LONG Arm vs SHORT Arm, which is better?

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Muddy Beards 4X4

Muddy Beards 4X4

Күн бұрын

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@GeekSmut-fg5te
@GeekSmut-fg5te Жыл бұрын
The part at the end was super useful to illustrate some important things about long arms. Particularly the axle movement forward and back, which 2” does not sound like a lot but at fully flexed can make a noticeable change in stability.
@tcd671
@tcd671 6 жыл бұрын
I have a long arm AND a short arm.. it’s hard to find a good jackets
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Ok but to settle the controversy. Which arm works better?
@tcd671
@tcd671 6 жыл бұрын
The short arm constantly holds the “👌” or ok sign and the long arm punches anyone who looks at it.. so I guess there both pretty important..
@paulhudson6138
@paulhudson6138 6 жыл бұрын
Ahahhaah!
@whowho8470
@whowho8470 5 жыл бұрын
My buddy had a short arm kit on his TJ and he hated it. He said it was very rough ride quality. He switched it out for a 4" Rough Country long arm and he absolutely loves it. Very smooth ride quality.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
👍🏻
@DavidNJ1
@DavidNJ1 5 жыл бұрын
Two hints. 1) you can write on the concrete floor with chalk, easier than a pad and paper. 2) string with a plumb bob can be held against something or wrapped over a wheels stud, frame rail, etc. to leave a point on the floor to mark with the chalk. Then just measure the distance.
@ronstachewicz4265
@ronstachewicz4265 3 жыл бұрын
You Verified and validated what I am doing to my jeep.. Thank you.
@ajclinton5299
@ajclinton5299 4 жыл бұрын
how does the long arms preform on fast pace trails? My short arms ride like hell and I am hoping to keep up with my friends and their JK’s with longer wheelbases and geometry. Thanks!
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 4 жыл бұрын
Makes it ride so much smoother for sure. Long arms make a huge difference 👍🏻
@aljohnson1191
@aljohnson1191 5 жыл бұрын
I remeber a few years ago asking on jeep forum if anyone ran long arms in the front and short arms in the rear and people absolutely tore me a new one
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Forums can be rough, lol. I did a front axle swap and decided to do the long arm at the same time. The thing that’s holding my up in the rear is the $1000 gas tank it takes to stretch it how I want it. Thanks for watching👍🏻
@romansteinbrenner
@romansteinbrenner 3 ай бұрын
which wrangler 2door is the best base for offroading and tuning for offroading ?
@ka4172
@ka4172 2 жыл бұрын
On extreme hillclimbs the short arm lifted Jeep tend more to hopping at the rear axel.
@mrrude7211
@mrrude7211 5 жыл бұрын
Can you/ have you made a video/ take pictures of your rear tire carrier? I'm interested in it but couldn't see too well in the video.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
I did a walk around video of my tj on the channel where I show and talk about the tire carrier. Thanks for watching!
@thinkclear3834
@thinkclear3834 4 жыл бұрын
If the front stock control arms are bent would that make a issue for the alignment not to be 100% . Cause my Jeep when the steering wheel is straight the left front tire sticks out a little would that be cause of the control arm or differential
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 4 жыл бұрын
Most likely something in the steering or the control arms.
@thinkclear3834
@thinkclear3834 4 жыл бұрын
Muddy Beards 4X4 oh ok thanks cause I don’t feel like spending 2500 on a differential
@The6FigureAffiliate
@The6FigureAffiliate 4 жыл бұрын
Awesome - appreciate the comprehensive info.
@Little.R
@Little.R 3 жыл бұрын
Interesting seeing long arm front and short arm in the rear. didn't know people did that.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 3 жыл бұрын
Upgrades come slowly, I just did the front first. It is now long arms all the way around.
@Little.R
@Little.R 3 жыл бұрын
@@MuddyBeards4X4 Did you notice a big difference when you upgraded the front?
@cannonball666
@cannonball666 8 ай бұрын
They got rid of teeter totters? Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
@danhambrick6331
@danhambrick6331 6 жыл бұрын
That's why I am going with Iron Rock OffRoad RockLink setup for my XJ.
@kdigiacomo
@kdigiacomo 5 жыл бұрын
Yep, good call Dan! I'm switching my setup to IRO long non adjustable.
@michael-michaelmotorcycle
@michael-michaelmotorcycle 6 жыл бұрын
Great explanation using the wood trim seesaw teeter-totter thing thing. Nate from bleepinjeep sent me. Wasn’t that him in the opening clip?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Thank you, and yes that was Nate filming me, lol. We have been friends for a long time.
@charliedee9276
@charliedee9276 6 жыл бұрын
Nice front axle. I have a 44hp from a 78 Ford waiting to go into my 04 WJ.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Sweet, what suspension are you going to run in the front?
@charliedee9276
@charliedee9276 6 жыл бұрын
Not sure yet, leaning toward a Clayton LA. I have the 9" rear axle also, that may be used in the rear.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Might as well keep it a matching set, lol. the Clayton kits are nice but expensive. No sure your fab skill level but i would go with a builders kit like the Barnes 4WD long arm kits.
@_migulin
@_migulin 5 жыл бұрын
thank. I will try to make long arms on my monster.
@markcarpenter3600
@markcarpenter3600 2 жыл бұрын
4" IRO lift on my WJ. Started out with long arms in the front and short arms in the rear, beat the crap out of me. I didn't think I wanted to go through what was needed to install them in the rear. The control arms were at a 30° angle sitting on the street. Made the switch to long arms front and rear. PLUSH. . . . PLUSH is the only word for it! It's so PLUSH on the last trip to Mojave, moving way too fast blew my shocks out between the mailbox and Razer Road Shell station. LOL!
@jeremy8715
@jeremy8715 4 жыл бұрын
Is a 2.5” long arm a thing on Jeep TJs?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 4 жыл бұрын
You could always make one, lol.
@jeremy8715
@jeremy8715 4 жыл бұрын
@@MuddyBeards4X4 That's true, but I'm wonder if it makes logical sense.
@ills95
@ills95 5 жыл бұрын
Do you feel that long arm makes a huge difference when it comes to just a daily commute? Would I be okay with a short arm or would I be uncomfortable?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Depends on how much lift your have. But short arms are great for a daily driver, unless you have like 6” of lift or more than the short arm will become a problem.
@ills95
@ills95 5 жыл бұрын
@@MuddyBeards4X4 thank you! I was thinking of doing like a 4.5 but wasn't sure if short arms would be comfortable
@BigCatRiverFishing
@BigCatRiverFishing 4 жыл бұрын
What year wagoneer axle shafts are you running?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 4 жыл бұрын
80-92 shafts
@BigCatRiverFishing
@BigCatRiverFishing 4 жыл бұрын
Muddy Beards 4X4 awesome! What bolt pattern is your hub for wheels? Just curious because I’m considering doing a 44 swap and narrowing it like you did.
@keithlea6804
@keithlea6804 5 жыл бұрын
My thought on this has always been. If you play in the rocks you want long arm. If you have more than 4 inches of lift you want long arm. Me I play in the snow and trail ride. I prefer short arm. Less wheel hop in the snow.
@nickphillips8682
@nickphillips8682 5 жыл бұрын
Mid arms
@yerwrng
@yerwrng 5 жыл бұрын
I have long arms and I don't have any wheel hop .
@Towing417
@Towing417 5 жыл бұрын
Understand wheel hop is more a function of geometry, wich with a lift can be %100 better than stock arms. Most likely though, any wheelhop issue has more to do with poor shocks.
@jasonlenihan9854
@jasonlenihan9854 5 жыл бұрын
I have some long drives planned for my cj7. I also plan on needing to be in four wheel drive to get to some of my hunting spots with my daughters. I never worried about a smooth ride in it 25yrs ago. But now with my daughters driving it as well . What changes or mods would you recommend to make it a Tighter better Steering ride ,and also a little smoother, I have been really interested in all the control arm work you have been doing and was just wondering if for my Purposes any of that would help. Sorry for the Convoluted question. I hope it makes some sense. Thanks for the video and keep up the good work. Here’s Mud in your eye from Snohomish Washington.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching and reaching out. I have no experience with a cj7, but the same rules would apply to most rigs. As far as steering you need to make sure nothing is worn out, tie rods, steering box, bushings etc. first. I am sure there are aftermarket springs and shock kits that will make it ride much better than stock. Thanks for watching👊🏻
@jasonlenihan9854
@jasonlenihan9854 5 жыл бұрын
Thanks for getting back to me, your advice is very much Appreciated.
@LorddOfChaoss
@LorddOfChaoss 5 жыл бұрын
Bought or built front fenders? If bought, which brand?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
They are home made, thanks for watching!
@LorddOfChaoss
@LorddOfChaoss 5 жыл бұрын
@@MuddyBeards4X4 they look meaner than hell
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Thanks 👍🏻
@lifewithdoberman1701
@lifewithdoberman1701 6 жыл бұрын
How about short arms with drop bracket it steal same or more flex
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Would be the same, just less ground clearance, which is never good, lol.
@seansutherland6270
@seansutherland6270 4 жыл бұрын
Long arms are just better Tho arm length gets confusing to me, is ideal arm length the same as your driveshaft length?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 4 жыл бұрын
You should download the 4 link calculator and play around with some numbers. Also I have a newer video on building a 4 link which has all the info in it.
@TheCollector5150
@TheCollector5150 5 жыл бұрын
In the rear, you say you have 18" of ground clearance at the bracket which is 15" from the axle. In the front, you say you have 19.5" of ground clearance at the bracket but that bracket is 35" from the axle. How much ground clearance do you have in the front to the bottom of the long arm at 15" from the axle? The short arms get out of the way quicker, long arms tend to get hung up on rocks far more easily.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately I cannot accurately measure since I have 40s on the Jeep now. But after just spending a week at king of the hammers, I can tell you my front long arm was great on the rocks, and my rear suspension gave my lots of problems and rides terrible compared to the front. There were no buggies or built rigs down there running short or mid arms. Everyone has long arms.
@TheCollector5150
@TheCollector5150 5 жыл бұрын
What's the ground clearance of the long arm directly behind the front tire and directly in front of the back tire? If you're running 40's, I'm guessing in the back the short arm is completely behind the wheel and not even a factor so clearance is up all the way to the frame.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
In my particular setup it is 18” of ground clearance in front of the rear tire, which is exactly where the control arm bracket hangs Down off the frame, and 18” at the back of my front tire on my lower control arm.
@TheCollector5150
@TheCollector5150 5 жыл бұрын
Sounds right, but that rear bracket is out of the way in another inch or so from the rear tire and at that point your clearance is up to your frame, the front arm extends for another foot and a half or so beyond the tire, you drop off a tall enough rock and it's gonna scrape long before a short arm would. My last TJ, I went long arm but it wasn't a daily driver and I didn't drive particularly fast off road either so I didn't really take advantage of the benefits of the improved ride quality much. It's a fact that long arms sacrifice some ground clearance and they were getting in the way so on my current TJ I stuck with short arm. That was the only reason for my comment. In your video you state you have almost 2" more ground clearance on the long arm side but that isn't factual, you just measured in completely different places to create that number. Of course if you go beyond 4" lift then it's a no brainer, long arm is the way to go but like with any mod, it all depends on how you're gonna use it.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Great points, Thanks for watching!
@j.m.967
@j.m.967 4 жыл бұрын
Hi gents. Please someone tell me, on wj rear upper short A arm and rear lower long works and it will be smooth ride with 5" or max 5.5" lift, with front long IRO 3 link? Thanks for all.
@the-bu3lb
@the-bu3lb 6 жыл бұрын
can u answer me were I can get the same tire carrier please
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
3d Sorry, you can’t buy it anywhere. It is a custom made one. There is only 1 and it’s on my Jeep, lol.
@luissowhat2511
@luissowhat2511 4 жыл бұрын
So the long arms are safer?
@rockhumper8843
@rockhumper8843 4 жыл бұрын
But don’t you want to lift the frame up and out of the way. As far as rock crawling go ....you’re crawling right which insinuates moving very slowly soooo pummeling the lower links are on a long arm really is counter intuitive don’t you think 🤔. The limiting factor is really the shocks coil overs being downward flex right and the shock body being the limiting factor going up.
@Bluestatesurvival
@Bluestatesurvival 6 жыл бұрын
Sweet rig. Can you do a walk around sometime?
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Thanks, I have been meaning to do one, I will get to it soon.
@sizzlechest6070
@sizzlechest6070 6 жыл бұрын
In my country you make car to get punch to neck face at night boss say no hit back to hurt for 3 day and 1night
@matty86suk
@matty86suk 5 жыл бұрын
Lunktar Bashnish same here bruh!
@danvaca199
@danvaca199 5 жыл бұрын
I feel your pain!
@michaelangelo4147
@michaelangelo4147 5 жыл бұрын
Excellent video nice to know this knowledge when thinking about a lift.
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Glad it helped! Thanks for watching
@bemyers123
@bemyers123 6 жыл бұрын
I really like Savvy's approach to suspension geometry with their MID-Arm design. It will be the next big upgrade on my '06 LJ. Jeep's stock geometry isn't a bad deal, but as you begin to lifting (especially over 3") it causes several issues. On-road manors suffer due to the angles created via short control arms and you'll feel every crack in the road. Off-road suffers due to the new and steeper geometry angles not allowing smooth and consistent articulation. I went from 2" of lift to 4" and it's a very noticeable difference. Long arms are not a good choice for off-road because the geometry is poorly designed. Long arms will not climb over obstacles as well as short arms. That being said, this is a comparison between equally built/modified Jeeps; one with short and one with long arms. Long arms will allow you greater lift and with the use of stronger axles, you'll be able to run a bigger tire than a short-arm lift...if the L@@K is all that you desire. One major plus with long-arms; a much better on-road ride and would be better for a mall-crawler than a short arm once you cross the 4'' lift mark. Short arms are better off-road, but you're stuck with a max lift of 4 inches and there will be some trade-offs. Savvy is the best option and people who've done the "long VS. short" and switch to Savvy's MID-ARM all agree that it's the real deal. Of coarse, this is just my $0.02 cents worth and opinions vary.
@rockshockoffroad4x43
@rockshockoffroad4x43 6 жыл бұрын
bemyers123 you are wrong about the long arm you can tell you don't know s*** about off-roading because long arm is 10 times better than short arm short arms good and better on the road driving daily compare to long arm I agree with that but when it comes to off-roading it climbs better articulates better it climbs better everything I got a 5.5 long arm kit by Rusty's Off-Road its a freaking Beast you sound pretty stupid saying that a long arm is not good for off-road think about it for a second learn your off road
@keyboardwarrior3089
@keyboardwarrior3089 6 жыл бұрын
@@rockshockoffroad4x43 Agree. You are 10x more likely to get hung up on long arms on a short wheelbase vehicle.
@blurglide
@blurglide 3 жыл бұрын
Actually, long arm front/short rear is a good idea
@speedyfpv7104
@speedyfpv7104 Жыл бұрын
Ok I cant be the only one. When he gets to the rear short arm he says it's transferring energy directly into the chassis. Yes this would be true If he was going in reverse. But if he was going over an obstacle going forward.....the forces being experienced by the rear drivetrain would be pulling it backwards to the rear. So when he says the rear lower control arm pushes FORWARD into the frame I die. literally l lose all willpower to continue watching. Great vid otherwise though 😅
@yeti9228
@yeti9228 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the video! You and Nate have allowed my walnut brain to understand long arm vs short arm arguments 😁 1 3/4", Math is hard. I felt that in my soul 🤣
@ozzstars_cars
@ozzstars_cars 6 жыл бұрын
The red Jeep is very arousing.
@chasingthesun1986
@chasingthesun1986 6 жыл бұрын
Great vid brotha
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Thank you, and thanks for watching!
@AlloffroadAu
@AlloffroadAu 5 жыл бұрын
great video and good explanation, long arm all the way
@Dannymurmaid
@Dannymurmaid 5 жыл бұрын
I actually miss my short arms
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Why is that?
@Dannymurmaid
@Dannymurmaid 5 жыл бұрын
Just preference. It’s like it’s too smooth for me.. almost like i blob over things. I’m over in Yakima, so maybe I’ll see you on the trails!
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 5 жыл бұрын
Well never heard of smooth being a negative, lol. But everyone has their preference. Hopefully planning a trip over the other side of the mountains soon! Thanks for watching.
@allanwagner4570
@allanwagner4570 5 жыл бұрын
still waiting for a muddy beards sticker????
@rockhumper8843
@rockhumper8843 4 жыл бұрын
Not to mention permanently altering and modifying your chassis plus excessive money in the thousands of dollars for minimal gains......aftermarket short arms are actually longer and stronger than stock and if you really need that cushy ride drop brackets have been around forever. Cutting your factor brackets are a semi permanent decision that could set you back hundreds if not a thousand to reweld those brackets back to oe specs.
@longhorn8459
@longhorn8459 4 жыл бұрын
I have looked for tj drop brackets and they really don't exist. True on cutting factory brackets but I'm still leaning towards selling my currie 4" short arms and going long arms for the ride quality.
@rockshockoffroad4x43
@rockshockoffroad4x43 6 жыл бұрын
Good video brother 😎
@MuddyBeards4X4
@MuddyBeards4X4 6 жыл бұрын
Thank you, and thanks for watching!
@jeffbeaird747
@jeffbeaird747 6 жыл бұрын
No car wash within a 100 miles.? You gave some good information but a LOT of it was HALF-ASSED...
@savagejesusj
@savagejesusj 5 жыл бұрын
I havent washed my 94 zj in 4months lmao
@snakeskinproductions7500
@snakeskinproductions7500 4 жыл бұрын
There is a company called "Stinkyfab" They have a very interesting article about short vs long arms. Very much worth the read. I have an XJ so its a bit different then your set up but they make some very interesting arguments. Check it out Its on there drop mount page for XJ's. You guys do some great videos by the way...
@DrHavok1
@DrHavok1 6 жыл бұрын
Long arms are the only way to go
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