This Game is a Profound Modern Religious Parable

[@Aczie042]

You play the game for it's deep symbolic and religious undertones. I play it because it features Dante from Devil May Cry. 😎

[@LucasNascimento-pl8qj]

We are not the same

[@ZorotheGallade]

I play it because I like a story where your friends who have different opinions from yours instantly become extremists and try to kill you the moment they're given power, and that's cool and relatable af.

[@markhovscrch4050]

I play it back then because of Raidou english patch.

[@XxDeViLBrInGeRxX]

For me this game is the missing Disc 3 of DMC 2

[@Vitor20XX]

I play it to beat god with Dante

[@Gaarkukan21]

I often tell people this game has the depth of an ocean. So much untouched aspects to it. Like for example you can connect a lot of the Reason factions choice of demons to Proto Indo-European religion. Things like the reason of Shijima having Ahriman being connected to this theory that the Zoroastrians made him as a vilification of Buddhisms interpretation of emptiness. Or the use of the Baal avatar to represent Yosuga as a more primal version of YHVH explaining why all the angels align with Chiaki in the second half. Thor himself has connections to baal as a Storm deity along with Gozu Tenno sharing connections with Susanoo who is himself a storm deity. Another thing is the use of deities and world comparisons to create these metaphorical realms. The use of the Amala network, spirits, isolative deities (Specifically ones from William Blake mythos, and the flow of magatsuhi reflecting the flow of water makes Musubi a sort of metaphor for the internet creating a society that values isolation more and more. The second interpretation I got from them is the deluge myth with Noah being this whale like fetus combination flowing in magatsuhi born in a world made of pyramids (Think the Nile River). In the way magatsuhi is handled by each faction is a metaphor of their goals. Yosuga makes magatsuhi flow violently in their areas and use magatsuhi as a bomb. Nihilo's base conducts and directs the magatsuhi in circular motions directing them into various parts of the base. The pseudo-fiend forms of each character bely their paradoxical drives. Chiaki wants a world of strength/Beauty but her demon form is of a tree branch arm symbolic of something that starts as a seedling before growing into something powerful/beautiful. As for her Baal Avatar form it is similar to a statue which is something requiring someone else to chisel and make beautiful. Isamu's pseudo-fiend is various faces engraved on his body like wounds showing that his want for isolation is a petty reaction to being shunned by everyone around him. His fusion with Noah is of a fetus like form, something incapable of living without someone else incubating them. The harder one to pin down is Hikawa as he basically doesn't gain a pseudo-fiend form though his metaphor for fire is very emblematic of his actions as one individual acting as the main driving force for change. Ahriman is said to be a destructive and evil spirit, something antithetical to Hikawa's clearly Buddhist themed leanings. Kazuma Kaneko knows his symbolism and incorporates and sectionalizes it into everything. The game basically uses symbolism to create a metanarrative for each character bearing a Reason. Their depth comes from their environment more than their archetypical personalities. A lot of people look at Nocturne as the weakest story in the series but if you know your mythology and symbolism you have a treasure trove.

[@giorgioguolo7196]

Great analysis man Hope this comment gets pinned

[@Gaarkukan21]

@@giorgioguolo7196 Thanks! I've come back to the game every so often so I always try to see if I can learn something new through what I've studied about in world mythology.

[@demityrant1784]

Theory as to why the Goetia support Hikawa's very Bhuddist philosophy?

[@Gaarkukan21]

​@@demityrant1784 Hikawa believes in a system where people will favor it over their own individual drives. The 72 demons themselves are a race who follow a specific hierarchy and system of agreement. They value power, but will always respect the system more. Same with Baphomet in esoteric thought as he himself pursues a wholistic system of "balance" rather than pure anarchy as believed by Abrahamic religions. Hikawa, despite being in the Gaian cult (a much more Tantric group) he follows a sort of radical form of achieving a complete pure land (Mahayana Buddhism). When you talk to him in the generator room in Nihilo the room itself is symbolic of pure land. I'd look up Womb Realms and Diamond realms which are similar in ways but different from Pure lands and Mahayana schools of thought. Looking at those you can see a familar pattern of various connecting circles. Looking at Nihilo design Various peacefully glowing circles within circles rotating at the same pace as the gear in the middle guiding spirits. Hikawa's goal is very orderly but his methods are very radical and accept upheaval so it makes sense that he'd work for Gaians for a time despite his beliefs contradicting them. This could explain exactly why the Demons from Ars Goetia follow him too. He wants order but he also has power worth respecting. Other things to note is that Hikawa carries these prayer beads with him called Mala, which are pulled on to create a sound meant to represent impermanence and spontaneity. They're used for meditation. Whenever he pulls them he's trying to both make a point to the player and to himself about the nature of samsara with it's pointless emotions. It's a very cold interpretation, but yet again take mind he's in a cult which often resort to new age and flawed interpretations of other beliefs. It's another important facet of SMT games that helps to explain when certain figures don't act as they usually would in the actual faiths because they're an intentionally different expression of them through the lens of Cultists. Edit: I keep thinking of things that connect that my hands can't keep up with the typing. I mostly just added in more about Buddhism and noted the differences between various schools of thought.

[@ready1fire1aim1]

A big problem Religion has is that everyone thinks the Bible is about El (Deus) when it's actually about Elohim (Deities). Keep in mind the Hebrews syncretized three main titles of God to all just mean God. Those titles are El, Elah and Elohim. To get some context on the meaning of El, Elah and Elohim we can use the Latin counterparts of Deus "God", Dea "Goddess" and Dei which has two uses one plural "gods" and one possessive "God's" based on context. Genesis 1 Elohim (Deity) is possessive context. (God's Son) Genesis 2 Yahweh Elohim (deities) is plural context. (adopted idiot) Try the NOG translation on Bible Gateway. Doesn't remove God's titles. Does remove a metric 💩-ton of contradictions. If you don't understand the Old Testament "knowing Good from Evil" then you won't understand the New Testament or Quran. Religious Dogmatics call the entire Bible "Good" and that generates sooo many biblical contradictions. Mark, Matthew and Luke are the NT versions of Yahwist, Priestly and Deuteronomist. It's no wonder everyone is drawn to John (Elohist). Also, nobody sees the book of Acts as demonic Yahwism? Seriously?

[@WobblesandBean]

SMT3 is my favorite video game of all time. I'm so happy to see you cover it!

[@maxderrat]

It's so freaking good, dude.

[@benfrancois7856]

​@@maxderratI've was hoping you would do a video on this thank you

[@BlackRoseCloud]

@@maxderrat I am so glad to see you cover this game, It is also my favorite. Been waiting forever for you to get to the Mainline SMT games. I think there will be Some interesting stuff in SMTIV as well. though a bit hard to play by modern standards 1 and 2 are great too in their own right.

[@naokibeats420]

It s simply the best game ever

[@johnfrancois8570]

​@@maxderratI would like to see you make a video on ex machina the movie. I've seen your videos on Deus ex and I love them and Deus ex machina means God from the machine in Latin

[@1Synner]

I came to this game for Dante. I stayed for a very complex parable told simply and entertainingly. My demi-fiend was the one that rejected the harsh, selfish reasons of those that wanted silence, solitude, and power, and embraced the possibility of a better future for mankind rather than fear. In turn, the world was brought back to what it was before the riot, and people were able to live the lives they once had taken away from them. Meanwhile, I live a normal life with the memories of the Vortex world and refuse to forget about the friends and allies I had made along the way. I personally think that was the best ending for the player. Nothing against the True-Demon ending, where you get to punch God out of multiple realities and amass an army to march up to heaven to break the status quo, but, hear me out... If I intend to defy the warped, selfish reasons of corrupted friends and defy the authoritarian hand that is trying desperately to have a reason that could yield a more efficient world, why would I EVER join up with a power that practically acts as all four paths at once? For me, rejecting Lucifer as well as God is the best way to attain the true sense of self, because you're following in your own beliefs, rather than the whims of authority or temptations of anarchy. At least, when you force God to turn back time and restore the world without Lucifer's help, you are free to live and grow as you see fit, without the influence of others to dictate your path.

[@Sailing10cjm]

This game completely changed the way I saw video games forever. I played it in high school and was casually going through fighting monsters, determined to beat the big bad guy Hikawa - I was very naïve at the time. But then relatively early in the story when he asked "Don't you agree, that the world should be ruled by serenity?" I was completely frozen. I had to put down the controller for a few hours to think about it. I struggled to disagree - with the apparent main antagonist of this story. It hit me then that the "story" in Nocturne is entirely unlike that of 99% of RPGs. This game tested my childish sense of morality and my view of humanity as a whole. It asked big questions that required deep thought to answer, and it had counter arguments prepared for every answer. This game showed me that video games can do far more than tell a story or provide casual entertainment. The gameplay and level design is very dated by today's standards but the creative vision of this game is hardly matched, even to this day. Thank you for doing some research and explaining some of the finer nuances of the game's inspiration. I learned some new things from this video.

[@jhonsmithy2873]

the ending where the devil kills god is the starting point of the plot of smt 5, a game where you can have the ultimate liberation true ending by getting rid of anything divine or demonic

[@panaghuyngadimadunggan]

The 'God' which smtv's Lucifer killed at the start isn't the one the Lucifer in Nocturne was after. I'm pretty sure both Lucifers aren't the same being. Furthermore, some time in the game, Sophia states the Nahobino is still being blessed by the Great Will through miracles. Meaning the true figure that influences everything in the Amala multiverse (and by extension the universe of smtv) hasn't been defeated in the end. Destroying the throne was a hollow patchwork at best, something it should be because it was meant to mirror Nocturne's freedom ending: an uneasy time of false peace. It was far from 'ultimate' liberation you sell it to be.

[@ltb1345]

@@panaghuyngadimadunggan He was talking about the True Neutral ending, where you use the throne to erase all demons and gods from existence.

[@raulrojas9253]

@@panaghuyngadimadunggan Dude the fiends and Demi fiend are in the game, of course they are the same.

[@NikkiTrip]

@@panaghuyngadimadunggan It is the same Lucifer.

[@panaghuyngadimadunggan]

​ @ltb1345 Erase all demons and gods from existence in *smt5's* universe, that doesn't affect the rest. It's already established in smt3 that the entire Amala is composed of multiple universes, even multiverses of their own, that doesn't affect each other. Heck, you kill and fuse iterations of him in previous games. ​ @raulrojas9253 ​ It's a checkbox DLC, I don't count that any better than I count the p3r protagonist using personas that doesn't exist yet in that point in time. That being said. @NikkiTrip, you're right. It's the same Lucifer. Lucy has a haunt convo that mentions being the one responsible for 'great demon of prophecy'. This makes Lucifer in SMT3/5 a damn let-down. Dude's preaching about the Amala and the cycle of death and rebirth, that whole TDE scene in 3 seemingly hypes him up to go against the Great Will itself, but nope, all he can do is kill one main 'god' in a single speck of the entire expanse.

[@Dahras1]

This is a great video and I really enjoyed your analysis! One thing I would push back on, though, is the point about characterization. While characterization certainly isn't the main focus of SMTIII, I do think they do a lot of great work with the small amount of space they have. You pointed out Chiaki as an example of weak characterization, but I think she's an example of the subtle characterization the game does so well. When you mean Chiaki, she's dressed in nice, fashionable clothes, and she reveals that the reason she wants to meet Yuko is to ingratiate herself with someone who could write her a recommendation letter for college. When you first meet Chiaki after the apocalypse, she says that she's glad that she and you survived, and declares that she will be the one to find Izamu and Yuko. All of her behavior signals that she's a go-getter, the kind of person who wants to get ahead in the world and believes that if she sets her mind to it, she *will* get ahead. This conception of herself comes together when she announces her reason to you after the fall of the Mantra: Chiaki realizes that the new world operates on different principles, but she believes that she is smart and strong enough to get what she wants. And what she wants is a world that rewards people like her, people who strive to better themselves and be more powerful. At this point, Chiaki still believes in herself. She wants to create a world for the strong *because she believes that she is one of them* . But over the course of the rest of the game, Chiaki has this belief beaten out of her. When you reach her in the reformed Tower of Matra, you see briefly, before she shows her demonic form, that she has lost her arm, taken from her by the rogue Maniken Sakahagi. She has realized that she alone cannot create the world that rewards the strong because *she is not one of them* . But rather than abandoning her beliefs, she persists in them. Her fusion with Gozu-Tennoh is, ironically, a refutation of her own philosophy - two weak existences teaming up to be something stronger than they could be alone. But she cannot see this irony because she is so consumed by her own need to succeed and be strong. Personally, I really like how subtle SMTIII is with its characterization. It shows a deep trust of their audience to pick up on the subtle clues they drop in the margins of a game decidedly more about ideas than people.

[@benderman1157]

YES my thoughts exactly that and while the interactions between those other characters is sparse it gives you time to carefully think them through instead of being constantly overwhelmed by them.

[@leonardocarvalho7306]

It's pretty awesome how that perspective tracks to the other characters as well. Isamu has a hero complex at the start of the game, trying to demonstrate bravery when searching for Yuko. After the Conception, he's still trying to search for her but fails spetacularly and has to be rescued, twice. His frustration with his inability to perform the image he had of his ideal self led to a reason that dictates that everyone will be able to be their own protagonists in their own worlds. His irony is that to reach his goal, he relies on collaboration, drawing power from the demons in the Amala Network and even relying on the Demifiend to defeat the demons blocking the flow of magatsuhi he needed to access in order to summon Noah. Hikawa is the one vouching for a harmonic world where everyone's individuality and ambition are subdued, where satisfaction of desire cannot trump over the collective. He's also the biggest schemer in the game, directly responsible for setting the Conception off and already having a head start in collecting the magatsuhi he needed, and had no reservations about involving unsuspecting people in his plans who suffered dire consequences, as long as he got his way

[@JackRaynerV]

Reading Paradise Lost and then playing this game in my teens was quite the trip...

[@michs7451]

I’m so happy that you finally covered SMT: Nocturne! There’s actually a very in-depth development history video on Nocturne that states how the developers noticed the feeling of “stuckness” that the denizens of Tokyo were feeling around the turn of the millennium, and they wanted this game to express that in some way or another. What if they were no longer stuck? What kind of a world would they form, with the swirling energies therein? On another note, the True Demon Ending is a later imposition on the original text, and it is arguably one that aligns Nocturne the closest to the traditional Law/Neutral/Chaos formula. Original Nocturne that didn’t have the True Demon Ending was a bit more ambivalent, and I feel a little sad that we now have a “canon” ending that would in some sense strip players of the immense task of thinking for themselves. In any case, you definitely hit the nail on the head in terms of Nocturne’s similarity to a religious parable. It’s a little bit like Nietzsche’s “Thus Spoke Zarathustra” in that sense, where the goal isn’t so much character development, but the underlying ideological message.

[@charlestonobryant807]

I think I've always loved True Demon cause of the extreme it takes that matched the viewpoints on the systems of the world people like me (Gen-Z) were born in. Why try to fix a system that is fundamentally flawed and out of your control when you can tear the entire system down? It's pure spite and rebellion, and i think it matches the anger of youth as generations pass. It's kinda of why Killmonger was liked as a villain in Black Panther. That anger at the world and the way it works is what a lot of people feel, even if they don't act on it.

[@michs7451]

@@charlestonobryant807 Yes, that's a plausible way of looking at it. I don't really like True Demon because it is pure nihilism, the will to tear down and destroy instantiated. I also don't really appreciate how it's regarded as the 'canon' ending for Nocturne (I don't think there's such a thing). My favorite is the Freedom ending, and I'd argue that that would be the ending that is most thematically consistent with the entire message of the game. The beauty of Nocturne is that it is a slippery game. It resists easy answers, and all of the Reasons and endings are plausible and legitimate.

[@UltimaLuminaire]

@@michs7451 The beauty of the TDE is that it convinced fans at the time that it has all the answers, but the one giving them is an unreliable narrator. Also, I don't know where you heard it, but TDE and the ending of Nocturne itself, has never had a dev comment on the canonical ending. We get versions of TDE since the SMT4A Diamond Realm DLC, if that's what you mean, but I think you are more than justified in hating any retcon from SMT4A lmao

[@ltb1345]

@@michs7451 I completely agree.

[@jasonblundelldobebussing]

Yes sir! Finally he got his hands on Nocturne. This game does *NOT* disappoint. Remember how Max was shocked by the profound moments from some niche games? Well, given he covered Nocturne, he's got even _more_ to see in SMT. Couldn't be more happy for the guy. Goida! 🎉

[@maxderrat]

SMT is like crack for me, man. I can't wait to play more games from this series. Which do you think I should tackle next? I've heard Strange Journey should be the next one.

[@InquisitorSinCross]

​@@maxderratStrange Journey is great, but man is it hard... I'd recomend SMT 4

[@giovanniprovost]

Suffer through Strange Journey, it's the best one in my opinion (even Redux)@@maxderrat

[@jojonta2119]

@@maxderrat Strange Journey is a good idea for the next game

[@pokestar9994]

@@maxderratStrange Journey, IV, or Devil Survivor would be good picks.

[@djinn6720]

Smt is without a doubt one of the most profound series of all time.

[@Frognosys]

What I'm seeing lately; religious and spiritual symbolism, mythological allegory, allusions to Gnosticism, esotericism, subconscious vs collective unconscious, etc. - it feels like all of this is culminating into something really important, that's right on the tip of my tongue/brain but can't find the terms to verbalize any of it. I'm looking forward to your next videos, maybe it'll set my mind on a more clear track.

[@kode-man23]

It's nice seeing something that was obsessed with as a teenager actually was "deep" and "good" haha.

[@HollowRick]

Same I picked the game up on a whim because I thought the cover looked cool lol

[@danieldorvil7683]

Honestly now I’ve gotta play it. The religious and cultural undertones are often placed on the back burner in games but this has them pleasantly pronounced.

[@DeepMoon45]

My absolute favourite series of all time, SMT IV being my personal favourite of the series. I adore everything about this series and I'm so glad to see you cover it!!! Nocturne is phenomenal also, I love it's world design and atmosphere so much!

[@loope9421]

Smt4 is soo good! I love everything about it, I don’t know how they managed to make such a badass soundtrack for the 3DS.

[@Uberwenis]

I cannot understate how happy I am to see videos about the SMT games. I'm definitely hoping you do one on SMT4 and 4A, there's a lot of good stuff in those (but virtually every game in the series is good anyway)

[@WayToDawn72]

I think you hit the nail one head for a lot of points. Ive played through Nocturne a while ago and for some reason i couldn't understand why i found it appealing despite the characters seeming rather static lacking significant development save moments where their Reason develops. I've yet to get TDE, or finish the game, life happens, but watching this has lit a fire to try and do both

[@HecmarJayam]

Can somebody explain to me how come Japanese entertainment seems to be able to grasp and use Mythology, Religion, Psychology and even esoteric principles like this? From anime to videogames, its quite impressive the depth and reach of these creators. I'm constantly blown away by the concepts and ideas they are able to play with with such mastery.

[@ponpo185]

Im not educated in this, but I believe it’s cause japan is not as secular as the west. Shintoism and its temples and shrines is deeply rooted in their culture.

[@Raxe-ev5zi]

Cause spirituality ( especially true spirituality) principles and ways of life arent so limited and so outwordish in Japan or generally in the east as they are in the west.. Its simple thing of culture and perception of life itslef...

[@DarkAdonisVyers]

It's because, unlike the west, they are not chained down by those things, so unlike American Christians and Indian Hindus, the Japanese are squeamish about using those characters to tell a story.

[@drewajv]

At one point the Japanese government made deliberate efforts for Shintoism (the animistic spiritual tradition indigenous to Japan) and Buddhism (malleable teacher-to-student spiritual transmission - some call it Hinduism packaged for export) to coexist. There’s a saying there: “born a Shinto, die a Buddhist”. While they do share some features, the differences cover enough of a spread that concepts from elsewhere are intelligible. For instance, even though the Japanese expression of Buddhadharma is Zen - a very dry, simple method of awakening that relies more on stories of how old teachers taught rather than larger-than-life myths - the average Japanese person would still be able to grok Tibetan Buddhism, which uses bells, smells, and bodhisattva veneration because those practices exist in Shintoism. Also, Buddhist practice being mind training, Buddhist psychology is actually more advanced than that of the West IMO

[@HecmarJayam]

@@drewajv Thank you. This is interesting, I've suspected in was related to their education system - but still leaves the question open to the depth and reach of their knowledge of the western mysticism and religion. From Alchemy to Mythology to Religion. Personally, I've learn more and understood more about these subjects trough Japanese media than by direct exposure - and I do live in the west.

[@aiodensghost8645]

Welcome to the SMT fold, we are happy you decided to join us in the Cathedral of Shadows! This series is genuinely one of the best, and if it wasnt prohibitively expensive to get into at points Id tell all my friends to buy every entry in the series

[@unoutdated]

Hell yeah! More Shin Megami Tensei videos. I REALLY love your analysis of them, as you always bring something new to the table. Thank you for the awesome video!❤

[@Locaneo]

What I appreciate so much about the True Demon ending is the philosophical/psychological undertaking needed to go that route and want to. If you're a fan of SMT that played the previous games you may realize Kagutsuchi is just the reanimated corpse of the series main villain so it may feel proper to kill him. but if you haven't, the core concept of taking all these desired worlds into yourself and not only choosing to be free of them, but to deny them entirely and forge as close to a new world, but aiming for even more freedom from universal laws is astounding. It's almost an apotheosis, inverted by the perspective of others. You know you sacrificed others dreams to get here, but deep inside you also know or at least may feel "it doesn't matter, these dreams and this world are controlled and true freedom for myself and/or others can only come with the release of the grip of the controller." (and in reality the ceremony of the Conception is being used to further the main villain's plans, but that shouldn't push a player as much as the philosophical journey).

[@ThatGuy-Jai]

Masterpiece video for a masterpiece of a game! Thankyou

[@maxderrat]

Hey, thanks brother.

[@ThatGuy-Jai]

​@@maxderrat & hey nice ending choice I think it's pretty dope since the way I look at it is: you obtain the most power possible and Become a demon strong enough to ensure everyone gets a fair chance at a decent life instead of being forced to choose such strong ideals that might go against your own and cut people out of a fair chance at life at the same time.

[@forte4450]

long time huge fan of megaton and I dont generally watch analysis videos of the series anymore bc I find them often very reductive. that being said I think you offered some genuinely fantastic analysis here and the fact that you offered it while being relatively new to the series makes me convinced you're good at this. Great video man

[@jaderabbit898]

It's only a matter of time before Max covers a mainline entry and honestly, I'm glad I waited for it.

[@OmegaNovious]

Xenosaga (Episode 1-3) for PS2 is a good trilogy to cover if you are interested in subtle religion. In this case, it covers a sort of futuristic space-age metaphoric neo-Christianity.

[@liamwithaspace]

Super happy to see one of my favorite youtubers getting into my favorite series! This was a really interesting way to view one of my favorite games of all time that I hadn't considered before. I think you'd really like the original SMT duology, especially II and it's use of Judeo-Christian mythology, though they can be a bit hard to get into due to some more archaic gameplay designs.

[@Lohmatiyshmel]

Besides TDE, I actually love the "bad" ending when you kill kagutsuchi without any reason active. Yes, you destroyed everything but you've done it on your own means. No one wants you to do that except yourself

[@backupschmliff1156]

Nocturne was my childhood game. The older I got the more I appreciated it.

[@e.sanchez5214]

man I played this game when released always knew it had very depth meaning behind thank you for the video

[@JeveMCD]

Happy to see it covered. Finished it over Christmas and the experience and ideas have stuck with me ever since

[@MrWarmchocolate]

I just got into this game a week ago and I'm so hooked!! This vid couldnt have come at a better time. More people need to know about this game

[@DeadYorick]

The True Demon Ending is more unique because it's the only ending that rejects the cycle of creation. All of the endings fit into Kagutsuchi's plan of conception to continuously remake the world to avoid its energy from running out. Except TDE. TDE is the only ending where the Demi-Fiend rejects even participating in Kagutsuchi's plan and destroys it.

[@leonardocarvalho7306]

Demon ending is kind of a rejection, but at the end it doesn't really change anything and you're just stuck waiting for the next cycle

[@DeadYorick]

@@leonardocarvalho7306 I think in a purely gameplay sense maybe since there's NG+ but still

[@jamonsommer6510]

Hey Max! I always love seeing that Jungian analysis applied to comparative religion! I had also heard that the process of “conception” in SMT: 3 was based on the Buddhist notion of time, which is rooted in the cycle of Samsara. I’m currently taking a class on Japanese philosophy, but right now we’re talking about different interpretations of Buddhism. The idea of enlightenment being akin to spiritual annihilation in Theravada Buddhism may sound like a form of nihilism, but the way I’ve heard it described is that “nothingness” actually denotes a lack of separation into “things”. So, what we view as “ego” could be seen as a dissociated aspect of “God”. While that may contradict the story here, I think the fact that Kagutsuchi is actively perpetuating separation by choosing one reason on which to base reality, is telling. I think Lucifer and “God” then, could potentially be seen as aspects of the Demi-fiend. I’ve been thinking about how the distinction between “self”, and “non-self” is largely semantic in this way. Because it seems to me that when a Buddhist describes selflessness, it’s a process of breaking out of limiting definitions. But I actually think that that’s what Jung’s individuation process entails as well. Probably because the same mindfulness practice that allows a Buddhist to adapt is the interval in which the unconscious is made conscious. So, it’s only in “selflessness” that the Jungian self can be realized. Maybe a simple way to say that would be that ego death is really ego integration.🤔😁

[@PaladinLarec]

I wrote my college final exam for my philosophy class on Digital Devil Saga. I remember getting an A on it. Probably still have the MS Word file somewhere. I still believe this series is the most important game series in the entire hobby and proof that gaming can be something so much more.

[@Jehnubis]

So happy to see you covering more Shin Megami Tensei, excited for more to come!

[@bearberserker]

A great Reason and not only that it's featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series! 😈☯️

[@necro819]

Great video, I hope to see you break down SMT 5 some day in the future.

[@arcaneScribbler]

This is amazing. Very insightful dive into the philosophy of this game!

[@OldManShane]

I am sacrificing seconds to the algorithm. Love your work, Max.

[@FractureOS]

I think you would really like Signalis, it is packed with meaning. You would definitely get something out of it even if you don't make a video about it

[@ahmedfalahy9337]

All SMT games have their multiple endings to encourage the player to see different "what-if" scenarios that happen in the universe different cycles As stated by the old woman in the Amala Network, all universes have cycles and therefore all endings are canon.

[@ShadyMorais]

Old angryjoe in a max derrat essay! Amazing video as always, very insightful

[@JG-kn7ew]

Since your alchemy video, ive really enjoyed the spiritual turn on your channel

[@Kyojinsei]

Maxx, brotherly love man, you always give me chunks of my research im missing, alchemy now this. you are wise and thank you for being so thourough.

[@razorthecurse]

Glad to see you're checking out the rest of SMT. Can't wait to see you check out the first MT game, or maybe it's SNES remake for a fun time, then seeing its influence all over SMT I, II and III, then playing I and II and seeing their references and influences in SMT III, IV, and so on~

[@samarthkapil6579]

Persona introduced me to turn based games. I played this after persona 4 and 5 and i loved it. The concept is not only very creative but also very thought provoking which i really like, the game really becomes a form of art when you finish it.

[@Spamkromite]

Greetings from Spain. I'm glad you found out about this game. It really is a masterpiece and I'm happy that the PC port has released this wonderful story to more people that will surely become fans of the franchise. All SMT are like this, odes to life, death, virtues, vices, beliefs, despair, love, hatred, nihilism, hope... But the hope paths are always the hardest routes in these games, to mirror reality as it should with its exquisite metaphors, subtle poetry and sometimes overboard honesty, specially from the mouth of all the "demons" you need to ally with to survive 👀 My first contact with the franchise was playing Strange Journey on the DS, and got enraptured by its depth. Then got to play the first 2 games (which work together) and Nocturne was a cherry on top. Then Digital Devil Saga, though another spin off like Persona, also was heavy loaded with tons of philosophical and cultural anvils. You never get disappointed with games about Shin Megami Tensei, as Persona and other derivates proved to those who didn't know from where this style of story-telling came from first.

[@DeadbeatShadows]

SMT 3 & 4 are two of my favorite games, SMT has been important to me for almost 15 years now. Glad you're loving the series!

[@MitsurugiR]

SMT 3 is a masterpiece.

[@zazikikomo7796]

Hello Max, I doubt if you remember me but back when Elden Ring first came out and you released your video on Ranni, I was someone in the comments who offered alternate theories about the relationship of Ranni and Renna, and I remember we had a very good exchange about it. I've been following your work for a while (some of your videos I have to avoid for now due to spoilers) and one point you bring up occasionally is that you believe video games are an effective story-telling medium and you've indicated a dream of seeing video game story-telling taught in class rooms. It got me wondering: if you were teaching a class, what games would you include in your curriculum? How would you go about sharing them with your students? Would love to see a response here but it might also be a fun video idea.

[@meimei8718]

Can I just say, thank you? I feel so grateful for your words. I appreciate how much information you give and how many questions you ask. Thank you for inviting your audience and therefore me to examine and think. Thank you.

[@otakubacklog]

Oh bless 🙏🏻 this game is so fascinating to look into when it comes to philosophy. That and also it’s fun af to play. Love your vids!

[@ciscornBIG]

This is what I'm talking about, Max. So looking forward to hearing this.

[@StonedHunter]

Oh man I hope you keep doing Persona and Shin Megami content. I've been slowly getting more into the series since I first played P5 and find the mixture of beliefs, philosophies, and various phases of our understanding of psychology to be fascinating. These are the games to play if you're looking to learn about yourself.

[@NarendraU23]

Love your videos! I'm puzzled as to why I'm not already subscribed to you, but I fixed it now. It'd be amazing to hear your analysis on SMT V. I've not played it myself, but I heard mixed reception from people. Lots of people praised its combat and music, but few comments on the story or symbolism. Maybe because it's similar to SMT III, so people don't look into it further. Hope to see you analyze it eventually!

[@slayeroffurries1115]

Oooooohhh yeah! Good to know more people are getting deeper into the SMT series

[@baddragonite]

Glad to see you checking out this series, always thought it would be a good fit for you and your atyle of videos

[@grayson8633]

in megaten games, I normally go for the ending that eradicates both angels and demons, or a free restart. Who`s to say humanity will loop again or not? I wouldn't know. But I do know that I depise the idea of humans being pawns for any reason. No one reason is correct, and no one person should make that big of a choice.

[@Doofloop23]

Sick vid! Really enjoy the theological approach to looking at this game. The difficulty typically dominates the discussion so I’m happy to see such analysis!

[@wraith.ferron]

Seeing as you are playing more RPGs as time goes on, I was wondering if you had played, or planned to play The World Ends With You or Neo: The World Ends With You? They're odd, but endearing RPGs that play with self-isolation vs interconnectedness from both philosophical and sociological perspectives. The target demographic was definitely more towards teens, but it's rare to see a game that approaches this topic outside of "we must unite to fight the big bad".

[@garvielloken8494]

There is so much symbolism in Nocturne, it may be not as plot oriented as other games in Megami Tensei franchise, but it's depth is sure is underrated, thank you for uncovering some of it! I hope one day you'll check out SMTI and II too, they are heavily outdated gameplay-wise, but it's story (SMTII is almost a direct sequel to I, which is very rare in series) is so wild it pays off!

[@darkdwarf007]

love you honey💖💖

[@dutchielander2478]

One of the best games i have ever played. Never have i played a videogame that gave me so much feeling of dread and anxiety all the way through. Absolute chefs kiss.

[@Davlavi]

Informative as always.

[@Diabhlai680]

Phenomenal work Whens the jack bros video?

[@OtakuSparrow]

I was playing this blindly and got the neutral ending, simply due to virtue of not wanting what the others were selling and wanted back what I lost. So on that note, I see many layers on how one can interpret an ending if you add personal feelings to the reasoning itself. Ultimately, this ending made me technically selfish since I did it all for self gain as opposed to somebody getting the ending to simply "fix" things.

[@ke9922]

Insightful as always! Keep up the good work!

[@shomzlezilebovic]

Your content kicks ass! A lot of the themes you cover intersect with my own interests. Keep up the good work!

[@giovanniprovost]

Was waiting for this one, thank you Max.

[@ShadowRohanX]

I would really love to see how you experience SMT Strange Journey. It a really solid story with great moments and a great dungeon crawler

[@Vitor20XX]

SMT is epic, i was fascinated the first time i got to known the series. The mix of religion, myths, post/apocaliptic world, various endings and philosophy/ideology to choose, it feels so real at the same time it's just fiction. The narratives, social and religious critics made me think a lot too.

[@NotCatchy]

What a good game, a lot of these concepts flew over my head when I first played it as a teen

[@federicobocchi]

Please continue this Megaten series! It's my favourite!

[@AntiAnnihilator5000]

The lyrics of "Freewill" by Rush spring to mind.

[@maxderrat]

One of my favorite songs by them. :)

[@restlessascension3260]

Nothing well ever compare to defeating this game on the hardest mode and path leading to your ultimate battle with lucifer. That 1hr long battle is beyond intense. Without the help of dante ,shiva, metatron . I would have never overcome that moment . 99hrs character levels lvl 99. Truly a glorious moment of nostalgia

[@verityverri6506]

Great as always. Also, as I said before, Nebula can be interesting. It is a payed streaming platform created and awned by creators, and unlike what some not very smart people said, it wouldn't prevent you from posting your videos on KZbin. Basically all Nebula creators publish their videos on both services, just earlier on Nebula (like, 2 days earlier) and on there, thsy do it without adds, sensorship and cuts on copyrighted/sensitive content.

[@XkaiX]

Your videos really speak directly to my soul! Thank you!

[@papperogue]

I'm so happy you finally covered SMT: Nocturne! One of my top 3 favorite games of all time.

[@holopawdruid6816]

Awesome video! I'm so glad you're going through the SMT and Persona games. I greatly appreciate your perspective of the game's themes that borrow from mythology and religion. Are you planning on playing SMT4? It's my favorite one, and I would love to hear your insights on its story (and its characters, since there's a bit more focus on them compared to Nocturne).

[@k.g.7591]

I feel like a reality where everyone would have a world unto themselves is anathema to the way humans function. A world of solitude would be a world devoid of external input. In the face of that, a consciousness on the level of a human would probably do nothing but try and subdivide so as not to be lonely and bored. It’s the theory of some that this is what god did.

[@rvidxrray3961]

I love your videos max! Thank you for uploading whenever you can! keep up the amazing work! I always look forward to your videos. 🥳🥳 So happy you’ve been digging into SMT

[@KingKaidoWororo]

LETS GOO NOCTURNE!!! My favorite rpg of all time !

[@animefurry3508]

Oow you convinced me, I desperately want to play this game now, multiple religions and ideologies all packed into one game yaaaay!

[@Brenntron]

Love your analysis of SMT 3, it's one of my favorite games. Lookin forward to the next video, stay yellow folks.

[@chickenmonger123]

3:50 Now I’m not one for many of the myriad living theologies of our day. Not because they aren’t relevant. Not because I do not value the topic. Rather, it is because I do not often find interesting or new things that can be casually found about them. That is why I appreciate your narrative distinction here. Parable as a different type of story. I think technically it is a type of narrative though. That is a distinction that I appreciate. I think it’s a fundamental language you have to understand about many belief systems old and new. That level of granularity and distinction is able to be applied to everything you experience, and I was taught that sort of study as a child. In order to understand a particular religious text. Sure. But one who it was my responsibility to understand for myself. Every truth in it being my responsibility to be concluded on in my own judgement. Pretty wild for a Christian Sect. As standard for every member anyway. Not just the clergy. And not half assed, or less than clergy either. Anyway I appreciate you getting into linguistic territory. Figures of speech are some of the most essential ways to get contextual information into and out of text. What I’m say is; “Go off!”

[@EleusiusBlack]

Excellent content as always. Look forward to seeing more! Hoping that you'll cover Strange Journey next- I'm really curious to see your thoughts on Commander Gore.

[@mehsium6200]

"WAR BROKE OUT IN HEAVEN!"

[@Raxe-ev5zi]

Even if so many are late to the SMT party i am so glad there are people joining in...

[@Lesandira]

The conflict between god and Lucifer is part of many SMT games and I think it often comes down to the choice of order / law and freedom / chaos. I think the SMT games are really fascinating in that regard.

[@sakura_pompadour]

I'm glad you shared my own initial impressions on the game's story. I found it confusing how basic the plot was compared to the persona games and how flat the characters felt - everyone at a certain point just suddenly developed their own ideologies and bam, I'm killing my friends. And as I went through the game and discovered that the game's true nature is not a traditional narrative, but an ideological battle filled with interesting symbolism. that really struck a chord with me. I think that some reasons aren't that... well, reasonable, but I still believe that nocturne's perspective on storytelling is unique and works fairly well. it's a one of a kind experience.

[@alenight3063]

Loved the video and the way you explained it. Suscribed instantly

[@rojanshabani]

I love the series, wonderful video! 💛💛

[@ratglyph]

Reminds me of this quote: "Whenever we have spoken openly we have actually said nothing. But where we have written something in code and in pictures we have concealed the truth." -some alchemy nerd

[@TheDashingRogue]

SMT4 is much better at teaching the parable

[@TeQxktcg]

I loved this game, has been way to long since I've played it. Judging by your recent uploads it's been a while since you've had your mind unexpectedly blown away by a group of young anime girls, if you have the time you really should give the genre melting, mind bending Puella Magi Madoka Magica a try. There's a movie coming up after what feels like a decade so it might make KZbin sense as well but I genuinely just want you to enjoy the ride, it poses and answers some really interesting questions and it has a distinct visual identity that really set it apart back then; heck, it basically reinvented a genre in doing so.

[@SzaposJogdan2733]

WOOOOO DEMIFIEND

[@superhbman]

unfortunately, most people want an interesting story, so nocturne is often said to be boring. i've seen so many people ask "when does it get better" "smt has bad story" "smt is boring"

[@rangermode]

As the Fierce battle theme seems to say, "One more god rejected," or perhaps it is the Miltonic-sounding "War broke out in heaven."

[@masternorg]

Thanks for the video and analysis! I love this topic so here are my two cents: While I agree with your main points about the game, I'd like to push back a bit against your depiction of the True Demon Ending. One point that the game emphasizes is that demons are creatively sterile while humans are not. This is why the Demi Fiend can only enforce the reason of one of the human characters while he cannot create his own. Actually if you reject every Reason, don't finish the labyrinth and still finish the game, Katsugushi flat out refuses to fight you as you have no will to propagate. This puts another spin on the TDE: In my opinion, Demi Fiend doesn't really ascend, he just becomes the enforcer of Lucifer, who is out to destroy the established order. TDE is thus not really a "reason" nor an ideal outcome: OK, you defeat the Great Will, but then what? This idea gets explored further in SMTV where Lucifer reaches this goal and realizes that he's just as trapped in the cycle as other gods. Haven't finished vengeance though so dunno if this gets continued in that story..

[@cde3003]

Great video as always!

[@Mantosasto]

This is probably my favorite game. I can't explain why, but I find it so captivating.