London DLR P86 & P89 Trains In Germany

[@EssexWolf1993]

How different that these trains were allowed in underground sections in Essen, yet were banned from the Bank extension in London in 1991.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+Joe Ross The only things I can think of were: 1) German standards were lower than ours. 2) The Essen tunnels are generally multiple track tunnels - for which different fire standards may be acceptable - whilst the London tunnels are single track 'tube train' tunnels in which space is very restricted.

[@Joschimon]

+citytransportinfo About one third of the tunnels at Essen are single track tunnels which are also used by the P86/89. ;)

[@MAANDTO]

+Joschimon Yes, but they have more space than the tunnels in London

[@harrytrotter5267]

"German standards were lower than ours" Nope. Thats not true.

[@eth3242]

Actually 5230 + 5231 (DLR 01,30) have been in a tunnel fire in Essen...

[@anindrapratama]

10:08 I see the driver enjoying the Lolly eh?

[@westy6214]

Very nice video. That garden suburb with the light rail is wonderful! I wish the uk had something like that.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Thank you - I think the New Addington area of the Croydon / south London Tramlink could be seen as a garden suburb and the tram route to there is also largely off-street / on private right of way

[@non-binarynerd9188]

This is an amazing video!

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

thanks:-)

[@non-binarynerd9188]

No problem. I've had an interest in my local railway since I was young so these videos help me out. :-)

[@lfewell2161]

Knew they went to Germany, but this is the first time I have seen a video of them. Thought I was watching a DLR video at first, so surprised that they look almost exactly the same. I suppose they could have even kept the DLR name, as Deutschland Light Railway would not be incorrect !

[@QuarioQuario54321]

Seems also they added announcements and displays when the moved to Essen (from what I can tell they didn't have that feature when they did operate on the DLR). But the folding doors were an odd choice.

[@lazrseagull54]

I remember loads of local bus and rail lines in the UK had no announcements or displays in the 90s. In some towns, they still don't.

[@DanielJ_00]

Sad news I discovered involving the P86 in Essen. It seems the last P86 in the DLR livery (number 11 from the U.K., 5221 in Essen) is getting repainted. I came across a photo from March 2017 with the train with everything removed except for the empty shell with the DLR livery, either getting scrapped or repainted. Sad news indeed.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Oh dear, but thanks for telling me.

[@bakedbeanishdragon]

Am I right in thinking that the P89 trains had sliding doors when in use on the DLR, and the P86 trains had the bus-style folding doors, and then they received sliding doors when they were refurbished for street running?

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+bakedbeanishdragon ah, and that is the question which explains why the film was made on Saturday night - rather than Thursday night! Different people were saying different things... in the end I worked out that what you said about the P86 is correct, however it seems that the first of the P89s also had twin inward opening doors but during production this was changed so that the later deliveries had single leaf sliding doors and eventually the rest of the P89s were modified to suit. I plan to post more information plus links of related interest to the video text and will reply to you again when this has been done.

[@bakedbeanishdragon]

citytransportinfo Ok, thank you for the reply, I understand now.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+bakedbeanishdragon Sorry that its taken me a week but I have now added a lot more information to the film text. This includes a link which is about the P86 and P89 trains... and talks about the conversion of the doors in the P89s. districtdavesforum.co.uk/thread/8600/when-old-trains-last-run Simon

[@bakedbeanishdragon]

+citytransportinfo This is very useful information, thank you Simon.

[@europeantechnic]

Are these units still running (summer 2016)? I'm off to Germany in a month and if so will visit Essen specially to ride a few !

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

As far as I am aware they are still running, albeit in yellow and blue livery. Route U17 includes some sections of street tramway where they share the road with th general traffic.

[@eth3242]

They are...and I think it will last many years until they are replaced... But we do not have any „Original“ anymore...all P89 and P86U, first and last 5211 has been destroyed...

[@schlumpfzocker1213]

There also right now running

[@jemjon]

And now its 2020 and they’re still running... at least until 2022/2023 because Ruhrbahn announced that then Essen will get a whole new set of U-Bahn trains!

[@f1zerstorertrams]

2023 now and they are still running

[@kaibamte9860]

Hey there, superb videos! How did you digitalize them from the vhsc tape to your computer? Greetings from Germany

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Hello, Many years ago I bought a pci card for my Applemac computer. This is now 'very old' but it still works. I also have a Pinnacle USB device which works on Windows computers

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

I should have also said... I have a S-VHS video machine, as my video tapes are S-VHS format. Greetings from the United Kingdom

[@kaibamte9860]

Hey, thank you for the response, helps alot! :)

[@S404_44]

Excellent video! 👍

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+SimonHellinger Thanks!

[@spinba11]

How many trains has the DLR had, I know it's using 2 types now (full height glass and half height glass on the doors, how many were used before the half height glass trains came into service?

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+spinba11 only the P86, P89, B90/B92/B2K (all same design built in batches) and the B07.

[@NextSound170]

You were lucky to visit Germany in the 80s a cultural shift in time and it's still a super cool country

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

The 80s were a good time to visit, I did also go in the 60s and 70s as part of family holidays. But I do not remember much from then. 1989 was a fantastic time to visit Berlin. I went in December, which was barely a few months after the wall had opened. Memories from that trip (and April 1990) will stay with me for my entire life. Happily some of what I saw can be seen in my Berlin KZbin films.

[@paularvozm]

Since reunification 1989 Germany has changed a lot. Its way more multicultural and world-open now.

[@Flektor-eo1ro]

@@paularvozm Reunification was in 1990, not 1989

[@leefran71]

1.04,what a rude prick barging in front of the other guy entering the train!

[@MAANDTO]

It's interesting that those trains have exactly the same size like the B-cars

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+MAANDTO probably because they were designed to the same dimensions.

[@florianbremehr8874]

citytransportinfo the b cars were first

[@mikeblatzheim2797]

That's because they're literally a B-Wagen with a different bodyshell

[@paularvozm]

@@CitytransportInfoplus The DLR Trains were built by a german Factory, the same that built the B Cars.

[@Flektor-eo1ro]

@@paularvozm That's nonsense. The Docklands LRVs were built by Linke-Hoffmann-Busch, while the B LRVs where built by DUEWAG.

[@wuloki]

About the trolley buses in the tunnels (it was called "Spur Bus" -> "Bus on Rails"): The termination of that project was not solely due to funds being allocated elsewhere. A big problem back then was that the overhead wires for the buses had to be left or right of the wire for the trams and subways. Due to the angle, the trolley poles often slipped from the wires in the tunnels, which lead to delays. Another reason was that trolley buses, while they had their hey-day for a short time in the 1960s, were never popular here. A lot of cities had them, but only for a few years. Trolley buses were gone by the early 1970s. Only two cities still have them, one of them being Solingen. That's an ad for the Spurbus concept in Essen, from 1987: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZu4pmiXjMSarbM

[@BirbarianHomeGuard]

It’s so bizarre to see these street running in mixed traffic. I know they are light rail vehicles, but in my head they are 3rd rail powered metros still.

[@wilfstor3078]

its sad to see them lose their historic DLR livery do you know if some still have it

[@wilfstor3078]

I am only 13 so I wasn't alive when they were in use in london on the dlr so I was hopping they still had the DLR livery in essen because I may be going to germany some time in the futre

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Hello, I think that there is just one train unit which still retains its London livery, however I am not 100% sure

[@wilfstor3078]

much thanks I realy want to see the p89/86 in the dlr livery in person

[@jamestoyn9755]

was this film on the frankfurt u-bahn tram network.

[@ethancampbell6076]

Did u record the last years videos about the tram and trolleybus

[@thischannelisdisused5841]

I like the garden suburb

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+Mega Swampert 123 I found it inspirational... gave me ideas for what could be here in the UK. This webpage (from my website) uses some of the ideas... citytransport.info/Lawn.htm Simon

[@thischannelisdisused5841]

The bad thing about it is that if someone sets it on fire the whole suburb would be in a blaze within 30minutes

[@ejcmoorhouse]

+Mega Swampert 123 doubt it also how slow do you think the German fire department are?

[@thischannelisdisused5841]

ejcmoorhouse sloow no offence

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+Mega Swampert 123 yikes, possibly it would be but that sort of concept is not something I even thought about! From what I've learnt from discussing forest fires with an Australian friend who lives in a rural area and a few years ago almost had to flee a major forest fire, a lot depends on wind speeds, directions and whether its high summer when everything is tinder dry or during the wet season.

[@jemjon]

And now, at last, they’re all about to be replaced as the first 3 new HF1 trains by CAF just arrived in Essen and are about to enter service early next year. They will completely replace all existing older trains including these P86/P89 and all other older Stadtbahnwagen Typ B trains.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Hello, thank you for the information. It will be sad to see the Docklands trains being replaced, but trains cannot last forever. Here in London the Docklands Light Railway is also getting some new trains - these also come from CAF. The first of them should already be carrying passengers but there is a delay. We have not been told the reason for the delay.

[@vincentkohlumcfan22]

At the last station filmed here, why did it not use the right track and used the left one instead?

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Was this the terminus station Margarethenhöhe ? If so, I do not know. sorry.

[@vincentkohlumcfan22]

citytransportinfo yeah I was talking abt Margarethenhöhe

[@schlumpfzocker1213]

Because there is only One Train, but they buildt 2 sides for the possibility to construct a bigger line

[@eth3242]

Unfortunately even 5211 is gone for ever now...shame...loved to traveled U18 with this one...

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

That is the one train above all others which should have been preserved - because its the train that HM The Queen travelled on when the system first opened.

[@eth3242]

citytransportinfo They demolished it...

[@HDTransport]

Good video!

[@HDTransport]

Well all your videos are good :)

[@redphone1438]

Why was the DLR operating in Germany? I thought it's in London.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

The DLR is in London, but some DLR trains were sold to Essen in Germany and for a few years the Germans used these trains in DLR livery. Nowadays the former DLR trains are in yellow livery.

[@AdamHiley-pj2zn]

Wuppertal has that monorail that goes back to the 1900's worth a trip

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

Yes, I've been on it - this film dates from a very wet day in December 1990 kzbin.info/www/bejne/on6un4mQm9ZmnNk

[@GHOSTGURUVJ0]

That very surfaced Dockland light railway in Germany!!!

[@awesometrainsandbuses]

I thought the dlr was only in London

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

It is in London, but some DLR trains were sold to Essen in Germany and for a few years the Germans used these trains in DLR livery. Nowadays the former DLR trains are in yellow livery.

[@Simulation101YT]

It's you again

[@martinbitter4162]

I doubt that safety standards are lower in Germany but I am open to correction. Who build those units and what consequences arose out of that "fiasco"?

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+Martin Bitter part of the issue about safety standards is that in Essen the trains travel in twin track tunnels whilst in London the DLR tunnels are single track, and for these the safety standards are different. The P86 trains were built in Germany, but to a specification designed for surface use... not for tunnels. The P89 trains were built by British Rail Engineering Ltd (BREL) and designed for tunnel use, but only as single unit trains. There was no fiasco, the trains were sold to Essen because Essen wanted more trains. The original DLR did not have tunnels; it was only because of the Canary Wharf Tower and the desire for a better link with the City area of London near to Bank station that the tunnels were built. The government was pleased as this meant that there was much investment being made. Local people however would have liked for investment in community things, like schools, playing fields, etc. But that is a different topic.

[@TheWillystyla]

Essen have single tubes too !

[@waleedarif9327]

They so look like the same ones that have been running in England on the DLR Line.

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+Waleed Arif Originally these ran on the DLR in London.

[@wharris302]

Why do I hear a cummins like engine...?

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

+dennis trident william where in the film?

[@wharris302]

when your ride it I can hear some sort of diesel engine

[@lohphat]

+dennis trident william It may be the air compressor (for brakes)

[@wharris302]

+lohphat through the whole train ride?

[@lohphat]

If there's a constant leak in the pressure system, maybe. Or could be a bad air conditioning/heating unit.

[@MikeWillSee]

I wonder if they'll get out current DLR trains when they are replaced in a couple of years 🤔

[@Karsten31]

Nope, ordered new at CAD

[@rebeccaliegeoise6895]

Und Deutsche haben die alten Kisten gekauft ?

[@schlumpfzocker1213]

Ja 😂

[@Flektor-eo1ro]

Die Briten spritzen auf die Wagen ab, und die Essener hassen die Wagen wie die Pest

[@the_retag]

@@Flektor-eo1ro wieso eigentlich? Ist doch im Prinzip auch nur nen b-wagen

[@the_retag]

Selbe technik wie die b-wagen, war eine wartungstechnisch sinnvolle Anwendung

[@Flektor-eo1ro]

@@the_retag Rein wagenbaulich sind die Docklands zwar an den B-Wagen angelehnt, technisch sind es jedoch völlig unterschiedliche Fahrzeuge. Die technische bzw. elektrische Ausrüstung ist seit dem ersten Tage in Essen an außerordentlich störanfällig, und die Ausfallquote der Docklands ist deutlich höher als bei den „richtigen“ B-Wagen. Wie kommst du darauf, dass die Docklands technisch mit den B-Wagen identisch sind?

[@Yamayorya]

Eww, the main station in Essen looked really ugly in pale yellow. I only know the station with its really cool blue design now

[@Simulation101YT]

In 2050: 96 stock trains in Berlin metro

[@elvirleonard]

Xs

[@perielosgaming3903]

THAT'S STEALING GERMANY!!

[@CitytransportInfoplus]

The Germans did buy them!

[@perielosgaming3903]

Oh ok

[@harrytrotter5267]

RobloxMaster010 And the Trains was build in germany. The automatic system called "seltrac" was also invented in germany.

[@ok7513]

Nooo

[@ok7513]

They stole