Masterclass: Lumineth vs. Skaven REMATCH (4th Edition Age of Sigmar) Battle Report

It's time for a 4th edition battle report! We're running back the Skaven vs. Lumineth Masterclass match from GW, so the same exact lists are in play.
Keep in mind we don't have the FULL rules yet, so we're using the articles and rules we do know to do our best. If we got something wrong, tell us in the comments!

[@johnraines7672]

For half of this game I kept saying, "You forgot to save a CP for battleshock!" It's going to be great not having to worry about battleshock in this edition.

[@warpfireminis]

It's a HUGE difference on that alone, Clanrats are definitely one of our MVP's going forward.

[@scottmills4164]

The lack of Battle shock really makes clanrats stick better. I forgot about that, makes a big difference, especially since you still recover models at the the end of the turn.

[@SpinupSquad]

Dude! you are always doing exactly what facilitates fantastic learning. Super comprehensive articulation of the game. Your presentation and patience is next level.

[@ChaseCrossing]

This was one of the most clear battle reports I've ever seen. Great job

[@scottmills4164]

4th Edition! Really exciting stuff!

[@ghostmutton]

Great battle report. Every round is succinct while still being informative. Camera angle is perfect.

[@interdimensionalcommunicat9750]

>Almost the entire Skaven army dies >Skaven still win. Typical Skaven strategy-tactics.

[@warpstoneenjoyer8293]

Acceptable losses

[@PleasantKenobi]

This video was fantastic. It really helped me to understand the eb and flow of the new editions games, and offered genuinely insightful commentary to help me better understand strategy. Thanks for this, and more of it please!

[@ThePageTurnerPT]

I just assembled some stormfiends last night, and I feel validated that I put them together in the same way they're assembled in the video

[@mrbunning8051]

Brilliant report, can't wait. Fantastic content as always 👍

[@BreakingTad]

These are always so well done. Excited to see more once we have the info

[@WarpstoneHoarder]

Awesome idea!! Fantastic BR as always!

[@MrElliotholman]

Just discovered your content but I love the way you do your battle recaps, such great detail man hope your Chanel explodes you deserve it

[@Hangfire100]

Loved this, thanks Jordan

[@LemonFlavoredTea]

This is a fantastic idea for a video, haven’t watched it yet but can’t wait

[@LemonFlavoredTea]

it was great! thanks for putting the time in prior to 4th

[@Strade8]

Super nice format! Keep it up!

[@Swirling_Leaf]

Onther good 4th edition focus video from you guys!

[@damianone4404]

Love your breports so much.thank you so much

[@DaHobbles]

Best bat rep content! 🙌🙌🙌

[@RAWxxx07]

Wow I really like the presentation of the battle… and the explanations helped a lot. Great job

[@jakea3950]

That last play was spicy. Goes to show once oer battle stuff can really make a good difference. Also overall a excellent close bat rap. Excited for 4th hope you guys get alot of success from it 🎉😊

[@jb87rell]

Love these

[@thordoo3047]

Your battle reports are amazing. Could you please show some zoomed shots? It’s hard to see the units from the range of the overhead. It looks like blobs of random units after a while. 😬💙

[@warpfireminis]

I'll get to work on it!

[@thordoo3047]

@@warpfireminis Appreciate it! Also I've ordered multiple times from your store and it's arrived promptly and in perfect condition. THANK YOU for all the AOS work you do. :)

[@markpandelidis2079]

Glad to see it wasn't as one sided as it seemed in the masterclass. Also really glad Skaven don't get to reroll charges 4 times anymore and use 1 roll for their whole army. That was a super feel bad as an opponent. But they're still tricky, still have good mechanics. I hope PCBs are gone forever.

[@warpfireminis]

The rules team has been doing a great job of removing a lot of feels bad mechanics from most armies. The 4 charge rolls and million damage PCB's definitely were a crutch and not much fun for opponents; excited to see what else we get!

[@Fotta1989]

Sweet!

[@rickroberts7312]

Awesome

[@carlofassa171]

1740 old POINTS.

[@chrisvillegas5182]

except for the battleshock what else is the new changes in 4th edition? thanks for the video :)

[@pagacco]

Great Bat Rep! Was there anything that could have been done to save your little foot heros, or did they just not matter?

[@warpfireminis]

I could have been a little better about saving them, but in the grand scheme Clanrats and scoring points > the output of the small foot heroes. Once we get artifacts and command traits that'll give them more value!

[@drzephy]

Great battle report! Would have loved an overlay with current round as well as current CP.

[@warpfireminis]

Definitely adding the CP tracker for the next one!

[@ScreamingD]

Dang! fantastic Battle report! Also, no battlechock! no Grand strat! 4th Edition is looking really nice! Exided as heck!

[@warpfireminis]

No Grand Strat to worry about has been absolutely EXCELLENT.

[@ScreamingD]

@@warpfireminis Awesome!

[@aphios2]

The way I read the new Forward To Victory, is you must use the command before you roll the charge. Since it is a reaction to declaring a charge ability and the wording says "can" reroll. It seems like you played it that if you failed you could do it.

[@warpfireminis]

That's what we thought at the beginning too, but it got clarified. The Charge roll itself happens during the Declare step of the Charge, which is also the trigger for Forward to Victory. That means you can still roll the dice, see the result, and then choose to re-roll just like before!

[@apokalyph7325]

What is your opinion on 4th edition ranged stormfiends without the warpstone sparks from 3rd? That's like more than half the damage gone now, right?

[@warpfireminis]

We need to see the points on everything before we can make really good decisions, but if they're around the same points they are now I'm 100% on team Melee for the Fiends. The shooting damage just isn't there, and I think overall for shooting we just have better options that (likely) do it for less points.

[@corbingovers7559]

Remember that we're missing what the bombardier at least does. Not to mention if the arch warlock gets a new model and whatever the rest of the skaven lore/enhancements are. Still a lot of levers to pull before having a firm opinion.

[@user-mz2ow4ky7v]

Is there a reason you didn't take endless spells? Thought you got a lore of normal and a lore of endless. Good vid!

[@warpfireminis]

We didn't know all of the rules when it comes to how to set them up, casting values, and so on so we left them out. Definitely looking forward to throwing those in there, it will definitely change things up!

[@cmoye2002]

Sorry. New player. The very first charge. You only need to touch one model of the unit to kill the entire unit? Is there no melee range or does that thing effectively touch them all?

[@warpfireminis]

Combat range is 3", so the Hell Pit was in combat. For Age of Sigmar when you take damage it goes to the unit, and then you allocate the wounds to the models killing one at a time (whichever one you want). In that case the Hell Pit did enough damage to kill all of the models in the unit, so they all got picked up. So when your unit takes damage you can pull a guy from the very back of the squad and leave the ones up front so they can fight back and things like that as well.

[@Holy121]

Damn for a while I was sure that skaven will lose. What a great game

[@SpinupSquad]

Wow, I can't help but think the failing of all those charges was hugely detrimental to the overall Skaven plan. Are you sensing Skaven are going to need charge buffs to ensure the the plan get's executed? The CP use would have cleared up a few thoughts on choices both players would be gauging during either turn. For example, how many points are there to be used, do I redeploy? do I shoot? could I do both. Feels a bit unclear. Obviously this is the best video Ive seen yet, and Im sure they will become more obvious when we have the full rules set. I noticed you placed the Gnawhole on turn 2 but didnt do anything with it really? I feel like players will take the Gnawholes out, are they really that valuable? How do you feel about the Warbringer in this match vs. his usability in 3rd Edition?

[@warpfireminis]

- Failing those charges definitely hurt, but my fault overall; I could've just taken Take Their Land and scored an easy one there. - Definitely going to add a CP tracker to future videos, it's really important to keep track so you know what you and your opponent can/can't do. - People will definitely be breaking Gnawholes; if they can kill all of them it full stops your recursion. Going first it's pretty easy to get value out of them because you can use them right away, but if you're going second you're going to have to put them in bad places to avoid them just being instantly destroyed. - This one was a Warpseer and so far I really dislike it haha. The spell and extra 2" are nice buffs, but I like having a Monster that can go in and hit something hard and he just doesn't do it MOST of the time. Skreech is better, but really excited to see what the Warbringer/Deceiver/Corruptor bring to the table.

[@SpinupSquad]

@@warpfireminis you mentioned the gnawholes, does that mean at the beginning of the turn, even when your not going first, you're placing a gnawhole, that the opponent will be able to act and destroy it before you can use it? - Back to your charges, I get that there is risk, yet my concern is given average rolls for your 2nd turn strat, some of those should have made it. That there wasn't something to help you get there, seems like that turns strategy hangs on a thread. I'm concerned about an upper level perspective of "effective play" if "charging isn't their thing, it feels self defeating in the list building element which is part of the satisfaction in the game.

[@Vonbrow]

Did we know points?

[@michaelwilson765]

This is such a clever approach to show not only strategies but some of the new aspects of the game. As a Lumineth player I loved seeing some of the changes and I've been teetering on the brink of starting a Skaven army so this was super informative.

[@jonfisher4106]

In Lumineth turn 5 (34 minute mark) if the Verminlord only had 2 wounds left, why didn’t the kangaroos charge it? Just gifts the Skaven player 5 points bottom of 5. Or did it simply not matter?

[@warpfireminis]

At that point I pointed out to him how I still had the Stormfiends and the battle tactic which was enough to win the game. The Warpseer can trigger fight last and kill in the combat phase too, so it may have been safer to just covering fire me dead in my own turn.

[@Iamtidal]

What do people think jezzails Vs cannons?

[@warpfireminis]

Show me the points! Jezzails look to be something we can bring a ton of and be useful, where Cannons we can only overcharge one per turn. Might be something where you bring one cannon and a bunch of other shooting options!

[@wildflamingo8490]

Are this armies 1 or 2k points?

[@warpfireminis]

These are 2k lists, lots of expensive units!

[@Bahamutkotd]

Shouldn't the gnawholes damnage things that walk near them?

[@warpfireminis]

That's only if the enemy chooses to move through it! They aren't impassable anymore.

[@Lawlalotify]

a non skaven unit that walks over them takes d3 mortal damage, just being near it is fine.

[@Avinan7]

Skaven can just return units back every turn?

[@warpfireminis]

We can spend a CP now at the end of our turn to bring back a dead unit at half strength!

[@X4ngu]

@@warpfireminis over and over again? return already previously returned unit? or it keeps halfing?

[@warpfireminis]

@@X4ngu each unit can only be replaced once!

[@melchoriuz8116]

more ...mORE .... MORE!!!

[@roubledoubledice7712]

5:56 that unit of clanrats is not in coherency

[@warpfireminis]

The circle up front is good, looks like one little straggler on the edge on the objective! That's something just for doing these walkthroughs where I'm just not paying much mind to the models that are out of the action; I'll tighten up next time!

[@johnraines7672]

Is the new rule that you just have to be within 1/2 inch of one other model? If so, long, loopy daisy chains are back!

[@MrGreenpaulo]

Kangaroos??

[@warpfireminis]

The Hurakan Windcharger ride Kangaroo looking "Treerunner" mounts!

[@hobbyton3575]

Lumineth seem a bit over cooked like they always are when they first come out 😅 everybody lost rend and damage, and stone guard just keep adding

[@jakea3950]

I think the stone guard are supposed to be their elite troops? Plus we dont know any of the points values so this isnt accurate just a partial battle.