Luthier Tips du Jour mailbag 97 - Repairing a ding in a guitar finish

[@danyarbrough7847]

Excellent demo! Thanks for the tips.

[@RavenMadd9]

thank you Robert

[@redrock1963]

Greetings from Australia - I have an Australian made 2002 Maton ECW80C that I bought S/H. It had so many dents and dings that It looked like it had been gigged a lot and then thrown into the audience after the show. I took it Maton in Boxhill who gave it a full bill of health, I fully stripped it, cleaned it and nurtured it back to full playable stage. It sounds amazing and feels even better to play. I left all the visible dents that I think just adds character. I will never part with this one.

[@OBrienGuitars]

If you don't have dings - you are not enjoying playing the guitar.

[@redrock1963]

@@OBrienGuitars - LOL It's a percussion instrument.

[@songsofsusannah]

I have a cedar-topped classical guitar that I bought when I was 15, I got a great deal on it because of all the cosmetic dings. Thanks for these great tips on how to finally fix those dings! I don't expect it to look perfect, but this will certainly reduce the appearance of the damage.

[@mrg6185]

Sorry, your comment was a year ago.. Exact same thing for me, few dings on a great old vintage guitar. How did this method work out?

[@mrg6185]

Cedar top as well :)

[@songsofsusannah]

​@@mrg6185 My idea of using a Varathane polyurethane scratch repair pen did not work out. It was as if I had done nothing at all. I made an attempt to fill the damage with a form of superglue so I could make the top flat, and then cover it with the polyurethane pen. Unfortunately, the superglue was harder to control than I expected, and when I tried to carefully absorb the excess...let's just say, I'm still trying to determine the best way to get the superglue spillage off of the guitar. It would've been better had I not even tried. The superglue residue isn't very big, but it affects the texture of the top in that one small area. I've wondered if naphtha might work.

[@davidthompson6832]

REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR REPLY TO ALMOST EVER QUESTION !!! SOME GREAT LUTHIERS DON'T GIVE UP THE TRICKS ...👀🎩

[@captainamerica9353]

Maybe, but you can also watch a wood refinishing or furniture refinishing video to get similar tips.

[@ericgreen86]

Wow, thanks for this information! Now, I know how to fix the ding in my brand new Fender Jaguar!

[@harpethguitar]

It happened to friend of mine too! 😁 cheers!

[@nomadworld6192]

I had the smart idea of using cedar for the first guitar I am making. Didn't take long for some dings mysteriously appear. Luckily I let quite a lot extra material for finishing but seems that one won't go. Thanks for the tip.

[@inoxidables]

Gracias, maestro!

[@firemunky1980]

Does this work for.plastic dipped guitars?

[@stephenclarke2481]

Robbies videos are fantastic. I have learned a lot from them and really admire his techniques. However, in this case, I didn’t think the end result was all that great. To tackle that ding, I would have first tried to reduce the depth with a few drops of water and a couple of touches with an iron or burn stick melter. Then I would have drop filled with lacquer. (Assuming that is a Nitro finish). That would take much more time waiting for the lacquer to cure for at least a week, but I think the results would have been better. And I’d have just buffed it and not fooled around with micro mesh. Much quicker there.

[@michaelinglis567]

I've done this on a belt ding in the back of my black 7 string LTD with a lacquer finish and it worked great. But now I've got a scratch all the way to the bare wood on the top of my Martin D10e sitka. It's a satin finish if your not familiar. Any tips on doing a similar technique but with a satin finish? The scratch is about 3/4 a cm long and about as wide as a fingernail. Almost looks like a splinter came out. I have no clue how it happened since I baby that guitar and the scratch just showed up tonight lol, devastating!

[@FeedThemCake]

Great video. But I have a question: my electric guitar has a polyester finish on a blue flame maple top, but the scratch appears to be only in the polyester clear coat, not the colour coat or wood underneath. Would this technique be able to make the scratch completely disappear?

[@OBrienGuitars]

Sometimes to cure can be worse than the disease. However, if done properly, you can get a good repair. I would use the Gluboost products.

[@daringetae5136]

I came here because when I changed the strings on my cordoba c12 the E1 snapped while was tuning it and it somehow hit the top behind the bridge and left a little ding. Not big but noticeable if you look close. I'm not sure if I would undertake this restoration process though. It might not be worth it because of the work and materials involved....and it still will be noticeable afterwards.

[@DougHinVA]

and take small cutters to snip off the string ends below the tie block... but use a piece of cardboard under the string ends so as to protect the guitar top finish...

[@taab7]

CA glue always leaves a very noticeable darker finish than the surrounding area. Would drop filling with clear coat lacquer not be a better option?

[@OBrienGuitars]

If the finish on the instrument is lacquer, my first choice is to use lacquer as a drop fill.

[@philipliethen519]

@@OBrienGuitars On contemporary production guitars what is ever used other than lacquer? Thank you.

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@philipliethen519 you can use catalyzed urethane or UV cured polyester.

[@philipliethen519]

@@OBrienGuitars how can you tell which of these finishes has been used? Can one be used to spot repair over another? Thank you.

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@philipliethen519 CA glue products work best over urethanes and polyesters in my opinion. For lacquer I drop fill with lacquer and shellac I use for shellac finish repair.

[@EssiasSouza]

Robert, infelizmente estes produtos não têm no Brasil.... mas valeu as dicas, vou usar outros produtos que existem aqui. Abraços,

[@klauscottonswab2322]

You forget one thing... strike the razor blade with the sharp side across a metal piece! It'll creat a burr.. if you did it correctly you'll have a 90degree angled burr (the sharp side is angled now!) Now put the tape around it and scrape..... magic!

[@lancehayashi8667]

I'm wondering if you could use scratchx to smooth out and level finish instead of sandpaper.

[@johnbre20]

Dang I thought you were a magician

[@MrDunosan]

rob is this fill n finish version ok to cover a big nitrocellulose laquer crack? to me you are a magician! saludos.

[@OBrienGuitars]

Yes, it will fix cracks in the finish no matter what the size.

[@MichaelMcCloy]

Doesn’t the accelerator make it cloudy? I’ve had issues with this but maybe not with this brand of glue?

[@BFTOBIN]

Cheap products do, but not this one.

[@TheTriplelman]

Im no luthier, but Ive been playing for over 50 years. My flame finish Breedlove, had a bad chip as big as a fingernail, right down to the spruce wood top. It was right where my arm layed over to strum, so I went to the dollar store, and got a set (3 in a pack) of furniture color stains in tip applicators, (3colors) black, maple, oak. put light to dark down, matching the top, looked GREAT then I took dollar store clear epoxy glue and filled the large deficit. after drying I scraped as he showed, then sanded with 2000 wet. and WOW looks better than his, you can BARELY see it and Im playing to crowds with my Breedlove again!

[@OBrienGuitars]

Way to go Dude!

[@jgrizzelvlogs6886]

Can I use just a lil drop of epoxy and not touch it?

[@OBrienGuitars]

My experience has been that you will need to level and buff the repair area.

[@jgrizzelvlogs6886]

@@OBrienGuitars thank you! 😄

[@Gatopaco4]

Asking for a friend who just put a tiny dent in a new spruce top that I'm, (ah, my friend) is working on. It's pretty small and was able to steam some of it out, but a tiny dent is still present. Would filling with CA glue be okay on raw wood? I've seen comments that CA glue can cause staining in the grain. This top will be French polished with super blonde, so bad things will show...

[@OBrienGuitars]

I wouldn’t put CA glue on the wood but rather seal the wood first with some finish and then level with either CÁ glue or another product during the finishing process.

[@nick16754]

Hi Robert, I recently got a Gibson Les Paul Studio (gloss finish), and the previous owner dinged out little notches on the back of the neck near the fret markers. I guess he wanted to feel where the frets were with his fretting hand thumb. The notches only seem to be through the outermost layer of the finish and do not go through to the color coat. Any recommendations to fix those? Thanks!

[@OBrienGuitars]

I would use probably glu boost to level and then buff to a gloss.

[@klauscottonswab2322]

And NEVER fold the sanding paper around the block! It'l create high spots!

[@bradstock]

Great video! How do you deal with this type of issue when the ding is in a place with a complex curve like a neck heel?

[@OBrienGuitars]

YOu can do it the same way but use a thicker CA glue

[@bradstock]

@@OBrienGuitars thank you! My main concern is after properly gluing and clamping (which I have done well I believe), that if I add CA glue, leveling it with the razor blade trick will be next to impossible because of the complex curves.

[@OBrienGuitars]

It is never easy is it?

[@bradstock]

@@OBrienGuitars😂😢

[@scaira60]

Robbie, I have an old but really nice Yamaha acustic guitar it has Two gouges in the sitka spruce top near the pickguard whats the best way to fix something like that??? The gouges are approx 1mm+ deep. Thanks Scott

[@OBrienGuitars]

You could probably use the method I show here in the video.

[@akfisher7138]

Can Nitrocellulose finishes be spot repaired. My Eastman has a few gauges that need repairing. Cheers

[@OBrienGuitars]

yes.

[@Johnsormani]

I had some good results with clear nail polish too ( old nitro based, not the modern stuff)

[@dryadson]

Any advice on a arched top of a Gretsch guitar a Les Paul shape.

[@OBrienGuitars]

same process will work.

[@kearnsguitars2236]

How can you tell what was used for too coat?

[@OBrienGuitars]

I assume you are asking about what type of finish was used onthe guitar. If this is the case then the Glu Boost products work well with any finish, especially lacquers, urethanes, polyesters etc.

[@kearnsguitars2236]

@@OBrienGuitars I have a crack in my father's 12 string Eco about 7" long from bridge down center line. Once I cleat it I'll need to refinish the repair. How can I figure out what finish was used so I can try and match it? Thank you for responding

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@kearnsguitars2236 Wipe some lacquer thinner in a non conspicuous area. If it melts the finish it is lacquer, if not, it is probably a synthetic resin like urethane or polyester.

[@kearnsguitars2236]

@@OBrienGuitars thank you so much

[@Pharesm]

Can you fix a light scratch in Taylor Guitars' "silent finish" with this stuff and your method...?

[@OBrienGuitars]

What is a silent finish? I have never heard that term?

[@Pharesm]

​@@OBrienGuitars Much thanks for the response! Its probably just marketing language from Taylor Guitars? Its supposed to not be noisy / squeak if your hand slides over it? idk. Beyond that, they say its sprayed with an electrostatic charge, so the *paint* or whatever it is will cling to the wood better. That's what they say in their KZbin factory tour. It may be silent, but its also not very sturdy... I somehow ended up with a scratch below and oddly forward of the sound hole on my new Taylor 517 Builder's, which doesn't match where or how I play. Probably can't figure out how to fix it if I don't know what kind of wood-coating they used...

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@Pharesm Thanks for the info. Sounds like some marketing play on words. Taylor I believe uses UV cured polyester for a finish and this is probably a satin finish is my guess. Fixing scratches can do more harm than good. I say just play the guitar and enjoy it.

[@Pharesm]

@@OBrienGuitars Much thanks for the info on UV Cured Polyester and the advice :)

[@revisionzero4525]

Any kind of super glue it is okay? I have a ding on the top of my martin guitar can i do that what you are doing but a different super glue?

[@OBrienGuitars]

I recommend Glu Boost fill and finish for this type repair.

[@revisionzero4525]

Thank you sir

[@captainamerica9353]

I have used just regular cheap super glue. Remember, the defect is not going to disappear completely, anyway. Any decent hardware store will have super glue and extra fine sandpaper. You will pay a lot for this kit and only use a fraction of it.

[@joshuaelvina3544]

Does any kind of superglue work?

[@OBrienGuitars]

some work better than others. I prefer the gluboost products for this type of repair.

[@5000loto]

Two questions. First, someone sent their guitar all the way from Australia for a ding, or was there another reason? Second, same as McCloy, does this combination of cyanoacrylate and accelerator not get cloudy? I pore fill with super glue which can take forever to cure on a clean surface and cloudy would be unacceptable. Thanks

[@OBrienGuitars]

The guitar is from Australia but it live sin Colorado. The Glu Boost accelerator doesn't get cloudy, white or bubble when curing.

[@5000loto]

@@OBrienGuitars Thanks Robert, I think I'll give it a try. Did you say that Australian guitar lives in sin in Colorado:-)?

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@5000loto haha. A funny typo.

[@RobbieMcLean]

Eeeeeeeek. I had a friend turn with an exaggerated arm movement and ring, and that horrible clunk and dink noise on a vintage 1971 almost perfect D-45 Martin. He felt and still does feel worse than me. I am like finally the fisrt significant ding, but would not mind minimizing it a bit. Jeff will pay what ever. I feel sorry for his guilt. Told him I would be happy to carve up his Taylor 914. ....Well don't feel quite that guilty :)

[@Mikec80]

Robert, I have a ding in the lacquer of my Eastman. Will this method work?

[@OBrienGuitars]

It might be. However, I do this type repair on a case by case basis.

[@Mikec80]

@@OBrienGuitars Thanks Robert. Any possible way I could send you a photo of the ding?

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@Mikec80 My contact info is on my website. obrienguitars.com

[@Mikec80]

@@OBrienGuitars Thanks so much Robert! I appreciate your time and will reach out to your via email.

[@akfisher7138]

@@Mikec80 Hi. I have an Eastman that has a few deep scratches. Did you try dissolving the finish with thinnner, and reapplying nitrocellulose finish, or did you try the cA glue trick? Thanks

[@louis.manteau.guitars]

Wasn't there any way to avoid that black spot the glue let between the lacquer and the wood I guess ?

[@OBrienGuitars]

unfortunately wood, especially cedar goes dark when adding a filler like this.

[@DynamicRockers]

@@assabetstrings700 Not sure if it's a matter of glue or wood but depending on the combination glue/wood it darkens the spot. Sometime refinishing the area is a better solution and almost invisible compared to the CA method.

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@DynamicRockers You are correct but some finishes can't be spot repaired, Also if you go through to the wood when sanding then you have a blotchy area to worry about.

[@ralphhiggs5803]

It can be avoided by matching color as close as you can get with stain and sealing prior to glue build up. You can find this being done successfully on KZbin with similar guitar finishes.

[@RonaldCid]

I was wondering the same, the cedar seems to absorb the filler, and appears dark. I'm wondering if that also can be solved...steaming some water into the dents and lifting the grains of wood to the natural position...It happened to me once on a non finished guitar..I dropped a tool on the top, and I was able with steam to make the wood return to almost normal with minimun sanding...any thoughts?

[@thomastommy1192]

I have this problem with my Martin D35. Where can I buy the Blu glue products? Awesome video thanks for sharing.

[@OBrienGuitars]

You can get them at Luthiers mercantile International. www.lmii.com/glue/2977-gluboost-masterglu-ultra-thin-2-oz-includes-2-whip-tips-and-2-extender-nozzles.html

[@danaeverhart6487]

You needed to level the fill in more!

[@teddybasterd9415]

Guess I'm the only one to notice you damaged the guitar from your initial sanding of the damaged area where you scratch it and didn't polish out all the sanding marks, don't you know the value of masking tape? If you would have masked of the area you could have avoided this. The damage I'm taking about can be seen at 7:17 in the video it's in the reflection of the light under your thumb. And the location of the damage provided you an other options to avoid damaging the guitar if you couldn't afford masking tape is to keep the non working part of the sandpaper off the guitar. I would like to know how much they pay you for your incompetency?

[@OBrienGuitars]

Not quite sure what you are referring to. However, I assure you that this client was quite pleased with the result of my work and willing to compensate me accordingly. Happy Building!

[@teddybasterd9415]

OBrienGuitars you left behind sanding marks you didn't polish out. You can see it at 7:17 pause the video and look at the reflection of the light you'll see the sanding marks. I don't know maybe half assed work is your trademark, I'm not asking you to work magic but if you're going to ruff up the finish for no reason then you should take the time to polish it out. I'd be embarrassed to call that job finished but that's just me.

[@OBrienGuitars]

@@teddybasterd9415 I appreciate your concern. Rather than worrying about and critiquing the work of others I invite you to contribute to helping educate others in the lutherie community like myself and so many others are willing to do. Anyone who has been following me and my body of work for any length of time is familiar with my reputation.

[@teddybasterd9415]

OBrienGuitars you don't find my suggest to mask off the area to be worked on to prevent damaging the rest of the guitar of any value? Well I bag to differ. "I'm just trying to fix somebody else screw up". Oh where did I hear that from... MMM?

[@kommi1974]

Still getting beatings from your mom, eh? Must be sad being a lonely fuck-tard living in your parents basement tossing stones at master repairmen. I digress, I will let you get back to your pathetic life that nobody gives two shits about.