Manaless Dredge Vs Affinity Game 3

[@justinpatrick8696]

Hey,i just started playing and like this idea for a deck, but wat i dont understand is how u r guaranteed a win after u flip ur deck, i feel like as soon as u explain it im gonna feel dumb for not getting it b4, but if u could thatd still help me out a lot.

[@tabletopmagic3386]

+Justin Patrick Once you have the deck in the graveyard you strip away there hand with Cabal Therapy while making tokens with Bridge from Bellow. Then Dread Return a Flayer of the Hatebound. (Doing 4 Damage) Then Dreaded Return a Golgari Grave Troll with Flayer of the Hatebound in play for 30+ damage. Check out my video Manaless Dredge Turn two Kill Explained.

[@viperf]

You made a mistake: you can't change graveyard order. You did that when used Golgari Grave troll to dredge, then last card revealed is Nether Shadow. Nether Shadow should be the last card in cemetery, but you put it before in the order allowing you to brought it in the next turn. (in 3:54 minutes exactly)

[@tabletopmagic3386]

I never changed the order of my graveyard, but I understand where you are going with this. When you resolve an ability, like Dredge, that moves multiple cards from one game zone to another; such as my library to my graveyard, you choose the order of the cards that are placed into the new zone. So what ever order I place them into the graveyard is the correct order as long as I don't change the order of the cards that are already in my graveyard. I understand the misconception since Nether Shadow is one of the only cards that have a ability that is relevant to the order of the graveyard. I believe this is also covered in my Manaless Deck Tech. If you have anymore questions feel free to ask.

[@viperf]

Table Top Magic Wrong. You have to flip cards to graveyard and CAN'T the order of the cards revealed this way.

[@tabletopmagic3386]

702.51a Dredge is a static ability that functions only while the card with dredge is in a player's graveyard. "Dredge N" means "As long as you have at least N cards in your library, if you would draw a card, you may instead put N cards from the top of your library into your graveyard and return this card from your graveyard to your hand." 404.3. If an effect or rule puts two or more cards into the same graveyard at the same time, the owner of those cards may arrange them in any order. If you have any other questions feel free to ask. :D

[@viperf]

Table Top Magic You're right ! I'm sorry (forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=8904329). I watch the SCG tournaments every weekend (for about 2 years), and never saw one dredge player rearrange the cards. Usually they flip the cards straight to the cemetery. Sometimes they "draw" (to hand) the cards, but don't rearrange and put on cemetery in same order. I saw twice, a judge ordered that the dredge player to "flip cards one by one straight to the cemetery". Tanks for the info man and sorry !

[@tabletopmagic3386]

No worry's here. I understand the misconception. I play this deck at competitive events and I get a judge call every round for this and Nether Shadows oracle text. This isn't a common deck nor a fair deck. That is why in non-casual play I will clearly announce every phase and every trigger as I go. This way when I do get a judge call I can clearly say where I am in the turn and what triggers are happening. If you have anymore questions about this deck feel free to ask. Comments are always welcome.

[@dimitriousdevilboon7714]

Wrong viper. The cards go in all at the same time and the player chooses what order they go in.

[@tabletopmagic3386]

:) 404.3. If an effect or rule puts two or more cards into the same graveyard at the same time, the owner of those cards may arrange them in any order.