Living with the Hyundai IONIQ PHEV - Real-world MPG test !

Thanks to Hyundai UK I had an Ioniq Plug-in Hybrid for a week and finally had the chance to put to test the fuel economy claims ! Can this car really do 250 miles per gallon ?
I go on a road trip with a range of different road types and journey lengths...but what will my MPG be ?
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[@fandango5900]

Beautiful. Can’t imagine not wanting a hybrid vs a bev for the next 10-15 yrs. Few worries yet huge mpg. A good transition car as long as it’s reliable. If I’m increasing my mpg by 50-100% every time I buy a car (every 10-15 yrs), then we continually proceed in right direction by reducing the effects of pollution. My first car in the early ‘70’s avg 11 mpg.

[@michaeltutty1540]

Mileage is a direct result of torque and revs. I had an 89 Mercury Grand Marquis I custom ordered. I was one of about 6 people who ordered the 5.8 litre (351CID) engine and the heavy duty trailer towing package. The torque output was 390 lb/ft at 2,200 rpm. With a 2.73:1 axle and 0.6:1 overdrive, the car was turning about 1,500 rpm on the motorway at 70 mph. Being in the thick of the torque, the engine never worked. On a straight run, the car returned 40 mpg in purely stock form. There were ways to upgrade from there. A solid, repeatable 55 mpg was achievable, although the car was wrecked in a crash before I got the work done. It also had the aerodynamics of a cardboard box. Oh, and that was with a carburetor and no computer anything. Makes me wonder what is wrong with modern cars.

[@Lewis_Standing]

Only of you plug em in. Of you do, it's quite a micromanagey experience having to do it every on the avg commute. Where as I can do 2-3 weeks on my full ev. Don't have to maintain a petrol engine, don't have to cart one around, don't have to burn a 30% efficient fuel. Don't have cold starts on an engine with poor mpg, and higher particulates.

[@Lewis_Standing]

@@michaeltutty1540 got 60mpg in my suzuki swift with dual injectors straight of the forecourt 🤷‍♂️

[@charlieharper4934]

I drive the big brother of the Ioniq plug-in, the Sonata plug-in, which I've had for two years. Last month (September), I used the car for my normal, daily routine of a 26 mile roundtrip into the city and back, with an occasional longer trek around the area. At the end of the month, I had logged 973 miles, on about 1/4 tank of gas. I decided to top up the tank to see just how much fuel I had used. It came to 4.54 gallons. That's 214 mpg. Not imaginary. Not incredibly unlikely. Just routine for this driving pattern. On a 1,000 mile vacation drive earlier this year, with no recharging, the mileage was over 50 mpg. And that's at interstate freeway speeds. IF you have a daily drive which falls within or just a bit over the full charge mileage limit, you will realize the seemingly mythical claims of 200 or more mile per gallon for these vehicles. It's just physics, after all.

[@PetrolPed]

Really interesting thank you. Pretty much what I say in this film 👍

[@brekkoh]

That's why the figure for fuel economy value for plug in hybrids and fuel electric vehicles is different because you don't get the full picture by excluding the energy cost of charging the vehicle.

[@peteroberts7637]

why do nun of these tests take into account of the cost of the electric

[@YamadaDesigns]

How often do you have to plug-in?

[@TheKrysis]

@@peteroberts7637 It's free, and charging it at your home it costs exactly £3.75

[@shawnsereal4175]

I have the 2018 Ioniq limited. My daily round trip commute to work and back is 64 miles. I fully charge my car every night. As of now, my average mpg is 82.6 mpg. My charge takes me approximately 25 miles cruising highway at 70mph. I use hybrid mode all the way to work which is 32 miles. Coming home I use all 29 miles of EV which usually last approximately 25 miles due to a couple of steep inclines and 70 mph speed. I think 82.6 is an excellent mpg for a vehicle with today's high gas prices. Too bad Hyundai didn't put a larger capacity battery in Ioniq PHEV. A battery that can do at least 50 miles would have made this the best phev ever created.

[@carssucksince1800s]

I think to improve fuel economy you'd drive EV on the streets, where stop and go is more common, and then switch to hybrid on the freeway and back to EV when getting off. But 68MPG is very good for a gasoline powered vehicle.

[@AsadKhan-yz9be]

I do 62.5mpg on hybrid And he drove mostly on motorway Plus if he bexome use to of ioniq its regenrate alot and will easily gives 72mpg i feel

[@YamadaDesigns]

I think PHEV is the best option for people who do not have long commutes but don’t want to commit to BEV and always have to worry about charging.

[@jakebookhunter7070]

Hi there! First of all: Thanks for your great reviews! This one helped me a lot, as I am in the middle of buying a hybrid... Considering the annoying "foot-hand-brake pedal" (...) in the Hyundai ionic.... guess, what I saw on the pics of the 2020 ionic facelift..???!! YES!! A button that looks to me like an electrical operated "Hand-brake-button" !! :-)) Keep up your good work! Greetings from Switzerland

[@frasermacleod7642]

Excellent review. Great to get real stats and figures and to see more of the issues that can arise with these vehicles on a daily basis. Cheers

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers Fraser :-)

[@BigVern1980]

Great video that highlights the difference between the lab tests and real world driving! As the lab tests are carried out over a very short distance and very little time at 70mph the results get skewed for hybrids giving rise to these daft numbers. Close to 70mpg on petrol in the real worl is impressive though so I would seriously consider one of these myself

[@FHB71]

I own the PHEV for a few weeks now and you are right, it all depends on how it is used. I have driven about 1600km so far and I have still half a tank of gas (ca. 20L). As soon as the wether gets colder, it will power up the ICE as soon as you start your drive, but it will just idle and charge the battery in order to produce warm water to warm the cabin, that will increase the fuel consumption a bit, but on the other hand, the engine is pre-warmed and will not have to power up with completely cold oil and deliver power when you push the pedal too far.

[@unwisemonkey2945]

This is exactly the video I was looking for. Thank you

[@debendragurung3033]

It aint bad. for 110 miles everyday it still sits in a sweet spot and i think it definitely did better than the hybrid. For hybrid you will get about 55mpg. It will prove very effective for short commuters. .Also it has one advantage over EV. there is no range anxietyfor occasional long journey. And you wont suffer from Cold weather winter mileage of the EV.

[@AsadKhan-yz9be]

In hybrid i usually get 62mpg and i drive like crazy

[@nicolasberchoux3782]

As always...a very interesting review. Thanks for it Ped. 👌👍😊

[@janettaschuch3591]

We have & love the Ionic blue hybrid. It gets 60 mpg up hill & 70 mpg downhill.

[@Inmate533]

Thumbs up mate. Most reviews I've read about the Ioniq say it averages 55 - 59 mpg for the typical morning commute.

[@eganfo]

I own a 2019 HEV and the adaptive cruise control is mighty impressive. I love it. Great car.

[@irishniall83]

3 Years old and find this helpful. Wife test drove a 2019 Ioniq PHEV and loved it. She has her current 206 11 years and only covered 30k miles on it in that time. with only city driving I think she could run this on EV alone. I drove it too and really liked it. Would never have considered one before only that she wants a PHEV and I started looking.

[@PetrolPed]

👍

[@AsadKhan-yz9be]

Iwill reccomend it to buy ioniq Best car With 62mpg if u drive only hybrid If u buy phev will be more better

[@davidcohen874]

Thanks. I will be adding petrol form time to time and quite often we exceed the battery range on the motorway so the engine does run but I will take your advice. In a proper charger it takes just over 2 hours or 4 hours on the mains. Even when the battery is run down it runs on EV at slower speeds. The heater takes a while to get going. Lets see what happens in the winter. We only add 10 litres so we add fresh petrol more often.

[@waynekerr3345]

I know why your car hadn't charged properly when you stayed at your friend's house... He switched it off, and thought cheeky bastard wanting to use all my electricity 😂😂

[@PetrolPed]

LOL 😂

[@kaya051285]

This is actually a problem With smart meters hopefully in the future you can plug in anywhere and the electricity used by your car will be billed to you directly rather than the home owner This way you can plug in anywhere and everywhere without offending anyone or feeling like you are taking the pi**

[@TheNodrog62]

@@kaya051285 a time will come when all residential street will come with street charging pods and we will.all.have a RFID type card that will sort out payments or pay a monthly subscription for free access

[@Lewis_Standing]

@@kaya051285 ubitricity - pay to charge from the lamppost on their street - 14p/kwh they say IIRC

[@Lewis_Standing]

@James Stewartor just you know be grown up about it, ask what his tariff is, pay them double and ask for a beer?

[@hugopendlebury]

You really shouldn’t use an extension lead and take such a large power draw whilst there is still cable on the coil. The safe wattage can be as much as half. Always fully uncoil the cable.

[@waqasahmed939]

Good life advice for cables in general tbh, not just for charging EVs

[@henryviiifake8244]

Does the inductance - when there's still cable coiled up - mess with whatever is on the end of the lead (a charging PHEV, in this case), or is there some other reason.

[@caedom21]

68mpg is brilliant. My 2017 5.0 V8 F150 is getting a combined 17.3mpg and the Honda Odyssey 3.5 V6 is getting 21.1 combined. This is a very entertaining and educational video. You don’t see too many real world tests. All you need is a Hamster and a May driving in a grand tour in the Ioniq’s top gear and I think you’d have a full episode.

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers Stephen, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@bobholmes4215]

This was spot-on. It perfectly demonstrated what I could expect to get out of a PHEV with the kind of trips I do. Thanks a lot! As an aside, I'd love to know how they calculated that 200+ mpg brochure figure.

[@PetrolPed]

So would I 😜😂

[@DermotCarroll]

I thought this was a really interesting piece! Especially since I have just taken delivery of a 2017 c350e estate. This has a rather small electric range od 19 kilometers, or in real speak about 10 miles. I work remotely, so from Monday to Friday most of my driving is to the shop to buy lunch, which is less than a two mile trip - I expect Monday to Friday will be free motoring. I think the plugin hybrid works in an inverted say to thinking about most other ICE vehicles. These are way better for short hop journeys, and get more thirsty as the journeys get longer. I was out and about today, and was getting 70+ mpg, until I started to play with sport+ mode. Oh boy - can this car be fast!! 0 to 62 in 5.9 seconds - a claimed figure, but I believe it! I love the way it blips on the down changes - but I think this mode is likely to greatly assist in the collection of penalty points!!! I am in two minds of how to be OCD with this car - Should I try to maximise my fuel consumption, or do I have a ball and see how low I can get it?? :D ... I am kind of kidding! ... I didn't set out to buy a PHEV, but I found the car, got a good deal, and here I am. By the way, my last car was an e350CDI, which I liked! ... It was a proper broad-shouldered, hairy-chested motorway muncher! I am very surprised to see how much nicer the C-class is to drive! NOt sure if PHEVs are the answer though. Apparently the batteries die after about 6 years, and cost ... about 6,000 to replace. That's ok the first time around - but what happens when the car is 10 to 12 years old? ... when it's not economically sensible to spend that sort of money? ... Surely this is not a green future? All governments are pushing us towards EV/Hybrid vehicles, in a similar way to how we were being pushed towards diesels! Tuens out Clarkson was right, when he called diesels the fuel of satan! .. What is the answer? I personally don't think it's electric - issues with lithium supply, disposal, recycling, power availability - we seem to be rushin headlong to a global power supply shortage. Am not hearing anything about hydrogen, even though the benefits appear to be massive! Haha .. apologies for "war and peace" .... but I think this is an interesting discussion! Keep up the great trend of delivering such brilliant videos! Thank you Sir!

[@armor1303]

Thank you for your time 🙏🙏

[@rolonow12]

Great video as always. You calculated fuel was 5.24 galls but divided range by 5.34. So mpg is slightly better at almost 70. As a Panamera Hybrid owner, I average 34, but not envious. I do love the nil VED though (registered before April 2017). A Panamera Hybrid has a switch to recharge while driving which I use when cruising above 60, so that I can have EV mode in built up areas, mpg suffers a little. On a 2500 mile Euro Drive last month, I didn't bother taking the charge cable with me. I see as little as 10 miles and up to 22miles EV range fully charged, but it needs to be driven really slow to maximise the range, not something I do. I' m fully converted to Hybrid and hope to change up to the current Panamera soon. Thanks again for well presented and edited videos.

[@PetrolPed]

It was a slip of the tongue 😛In my full review of the Ioniq that goes live on Monday I actually say that the only PHEV I would currently consider was the Panamera Sport Turismo. A simply awesome car 👍

[@octaneparker6200]

A brilliant honest review, well done.

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers Stuart :-)

[@jadams3427]

Nice report, thanks. I get an average of 66mpg out of a Polo TDi 90. It has some naughty tuning by BSR that gives me 132hp. I don't often demand a lot of power, and don't slow down or use brakes often. I prefer the simplicity of a pure IC engine car. I had thought of changing to a Hyundai Ioniq full hybrid. I think I will wait a while and go to full EV when the charging infrastructure is adequate, and I no longer go on trans-European trips.

[@mikees60]

I've been driving a Golf GTE plug in hybrid for the past 3 years, and my journey to work and back is about 25 miles, so the majority of commuting is on purely battery. On a long journey I tend to run in hybrid and save the battery for congestion and driving at slower speeds, through villages etc. I tend not to use the battery on motorways, unless I'm stuck in traffic. Pre heating the car whilst it's plugged into the mains also saves battery. On average throughout the year I average about 180 mpg.

[@PetrolPed]

WOW...so interesting ! That is exactly the kind for journey/ownership I was trying to explain in the vid. Thanks for sharing :-)

[@JIMMYHIBBS1]

This is interesting - I also do about 25 miles (max) a day - so in theory I could (look at) leasing a GTE and the cost of the lease is paid for by my savings in fuel costs (maths needed - but certainly in part)

[@driveXperience]

Proper test! You name the problems. We didn't get very far in pure e-drive with brandnew VolvoXC40 Plug-In-Hybrid in our film...

[@ltkwok2961]

The hybrid & EV should be thought of separately. Miles per gallon of petro for hybrid and miles per kilowatt hour for EV. So MPG would be 52 and MP kWh would be 3.25 (29 mile EV range /8.9 kWh battery).

[@iainmillar1532]

Exactly, I wish the car companies would report both separately.

[@johns14a]

Very interesting Pete. I don't think I've seen a real world test carried out by a non Eco-mentalist before, so I find this very, very useful. I've been running a V90 T8 PHEV for the past nine months and only ever plug it in at night. Two or three days a week I'm just on short runs so only ever use electric which of course means infinite MPG but of course still incurs a cost for the electricity used. It does however mean that, around town, I'm not adding to the pollution and noise being generated by other motorists. The rest of the time I run in Hybrid mode on a mix of fast A roads and motorways. I use the power available (and it's a quick car in a straight line) and cruise on the motorways a near the legal limit. That type of driving gets me 57/58 mpg (measured, not relying on the trip computer), which for a car that's the size and weight of a medium sized continent is really quite good. Interestingly a mate has a V90 D5 and he gets 32mpg in town and 50mpg out and about. Now that's not a massive difference and when you take the difference in price of the cars into account then the PHEV probably isn't worth it over a three year period. But I do like just slipping along silently in town or in traffic jams on the motorway. My wife would use her Ioniq almost exclusively in electric only mode only needing petrol extended range three or four times a month, so that makes it a whole different ball game. In those conditions then I think a PHEV is a bit of a no brainer.

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers John. Very interesting :-)

[@happysporran]

Only 4 years late with my comment! Excellent video, highlights my dilemma. My 15 mile commute would be perfect for a plug-in, but I usually cycle! For my longer journeys only a standard hybrid or a Tesla seems to make sense.

[@PetrolPed]

Glad it helped!

[@karlint39]

Nice video with practical information. Since someone has to pay for the electricity too, it would have been interesting if you had measured the amount of electricity you put in. Clearly the price of electricity varies from location to location, but from both a cost perspective as well as a pollution perspective, the electricity is still half of the story in the case of a PHEV.

[@EagleShieldBay]

In Sweden we never put handbrake on unless parked on an incline. Reason: if handbrake is applied, it will freeze in the on position, making it very difficult to move driving with handbrake stuck on.

[@pradogxld4d]

Top review as usual !

[@PetrolPed]

🙏🏻

[@Martin-dx5zs]

Great test!! I bought a Nissan leaf as my first ever car and skipped the hybrid drivetrain, but I think this offers a great option for those scared to go straight to a battery electric :)

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers. Glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@Rhaman68]

Hi. A bit of a correction. I have a 2018 Ioniq PHEV and zero EV miles does not mean zero electric energy in the battery. The hybrid mode kicks in a zero EV miles, yes, but using the car’s display shows up to 18-20% battery levels that enables car movement on electric only depending on set conditions in the software. From a set low charge level or when road conditions demand, the engine runs and recharges the EV battery to that 15% or so higher level so as to perpetuate hybrid mode. In a 289 mile trip last year, hybrid mode yielded 63.7 MPG. All of this magic happens with an 8.9 KWh battery and a 59 HP!!!!!! electric motor! It’s is an astonishingly zero to ultra low emissions vehicle. Thanks Ohio, USA

[@ginggur17]

The Vito vans have the same foot ‘hand’ brake. When you pull the catch to release them, they can go with a hell of a bang if you don’t place pressure on the pedal as ya do it.

[@washubrain]

Thanks for the reveiw. That's what I'd expect from the hybrids realistically. In terms of fuel economy on the long journeys I guess they offer little, if any, advantage over the diesel cars. If your daily routine is in the range of 15 to 20 miles then I guess the economy is great.

[@PetrolPed]

Spot on :-)

[@rdr555]

The 3pin plug in lead is NOT TO BE USED WITH AN EXTENSION LEAD. (Plug in Hybrid Brochure 2020)

[@WolvesInferno]

Excellent video. I am at some stage thinking of getting an Ioniq Plug-in Hybrid sometime as my next car. I currently have a late 2012 Toyota Auris/Corolla Hybrid and it's a fantastic car, and much cheaper to run than an average diesel. I get usually a combined MPG of 75 to 85 or so MPG. Believe it or not, I get more mpg in the summer. I do have a very light foot, and on motorways, I keep to around 58 to 62 mph. Overall it's a fantastic car and has been much much cheaper to run than my previous 1.6 VW Golf petrol, which got 45 to 55 mpg.

[@martingrady7654]

I own a KIA PHEV, for 2 years and 26 thousand miles, battery = about 32miles. I have a 7kw at home and a standard 3kw plug at work. Work is 10 miles away, that works out 5000mile per year all from the battery, I charge sometimes 3 x per day, sometimes full or sometimes just a top up. I normally from my work travel 20 to 50 miles each day visiting clients who are local, then once every 2 weeks travel more than 150miles. Weekends I take the kids to footy, go shopping all the normal stuff and normally do each journey witin the 32 miles, my last car I was spending £85 plus per week on fuel, now its more like £10 per week if that. So its basically its horses for courses, the car works for me, but if someone is doing 100 mile trips per day, then it will never work, if you are doing 100mile trips per day, then get an EV. My electric cost worksout to about £10 per every 400ish miles. Sorry to go on, but when peoplel say things like my desiel does 64mpg, then yeah maybe, but it all depends on the journeys you have to take. One big thing is its a company car and on my BIK i have saved a good £2500 in tax.

[@PetrolPed]

Thanks for this Martin. Really interesting :-)

[@donnaouellet219]

This was way more informative than the Hyundai salesman who quoted 119 miles on EV alone. Excellent explanation about how the EV and Hybrid actually interact.

[@PetrolPed]

Thanks Donna 👍

[@jaroessa294]

PHEV's seem to be the best option at this point. They give you the convenience of an all-EV car when you are doing errands around town, but the reassurance of a regular ICE vehicle when you need to make that long trip to go on vacation or visit family in another state for the holidays. No range anxiety or "I need to find a supercharger NOW" worries with this vehicle. We were slated to buy a Chevy Volt (because it had the highest EV-only range of all the PHEVs), but once GM announced they were stopping production, we got worried and cancelled the purchase. Now, we're back to searching for a regular ICE vehicle.

[@0hypnotoad0]

It's the best option for somebody who wants to dip their toes in without springing for a long range electric. The electric fuel economy on PHEVS is not as good as BEV due to the added weight of the engine. Admittedly though if EV demand does explode in the future then PHEVs may become more common due to their higher availability. A big demand for very large EV batteries could eventually put stress on the mining supply causing a shortage of BEV's to meet consumer demand, and in that case PHEV would be a good solution since their batteries are quite a lot smaller. The Hyundai Ioniq stands head and shoulders above other PHEVs in this regard, really great e-fuel economy in it's class.

[@YamadaDesigns]

Nicely said. If you want to be reassured that they won’t stop production, go for Toyota and Honda, who are much more invested in hybrid electric vehicles

[@johndoyle4723]

I spotted the extension lead problem immediately, however.. The keys to good MPG, are do not waste your battery on motorways/dual carriage ways, save it for town driving and low speed stop/start, as you mentioned always plan to arrive home with zero battery. If you can use the regen manually, better to coast, rather than regen and power up again. Pre heat the car whilst plugged in if you can. Finally these cars really only suit those with a certain typical daily mileage, for long distances, a diesel wins, yes I know they are not flavour of the month, but we are talking MPG. Thanks for the video, very interesting.

[@Tore_Lund]

Yes you know it too: Regen is only efficient at higher speed. When you get below 35mph or so, better coast and store the energy as kinetic energy in your moving vehicle, i.e. time your red lights. There are numerous reasons for that: #1 electric motor efficiency drops at lower loads like braking lightly. #2 The voltage the motor produces driven as a generator drops as the rpm drops and if it is lower than the pack voltage, nothing gets back into the battery. #3 Even when doing regen at high speed, charge efficiency is poor in Li-ion batteries 15% is lost. So just keep all your old hypermileing tricks from when you drove a fossil powered car and your range will improve.

[@andrzejszczygiel85]

We've owned a 2017 model Toyota Prius for over 2 years, from new. On a longish journey like yours, I regularly get 70 to 85mpg, Fuel consumption in the colder months is slightly lower. We are considering a PHEV, but most of our daily journeys are sub 30 miles, so I think in the long run our fuel savings will be considerable.

[@Lewis_Standing]

I get 180mpg equivalent in my kona electric 👍 on one slightly downhill journey

[@davidcohen874]

We have had this car since the beginning of April. It suits our motoring perfectly. We mostly do about 30 miles and always plug it in on our charger when we come home. SO WE PUT PETROL IN FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE THEn. 10L YES 10 L. The brake is a pain but you get used to it and you can leave the car in Park on a flat surface. Great Tech and safety features. If you use Adaptive Cruise Control and Lane Keep Assistance the car will steer itself and you only need to hold the steering wheel lightly. We love it. The sound system is not very stereo so could be better.

[@tonyb1223]

You may have done better with an all electric vehicle, if you hsve not topped up the fuel since April, that in itself can cause issues as fuel does "go off" over time. The thing with a hybrid is you are suppose to run the engine as well (again, not doing so or running for short periods of time can cause issues), I would suggest a good weekly run out using only the engine.

[@PetrolPed]

Thanks David. Interesting to hear about your ownership :-)

[@jefferiespj1]

Enjoyed that Peter very interesting 😁👍

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers Paul :-)

[@michellenotherday1482]

Nice job! Thanks!

[@mad636man]

What a clever transition between days!!! Nice video!!

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers, glad you enjoyed it :-)

[@jamesmgreen15]

Thanks for a v solid non fanboy review. All I would say is that working in gallons can lead to confusion across the pond, as most will not immediately remember imperial v USA volumes differ. I dislike those foot parking brakes too. Get used t it I guess but I remember a merc I drove once had one with a clutch - plain silly.

[@PetrolPed]

I am still amazed at how much debate the whole MPG question with this car generated :-)

[@jamesmgreen15]

@@PetrolPed Yes:) In the end it's still a case of the market having to meet the product too much in any mass just go to way. If an ice car had a 4 gallon tank it would be laughed off the market. EVs are working for more in what is still early doors:)

[@kernowrock555]

Love this Ioniq, the design and interior look lovely. The only worry is 'finding' a place to charges overnight , not all of us have friends ...with 'driveways' , I think the only way forward is charge -points integrated into lamp posts ? so anyone can charge on the street..

[@PetrolPed]

That is a good idea. Charging infrastructure is certainly something that needs addressing. For now you could go for the Hybrid version :-)

[@yggdrasil9039]

Yes please, a full review of this car. I'm still concerned about the DCT and also the interaction of the DCT with EV and also if there is any control over the hybrid engine, and also if you can increase the regen braking strength like you can in the Ioniq full EV with 0 to 3 on the paddle shifters. Also can you please floor it coming out of a roundabout and tell us what happens. Does it randomly shift in and out of EV and DCT/hybrid?

[@mikeytrw]

Yeah you read the instructions it says don't use cheap extensions. They're not made to handle a solid 2kw draw for hours on end.

[@rickymills8612]

Great video! Very interesting!

[@PetrolPed]

Cheers Ricky :-)

[@flash-us9bn]

I've had a hybrid ioniq almost 5 months and average 72mpg. Just short journeys 66mpg. On an 8hr journey down to Wales I saw an average of 81.2mpg. I love the thing.

[@PetrolPed]

That's great to hear :-)

[@TheBeggFamily]

My wife hates the idea of plugging in a car, so we have a full blown hybrid, Toyota Yaris. We love it, though the results are much better than any of our previous ICE only cars, but not as good as a plug in COULD be or our son’s full electric. Annually we travel down to Southampton for a cruise, which would be a nightmare in an electric car and soon use up the electric miles of a PHEV. We get 55-60 mpg depending on the time of year, so the change with the PHEV is not startling for all the faff on with plugging in.

[@Lewis_Standing]

Are you sure it would be a nightmare? How does your son manage? + Hyundai ioniq 5 fully charges in 18 mins on the right charger

[@TheBeggFamily]

@@Lewis_Standing Since this post I've part exchanged the hybrid for a battery electric Renault ZE50.

[@michaeltutty1540]

Most interesting indeed. I particularly enjoy the real world conditions that make the cars you test perform in suboptimal conditions. Even at that, the conditions you encounter are better by far, and your distances much shorter, than we face here on Central Ontario, Canada. We won't even get into Northern Ontario. Just forget about the Arctic where my brother lives. I don't think any EV or hybrid is going to do well at -60.

[@Lewis_Standing]

There is a few Norwegian and Finnish youtune channels that are okay at - 30. - 60 does seem like a no no though. Tbf I'd probably stay inside on those days

[@stevee6305]

With a Hybrid Ioniq with standard wheels, I was steadily doing 77MPG, as winter set in (and a slow puncture) it's now 72MPG. Mileage was 66miles a day though.

[@stevevater8598]

Honda civic does 63mpg in stop start driving , nearly 80mpg on motorway , will last at least 15 years of fault free motoring .

[@zaypeaceIslamstories]

@@stevevater8598 which yeah model

[@zaypeaceIslamstories]

Hybrid ionic which yeah and type is it ?

[@jrh1901]

Great review as ever Ped. A very good car but I can see no reason what I would swap my Vauxhall Ampera for one as the Ampera, despite it's age matches or betters the Ioniq in almost every area. I see a real 50 miles of battery range in summer and near thirty in freezing conditions with a further 320 miles or so on the petrol 'generator' if required. I'm much more tempted with the Kona which seems to offer the very real possibility of owning a car without the reliance of a petrol engine as back up.

[@PetrolPed]

I'd like to drive the Kona next. I only here good things about it :-)

[@stubones]

"Without going anywere near the ICU"... In many countries that stands for Intensive Care Unit, which you definitely want to stay away from ;) Great review Ped, it was pretty fascinating, I'm not convinced on Hybrid myself. I prefer a simple powertrain for now; one economical diesel engine, 60mpg/circa 800miles of motorway range. My great uncle had an old 1970's diesel Merc (no turbo so it was slower than a dead tortoise) , which had a foot "hand" brake if I recall.

[@PetrolPed]

I heard myself say ICU and thought exactly the same !!

[@vincecaruso2459]

We have a Prius Prime 2017 and have used only about 1 1/2 tank last year with about 3,500 miles, 230 mpg. The car has the highest rated of any car electric or not at 133 mpge. Some of the gas was used when it was not needed to use up old gas and get the engine running for a bit. We get about 30 miles to a charge. Plug it in at night and normally do not need to run the engine on most trips. We live near where we work and shop. Use EBikes for some commuting and shopping. Wonder if in years to come we will be able to update the LI battery in the car and get more E Miles and better mpge.

[@SchottGun76]

I'm currently looking at both this car and the Prius Prime. I'm curious with you plugging it every night for the charge. What type of increase do you see in your electric bill?

[@simonworsley8551]

Yes, definitely a fire hazard, always unwind the extension lead fully. Also should plug into car first then the mains.

[@PetrolPed]

Point taken. Many thanks :-)

[@hongkongfuey6882]

In my Outlander I can heat the car through the app before I jump in and whilst it's charging. Also I can hit 'save' to conserve electric power. It takes _months_ to work out how to eek out extra miles. Whatever you get in the first few weeks can almost be doubled over you've learned his to operate the car. Ps, electricity _IS_ fuel

[@davidwratten7728]

Overnight charge extension lead tripped !!! Had he unwound the lead, if it was not the inductance loop would have got very hot tripping it. The charging indicator in the widow was working when he locked the car. Do not understand the dislike of the foot brake, Mercs have them not an unusual means of a parking brake.

[@PetrolPed]

My bad not unwinding the extension lead. Foot brake is just a personal dislike ;-)

[@paulashton5990]

Impossible to do handbrake turns.

[@oloilmann4288]

I was used to my handbrake in my Prius C. I've had my Ioniq 3 months and still forget to release the foot brake. It takes time.

[@TekAutomatica]

Hot tripping - is that when the pedestrian is consuming a hot beverage?

[@yvesklein669]

Thanks buddy, for answering my question on MPG. My Audi computer said I could travel 485 miles on a full tank when new. Now it's down to 453. Still cheaper to drive a Plug-in Hybrid.

[@PetrolPed]

You get a better spot in Monday’s Collaboration Review 👍

[@yvesklein669]

Petrol Ped Thanks!

[@malcolmbrew8815]

Excellent informative.

[@PetrolPed]

Thanks Malcolm :-)

[@tomm1359]

I have a 2020 Ioniq PHEV and I only travel on short trips. I have used very little gas. I filled up 1/2 tank after 6 months. I had to force my car in Hybrid mode and Sport mode to use up gas. I don't think it would be good to let the gas engine sit for too long. I also use ethanol free gas, because I heard lead free gas is not good for the engine. I have to plan longer trip somewhere to use the gas in my tank, and to run the engine. So far it's been a great car. I like the fact that if I do go on a long trip I won't be looking for a charger. I have 10k solar panels and 2 tesla power walls installed at my house. My next car will be a Tesla. Hopefully the prices will come down by the time I am ready for a new car.

[@dagysteinjohansen7268]

I think all sorts of tests are kinda cool, and usually interesting. This one, too. But I think it is important to point out that this test is not very *relevant* to the overwhelming majority of drivers/car buyers. Very few people drive hundreds of miles even once a week, and a lot of people drive only about 20 miles a day on average - close to that "every day", a bit more a few times a month, but really long trips (say, more than 300 miles) not even once a year. So they end up doing something like 12000 miles of short trips, 2000 miles of medium trips, and 400 miles of long trips. Clearly, what matters then is that the car is efficient on short trips. Which the Ioniq definitely is, btw. In many places, it is worth doing a little math. You might save significant money (and time) getting the all-electric Ioniq instead, which has a combined EPA range of 124 miles, and e-mpg rating of a whopping 150 in the city! (e-mpg is "equivalent miles per gallon", the number of miles a vehicle can drive (under certain conditions!) consuming the energy in one gallon of gasoline - regardless of whether that energy actually comes from gasoline, or some other source. It exists to make it easy to compare the energy efficiency of vehicles using different energy sources. And btw, this PHEV and all others on the market as far as I know really cheat when they calculate MPG: they count *only* the gasoline used, but divide it on _all_ the miles. So if you drive 20 miles on electricity and 10 miles on gasoline using a fifth of a gallon, you'll get 30/0.2 = 150. But if you drove 20 miles on electricity and 1 mile on gasoline using 0.02 gallons, in other words the *same* efficiency, the car would report that as 21/0.02 = 1050. I think using mpg in such a way is extremely dishonest, because most people think of mpg the way it was intended - as a measure of efficiency. At best, this way of calculating mpg is a measure of the tailpipe emissions (and the upstream emissions from gasoline, but not from electricity). So, in this test, when he drove hybrid mode and got mpg = 56, then switched off the engine and ran down the battery, boosting mpg to 75, it is a LOT less impressive than it sounds, and compares rather badly (considering it is massive cheating!) to the *e-mpg* (i.e. *real* efficiency) of the Ioniq electric. It isn't even possible to have the car report e-mpg, although this could of course easily be done. In fact, all the data needed to do this simple calculation is reported by the car - it just chooses to present the meaningless (electric miles + gasoline miles) / (gasoline used) "mpg" instead.

[@z1az285]

124 Mile range is low for most electric vehicles today. I'm surprised the Hyundai ioniq EV still has this low range, but it will only improve going forward. That being said, PHEV's do offer advantages for a lot of US commuters especially for those who mostly drive within cities. Certainly not perfect, but better than gasoline guzzling cars and a big step forward.

[@danieldarcy7862]

Thanks for the vid. The point surely is that this journey was about as "worse case" as it could be; its a long journey that most people (me included) would only make occasionally, and the battery was not charged as it should have been. Had the battery been fully charged overnight and the trip not gone in the extension lead, one of the journeys would have used no fuel at all. Had you plugged in at the workplace where it turns out there was a charge point then another 37 miles of petrol driven miles would have been saved. That probably equates to a gallon of fuel saved overall and in that case the overall consumption would have been 366/ 4.24 which equates to 86.32 mpg. Agree with comments about the foot handbrake. I notice the 2020 version has an electronic one!! The PHEV is on my shortlist.

[@PetrolPed]

Yep 👍

[@danieldarcy7862]

​@@PetrolPed Although the parameters of this test were not typical of the average person's use and therefore a bit unfair on the car, Hyundai claiming 250 mpg without defining the breakdown of journey types is just marketing hype. They could just as well claim 500 mpg or infinity mpg!! Potential buyers have to work out for themselves whether it suits their typical journey pattern and in my case i think the PHEV is ideal. Annoying though that the dear old UK government gives no incentives to purchasers of plug-ins any more, a car that is so good for the environment, even to the extent of charging the same road tax as a 30mpg SUV gas guzzler! Hardly a green policy.

[@jfan4reva]

Lots of highway driving will kill a hybrid's fuel mileage. The last time I checked, a Prius gets about the same gas mileage around town as it gets on the highway. Also, highway driving is mostly constant speed and has very little stop and start driving. This doesn't give the car much of a chance to recharge the battery with braking. If you have a 100 mile commute every day, this isn't the car for you.If you have something more reasonable like 20-50 miles (30k - 80k), it might be.

[@jonscoupe]

In theory these plug in hybrids are a good idea and I have a few friends who have recently acquired hybrid cars. When they first had their cars, they plugged them in all the time, but the novelty soon wore off Peter and now they don't bother to 'plug them in' any more because they either forget or can't be bothered. I think it will be a while before we adjust to these cars. Cheers, Jon.

[@PetrolPed]

I'm glad I'm not the only one !

[@ricco123tube]

I travel 50 miles twice a week and 25 miles a day the rest of the week all around town so I reckon it would be a great choice for someone like myself who may do the odd long trip. Motorway driving is for evs such as the Kona or Tesla etc and not hybrids or phevs. Its a shame you didn’t do a town comparison as thats where the hybrid part would have come into its own and a 60mile trip may well have achieved great mpg.

[@PetrolPed]

I agree about the town driving. Sadly that wasn't really in my travel plans that week :-(

[@AsadKhan-yz9be]

Hybrid or ev or phev all car gives very less miles on motorway I have ioniq from last 4years No problem and love it

[@pnf44]

Nice job. I like the real world approach to reviewing the car. I signed for one, this morning and will pick it up in a day or so. I have a Niro EV.... now I will try an Ioniq PHEV.

[@PetrolPed]

I love the Niro 👍

[@nowisthetime6093]

Am thinking of buying a 2018 Ioniq phev soon. Would be interested in your opinion on it since you've purchased it. Are you happy with it? Has it lived upto your expectations on fuel savings? etc...

[@TheKandyGuy]

Interesting video...!! Korean car is better than Japanese Lexus it seems when it comes to MPG.. I have had few Highbred Lexus they never did what Lexus clams, also did not have enough power too, now I have a 450h got power that I like but need to see the MPG...

[@unpluggedEV]

You use the EV mode during slower speeds and use the hybrid mode on the highway to save the battery capacity for when going slower again. City->EV, highway->hybrid. This will maximise your MPG. The Outlander PHEV im driving has also a charge button which can recharge the battery during driving on the highway so you arrive with a higher level battery for city driving. You said it at <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1110">18:30</a> arrive at home with an empty battery. ABC - always be charging.

[@PetrolPed]

Sounds like a good technique you've got there. This car doesn't have a recharge button, it will keep the battery topped up but won't fully recharge the battery like some hybrids.

[@TekAutomatica]

Mitsubishi dealers no longer accepting outlandish PHIBS in px if over 3 years old due to battery issues. Most units damaged by remaining too low on charge or abused by hard driving at low soc.

[@AidanMillward]

Got 83mpg out of one of these driving down the M40 between Birmingham and Stratford. They can do massive amounts if you drive them properly.

[@PetrolPed]

It's all about where and how you drive them :-)

[@AidanMillward]

Regularly get 70 in town 😉

[@yushanyasindu9762]

If your one overnight charge works i'm pretty sure it should do 75mpg. In my experiance with real world calculations prius can't get no were near what ioniq achive. Plus lower maintaince cost it really worth every penny.

[@dvrify1]

69 mpg in a mixed cycle is impressive. In my diesel car, I can only achieve it by crawling at 50 mph on an empty motorway and using every bit of decline to coast, which is very exhausting. Thanks for this real-world review! P.S. Wonder if one can improve on that with some more hypermiling techniques? Regen-braking seems more like a gimmick and I wonder whether it could be turned off in that car.

[@PetrolPed]

I didn't really go for the lowest MPG. I just drive normally. If I really tried I am sure I could get a better number :-)

[@dvrify1]

@@PetrolPed Well, that's even more impressive. I wish the petrol engine recharged the battery and I'm sold. Looking forward to the next test!

[@Brett1psp]

The trick to a plug in hybrid is even if it’s cold you deal with just seat warmers and heated steering wheel. Using the actual heater kills all range. I have a 2015 ford fusion or as you guys were called in the UK is a Ford mondeo, plug-in hybrid

[@PetrolPed]

Nice tip :-)

[@justjc51]

About your question on plugging in at a charger for a work day, the answer is that it is considered very rude. It is however ok, as long as it is charging, so if you set a timer or make it so you get a notification when the car is fully charged and then move it everything is good ;-)

[@alanbutterfield8057]

Hi Peter, you need to ask Hyundai under what conditions they get 250 MPG as you have shown under normal every day driving the numbers don't add up. Great video I just love how all the car companies make claims that just don't up. Truly Alan B x

[@kissmeraas]

It's not them, it's a standardised test that all cars have to go through and advertise the results by law. The test is in a lab, mpg figures aren't real, but rather extrapolated from emissions, and only lasts a short while so Hybrids can do it almost entirely on battery power alone...

[@PetrolPed]

It must be a standard test but I’m not sure what it looks like 🤔

[@kissmeraas]

@Petrol Ped - It looks like *this* kzbin.info/www/bejne/pIiqkH56fM2Hh5o

[@yggdrasil9039]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1187">19:47</a> West Sussex - my old stamping ground :)

[@paulcarnall791]

I skipped the hybrid and went for a 30kwh leaf. It was for my commute to work of 70miles return Mon to Fri. My wife's petrol car a Kia picanto was to be our long distance car. I have now done 24k miles in 15months and the leaf has become our 1st car. Even on longer journey's. Just did 500 miles in a weekend in the lake District . Charging at 50kwh chargers. No problems whatsoever. Also to Birmingham 220 miles return and to Cleethorpes for fish n chips. Would never go back to fossil fuels. Also my wife now wants a ZOE . Looks like shell and BP are going to lose our custom.

[@PetrolPed]

Wow, that is brilliant ! I've driven a Zoe and thought it was a great little car :-)

[@TekAutomatica]

You need to account for total energy useage not just petrol! Diesel is around 10kwh per litre. Bit like cycling from Birmingham to London but getting a, lift in a van part way whilst claiming only 5 litres of water consumption and ignoring the fast food eaten in the van at the M1 service station! Evs are older than gasoline ones - first Porsche was electric in 1890s

[@darkhorse2reign]

Lithium ion batteries are most efficient between about 60 and 80 degrees Fahrenheit. Below 60 degrees your batteries will not work as efficiently. They are "full" but won't give you a full charge on very cold days. Similar on a hot day. As far as driving situations, plug in hybrids are most fuel efficient in stop and go city driving, heavy to moderate traffic on the highway and less efficient on regular highway driving. In my 2015 Ford CMAX Energi I have mastered saving the battery for the situations that will make it give the most bang for the buck. Driving as you did with the electric on the open highway is not optimal vs gasoline. I also do NOT use the air heater on cold mornings... I use the seat heaters instead. As far as MPG compared to my car - 68.5 MPG is phenomenal. I'm getting right at 51 MPG for the past 84,000 miles. That's down from approximately 60 MPG because I started doing much more Uber/Lyft.

[@fintrollpgr]

Actually you need to drive in EV when you have lots of start-stop traffic, like city driving. On the motorway you want hybrid. You have been doing the exact opposite of what you should do.

[@YamadaDesigns]

fintrollpgr is there an automatic setting you can use so the car automatically does this?

[@hyperspaced77]

His point is that when you use the vehicle on your daily commute, you want to reach home with zero charge. The question is: can you drive one the motorway at e.g. 70-80mph on EV only?

[@arenjay3278]

@@hyperspaced77 You drive EV mainly in slower lower hybrid mpg mode and then use Highway 75+ mph in hybrid mode. You use the EV battery up and don't leave it charged. Regen is made to recharge the battery it can cause drag if the battery is full, without added benefit. The Electric Ioniq has the option to turn the regen off. PHEV version should use up the regen, best in city urban driving, then recharge as you drive. Don't drive in hybrid mode if you have a full battery. Use up any EV mode before you get home.

[@Marmocet]

Hybrids typically achieve better fuel economy in stop-and-go driving than they do cruising at motorway speeds.

[@philipparkes5079]

Hi Ped Very interesting review once again. Makes a nonsense of the ridiculous mpg claims which I feel are totally misleading. Not sure that I would choose this form of technology although I can see the perceived advantage. Still believe as a Dinasour that there is still progress to be made with clean Diesel engines before 2040!

[@PetrolPed]

You should try the Porsche e-Hybrid...right up your street :-)

[@classic287]

The idea of a plugin is to plug it in before it's fully discharged...

[@brandoncarr441]

Great vid. Good figures, however funny that we forget electricity cost money as well, so its not just about mpg really. You're spending money on charging it every night, although probbably for 1/2 of the price for the electric range that would be for purely on fuel.

[@yggdrasil9039]

The only thing that puts me off about the PHEV Ioniq is the dual clutch gears, as the CVT I'm used to is fantastic. But the fact that this is 3/4 the price of the full EV makes it an attractive option, although slightly out of range for my commute on just EV.

[@PetrolPed]

The gearbox is really smooth :-)

[@dumirazvan8741]

@@PetrolPed the ecvt is a much simpler gearbox and whit minimal cost! Much better way to go for a phev hibrid whit ecvt!

[@nickiemcnichols5397]

Wow I want one!

[@mlabrador4276]

It wouldn´t be difficult to add the cost of electric energy you used in the test: kWh you used x price of kWh and then add it to the fuel cost. I´m sorry to say that the analysis you do is kind of useless if you do not take into consideration the cost of the electricity, because the mpg you get during the test is completely dependent on how many times the batteries are charged.

[@trojertroj2422]

You are a philosopher

[@aandccash8951]

If the car had been properly/fully charged on one of your overnight stops, it would have added at least 20 miles to your range. Adding add that 20 miles on to your 366 driven miles, then you would have had an mpg in the low 70s.....which is pretty darn good and several mpg better than the (very good) "real world" figure you arrived at! Other than that, like the video! I reckon if you mainly do short trips then this car is a smart choice and you can do the occasional 'petrol trip' without the dramas of locating and being able to use a public charging station, simply charge whenever your arrive home (and what a bonus if you have solar EV panels!).

[@PetrolPed]

Glad you enjoyed it 👍

[@amp2amp800]

Nice story, thanks! Take away point seems to be that the petrol consumption of the plug-in hybrid in typical conditions is only a tiny bit better than the (plugless) pure hybrid. I can be swayed by both environmental and personal economic arguments. But as someone who needs an invalid parking spot (no power convenient outlet) both the electric and plug-in hybrid Ioniq models are still far too impractical for my serious consideration. I can't charge up at home, on the street, or faff about for an hour during long journeys. That reality will only change after a massive and enlightened investment in providing public charging points on the street. This investment hasn't happened yet. When it does come (and it must), even then it will be mostly window dressing. The real issue here is that 50% of UK electricity generation still comes from coal and gas. Electricity production efficiency from these combined sources is under 50% and losses in distribution are also around 50%. On the other hand, combustion engine efficiency is around 20% and there is also a carbon cost in delivering the fuel to the garage courtyards that can't be ignored. On balance then, the environmental impact of running pure electric in the UK in 2020, is just barely (almost imperceptibly) better than burning petrol in the conventional way. Despite this surprising (hype-free) conclusion, and the impracticality for my personal situation I still considered pure electric, because they are better for particulates/local city air, and have the potential to be cleaner, if during the lifetime of the car we can progress as a country to a clean efficient electricity supply (a move to renewables and an HVDC upgrade to the national grid). But when push came to shove, I chose the pure hybrid Hyundai Ioniq instead. I get 64.2 mpg (averaged over 2 years/22500 miles). This is unarguably >30% cleaner than the car that it replaced, but that improvement doesn't just come from a different power train. It comes from improved overall vehicle design including low air resistance, running high pressure tyres, a thermally efficient combustion engine design, electric assisted accelleration, and decelleration/brake energy recovery. The all electric car will have its day, but we are not quite there yet. Fuel pricing is all adjusted by government taxation to encourage/discourage changes in behaviour - and that's all managed by lobbyists/idiots of course - but that too has to be factored into mileage costs. You can't just ignore the charging costs (or the cost of a new battery around the 7 year mark). Taking all this into account, the PHEV model always struck me as being neither fish nor fowl, and in some ways the worst compromise. It has more weight than the pure hybrid, an all electric range that's less than the pure electric. Additional systems/complexity suggest that lifetime cost of ownership might be a bit higher than either the electric or the pure hybrid. I guess the idea is to run electric all-day every-day around town and to work on an overnight charge and/or at work, and still have a petrol option when you need it for going on longer runs like holidays (cheap-out the total petrol+electric fuel cost that way). I'd like to know if any PHEV owners feel that they have achieved that Ped, as for me, your 68 mpg doesn't butter the parsnips. neither does a much reduced electric range. But you know what, when all's said and done, all of the Ioniq models are hidden gems.

[@hamptonhardy]

So I drive 130 miles to work (mostly motorway) at the beginning of my working week and back home again at the end. In between my daily commute is 16 miles round trip to and from my digs. Sounds to me I'd be looking at minimum 60mpg for the long drive and pure EV mode for my daily commute. My Jaguar XF 3.0 S Diesel gives me 43mpg and 28mpg respectively. So this is a no brainer for me. But possibly one of the new pure EVs may be a better choice.

[@PetrolPed]

The perfect drive profile for this car as long as you have somewhere to charge it overnight :-)

[@computerbob06]

You should be in hybrid mode all the time. All slow speed driving will automatically be in full EV then when you speed up it switches the engine on. You seemed to be up to speed pretty quickly on leaving where you were staying - it would then keep the charge till slow speed driving at the end. If the car has an Eco mode, they usually have more battery recharge under braking and use more battery assistance on the highway.

[@RecreationalRunner]

nope if you stay in Hybrid all the time you don't seriously deplete the battery at all and end up with a full charge at the end of your journey, so basically just lug around a charged battery all day and use more fuel than was necessary. Ped explains this in the video when he trialled just staying in hybrid and was almost home with 37 mile EV range left. I commute exactly 36 miles per day with my plug in and can do this on one overnight trickle charge (which is actually 4.5 hours set between 2am and 6.30am). I drive what I call normally, my computer actually says something like 50% ECO, 10% aggressive and 40% normal. Outside of my commute I do a regular longer trip at weekends. I have done a little over 6,000 miles and have 80.5 mpg average. I usually go into sport mode on motorways and flick back to EV if in traffic and when I come off the motorway. The ioniq PHEV totally suits my commute profile.

[@yerocblack3328]

The range is lowered severely in the winter. You should try the same car when it's warm outside.

[@michaeltutty1540]

It is winter here for 6 months of the year. I find the "cold" English weather tests interesting. Then again I am left wondering what happens at -40 with a foot of snow on the roads, which is not an unusual occurrence here.

[@ginggur17]

I do like your hand to hand edits

[@PetrolPed]

I must try and not use them too often :-)

[@ginggur17]

It works a treat to denote a day change.