Mantic Games - Perfect Alternative to GW?

[@Philtopy]

One important aspect about Firefight is: The game is unit-activation and not turn based, like 40k. This means you and your opponent activate units one after the other, leading to both of you beeing constantly engaged in the game, wich enhances your enjoyment of a match by a lot. It also prevents that awkward situation like in turn-based systems where you loose half your army in your opponents turn and you can actually play the big units you want to play. It also doesnt have strategems and rule bloat with constant rewrites and updates that force you to rebuild your entire army setup and buy new support material. And also: The starter sets from Mantic have enough units of both factions to actually play a decent game that feels dynamic and exciting. They immedietly feel like you have a finished game on your hands with just that one box. The starter Sets from GW only have barely enough units for both sides to make a match work, but not enough to make you feel like you have a dynamic experience. They are designed to make you instantly crave a bigger army size so you can have options and dynamics, leading you into dumping even more money into the game. So while Mantic offers you to buy more minis so you can put the cherry on top of your playing experience, GW manipulates you into spending even more cash just to sate your craving for a baseline fun game. Also you can perfectly proxy some Mantic minis for 40k and play them in OnePageRules Grimdark future.

[@colinmack8655]

Kings of War is the game I wish fantasy had been and the Goblins are stunning I love the fact that they have other armies gear.

[@leesimpson6334]

I've upgraded to mantic Firefight ...have 1500pts of Asterians for a fraction of a GW army

[@intzbk1]

The Warpath? sized boxes remind me of the GW Combat Patrol sized forces. So, $45 on Mantic vs. $160 for GW.

[@dadashlorgar]

yeah but the mini design is bad af...like really bs level. it is not compareable - so it is cheaper.

[@AnnihilatedHope]

@@dadashlorgar that is actually not true anymore. Just resently painted some enforcers and have some GCPS here. While its true that its not GW standard , they are very solid models. just without much details. Dont know from when your info is but it is unfair to say they are bs level.

[@colinmack8655]

@@dadashlorgarwhat minis most of the new stuff is excellent. Times move on and they do not billion parts like gws kits that just annoy me.

[@tyrs8657]

​@dadashlorgar that is true for their older stuff. The newer models have come a long ways, still not up to GW quality though. The Mantic Vault is also awesome for printing out the minis/extras which come out pretty nice.

[@salperez50]

Not true anymore, there just as good and with less detail creep so you don't have to pend an hour on one mini.

[@robertstrong6798]

Completely agree I did this a year ago. Models are not quite as good cosmetically. But they are good and a dam sight cheaper. If they can just fill out there lore a bit more. But yes the fact they seem to care does really help I’d recommend them too

[@athel06]

If looking at kings of war and not wanting to buy one of the 2 player starter sets, the ambush sets are great value, with a small chunk of models as well as the rules to play them. Most of the ambush sets also have the newer mantic plastics in as well.

[@elizabethmilward8301]

The ambush sets looked good to me, too. I have a box en route to me now.

[@montycasinosbarandgrill]

Mantic is the best gaming company out there right now. Their games have ways been fantastic to play not being bogged down in endless rules and nonsense like other companies. They are quick to learn and super fun to play. I remember reading the rules for Deadzone and thinking this just makes sense, this company is getting everything right. I've played Mars Attacks, Deadzone, Walking Dead, Hellboy, Vanguard (My favorite Mantic game!) and Dungeon Saga and looking forward to Firefight and Kings of War. But above all, they love their customers and actually care about what we think. I will always be a fan of this company! Thanks Ronnie and team you are the best! (PS - their miniatures are getting better. Every new release is an improvement on the last. I love them. Great models, great games!)

[@MrMediaYSB]

Been looking at maybe picking up the Marauders Enforcers firefight box, thanks for the video!

[@chezratte1357]

Mantics zombies and Gouhls are pretty good miniatures. still prefer those to the GW versions.

[@Arcemise]

Firefight is so much fun! So are Deadzone and Kings of War! Mantic makes some seriously fun games :D

[@Gumlass1]

Armada is great, and you can get all the models as STLs from Mantic Vault.

[@ratatatuff]

And that makes me really think of getting a 3D-printer. I think the Vault is a great idea. It's just that I'm unsure because from what I gather a resin printer is not the most healthy piece of equipment to have in your flat.

[@Gumlass1]

@@ratatatuff no. It's not. With room for cleaning and curing, it's a lot of space too. But I have a shed, so it's not an issue for me.

[@juggernugget]

I am still currently putting together marauders and enforcers from the starter set. Also they have a new faction coming up for the game as well. I look forward to getting into a game sometime.

[@insomniacbritgaming1632]

KoW and Deadzone are far better

[@colinmack8655]

Ronnie Renton is the owner and CEO he was once a GW executive back in the day.

[@GettingHandsy]

I've always liked Ronnie. I just didn't know if he still ran everything.

[@ERBarratt]

​@@GettingHandsyHe certainly does (he's my boss). I can say too, as an employee, best company to work for and actual, genuine hobby loving people!

[@GettingHandsy]

@@ERBarratt Awesome!

[@Gumlass1]

The Mantic rules are way better than GW stuff. Very streamlined.

[@hughsammy4278]

For me the rules is the #1 reason to play Mantic games. Firefight vs 40K isn't even a contest in my opinion.

[@XX-jn8co]

I was about to post similar, for me the real draw of Mantic vs GW is that their actual games are simply better. Both Kings of War and Firefight are simply excellent games, Firefight in particular is great. It's engaging, both players are constantly involved in the game, it has a broad range of tactical options and it simulates real small-scale combat scenarios like pinning and flanking very well. It also has simple but well developed urban combat support, with storming buildings or fast-roping a team onto the roof to work down through the building being valid options. It manages all of this while still being far simpler than 40K.

[@GettingHandsy]

I've always heard Mantic's rules are easier to understand and as you said, more streamlined. I've just never had a chance to actually play them...I'm more of just a miniatures collector at this point :)

[@AnnihilatedHope]

@@GettingHandsy the rules are really quick to learn. specially if you know 40k already. Only the hight system was a bit abstract for me at start but after a few rounds you get comfortable with it

[@madpolitico]

Ah man, you missed Dungeon Saga, which is like their version of Warhammer Quest! Neat little board game with minis that can be used for RPGs. I think they’re releasing a new edition, definitely got my eye on it. Their newer minis are definitely better. Not as cluttered with “detail” as GW minis, but that makes them easier to assemble and paint and actually get on the table, and you don’t need fifty pouches and random stuff covering every model.

[@GettingHandsy]

Ya, I kickstarted the original Dungeon Saga, but forgot to mention them in the video specifically. Thanks for the reminder!

[@kudosbudo]

My kid loves that game but boy is it boring to Gm for him and co.

[@falconiusazurius5572]

Neither GW or Mantic used to interest me much. I'm not into "gangs fighting in a parking lot" style games. But now both are giving us Epic games that are arguably REAL wargames.

[@pepdawg18]

Would definitely recommend Warmachine MKIV as an alternative as well! :)

[@GettingHandsy]

I played WarmaHordes during....i think it was 2nd edition. I have always liked the minis, but the gameplay just wasn't for me, and mostly for just one reason...when someone can one-shot your leader and that ends the game. That super competitive gameplay was just too much for me at the time. I have no idea if it has changed in 2 editions though, so might have to look into it again. Thanks for the recommendation!

[@FangYuLee]

From what I've heard about older editions, definitely more balanced and less gimmick. Assassination is still real, gives you a chance to come back when losing.

[@sullyway51]

The only problem I have is with their injection molded plastic kit figures(the Forge Father figures) do not come with any instruction sheets for assembly. Some of them have a heck of a lot of small parts.

[@GettingHandsy]

I can see that being an issue. Not knowing how to put the models together is frustrating!

[@interessierterArbeiter-161]

The new ambush boxes and the new starters have assembly instructions now and i think on their websites you can find them for enforcers and forgefathers too

[@Cardulionax]

I actually have a Mantic Games bag that they gave out exclusively that first year (months?) they were operating as an early adopter bonus. I bought a whole ton of those early dwarves and I still have a load of them unmade as I stopped playing fantasy shortly afterwards when I moved and had no one to play it with any longer.

[@ratatatuff]

I just wish they wouldn't have abandoned Vanguard. I'm in the process of collecting all the warbands (yes, I'm a crazy person) but have to stick to alternative models for some. I love the Trident Realm of Neritica, though.I hope they do a streamlined version of Vanguard at some point. I like that they embraced 3D-printing and I'm really thinking of getting a resin printer for all the Armada stuff in their Vault.

[@tim192837645]

Agree 100%. I went full-in on the Kickstarter and it's the one game from Mantic that I was able to get my friends into properly, and Mantic seem to have dropped it :( Such a shame

[@HrNobody]

have been writing to Ronnie asking what is going on with Vanguard and he said they would get back to it but wouldn't say when. my thought is that they might do it when new editions of Kings of War come out

[@tim192837645]

@@HrNobody I really want to believe they'll bring it back, but all the Vanguard stuff on their website is in the "last chance to buy" section, there's no unit cards that I can find, and there's no support for it on the Mantic companion site. Maybe it performed so poorly that dropping it was the right thing to do, but if they did bring it back they've lost the players they fucked over who invested in the original launch.

[@ratatatuff]

@@HrNobody Thanks man! It's great to hear news about Vanguard! At least they are still thinking about it and haven't completely forgotten it. I would play KoW but I like my models painted and I know I'm never be able to finish a full army so I stick to skirmishers.

[@Aethon988]

For an alternative game you should look at Conquest. Their quality is very close to GW and the gameplay is super fast and interesting.

[@GettingHandsy]

Conquest is on my list as well! Got one of their 2 player starter sets awhile back; just haven't had a chance to play it yet. Thanks for the recommendation!

[@CTX-lk8hf]

I'm just not sure how good Mantic's quality control is. The first box I purchased was the mega army of the Trident Realm of Neritica and the Depth Horror Eternal model was missing his head. After contacting Mantic they want proof of purchase before they will send me a head. I have it but it just seems a little silly, as if I'm trying to cheat them out of just a head of a $12 model. I had been buying GW stuff since 1987 and say what we will about them I have never had a single piece missing from any blister pack or box set in 37 years. That being said Mantic does make some nice looking models I just hope quality control isn't an issue going forward.

[@GettingHandsy]

That's unfortunate! I haven't had any issues with the kickstarters and stuff I've bought from them, but that's just my experience. I've heard their models in general have gotten better over time, so I would hope that would means their service as well.

[@colinmack8655]

Odd I had one mis pack and they asked for a picture and they sent me a whole new model. Gw demanded I send items back once and when I did recorded delivery they stated they only got one item (both where in the box) I got it sorted but they are not the kings of customer service. Also forgeworld asked for a receipt on an mis pack too.

[@CTX-lk8hf]

@@colinmack8655 Yeah kings of customer service is not the first thing that comes to mind with GW. I’ve just been fortunate enough to not have been missing anything in packages I have bought from them through the years.

[@spamerling833]

I usually buy Mantic stuff. The QC has increased and my issue requests have dropped from once every two months to once per year^^

[@Bodkin_Ye_Pointy]

So my observation is. why play Mantic as an alternative to GW? Why not play it for its own sake? Why does any game have to be played as an alternative to any other game, like so many content producers seem to suggest? You should be playing any game for its own sake and because you enjoy it of course. I play multiple games not because one is better than the other but because they have value in their own right.

[@GettingHandsy]

I agree, we should be playing Mantic games just to play Mantic games, or other companies' games. But this video was specifically made because people were mad at GW and looking for alternative games.

[@KinaQuinquina]

Been looking in to Deadzone and Firefight as an alternative. GW rules are too complicated for their own good. Some models might look average but there isn't a rule you can't use for example GW models or 3D printed ones. I'm collecting Leagues of Votann from GW because I like the look. I'm planning to use them as proxies for Forge Fathers. I just need to change the bases to sizes meant for Firefight/Deadzone. The Mantic army that I wanna collect are the Veer-Myn. I might even use them in some skirmish games from GW. Kings of War looks interresting but the multibasing is a nono for me. I would use multiple small bases and use movement trays. Helps if I need to repaint a model of want to change the places of models. I know it's an extra investment but I will gladly pay. Their Mantic companion is cool and their extra 3D printed options give more dynamic poses to their models. For me the price and the rules are a big plus. I never intend to go for super detailed models or well painted models. I'm just a beginner painter and just want to play some games.

[@GettingHandsy]

My understanding of Mantic games has always been: while they always sold minis, they didn't necessarily limit you to playing with them. You were free to use whatever minis you wanted. But I haven't looked recently to see if they stepped away from that. Regular bases with movement trays would be the way I go. Gives you the most options later on.

[@robtibbetts890]

Reviewing Mantic's catalog is sort of an interesting way to survey the company, but I'd enjoy this video more if you showed some physical minis, either painted or unpainted.

[@ericknutsen8133]

I've bought some of their sets as alternatives for necromunda.

[@tim192837645]

I have a soft spot for Mantic games but it's been hard to get my friends into their offerings, I've only really succeeded with Vanguard and to a lesser extent Deadzone. The rulesets for the bigger games like Kings of War were a bit too simplified/abstracted compared to the likes of Warhammer Fantasy, and while they have got better some of their sculpts are... not great. Not to mention the fact that they still use restic/PVC plastic for many models which is horrible to work with. Also personally gutted that they seem to have dropped support and/or development for Vanguard, which is a fantastic game.

[@BackPackBadger]

I used to love playing Firefight but with the player base in the UK being so small I was lucky if I could find a game once a month 😕

[@GettingHandsy]

🙁

[@0bverse]

I can't get away with the waxy pvc-like material Mantic use, and the yawning gaps on their multipart models. Bought a pre-owned starter army dirt-cheap from eBay and I had to grind joylessly through the assembly and painting. Love their company ethos, but I don't think the quality is really there.

[@GettingHandsy]

Depending on when you bought those, supposedly, Mantic has gotten better over time. That being said....3D printing is an option too 😁

[@law_of_the_jelly298]

You cannot beat GW at quality "and" you become part of a massive community with clubs everywhere

[@GettingHandsy]

It's tough, that's true!

[@salperez50]

Not true check out conquest

[@GettingHandsy]

@@salperez50 I do think conquest has awesome models. They are probably one of the next videos I'll do

[@law_of_the_jelly298]

@@salperez50 might be true... but then i would end up with something nobody in my area plays. GW community is great in my area and I enjoy playing 40k.... never even heard of conquest..

[@dariostabletopminatures]

WORKS! 9:40 Yupp....its good!

[@bruced648]

I was hoping to see a demonstrated play thru comparison. not simply a product infomercial.

[@GettingHandsy]

In the current climate, I've just seen people looking for alternatives to GW. I was just showing one of the companies that offers some options. Thanks for watching and commenting!

[@bruced648]

@GettingHandsy maybe a short run thru of the game turn as a suggestion for a follow-up vid. have options is great, but I think people would like to know what's different. thanks for your efforts.

[@EverydayEldrad]

This is all nice and well but if other people don't play it then you can't get value out of your models. Doesn't matter how much cheaper they are

[@GettingHandsy]

Then more people need to start putting their money where their mouths are, and actually playing alternative games 🙂

[@bigegames2019]

Ronnie owns 100% of Mantic

[@GettingHandsy]

Appreciate the confirmation!

[@sssuperslayer25]

The only problem is thst no one plays this stuff near me, it's all GW wargames.

[@GettingHandsy]

Just gotta start it up yourself then! 😀

[@SuperEagle112]

Same at our independent store but we just started using mantic models to play 40K. Works amazingly well.

[@spamerling833]

We had one guy playing it. Seven years later a large part of our club mainly plays Mantic Games

[@ChaseDaOrk3767]

Are the Marauders a good cheap alternative to 40k Orks

[@GettingHandsy]

The Marauders don't have as many options, so you might have to get some extra stuff from someplace else (mix and match from different companies or 3d print), but they are pretty cheap compared to the 40k orks, at a glance. The main troops for the marauders are the commandos, and they are 10 for $25 vs the Ork Boys, who are $55 for the same amount. The Marauder Strike Forces is 30 infantry, 4 bigger elite looking guys, a boss and a jet for $100, vs the Orks Combat Patrol which is 20 infantry, a boss and 4 cavalry for $160. More models for less money, as long as you are okay with the different look. And you get reward points when you spend at Mantic, which gives you credit for the next thing you buy (within a time limit). Seems like a pretty good deal to me (if you dont have access to a 3d printer).

[@ChaseDaOrk3767]

@@GettingHandsy Kinda wish I had a 3d printer, might have to save up some money to possibly buy one someday

[@GettingHandsy]

3d printers have come down a lot in price, and there are tons of ork models out there, so if you can save up enough for a couple GW boxes, you should easily be able to afford a small resin printer :)

[@ChaseDaOrk3767]

@@GettingHandsy fair enough, any recommendations for good cheap 3d printers?

[@GettingHandsy]

I started with an elegoo mars. I don't think they are necessarily the cheapest tho. You can get a brand new mars for under $200 on Amazon. Pretty sure there are other cheaper ones (anycubic photons I think, maybe creality), I just don't have any experience with them. You will then need cleaning supplies and a way to cure the resin. A lot of people buy a wash/cure machine, but I use a makeshift bucket with LED strips and cheap food buckets/alcohol. One thing to note about resin printing, it's going to take some money and time to get going, but once you make the investment, it pays off pretty quickly. After I got my first printer, I printed off enough custodes for what would have been $600+ in store for a round 2 bottles of resin, which at the time was like $40-50 ish. Otherwise, you could try an fdm printer. Some of those are closer to $100, and don't require the cleaning (post processing) steps. They just aren't nearly as detailed as resin.

[@Hiddenronin]

Mantic models are cheaper but imo most of the range looks like absolute arse. The undead are about he only ones I use.

[@themidnightaristocrat]

If you were to play Kings of War at full model count, KoW can be far more expensive than The Old World. KoW armies are HUGE. Luckily you can multibase your units and use a lot less

[@interessierterArbeiter-161]

They abandoned the FMC, some of the newer boxes don't even adhere to it anymore, especially the resin only boxes because resins are expensive af to cast in decent quality

[@spamerling833]

Not true. I play KoW FMC and WHFB FMC. I can play every list option with my. army in KoW for about 2k. In WHFB I would have to spend for the same idea 12k^^

[@martinjrgensen8234]

Rules are decent. But their models almost always look like pants. And are cheaply made, from cheap materials

[@GettingHandsy]

Supposedly their quality has gotten much better over time...but also, you can 3d print and play their rules at least!

[@WinstonSmith-yy8qs]

Their orks are terrible, their guard is perfect

[@GettingHandsy]

Ya, the marauders are probably one of their weaker options imo, but I do really like those GCPS!

[@colinmack8655]

The maurader are cool man like old school gw orks back in space crusade

[@WinstonSmith-yy8qs]

Have you painted them, the sides of the mInis lack detail and the head are stupidly small, brought 30, I let the kids play with them.

[@colinmack8655]

@@WinstonSmith-yy8qs the casting in china fucked up the moulds sadly it’s why they switched to Archaeon but they don’t have the momey to get the moulds redone.

[@DeusMachina71]

I like Kings of War, but Mantic is a big, loud meh from me. I like the company, but the models and lore are an issue. The models are often ugly, the scaling weird and the materials sometimes questionable, particularly the PVC stuff. The lore is bland and not very captivating, GW lore, particularly in the past, has been lightning in a bottle. The fact that they stick a proprietary spin on many of the armies instead of a pure miniatures agnostic system doesn't work to the games strengths imop. They have expanded into 3d printing with Mantic which is a move in the right direction. The bottom line is its quality is Mediocre, the lore is poor and it's harder to get players. As much as I like Kings of War it hasn't become my default system as I now prefer One Page Rules or just Oldhammer it for Grim dark fantasy.

[@cillamccarthy6987]

I can understand your pov. Restic was a knightmare to work with and the pvc can be hard to clean up. Mantic have made a push over the last few years to move more of the range to hard plastics. Most of their core kits for the army are now Hips. With resin casts or 3d print options available for other items. Yes there are still some of the older minis kicking about in the ranges but they're alot less than they used to be.

[@telleryoutube4458]

the lore argument is always interesting to me. An established narrative vs building your own etc. I was die hard GW for a while, I know everything there is to know about Eldar. That being said I never 'felt' Eldar on the board. Mantic Warpath lore to me feels more like Aliens, than GW. A different type of Grim Dark, but certainly Grim Dark. I recommend grabbing their source book and taking a read. As for the restic/pvc stuff. I feel you there. A lot of their stuff is plastic now, but I'm more in the OPR world/3d printing.. so if I don't like something I just print out an alternative haha =D Mantic games are pretty mini agnostic.

[@GettingHandsy]

I was just trying to show some options for people who don't 3D print and are looking at trying to move away from GW. But ya, if you asked my opinion, I would say get into 3D printing ASAP and play whatever ruleset you enjoy the most.

[@colinmack8655]

The issue with restac was that people who are used to working with HIPS did not understand the material. It’s like resin, or metal, once you know the tricks the sky is the limit.

[@cillamccarthy6987]

@@colinmack8655 I agree once you had the skills down the minis came out well. But it's not a intro friendly material for someone new to the hobby. I'm glad there moving over to hips more and more.

[@TheDuke07]

Their sci fi line is phoned in they kept chasing whatever fad GW was doing with deadzone and were always behind. Their fantasy is far better alternative.

[@GettingHandsy]

I can agree with that, and I think you can tell just based on the number of factions in fantasy vs scifi.

[@kudosbudo]

I'd disagree. Havign played Killteam Deadzone is a much easier friendlier gamified game to get into. Great for new players. Killteam by comparison is a faux complex game that doesn't quite hit right. Its basically tryign to be what Infinity is and does about 100% better. Not that thats bad. Ist a good game just in a weird middle spot.

[@hellcat64]

cat

[@peaceturtleinfinity]

Mantis’s figures look like garbage for the most part. Super static poses…not good.

[@GettingHandsy]

They might not be perfect...but they are an alternative 🙂 But yes, they could use some additional dynamic poses.

[@cthuludreams1]

Mantic rules? 👍 Mantic sculpts and models? 👎👎