty much half of the top 20 was waaay more off than just these little accuracy problems. I agree that I still had a good workout as well!! But I can also do that in any other of the 100 races zwift has going on every day. So if we are trying to elevate this series. If we are trying to get spectators to enjoy it and if we are trying to have the best competitors keep interest in the race, we need rules on which trainers you can use etc. Because now we are just making these pro tri races a bit of a joke and the platform is making itself look bad towards the people watching.. 😊 Anyway great job on crushing it once again! Your numbers are freaking insane, but I know you roll us all up on the outside roads as well 😁👊

[@jimmy.goes.camping]

Agreed, it makes it a bit of a farce for us spectators to watch when there's guys using zpower or using dodgey power meters to push watts in excess of what world tour riders are capable of. Hard to make it fair though unless you standardise everyones smart trainer.

[@lifefindsawayx3]

Marten Van Riel Problem is Zwift is not real. And by that I mean its variable inputs are so numerous, that a comparison to outdoor riding is never going to be close unless you have standardization (as Lionel mentioned). Don’t get me wrong, Zwift is epic in all the aspects they push as a platform, but when it comes to real bike racing, you’ll never have 100% fairness unless you have a judge in every athlete’s home watching as every athlete uses the same trainer, same power source, and same weight scale. Again, for what Zwift is worth, it’s awesome in 99% of ways, but not professional cycling or triathlon. Just my thoughts....

[@rogerc23]

@Marten Van Riel. Excellent comment. You guys are really still the early adopters of this technology and tend to be the younger, better educated, more entrepreneurial types of the racing field but there is no doubt you will also be the guinea pigs who work out a lot of the issues and kinks of these systems. Hopefully all of us fans realize this as well and support all of you. At the end of the day it has been really fun watching these races so thanks to all you pros for giving it a go in definitely not so ideal conditions and technology 😀👍

[@danjo1967]

the first 2 guys maybe should ride a kickr, and i doubt they would have made the first group on the first climb

[@Maartenvankooij]

Agree with you on this one Marten. Zwift doesn't seen to really work on this and as result of this (combined with the gaming aspects in the race that influence the resultst too much) there are already new platforms and events. Take a look at what we did with SEG Racing Academy. www.segracing.com/eracingu23series/ There are more rules, there is less gaming. Maybe something for PTO?

[@authorjohnwquinn]

Loved his post race thoughts. Way to keep things in perspective. Ride on!

[@nickclark5883]

That race you won the other day motivated me to enter my first Zwift race - came 19th of 31 in the my group but it was super fun, managed to drop two guys at the end which was satisfying!

[@qonsultri]

Good job for today's race, great words at the end

[@stevemeis2]

Lionel you’re a man of class. Love the positivity and attitude you display as you’re a great role model to athletes all over the world. Great job in the race!

[@chrisblanchard4938]

That was awesome! I love your attitude about the whole zwift racing. What a stand up guy.

[@douglopata4582]

Well Lionel - I had to check it out given your relatively subtle reference. KOM to Lemmon Towers/All of Lemmon. You fully squeezed Lemmon. Not surprised after your Lemmon official KOM... Congrats. That’s killer. Screw Zwift, Lemmon Towers, no one is faking that... To the Towers is pretty brutal, and I’ll also never forget those brutal last 3+ miles, especially for my old legs. I expect you have video coming, it’s must see KZbin...

[@zepols86]

this was exciting to watch live, great job LIONel, your scaring the cycle world on Zwift, RIDE ON!

[@oc.ca.triathlete]

I'll stick with my TrainerRoad and Rouvy subscriptions. Here as a fan, always inspired by Lionel. Just got my LS headband, going for a run now.

[@sunilmukerjea525]

Lionel has such a great out look on things. So refreshing. Keep up the good work.

[@jasenrohatinsky3555]

Such a great speaker/analyst. Thanks for these videos.👍

[@JohnIn2SonAZ]

Mount Lemmon and the weather is why I moved to Tucson to Train in 1993 Love this place! Fun to watch Lionel.

[@cotejnfrs]

Loved the final 3 minutes. All about putting in a great effort and having a great workout. Keep pushing it..

[@lemingsoup]

"it's a lull" at 400w

[@glenngundermann2433]

Thanks Lionel. Great recap. It was fun watching you. Well said about the technology!!

[@TheDomLouis]

Great racing under the circumstances @Lionel. If you have the time check out Ed Laverack's race yesterday, which was 3x up Fox Hill(the opposite end of Box Hill) and watch him launch an attack from 10km from the finish at a consistent 7-8w/kg up Fox Hill. Fox Hill is shorter but steeper than Box Hill. Ed is UK's 2019 Hill Climbing Champ so knows a thing or 2 about attacking on the them. Looking forward to your next race!!

[@Alex-mq4qe]

Amazing outro Man! You are so much on point. Thanks for the quality.

[@drm437]

Awesome perspective. Can’t wait for the next race.

[@benwao7278]

I think Lionel has the exactly correct attitude about e-racing and I respect it even more because Lionel is such a power beast. I have encountered some people on Zwift (who I will not name) who are former pros, who have this high and mighty attitude, who take e-racing deadly serious and cannot wrap their mind around the fact that with current technology there is no way to guarantee that e-racing is 100% fair and accurate. It's a video game and people are getting great workouts and having fun. That should be enough.

[@mariesimmonds3118]

Well done Lionel respect and good to see your positives in everything

[@craigcooper1776]

I love how we all are really careful to step on weight scales lightly thinking somehow that makes us weigh less...

[@jonathane6694]

Great perspective! Ride on 🇨🇦

[@mrinagl]

Great perspective and keep competing Lionel, inspiring stuff

[@VanLifeTriathlon]

We’re doing full pre and post race coverage of these races over on The REAL Triathlon Podcast

[@TriathlonDan]

You're right, it's a great workout and you have to take it with a grain of salt with the equipment issues. The Zpower should be kicked out mid race though, you can take them out of the results but not out of the race, the damage has already been done to the race dynamic. Great numbers!

[@rogerioscheidemantel2997]

How we identify Zpower into an athlete? Aware speed sensors are totally innacurate but Z power stands for what exactly?

[@viljarsaare5491]

That was really good wrap up video!

[@MasaroVerita]

I always wonder what Lionel's strength training routines are. Would love if he makes a video about this topic.

[@ashdanga]

Well said, keep some sensible perspective!

[@fritsgerms3565]

really enjoyed watching the race. fantastic performance.

[@Dany979797]

You a beast man! Let your body recover and come back even stronger ;)

[@adammackson7807]

Awesome insight as always!

[@Jscogs]

Great wisdom At the end of the day it’s still a video game and it’s fun and fitness!!

[@TriGator]

Great perspective on using Zwift.

[@Silvrhands1137]

I just ordered a Road Machine and hopefully that will help be a bit more accurate in terms of power. My mom wants to get involved after she saw me on Zwift a couple times. What would you recommend for a cheap setup just to get a 60 year old woman on the bike..

[@CryWolfFilms]

"no one is trying to cheat" it's adorable that you think that.

[@rogerioscheidemantel2997]

Class act

[@iLuVxJaWzZ]

He's obviously talking about the pros taking part in the pro-AM race.. hopefully they are not trying to cheat!

[@maurice4407]

400 watts the whole race is NUTS! Great workout

[@KetzalSterling]

Superb effort Lionel. Agree on your thoughts in general. Your attitude is amazing. Sadly, I don't believe everyone on Zwift racing is quite on the level. A significant portion are cheating, both intentionally and unintentionally. This has been confirmed repeatedly. It will never be a level playing field, no matter what Zwift do. As you say, it's simply too complex a problem. You have the solution, don't take it remotely seriously. It isn't real. It's fun and great training. The results are almost meaningless. What's the story with the ZPower athlete being allowed to race though? That seems a little off. Hopefully Zwift will finally set-up totally separate races for users on ZPower as they often ruin quality events.

[@richardmiranda5024]

I hope Mr.Sanders can cycle with the real athletes.Thanks and God bless po.

[@ikerordonana8832]

What happened to Lionel's "pain cave"?

[@Check-it-out]

After reading the instructions on how to setup zPower, i wonder how it is even possible that a guy with a zPower setup is allowed into a race.

[@charliebad]

Many don't get it, that's fine, at the top end of Zwift racing, you all have very reliable trainers and power meters, and integrity!!!! and tbh who wants to race Sagan anyway when he'll never weigh in like you do atm..... 😮 #missingthepoint #embracenew

[@rhysrunsriot]

Nice work man. Still amazes me zpower riders are still allowed to enter these races. Madness. But solid effort.

[@josiah9008]

I didn't know you have a Doggo! They're so cute!!

[@bonn1771]

great video and too bad this could not be when i was not working to watch it live but always next time

[@andrewchadwick8405]

Great perspective

[@jean-lucgottsche7307]

"I felt like i was going to be sick the whole time... no problem uhmm, it was still fun" lol

[@nhug5674]

very well said lionel!

[@headroomcapital1745]

Send it Lionel!!!!

[@jonathanpereira9547]

What is a “Z Power”?

[@LJimmy08]

It's when you don't have a proper power source smart trainer or the one you are using is not compatible with zwift.

[@rogerioscheidemantel2997]

Any examples of Z power meters? How can you identify an athlete using it, as Lionel said.

[@rogerioscheidemantel2997]

@@LJimmy08 👆

[@NeinNein99]

Basically cheating in a race. Most races won't allow it to be used. You need a real power meter or smart trainer with power.

[@wrxzboost]

there are "pro's" on zwift using z-power - pathetic.

[@Rosenrot213]

Have you looked at the virtual Ironman races vr4 this weekend

[@sLiv256]

As you said, Zwift is still great and a big benefit

[@rogerc23]

Ummmm not at the price they charge to be honest.

[@nathanrs1016]

What's a Zpower ?

[@notredame233]

fake power coming from a speed/cadence sensor. basically an approximation, but not coming from a real power meter

[@nathanrs1016]

@@notredame233 oh... So I think I have this too, as I don't own a power meter... Not that I compete in races though

[@WRXJIM]

still a great spectacle to watch. you're a beast!

[@gaelmenes6444]

Great job!

[@Nonixification]

Online Zwift racing is only for fun, I totally agree with Lionel here. All equipment is measuring power differently. For example if I set my crank length longer on my gps with my p1 pedals powers are waaaay higher, so basically its very easy to cheat.

[@rogerc23]

Not sure it’s in a pros mindset to be out e-racing or any racing for fun.

[@miker5624]

what is z power?

[@NoahT11112]

Why does it say “go to 15:00 in the description?”

[@tryhardpker]

I think Talbot wanted to make sure people saw Lionel's thoughts on the whole cheating thing

[@TalbotCoxMedia]

Stewie 5.6k exactly

[@NoahT11112]

Thanks

[@BlindManWalking]

Lionel, have you always went with such a low cadence? Have you ever tried spinning and easier gear faster? Thanks and awesome work!

[@rogerc23]

I’m guessing because he can push so much power he doesn’t need to do easy spinning.

[@Tethysmeer]

He's a grinder.

[@ivancajka732]

3:10 My Ipad also freezes and crashes on avregular basis in Zwift. Have to use my desktop computer

[@johnlvs2run]

Connecting with a cable would be more stable.

[@ivancajka732]

johnlvs2run I dont have conection problems. Its a siftware isue

[@MrMichaelfalk]

How does it work - if you in zwift claims you only weigh 60kg when you weigh 80kg - wouldnt that give you a huge advantage?

[@williamward7801]

Dogo confirms Lionel is a good human.

[@the_fast_life]

How do we settle it? We go to the hill and see who gets to the top first.....💡

[@notredame233]

Vinicius Canhedo gonna drop a sub-4hr Kona bike split this year apparently

[@rogerc23]

I thought S. Laidlow has it won already lol.

[@zacharypeattie]

I would love to know how you keep 500w and a hr of only 146bpm!?

[@rogerc23]

Strong heart. Clear arteries. Limber muscles.

[@jannekoskinen2050]

Max heart rate is individual and not an indicator of fitness. Someone might have max heart rate of 225 and other guy 165.

[@airzonaian]

Soo you came in 3rd?

[@theofflineadventurer8325]

This man is a freak of nature ❤️ with such a low heart rate at that much power, somehow I have the same condition, developing high power with a low heart rate, but not at that level. Good job Sanders 😊

[@MR-wh5wp]

I'm the same! I love how he said that when he is tired his heart rates doesn't move. Im the exact same. It will just sit on 140bpm while going hard and fast. Everyone else's heart rate seems to go higher when tired. Weird...

[@viccycling7862]

Tacx Neo smart trainers for everyone will take any of the guesses out of it. Will level the Plainfield. All within 1%

[@phxrsx]

Z power shouldn’t be allowed for any Zwift race.

[@ezeddie9747]

What is z power

[@MaximilianSaerath]

Just implement some social control everyone can post their setup and their weight before the race on social media should not be to hard to let them go if anyone is taking numbers from a wheel on trainer

[@mauricestephan8445]

Pls show the whole race

[@jamesgibson6846]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/nIPKnnqmfaZ2nsk

[@matthewbloom276]

Dude you need to do what you did in the first race, you can hold a ridiculous power a lot longer than everyone else. You need to go early, go hard and see who wants to suffer. You suffer better than anyone and you were in perfect position to go at the base of the climb. Obviously easy for me to say this being the one just watching 😂. Big love dude, love the videos as always!

[@gengar678]

Beast!!

[@wrxzboost]

161.4 rounds down baby! lol

[@B1gC4st]

What is Z Power?

[@lewisjohn2597]

I think it's the power from cadence and a speed sensor instead of an actual power meter 👍🏽

[@brunochampoux]

I don't see anyone on ZPower...

[@rogerc23]

So?

[@matitsershares5566]

Oh yeah yeah

[@phxrsx]

It’s funny how’s he’s talking and just sitting at 600 watts... lol

[@seulebrg]

Zwift power should just be forbidden as the ecycling sport becomes more mature. More likely, they should only allow auto-calibrating trainers (e.g. Tax Neo2t) or the power bikes.... Otherwise "racing" each other is pointless. Love the format though Lionel;)

[@Karl.M.P]

433watts.. Bro!

[@FitnessFundamentalsExplained]

08:31 e-zwift racers: "its a lol"

[@Tree25888]

@09:35 you said you won‘t win. Bro i think you know better than i how strong the brain is mindset is everything! If you don‘t want to climb again, it won‘t be as good as you can. You can win, i f*cking know it, do you know it to?

[@aounjose]

And now Lionel has a target on his back. There is no way anybody is gonna let him go with 2 k to the finish.

[@jmlgl]

Zwift is ok for what it is for trainning video game but what you see as far as performance is questionable by some. Take that same person hitting those huge number outside and i m sure it would be a different story.

[@manooms78]

Second!!!

[@bobbymac1972]

First!!!

[@keomo]

Pfff... just 'cause Z Power

[@bobbymac1972]

Kevin Boucher I’m on a Gen1 Wahoo Kickr. Bought it back in August 2014. Things a tank!

[@Queenmania2007]

You are a physiological anomaly Lionel, absolutely fascinating that even at 450W your HR can keep so low while other pro riders would be 20-30 beats higher!

[@Tomas-eb7qj]

I doesnt mean anything someone has naturaly low hr and someone high it is not related to perfomance

[@henrylee6602]

HR comparison is meaningless between athletes.

[@NoahT11112]

Third!!!!

[@rhysrunsriot]

I checked Zwiftpower and you basically won. The official results have you in 3rd and the two guys above you do not have adequate data to warrant still being on te leaderboard. So kind of annoying.

[@nadsim154]

Even if your trainer is giving you 100 watts more, Lionel doesn't care and will ask his body to keep up with you.

[@charlesborlase2238]

lol.....my trainer would have to give a lot more than 100 extra watts to be in front of Sanders. He's a beast.

[@fritzauguste6669]

Hey -- your character was drinking water but you were not .... mmmh I am suspicious if it was actually your character

[@averagesquares9140]

Fourth

[@johnlvs2run]

You shouldn't be talking when you're racing.

[@ChopStixLoL]

It seems very odd that these talented Zwift players don't bless the pro scene with their obvious talent (sarcasm)