Essential Ear Training - Feeling the Minor Scale

[@maxkonyi]

Due to popular demand, a fully-realized version of the circle visualizer seen in this video (now called Sonofield) will soon be available! Sign-up here to receive updates regarding the launch of Sonofield: m.schulz.audio/sonofield Sonofield is a real-time harmonic visualizer. It displays all the relevant information about the chords and melodies you play on your MIDI controller in a visually intuitive way. The version I'm using in this video is just a simple prototype...

[@avymikey]

Thank you so much!!

[@iMaxBlazer]

Thank you, man

[@TapedTogether]

Can’t wait!

[@gregoryespinosaortiz0410]

I'm learning a lot broo. And yes I would like more of it in differents mode or ways to visualized. Thank you very mucho.

[@NaomiKory]

cant join

[@misoduricaa]

The spotify long format for training is a great idea

[@cyberkills5728]

totally

[@JAYDUBYAH29]

Your teaching is so strong because of your immersion in the sound/feeling quality-which is beautiful. But I also wanna acknowledge how careful you are with your language to both not create/perpetuate confusion, but also to keep the immediacy of experiential space open. I hope a lot of people get to benefit and that this rewards you handsomely.

[@maxkonyi]

Much appreciated 🙏🙏🙏

[@cultivatelife]

Max is TOO MUCH handsome

[@maxkonyi]

@@cultivatelife lol

[@acebinko1]

Wow! Wow! Wow! I have listened to the Major video in the background many times over. Just earlier today, I drove an hour to drop some family memorabilia with a family member and her newborn, and drove an hour back. I had the Major video playing in the background while humming, and I feel I have come very far. I signed up for the waitlist when I got back and was wondering when you would explore the other degrees. I can't believe a few short hours later this video drops. Thank you! We really appreciate the work you put into your videos!

[@KipIngram]

You know, if you have a video about this then I apologize, but I've watched a lot of folks like you on KZbin and one thing I have never seen ANYONE present is how the notes arise from the physics of a single vibrating string. That goes a long way to explaining WHY the 5th and 4th are next to the tonic in the circle, and so on. You could then extend that by showing how the result of that process (the just intonation scale) doesn't transpose the way we can on modern instruments, and that leads you to the equal temperament scale. Then you'd carry on just as you already do. I just feel like this makes a person's intuitive grasp of the whole business more complete and satisfying. I think an important part of this derivation is in how it reveals that the equal temperament scale is actually IMPERFECT acoustically. It's a COMPROMISE that we decided was "close enough that it didn't matter." Some people claim they can hear the difference, and sometimes I can if I hear a just intonation note and an equal temperament note side by side. Certainly if they're played simultaneously I can hear them beat. But one after the other it's difficult to tell the difference, and without that immediately adjacent comparison ability I absolutely can't discriminate them. Equal temperament sounds fine to me, and I suspect it does to most people. And it gives us all those advantages of being able to transpose on our instruments and so on. Anyway, it just feels like an important part of the musical story to me.

[@maxkonyi]

Agreed! I may present that type of information in a future video as I also find it fascinating, profound, and important. For these, I'm trying to keep the focus on the experience and not get too deep into the technicalities. Interestingly, beyond the qualitative differences between various intervals in JI and ET, there are possibilities that exist via ET that do not in true JI. What we lose in sweetness and purity of tuning, we gain in compositional potential. The funny thing is, it's through leveraging the reality of JI that all variety of strange ET phenomena (extra-terrestrial?) are possible. I can highly recommend a book called Harmonic Experience, if you haven't already checked it out.

[@dewive6844]

For training, I think it’s interesting to play the same note on 2 or 3 different octaves at once, to make sure we get familiar with the feeling of the note and not the way they sound because of their pitch (high or low). When I play the same note on different octaves at the same time, I can really extract the feeling of the note, there is no doubt that it’s the same number even if it’s a mix of high and low pitches

[@JaraNietoDiego]

How clever a point you made!

[@cultivatelife]

Max is always doing it BIG for the music community! This one helped clear up some confusion with the feeling/familiarity aspect of the interval. I understand what you mean by harmonically similar now. The visual asesthetics with a black background was clean and easy to follow along. I'd like to see a sequel with harmonic intervals and you're approach to them for a possible future video.

[@maxkonyi]

Thanks! Good to know.

[@jakestewartmusic]

This format is great; I love to just put these on for meditative practice. Would love to see this series continue with more unusual scales, too - whole tone, diminished, augmented, etc. These are often more difficult to 'feel' musically

[@VortexSC2]

Just discovered your Major Scale video yesterday, now your Minor scale one just got recommanded to me. Too nice :) Thank you for your work !

[@daniel_cunha]

This channel is pure gold!

[@leandrogomes7738]

We are blessed!

[@Hennimore]

Just wanted to leave a comment of appreciation here. I have been trying to get into ear training, and your videos are by far the best learning material on the topic that I have found. This "feeling" approach makes so much sense and has made interval recognition finally click for me. Thanks a lot, and keep it up!

[@maxkonyi]

Thanks for letting me know!

[@ilyas1654]

Thank you for being one of the few good theory/ear training channels on youtube

[@massimozart]

Watching these types of videos over the past month has rewired my perspectives and approaches when it comes to ear training. Thank you so much, Max. I’m also really looking forward to Sonofield :))

[@maxkonyi]

Great to hear!

[@LiamRobot2014]

This is seriously amazing. The best explanation of ear training i've heard on KZbin, and the best execution. Love the drone in the background. Just subbed

[@sebgra3387]

Jacob Collier must have watched your videos to be such a genius as a musician. In fact the two of you are able to put tons of music theory in emotions and make it this way possible to understand.

[@maxkonyi]

lol well I'm glad you find it helpful!

[@TheHBaer]

This is amazingly helpful, Max!! Your approach to ear training is exactly what I have been looking for. Inspiring and such beautiful pacing. Thank you!!!!

[@EricWestphal]

These videos are so good! Thank you for doing this. It's exactly what I needed for ear training.

[@YaBoiiiiiiiii]

OMG! Ive been waiting for you to make more videos like this! Thank you!

[@JaraNietoDiego]

Extremely helpful stuff ❤ Please make more videos along these lines! I would pay for a practical series of "audio drills" that you could listen to over and over with emphasis on different degrees or even micro-melodies over different modes. 👌🏼🙏🏼

[@maxkonyi]

Good to know!

[@josephandrosky6377]

Yea, you keep us motivated and growing as musicians, thank you !!!

[@papamashas]

Я в это самое время, прямо сейчас смотрел первую часть) The Major scale Спасибо за знания!

[@kazaeza]

Can't wait for your app to release!

[@ksooshinka]

Вот-вот))) Уау!Уау!! Уау!!! - это первая реакция))) И было бы вообще здорово иметь такой сокращённый быстрый ролик под рукой для тренировки на каждый день. А особенно перед музыкальным диктантом по сольфеджио! После такой разминки оценка отлично будет гарантирована))) Ах, как жаль, что этого не было в моём детстве и я не могла увидеть это до того, как привязалась к белым клавишам!

[@colognialist1964]

so great that you're back musical wizard.

[@jameslifetimelearner]

I like this demo, really helpful to visualize the musical palette, my goal is to feel each interval with in a tonal center and around each individual note on guitar.

[@jsenger24]

Thank you for the video on minor scale! It may be selfish, but I would love to listen to a loop of you playing various tones against a drone, with the ability to peek at your visualization and "check" myself as I practice. I really appreciate the new approach to ear training here, thank you!

[@maxkonyi]

Stay tuned...

[@portley777]

Thanks for these tutorials Max. They are fantastic and very helpful.

[@maxkonyi]

Good to hear! My pleasure 🌞

[@Nirias103683]

Beautifully presented! The drone is very soothing. However, you can hear harmonics in the drone, and as the sound sort of "pulsates", you can slightly hear the major 3rd, and it rubs against the b3 pitch when you're playing it (like at 14:38) it's a very small detail but it's still noticeable. It doesn't affect the overall quality and impact of your video though, I'm glad I found your channel! Keep up the good work 😊

[@maxkonyi]

Agreed! I was considering this while editing the video yesterday. This drone I'm using is a new one I made fairly recently and is more closely emulating a tanpura, including the attendant harmonics (although they are reduced a fair amount with some processing). This does colour some of the relationships but also provides a more 'wholistic' or realistic bed to play on. In the future, I'll probably reduce the harmonics beyond the 4th to avoid these things. Good ears!

[@kyleolin3566]

I’m really enjoying this series. One thing that might help is to study how people do meditation, ASMR videos, or radio, so that when you talk it could lead to a more relaxed state. The drone and notes already kind of do that, as does the way you articulate your words. Just a thought. I’m probably an outlier, so take this with a grain of salt.

[@maxkonyi]

Noted!

[@ricos1497]

You're correct. I actually fell asleep twice listening to this!

[@nuborn.studio]

Please keep making those ear training videos, i would love to jump onto it like everyday but maybe once a week - Its great content, thank you for your efforts!

[@maxkonyi]

Thank you! Will do...

[@JAYDUBYAH29]

Been waiting dude! These are fantastic.

[@Kveat-woman]

Brilliant visualisation.

[@michaelrevell1501]

Love the ear training videos. This is amazing. Had my fingers crossed when I saw the major scale video that you’d do a follow up Would love to hear more about what you mentioned in the last video that scale degrees counter clockwise have distinct similarities in contrast to the ones clockwise. I somewhat can feel that, but I also don’t feel like I can pinpoint exactly what that is. I know the descriptions aren’t the feelings but sometimes those cues help me tap into what’s distinct about each one

[@maxkonyi]

Good to hear! Noted, thanks.

[@SamuelGfeller]

Oh I'm so looking forward watching this video! Thank you ❤

[@minenkleadresse]

To better ignore the pitch and focus on the feeling it is helpful to play the 5 and 2 (and all the rest)in different octaves over the drone to catch the feeling and not just the pitch.

[@serhandev]

Amazing video, thank you Max!

[@TVZMusic]

your videos keep getting tighter. keep it up bud!

[@maxkonyi]

Thanks TVZ!

[@ANordicPainer]

Another mode thanks getting back in the circle ❤

[@RahulDas-zy6ut]

Thank u so much for this.. I am sure everyone's having fun.. One thing I want to share about my listening journey. When it comes to actual songs. It becomes very hard for me to understand. Sometimes even major and minor chord feelings get all muddled up .😅😅😅😅

[@maxkonyi]

Yes! Real music provides a ton of complex relationships to navigate. That's why we start simple and gradually move into more complex situations

[@chris-chentrice2019]

This is amazing. I really enjoy beato but sometimes he’s a little too wise for my knowledge. I know theory, just not at that level. I watched the video on the major scale and I feel like it gave it what I need to be on my way to an intermediate guitarist.

[@maxkonyi]

Hooray! Happy to hear it

[@autistikicecream]

This is awesome!!! Thank you! ✨✨✨✨

[@Dylan.Gmusic]

Could you release some videos maybe around an hour long of just the first part? Its so relaxing and also fun to try to remember how the different intervals sound and i think is good ear training in itself. Love your chanel its so helpful.

[@maxkonyi]

Yeah I've been thinking of doing something like that...

[@henryaudubon]

This is a gem, Max. Thank you!

[@ErixSamson]

Super interesting!

[@fernandamolina729]

Love the spotify ear training idea!!!

[@michaelseidl1562]

extrem usefull, i love it

[@saarikivit]

These videos are amazing! There is enough time to get the feeling down for a note. In a video you told you put a drone in your ear and you walk and sing notes to it. I created a mobile app based on your philosophy of ear training :) There is a drone and it plays random notes over it, I then "guess" what the number of the note is, and after a delay there is a human voice that tells the correct answer. It also works the other way around: it can tell a number and after a while it plays the note for it. So I just put it in my pocket and go for a walk and listen. Step by step I'm learning. I notice that I'm picking it up quite fast :D Thanks Max!

[@maxkonyi]

That's great! I'm quite interested in making something similar to that. If you want to show me what you've got, feel free to message me using contact form on my website: www.maxkonyi.com

[@dunker20]

Hey @saarikivit is there a way to download the app you created? It sounds amazing and I’m super interested in trying it out.

[@KeithEndre]

Love this series

[@beachbarlouie]

Excellent job!

[@JAYDUBYAH29]

7 has sooo much expectation. To me b7 is the only one that is less dissonant than its natural note. b7 feels warm and just mildly complex. 5 open easy triumph. b6 is ominous/serious. b3 got some sass. 4 is easy forward motion, optimistic but new. #4 is purple magic. 6 is the beginning of a story. 2 is like I’m not sure what’s next but it’s nice here, ya know?

[@cultivatelife]

That's great. Music learning is so subjective, and can be such different experiences for each. It's always fun to see how others are learning and interpreting music. Many here align with my own sense of each interval and I know exactly what you're pointing to with your descriptipns

[@maxkonyi]

Regarding the b7 thing - I actually had a section in the video about this exact point but I ended up cutting it, so I'm glad you picked up on that anyway.

[@JAYDUBYAH29]

@@maxkonyinice. Thanks for the reply! I had never really thought about that before-but yea, all the other flats are so pointed or have such a dissonant rub, but not the b7, to me. I think what’s most striking about this approach is the drone. You are really immersed in the notes as they exist in direct relation to the tonal center-which makes it less about memorizing interval recognition, and more (as you say) about the feeling. It’s super meditative.

[@glabousky9676]

Great video (and great channel), thanks a lot for sharing ! At 15:25 I am really interested by this way of seeing tones, where did you get it (did not find anywhere) ?

[@maxkonyi]

Thanks! That image is based on a tonnetz or harmonic lattice. This particular version is just one I made myself. There are many different styles out there

[@glabousky9676]

@@maxkonyi ok nice, thanks for the information !!!

[@bakegla]

can you explore rhythm in relation to feeling states at some point? your work is hugely valuable!

[@maxkonyi]

Thanks! Will do

[@natalybonnet7013]

excelente!!

[@floydrose2384]

You should do more of these but maybe with more exotic scales like harmonic minor and its modes, or melodic minor and its modes it’s super helpful.

[@maxkonyi]

Will do...

[@brokeboi9996]

You should write a small book with the next course to go along and just call out the notes and you can charge 99 cents but I'm sure it would help your revenue but that's just my opinion still very helpful and appreciate your hard work!

[@fernandamolina729]

YOU'RE BAAAAAACK!!!!

[@edwarddannenberg5084]

First of all a big thank you for this video! I wonder a bit about the "Tone-net" at 15:25. Have you a video about it before? Did you made it? Looks very interesting. At 15:25 you say what b3 is not next too 2, do you mean regarding too "the net" or in the scale? "Shine on you crazy diamond" was for some reason in my head after the video (without the b6).

[@WACkZerden]

YES! thank You

[@classicbasslines]

Thanks for another great video Max. I’ve been going hard on the Functional ear training app, as well as singing along to the Indian drones. For the most part I am able to both recognize sounded intervals in the app, and produce by singing almost all of the intervals, but am very hung up on #4 and b6. I have the hardest time hearing those, and the hardest time singing them against a drone. Any recommendations for getting past tricky intervals?

[@maxkonyi]

All it means is you are not familiar enough yet. More exposure is needed. Spend time with an instrument playing and singing b6, b3, and b2 over a drone. Back and forth, comparing and contrasting. You don't have to do anything special, your ear will figure it out naturally. #4 is probably the most unique and strong sound, but since the ratio is so complex, it can be hard to produce it at will. I can't always produce it at the drop of a hat, but I can recognize it when I hear it instantly. Funny enough, the only degree I will confuse it with is b7...

[@classicbasslines]

@@maxkonyi thanks for the tips!!

[@alant779]

Nice, i just finished associating intervals to songs and can tell them apart consistently with basically mnemonics. This feels like the perfect next step of learning to recognize intervals directly without thought. The logical method always seemed too slow to be practical, and distracting even if it worked.

[@raptorboss6688]

Let’s freaking go

[@morganst.pierre]

Curious on your opinion when ear training or singing minor scales doing it as relative starting 6. I think it’s helping but as I mainly blues musician very important for me hear both together 3b and 3 on same tonic etc major minor intervals together

[@maxkonyi]

I suggest always calling the tonic 1. If the song is a minor key, call it 1, not 6. This will lead to a universal system for all scales wherein the tonic is always 1 and the other degrees are named in a consistent way. That being said, this whole business is very slippery and strange, so there will be times that a minor tonic suddenly sounds like 6 in a major scale, depending on context...

[@АльонаБузніцька]

Man, from depth of my soul asking u. Pls explain me how did you do this video? Which programs u used? I teach music and that’s exactly what I need to write exercises like this. Be blessed

[@maxkonyi]

I used the prototype of Sonofield, which is an app that will be available fairly soon, to do the circle visualization. I then used OBS to put my face in the circle while recording. That's it!

[@charlesmot54]

Unrelated to this video although its a great one, you dont seem to be streaming right now so i came here instead Do you have a place where you release your music? I'd love to go back and check out some of the finished products of the songs youre making in your streams

[@maxkonyi]

I don't really release stuff these days. I do have a Soundcloud which has all the stuff I have released over the years, including all the tracks from Weekly Challenges, but the stuff I've started on streams in the past year or two still remains on my hard drive... I do want to change that though and I'll take a week sometime soon to finish off the mass of 99% completed tracks I have. When it's not for work, I have hard time caring enough to finish things since I don't release music as an artist in that way. I appreciate the nudge though! soundcloud.com/maxkonyi

[@shawnie9472]

i love your videos

[@RoxiTube1]

When you say feeling... do you mean the place of sensation in the body... like a yoga bija sound Om etc that you can sense in the torso and head. As well has the hearing feeling sound in the degree of scale. My teacher has mentioned a little bit about this but I'm a bit confused 😮

[@sophie4636]

I understand it as emotion, the emotional state it produces. It's the way one song evokes sadness, and another makes you feel happy, or tense or strained.. I could very well be wrong as Im learning too!

[@maxkonyi]

Primarily, I mean some kind of 'emotional' tone, though the word "emotion" feels a bit too strong or direct... I don't mean a particular sensation in the body, though that may make sense for some people. These feeling-states are intagible, fleeting experiences, not something clear and concrete. Remember to be simple and immediate with it. No need to think or wonder if you've got it right. The instant a particular degree is sounded, there is some experience which we would normally term as a "feeling" in the mind.

[@RoxiTube1]

@@maxkonyi Ok... yes I feel the degree and a feeling. Thank 😊 you

[@pottedrodenttube]

Thanks, this video helped me communicate with the aliens up here on Devils Tower! 👽

[@maxkonyi]

Unintended but excellent!

[@beachbento]

is there a hands free place to find drones to practice this? i couldn’t find anything on spotify haha

[@maxkonyi]

Coming very soon!

[@beachbento]

@@maxkonyi very excited thank you!

[@annebouscatie8846]

At 23:20 you are saying that flat 3 is a little bit more dissonant with the tonic than flat 7, I am not sure about that. If your logic is that the further away on the circle, the more dissonant, it seems wrong. For instance, 3 is more consonant than 6, 2 or 4…

[@maxkonyi]

Yes you're totally right! I mispoke here. In the other video (or maybe it was this one?), I mentioned that things are more complex than the circle makes them appear, and this is an example. The circle is one-dimensional whereas a tonnetz or harmonic lattice is two-dimensional, allowing for a more accurate (though more complex and potentially confusing) depiction of harmonic relationship. It's the same on the other side of the circle as well - 3 is more consonant than 2 but it requires a two-dimensional representation to show that.

[@sharks445]

I can't help but think of "Scarborough Fair" whenever you move from 1 to 5 to 2 lol

[@gedinchristian603]

To complete my post: in minor scale the tonal center is 6 and not 1. What is your opinion?

[@maxkonyi]

The 6 of a major scale is indeed the tonic of its relative minor scale. However, when listening to music in a minor key and the tonic is sounded, it feels like 1, not 6. If you call it 6, you may develop a confusing perspective where the tonic feeling and the 6 feeling become blurred. In my opinion, it's best to have a more universal perspective on keys: There is simply a tonic and 11 other (actually more but let's ignore that...) degrees. Scales/modes are just subsets of this fuller set of relationships. Whether the notes you're currently playing conform to some kind of minor mode or some kind of major mode, they are all just possibilities within the full set of relationships. A lot of music moves between various modes while keeping the tonic the same - major for a bit, then minor, then phrygian, back to major, and so on... When you look at things like this, having separate systems for major and minor stops making as much sense.

[@gedinchristian603]

@@maxkonyi Hello. Today there are many approaches as you can see in "Improvise for real".

[@maxkonyi]

@@gedinchristian603 Indeed!

[@4c00h]

3:49 works like an anchor to that feeling (i think it's called objectifying in NLP)

[@gedinchristian603]

Hello. Minor scale is the 6xth mode of the major scale. Why don't you begin this scale by the 6 ? Thank you

[@i-is-alive]

How many feelings exist in the music that are to be learned?

[@maxkonyi]

Too many! But the important ones are: - 12 primary scale degrees - Chord types: major, minor, suspended, diminished, augmented, sixth chords, seventh chords - Chord extensions (9,11,13) - Modes Then there are more and more specific cases but it doesnt really matter unless you use those sounds often.

[@i-is-alive]

Does the 12 scale degrees always sound the same in every scale and mode?

[@maxkonyi]

@@i-is-alive Yes and no. Fundamentally, yes they always sound the same because the relationship between a degree and the tonic is always the same. However, the surrounding context can colour the degree in variety of ways which can be confusing. Part of ear training is learning to deal with this

[@i-is-alive]

@@maxkonyi Thanks alot🥂⚡️

[@XXmatt18XX]

Thought u forgot about us big dawg😔

[@maxkonyi]

Nah I'm just slow and lazy 😅

[@i-is-alive]

The rest is fine, but I always get stuck with degrees in different scales, like the same degrees sound different in other scales in the same tonality, can you please tell me how to deal with this? And I can’t somehow get the degrees when one’s singing it, not even the diatonic degrees, what to do??

[@maxkonyi]

You will learn to differentiate between each degree and the overall harmonic context (the scale/mode of the moment). For me, 5 always sounds like 5, regardless of which mode I'm playing with. That being said, each mode has it's own overall quality which can easily be mixed up with the feeling of each degree, causing the situation you describe. Do you mean you can't sing the degrees yourself? Or recognize them when it's a voice singing?

[@i-is-alive]

@@maxkonyi i mean recognizing when someone else is singing them/voice singing.

[@maxkonyi]

@@i-is-alive That's just practice! Listen to someone sing a melody, work it out and sing back to yourself, remain conscious of which scale degrees you're singing. Go slow. Then listen to the song again and keep the new information in mind. Repeat until you can hear the degrees as they're singing them, then move onto another song.

[@i-is-alive]

@@maxkonyi Isn't it possible by listening it right away? Is that "one listen and figure out right away" level possible to get to? And i can sing the degrees when i just produce them on a single vowel or sound, but it's a whole different game when i start it with lyrics, i can't figure which degree I'm singing or how to get to the degree that i want to.

[@JAYDUBYAH29]

27:13 all the blues players light up 😊

[@dewive6844]

Why is #4 not called b5 ?

[@maxkonyi]

Because #4 is more common in actual practice. It will change to b5 when the situation calls for it.

[@StratsRUs]

Depends on the key of the song or music. This is important to play songs at the same time.Then you have references in your head. Singing the melodies etc. See/feel the intervals within a song.

[@IsakuItou]

I cant feel notes.... no matter how hard I try... Am I a psychopath?

[@maxkonyi]

Trying hard is the problem. Have you seen my other video - The Secret of Ear Training?

[@cristosabedoriadedeus4542]

Não comece com melodias aleatórias. Toque melodias conhecidas, melodias que você já conhece a música. Exemplo: Parabéns pra você, etc... Melodia infantil, musicas pequenas... Outra opção é criar suas próprias melodias. Use a nota 1 como base. No começo use apenas a escala maior de 7 notas. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7. A escala maior é mais fácil perceber as diferenças entre as notas.

[@timorochademacher1080]

This is not a really a training. Its more of a repetition of your long stream, which i've seen. Way too much bla bla for me to be an ear training... (still i like your method)

[@maxkonyi]

More focused ear training exercises coming soon...

[@brokeboi9996]

Way to much talking